Strict gear standards?

[SoundOFaGun]

Hey, I am currently in a unit in the US Army that is in my opinion tieing its soldiers hands with its strict gear standards.

Chinstrap must be ACU Green, must have army issue one with new stupid bulky Nape released by the Army

IBA - IOTV pouches must be set up according to packet, no other way is an option and you may not have any additional pouches just Canteen, Mags, Med pouch.

No chest rigs, FLC everything must be attached.

The theory is that the enemy will not attack a unit if its soldiers all look the same.

Are there any other units like this? there is nothing I can do, but I would like to avoid units like this in the future.

I think that not every soldier fights the same and this is a bit stupid.

[SScurlock375]

I've heard of some units adopting this uniformity however it is all up to commander/CSM discretion. At one point in time my unit tried the same thing and found it far too ineffective as everyone prefers their set-up differently and can react better with a set-up comfortable to themselves. Granted I have no experience with the IOTV and I haven't heard anything good about it to begin with so I can't relate with you there.

So yes, it isn't just your unit and hopefully after training and feedback from the 1SGs and COs your BC/CSM will rethink their decision.

[Sniffit]

I do not have any experience serving with any other armed forces then the swedish army, however I am fairly confident that no matter what army you are serving with you are likely to come across people that have some kind of belife in the superiority of uniformity.

One always have to remeber that for an officer in teh career it is always safer to not take any radical/drastical decisions when it comes to things like this. However good a change might be it will (almost) always be fought/frowned upon by higher ups.

[dave81]

Let me guess: You're an airsofter who joined the US Army and suddenly found yourself unable to wear the Gucci kit you spent all your parents' money on? :)

Some units are a__holes about it, some aren't; as mentioned, it depends on your CO/1SG. For years, I had my IBA set up exactly the way I wanted, then when we got a new 1SG he had us stand in formation with all our gear on and had our supervisors make notes on everything that needed to be "corrected" for uniformity. If you go downrange they'll probably relax a bit, but you never know.

[Smitty_Damitty]

The theory is that the enemy will not attack a unit if its soldiers all look the same.


Now, I'm no General or Flag officer but, I could tell you off the bat that the biggest load of poo I've ever heard. Surprisingly enough (at least to me), the Army does seem to push the uniformity issue more than does the Marines. Especially now that every piece of your guys' gear is ACU'd up from the floor up. Although, our chain would threaten us with NJP's and the like if we weren't uniform throughout our work-ups and training ops. Once we got in country though, we configured our own rigs and uniformity subsequently went out the window.

[LineDoggie]

The theory is that the enemy will not attack a unit if its soldiers all look the same.


My theory is whomever came up with that is using crack. Just another typical Bull**** excuse given by some CSM still living in the days of LC gear set up for Parades, not combat.

I GUARANTEE you will not find one TTP coming from the enemy that says to attack the guys with chest rigs or Avoid those with FLC's. The person who seriously puts that forth is incredibly deluded.

Think about it, how good is enemy observation, that on the field they can detect the difference between an ACU Pattern Issue FLC with only Issue Pouches and say a MAV while wearing ACU uniforms, and pattern Vest cover? and that that enters the enemy OODA loop as a consideration for engaging?

One of the Bde.s I was O/C 'ing for put out a memo from thier CSM wanting a similar set up as he thought it was "Neatest". At least he admitted that was why, so I gave him credit for that. During lanes training we showed him the advantages of having the option for the gear seperate from the vest, and of setting the pouches up to suit the individual shooter (IFAK excepted) and not to parade standards and to his credit the CSM who had never been downrange before decided to change his policy.

Sorry for the rant but I really hate dumb motherfcukers who come up with the stupidest reasons for their uniform policies, they should just admit their neat freaks. These are the same type of clown who would have the armorer reset all the M16 sights Mechanical Zero for IG Inspections so everything was dress right dress (and I have seen that done several times at Hood).

[dave81]

The theory is that the enemy will not attack a unit if its soldiers all look the same.

