The BNP on Question Time (UK)

[Stevey1]

So, what's everyones' opinion on tonight's show?

I think that freedom of speech ensures that Nick Griffin had a right to take part in the programme.

However, while I understand the intention, devoting 99% of the programme to attacking the BNP may well backfire. While of course it is different with a racist party, the show did not spend a similar amount of time attacking UKIP participants on Europe or the Greens on the environment when they took part. Griffin may be able to present himself as a martyr in this regard, which is dangerous.

The anti-fascist protesters may well have played into BNP hands as well when they became violent (policemen injured etc). I don't know if anyone saw it on the news but the anti-fascists that had to be dragged along the floor out of the BBC building whilst wagging their fingers seemed to be a bit idiotic. Had I been a policeman there, I may have been tempted to use them to mop the floor :)

I thought Sayeeda Warsi actually came across the best. Adopt a sensible cap on immigration and groups like the BNP will shrink very quickly, I believe.

[Estopped]

The BNP are a joke. There's no doubt that all the furore over his appearance was a boon to him and his party.

[nemowork]

I thought Sayeeda Warsi actually came across the best. Adopt a sensible cap on immigration and groups like the BNP will shrink very quickly, I believe. The problem is that she has a very obvious get out clause when anybody accuses her of being a closet BNP supporter and racist. Lots of other people are still stuck in the 60's and 70's mindest where coloured minorities had to be protected from a biased white state and majority. Jack Straw seems to be one of them and Peter Hain is another. It gets complicated now some of the establishment are the children of thiose minorities and the new minorities are white eastern european and people have seen them integrate, its culture not colour that scares people now and i'm not sure how much the anti0fascist groups have adapted to that. Griffin definately got flattened except for a brief perking up at the end when the subject turned to immigration policy, i dont think it will do much for his supporters since they expected him to be attacked by the media, the sheer dislike shown by the audience might make a point but i dont think it will make a big victory for either side. Still Griffin trying to defend David Duke the 'non-violent' leader of the KKK made me chuckle just for the audience reaction.

[coltfan111]

So, what's everyones' opinion on tonight's show?

I think that freedom of speech ensures that Nick Griffin had a right to take part in the programme.

However, while I understand the intention, devoting 99% of the programme to attacking the BNP may well backfire. While of course it is different with a racist party, the show did not spend a similar amount of time attacking UKIP participants on Europe or the Greens on the environment when they took part. Griffin may be able to present himself as a martyr in this regard, which is dangerous.

The anti-fascist protesters may well have played into BNP hands as well when they became violent (policemen injured etc). I don't know if anyone saw it on the news but the anti-fascists that had to be dragged along the floor out of the BBC building whilst wagging their fingers seemed to be a bit idiotic. Had I been a policeman there, I may have been tempted to use them to mop the floor :)

I thought Sayeeda Warsi actually came across the best. Adopt a sensible cap on immigration and groups like the BNP will shrink very quickly, I believe.

Yer the UAF commies annoy the hell out of me. They brand anything that openly questions our imigration policy and national identity as facist. Attacking police and trying to shut down open forum because one person on it disagrees with you view sounds prety facist to me.

Yer she made the best points. There is a problem and not adressing it in the open and head on will only lead to a rise in facism.

[LordTyphus]

The FN and BNP should form an alliance; however I have some reservations about the BNP which is a bit too extreme and might tarnish the FN growing reputation. It was Marine LePen who made the revelation about the pedophile Frederic Mitterand. The FN is about the same as the Republican I reckon.

Yea a Celtic warrioress, not a Hungrian, at the head of France, whose core is Celtic!
http://www.nationspresse.info/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/lepen_marine.jpg

[muttbutt]

The FN and BNP should form an alliance; however I have some reservations about the BNP which is a bit too extreme and might tarnish the FN growing reputation. It was Marine LePen who made the revelation about the pedophile Frederic Mitterand. The FN is about the same as the Republican I reckon.

Yea a Celtic warrioress, not a Hungrian, at the head of France, whose core is Celtic!
http://www.nationspresse.info/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/lepen_marine.jpg
Wha?........................:|

[Connaught Ranger]

So, what's everyones' opinion on tonight's show?

I think that freedom of speech ensures that Nick Griffin had a right to take part in the programme.

However, while I understand the intention, devoting 99% of the programme to attacking the BNP may well backfire. While of course it is different with a racist party, the show did not spend a similar amount of time attacking UKIP participants on Europe or the Greens on the environment when they took part. Griffin may be able to present himself as a martyr in this regard, which is dangerous.

The anti-fascist protesters may well have played into BNP hands as well when they became violent (policemen injured etc). I don't know if anyone saw it on the news but the anti-fascists that had to be dragged along the floor out of the BBC building whilst wagging their fingers seemed to be a bit idiotic. Had I been a policeman there, I may have been tempted to use them to mop the floor :)

I thought Sayeeda Warsi actually came across the best. Adopt a sensible cap on immigration and groups like the BNP will shrink very quickly, I believe.

Now that would have been a very intelligent thing to do in front of tv cameras.:roll: If you were a policeman, you would be required to follow the law and regulations the same as anybody else or face charges and disciplinary action if you went OTT.

[CMNot]

I don't think it was a moment of pride for the BBC. I didn't expect it to be non-partisan, but I didn't expect it to be a bear pit either.

There is some ~45million voters in the UK. On average 60% may vote, or ~27-28m. So one in every 30 British citizens is voting for a party that wants to fire brown people into space. That is not so insignificant. The show did nothing to suggest the major parties will wrest any of those 1m votes from extremism to moderatism. There are clearly issues that need to be tackled, confronted, or at least distorted and spun.

Griffin showed brief glimpses of his inability. The program could (and IMO should) have let him shoot himself in the foot (which he displayed he was more than capable of and willing to do), instead of baying and heckling. If anything, I imagine in BNP areas it may entrench feeling towards if not him then perhaps his party.

[WKD]

I don't think it was a moment of pride for the BBC. I didn't expect it to be non-partisan, but I didn't expect it to be a bear pit either.

There is some ~45million voters in the UK. On average 60% may vote, or ~27-28m. So one in every 30 British citizens is voting for a party that wants to fire brown people into space. That is not so insignificant. The show did nothing to suggest the major parties will wrest any of those 1m votes from extremism to moderatism. There are clearly issues that need to be tackled, confronted, or at least distorted and spun.

Griffin showed brief glimpses of his inability. The program could (and IMO should) have let him shoot himself in the foot (which he displayed he was more than capable of and willing to do), instead of baying and heckling. If anything, I imagine in BNP areas it may entrench feeling towards if not him then perhaps his party.

Meh, bring on the bear pits I say. If they can't last on the beeb how the **** are they meant to last in parliament?

I want my politicians to destroy each other. Respectful and dignified is for when the Queen is around. If they start treating each other like that then I'm going to start counting the silver.

[rgjbloke]

I'm not for giving Nazi's any publicity but the BBC said it's obliged under it's rules to invite them so it did. Anyone who claims it's anti-democracy to deny the BNP their "right" to participate should bear in mind the freedom people gained when the Nazi's gained power in Germany. That's why I would deny them the oxygen of national publicity in institutions like the BBC.

Having said that. Nick Griffin came across as an insignificant bigotted man lacking in the stature that you generally see in politicians who aspire to lead the country. The reception he received on the program both from the audience and the other guests was overwhelming in it's disgust at him and his party. I think Griffin and the BNP gained nothing from being there. Giving that he will play a role in politics as a member of the European Parliament for the next 4 years, I look forward to seeing him being held up in the public arena for the bigoted small minded fascist that he is.

[Strongie]

These type of occasions remind me of a showtrial in Stalins Soviet Union. The host is the judge that has instructions beforehand on what his verdict should be. A panel of professional opinionmakers act as the jury and are there to educate the masses on what's ok to think and speak about. And to finish the charade there's a selected audience with a mission show "spontaneous" fury towards the peoples enemy. No real interest in discussing the issues, the objective is to show the undecided whats going to happen if they choose the same path as the accused.

Disgusting. The state of democracy is weak in a country that cannot handle different opinions. If his opinions are so "looney" there should be no problems in argumenting against them instead of attacking him as a person with a lynch mob mentality.

[Connaught Ranger]

These type of occasions remind me of a showtrial in Stalins Soviet Union. The host is the judge that has instructions beforehand on what his verdict should be. A panel of professional opinionmakers act as the jury and are there to educate the masses on what's ok to think and speak about. And to finish the charade there's a selected audience with a mission show "spontaneous" fury towards the peoples enemy. No real interest in discussing the issues, the objective is to show the undecided whats going to happen if they choose the same path as the accused.

Disgusting. The state of democracy is weak in a country that cannot handle different opinions. If his opinions are so "looney" there should be no problems in argumenting against them instead of attacking him as a person with a lynch mob mentality.

I thought he received the same response that his own "party" political manefesto aims to encourage, i.e. intolerance, hatred, and outright condemnation, why did he not seem to fit right in? :roll:

[Britishhawk]

To deny the BNP air time is against the UK Charter. I myself was quite annoyed at how the show went down, for a start its called 'Question time' yet it was more of a brawl. There was an African American woman.. who works in a museum? I dont understand why they bought her on?

I thought the show was about politics yet they kept having personal digs at Nick Griffin and not about the BNP policies as a whole, for example: they kept using 'quotes' from him from the past, then inviting the audience to have a bash.

Dont get me wrong, im not fan of Nick Griffin but I do however agree with some of the BNP's policies. The only fuel the other parties have against the BNP is to keep naming them as 'racists' & 'Nazi's'.

[futurepilot2004]

Watched it last night and thought it was a fantastic idea to get Nick Griffin on. It showed him to be a rambling idiot.

Now saying that, I agree with "Britishhawk", not in relation to the BNPs policies, but to the fact that Nick Griffin/BNP are entitled to air time and to freedom of speech. The discussion did tend to descend every now and then into everyone trying to shout as many insults as they could at Griffin whe they should have been debating BNP policies.

Did anyone else think Jack Straw did a terrible job btw??

[vrb]

To deny the BNP air time is against the UK Charter. I myself was quite annoyed at how the show went down, for a start its called 'Question time' yet it was more of a brawl. There was an African American woman.. who works in a museum? I dont understand why they bought her on?

