Israeli woman gets teargased for using (men Only) sidewalk

[Vettec]

An activist in Jerusalem's ultra-Orthodox Eda Haredit community was conditionally released from prison Monday, a day after his arrest for allegedly spraying an ultra-Orthodox woman with tear gas in the capital's Mea She'arim neighborhood.

Yoel Kraus was arrested after the woman filed a police complaint. The alleged attack occured about two weeks ago, during the Sukkot holiday, as the woman was walking on a "men only" sidewalk, and refused Kraus' demand that she move to the women's side.

The woman did not require medical attention.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/images/0.gifAccording to an agreement reached with the police, Kraus is to spend five days under house arrest at a location outside of Jerusalem and will not be allowed to return to the city for two weeks. He will then be prohibited from participating in public protests or public events for 30 days.

Although Kraus is not the Eda Haredit's official spokesman, he often grants interviews, leading the media to dub him the "operations officer of the Eda Haredit."

The alleged incident occured during the interim days of Sukkot, when the streets of Mea She'arim and adjacent Geula neighborhoods are packed with hundreds of thousands of visitors celebrating the Simchat Beit Hashoevah festival.

Because of the crowds, community leaders decided three years ago that to preserve the community's standard of modesty, men and women would walk on separate sides of the street. Parents were permitted to walk together with their children on one of the side streets.

A special pedestrian interchange was set up on the street to lead men and women to their separate sidewalks. The neighborhood leadership and the various Hassidic groups hired dozens of security guards to maintain the gender-specific arrangement. Kraus reportedly did not trust the guards, and set out to inspect the arrangement himself.

source: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1123825.html

Men and Women only sidewalks!! with dozens of security guards to make sure everyone keeps to their side. Some people are still living in dark ages.

[Holycrusader]

It was very nice from him, that he do not use shotgun or acid against her...







^
That was sarcasm....

[Octavariable]

Vettec -> haaretz -> Israel -> get a life.

As for dark ages, well, considering the fact that they choose to live their life as they have in the dark ages, it's not really a surprise.

And for the incompetent biased reporters of Haaretz, They aren't even the "regular" orthodox, but of an even more ridiculus sect, Toldot Aharon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toldot_Aharon) who don't recognize Israel's independence, don't speak Hebrew, don't vote and don't venture beyond their neighborhood.

[GB_FXST]

It was very nice from him, that he do not use shotgun or acid against her...







^
That was sarcasm....

True. This Kraus person is, nonetheless, a nutjob.

And, it should be noted that the article is talking about a specific neighborhood community. Obviously, this is not a universal state policy.

[~Berdan]

Mea Shearim guys are mostly really ****tards.They try to close themselves from outside world,some of them try not to speak Hebrew at all,and speak Yiddish instead(Yiddish was the language of Jews who lived in Europe,it's a mix of mainly German,couple of Slavic languages words,couple of Hebrew words),they dress like 16 century people.Some of them don't even believe in the state of Israel,and you can see signs inside that neighborhood denouncing Israel...

Our school visited that place,like one visits a zoo.Sure enough,the people there were acting like animals when they saw us.Some of them deliberately put their hands on their faces,not to look at us (we were not modest,or shiat?)..Some of them acted a bit aggressive,which was actually kinda funny,cause by the looks of their fitness level,I could KO the "strongest" of them with my week hand.

Actually many tours,like school or any other tours do visit that neighborhood,like some freak show..Like "long neck" tribe of Thailand.They put a good show for tourists,heh.Thank god those guys are small groups,and they actually try to minimize their friction with outside world.

[Difool]

Seperated sidewalks for men and women. I always thought Israel to rather western. Foreign countries, foreign habits.

[Abschaum]

Maybe they should move to saudi arabia, probably have very similar views on many things.

[GB_FXST]

Seperated sidewalks for men and women. I always thought Israel to rather western. Foreign countries, foreign habits.

This is exactly what the OP wants you to believe.

But, it is simply wrong.

The article is about a fringe group in an isolated area.

Again, this is not the policy of the state by any means.

[RoyB]

Seperated sidewalks for men and women. I always thought Israel to rather western. Foreign countries, foreign habits.
It is.

Vettec, every thread you ever posted was about something negative connected to Israel.. STOP IT.

[Rubber Johnny]

Hahahah, living in the dark ages you say?
I say constantly looking for anti-Israeli articles from questionable sources then posting them on forums, is a pretty much dark aged way of living.