I'm guessing this is an E-3 and below's "barracks lawyer" theory about why they have to be uniform, to give them something to grumble about. I seriously doubt (or at least I seriously HOPE not) that this is the reason put out to the soldiers by their chain of command as to why they all have to be uniform.

[EVIL NADMAN]

Hey, I am currently in a unit in the US Army that is in my opinion tieing its soldiers hands with its strict gear standards.

Chinstrap must be ACU Green, must have army issue one with new stupid bulky Nape released by the Army

IBA - IOTV pouches must be set up according to packet, no other way is an option and you may not have any additional pouches just Canteen, Mags, Med pouch.

No chest rigs, FLC everything must be attached.

The theory is that the enemy will not attack a unit if its soldiers all look the same.

Are there any other units like this? there is nothing I can do, but I would like to avoid units like this in the future.

I think that not every soldier fights the same and this is a bit stupid.
The reason that they do stupid sh!t like that is because if you don't have a standard there is going to be that one retard who would leave the wire without his NVGs and ammo... Trust me I have seen that kind of thing before. The unit is over compensating right now and it should fix itself in a couple of months when they realize that the standard that they have put out just doesn't cut it to the mission requirement.

[gaijinsamurai]

I served with both the Marines and the Army National Guard (on active duty in Kuwait), and from my experience, I felt the Army was a lot more uptight, in regards to what we wore.
But, it is my opinion that it mostly depends on your unit's officers and staff ncos.

In the Marine Corps, it seemed like the only thing they really cared about was if we were wearing our flak vests. I was a gear hound back then, and bought all kids of crap from Brigade Quartermasters, US Cavalry, etc., plus kit I had traded with foreign soldiers. My platoon and company commanders would tease me about it, but no one ever tried to stop me. I think the only times they ever tried to enforce some sort of uniformity was when high ranking officers were in the area.

[Hollis]

When I was in the Marines, a part of our gear as borrowed from the Army and from the other side. In the states a completely different issue. Uniformity is also part of the KISS principle. It may not seem like it, but it is for management. Plus it gives 2nd Lts something to do and hopefully will keep them out of trouble. 2nd Lt needs to feel important too.

[SoundOFaGun]

Let me guess: You're an airsofter who joined the US Army and suddenly found yourself unable to wear the Gucci kit you spent all your parents' money on? :)

Some units are a__holes about it, some aren't; as mentioned, it depends on your CO/1SG. For years, I had my IBA set up exactly the way I wanted, then when we got a new 1SG he had us stand in formation with all our gear on and had our supervisors make notes on everything that needed to be "corrected" for uniformity. If you go downrange they'll probably relax a bit, but you never know.

Ha not an airsofter, not a geardo, just a soldier that works better when his kit is how i like it

[SoundOFaGun]

The theory is that the enemy will not attack a unit if its soldiers all look the same.

I'm guessing this is an E-3 and below's "barracks lawyer" theory about why they have to be uniform, to give them something to grumble about. I seriously doubt (or at least I seriously HOPE not) that this is the reason put out to the soldiers by their chain of command as to why they all have to be uniform.


This is a 1st Sgt. "An insurgent looking through a dragonov scope will think twice about shooting at a unit that has everything the same"

Well im sure a sniper is going to take a shot on a team of rangers or SF just as fast as he would on a unit of grunts.

and this dumb @ss nape vs. the very stable and proven H nape or Xnape made by headloc. I like the H nape for NVG support but uniformity over soldiers ability in combat

http://www.army.mil/-images/2007/03/01/3011/size1-army.mil-2007-03-02-080400.jpg

[James]

In the Marine Corps, it seemed like the only thing they really cared about was if we were wearing our flak vests.

This was also my experience. The only time we all looked the same was during a parade. I continued to wear ALICE suspenders long after we'd been issued the LBV, and I augmented my carrying capacity with SAW drum pouches on either side, even though I was no longer a SAW gunner. I wore green jungle boots longer than just about everyone else too.

[TehSuig]

The reason that they do stupid sh!t like that is because if you don't have a standard there is going to be that one retard who would leave the wire without his NVGs and ammo...

That's a leadership failure, not a uniformity one.

