View Full Version : Take stock of Woodstock 40 years afterwards
Shuimo
08-19-2009, 01:18 PM
How does Woodstock strike you or grab you, in the wake of the 40th anniversary of the arguably greatest rock festival in our living memory?
How could a music festival pull off such strength in the name of 3 Days of Peace & Music and go down in history as a significant social event?
Could we recapture the glory and splendor of legendary rock festivals as such in these days of 21 century? Or have rock festivals or rock music or performing artists in an infinitely commercialized world lost their ability to thrill & inspire & excite us contemporary digitally-addicted folks?:roll:
Or is it desirable for us to recreate Woodstock? Or is the spirit of Woodstock simply non-existent today?
Plz have yr say on Woodstock in retrospection of 40 years afterwards!
http://www.usqiaobao.com/images/2009-08/15/xin_3408061509233901791621.jpg
http://www.usqiaobao.com/images/2009-08/15/xin_330806150923953468320.jpg
http://www.13ho.com/uploadfiles/2009/0610/1229172.jpg
Chinese copy of Woodstock?
http://i29.tinypic.com/33uzbt4.jpg
http://i30.tinypic.com/f9p6rd.jpg
How could a music festival pull off such strength in the name of 3 Days of Peace & Music and go down in history as a significant social event?
clever marketing and cinema.
The Woodstock hype didn't start untill afer the movie hit the cinemas across the globe.
Many festivals can pull off a completely peacefull atmosphere where everybody gets along nicely with each other. send some camera crews ou and ask the people what they think about war, drugs, bands, atmosphere, spend some time cutting it to fit the mood you want to transport with the movie, at voila, there you have your own woodstock.
But nowadays, nobody would be surprised anymore.
Shuimo
08-19-2009, 02:01 PM
clever marketing and cinema.
The Woodstock hype didn't start untill afer the movie hit the cinemas across the globe.
Many festivals can pull off a completely peacefull atmosphere where everybody gets along nicely with each other. send some camera crews ou and ask the people what they think about war, drugs, bands, atmosphere, spend some time cutting it to fit the mood you want to transport with the movie, at voila, there you have your own woodstock.
But nowadays, nobody would be surprised anymore.
Was Woodstock the first to do that using marketing and cinema?
Why are we no longer suprised? Because there are too many such events?
Or becuase the ideals and notions prettified by Woodstock are just out of fashion?
Aerosoul
08-19-2009, 02:07 PM
I don't know if it's really out of fashion.
Bonnaroo down here in TN gets 75-100K people a year.
Festivals have never gone out of fashion in the UK, I've been to seven - three Leeds Fests, a V Fest, a Download, a Field Day and this years Glastonbury which had 177,000 people there.
timetraveller
08-19-2009, 02:34 PM
Festivals have never gone out of fashion in the UK, I've been to seven - three Leeds Fests, a V Fest, a Download, a Field Day and this years Glastonbury which had 177,000 people there.
Some of the Festivals has been hijacked by those claiming to know whats is cool and whats no along with really bad tv coverage and really bad presenters ..
ie Glasto , TITP
The Glasto Coverage was extremely awful and download is the worst name ever given to a rock metal gig dl will never top the 108.000 crowd that Maiden drew back in 88 , there was an event this year at Knebworth that soley featured true rock and metal acts which is going to be happening again in 2010 , because older fans are pissed off with the crap wannabee acts calling themselves are Rock n metal ...and the plebs that follow em ..
futurepilot2004
08-19-2009, 02:36 PM
Festivals have never gone out of fashion in the UK, I've been to seven - three Leeds Fests, a V Fest, a Download, a Field Day and this years Glastonbury which had 177,000 people there.
x2, same in Ireland(Oxegen, Electric picnic) and Europe in general I think. Roskilde, Pukkelpop,Rock werchter, Rock am Ring etc etc
timetraveller
08-19-2009, 02:39 PM
Has there been talk or a promoter been enquiring about hosting such a Festival in China ? as am getting the impression that such an events is on the cards ..