Those sidewalks are not only very small in numbers (how much, 7-8 in the entire country?) but are also not recognized by any authority or anything.
If a bunch of women were to cross a sidewalk which is claimed by someone "men only", the presence of a police officer won't bother anyone - it will only safeguard the women into knowing no nutjob is going to try and pull anything funny.

A pathetic attempt to make a whole country look bad over a single sideway.

This is not different than any other street in the world where people could be attacked for being who they are. Being white at Compton, being a mature woman without headgear(?) in Saudi Arabia, being a Boca fan in a River plate inhabited neighborhood, or being a Liverpool fan in Manchester.

Haaretz is trying to make it seem like the equation of one person is bad = automatically means the country he belongs to is immediatly infested with corruption and dark age mentality. Ofcourse Haaretz also makes it difficult only for Israeli related issues and not for any other place in the world, while being the best choice by anti-Israeli flamers due to their feeling that they have "unbiased" news from a reliable "inside" source, creating the illusion that Israel's newspapers are actually admitting something.

Excuse the long post but I am just sick and tired of people quoting Haaretz like it's some holy all-knowing source with not even the slightest of bias.

[LEGEND]

Seperated sidewalks for men and women. I always thought Israel to rather western. Foreign countries, foreign habits.

Did you bother to read responses to the original post?

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Religious nuts of any stripe never fail to entertain.

[Difool]

Did you bother to read responses to the original post?

I just read the latest reponses. Maybe you can explain to me how these communities work. Do they have their own laws? How much independend is their administration?

[juliannicholas]

Nutters

Still at least its not Germany of the recent past

[Noons86]

So how do these separate sidewalks work anyway? Are they on opposite sides of the street?

[LEGEND]

I just read the latest reponses. Maybe you can explain to me how these communities work. Do they have their own laws? How much independend is their administration?

There are no community laws, there is only one state law. It was a criminal act against a person, the person filed a complaint with police and the perpetrator got arrested. Isn't that how it works in Germany as well?

[Player]

The problem is not just with the zealots, but also with the fact that the authorities/police tolerate this kind of practice on the streets, and haven't dismantled it yet. Doesn't matter if it's just 1 street or 1000, such practice is wrong by all means and should be illegal.

[Difool]

There are no community laws, there is only one state law. It was a criminal act against a person, the person filed a complaint with police and the perpetrator got arrested. Isn't that how it works in Germany as well?

Not quite and I think it's not that simple in the US as well. Both are federal republics with different laws in the single states. You should know for your country. As for Germany we have federal law wich is above everything. The German states have their own laws that fill the gaps left open. A little is left for the cities and communities to be regulated. I very much simplified it but that's how it works.
Finaly back to topic:
You tell me that there is one Israeli law only. Is that correct? And then how is that sidewalk system possible in that mentioned community?
Proof me wrong but it reminds me of the autonomous religious communities in the USA.

[AgentX]

Stupid stubborn woman deserved this. Think of the feminist outrage if a man refused to get off a female-only sidewalk.

Get off my sidewalk!
[/s]

[GB_FXST]

The problem is not just with the zealots, but also with the fact that the authorities/police tolerate this kind of practice on the streets, and haven't dismantled it yet. Doesn't matter if it's just 1 street or 1000, such practice is wrong by all means and should be illegal.

I agree. But, I think that in dealing with the Jewish religious the authorities have a certain hands off approach. And, sometimes discretion is the better part of valor. Sometimes not.



Not quite and I think it's not that simple in the US as well. Both are federal republics with different laws in the single states. You should know for your country. As for Germany we have federal law wich is above everything. The German states have their own laws that fill the gaps left open. A little is left for the cities and communities to be regulated. I very much simplified it but that's how it works.
Finaly back to topic:
You tell me that there is one Israeli law only. Is that correct? And then how is that sidewalk system possible in that mentioned community?
Proof me wrong but it reminds me of the autonom religious commonities in the USA.

AFAIK, there are no autonomous religious communities outside the law in the US.

[timetraveller]

Hahahah, living in the dark ages you say?
I say constantly looking for anti-Israeli articles from questionable sources then posting them on forums, is a pretty much dark aged way of living.

Those sidewalks are not only very small in numbers (how much, 7-8 in the entire country?) but are also not recognized by any authority or anything.
If a bunch of women were to cross a sidewalk which is claimed by someone "men only", the presence of a police officer won't bother anyone - it will only safeguard the women into knowing no nutjob is going to try and pull anything funny.

A pathetic attempt to make a whole country look bad over a single sideway.

This is not different than any other street in the world where people could be attacked for being who they are. Being white at Compton, being a mature woman without headgear(?) in Saudi Arabia, being a Boca fan in a River plate inhabited neighborhood, or being a Liverpool fan in Manchester.