SoundOFaGun, what kind of unit are you in? It's my experience that POG units or units that never actually do anything are much more strict about equipment and uniformity. We used to get the stink eye walking around Jalalabad in hiking boots and tan gear from the POGs that lived there, but screw them.

[martinexsquaddie]

can go to far the the other way though my Platoon in the 80s everybody had there own pattern of webbing own packs and various personal weapons had been aquired 2 argentine Fals bringbacks that had been donated and a couple of M16/m203s and some UZI's stolen off the dutch!
strong words were eventually had and somebody who was emigrating to south africa had quite a few extra's included in a hurry in there packing

[Pappy]

Luckily my unit isn't too restrictive. One bad thing is that any personally bought gear must be ACU now. Last deployment we had more freedom.

But one thing that's always been uniform between soldiers is the IFAK. The contents are all set up the same, and it's always on the left side for our Brigade. The IFAK being the same is key because other soldiers will have to use yours when they're trying to patch you up.

Having every other pouch uniform is ridiculous. The no rack systems is ridiculous too. Heck, our Battalion is ordering us all Tactical Tailor racks.

I'm curious, what kind of unit are you in?

[Ratamacue]

My battalion commander has this sort of anal-retentive insistence on uniformity. In most of the line companies they just flat-out ignore it. One company Gunny refuses to let anyone in his company wear boonies as stated in the BN gear SOP. Eight-points only.

Unfortunately, being in the battalion commander's security detail, I don't get the luxury of ignoring his SOP. One of our Sergeants got blasted by him simply for the fact that he had an American flag velcroed to his Camelbak.

[Triple2-11b]

Most of my pouches are multicam, we ditched our FLCs long ago, all that crap just depends on the Brass, Mine just put out it must have IFAK and enough kit to carry your combat load, And no one in my unit wears that gay kevlar pad for the back of your MICH.

[USMC29]

In my unit its pretty chill. As long as you have IFAK and rank on there your good to go.

[EVIL NADMAN]

That's a leadership failure, not a uniformity one.

SoundOFaGun, what kind of unit are you in? It's my experience that POG units or units that never actually do anything are much more strict about equipment and uniformity. We used to get the stink eye walking around Jalalabad in hiking boots and tan gear from the POGs that lived there, but screw them.
Trust me man I'm in an infantry unit with some pretty stupid CSM's recently...

[Dan2004]

Trust me man I'm in an infantry unit with some pretty stupid CSM's recently...

Nasty Girls?

[Sabre]

Sounds pretty anal. My first (TA) unit was like this. Kit inspections before EVERY weekend and exercise. Felt like being a child again.

There is some logic to standardising where/how you carry things like med kit, ammunition, radio kit etc though.

Most UK soldiers were/are taught to put personal trauma kit in the top left smock pocket, so a fellow soldier can get to it quickly. Equally, storing the CSM's spare ammo in the same part of your bergan/daysack would mean that he can quickly centralise it from a bergan cache without pulling out your doss bag, goretex, duvet, lawn chair bedside table etc from your bergan first.

Sounds like your headshed are super-anal though.

That said, I suppose it is only the last ten or twenty years that a tom out of basic could either afford to buy their own kit, or find any commercial kit at all. I kept my head down when I first got in and set my issued kit up to unit SOPs, then splurged loads on kit and am now selling it all back on ebay!

Swings and roundabouts..... :)

[Heazy]

well like it was said, CSM's will be CSM's and enforce sometimes stupid rules. My unit is very lax about gear, anything really as long as it's not armor related. You see quite a mix of RACKs, vests, etc. here. Anything is basically a go as long as you know what your doing with it. The only thing is Multiscam gear is a general no-go but who cares when you are 2km from the boarder with just your platoon. p-)

my whole deal is if it works, its works. No need to make things suck or make things impractical. Yeah im a geardo but i've seen way too many privates walking with rigs which make them look obese with the extra stuff they really dont need. Sometimes uniformity can be a good thing if placed right.