I thought the show was about politics yet they kept having personal digs at Nick Griffin and not about the BNP policies as a whole, for example: they kept using 'quotes' from him from the past, then inviting the audience to have a bash.

Dont get me wrong, im not fan of Nick Griffin but I do however agree with some of the BNP's policies. The only fuel the other parties have against the BNP is to keep naming them as 'racists' & 'Nazi's'.

Bonnie Greer has been on question time plenty of times before and is deputy chairman of the British Museum, a place Griffin should visit. The BNP and it's supporters trumpeted this as Nicks 'Coming Out Parade' so why wouldn't a lot of the questions be about his view and policies especially as he thinks that their policies are being kept out of mainstream debate. If the questions had been about the price of fish, his supporters would have moaned that policies the BNP believes in were not being debated.

I think he should be on Question time more, him and idiots like Galloway.

It was interesting to hear his views about the 'Non violent KKK' and his Ice age history lesson. Also the platform he shared with Abu Hamza and his courting of Gadaffi

[Strongie]

I thought he received the same response that his own "party" political manefesto aims to encourage, i.e. intolerance, hatred, and outright condemnation, why did he not seem to fit right in? :roll:

Please spare from that type of pre-packed responses. I reacting to how some of the most important issues of our time in Europe, immigration and islam, is off limits for discussion and that any attempt ends in a public showtrial.

[Connaught Ranger]

Please spare from that type of pre-packed responses. I reacting to how some of the most important issues of our time in Europe, immigration and islam, is off limits for discussion and that any attempt ends in a public showtrial.

Sod off kid, where does it say my legitimate opinion has to agree with your preconceptions with regards the BNP. The majority of the British people know what these pilliocks stand for, many are veterans of fighting such ideas from 1939 - 1945, some thing Griffin and his "supporters" would do well to remember.

Of course there are no more important things in UK & Europe than immigration and Islam, especially if you are a subscriber to the tin.pot Islamification of Europe theory.:roll:

And lets forget the BNP has no standing in the Government of Britain, and two seats in the European Parliament is not much to brag about either.:roll:

[Muddlers]

I thought it was a joke too. I agree with Britishawk. This was a childish display of 'bashing' the BNP. Yes I am against the BNP completely, however like he said, why the hell is there a 'token' black from a Museum.

What annoys me more, is the fact to the run up to the broadcast, they were worried about issues regarding public safety when the only people causing public disorder is the UAF (United Against Facism) and sending a police officer to hospital. In my opinion they are just as bad as the bloody fascists by bullying, threatening in this case Nick Griffin.

[DPM_Sheep]

The QT panel has always been made up of politicians, political commentators, collumists and academics. Bonnie Greer falls into the latter category and has been on QT several times. "Token Black" she wasn't.

[Strongie]

Sod off kid, where does it say my legitimate opinion has to agree with your preconceptions with regards the BNP. The majority of the British people know what these pilliocks stand for, many are veterans of fighting such ideas from 1939 - 1945, some thing Griffin and his "supporters" would do well to remember.

Of course there are no more important things in UK & Europe than immigration and Islam, especially if you are a subscriber to the tin.pot Islamification of Europe theory.:roll:

And lets forget the BNP has no standing in the Government of Britain, and two seats in the European Parliament is not much to brag about either.:roll:

Right back at you old man, it seems that manners and style doesn't improve with age when it comes to you, well you can't improve what you've never had. :slap:

Immigration, islam and the effects of it are some of the most important issues in Europe today, if you haven't been following the changes that secularized western societies have made for the worse in order to adapt to this you must be very uninformed. Politicians are killed, artists are threatend, there are riots in suburbs across Europe, parallel sharia courts are instituted and so on, wait, I must be a nazi so this isn't happening.:roll:

[Connaught Ranger]

Right back at you old man, it seems that manners and style doesn't improve with age when it comes to you, well you can't improve what you've never had. :slap:

Immigration, islam and the effects of it are some of the most important issues in Europe today, if you haven't been following the changes that secularized western societies have made for the worse in order to adapt to this you must be very uninformed. Politicians are killed, artists are threatend, there are riots in suburbs across Europe, parallel sharia courts are instituted and so on, wait, I must be a nazi so this isn't happening.:roll:

Or a closet BNP supporter.p-)

[Muddlers]

The QT panel has always been made up of politicians, political commentators, collumists and academics. Bonnie Greer falls into the latter category and has been on QT several times. "Token Black" she wasn't.

Good point and taken.

[CMNot]

Did anyone else think Jack Straw did a terrible job btw??

I thought the Demon Headmaster was doing OK up until he received the full **** for Liebours dreadful handling on immigration.


I thought he received the same response that his own "party" political manefesto aims to encourage, i.e. intolerance, hatred, and outright condemnation, why did he not seem to fit right in? :roll:

Nice.

I would have preferred to have seen him on Paxman, or perhaps on QT someplace else than West London. The major parties still need to address the xenophobia and racism that has swelled support for extremist politics; something, on last nights eveidence, they are utterly failing to do.

I think the politicians present were also guilty of downplaying the typecast of BNP voters. They have to acknowledge, even internally, that racism is still a very clear and present trait in 'modern' Britain. Mishandling that merely highlights the already obvious disconnection between Westminster and 'the world'.

I think the BNP gathering enough strenght to influence British politics would be an unmitigated disaster for Britain; far worse than anything even Bliar/Brown have managed to concoct. The political establishment however, needs to deal with the issues that have 'empowered' them. ****to.

[Lazy Lob]

Even though the BNP are a bunch of bell-ends I think the BBC made the right choice. Dimbleby could have done a better job moderating and stopped the non ending attacks on Griffin. But I do find it disgraceful that “liberal” and “anti-fascist” elements of society wanted to gag Griffin. Griffin is quite capable of shooting himself in the foot and doesn’t need anyone’s help. But these self righteous gaggers are just as dangerous, if not more so IMHO. Who the f@ck do they think they are dictating how the democratic process should work?

Griffin made little sense but a lot of the tirade and vitriol against Griffin did not follow any logic either and that played in his favour.

[Muddlers]

Even though the BNP are a bunch of bell-ends I think the BBC made the right choice. Dimbleby could have done a better job moderating and stopped the non ending attacks on Griffin. But I do find it disgraceful that “liberal” and “anti-fascist” elements of society wanted to gag Griffin. Griffin is quite capable of shooting himself in the foot and doesn’t need anyone’s help. But these self righteous gaggers are just as dangerous, if not more so IMHO. Who the f@ck do they think they are dictating how the democratic process should work?

Griffin made little sense but a lot of the tirade and vitriol against Griffin did not follow any logic either and that played in his favour.

Good post and totally agree.

[Strongie]

Or a closet BNP supporter.p-)

Just keep dodging the issues, use personal attacks on those who talk about them and eventually the problems will go away. How original. :roll:

[oldsoak]

A very perverse part of me hopes it will backfire - and then we might see some intelligent action, and not the knee jerk reaction that the various political groups have to the BNP and the smug "it wont happen here" attitude from them - its a bit like watching the genesis of the NSDAP over again. Like all these organisations, it has its greatest support from amongst the working classes, especially those who considerer themselves unfairly disadvantaged. Until the Lib, Lab + Cons make an effort to listen, appreciate, and allay the fears of this section of society, I can only see the BNP - as odious as it is - making headway.

[NathS]

The FN and BNP should form an alliance; however I have some reservations about the BNP which is a bit too extreme and might tarnish the FN growing reputation. It was Marine LePen who made the revelation about the pedophile Frederic Mitterand. The FN is about the same as the Republican I reckon.

Yea a Celtic warrioress, not a Hungrian, at the head of France, whose core is Celtic!
http://www.nationspresse.info/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/lepen_marine.jpg

They don't need anyone to tarnish their "reputation".


On January 7 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/January_7), 2005 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005), Jean-Marie Le Pen declared in the far-right newspaper Rivarol that the Germans' occupation of France "hadn't been so inhumane".[32] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-31) On 13 September (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_13) 1987 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1987) he had already referred to the Nazi gas chambers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extermination_camp) as "a point of detail of the Second World War (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_World_War)." In accordance with the 1990 Gayssot Act (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gayssot_Act) prohibiting Holocaust denial (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial) and others forms of negationism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_revisionism_%28negationism%29), he was at the time condemned to pay 1.2 millions Francs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Franc) (183,200 Euros)[33] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-32)
Bruno Gollnisch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruno_Gollnisch), MEP (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Member_of_the_European_Parliament) and leader of the European parliamentary group Identity, Tradition and Sovereignty (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identity,_Tradition_and_Sovereignty) since its creation in early January 2007, was condemned the same month to three months of prison on probation and 55,000 Euros in damages and interest by Lyon's tribunal correctionnel (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Tribunal_correctionnel&action=edit&redlink=1) for the "offense of verbal contestation of the existence of crimes against humanity,"[7] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-holocauste-6) Gollnisch had carried out the incriminated verbal contestation on October 11 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_11), 2004 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004), by declaring:
I do not question the existence of concentration camps but historians could discuss the number of deaths. As to the existence of gas chambers, it is up to historians to make up their minds {de se déterminer}.[34] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-33)
Some FN activists have been prosecuted for illegal acts : on May 1 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_1), 1995 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1995), Brahim Bouraam was pushed into the Seine River (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seine_River) by four FN activists.[35] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-MRAP-34)[36] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-35) In December 1997, skinhead (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi-Skinheads) David Beaune was judged in Le Havre (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Havre) for the death of Imad Bouhoud.[37] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-36)[38] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-37)[39] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-38) In 1998, Ibrahim Ali (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibrahim_Ali_%28France%29), a 17-year-old Frenchman with Comorian origins, was shot dead by three FN billstickers, members of the FN's militia, the Department of Protection-Security (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Protection-Security) (DPS) (15 years, 10 years and 2 years of prison for the group).[35] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-MRAP-34)[40] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29#cite_note-39)
Yep, about the same as the Republican. :roll:

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_National_%28France%29)
(Before anyone complain about Wikipedia, I'll just remind you that the most interesting part is always located at the bottom.)

[Britishhawk]

Parties moan about the BNP's intolerance but by intolerating the intolerable they infact contradict themselves... I've lost myself here :S.