Haaretz is trying to make it seem like the equation of one person is bad = automatically means the country he belongs to is immediatly infested with corruption and dark age mentality. Ofcourse Haaretz also makes it difficult only for Israeli related issues and not for any other place in the world, while being the best choice by anti-Israeli flamers due to their feeling that they have "unbiased" news from a reliable "inside" source, creating the illusion that Israel's newspapers are actually admitting something.

Excuse the long post but I am just sick and tired of people quoting Haaretz like it's some holy all-knowing source with not even the slightest of bias.

What when a women getting beating for entering another mans house .. which was posted on here it happend in Pakistan

And the number of issues that has happend in Saudi Arabia and people on here posted those articles when such things happens about those Countries
It hightlights that there is people on this planet who are still back to front

And you mock Vettec for posting the above Article same could happen anywhere else in the world .. But it shows not every Country is free from complete and utter nut jobs

In Germany a man walked into a Courthouse and murdered a Women , Honour killings have happend in the UK ... forced arranged marriages

No Country can EVER BE PERFECT ..........

It's utterly impossible

[Octavariable]

No Country can EVER BE PERFECT ..........

It's utterly impossible

No one claimed that, but there's a huge difference in saying "Israeli woman gets teargased for using men Only sidewalk" and in saying:
"nutjob man attacked woman that defied his personal world view and opinions"
The later being a tad more correct and objective.

[futurepilot2004]

What was she doing outside the kitchen in the first place???:)

[RoyB]

The problem is not just with the zealots, but also with the fact that the authorities/police tolerate this kind of practice on the streets, and haven't dismantled it yet. Doesn't matter if it's just 1 street or 1000, such practice is wrong by all means and should be illegal.
x2.
I just hope that one day a leader will come with a set of balls big enough to kick the Jewish religious fanatics off their high tree.

[kamaz]

Im sick of reading about people complaining that these types of articles are getting posted. Good. I hope they post more of this ugliness so some change can be done, and its not just brushed off under the radar.

No society needs this kind of Taliban in their midst. I hate these people, they are human parasites, they dont serve the army, they smell like sht (I had to suffer many bus rides with these Satmar-types, no sense of personal grooming whatsoever), and they consider everyone who isnt part of their sect to be a fake Jew.

these people live on another planet, and no sane society (obviously excluding S.Arabia)would tolerate 2 sidewalks for men and women!

[gilgoul]

Seperated sidewalks for men and women. I always thought Israel to rather western. Foreign countries, foreign habits.
And that is exactly why people like vettec transmit those reports by Haaretz.
Mea Shearim is a ghetto, a self inflicted one, of ultra orthodox Jews living there in a closed neighborhood.
The Israeli press translated in english, with it critical reporting on Israel and internal affair stories, became a holy mana for every person wishing to depict Israel as some kind of **** hole, because of course the press doesn't report on what goes well here.

But back to the point, there have been about 20 declared Muslim honour killing in France last year, would you conclude that France has become some sort of Somalia or Pakistan?

Same thing here, there are plenty of religious nutjobs on the "holy land", an even larger proportion than elsewere, but that doesn't mean that the rest of the country functions this way.

On a side note, it is in part the responsibility of the liberal mentality of the secular majority in Israel, who wishes not to provoke the nutjobs and is therefore even more cautious in caring for the sensibilities in those neighborhood.

Personnaly, I'd like to run a tour of the place with ham sadnwich eating and girl on girl mobile strip tease just to signify clearly to the crazies:
As long as those streets are maintained by MY taxes, as well as the schools, the hospitals, and the general security of this place is maintained by MY services, this is PUBLIC SPACE and you'd rather behave.
Don't like it, the airport is open (even on shabat)

[gilgoul]

The problem is not just with the zealots, but also with the fact that the authorities/police tolerate this kind of practice on the streets, and haven't dismantled it yet. Doesn't matter if it's just 1 street or 1000, such practice is wrong by all means and should be illegal.
X100
send magav with all the means at their disposal, impose a curfew if necessary, until the bad apples are rooted out and prefer to curse us from afar instead of from within.
I volunteer for that.

[Invisigoth]

It is.

Vettec, every thread you ever posted was about something negative connected to Israel.. STOP IT.

Yeah seriously, Vettec. Go post articles about muslims.

[kamaz]

I'd love to dress up as a giant fuzzy porker or a big red lobster and just run around that neighborhood Jackass-style. Oh teh comedy potential!

[LEGEND]

Don't like it, the airport is open (even on shabat)

Yeah, but ELAL doesn't fly on Saturdays.