[crazyman]

Here is an alternate look at it...my old CSM instituted very strict kit rules early on, not to make everyone look the same (which does have benefits) but to save young privates from spending a ton of money on cool guy **** then either A deciding they didnt need it, or B wrecking it in training. 60-90 days before deployment the rules were eased back, and it worked out fine. As a leader I believe in doing stuff like this to an extent, to protect soldiers from themselves. private sees a SSG with some crazy rig, spends his months' pay on it...then decides its not for him. Or they see some new vest on here, buy it, then find out that its a no go. Just some food for thought. My advice to anyone in a unit that is being "overly restrictive" is to have patience, and save your money for later on

[Apogee]

Are you in an infantry unit or a support unit?

[crazyman]

The particular unit I'm using as an example was a stryker infantry battalion.

[jimmyboots]

Now, I'm no General or Flag officer but, I could tell you off the bat that the biggest load of poo I've ever heard. Surprisingly enough (at least to me), the Army does seem to push the uniformity issue more than does the Marines. Especially now that every piece of your guys' gear is ACU'd up from the floor up. Although, our chain would threaten us with NJP's and the like if we weren't uniform throughout our work-ups and training ops. Once we got in country though, we configured our own rigs and uniformity subsequently went out the window.


I agree with doc on this. When I was with the MP's in 2004 the thing they cared about in country was that we had our issued flacks and kevlars. I wore a DBT fapc when at a ecp and nobody cared. Shoot, some of our guys would put collaspable stocks on their M16's so they could shoulder them in vechicles and noone cared.

[SoundOFaGun]

Im infantry

[Pappy]

I agree with doc on this. When I was with the MP's in 2004 the thing they cared about in country was that we had our issued flacks and kevlars. I wore a DBT fapc when at a ecp and nobody cared. Shoot, some of our guys would put collaspable stocks on their M16's so they could shoulder them in vechicles and noone cared.

The collapsible buttstocks on M16s has since been locked down Army-wide for regular Army. It's a definite no-no for everyone. But luckily the Army is researching new buffers so they can authorize a legitimate modification work order to the M16s.

[LineDoggie]

Never understood the Army on that when you consider the Canadian C7A2 is basically an M16A2 with M4 stock. Canada doesnt seem to have problems with it

[Apogee]

The reason I ask is in my experiance (Stryker as well) infantry units seemed to be more laid back with gear standards than the support units. Might have just been our leadership though. I didn't care what my guys carried as long as they had their plates in, ammo, water and their IFAK.

[Pappy]

Never understood the Army on that when you consider the Canadian C7A2 is basically an M16A2 with M4 stock. Canada doesnt seem to have problems with it

Well, on this one, the Army isn't just being their usual uptight self. They actually did do tests and the reliability wasn't up to standard. I do wish they'd just come out with that modification work order and buffer already though. They're taking their sweet time as usual.

[HGRazorR]

Well, it's probably for one of the reasons that you had to have your LBE and ruck exactly uniform during BCT, so your Drill or battle buddy could take one look at you and tell right off the bat if you've got the essentials.

At least that's what I think. Yes, someone could have just put out a list of "have this stuff on you," but with everyone having stuff all over the place a simple glance wouldn't be able to decipher if you had all your equipment accountable.

It's just a leadership style and you'll encounter many throughout your career.

[USMCRTop]

This was also my experience. The only time we all looked the same was during a parade. I continued to wear ALICE suspenders long after we'd been issued the LBV, and I augmented my carrying capacity with SAW drum pouches on either side, even though I was no longer a SAW gunner. I wore green jungle boots longer than just about everyone else too.

Yup me too--Colonel only cared if Flak Jackets and helmets were worn- people could go around in flip flops if they wanted to

[joeyl]

my tour to afghanistan went like this: if it was camoflauge (desert,woodland,acu, multicam, marine, od,tan,or black) our CSM would allow it. Had nothing to do with discipline but rather what was comfortable for the guy wearing it. So there was a multitude of tac-vest,FLC, LBV,LCE, and RACK vest for everyone.
I went to Iraq with a different unit everything had to be in UCP but some people had tan, brown, or green gear. On the IOTV its pretty much standard without anyone ever really putting anything out. Ammo pouches in the front, IFAK on the left side, and what ever you can fit on the side or back

[crazyman]

From what I have seen on my deployments, its got a lot to do with the leadership, and the climate in the unit. My first tour it was anything goes, just go out and do your job (stryker, infantry, mosul 2005) my 2nd tour, still in an SBCT, still in an infantry battalion, totally different. The leadership was much more prescriptive with what was worn, carried, etc by its soldiers. Personally, I think it was personal beliefs of the Bn level leadership at each time, their experiences, and the fight we were in.