[Stevey1]

Now that would have been a very intelligent thing to do in front of tv cameras.:roll: If you were a policeman, you would be required to follow the law and regulations the same as anybody else or face charges and disciplinary action if you went OTT.


I'm sorry if my comment offended anyone, it was made in jest. I support and sympathise with those peaceful protestors at the BBC last night (and that includes those who staged a peaceful sit in). I just thought that those protestors who refused to walk out of the BBC having made their point looked a bit daft being dragged out.

Of course using protestors who have to be dragged along the marble ground as a mop substitute would not be practical or moral and may not be a great advert for community policing :)

I still think that changing the whole format of the show to attack Nick Griffin was a mistake. I see today that the BNP are, indeed, using this to play the 'victim' card. Yes the show successfully reinforced that the BNP are unpleasant, racist and should be opposed at every turn. But listening to a radio phone-in this morning, many people thought it went too close to being an hour-long witch hunt that achieved nothing but to make a bully like Griffin into a martyr.

[martinexsquaddie]

UAF should have stayed out of it nick was quite capable of making himself look like a bellend.

the ice age was a classic as was the non violent KKk (whats the point of that then)

[Connaught Ranger]

Just keep dodging the issues, use personal attacks on those who talk about them and eventually the problems will go away. How original. :roll:

Your post is full of crap, to read it sounds like there is wide spread killing of European politicians and "Artists" all over Europe and we know that is not true.

There is no issue to dodge, and this has been proved countless times on other similar threads posted by Islamaphobes such as yourself, so please go and get your tinfoil hat refitted as your arguments as such are nonfactual and pointless.

Pretty much the same as the BNP and like minded manifestos. rofl rofl

[CMNot]

Talking of Celts and indigenous peoples...Celts are descended from Iberian fisherman. How that is indigenous is beyond me. Likewise Anglo-Saxons, quite a way from a pure bloodline there. Neither is fine Aryan stock. For a Cambridge history student, Griffin sure does a fine line in revisionism.

On the plus side, according to some, I woke up this morning an Aborigine and didn't have drunk Australians taunting me p-)

[oldsoak]

I havent woken up with an aborigine in a long time

[Lazy Lob]

UAF should have stayed out of it nick was quite capable of making himself look like a bellend.

the ice age was a classic as was the non violent KKk (whats the point of that then)

Grier also talked a lot of bollocks about the ice age. It was a pathetic spectacle all round, except for Warsi.

[martinexsquaddie]

UAF should have stayed out of it nick was quite capable of making himself look like a bellend.

the ice age was a classic as was the non violent KKk (whats the point of that then)

[CMNot]

There's an echo in here.

[Lazy Lob]

Any bunnymen?

[CMNot]

lol, apt song?

http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/t5QfFQA4Tgc

p-)

[vrb]

Grier also talked a lot of bollocks about the ice age. It was a pathetic spectacle all round, except for Warsi.

It was Griffin who brought the ice age up as an example of how far back you had to go to be regarded as indigenous to Britain.

[Lazy Lob]

It was Griffin who brought the ice age up as an example of how far back you had to go to be regarded as indigenous to Britain.

I never said it wasn't but that didn't stop Grier talking bollocks as well.

[Strongie]

Your post is full of crap, to read it sounds like there is wide spread killing of European politicians and "Artists" all over Europe and we know that is not true.

There is no issue to dodge, and this has been proved countless times on other similar threads posted by Islamaphobes such as yourself, so please go and get your tinfoil hat refitted as your arguments as such are nonfactual and pointless.

Pretty much the same as the BNP and like minded manifestos. rofl rofl


No, the wide spread killing occured in the London and Madrid bombings by muslim extremist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_July_2005_London_bombings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madrid_bombings

Totalling 247 killed and 2750 wounded

So far we have one killed politician in Holland with many more threatend.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pim_Fortuyn

About the artist, well I guess you havn't followed the "Muhammed cartoons" and the self cencorship that now follows.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammed_cartoons

But I guess this is non-facutal and discussing it pointless according to you. Your inability to face the issue is as tiresome and old as you obviously are.

[Stevey1]

Even though the BNP are a bunch of bell-ends I think the BBC made the right choice. Dimbleby could have done a better job moderating and stopped the non ending attacks on Griffin. But I do find it disgraceful that “liberal” and “anti-fascist” elements of society wanted to gag Griffin. Griffin is quite capable of shooting himself in the foot and doesn’t need anyone’s help. But these self righteous gaggers are just as dangerous, if not more so IMHO. Who the f@ck do they think they are dictating how the democratic process should work?

Griffin made little sense but a lot of the tirade and vitriol against Griffin did not follow any logic either and that played in his favour.


Agreed on all counts

[CMNot]

It was Griffin who brought the ice age up as an example of how far back you had to go to be regarded as indigenous to Britain.

Which again would point to anyone being of Anglo-Saxon or Celtic descent would not be indigenous.

Here's a rather amusing twist on Griffin's indigenous stream of consciousness. A racist apartheid like system was in place circa the fifth century; the aim was to stop the Anglo-Saxon bloodline mixing with the existing Celtic Britons. Some indigenous homology there.


No, the wide spread killing occured in the London and Madrid bombings by muslim extremist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_July_2005_London_bombings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madrid_bombings

Totalling 247 killed and 2750 wounded

So far we have one killed politician in Holland with many more threatend.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pim_Fortuyn

About the artist, well I guess you havn't followed the "Muhammed cartoons" and the self cencorship that now follows.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammed_cartoons

But I guess this is non-facutal and discussing it pointless according to you. Your inability to face the issue is as tiresome and old as you obviously are.

249 dead. Not a lot is it?

In the ensuing 8 years since the Afghan debacle began, we've lost ~23,000 dead on the British roads with a further ~1,280,000 injured. I henceforth propose the voluntary repatriation of all motor vehicles to Greenland.

[Lazy Lob]

lol, apt song?


p-)

:) It is.......

[oldsoak]

Which again would point to anyone being of Anglo-Saxon or Celtic descent would not be indigenous.

Here's a rather amusing twist on Griffin's indigenous stream of consciousness. A racist apartheid like system was in place circa the fifth century; the aim was to stop the Anglo-Saxon bloodline mixing with the existing Celtic Britons. Some indigenous homology there.

Souds like a re-hash of Aryanism to me.
I'd love to see the evidence. In anycase, divisions between the two would have been along tribal and linguistic lines. Both tribes would have kept to themselves simply because it was easier tro be understood - and even then, there was considerable intermingling.

[CMNot]

There's a UCL paper on the quasi-apartheid system here (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1635457/). It's a fascinating piece of history, as is so much regarding the British Isles. It's just with several thousand years to pick from, it is very challenging to engage with most of it in any depth or detail. That's where I develop slight envy for the Canadian/American/Australian historian p-)

Here's something to get lost in Oldsoak -> Linky (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Origins-British-Genetic-Detective-Story/dp/1845294823/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1256299787&sr=8-1-fkmr0)

Laugh a minute, I'm sure.

[Stevey1]

Oh dear, looks like the programme may have portrayed Griffin as a victim to many, as feared:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/oct/23/bbc-question-time-responses-griffin

[CMNot]

Not a massive surprise. 1m votes, ~33k members, you had to figure some would at least send an email.

[Connaught Ranger]

No, the wide spread killing occured in the London and Madrid bombings by muslim extremist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_July_2005_London_bombings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madrid_bombings

Totalling 247 killed and 2750 wounded

So far we have one killed politician in Holland with many more threatend.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pim_Fortuyn

About the artist, well I guess you havn't followed the "Muhammed cartoons" and the self cencorship that now follows.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammed_cartoons

But I guess this is non-facutal and discussing it pointless according to you. Your inability to face the issue is as tiresome and old as you obviously are.

Hey-up Cloggie,:)

Following your questionable line of reasoning then, the U.K. would have had the right to nuke the Republic of Ireland for the terrorist attacks carried out by the mainly Catholic Nationalist I.R.A. and their associated splinter groups.

A campaign which killed far more people than the "London or Madrid" car bombings by your Islamic terrorists.

The U.K. is well used to and prepared to deal with real terrorist threats if and when the need be, and that can be achieved without the Fascist, racist, mentality of a bunch of idiots like the BNP.

Perhaps the question of the BNP stance of Gay-Rights in the U.K. should have been put to Nick "the fruit" Griffin. rofl

[oldsoak]

There's a UCL paper on the quasi-apartheid system here (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1635457/). It's a fascinating piece of history, as is so much regarding the British Isles. It's just with several thousand years to pick from, it is very challenging to engage with most of it in any depth or detail. That's where I develop slight envy for the Canadian/American/Australian historian p-)

Here's something to get lost in Oldsoak -> Linky (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Origins-British-Genetic-Detective-Story/dp/1845294823/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1256299787&sr=8-1-fkmr0)

Laugh a minute, I'm sure.

@CMN - interesting. No doubt a cornerstone arguement for institutional racism.

[Eagle The Lightning]

http://www.youtube.com/v/_QAvkFS_cgk

.....p-)

[CMNot]

Haha, Cassette Boy wasting no time.

[Derbedeu]

LOL!, Thanks for that Eagle! That made my day! :)

[coltfan111]

hahahaha! Now thats funny!

I don't see how people think he is a danger to appear on television, he hardly has the magnetic charisma of Adolf Hitler, if anything he undermines the "cause"; he inspires pity yes, but people don't want to have a leader who has the personality and power of a wet carrot.

The problem is that the far left don't want any pressing issues regarding immigration brought to light as it may be detrimental to their uber socialist/communist wet dream of england becoming the "repulbic of the combined global community".

[SpankyMcCollins]

Gave me a quite a few chuckles watching it, don't support the BNP, but I hate the UAF, some decent points were made about immigration.

Just popped on the site and huh, utter bullsh*t or has the BBC and question time just made a huge mistake ?

http://bnp.org.uk/2009/10/lynch-mob-question-time-becomes-biggest-recruitment-night-ever-for-bnp-%E2%80%93-30-increase-in-membership-interest/

[CMNot]

Spanky, I'd take ANY numbers the BNP quote with a large sack of salt (probably over Griffin's lips, I hear he likes that).