When Shanghi clubs attracts the cream of the DJ world IE Paul Oakenfold whom did a set at the Great wall
timetraveller
08-19-2009, 02:39 PM
x2, same in Ireland(Oxegen, Electric picnic) and Europe in general I think. Roskilde, Pukkelpop,Rock werchter, Rock am Ring etc etc
and there is also Planet love
Some of the Festivals has been hijacked by those claiming to know whats is cool and whats no along with really bad tv coverage and really bad presenters ..
ie Glasto , TITP
The Glasto Coverage was extremely awful and download is the worst name ever given to a rock metal gig dl will never top the 108.000 crowd that Maiden drew back in 88 , there was an event this year at Knebworth that soley featured true rock and metal acts which is going to be happening again in 2010 , because older fans are pissed off with the crap wannabee acts calling themselves are Rock n metal ...and the plebs that follow em ..
How can you bitch and moan about Glastonbury and then mention the TV coverage? If you weren't there then you have no clue what you're talking about.
Also, the Knebworth event you mentioned is called Sonisphere, it was headlined by Linkin f*cking Park on the Saturday night so don't try to feed me a line of crap about it being a festival for true rock and metal bands.
Shuimo
08-19-2009, 03:11 PM
Has there been talk or a promoter been enquiring about hosting such a Festival in China ? as am getting the impression that such an events is on the cards ..
When Shanghi clubs attracts the cream of the DJ world IE Paul Oakenfold whom did a set at the Great wall
Such music festivals are now becoming annual glamorous events in some Chinese cities!
BUt I doubt the hosts can be of foreign background!
CPC keeps alert eyes upon our youthful indulgences, as always!
LineDoggie
08-19-2009, 03:14 PM
**** Woodstock, the important memorial is Panel 19 West, Line 43-64 (http://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=13078) of the Vietnam Wall
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h222/linedoggie/Woodstock1.jpg
109 Americans
An American Profile
They mirrored the population of the time. A full 92% were white (seven of whom had Spanish surnames) and 8% black. Some 67% were Protestants; 28% Catholic. A disproportionate number—more than one-third—hailed from the South. More than two-thirds were single; nearly one-third married. Not surprisingly, the vast majority (91%) were under the age of 30, with 78% between the ages of 18 and 22.
Overwhelmingly (87%), they were in the Army. Marines and airmen accounted for 8% and 4% of the deaths respectively, with sailors sustaining 1%. Again, not unexpectedly, two-thirds were infantry¬men. That same proportion was lower-ranking enlisted men. Enemy action claimed 84% of their lives; non-hostile causes, 16%. The preponderance (56%) had volunteered while 43% had been drafted. One was in the National Guard.
http://www.vfw.org/index.cfm?fa=news.magDtl&dtl=1&mid=5144
Was Woodstock the first to do that using marketing and cinema?
Why are we no longer suprised? Because there are too many such events?
Or becuase the ideals and notions prettified by Woodstock are just out of fashion?
they had to make money with the movie because the organizers were left deep in the red numbers after the festival. that's why the marketng rights of the movie were sold to Warner Bros. They needed the cash badly.
Most festivals in that era were poorly organized. security was taken over by violent Motorcycle gangs who had no concept of professional ways in dealing with crowds. A hell's Angels member, who was stage security, killed a black guy with a knife at Altamont Speedway Free Festival in 1969 (Thanks CJ). The Black guy pulled a gun though... Makes you wonder about security back then. Anybody could get in there and they could take anything with them.
Another thing was ticket sales. at max a third of the people at woodstock would have payed for it. the others just climbed over the fence.
The organizers of Fehmarn Open Air in 1970, headed by Jimi Hendrix (his last gig), knew they were screwed financially and fled the scene with all the cash after putting fire to their office at the festival site, before the festival even ended.
On the second day of woodstock there was a similiar situation. The Who didn't want to go on stage befor getting paid, so the organizers had to get the money at night and had their bankers flown in with a cheque in a helicopter.