In some circumstance I am for the leadership enforcing certain standards. If you don't think Iraqis know the meaning of a right shoulder patch on an American soldier, think again. Combat patches and leaders prescribing that everyone wear the current unit one while in theatre is a touchy touchy subject, but I can honestly say that I am for it, along with some other rules. I simply draw the line at telling a soldier you WILL wear your gear according to this exact standard. Partly this is because I'm a southpaw, and no one ever figures that into the plan. placement of first aid gear should be standard for the obvious reason, but I like to leave everything else to shooter preference. To me this is the line between protecting soldiers (both from the enemy and themselves) and going for that parade field uniformity. Take it for what you will

[trunk_munkey28]

Well guys, rest well in the knowledge that you're not saddled with this piece of junk:
http://i44.tinypic.com/a0b155.jpg
Not only is it not modular except for the 2 kinds of pouches under the arms, I have seen kit lists that go so far as to dictate where in your Tacvest you will keep gloves, 50 feet of 550 cord, and a BFA, on operational deployments.

[Pete031]

Good thing we said Fvck that.... There is a 6 rig list out there now including HSGI, TT, Eagle, etc...
Whatever works now.

[LineDoggie]

Upside down Bayonet?

[Pete031]

Yeah it is a ****ty place to have it. Right on the sternum.... And yeah upside down so you can pull it straight down.
However most unit SOP's have it somewhere else so that when you hit the ****e you don't drive it right into your sternum.

[pascalywood]

On Op Podium, you are not allowed to use anything (gloves, boots, camelbacks, tacvest modification, etc) that is not issued.

[DnA]

Upside down Bayonet?


Yea, but the majority of us have our bayonet on the side of the tac vest.







On Op Podium, you are not allowed to use anything (gloves, boots, camelbacks, tacvest modification, etc) that is not issued.

Depends on your unit.

[trunk_munkey28]

Upside down Bayonet?

But doesn't it look fierce? I mean, it's RIGHT THERE!
Can be mounted up or down on the chest, its the only MOLLE on the vest, I column of seven tabs. Most times it's not even mounted there, apparently the Infantry dudes kept getting smacked in the jaw and teeth when they went to ground. I chipped a tooth in my truck's turret on one, snagged on the ring.

[Pete031]

On Op Podium, you are not allowed to use anything (gloves, boots, camelbacks, tacvest modification, etc) that is not issued.

Yeah, a CANLADGEN came out for all troops deploying to Afghanistan. Of course stuff in Canada is still going to be anal.... Public image and all.

[Roy Batty]

On Op Podium, you are not allowed to use anything (gloves, boots, camelbacks, tacvest modification, etc) that is not issued.

You're in the wrong unit man....lol

[pascalywood]

Depends on your unit.

You're in the wrong unit man....lol


This is not a unit thing, Im pretty sure its the whole GJTF (Games Joint Task Force) or whatever it is called in English.

[Roy Batty]

This is not a unit thing, Im pretty sure its the whole GJTF (Games Joint Task Force) or whatever it is called in English.

First off it's supposed to be low-vis anyway so I dont think you'll see alot of Tac vests in public anyway........

[hank2222]

that guy name by chance would it be capt .m-jones would it ..for i think we had the same guy there my friend ..

this guy want everyone to have the same items in the same pants pockets and no other thing in that pocket when we where out in field .. ..

plus when we went to the field we could not wear own private owned custom set up of the mag and other access pouch items on the lbe gear ..where we did a few typle mods to make it fit better here and there over the old style flak jackets we wore..

he wanted everyone to wear the pouchs in the same spot on the all the unit lbe so it would look more uniform when where in the field ..

give me a break on some of the mickey mouse bs that they guys could come up with at the time..

like our boots where not laced up in the standard pattern we laced our boots for the field and daily wear was the old school airborne style or we could not wear do rags around our head under the helemts to keep the sweat off faces at times..

so for the rant ..but those typles of officers and nco typle allways burnt my butt at times with some of the most mickey mouse crap that they could come up with at the time..

[PvtPyle]

Now granted my background is coming from a unit where big boy rules apply and you set up your kit based on your job and personal pref. But that said, what kind of fu@&ed up unit are you in? I mean seriously, what kind of unit is it, NG or active Army nd what is the type of unit. Also, what kind of field experience does your senior leadership have? I would guess not much because this is some serious garrison dress-right-dress bs.

Sounds like a failure of leadership because they are either too stupid to understand that every mans mission and capability is different, or they are lazy and figure this is the best way to keep track of stuff and make inspections easier.

I can't wait to learn more bout this goat-fu@& of a unit. If you want a transfer there are lots of slots open for guys to go down range.

[KEEPER0311]

God I remember during my battalions work up it was anal. Mag pouches had to all be in the same place , dummy cord on every thing, carry all the useless heavtly gear that doesn't work. Luckily once we got to Mojave Viper and we were able to put some distance between ourself and higher we started getting the freedom that as needed. In country the only true SOP place we had was for the IFAK, located centerally on your flak, logic being you could reach it with either arm.

[hank2222]

i think that putting your first aid kt and trauma kits all in the same place is a good idea ..
but some of the mickey mouse bs that goes on at times ..it that they do not have anything else to do

[Ratamacue]

God I remember during my battalions work up it was anal. Mag pouches had to all be in the same place , dummy cord on every thing, carry all the useless heavtly gear that doesn't work. Luckily once we got to Mojave Viper and we were able to put some distance between ourself and higher we started getting the freedom that as needed. In country the only true SOP place we had was for the IFAK, located centerally on your flak, logic being you could reach it with either arm.That's the way my battalion is. We're going out to Yuma in about a week for the rest of the month, and the rumor is that my platoon is going to be detached from the BC and SGTMAJ for most of the time instead of driving them around. So hopefully we'll be able to stay away from the COC and go OFP for the majority of the duration.

[PvtPyle]

Your IFAK should be centrally located so that you can get to it with either hand, you never know which one you will still have. Other than that, your **** should go where it works for you and makes you more functional. If you are too assed up to get it right that is what your NCO's are for. Anything else is for politicians and REMF's with no field time. It is a serious lack of quality leadership plain and simple.

[hank2222]

on our lbe ..we all had the first aid pouch on the left shoulder strap taped down for use in the field ..

that why a lot of the old timers in the units had the two lbe typle one for the mickey mouse crap around the base and the other for field use and it was set up as you like with the basic of what you think you would need along with all the first aid wound dressing pouch was on the left shoulder ..along with a second first aid dressing in the canteen pouch as need ..


plus i say that you guys have a lot better gunshot trauma and basic trauma kits issused to you now..then we did back and the day ..

for i wonder how many guys would still be alive in the they had the tryple of basic trauma kits that you have now ..

[hank2222]

plus it was a diff typle of warfare back in my day ..,

for my time it was the russian comeing over the fuda gap and we where going to get over ran and it was little alamo typles of fights. up and down the gap area .. for we had to buy time with our lifes to allow our familys to get out the area and somewhere safe .for we all had our familys with us there in germany and that was a lot of us worryed about at times if the russian came over the gap .

if we could hold them up here and there enough to throw off there time tables to allow the familys in the areas to escape and the people behind us get the ball rolling to counterattack the forward waves of russian tank companys

so basicly be came a time stalling effect on our part to help try and pin down so of the russian miltary units in the area to deal with us ......

so we striped it down to the basic ammo and grenades and laws rockets that we could carry and still move around along a little water and food and comfort items as need ..

for we knew that we where goin to be overran and it was a basic fight for a few days of survival and time intill something stoped there movement and our side counter attacked to stop the russian attack ..

it a diff typle of warfare now days than i praticed for back in the day ..you guys have better tactics and gear than we ever hoped to have a times ..