If you sort the BNP membership list by member no., you'll see some...massaging (ho ho).

I present you, magic membership list.

http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/6913/bnplulz.th.jpg (http://img36.imageshack.us/i/bnplulz.jpg/)

According to the BNP, they have had a leap of 3000 memberships today, or 30% of their total. In which case they simply can't have the 100k+ they claim. Again, looking at their membership list, they appear to have ~40k members. So a figure of ~10% is more likely accurate. That is of course, assuming that they have dropped their penchant for multiplying reality by multiple thousands.

EDIT: Actually it looks like the figure of ~20k is more accurate for their membership taking into account the April figures and the BNPs claims of membership since.

[Blackcatnursery]

Gave me a quite a few chuckles watching it, don't support the BNP, but I hate the UAF, some decent points were made about immigration.

Just popped on the site and huh, utter bullsh*t or has the BBC and question time just made a huge mistake ?

Immigration is the big topic that neither of the two main parties have got to grips with. Labour wants it because they vote Labour, Con's don't care because they don't live in the area where they settle.
UAF are in some respects more dangerous than the BNP, we need neither in the UK.
Unfortunately the BBC made Griffin look like a victim and people will continue to gather on his side.
The run up to the election next year is going to be really interesting.

[Connaught Ranger]

Since BNP hates the Irish I can only say that a vote for BNP is in everyone's best interest. All racial groups should put their grievances aside and unite against those smelly gingers.

Oh look "Dances with Reindeer" made a funny post :roll:

[SpankyMcCollins]

Spanky, I'd take ANY numbers the BNP quote with a large sack of salt (probably over Griffin's lips, I hear he likes that).

If you sort the BNP membership list by member no., you'll see some...massaging (ho ho).

I present you, magic membership list.


According to the BNP, they have had a leap of 3000 memberships today, or 30% of their total. In which case they simply can't have the 100k+ they claim. Again, looking at their membership list, they appear to have ~40k members. So a figure of ~10% is more likely accurate. That is of course, assuming that they have dropped their penchant for multiplying reality by multiple thousands.

EDIT: Actually it looks like the figure of ~20k is more accurate for their membership taking into account the April figures and the BNPs claims of membership since.

Hahaha salty. Yeah I figured it'd be utter bullsh*t, cheers for the pic buddy, is that recently leaked list ?

Oh yeah, any reason why you left it on C ? p-) Hah !

[gazell]

I would have not thought the BNP could stand many a candidate at all.

What little I saw of it, Warsi seemed the most reasonable there. They messed it up a bit.

He shouldn't have been on Question Time really, more like on Who do you think you are? That would have been fun.

[CMNot]

Hahaha salty. Yeah I figured it'd be utter bullsh*t, cheers for the pic buddy, is that recently leaked list ?

Oh yeah, any reason why you left it on C ? p-) Hah !

A certain Mr. Coleman lives literally round the corner. Pfff.

The full list can be found here (http://88.80.16.63/leak/bnp-2009.xlsb) (might need to right-click-> Save As).

[Breerman]

Oh look "Dances with Reindeer" made a funny post :roll:
Nothing funny about it.

The Irish have a history of slavery. Introduced by the Vikings and later reinstated by the English.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Were_there_Irish_slaves

[CMNot]

Hold on...you have a problem with the Irish because they were enslaved?

Damn bro, you must hate black people then.

[Connaught Ranger]

Nothing funny about it.

The Irish have a history of slavery. Introduced by the Vikings and later reinstated by the English.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Were_there_Irish_slaves

Oh your source is Wiki, well then it has to be 100% true then. rofl

The post on Wiki-Answers is a pile of s h i t e, look at this:-


Authors Bio: Media Consultant that cares about the future of America and the endless possibilities this nation possesses.:cantbeli:

[happyslapper]

Since BNP hates the Irish I can only say that a vote for BNP is in everyone's best interest. All racial groups should put their grievances aside and unite against those smelly gingers.

Creates quite a quandry for the Jocks then....!

[Breerman]

Oh your source is Wiki, well then it has to be 100% true then

The post on Wiki-Answers is a pile of s h i t e, look at this:-
The English for sure wouldn't be the first ones to do it to you.

It's important to have the background info on all of this to better understand why certain feelings are in play.

[Connaught Ranger]

The English for sure wouldn't be the first ones to do it to you.

It's important to have the background info on all of this to better understand why certain feelings are in play.

Here is my background:-

Born in Nottingham England of an Irish Father / English Mother in 1958.

Father Irish Catholic stock - Mother English Anglican stock

1968 Moved with family to Irish Republic to live.

Attended school in Ireland.

In 1976 myself and my twin brother joined the Irish army, we both served over 21 years in that Force, including service with U.N.I.F.I.L.

Served mainly on the Southern Irish / Northern Ireland Border.

Spent over 5 years researching British Military history in connection with the county of Mayo where I lived. From newspapers of the periods 1700-1920 and old publications in the Librarys.

Astounded at the many myths and stories that the Irish cling to as facts with regards their history.

Astounded with the stories and myths the Plastic Paddys in the U.S.A. continually cling to as the truth:-

(Gee, No I was never in Ireland, my Great Great Great Great Grandaddy was shipped over by the English and he told the family it was because he was a rebel, blah!blah! blah! (in all reality he was a sheep thief or a very common criminal.)

Its also possibly to pay to publish a book filled with any claims and offer it as proof.:roll:

You can say almost anything pre-1600 because there are very few if any written records to back-up the most outlandish claims.

And in reality Wiki answers is about a reliable source as Yahoo Answers :roll:

[kamaz]

just finished watching the program on youtube. Ironically Griffin barely spoke, despite the tons of bile directed at him. I really like the lady from the Conservative party, forgot her name, and the black lady sitting to the left of Griffin with the head band. They had the most common sense of all.

Jack straw is a jackass, a typical 2 faced politician liar, and he got called out on it right there on the program, which was pretty sweet. I wish we had this kind of debate here in the States.

The truth of hte matter is that much of what Griffin said makes sense and is based on reality, despite his and his parties racist views. The 'multicultural' experiment that Labor initiated has been a total failure, and Straw just sat there and denied it knowing the truth full well.

I think Griffin is good for the whole system as a whole, because as ugly as he is, he brings the issue to light and isnt afraid of taboos. There is nothing wrong with wanting to retain your heritage and protect your culture and control immigration to your country. Anything less is cultural suicide.

He kills his own ideas though with his stupid racial quotes and ideology, just like any other dumb bigot.

[Breerman]

@Connaught Ranger

You should submit that a dating site if you think anyone's interested.

[kamaz]

btw the whole talk of ice age, who was here before the ice age, the talk about neanderthals and who is indigenous and who isnt, was beyond retarded and counter productive.


If Griffin was smart, and he is not, he would not even mention anything race-related or who's indigenous and who isnt. There is real discontent regarding immigration and proliferation of Islam within Britain that should be a real concern for any citizen, and when you infuse race and 'aborigenes' into this topic you dilute it and make it worthless and open to derision.

And Griffin should've known this well, before yapping about the Holocaust and about what race should stay here and what race shouldnt.

[Connaught Ranger]

@Connaught Ranger

You should submit that a dating site if you think anyone's interested.

Well it proves I have a much closer connection to Ireland & Britain than some idiot of a plastic paddy who publishes a book on Irish slavery and some git from Scandinavia who ancestors used to come to Ireland to pillage the sheep. rofl

[welshmann]

well u calling me Darling! u sure ure girlfriend is not a bloke? they do very clever ops these days so ive heard.

[CMNot]

Perhaps he meant Thai...

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

The 'multicultural' experiment that Labor initiated has been a total failure, and Straw just sat there and denied it knowing the truth full well.It's impossible to pin the blame on Labour or any other political party for this.

[BlackHigh]

stuipid protests! the BNP have a right to speak out, we have freedom of speech after all! and who watched interviews with BNP will say they are actaully not racist at all just national... and fascist?? BS! :roll:

[Zarak]

Its pretty hilarious to see the British people complaining that BNP is Fascist while they're being watched daily on millions of CCTV cameras, put in place by people they happily vote for over and over...and lets not forget the Hate Speech laws, Prevention of Terrorism Act 2005, etc.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

[welshmann]

Quote: they're being watched daily on millions of CCTV cameras, put in place by people they happily vote for.....what the local police????

[Stevey1]

It's impossible to pin the blame on Labour or any other political party for this.

A pretty shocking claim has come out tonight from an ex-Government advisor, claiming that Labour's immigration policy was deliberate: to score points against the right 'rubbing their faces in it' and to 'enrich' Britain.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Politics/Ex-Government-Adviser-Andrew-Neather-Says-Mass-Immigration-To-UK-Was-Deliberate/Article/200910415414170?lpos=Politics_First_Politics_Feature_Teaser_Region__0&lid=ARTICLE_15414170_Ex-Government_Adviser_Andrew_Neather_Says_Mass_Immigration_To_UK_Was_Deliberate_

Much as I do not like the current Labour government, I imagine this man is probably a hippy with kooky perceptions of meetings he's had with ministers. Even so....

[kkbou]

What little I saw of it, Warsi seemed the most reasonable there. They messed it up a bit.


It seems ironic that the only group of politicians taking the threat of the BNP seriously are the children of immigrants.

They have got the most to fear from the BNP making any headway so I guess its not surprising that people like Warsi manage to articulate their arguments and see the problem for what it is-->politicians not giving a stuff about the British peoples' needs and wants.

I guess if we want to stop immigration and have politicians who actually listen to the people, we are going to have to put more brown people in power. Who would have thought. The rest it would seem don't have a reason to give a **** whether the BNP becomes a major player.

[CMNot]

stuipid protests! the BNP have a right to speak out, we have freedom of speech after all! and who watched interviews with BNP will say they are actaully not racist at all just national... and fascist?? BS! :roll:

What Freedom of Speech?

[Ssandro]

Maybe they should have let the fool do more talking. When they let him talk at the end he said the "indigenous " people in england (living here since "time immemorial") are the new aborigines (not a prosperous line of argument given what "indigenous" emigrants from england did to aborigines), that he was being subjected to a lynch mob (also not a good idea when justifying your appearances alongside the KKK), and then ended with the statement that gays are "creepy" - "creepy"? people in glass eyes, oops - glass houses...