Those days are long gone though, festivals are higly commercialized now. There are enough toilets, showers, ATMs and enough to eat and, as long as you have the cash. and more security than you can imagine and sometimes tolerate... ;)
Nowadays there's not much to fight for. all those freedoms we have today were given us by those fo fought for it back then. it has become naturally to take drugs, **** around with strangers, live the way you feel is right and say whatever you want. Maybe that is still to come in china, but not as long as the CCP distrusts the chinese people.
Ordie
08-19-2009, 05:11 PM
Shuimo,
Given that Beijing has many 'white elephants' in and around Olympic Park, they should promote concerts, monster truck races, rodeos, raves, and exotic erotic balls.
I get the feeling that to be a successful artist in China, you need to be censored by the government. Anything that is forbidden, makes it more appealing.
That's why Chinese made art films do well in the west.
Zarak
08-19-2009, 05:13 PM
**** hippies.
ARGAR FORKBEARD
08-19-2009, 06:55 PM
Never trust a hippie!!!!!!!!!
2Sheds_Jackson
08-19-2009, 06:58 PM
To me, Woodstock really works better as a marker for the end of things, not the beginning. It was the nail in the coffin of the hippie movement. It was the beginning of the end of freewheeling rock festivals. Woodstock moved hippie and rock culture from the edge of society, straight into the mall. Once everybody starts group-identifying, well, it's just not cool any more. Especially if your parents are into it. There's still some freedom to be found in rock - and in truth maybe there was a bit too much freedom going around (if Grace Slick is to be believed)...but waaay to much of rock & roll today just strikes me as pathetically packaged and commercialized garbage.
RECON DOC
08-19-2009, 07:00 PM
How about Abba?^^
ARGAR FORKBEARD
08-19-2009, 07:01 PM
To me, Woodstock really works better as a marker for the end of things, not the beginning. It was the nail in the coffin of the hippie movement. It was the beginning of the end of freewheeling rock festivals. Woodstock moved hippie and rock culture from the edge of society, straight into the mall. Once everybody starts group-identifying, well, it's just not cool any more. Especially if your parents are into it. There's still some freedom to be found in rock - and in truth maybe there was a bit too much freedom going around (if Grace Slick is to be believed)...but waaay to much of rock & roll today just strikes me as pathetically packaged and commercialized garbage. TOOOO TRUE!!!
q
commanding
08-19-2009, 07:09 PM
From an old coot's perspective, of course I wasn't at Woodstock, I was in university, married and studying my arse off...but the ONLY good thing about W.S. was "Jefferson Airplanes" vocalist Grace Slick singing White Rabbit....she was HOT to me ....p-)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EntBFYOPIcE
<dirty old man signs off>
Ordie
08-19-2009, 07:13 PM
From an old coot's perspective, of course I wasn't at Woodstock, I was in university, married and studying my arse off...but the ONLY good thing about W.S. was "Jefferson Airplanes" vocalist Grace Slick singing White Rabbit....she was HOT to me ....p-)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EntBFYOPIcE
<dirty old man signs off>
You still have memories of that era?
I've been to many concerts in the 1980's and 90's. It has now become corporate.
timetraveller
08-19-2009, 07:26 PM
How can you bitch and moan about Glastonbury and then mention the TV coverage? If you weren't there then you have no clue what you're talking about.
Also, the Knebworth event you mentioned is called Sonisphere, it was headlined by Linkin f*cking Park on the Saturday night so don't try to feed me a line of crap about it being a festival for true rock and metal bands.
You mis-understood me about my comment GLasto and TITP offcourse i know there is a difference between watching on tv and being there my gripe is with the presenters and the media outlets that hijack the festivals and do a godawful job of the coverage ... It's brutal viewing on another level
And as for Glasto itself i would only go for the Twisted recs tent !!
And as for sonisphere well my mistake for believing those who were promoters of the event whom interviewed for a tv programme and the owner of Knebworth castle as well ...
timetraveller
08-19-2009, 07:28 PM
From an old coot's perspective, of course I wasn't at Woodstock, I was in university, married and studying my arse off...but the ONLY good thing about W.S. was "Jefferson Airplanes" vocalist Grace Slick singing White Rabbit....she was HOT to me ....p-)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EntBFYOPIcE
<dirty old man signs off>
That's deffo a Brian May Mullet :)
Or was she his inspiration for his Mullet p-)
timetraveller
08-19-2009, 07:32 PM
Never trust a hippie!!!!!!!!!