[OrangeWolf]

The guy who did this is member of a radical religious anti-Zionist (anti-Israel) organization.

So every thank Vettec, rather than his usual "let's make Israel look bad threads", Vettec has exposed what a load of idiots, amongst others, are the ones against the State of Israel.

Either Vettec FAILED gloriously, or he's alerting people on the insanity of religious nutjobs who are against Israel.

[OrangeWolf]

I'd love to dress up as a giant fuzzy porker or a big red lobster and just run around that neighborhood Jackass-style. Oh teh comedy potential!

There's this Israeli show I saw back when I was there, and this Israeli woman went on a walk there in that anti-Israeli neighborhood and she got thrown at with vegetables. Don't know the name of the show, it's supposed to be really funny.... :roll: (I guess if you know Hebrew well enough)

[~Berdan]

I'd love to dress up as a giant fuzzy porker or a big red lobster and just run around that neighborhood Jackass-style. Oh teh comedy potential!

I think sometimes people do that,for funzies.It's not like those guys are strong on physical side(unless you are cornered or something).

[RoyB]

Yeah seriously, Vettec. Go post articles about muslims.
Come on.. you know that ain't what I meant.
If you check the guy's threads you'll find out that every single thread he ever delivered was about Israel. the annoying thing is that he never takes part in them, he just posts them and vanish.

[trondjac]

source: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1123825.html

Men and Women only sidewalks!! with dozens of security guards to make sure everyone keeps to their side. Some people are still living in dark ages.

I can enlighten you and tell that Israel is just as any other western country, I lived there for a year. the special here is that a crazy man got in the news. We have some of them here too. So it is nothing special. Remmember the last Idiot isn't born yet...

[trondjac]

Come on.. you know that ain't what I meant.
If you check the guy's threads you'll find out that every single thread he ever delivered was about Israel. the annoying thing is that he never takes part in them, he just posts them and vanish.

Like the persons who rings my doorbell and vanishes! Bloody irritating!

[gilgoul]

Yeah, but ELAL doesn't fly on Saturdays.
other companies do.
I'll fund part of the tickets

[JJC]

I'd love to dress up as a giant fuzzy porker or a big red lobster and just run around that neighborhood Jackass-style. Oh teh comedy potential! There was some kid from Brooklyn on a birthright trip that got seriously fkced up by Charedim after he tried taunting them. One lesson he learned is that Israeli Hassidim are not the frightened geekish types from Williamsburg who are scared of their own shadow. The media doesn't differentiate between dozens of "ultra orthodox" sects who may look the same but are different in practices. This Yolish guy is an example of radical fringe that even another anti-Zionist group like Eida Charedit don't support his movement. He is under house arrest and I'm sure he will do something stupid again.

[kamaz]

reminds me of this scene from Bruno

http://www.bangitout.com/uploads/29bruno.bmp

he had like 50 haredim chasing him lolol

[shilka234]

source: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1123825.html

Men and Women only sidewalks!! with dozens of security guards to make sure everyone keeps to their side. Some people are still living in dark ages.

Sad story we have there. Thanks for posting.

[IsraDani]

sidewalk strong!!11

[Givati575]

Im sick of reading about people complaining that these types of articles are getting posted. Good. I hope they post more of this ugliness so some change can be done, and its not just brushed off under the radar.

No society needs this kind of Taliban in their midst. I hate these people, they are human parasites, they dont serve the army, they smell like sht (I had to suffer many bus rides with these Satmar-types, no sense of personal grooming whatsoever), and they consider everyone who isnt part of their sect to be a fake Jew.

these people live on another planet, and no sane society (obviously excluding S.Arabia)would tolerate 2 sidewalks for men and women!

Some would argue that these are the people that keep our religion alive....and without them we would assimilate and vanish into the masses!!

[gilgoul]

Some would argue that these are the people that keep our religion alive....and without them we would assimilate and vanish into the masses!!
So open reservations, and I'll got visit and throw peanuts.
They ain't representing ****, and ain't contributing ****.

If they are so nostalgic about the good old shtetls of Eastern Europe, WTF are they here?

You call me biased, and prejudiced, and you'll be right. The burden of proof of higher morality, of contribution to society, of better education, is on their side.

But on a general note, I find it fabulously ironic to see people justifying human right abuses everywhere in the world by mentioning cultural differences, going suddenly universalists when it comes to mea shearim.

[Givati575]

So open reservations, and I'll got visit and throw peanuts.
They ain't representing ****, and ain't contributing ****.