The next day he whines about it like a five year old. It is curious that such people become famous, or even employable http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HMCpI8nFUs



Talking of Celts and indigenous peoples...Celts are descended from Iberian fisherman. How that is indigenous is beyond me. Likewise Anglo-Saxons, quite a way from a pure bloodline there. Neither is fine Aryan stock. For a Cambridge history student, Griffin sure does a fine line in revisionism. Not history - evidently. He got a 2:2 in law.

[manberries]

It seems ironic that the only group of politicians taking the threat of the BNP seriously are the children of immigrants.

They have got the most to fear from the BNP making any headway so I guess its not surprising that people like Warsi manage to articulate their arguments and see the problem for what it is-->politicians not giving a stuff about the British peoples' needs and wants.

I guess if we want to stop immigration and have politicians who actually listen to the people, we are going to have to put more brown people in power. Who would have thought. The rest it would seem don't have a reason to give a **** whether the BNP becomes a major player.

Britain and the US are on the same path with that last paragraph. Many blacks including Obama claim that racism is institutional because blacks aren't in enough positions of power. Perhaps stating that one person should be in an office more than another because of their skin color is just a racist when you claim the blacks and latinos belong there more than the whites, as it is to say the whites belong there more. Reverse racism is racism folks.

[Ssandro]

Britain and the US are on the same path with that last paragraph. Many blacks including Obama claim that racism is institutional because blacks aren't in enough positions of power. Perhaps stating that one person should be in an office more than another because of their skin color is just a racist when you claim the blacks and latinos belong there more than the whites, as it is to say the whites belong there more. Reverse racism is racism folks.
They don't have direct affirmative action policies in Britain.
Obviously affirmative action is ridiculous. But this kind of discussion isn't relevant here, when you're contemplating nick griffin, who far more saliently denies the holocaust, and hangs out with the KKK.

[nemowork]

The main point Griffin plays on isnt the reality of racism its the impression of it.Creating a myth of victimhood so that anything you do in retaliation is justified. All those myths about white people being banned from the lake district if they havent got a multi-ethnic partner arent true but they are meant to feel true. The one definite thing you can count on the working class of Britain is that they dont give a flying **** for the opinions of parties, Government agencies or anybody else. There is a lot said about race but the one part of Britain where your guaranteed to see a multi-racial family is among the working classes. They've arrived, they've assimilated and they've proved they're normal people just like anybody else. The National Front stood up to fight that whole battle about the colour of a British citizen and they got smeared into the dirt. They could claim all they wanted about British rights when a good percentage of the immigrants from Cy Endfield onwards could claim that not only were they commonwealth citizens they had served in Empire forces during WW2. The BNP is the third generation of racism, after Moseley and Tyndall, they hide their hatred of colour behind their hatred of immigration and culture. Fortunately most British people still ignore that whole thing about movement and causes and still judge people on the individual in front of them.

[nemowork]

Hmm, i didnt write that as a block rant, why have i done a Firefox and Win 7 upgrade and suddenly all my paragraphs and spacings have vanished?

[Zarak]

Also, why have i done a Firefox and Win 7 upgrade and suddenly all my paragraphs and spacings have vanished?

In the future envisaged by Microsoft, there will be no paragraphs or spacing.

[Ssandro]

No, the wide spread killing occured in the London and Madrid bombings by muslim extremist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_July_2005_London_bombings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madrid_bombings

Totalling 247 killed and 2750 wounded

So far we have one killed politician in Holland with many more threatend.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pim_Fortuyn

About the artist, well I guess you havn't followed the "Muhammed cartoons" and the self cencorship that now follows.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammed_cartoons

But I guess this is non-facutal and discussing it pointless according to you. Your inability to face the issue is as tiresome and old as you obviously are.
Your point is correct but totally irrelevant. We have a huge problem dealing with radical Muslims, in all the European countries which allowed significant Islamic immigration. This is indisputable. Almost all the resources of the British intelligence service are spent tracking Islamic extremists.
However, what has this got to do with condoning a Neo-Nazi like nick griffin? Griffin is the same thing as the Islamists. He petitions gaddafi for funding, denies the holocaust, says the media is controlled by "a Jewish conspiracy", that "black people walk like monkeys" etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04QolIvfQEw

Aside from that, he is semi-retarded, phoney, vulgar, and perhaps slightly pathetic - witness his ingratiating laughter http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n8l6Gjws2s

[welshmann]

but the main point being,he should been allowed to have his say!,as some1 said he would have then shot himself in the foot,i think most peps are more angry of the setup the bbc made of this.

[Ssandro]

but the main point being,he should been allowed to have his say!,as some1 said he would have then shot himself in the foot,i think most peps are more angry of the setup the bbc made of this.
Yes he should have been given more rope to hang himself. But it's not as if the bbc are persecuting him. He often gets to have his say on the bbc, like this interview in May http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMWcxqgzYdQ
and this one in july http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2a6S10cnpE

You see him on british tv more often than you see the UKIP

[welshmann]

Quote: But it's not as if the bbc are persecuting him...oh come on!! the prog was wank! it was a setup.

[timetraveller]

I only caught the last 10mins of the programme last night so i can't really comment on the whole show .. when they were talking about Mr Gately and some thing that was mentioned in the a Paper ..

Still i thought to myself why on earth are they wasting precious time about that , when there is more important issues i would rather see them talk about ..

And in work today some of those whom i work with said to me they felt that Griffon made some good point's again that's they're opinion because it was the first time they have watched the show and still with Griffon being on it many people watched it when other times they never botherd period any other times of watching BBC's question time .

[timetraveller]

Yes he should have been given more rope to hang himself. But it's not as if the bbc are persecuting him. He often gets to have his say on the bbc, like this interview in May http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMWcxqgzYdQ
and this one in july http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2a6S10cnpE

You see him on british tv more often than you see the UKIP


,.,. do you watch QT everyweek ???

What is the difference between Peter Hitchen and Nick Griffon ..

Peter is just as racist AS nick only difference being the Most people are willing to accept what Nick spouts than rather what Nick say's because he is the leader of the BNP

And bear in mind both have appeared on QT Peter a good few times already
...

[israeli beauty]

We don't like the messenger, but that should not distract us from the message, which is very clear: Britain is being Islamized.

White Britons are not having enough babies, while Muslims are having a lot of them. It's a matter of numbers: Britain is becoming Muslim. And since mainstream politicians are doing nothing, people will join "extremist" parties.

[kkbou]

Britain and the US are on the same path with that last paragraph. Many blacks including Obama claim that racism is institutional because blacks aren't in enough positions of power. Perhaps stating that one person should be in an office more than another because of their skin color is just a racist when you claim the blacks and latinos belong there more than the whites, as it is to say the whites belong there more. Reverse racism is racism folks.


You may want to switch the rant mode off, and actually read what I wrote and if you have already done so, try and understand what I wrote.

You obviously did not understand the spirit of my post. It wasn't a prescriptive comment.

I was just illustrating that anti immigration policies may be more likely instituted by politicians whose parents were immigrants because these people have the most to lose if immigration continues at its current pace.

[kkbou]

We don't like the messenger, but that should not distract us from the message, which is very clear: Britain is being Islamized.

White Britons are not having enough babies, while Muslims are having a lot of them. It's a matter of numbers: Britain is becoming Muslim. And since mainstream politicians are doing nothing, people will join "extremist" parties.

Have you got any proof for this. Even if they are having more babies this does not directly lead to the islamisation of the UK. When they become 2nd generation their birth rate will plummet just like those who came before them. Education is inversely proportional to birthrate, and immigrants love education. Check out the the makeup of the NHS especially doctors (check out the number of muslims in proportion to their actual population numbers).The website below contains a list of all practicing consultants in the UK.

-->www.specialistinfo.com.


Anyway,I find your comments a bit strange. You are defending the views of a man who would have happily finished the job on the surviving 2/3 of the jewish population post Nazi germany. I guess I shouldn't be surprised. The IDF were supporting fascist groups in Lebanon way back in the 70s. There are even pictures of IDF officers with Lebanese phalange in the backgroud making Nazi salutes.

Hey I guess its not just the arabs whose motto is '' the enemy of my enemy is my friend'.

[Ngati Tumatauenga]

White Britons are not having enough babies, while Muslims are having a lot of them. It's a matter of numbers: Britain is becoming Muslim. And since mainstream politicians are doing nothing, people will join "extremist" parties.

Oh, the irony.

[Connaught Ranger]

We don't like the messenger, but that should not distract us from the message, which is very clear: Britain is being Islamized.

White Britons are not having enough babies, while Muslims are having a lot of them. It's a matter of numbers: Britain is becoming Muslim. And since mainstream politicians are doing nothing, people will join "extremist" parties.

Time to get your tinfoil hat readjusted kid, before its tight fit damages your brain. So far your posts here are falling into the troll category.

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

We don't like the messenger, but that should not distract us from the message, which is very clear: Britain is being Islamized.

White Britons are not having enough babies, while Muslims are having a lot of them. It's a matter of numbers: Britain is becoming Muslim. And since mainstream politicians are doing nothing, people will join "extremist" parties.This is a guy that denies the Holocaust and most likely along with his merry band of Facists put British Jews in an uncomfortable position. And your cool with that.:roll:

[israeli beauty]

I saw the show on BBC. The parties showed a complete lack of ability to deal with issues of immigration and British heritage.

Instead of reclaiming the mantra of being for the British people, and by definition the UK (English, Scottish, welsh and somewhat Irish heritage), they attacked him as a bigot, but left him as looking like the ONLY person standing up for people scared of how their communities are changing due to foreign immigration.

They failed utterly on calming peoples fears of immigration causing changes to their communities, and displayed great ignorance on the topic.

This is a sad day. My assumptions about them were proven wrong, not only were they incapable of escaping political correctness, but did not understand the problem in the first place (community's social breakdown due to cultural and language differences from immigrations - where once you went to a neighbors for tea, today you don't know who they are).

They either didn't get it, or felt afraid to talk about it. Either way they left Griffin looking like the only one there who cares specifically for the social cohesion of the 'original' English, Scottish and Welsh, who make up 90% of the country.

Sad, sad, sad, but they have only themselves to blame for being so disappointing in their responses, which should have been clear, concise and motivational.