..

[Pappy]

Your IFAK should be centrally located so that you can get to it with either hand, you never know which one you will still have. Other than that, your **** should go where it works for you and makes you more functional. If you are too assed up to get it right that is what your NCO's are for. Anything else is for politicians and REMF's with no field time. It is a serious lack of quality leadership plain and simple.

You IFAK is for other people to use on you, not for you to use on yourself. So it's important for it to be in the same place for everyone in your unit.

Personally, I carry one extra tourniquet and an extra Israeli dressing separate from my IFAK for me to use on myself.

[trunk_munkey28]

You IFAK is for other people to use on you, not for you to use on yourself. So it's important for it to be in the same place for everyone in your unit.

Personally, I carry one extra tourniquet and an extra Israeli dressing separate from my IFAK for me to use on myself.

That's an interesting SOP. We're always taught that your IFAK is for yourself, whether using it for self aid or if somebody else is using it for you. The major point is not to use your IFAK to treat other people; they have their own IFAK for that purpose, and if more treatment is needed, a Tactical Combat Casuality Care responder is carrying a bag with extra kit in it.

[KEEPER0311]

That's an interesting SOP. We're always taught that your IFAK is for yourself, whether using it for self aid or if somebody else is using it for you. The major point is not to use your IFAK to treat other people; they have their own IFAK for that purpose, and if more treatment is needed, a Tactical Combat Casuality Care responder is carrying a bag with extra kit in it.

You are correct. Each Marines IFAK was used for his treatment, whether by himself, or another Marine. Centeral location of the IFAK making it easier for an injured Marine to reach his IFAK with either arm. I carried three tourniquets with me, one over my left shoulder, one in my IFAk, and a final one in my right cargo pocket.

[trunk_munkey28]

You are correct. Each Marines IFAK was used for his treatment, whether by himself, or another Marine. Centeral location of the IFAK making it easier for an injured Marine to reach his IFAK with either arm. I carried three tourniquets with me, one over my left shoulder, one in my IFAk, and a final one in my right cargo pocket.

I always carried extra tourniquets for sure. On the few occcasions I was tasked as a M113A3 driver, I actually wore two loosely above my knees.
That SOP ended up saving my buddy's life the next rotation after us.
As well, I was TCCC qual'd. I had a leg bag on my gun belt and we carried a go-bag in my LAV as well.

[Pete031]

That's an interesting SOP. We're always taught that your IFAK is for yourself, whether using it for self aid or if somebody else is using it for you. The major point is not to use your IFAK to treat other people; they have their own IFAK for that purpose, and if more treatment is needed, a Tactical Combat Casuality Care responder is carrying a bag with extra kit in it.


I think you both mean the same thing... Your personal casulty care stuff, is for someone else to use on you... And for you to use on yourself while doing self aid.
You don't use your own on someone elses....:roll:
But whatever keeps the guys alive right.

[PvtPyle]

Your IFAK IS for you, but the first stage is SELF AID. Ask any medic, go to any SOCOM Medical course, ask any PA. YOU have to be able to get to your kit with either hand to begin self aid while everyone else that can still fight gains fire superiority. Then they come help you out. If you get a sprayer you have about 30 seconds to get your tourney on before you pass out. If the doc is 45 seconds away......

[Sabre]

Self aid first...deffo.

There's a case of a Royal Marine who was over a large IED when it went off, leaving him at the bottom of a deep crater. By the time the rest of the patrol located him and got to him, he had already applied a torniquet to his severed arm and one of his severed legs. They quickly used a spare TK and controlled the bleeding in his other leg and he lived. He lost three limbs, but he's alive to see his family and tell the tale. Without the new kit and training, he'd be dead.

[Pappy]

Yes, you guys are correct. I had some verbal diarrhea. The IFAK is for self-aid, and first aid on you from someone else. Although my personal method is to have an easily accessible CAT and Israeli dressing in addition to my IFAK. That way I can handle most issues myself without fumbling through the IFAK.