Hatred of the SNP

[scttgillies]

Fellow MP members,

First of all i wish to apologise vehemently to all affected and hurt by the Lockerbie Bomber scandel. I wish to state the the normal scottish people had hee haw to do with that idea. However we voted those Cnuts into power and should shoulder some of the blame.
Secondly, i believe that the SNP, a second rate party at best are acting in their own interests, in building ties with that nation, i also believe that the faceless watchers at whitehall have something to do with that. I dont trust them and believe that their actions will damage the reputation of scottish and british troops to our allies in the ME. Please do not tar us with the same brush as those scum.
Thirdly i wish the lockerbie bomber a long, painful lingering death with his prostrate getting poked at every oppertunity, preferibly by a half trained doctor with fingers like a full Bratwurst.

SG

Germany

[gaijinsamurai]

Hey, SG!
I think that on this side of the Atlantic, a lot of people are bewildered and disgusted at the release of the terrorist, and feel the actions of the Scottish Government is a slap in the face to the memory of the victims, and their loved ones.

However, most of us also are quite aware of the fact that the actions of a government do not necessarily reflect the attitudes and wishes of the people they supposedly represent.

On a personal note, ever since your unit and mine shared quarters in Al Jubail back in '91, you Scots, especially those who serve your country in uniform, have been held in high regard.

[Andy-M]

looks like the backlash has started, albeit small scale. :-(


The government of Scotland has officially freed the terrorist al-Megrahi to return to Libya, according to the latest AP news report. Americans need to respond to this outrageous miscarriage of justice and betrayal of the victims' families, who were mostly fellow Americans, by refusing to spend their tourist dollars in Scotland and avoiding any kind of business there. Boycotting is the only way to send a clear and direct message to both the Scottish and British governments that Americans will not tolerate such a flagrant betrayal.

http://www.boycottscotland.com/

[oldsoak]

Scots in the street are not to blame, write to the powers that be.

[happyslapper]

http://www.boycottscotland.com/

:roll:

Good God... some people are just massively thick.

It was disappointing to witness how the Scottish Justice Minister handled the saga. It was equally disappointing that central government (Westminster) did not step in to correct the idiocy. The fact that every government minister who's appeared on TV since has not even bothered to defend the actions of that prat speaks volumes, it also suggests that central government wanted to act, but felt forced into a corner.

... and that is what the SNP attempt to do; force people into corners. Nothing they promote is remotely in the interests of Scotland or the UK at large. They're a bunch of self-righteous, reactionary, shallow, selfish and entirely incompetent cvnts.

[Panchito12]

So what's going to be the Scottish equivalent of "Freedom Fries"?

[muttbutt]

So what's going to be the Scottish equivalent of "Freedom Fries"?
Haggis....

[Eagle The Lightning]

Haggis....No Haggis is English...http://i26.tinypic.com/359yb0j.jpg

[Panchito12]

No Haggis is English...http://i26.tinypic.com/359yb0j.jpg

How 'bout that crap Porridge, is it Scottish?

[happyslapper]

How 'bout that crap Porridge, is it Scottish?

Porridge is a great breakfast. Healthy, and delicious if done properly.

None of that explosively sugary fluorescent bollocks ''cereal'' they give you in the states, ta.

[Chimera]

No more scotch for me. I'll have some freedom whisky.

[Eagle The Lightning]

How 'bout that crap Porridge, is it Scottish? There is nothing more Scottish than A deep fried Mars bar and a can of Irn-Bru.

[Wha_Dar]

Im getting a wee bit fed up with the "outrage" that people seem to have. And why are you Scttghillies apologising for a governmental decision that was "unilateral'. However, you have to ask why the appeal was dropped, and then the man was released on compationate grounds. I can see a Westminster link here.

There have been questions asked for many years regarding the voracity of eyewitness and forensic evidence. At the same time the West has been trying to get a greater share in Libyan oil.

If I remember rightly, although only accused, OBLs bodyguard was held at Gitmo but released on compassionate grounds, along with a few others. This sort of thing is not new.