[israeli beauty]

This is a guy that denies the Holocaust and most likely along with his merry band of Facists put British Jews in an uncomfortable position. And your cool with that.:roll:

he regret denying the holocaust and apologized fot it numerous times.
he was very young when he said those things.

uncomfortable position??!! i hope you are not going to defend the muslims now after long years of abuse, violent incidents, hateful marches and so on.

diaspora jews are known to be cowards, i hope you will surprise me.

[Player]

diaspora jews are known to be cowards, i hope you will surprise me.

Your posts are already extremely stupid and racist, but this is just... :cantbeli::cantbeli::cantbeli::cantbeli::cantbeli:


P.S. You've just insulted many of our Jewish members of the forums, which is against the rules AFAIK.

[Connaught Ranger]

he regret denying the holocaust and apologized fot it numerous times.
he was very young when he said those things.

uncomfortable position??!! i hope you are not going to defend the muslims now after long years of abuse, violent incidents, hateful marches and so on.

diaspora jews are known to be cowards, i hope you will surprise me.

Trolling again & its reported as such.

Your own comments on this forum with regards Racial Purity make me wonder which book you are reading, possibly one by an ex-corporal from Austria who caused so much death and destruction between 1934 - 1945. :roll:

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

I saw the show on BBC. The parties showed a complete lack of ability to deal with issues of immigration and British heritage.

Instead of reclaiming the mantra of being for the British people, and by definition the UK (English, Scottish, welsh and somewhat Irish heritage), they attacked him as a bigot, but left him as looking like the ONLY person standing up for people scared of how their communities are changing due to foreign immigration.Our communities are always changing due to immigration I myself have a Scottish / Irish heritage and amongst my living relations I have Ukrainians, Indian/Persian and Basque and also a religious make up of Islam, Catholic, Protestant, Hinduism and Zoroastrianism and guess f*cking what! we can all be in the same room at the same time talking about anything including religion.

[happyslapper]

Israeli Beauty, just stfu. You're embarrassing yourself as just about every foreigner to comment on this thread has done.

[CMNot]

(community's social breakdown due to cultural and language differences from immigrations - where once you went to a neighbors for tea, today you don't know who they are)

What has that to do with immigration? Besides nothing.


he regret denying the holocaust and apologized fot it numerous times.

You know if you were a British Jew, you'd be amongst the first against the wall. Whatever, I'm stunned that even "non indigenous" people are swallowing that ****.


we can all be in the same room at the same time talking about anything including religion.

That's because there is no English heritage there p-)

[Player]

Our communities are always changing due to immigration I myself have a Scottish / Irish heritage and amongst my living relations I have Ukrainians, Indian/Persian and Basque and also a religious make up of Islam, Catholic, Protestant, Hinduism and Zoroastrianism and guess f*cking what! we can all be in the same room at the same time talking about anything including religion.

Also, the irony is that he comes from a country with over 20% Muslims who are in fact very productive and educated members of the Israeli society. And except for the few hooligans among them (just like within any other population), they get quite well along with their Jewish counterparts.

[happyslapper]

Also, the irony is that he comes from a country with over 20% Muslims who are in fact very productive and educated members of the Israeli society. And except for the few hooligans among them (just like within any other population), they get quite well along with their Jewish counterparts.

....plus the little coincidence of the banning of 'Jewbanker', then the swift appearance of 'Israeli Beauty' whose first 12 posts are all flames on the politics section (of a fvcking military forum).
hmmmmmm

[israeli beauty]

But from now on we'll see some special interests diverting attention by focusing on the leaders of "far right" groups instead of the issues behind it their movements. They don't want those issues discussed. Period.

Same thing happens in Israel. There are certain subjects that are verbotten. In the meantime, silence hasn't solved the problems, and the lack of adequate policies have made them worse.

In Israel the government and the media do the censorship. In the uk it's intimidation and self-censorship.

[Ngati Tumatauenga]

Absolutely facinating...

[israeli beauty]

Also, the irony is that he comes from a country with over 20% Muslims who are in fact very productive and educated members of the Israeli society. And except for the few hooligans among them (just like within any other population), they get quite well along with their Jewish counterparts.

i am sorry, but i dont see the irony.

we are lucky to be the 80% majority, if we were the 20% minority it will only be on a kabab stick.

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

That's because there is no English heritage there p-)Oddly enough there never is, how strange.:) I do have a cousin that thinks he's English and a cousin that is married to guy who's family own a chunk of Hampshire and my girl is C of E but thats is as close as it gets. p-)



Also, the irony is that he comes from a country with over 20% Muslims who are in fact very productive and educated members of the Israeli society. And except for the few hooligans among them (just like within any other population), they get quite well along with their Jewish counterparts.Player I guess that this guy does not get out much he comes over as a daft kid. :)

[Connaught Ranger]

i am sorry, but i dont see the irony.

we are lucky to be the 80% majority, if we were the 20% minority it will only be on a kabab stick.

So your minority are cannibals as well :roll:

[happyslapper]

i am sorry, but i dont see the irony.

we are lucky to be the 80% majority, if we were the 20% minority it will only be on a kabab stick.

Reported :bash:


Take your pathetic Islamophobia somewhere else.

[Ngati Tumatauenga]

As facinating as his hypocracy was to watch, he's gone.

Permanently.

[CMNot]

Good, good. I've seen some lunacy on here, and absurd amounts of stupidity; watching a Jewish Israeli support an anti-Semitic party was like reading Kafka on acid.

What interests me regarding the BNP is peoples perception of the situation often seems to trump their own experience. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I live in an area that has elected a BNP member to local Gov't, yet we don't have any mosques, Asians/Blacks are in a massive minority. It's almost like people choose to believe what the Mirror/Scum is saying, more than they trust their own experience of life in Britain.

Another alarming point is that people seem more concerned with a problem that may or may not actually exist, all whilst the economy is consistently tanking. Almost like folk are hellbent on focusing upon an issue that might exist, as opposed to an issue that does exist. Almost like the Governmental paradigm we see of the MoD constantly preparing to fight a war, not the war.

[a_very_ex_STAB]

Even though the BNP are a bunch of bell-ends I think the BBC made the right choice. Dimbleby could have done a better job moderating and stopped the non ending attacks on Griffin. But I do find it disgraceful that “liberal” and “anti-fascist” elements of society wanted to gag Griffin. Griffin is quite capable of shooting himself in the foot and doesn’t need anyone’s help. But these self righteous gaggers are just as dangerous, if not more so IMHO. Who the f@ck do they think they are dictating how the democratic process should work?

Griffin made little sense but a lot of the tirade and vitriol against Griffin did not follow any logic either and that played in his favour.


That was pretty much my take on it too.

The arguments of Griffin and the BNP should be forensically picked apart in a calmer environment by a skilled and tenacious interviewer not blasted by the half-baked knee jerking 'attitudes' of the self righteous tw@ts that seemed to make up most of the audience on QT.

[happyslapper]

That was pretty much my take on it too.

The arguments of Griffin and the BNP should be forensically picked apart in a calmer environment by a skilled and tenacious interviewer not blasted by the half-baked knee jerking 'attitudes' of the self righteous tw@ts that seemed to make up most of the audience on QT.

Definitely.

It would have been ideal if the 'real' politicians on the panel had been throougly examined over areas which are turning people to the BNP, particularly immigration and cultural security. It would have given Lab/Lib/Cons the opportunity to compare-and-contrast a sensible mainstream view and action with the ridiculous nature of the BNP's.

Instead I think they've further marginalised BNP's sypathisers (many of whom are not biggoted pigs like Griffin) by turning it into a lynch-mob, when the Tories in paticular could have completely dismantled the facade of the BNP being a serious party.

I completely salute the BBC for having him on. It actually made me quite proud to be British, that we confront these people's views in an open and democratic way. The fact that asians/whites/blacks/christians/muslims/etc all stood together against this affront to our society speaks volumes about the strength of British society, and ironically proved the BNP's core raison-d'etre to be utterly flawed.

[Strongie]

Which again would point to anyone being of Anglo-Saxon or Celtic descent would not be indigenous.

Here's a rather amusing twist on Griffin's indigenous stream of consciousness. A racist apartheid like system was in place circa the fifth century; the aim was to stop the Anglo-Saxon bloodline mixing with the existing Celtic Britons. Some indigenous homology there.



249 dead. Not a lot is it?

In the ensuing 8 years since the Afghan debacle began, we've lost ~23,000 dead on the British roads with a further ~1,280,000 injured. I henceforth propose the voluntary repatriation of all motor vehicles to Greenland.

Are you actually comparing religious driven planned murder with car accidents? Tell the relatives of the dead that 249 isn't much.

[Strongie]

Hey-up Cloggie,:)

Following your questionable line of reasoning then, the U.K. would have had the right to nuke the Republic of Ireland for the terrorist attacks carried out by the mainly Catholic Nationalist I.R.A. and their associated splinter groups.

A campaign which killed far more people than the "London or Madrid" car bombings by your Islamic terrorists.

The U.K. is well used to and prepared to deal with real terrorist threats if and when the need be, and that can be achieved without the Fascist, racist, mentality of a bunch of idiots like the BNP.

Perhaps the question of the BNP stance of Gay-Rights in the U.K. should have been put to Nick "the fruit" Griffin. rofl

Nuclear weapons? "Your Islamic terrorists"?

What are you talking about, you rambling makes no sense. The issue is immigration and islam and you are talking about nukes. :cantbeli:

[a_very_ex_STAB]

Why is it when ppl with a right wing 'bent' have a forum name like 'Strongie' you just know that in reality they are most likely a limp wristed effeminate pansy with an unhealthy interest in dressing up and an encyclopaedic knowledge of SS regalia :-)

[Strongie]

Your point is correct but totally irrelevant. We have a huge problem dealing with radical Muslims, in all the European countries which allowed significant Islamic immigration. This is indisputable. Almost all the resources of the British intelligence service are spent tracking Islamic extremists.
However, what has this got to do with condoning a Neo-Nazi like nick griffin? Griffin is the same thing as the Islamists. He petitions gaddafi for funding, denies the holocaust, says the media is controlled by "a Jewish conspiracy", that "black people walk like monkeys" etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04QolIvfQEw

Aside from that, he is semi-retarded, phoney, vulgar, and perhaps slightly pathetic - witness his ingratiating laughter http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n8l6Gjws2s

Because what happend to Nick Griffing happens to everyone in western Europe today that dares to talk about these issues. If there would be an open and democratic debate there would be others than Nick Griffin that would talk about it.
People have been killed, threatend, lost they're jobs, been forced out from they're unions because they have talked about this. Self censorship is used by media on these issues, schools and other public institutions adapt to islamic custums. When I mention it i get responses like "249 dead isn't much". Of course that only the most extreme people with nothing to loose will be left talking about it.