Now yer at the bam up p-)
kinney_bmx
08-19-2009, 07:35 PM
God damn I wish I could have been born sooner and went to Woodstock, those were such happening times. I mean SOOOOO many people just havin a good time. Sitting together taking in the atmosphere listening to some of the best music in the world: I mean come on Santana, Jefferson Airplane, Jimi, CCR, Richie Havens, Country Joe, Crosby, I would have killed to have made it there. Those people knew how to live. My grandmother and grandfather went and took my mom even though she was eight. Nothing so great will probably ever happen again, people getting along although there was way too many people for the area, sharing food, listening to music.
All I can do is buy all the books and the movies, and try to imagine a time that was so easy.
Tejano
08-19-2009, 07:37 PM
If y'all knew how much damage those hippies caused.
The saddest generation of America really.
kinney_bmx
08-19-2009, 07:37 PM
From an old coot's perspective, of course I wasn't at Woodstock, I was in university, married and studying my arse off...but the ONLY good thing about W.S. was "Jefferson Airplanes" vocalist Grace Slick singing White Rabbit....she was HOT to me ....p-)
Ohh godddddd, Grace Slick Mmmmmmm, dedicated many a nights to her if im being honest
Zarak
08-19-2009, 07:38 PM
I like Grace Slick's solo albums, to be honest. But seriously, **** hippies.
Ordie
08-19-2009, 07:39 PM
I mean come on Santana, Jefferson Airplane, Jimi, CCR, Richie Havens, Country Joe, Crosby, I would have killed to have made it there.
Don't forget Sha Na Na
kinney_bmx
08-19-2009, 07:42 PM
Don't forget Sha Na Na
holy mother of god, With all that great music that sure ****ed it up with that.
I guess everything has to have one really REALLY bad act. Warped Tour is the same way just flipped, its like 99 horrible bands and one good band anymore
Speaking of hippies, kind of want to start up that tie dye business I had when i was younger
Ohh godddddd, Grace Slick Mmmmmmm, dedicated many a nights to her if im being honest
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i228/Captainbadd/GraceSlick2008.jpg
kinney_bmx
08-19-2009, 07:48 PM
DAMN you SBL damn you to hell, ugh. Id rather imagine that shell always look like this:
http://ponderingpig.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/grace.jpg
commanding
08-19-2009, 07:50 PM
well heh, Grace slick is like 68 now. 40 yrs ago she was 28, and NUBILE.
wotsnext
08-19-2009, 07:53 PM
I would love to have seen Joni Mitchell. :hug:
Peace brothers :)
commanding
08-19-2009, 07:59 PM
back to the original thread question.....to me, the woodstock event was a music event, it had little or no political implications, or impact. Nor do I think it was intended to. What made it "big" was that it was an east coast event catering to the hippie crowd...of considerable size and had a lot of musical talent that became famous mostly later.
It was a one time thing. Stuff like that isn't planned, it just occurs.
2Sheds_Jackson
08-20-2009, 10:56 AM
back to the original thread question.....to me, the woodstock event was a music event, it had little or no political implications, or impact. Nor do I think it was intended to.
I have to disagree with you on this point. I think it was massively political. Richie Havens, who opened the show, ended his set by chanting "freedom" over and over. There was a war on, with a draft of course. These kids were either in college, many to avoid the war, or had put themselves outside of the system all together - in order to avoid the war. Like Timothy Leary said -they were about disconnecting themselves from the conventions and hierarchies of society. I mean, if it was 1969, and you were 20 years old- you either had to be in college, or in the military, right? At least that's how I think it worked, I was only 6 in 1969 and more interested in HotWheels than the war at the time. :)
I think the war was a huge factor - these kids had a sword hanging over their heads -it colored all of their thinking. It gave an urgency to their time together - why not get stoned and have ***? Oh sure that's good advice all the time but with the war...who knew where they'd be in 6 months?
The full list of performers;
Richie Havens
Sweet water
Bert Sommer
Tim Hardin
Ravi shankar
Melanie
Arlo Guthrie
Joan Baez
Quill
Country Joe McDonald
John B. Sebastian
Keef Hartley Band
Santana
Incredible String Band
Canned Heat
Grateful Dead
Leslie West & Mountain
Creedence Clearwater Revival
Janis Joplin
Sly & The Family Stone
The Who
Jefferson Airplane
Joe Cocker
Country Joe & The Fish
Ten Years After
Johnny Winter
Blood Sweat And Tears
Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young
Paul Butterfield Blues Band
Sha Na Na
Jimi Hendrix
California Joe
08-20-2009, 11:12 AM
Woodstock has definitely become mythology at this point. Good, bad, and very muddy...
P.S. The black guy (Meredith Hunter) that was stabbed and beaten to death by the Hells Angels was at Altamont Speedway in December '69 while the Rolling Stones were on stage, see the movie Gimme Shelter...Just sayin...
AFAIK richie havens' set was improvised to a great extent, because he had to play longer than planned. this includes his Freedom song. The other bands simply weren't ready yet. Snatana's whole band was on acid on stage beacuse they expected to play a couple of hours later and thought there was still some time left for a trip.
Another great scene with political symbolic content was the toilet cleaning man. He said he had a son at woodstock and another over in vietnam. a scene full of symbolism about the dvision in America's society.
Woodstock has definitely become mythology at this point. Good, bad, and very muddy...
P.S. The black guy (Meredith Hunter) that was stabbed and beaten to death by the Hells Angels was at Altamont Speedway in December '69 while the Rolling Stones were on stage, see the movie Gimme Shelter...Just sayin...
Thanks joe, mixed these two up.
California Joe
08-20-2009, 11:22 AM
Alvin Lee kicks ass in the movie. (10 years After)
commanding
08-20-2009, 11:39 AM
I have to disagree with you on this point. I think it was massively political. Richie Havens, who opened the show, ended his set by chanting "freedom" over and over. There was a war on, with a draft of course. These kids were either in college, many to avoid the war, or had put themselves outside of the system all together - in order to avoid the war. Like Timothy Leary said -they were about disconnecting themselves from the conventions and hierarchies of society. I mean, if it was 1969, and you were 20 years old- you either had to be in college, or in the military, right? At least that's how I think it worked, I was only 6 in 1969 and more interested in HotWheels than the war at the time. :)
I think the war was a huge factor - these kids had a sword hanging over their heads -it colored all of their thinking. It gave an urgency to their time together - why not get stoned and have ***? Oh sure that's good advice all the time but with the war...who knew where they'd be in 6 months?
Well, you may know better than myself. I have never been a huge fan of that type of music, and have never really delved into the woodstock phenomena. I think there is a lot of misconception about the use of being in college as purely a way of avoiding the war in VN. Of course my experience is limited to a VERY conservative university, Texas Tech in a very conservative Lubbock Texas. But the majority of the people I met there were there to get an education. The majority of the "draft dodgers" or evaders of the draft that I met, used other methods of avoiding being drafted. They went to Canada, joined the reserves, had vulgarities tattooed on the back of their right hand (where when they saluted it would say f*** you), joined the Peace Corps, etc. I had friends which joined the peace corps, some who joined the reserves and one who would definitely had gone to Canada had not his draft # been so high. The Selective Service board here was actually very good about letting me graduate, before they drafted me. And that was fine with me, as I just wanted that stinkin degree (no one in my family had ever gotten a degree and I am very hard headed once I start something).
Shuimo
08-20-2009, 11:44 AM
Shuimo,
Given that Beijing has many 'white elephants' in and around Olympic Park, they should promote concerts, monster truck races, rodeos, raves, and exotic erotic balls.
WE have long thought of that!
It is such a shame!
We tried to do that by putting on a rock festival there----Midi Music Festival, an annual music event hugely influential among young rock music fans in China! But the coward and conservertive municial gov of Beijing City dared not permit events as such! WE then only managed to do the festival in the suburbia of Beijing!
I get the feeling that to be a successful artist in China, you need to be censored by the government. Anything that is forbidden, makes it more appealing.
That's why Chinese made art films do well in the west.
Entirely agree and an observation that can be easily noticed!
That is a very bizarre scene!
YOur fast track to fame and renown as an artist in China is by making yrself or yr works politically controversial!
YOu consider this as resistance to the infamous surppresion of artistic freedom of totalitarian regime, don't you?
I never believe we now live in a world that can afford to celebrate the end of ideological conflicts! Where there is repression, there is resistance! Mao was too true!
Shuimo
08-20-2009, 03:02 PM
To me, Woodstock really works better as a marker for the end of things, not the beginning. It was the nail in the coffin of the hippie movement. It was the beginning of the end of freewheeling rock festivals. Woodstock moved hippie and rock culture from the edge of society, straight into the mall. Once everybody starts group-identifying, well, it's just not cool any more. Especially if your parents are into it. There's still some freedom to be found in rock - and in truth maybe there was a bit too much freedom going around (if Grace Slick is to be believed)...but waaay to much of rock & roll today just strikes me as pathetically packaged and commercialized garbage.
I really appreciate yr razor-sharp insight (or cynicism?) here! and I heartily agree!
The best comment I seen in this thread!:)
Shuimo
08-20-2009, 03:09 PM
I can hardly bear to believe the person in post 31 and post 32 is just one and the same person that has spanned a period of 4 decades!
Too cruel and ruthless TIME is!
commanding
08-20-2009, 03:55 PM
I can hardly bear to believe the person in post 31 and post 32 is just one and the same person that has spanned a period of 4 decades!
Too cruel and ruthless TIME is!
welcome to life sonny.:)
Ordie
08-20-2009, 04:30 PM
YOu consider this as resistance to the infamous surppresion of artistic freedom of totalitarian regime, don't you?
Government actions such as censorship or an export ban brings more attention to the artist and thier work of art.
"Raise the Red Lantern" by Director Zhang Yimou was banned in China, but was a huge success in launching Gong Li career and promoted tourism in Shanxi in part because of the ban.
Shuimo
08-21-2009, 10:04 AM
welcome to life sonny.:)
I think I would be in the bloom of my youth forever!:)
Shuimo
08-21-2009, 10:15 AM
Government actions such as censorship or an export ban brings more attention to the artist and thier work of art.
"Raise the Red Lantern" by Director Zhang Yimou was banned in China, but was a huge success in launching Gong Li career and promoted tourism in Shanxi in part because of the ban.
What is really worthy of note is why the CPC-led gov should get this or that banned in the sphere of artistic creativity!p-)
For what fuc*ing reason does a given piece of artistic work deserve to be banned? Because of leaking state top cultural codes, or threatening national cultural security, or challenging social fabric, or polluting young minds, or defying CPC authority & legitmacy?
Banning """Raise the Red Lantern" seems to me among the most foolish censoring scandals CPC ever maneuvered!
BTW: I am no fan of either Zhang or Gong! They are a generation of outdated people of the past to us youngsers born post-1980!
Fallap
08-21-2009, 11:05 AM
Denmark have its own Woodstock :)
commanding
08-21-2009, 11:07 AM
I think I would be in the bloom of my youth forever!:)
glad to see you ALSO have a sense of humor besides your intelligence. humor will help you through tough times.p-)
commanding
08-21-2009, 11:16 AM
What is really worthy of note is why the CPC-led gov should get this or that banned in the sphere of artistic creativity!p-)
For what fuc*ing reason does a given piece of artistic work deserve to be banned? Because of leaking state top cultural codes, or threatening national cultural security, or challenging social fabric, or polluting young minds, or defying CPC authority & legitmacy?
Banning """Raise the Red Lantern" seems to me among the most foolish censoring scandals CPC ever maneuvered!
BTW: I am no fan of either Zhang or Gong! They are a generation of outdated people of the past to us youngsers born post-1980!
China is, IMO, a great group of people. Basically the people are no different than those in the US, or UK, or Spain or anywhere else that is a modern country. The govt. of (everywhere) is a different matter. Governments, sometimes loose their moral and cultural compass, and wander into various tantrums, led by leaders who are sometimes obsessed with causes (religion being a large one).
If the people could figure a way to operate without a government, there would be a lot fewer wars, not to mention taxes.
As an ex-soldier/veteran, no one hates war more than the soldier, IMO. No one wants to die at 18 because of some patriotic cause. That being said, there are people in the world still living in the middle ages, i.e. Taliban, and terrorists, whose religious and cultural traditions instill in them the desire to kill all those who do not agree with their particular brand of ______(fill in the blank). Most of those folks, basically need education, and a chance to work and earn a living wage so they are not eating garbage, and so the bottom rung of their socieity (women and children) are not mistreated (raped, abandoned, forced to do demeaning things)
that is my rant for the day.
BTW: I am no fan of either Zhang or Gong! They are a generation of outdated people of the past to us youngsers born post-1980!
Your loss. They're great flicks.
Shuimo
08-22-2009, 03:01 PM
China is, IMO, a great group of people. Basically the people are no different than those in the US, or UK, or Spain or anywhere else that is a modern country. The govt. of (everywhere) is a different matter. Governments, sometimes loose their moral and cultural compass, and wander into various tantrums, led by leaders who are sometimes obsessed with causes (religion being a large one).
Yes, peoples from different parts of the world are basically the same in nature! So are the governements!
If there are any differences, it is the difference of degree, not type!
If the people could figure a way to operate without a government, there would be a lot fewer wars, not to mention taxes.
That is too good an idea even to visualize!
What life would be life without governments?
As an ex-soldier/veteran, no one hates war more than the soldier, IMO. No one wants to die at 18 because of some patriotic cause.
Soldiers are really a speical group of people, for whom I have great respect! But I bet it that being a soldier is the last sort of profession I want to join in! I am such a helpless chap longing for free-wheeling and fancy-free lifestyle! I really cannot imagine myself taking orders from officers like poor slaves!
That being said, there are people in the world still living in the middle ages, i.e. Taliban, and terrorists, whose religious and cultural traditions instill in them the desire to kill all those who do not agree with their particular brand of ______(fill in the blank). Most of those folks, basically need education, and a chance to work and earn a living wage so they are not eating garbage, and so the bottom rung of their socieity (women and children) are not mistreated (raped, abandoned, forced to do demeaning things)
that is my rant for the day.
Even yr ranting is of such quality!
Shuimo
08-22-2009, 03:25 PM
Those days are long gone though, festivals are higly commercialized now. There are enough toilets, showers, ATMs and enough to eat and, as long as you have the cash. and more security than you can imagine and sometimes tolerate... ;)
That is perhaps one of the big reasons why Woodstock is remembered!
Free bread for all!
I actually hate it the hell when rock festivals are used as cash cow for organizers! That commericial stink is an insult to and mockery of the spirit and soul of rock music that is aimed at breaking barriers of all sorts, not the least barriers erected by possession of weath and money!
Nowadays there's not much to fight for. all those freedoms we have today were given us by those fo fought for it back then. it has become naturally to take drugs, **** around with strangers, live the way you feel is right and say whatever you want.
Really, there is not much to fight for, even in the western world?
On the contrary, IMO, there is so much more than ever to fight for in this rapidly globalized world dazzling with unsettlingly unpreedente changes! You figure it!
Maybe that is still to come in china, but not as long as the CCP distrusts the chinese people.
Tooooooooooooooooooooo truuuuuuuuuuuuuuue!
China now represents one of the most grotesquely intriguing chapters in the 21 century!Rapid urbanization, industrilaization and marketization and corporate capitalism under a most powerful sinister one-party rule with all the scandalous happenings constantly grabbing world new headlines!
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