Also how many people died during the WWII in forced labour or as experiments by German and Japanes scientists, who were later allowed into the US.

Maybe, Ill get banned for writing this, but I dont get the indignation. Even Obama only used the word "disappointing" which I imagine in Foriegn Relations speak means nothing.

The tradgedy at Lockerbie cannot be forgotten.

[ninja-lewis]

Good God... some people are just massively thick.

It was disappointing to witness how the Scottish Justice Minister handled the saga. It was equally disappointing that central government (Westminster) did not step in to correct the idiocy. The fact that every government minister who's appeared on TV since has not even bothered to defend the actions of that prat speaks volumes, it also suggests that central government wanted to act, but felt forced into a corner.

... and that is what the SNP attempt to do; force people into corners. Nothing they promote is remotely in the interests of Scotland or the UK at large. They're a bunch of self-righteous, reactionary, shallow, selfish and entirely incompetent cvnts. How were Westminster supposed to step in? Westminster has no control over Scots Law since Devolution (when it was the responsibility of the Secretary of State for Scotland). Furthermore, it was Westminster that unilaterally negotiated the prisoner transfer agreement with Libya (although that wasn't actually used in this case).

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

Don’t be an innocent scttgillies this decision would have been made no matter who was in power and for the sake of Christ wise up to the fact that Holyrood despite all outward appearances did not come to this decision on their own as they have f*ck all to give to Libya other than this guy

[happyslapper]

How were Westminster supposed to step in? Westminster has no control over Scots Law since Devolution (when it was the responsibility of the Secretary of State for Scotland). Furthermore, it was Westminster that unilaterally negotiated the prisoner transfer agreement with Libya (although that wasn't actually used in this case).

Because Westminster has de-jure power over the entire UK, and it's overseas territories.

[ting]

Is it usual for prisoners to be released when they are dying in Scotland?

If yes, what's the big deal?

He was sentenced to prison, not death.

[Arfah]

Don’t be an innocent scttgillies this decision would have been made no matter who was in power and for the sake of Christ wise up to the fact that Holyrood despite all outward appearances did not come to this decision on their own as the have f*ck all to give to Libya other than this guy

According to Alec Salmond, the justice minister acted alone with no external pressure. Make of that what you will.

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

According to Alec Salmond, the justice minister acted alone with no external pressure. Make of that what you will.Trying to save face if you ask me they cannot come out and say that Scottish justice should play second fiddle to the UK's unfettered pursuit of energy resources abroad.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/340a91ba-8ac4-11de-ad08-00144feabdc0.html?nclick_check=1

[rgjbloke]

Here's an article from the Guardian that's interesting and I think relevant, whether it's factual, I'll leave to those better informed than me?



Comment is free (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree)



Megrahi release is an independent step

It's not surprising that Scotland's Kenny MacAskill held his nerve and released the Lockerbie bomber, despite the political stakes



Comments (19) (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/aug/21/megrahi-lockerbie-scotland-macaskill?commentpage=1)
Buzz up! (http://buzz.yahoo.com/buzz?publisherurn=the_guardian665&targetUrl=http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/aug/21/megrahi-lockerbie-scotland-macaskill&summary=%3Cstrong%3ELesley+Riddoch%3A%3C%2Fstrong%3E+It%27s+not+surprising+that+Scotland%27s+Kenny+MacAskill+held+his+nerve+and+released+the+Lockerbie+bomber%2C+despite+the+political+stakes&headline=Megrahi%20release%20is%20an%20independent%20step%20%7C%20Lesley%20Riddoch%20%7CComment%20is%20free%20%7Cguardian.co.uk)
Digg it (http://digg.com/submit?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.guardian.co.uk%2Fcommentisfree%2F2009%2Faug%2F21%2Fmegrahi-lockerbie-scotland-macaskill&title=Megrahi+release+is+an+independent+step+%7C+Lesley+Riddoch)




http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2008/05/28/lesley_riddoch_140x140.jpg (http://www.guardian.co.uk/profile/lesleyriddoch)


Lesley Riddoch (http://www.guardian.co.uk/profile/lesleyriddoch)
guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk/), Friday 21 August 2009 18.30 BST
Article history (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/aug/21/megrahi-lockerbie-scotland-macaskill#history-byline)


It's clear the release of Abdelbaset al-Megrahi (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/aug/21/lockerbie-megrahi-libya-return) has soured relations between Scotland and America (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2009/aug/20/megrahi-release-lockerbie-snp). But perhaps, in the long run, the release decision will have a longer-lasting impact in the domestic arena, where the SNP wants to put clear blue policy water between itself and England.
Kenny MacAskill's decision (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/video/2009/aug/20/lockerbie-bomber-released) to choose the compassionate rather than the punitive option regarding Megrahi's release didn't come from nowhere.
I was a member of the prisons commission (http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2008/06/30162955/0) that MacAskill set up on his appointment as justice secretary – charged with finding out why Scotland imprisons twice as many people as our neighbours Ireland and Norway. He accepted our recommendations in full and the controversial policy of a seismic shift towards community payback has already begun amid a hail of media brickbats suggesting the SNP has adopted a "thug's" charter.
There are absolutely no votes in being "soft on crime"– as Labour politicians have styled SNP policy – but tackling Scotland's macho, punitive culture was postponed by Labour administrations for far too long. At the same time the justice secretary is aiming to introduce minimum pricing this autumn to curb the binge-drinking culture that lies behind so much violent crime. Despite more brickbats from the media, opposition politicians and the licensed trade, progressive policymakers across Europe are holding their collective breath to see if MacAskill's bold measure can possibly work.
If these new policies to raise the price of alcohol and to halve the prison population go ahead, Scotland will have moved in a distinctly different policy direction from England.
It's a big if.
Hardly a week passes in Scotland without a call for MacAskill's resignation – and with violent prisoners absconding from jails in the midst of his prisons review there have been legitimate grounds. But he's still there. And still there largely with the backing of the people at the sharp end – doctors and alcohol experts, victim support, prisoner charities and the Scottish prisons service.
Is it any surprise then, that a man prepared to fight two massively unpopular political battles at once didn't visibly falter over deciding the fate of the Lockerbie bomber? It appears that MacAskill simply held his nerve and decided not to deviate from normal practice despite the high political and diplomatic stakes involved. All but seven of the 30 appeals for compassionate release in Scotland since 2000 have been granted, and despite the fact Megrahi was found guilty of Britain's biggest terrorist incident with the murder of 270 people, the principles and criteria involved in making the Megrahi decision were the same as those involved in any other application.
Perhaps MacAskill even reached a tiny ledge of moral high ground by deciding not to use the prisoner transfer arrangement (http://lockerbiecase.blogspot.com/2008/11/uk-and-libya-sign-prisoner-transfer.html) agreed between the UK and Libya after American relatives of the bombing victims insisted that the British had agreed Megrahi would serve his time as a prisoner here in Scotland – not anywhere else. Hence the decision to use compassionate release not prisoner transfer.
So is this a popular move in Scotland? Maybe not immediately. But some Scots doubt Megrahi is actually guilty – a view not shared by MacAskill, but backed by the extraordinarily compassionate and rational British relative, Jim Swire (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/scotland/6034698/Lockerbie-bombing-victims-father-to-sue.html).
Newspaper headlines talk of fury over the decision to release Megrahi – but that's hardly evident in conversation here. One leading Scottish Labour politician says he's even considering supporting MacAskill in Monday's recall debate (http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/aug/17/lockerbie-bomber) in the Scottish parliament. If he and others have the courage to ignore the party line, Scottish Labour may finally abandon its knee-jerk opposition to the SNP's increasingly distinctive and Scandinavian stance on issues of justice and accept that Scotland is on a journey away from the incarceration-oriented American model still apparently favoured by Labour in England. The Scottish parliament could decide to defend the government's decision against all comers and realise that with the Megrahi decision, Scotland has finally emerged from the shadow of Britain as a punitive, wheeler-dealing, interventionist post-colonial state.
Scots love nothing better than an underdog. And so far the SNP government has managed to look like the plucky little Braveheart (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braveheart) of the piece – placing compassion above vengeance, and independent decision-making above kow-towing to the world's most powerful nation.
Would David Miliband (http://news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_8213000/8213516.stm) have decided otherwise? Who knows. But his moment of truth may yet arrive. Swire is determined to use human rights legislation to force an inquiry into the entire Lockerbie investigation. MacAskill has already kicked responsibility for such an inquiry into touch across the border – pointing out that thanks to the limitations of the devolution settlement, the Scottish government's jurisdiction doesn't allow it to embark on a task of such international dimensions.
No matter how the Scottish parliament votes on Monday, the SNP's larger independence project may have taken a surprisingly large step forward as the international whirlwind around Megrahi starts to settle.

[oldsoak]

I think this shows a complete disconnect at senior level. Did they not think this might get trotted out the next time we go to Uncle Sam for favours ?
Brown wrote to the Libyans asking for the blokes return to be kept low key. Did the f*ckwit really think they'd do as he asked ?

[big_les]

The compassion argument is utter nonsense. If he's guilty that is. But most I think realise that his conviction was actually unsafe, and so there's support for his release. The SNP and UK govs didn't want the appeal to go ahead, because it would reveal all the behind-the-scenes machinations with Libya and make them look even worse. So they twisted megrahi's arm to drop that appeal, on the understanding that he would get his 'compassionate' release. There is precedent for that, but for the biggest murderer in Scots history?

No. They know he's not their man, so they're letting him go. It's wrong on a number of levels.

[Arfah]

It's wrong on a number of levels.

Precisely !

That's why he should have maintained his appeal.

He may die free but he's still a mass murderer.

[big_les]

Assuming that he was innocent (for the moment) - it seems that he was offered the current deal to see his family and be free for the last months of his life, but only if he dropped his appeal.

What would you do?

[Arfah]

What would you do?

Fair one !

He should never have been given the option though.

Once convicted, guilty 'til proven innocent !

Whether it's English law or Scottish law.

[CMNot]

The problem is the possible questions arising from the appeal. One can only think that a whole nasty world of Whitehall **** would have been exposed for them to think this is the lesser of two evils.

[Wahnsinn]

Fair one !

He should never have been given the option though.

Once convicted, guilty 'til proven innocent !

Whether it's English law or Scottish law.

Megrahi had no option, his fate was in the hands of someone who did have options.

Thank god we don't have the death sentence then, execute one innocent man and the whole system becomes flawed.

[timetraveller]

Well BP was awarded the rights to Libyan Oil rights not long after Tony blairs meeting with the Colonel and also Mandelson was spotted with the Colonel abroad which Mandelson claims it was just a coincidence ....

[timetraveller]

Fellow MP members,

First of all i wish to apologise vehemently to all affected and hurt by the Lockerbie Bomber scandel. I wish to state the the normal scottish people had hee haw to do with that idea. However we voted those Cnuts into power and should shoulder some of the blame.
Secondly, i believe that the SNP, a second rate party at best are acting in their own interests, in building ties with that nation, i also believe that the faceless watchers at whitehall have something to do with that. I dont trust them and believe that their actions will damage the reputation of scottish and british troops to our allies in the ME. Please do not tar us with the same brush as those scum.
Thirdly i wish the lockerbie bomber a long, painful lingering death with his prostrate getting poked at every oppertunity, preferibly by a half trained doctor with fingers like a full Bratwurst.

SG

Germany


This had nothing to do with the SNP they wouldn't have the braincells to Orchestrait such a move ....

[timetraveller]

looks like the backlash has started, albeit small scale. :-(



http://www.boycottscotland.com/


The person or persons that created that site seem to forget a few simple home truths ...

Infact am gonna send em a few home truths

[big_les]

The problem is the possible questions arising from the appeal. One can only think that a whole nasty world of Whitehall **** would have been exposed for them to think this is the lesser of two evils.

Oh yes. That much is clear. Quite what they didn't want people to know is not. Dammit, I hate this - it makes me as close to tinfoil as I'm ever likely to get. But you know you're not dreaming it when major organisations/politicians are pointing to something fairly big. And when the basement-dwelling neckbeards aren't getting all TROOTH about it. They don't care about real conspiracies - only youtube-based ones.

[CMNot]

many have advocated avoiding scotch whisky and opting for american, canadian, or irish whiskies.

OK, shouldn't laugh but...haha, Freedom Whiskey anyone?

Neo-cons, even more amusing now they have been neutered.

[Breach]

http://www.boycottscotland.com/

:roll:

Good God... some people are just massively thick.

It was disappointing to witness how the Scottish Justice Minister handled the saga. It was equally disappointing that central government (Westminster) did not step in to correct the idiocy. The fact that every government minister who's appeared on TV since has not even bothered to defend the actions of that prat speaks volumes, it also suggests that central government wanted to act, but felt forced into a corner.

... and that is what the SNP attempt to do; force people into corners. Nothing they promote is remotely in the interests of Scotland or the UK at large. They're a bunch of self-righteous, reactionary, shallow, selfish and entirely incompetent cvnts.


Too true,but then that goes for most UK polititians regardless of party:-*$

As for boycoting Scotland,I wish some of them would.

As for the septics crying about justice....seems some have a short memory either that or they think justice is only for Americans.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/29332… (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/2933231/Natwest-Three-caught-on-extraditions-one-way-street.html)

http://www.civitas.org.uk/blog/2006/07/s… (http://www.civitas.org.uk/blog/2006/07/save_the_natwest_three_until_w.html)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/america… (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/1563119.stm)

[martinexsquaddie]

A realpolitik message, possibly:

"Thank you USA for giving us nothing in Iraq, and thank you for thanking us for helping you out in your Afghan crusade, and before you put your hobnails into any other country, we are going our own way geopolitically when it comes to our fnancial interests, which is not to say we ain't best buddies of course, but look what happens when we let America decide our sovereign foreign policy. It all goes to rat-sh!t, and we get egg on our faces - hugely expensive egg too, both in lives and money. Now, we might, as a nation, make some money out of the unfreezered Libya, so we'll let the bloke go, because we'll not be last in the queue after France, China and the USA with international income - considering the global meltdown, and the USA's large part in it, it's every country for himself for a while until the cupboards get restocked. Oh, yes, as for the 'Buy American' policy . . . . . fcuk you."

[CMNot]

Scot free jokes anyone?

[a_very_ex_STAB]

OK, shouldn't laugh but...haha, Freedom Whiskey anyone?

Neo-cons, even more amusing now they have been neutered.

Yes I have to agree - it's always been amusing to watch the neocons frothing at the mouth. Even in their heyday a few years ago when they mistakenly thought they were on a roll and that there was going to be 'A New American Century etc etc' it was fun but now they're even more impotent than before they are absolutely hilarious :)

[a_very_ex_STAB]

A realpolitik message, possibly:

"Thank you USA for giving us nothing in Iraq, and thank you for thanking us for helping you out in your Afghan crusade, and before you put your hobnails into any other country, we are going our own way geopolitically when it comes to our fnancial interests, which is not to say we ain't best buddies of course, but look what happens when we let America decide our sovereign foreign policy. It all goes to rat-sh!t, and we get egg on our faces - hugely expensive egg too, both in lives and money. Now, we might, as a nation, make some money out of the unfreezered Libya, so we'll let the bloke go, because we'll not be last in the queue after France, China and the USA with international income - considering the global meltdown, and the USA's large part in it, it's every country for himself for a while until the cupboards get restocked. Oh, yes, as for the 'Buy American' policy . . . . . fcuk you."

Yup that just about sums it up I suppose.