[Strongie]

Why is it when ppl with a right wing 'bent' have a forum name like 'Strongie' you just know that in reality they are most likely a limp wristed effeminate pansy with an unhealthy interest in dressing up and an encyclopaedic knowledge of SS regalia :-)

How come when people with a left wing "bent" attack presumed personality traits and habits of a person that voices opinions they don't agree with, you just know they haven't got the knowledge or ability to face them in a reasonable discussion. :)

[a_very_ex_STAB]

How come when people with a left wing "bent" attack presumed personality traits and habits of a person that voices opinions they don't agree with, you just know they haven't got the knowledge or ability to face them in a reasonable discussion. :)

Left wing

Ha Ha that's a good one.:)

As for your opinions - you've already been argued down in this thread and quite obviously live in some kind of paranoid parallel universe. I see no point in merely repeating the sensible things that others have said about the pathetically inadequate waste of space that you and other BNP fellow travellers represent.

[CMNot]

People have been killed, threatend, lost they're jobs, been forced out from they're unions because they have talked about this

http://www.abrsm.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/violin.gif

Not wholly unlike facing persecution because you were unfortunate enough to be born a funny colour then.

[Connaught Ranger]

Nuclear weapons? "Your Islamic terrorists"?

What are you talking about, you rambling makes no sense. The issue is immigration and islam and you are talking about nukes. :cantbeli:

Learn to read English then, it might help you understand the way the British & Irish people think, MOST of us do not believe your pysco-babel about an Islamic take over, because there is no evidence to support your claims.:bash:

[Strongie]

Left wing

Ha Ha that's a good one.:)

As for your opinions - you've already been argued down in this thread and quite obviously live in some kind of paranoid parallel universe. I see no point in merely repeating the sensible things that others have said about the pathetically inadequate waste of space that you and other BNP fellow travellers represent.

Yeah, just as funny as that right wing comment :)

Argued down, sensible things? Wich ones? Connaugh ranger comparing discussing the issue of questioning the effects of immigration and islam with nuking Ireland or maybe CMN comparing 249 victims of Islamic terrorism with car accidents. No, I think your comparing me to a SS officer is the best so far. :roll:

In my paralell universe i still manage to work and pay taxes, taxes that finance the running of the country I live in and as such I take the right to talk about issues that affect it. Too bad most answers come from people that have been drilled to see a SS officer everytime someone mentions the issue.

[Connaught Ranger]

I propose the words:-

Whinging Dutch Islamaphobe & Neo Jerk-Off

be added to "Strongie"

avatar title.

[CMNot]

CMN comparing 249 victims of Islamic terrorism with car accidents

I didn't make any comparisons. I merely offered some perspective in the face of the Islamic onslaught.

Right now, we face far a larger issue than immigration (not least of all because the immigrants are leaving) and Islamification [sic]. Unfortunately, the morass don't care.

[a_very_ex_STAB]

In my paralell universe i still manage to work and pay taxes, taxes that finance the running of the country I live in and as such I take the right to talk about issues that affect it. Too bad most answers come from people that have been drilled to see a SS officer everytime someone mentions the issue.

We dont' care about your pathetic rationalizations - you're a foreigner ignorantly commenting on domestic British affairs of which you know nothing.

Now wind your neck in and get back to polishing your SS dagger collection.

[Strongie]

I propose the words:-

Whinging Dutch Islamaphobe & Neo Jerk-Off

be added to "Strongie"

avatar title.

Dutch? Now that's just below the belt. Maybe your working for the BBC? rofl

[Connaught Ranger]

Yeah, just as funny as that right wing comment :)

Argued down, sensible things? Wich ones? Connaugh ranger comparing discussing the issue of questioning the effects of immigration and islam with nuking Ireland or maybe CMN comparing 249 victims of Islamic terrorism with car accidents. No, I think your comparing me to a SS officer is the best so far. :roll:

In my paralell universe i still manage to work and pay taxes, taxes that finance the running of the country I live in and as such I take the right to talk about issues that affect it. Too bad most answers come from people that have been drilled to see a SS officer everytime someone mentions the issue.

So post your crap comments on the appropriate white power websites,

as it is plainly clear you have no idea how the majority of the British or Irish think with regards these issues.

They do not see any of problem that you Islamaphobes perceive and rant on about.:roll:

You really are moronic, :roll: I was saying your statement with regards the Islamic Terrorist attacks in London & Lisbon Casualties, in all reality do not even compare to the casualties inflicted upon the UK by the Catholic Nationalist IRA terror group.

And by following your line of thinking the punishment that should have been inflicted upon the Catholic population of the Irish Republic by the U.K. in retaliation would equal a nuclear strike in ratio to the punishment you would have us inflict on the Muslim community.

Connaught Ranger.

[Connaught Ranger]

Dutch? Now that's just below the belt. Maybe your working for the BBC? rofl

well you whinged about:-


So far we have one killed politician in Holland with many more threatend.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pim_Fortuyn

So that leads me to believe you are a cloggie.

and in your post of:-

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showpost.php?p=4502291&postcount=20

"I must be a nazi so this isn't happening"

Freudian slip of the tongue maybe :roll:

[Connaught Ranger]

Why is it when ppl with a right wing 'bent' have a forum name like 'Strongie' you just know that in reality they are most likely a limp wristed effeminate pansy with an unhealthy interest in dressing up and an encyclopaedic knowledge of SS regalia :-)

Good one. rofl rofl rofl

[Strongie]

We dont' care about your pathetic rationalizations - you're a foreigner ignorantly commenting on domestic British affairs of which you know nothing.

Now wind your neck in and get back to polishing your SS dagger collection.

These issues aren't just a British phomena, if it where I wouldn't be interested.

Sorry. no SS dagger collection here, maybe I can borrow yours?

[Ssandro]

Because what happend to Nick Griffing happens to everyone in western Europe today that dares to talk about these issues. If there would be an open and democratic debate there would be others than Nick Griffin that would talk about it.
People have been killed, threatend, lost they're jobs, been forced out from they're unions because they have talked about this. Self censorship is used by media on these issues, schools and other public institutions adapt to islamic custums. When I mention it i get responses like "249 dead isn't much". Of course that only the most extreme people with nothing to loose will be left talking about it.
Muslim extremism is a genuine problem, which governments were too slow to deal with. The governments messed up right at the beginning, by not having programmes to integrate immigrants from very different cultures into Western culture. Instead they were left on their own, to set up communities which often became too isolated.

The response now is that they have to be better integrated. For this issue to be hijacked over by neo-nazis is quite counter-productive.

Muslims don't pose a demographic threat in britain. There are less than 2 million muslims in a population of 61 million. And we only have trouble with the small (although obviously dangerous) extremist minority of those 2 million. The policies used to integrate them will have to be intelligent. The british government has developed some policies already, although they might not be effective http://www.quilliamfoundation.org/quilliam-outreach-and-training-unit.html


Good, good. I've seen some lunacy on here, and absurd amounts of stupidity; watching a Jewish Israeli support an anti-Semitic party was like reading Kafka on acid.

I suspect he's a bnp troll who suddenly appeared just for this thread, not an actual israeli - either that, or very ignorant

[happyslapper]

@''strongie''
Why are you even posting here? What the hell has a UK TV programme got to do with you?

There are countless other threads in this site where you'll find like(/small)-minded people who you can converse with about the 'perils of Islam' yada yada yada.
Piss off and let the people who want to discuss the programme sensibly discuss it sensibly.

[Strongie]

@''strongie''
Why are you even posting here? What the hell has a UK TV programme got to do with you?

There are countless other threads in this site where you'll find like(/small)-minded people who you can converse with about the 'perils of Islam' yada yada yada.
Piss off and let the people who want to discuss the programme sensibly discuss it sensibly.

1. I've watched the show

2. The show featured BNP leader Nick Griffin head of a party that is critical of immigration and islam. Instead of facing his arguments on those issues the show was designed as a media execution.

3. This is not a uniqe ocurence in Britain, the same approach is used in other western European countries when people adress this issue.

Is it clear? What's your sensible contribution? Telling me to piss off? Piss of yourself.

[Ssandro]

1. I've watched the show

2. The show featured BNP leader Nick Griffin head of a party that is critical of immigration and islam. Instead of facing his arguments on those issues the show was designed as a media execution.

3. This is not a uniqe ocurence in Britain, the same approach is used in other western European countries when people adress this issue.

Is it clear? What's your sensible contribution? Telling me to piss off? Piss of yourself.
Except he didn't face repulsion just because he thinks that immigration policies should be changed, but because he is a crazy racist from the National Front (which used to throw bananas at black people), who denies the holocaust, hangs out with the kkk, and then has the vulgarity to talk about how he was "lynched" by a television show. You have to distinguish between his latent and manifest views. His manifest views are similar to Geert Wilders (who is counter-productive, but probably not a racist or a nazi), but his real views are very different. The hostility is to what he really is, not to what he pretends to be.

[Strongie]

Except he didn't face repulsion just because he thinks that immigration policies should be changed, but because he is a crazy racist from the National Front (which used to throw bananas at black people), who denies the holocaust, hangs out with the kkk, and then has the vulgarity to talk about how he was "lynched" by a television show. You have to distinguish between his latent and manifest views. His manifest views are similar to Geert Wilders (who is counter-productive, but probably not a racist or a nazi), but his real views are very different. The hostility is to what he really is, not to what he pretends to be.

In that case those actions would speak for themselfs, if he's that crazy as some claim and if he has no substance for his opinions let him speak, there should be no problem in proving him wrong. We live in a world where information is free to find if you want to search for it.

[a_very_ex_STAB]

These issues aren't just a British phomena, if it where I wouldn't be interested.

Sorry. no SS dagger collection here, maybe I can borrow yours?

Oh dear - hard times - did you have to sell them to top your unemployment benefits or something:roll:

You're right it's not just a paranoid fantasy about Britain you're obviously having them about other countries in Europe as well. That doesn't mean you have any qualifications to comment on the 'real world' in Britain though so we will continue to treat you with the contempt that your ludicrous opinions deserve.:)

[Ssandro]

In that case those actions would speak for themselfs, if he's that crazy as some claim and if he has no substance for his opinions let him speak, there should be no problem in proving him wrong. We live in a world where information is free to find if you want to search for it.
He is being allowed to speak, that's why he was on question time, and also several other bbc programs this year. He gets more chances to speak than other minority parties like the UKIP. The reason that the program focused on him this time was to inform people that he is not what he pretends to be (i.e. he's not just anti-immigration, but an all-out racist).

He's also had interviews where people listened to him very politely, as I already posted:

Yes he should have been given more rope to hang himself. But it's not as if the bbc are persecuting him. He often gets to have his say on the bbc, like this interview in May http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMWcxqgzYdQ
and this one in july http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2a6S10cnpE

You see him on british tv more often than you see the UKIP

[Strongie]

Oh dear - hard times - did you have to sell them to top your unemployment benefits or something:roll:

You're right it's not just a paranoid fantasy about Britain you're obviously having them about other countries in Europe as well. That doesn't mean you have any qualifications to comment on the 'real world' in Britain though so we will continue to treat you with the contempt that your ludicrous opinions deserve.:)

"We"? The league of extraordinary retards? :) Sure you do that, fortunately I'm used to dealing with simpletons on a professional basis so a couple more wont make a differance. p-)

[gazell]

I missed out on the fun & games.

Foreigners posting, often seem to mix that there is an immigration issue almost all over Europe with particular problems and the situation an individual country has.

The UK does not have a particularly high Muslim population.

The UK has more of a problem with other immigrants.

The UK does not have regular car burning happy days, etc.

The problem here - as far as I can see - is of a different nature. The lack of information or misinformation by sensationalistic media. Sharia law and such calling words for scaremongering. I also went like, what the heck, I educated myself on it. Not many people will do so I have the feeling. More information and more public dialogue and debate is needed on these topics.

For the very reason, it's good that the BBC took him on, however the programme seemed a disaster. I , just as some previously stated, would have liked him destroyed based on his ignorance on the very topics he is campaigning on. And on others.

[a_very_ex_STAB]

"We"? The league of extraordinary retards? :) Sure you do that, fortunately I'm used to dealing with simpletons on a professional basis so a couple more wont make a differance. p-)

You don't seem to be making a very good job of it:roll:

[Strongie]

He is being allowed to speak, that's why he was on question time, and also several other bbc programs this year. He gets more chances to speak than other minority parties like the UKIP. The reason that the program focused on him this time was to inform people that he is not what he pretends to be (i.e. he's not just anti-immigration, but an all-out racist).

He's also had interviews where people listened to him very politely, as I already posted:

This is how it should be. He was asked tough relevant questions, now let the people decide. If they think hes crazy they'll vote for someone else, no lynch mob necessary.

[CMNot]

The problem here - as far as I can see - is of a different nature. The lack of information or misinformation by sensationalistic media. Sharia law and such calling words for scaremongering. I also went like, what the heck, I educated myself on it. Not many people will do so I have the feeling. More information and more public dialogue and debate is needed on these topics.

I think this is an important point. I am of the opinion that education in Britain is currently not experiencing a purple patch. My mother's old school were enacting a course in 'Critical Thinking' which was effectively blocked and stamped out. The reason for this was that the school board didn't see it as important. I can't think, in the world of globalised 24/7 streaming media, of many skills more important to learn. I certainly have benefited from being able to pick apart hap-hazard, page filling articles.

[gazell]

I think this is an important point. I am of the opinion that education in Britain is currently not experiencing a purple patch. My mother's old school were enacting a course in 'Critical Thinking' which was effectively blocked and stamped out. The reason for this was that the school board didn't see it as important. I can't think, in the world of globalised 24/7 streaming media, of many skills more important to learn. I certainly have benefited from being able to pick apart hap-hazard, page filling articles.

I cannot argue with that for a second, Sir.

[kkbou]

That was pretty much my take on it too.

The arguments of Griffin and the BNP should be forensically picked apart in a calmer environment by a skilled and tenacious interviewer not blasted by the half-baked knee jerking 'attitudes' of the self righteous tw@ts that seemed to make up most of the audience on QT.

x2

Nearly felt sorry for the ****. I guess that was his game from the start.

[marktigger]

I have to say I throughly enjoyed QT this week watching that clown griffin being crucified was great entertainment, and I agree Jack Straw struggled. The 2 Panalists who came across best were Baroness Warsi and Ms Greer.
I was glad to see the oxydizing effect of the oxygen of publicity on the BNP they were shown to be offering nothing to the mainstream of British politics. Baroness Warsi did challange Straw over Labours record on immigration and hold him more to account than Griffin.
On the question time websitet there is an interesting article :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/question_time/8271710.stm

"US Question Time 'would not work'
On Question Time's 30th anniversary, editor Ed Havard celebrates the show's capacity to put politicians on the spot.



David Dimbleby has chaired Question Time since January 1994
There is something very British about Question Time.

Having just spent a sabbatical year in Washington - where politicians are in the most part astonishingly remote from their electorate - I am reminded that the programme represents a major investment in the democratic process by our political class.

My American colleagues - some of them aides to top US politicians - would watch DVDs of the show in near disbelief, open mouthed.

This could never happen in the US, they would say, none of the senior politicians would be willing to mix with voters in prime time.

Yet back in the UK, that is exactly what happens, week after week.

Speaking at the weekend to mark the show's 30th anniversary, Harriet Harman said that Question Time can still make or break a political career - and it remains the most dangerous of political formats.

There is none of the predictability of a set piece interview.

'It takes guts'

With an audience determined to ask questions about almost anything - and to keep asking until they get a straight answer - it takes guts for politicians to appear.





Margaret Beckett was heckled on Question Time
Some current ministers, like many Tories before them, have agreed to come on the panel even when they know they are riding into the eye of the storm.

At the height of the public's anger over Northern Rock, Ruth Kelly, then Transport Secretary, dropped everything to travel to the bank's home, Newcastle, to face the public's fury - something no Treasury minister was willing to do.

Some members of the audience were genuinely worried that they would lose huge sums of money, but she found the audience's outrage tempered significantly by their appreciation that a senior member of the government had come to listen to them.

Similarly, Patricia Hewitt was on the programme as Health Secretary at the very moment that she was being attacked relentlessly by doctors in the press.


Question Time has never enjoyed an easy or cosy relationship with the political parties

Though subjected to repeated calls for her resignation from the audience, she calmly argued her case.

She could easily have pulled out of the show - other ministers have done so over much less - but not only did she come, she answered e-mails from doctors in the audience in the days afterwards.

'Genuine balance'

Others have distinguished themselves by their readiness to appear despite the burden of their office.

David Miliband, for example, came on shortly after becoming Foreign Secretary.

Jack Straw, who has held almost all the major offices of state, has made regular appearances.

Of the current cabinet, only one member is a resolute refusenik.





In pictures: 30 years of Question Time
There are none in the shadow cabinet, or in the Lib Dem front bench.

But Question Time has never enjoyed an easy or cosy relationship with the political parties.

Most recently, our decision to invite the BNP onto the panel has been attacked by some. Peter Hain has indicated that he intends to boycott the programme.

Others, including Alastair Campbell and Denis Macshane, have suggested that we are inviting the BNP onto the programme to increase ratings.

Question Time is already the most watched political programme in the country.

What is more, it has recently been getting its highest viewing figures since the programme began 30 years ago - almost four million viewers. An odd time then to be trying to artificially inflate ratings.

Others, though never the top tier politicians, have complained about their treatment at the hands of the audience.

Iraq was especially difficult. Opponents of the war tended to be more vocal than those who backed it, and we always had to work hard to ensure a genuine balance in the audiences.

Audience balance

When we mounted a special to mark the fourth anniversary of the invasion - with an international panel including John Bolton, Benazir Bhutto and the then Defence Secretary Des Browne - that balance was effectively realised (despite the weight of public opinion against the war four years in).





About the BBC decision to invite the BNP onto Question Time
But a year or so before, when Jack Straw came on in Manchester during Tony Blair's last party conference as Prime Minister, he was the focus of red hot anger over the war.

The public had not forgotten that he was foreign secretary at the time of the invasion and he was repeatedly challenged during a series of highly-charged exchanges.

For whatever reason, many of the supporters of the war in that audience did not speak up.

The TV reviewers loved it and the viewing figures were sky high.

"Brilliantly enjoyable television," said the Daily Telegraph the next day.

I was not so sure. High-viewing figures and great press coverage do not always equal a good programme.

A one-sided haranguing may be good theatre, but for some it is also television which can appeal to the lowest common denominator and that should not be what Question Time is about.

Although this dynamic between the politicians and the audience is a vital ingredient for Question Time, another is the chairman, David Dimbleby.

The audiences respect him and the panellists trust him. For that reason he is always in control, however heated the debate, and he wields his authority with immense skill.

Thirty years on, he remains one of the secrets behind Question Time's enduring success. "

one of the best episodes of QT closley followed by the Episode the week of the MP's expenses where the politicians were savaged on National TV by an audience of ordinary voters.
I think this is a good thing in British politics where Politicians will appear on forums like this or on things like "The News Quiz" and "Have I got news for you" things that would be seen as unthinkable across the pond. OK some take it to far like George Galloway on Celeb big brother.

[CMNot]

Have I Got News For You is brilliant when politicians turn up at exactly the same time. Probably because Hislop and Merton are far smarter than most.

I second the MPs expenses show. That was awesome.

[Lazy Lob]

Bollocksmith


http://www.youtube.com/v/lq2Mx9uFXO8&hl=en&fs=1&

[CMNot]

lol LL, good drills.

[Eagle The Lightning]

Two faced CONservatives!

http://www.youtube.com/v/gffhtuikV80

[CMNot]

lol not so cocky now,