If they are so nostalgic about the good old shtetls of Eastern Europe, WTF are they here?

You call me biased, and prejudiced, and you'll be right. The burden of proof of higher morality, of contribution to society, of better education, is on their side.

But on a general note, I find it fabulously ironic to see people justifying human right abuses everywhere in the world by mentioning cultural differences, going suddenly universalists when it comes to mea shearim.

you're way to angry to discuss this right now. Have a shawarma, cola, and a nobless, calm down and let's discuss this again :D

[LRPV]

And that is exactly why people like vettec transmit those reports by Haaretz.

x2

Personnaly, I'd like to run a tour of the place with ham sadnwich eating and girl on girl mobile strip tease just to signify clearly to the crazies:
As long as those streets are maintained by MY taxes, as well as the schools, the hospitals, and the general security of this place is maintained by MY services, this is PUBLIC SPACE and you'd rather behave.

Philosophically I agree with you, however I would rather they have an area than be dispersed and cause mayhem throughout the city.

Don't like it, the airport is open (even on shabat)

The airport is open to foreign airlines on Shabbat. El Al doesn't fly due to protests by your haredi friends (p-)). Also many duty free shops are closed.

[Holycrusader]

Im sick of reading about people complaining that these types of articles are getting posted. Good. I hope they post more of this ugliness so some change can be done, and its not just brushed off under the radar.

No society needs this kind of Taliban in their midst. I hate these people, they are human parasites, they dont serve the army, they smell like sht (I had to suffer many bus rides with these Satmar-types, no sense of personal grooming whatsoever), and they consider everyone who isnt part of their sect to be a fake Jew.

these people live on another planet, and no sane society (obviously excluding S.Arabia)would tolerate 2 sidewalks for men and women!

*2
Good post kamaz...

[tea drinker]

^I agree too... but

Im sick of reading about people complaining that these types of articles are getting posted. Good. I hope they post more of this ugliness so some change can be done, and its not just brushed off under the radar.

No society needs this kind of Taliban in their midst. I hate these people, they are human parasites, they dont serve the army, they smell like sht (I had to suffer many bus rides with these Satmar-types, no sense of personal grooming whatsoever), and they consider everyone who isnt part of their sect to be a fake Jew.

these people live on another planet, and no sane society (obviously excluding S.Arabia)would tolerate 2 sidewalks for men and women!
I think people (well, me anyway :) ) are a bit jaded by some of the unnecessary bad news articles. It might be better to just setup a live feed to a funeral parlour to watch the relatives grieve - it would be less depressing frankly.

But to get back on topic, I hate religous fundamentalists, they are inevitably bigots with no compassion for others not branded as superior like them. I think posts about this and intolereance are informative and constructive. The guy in this article sounds like he needs a good beating. Hope the girls family can do the necessary here.
In that film "Where is Osama Bin Laden" They made a very bad impression to outsiders of Israel.

[hidayatnw]

^I agree too... but

I think people (well, me anyway :) ) are a bit jaded by some of the unnecessary bad news articles. It might be better to just setup a live feed to a funeral parlour to watch the relatives grieve - it would be less depressing frankly.

But to get back on topic, I hate religous fundamentalists.

Yes, Religious Fundamentalist is enemy of human being. Dont give fundamentalist in what ever forms (Jewish, Islam, Christian, ultra nationalist) chance..

Peace in the world..

[Lemonz]

Religion poisons everything.

[the_Wicked]

Like I've said before, **** the status quo. Let the dosim found their own country. We'll call it Judea and the two state situation will parallel the bible they adore so much nicely.

[IsraDani]

Like I've said before, **** the status quo. Let the dosim found their own country. We'll call it Judea and the two state situation will parallel the bible they adore so much nicely.

x2...woot
religion is the opiate of the people

[0rphie]

Sorry for derailing the thread. I remember that I read about separated sidewalks for fast and slow walkers. This actually make a lot of sense because quite often in congested places (think Times Square) it might be difficult to pass by people who are not in a hurry. If women prefer window-shopping when men hurry to work I think separating these two groups may make sense. this is probably not the case here.

[OrangeWolf]

Sorry for derailing the thread. I remember that I read about separated sidewalks for fast and slow walkers. This actually make a lot of sense because quite often in congested places (think Times Square) it might be difficult to pass by people who are not in a hurry. If women prefer window-shopping when men hurry to work I think separating these two groups may make sense. this is probably not the case here.

:cantbeli:or rofl

[hidayatnw]

-deleted---

[kamaz]

x2...woot
religion is the opiate of the people

probably the most misquoted quote in history.

heres the full quote in its context

"Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx