marines (not very humor) vignette

[easyand]

I couldn't resist......

http://ssos.altervista.org/mchymnnew.JPG

(CNN) -- A U.S. warplane flying over a ski resort in northern Italy severed a wire supporting cable cars on Tuesday, plunging one car 240-300 feet (80-100 meters) to the snow-covered mountain below. Twenty people, including the cable car's operator were killed in the mid-afternoon accident. Many of the victims were German, rescue officials said.

The plane, an EA-6B Marine Prowler stationed at the U.S. air base in Aviano, Italy, suffered minor damage but returned safely to the base about 62 miles (100 kilometers) east of the accident scene. The pilot was unhurt, a base spokesman said.

[Wilco]

R.I.P. to the 20, horrible accident, but that is a tasteless "toon".


Next time, resist.

[chauncy republicans]

Marines are some of the most responsible and professional fighters on Earth.

[easyand]

Marines are some of the most responsible and professional fighters on Earth.

I know but this time cpt. Ashby wasn't so responsible and professional....

[Ratamacue]

Marines are some of the most responsible and professional fighters on Earth.

I know but this time cpt. Ashby wasn't so responsible and professional....
So you generalize the entire Marine Corps as being such?

[pathetic]

Marines are some of the most responsible and professional fighters on Earth.

maybe - but sometimes they f...cked up... :)

[cropduster]

To be accurate, easyend didnt say anything about the marine corps as such but about the way this pilot may have seen his profession by doing this risky action he did.

[Ratamacue]

The cartoon mocks Marine Corps mottos and the hymn. That usually means that it's portraying the Marine Corps as a whole as cocky, reckless, and irresponsible. I'm not defending the actions of the pilot, but I have a problem with the message in the cartoon.

[SFontaine]

Dude give it a break. It was a good chance for a joke and the guy seized it.

[szr]

that incident was like 5 or 6 years ago.

[Saranof]

that incident was like 5 or 6 years ago.


So that means it's less funny? :)
Give i a break, if someone cracks a joke about a military branch or whatever, getting pissed about it just makes them look silly.

[Obergefreiter]

that incident was like 5 or 6 years ago.

Yes, and it was an episode of JAG about 3 years ago.

[1Shot-1Kill]

What a f**tard!!!!!

[OldRecon]

I guess the fact that the aircraft survived the incident is sort of a testimony to the ironworks philosophy of the Grumman products.
As for the incident in question we have a similar case in Norway during the early 1980's with an RAF Harrier GR-3 who downed a DHC Twin Otter after a collision.
The Harrier, like the Prowler in the Italian case, also survived the encounter, and the pilot apparently still serve in the RAF as an air vice marshall or something of that order.
Apparently there was some major cover up after the incident, including help from Norwegian officials (one of whom had served in one of the Norwegian Spitfire squadrons working with the RAF during WW-2).
Only recently have the pieces come together, and nowdays don't think there will ever be a chanche for the responsible ever being dragged to court for it.

[epc]

R.I.P. to the 20, horrible accident, but that is a tasteless "toon".


Next time, resist.

It was not a horrible accident. An accident implied that everything was ordinary and then something really unexpected happened. Nothing was ordinary at all. It was an incredibly stupid and reckless flight by the crew. What the crew did after the incident to cover up was disgraceful and dishonorable.

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS. The four's actions tarnished the Corps. While they are not the Corps, they are the product of the Corps. The Corps cannot expect its reputation to be unblemished by this incident and the behaviors of its 4 officers.

[Deuterium]

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS.

I take it you would be lenient if it was done by enlisted members? Are officers more knowlegable or honorable than enlisted members?

[el borracho]

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS.

I take it you would be lenient if it was done by enlisted members? Are officers more knowlegable or honorable than enlisted members?

As an enlisted member who has seen the consequences of the UCMJ (applied to others of course) officers are expected to be more honorable and knowlegable than their enlisted counterparts. That's not what the military preaches, but that's how they apply policy. Why do you think that officers have a commission and are placed in a position over enlisted members? It's ridiculous, but the oldest, crustiest sergeant is subordinate to the green, pimply faced 2nd lieutenant, thats just how it is.

[Trigger]

It was not a horrible accident. An accident implied that everything was ordinary and then something really unexpected happened. Nothing was ordinary at all. It was an incredibly stupid and reckless flight by the crew. What the crew did after the incident to cover up was disgraceful and dishonorable.

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS. The four's actions tarnished the Corps. While they are not the Corps, they are the product of the Corps. The Corps cannot expect its reputation to be unblemished by this incident and the behaviors of its 4 officers.

Well then, by your logic anyone of Italian ethnicity is tarnished by the actions of Al Capone. Let the deportations begin.
Gimme a friggin' break. :roll:

[A Soldier]

Old news

[Deuterium]

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS.

I take it you would be lenient if it was done by enlisted members? Are officers more knowlegable or honorable than enlisted members?

As an enlisted member who has seen the consequences of the UCMJ (applied to others of course) officers are expected to be more honorable and knowlegable than their enlisted counterparts. That's not what the military preaches, but that's how they apply policy. Why do you think that officers have a commission and are placed in a position over enlisted members? It's ridiculous, but the oldest, crustiest sergeant is subordinate to the green, pimply faced 2nd lieutenant, thats just how it is.

There is no question as to Chain of Command, but most E7-E9s are EXPECTED to be more knowledgeable and honorable than any 2nd LT. Sorry that's the way it is. Your "expectations" are from an era gone by. The average senior enlisted in today’s military has undergraduate degree or higher. Maybe your supposition was true during the draft era, but it is an invalid assumption in today’s military.

[el borracho]

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS.

I take it you would be lenient if it was done by enlisted members? Are officers more knowlegable or honorable than enlisted members?

As an enlisted member who has seen the consequences of the UCMJ (applied to others of course) officers are expected to be more honorable and knowlegable than their enlisted counterparts. That's not what the military preaches, but that's how they apply policy. Why do you think that officers have a commission and are placed in a position over enlisted members? It's ridiculous, but the oldest, crustiest sergeant is subordinate to the green, pimply faced 2nd lieutenant, thats just how it is.

There is no question as to Chain of Command, but most E7-E9s are EXPECTED to be more knowledgeable and honorable than any 2nd LT. Sorry that's the way it is. Your "expectations" are from an era gone by. The average senior enlisted in today’s military has undergraduate degree or higher. Maybe your supposition was true during the draft era, but it is an invalid assumption in today’s military.

I understand what you are saying, and on my personal level I respect any E7-9 a lot more than an LT...but still, the people running the show still act the way that I posted earlier.

[Damian]

We cannot generalize the Prowler's pilot made a mistake not the USMC

[b.scheller]

the toon is tasteless but also terrible. the words don't even match the melody of the "Halls of Montezuma"...ugh, if your not going to take an effort to try to make the melody and the words to go well then their is no point of attempting...

[Saranof]

the toon is tasteless but also terrible. the words don't even match the melody of the "Halls of Montezuma"...ugh, if your not going to take an effort to try to make the melody and the words to go well then their is no point of attempting...

I know, let's go back to making tasteless cartoons of french people and leftists and stupid arabs. Since it's not the US or Israel getting picked on, it's ok :D

[Ratamacue]

the toon is tasteless but also terrible. the words don't even match the melody of the "Halls of Montezuma"...ugh, if your not going to take an effort to try to make the melody and the words to go well then their is no point of attempting...

I know, let's go back to making tasteless cartoons of french people and leftists and stupid arabs. Since it's not the US or Israel getting picked on, it's ok :D
You've been the first person to mention anything of the sort in the thread. Way to hijack.

[shrek]

Bad joke, not funny!!

We all have bad days, how many times have you all driven drunk or sped. No different, so don't cast stones.

Semper Fi

And BTW, the cartoon did mock the entire Marine Corps ans is tasteless. Any joke that stems from a tragedy is tasteless. IF you post it, then you have a tasteless sense of humor.

Hey, Iv'e got an idea, print the cartoon out and show it to some Marines, then come back and post pictures of yourself, now that would be funny!!!

[Hiroshima]

Donno Shrek, I found it very very funny, course, me being a chAIR Force brat, and know a few good Marine jokes, I would find it very entertaining. RIP to those 20 civvies, that Marine pilot was just far too low.

[KIOSK]

It's a bad case of hot dogging, and it turned real ugly real fast, i know a lot of folks do this but that is the sad consequence. and that cartoon wasn't funny, but it wont make USMC any better if we let it get to us in an unprofesional manner by showing anger. ( Shrug it off )

[Hiroshima]

Wow....I'm awfully impressed...the Marine in my office would have found some Air Force jokes to fire back at me if I sent him that one.

[aartamen]

Many of the victims were German, rescue officials said.

The plane, an EA-6B Marine Prowler stationed at the U.S. air base in Aviano, Italy, suffered minor damage but returned safely to the base about 62 miles (100 kilometers) east of the accident scene. The pilot was unhurt, a base spokesman said.

And those are the important things.

[easyand]

Many of the victims were German, rescue officials said.

The plane, an EA-6B Marine Prowler stationed at the U.S. air base in Aviano, Italy, suffered minor damage but returned safely to the base about 62 miles (100 kilometers) east of the accident scene. The pilot was unhurt, a base spokesman said.

And those are the important things.

20 people are minor important than a plane? :bash:

[szr]

Poor judgment on the part of the pilot. Poor taste on the part of the artist. This incident was bad for everyone involved.

[Freibier]

Many of the victims were German, rescue officials said.

The plane, an EA-6B Marine Prowler stationed at the U.S. air base in Aviano, Italy, suffered minor damage but returned safely to the base about 62 miles (100 kilometers) east of the accident scene. The pilot was unhurt, a base spokesman said.

And those are the important things.
You ****ing wanker

[glamwar]

Whoopie friggin dooo...

I have a high opinion of the corp, and this incident nor this toon affect that in the least!

It's an unfortunate inicident, but oh well.

[riesgoyfortuna]

Many of the victims were German, rescue officials said.

The plane, an EA-6B Marine Prowler stationed at the U.S. air base in Aviano, Italy, suffered minor damage but returned safely to the base about 62 miles (100 kilometers) east of the accident scene. The pilot was unhurt, a base spokesman said.

And those are the important things.

you are very sick

[epc]

It was not a horrible accident. An accident implied that everything was ordinary and then something really unexpected happened. Nothing was ordinary at all. It was an incredibly stupid and reckless flight by the crew. What the crew did after the incident to cover up was disgraceful and dishonorable.

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS. The four's actions tarnished the Corps. While they are not the Corps, they are the product of the Corps. The Corps cannot expect its reputation to be unblemished by this incident and the behaviors of its 4 officers.

Well then, by your logic anyone of Italian ethnicity is tarnished by the actions of Al Capone. Let the deportations begin.
Gimme a friggin' break. :roll:

If you think a citizenship by birth is the same as wearing the uniform of an elite service, then your logic could work. I don't think they are the same, so I think your logic stinks.

These Marine officers were not some lieutenants fresh out of college. Those were captains. Went through officer training and flight school. Reviewed and promoted twice to captaincy. So what did they do? Broke flight safety rules. And then destroyed evidence to hide their culpability. You cannot say what they did was honorable. And how can anyone say their action did not tarnish the Corps is beyond me.

Perhaps the US military culture is different from what I imagined. To me, when I wear a uniform, I represent the organization. And anything I do or say while wearing the uniform represents and reflects the organization, period. But hey, that was what I was taught when I was in the first grade, when I started to wear the uniform of my elementary school. And heaven help me if I was loitering in a video arcade near school in uniform and a teacher saw me. Then again, that was in a different county, culture and continent.

Sorry if my values are too harsh and not applicable to the US military.

[Jack Mehoff]

So 199,998 hard working, honest Marines are bad people because of 1-2 bad Marines? Sweet!!! Using your own logic, ALL muslim are terrorist ragheads and must be bomb into submission.

[epc]

I never said every Marine is bad because of a few. I simply said the reputation of the Marine Corps is tarnished bedcause of the actions of those few. I don't think it's the same.

In any case, I am really beginning to think it's a cultural gap.

If there's a bad apple, I think it's important to find out why there's a bad apple, do something about it so there won't be another one. Saying it's only 1 bad apple, and therefore does not matter, will just result in more bad apples coming.

Some Americans here seem to think that since it's only 1 or a few apples, it's no big deal at all and life goes on as usual.

[abncougar]

isnt this REALLY old news?

[abncougar]

isnt this REALLY old news?

[caleb]

Many of the victims were German, rescue officials said.

The plane, an EA-6B Marine Prowler stationed at the U.S. air base in Aviano, Italy, suffered minor damage but returned safely to the base about 62 miles (100 kilometers) east of the accident scene. The pilot was unhurt, a base spokesman said.

And those are the important things.

You sick fücking cocksucker, say that standing in front of me and I crush every single bone in your fücking body.

[ZeroPositive]

Good Joke tbh shows someone had to bother to draw and fill out the cartoon :)

RIP to those poor bastards

Respect to the USMC as long as they punished the person who did this.

[Freibier]

Those wankers were acquitted of all charges! :fork:
However, they were later found guilty of obstruction of justice for destroying the videotape from a camera they had brought on the flight, and discharged from the Corps.

[Trigger]

It was not a horrible accident. An accident implied that everything was ordinary and then something really unexpected happened. Nothing was ordinary at all. It was an incredibly stupid and reckless flight by the crew. What the crew did after the incident to cover up was disgraceful and dishonorable.

Here you have four highly educated and trained OFFICERS. The four's actions tarnished the Corps. While they are not the Corps, they are the product of the Corps. The Corps cannot expect its reputation to be unblemished by this incident and the behaviors of its 4 officers.

Well then, by your logic anyone of Italian ethnicity is tarnished by the actions of Al Capone. Let the deportations begin.
Gimme a friggin' break. :roll:

If you think a citizenship by birth is the same as wearing the uniform of an elite service, then your logic could work. I don't think they are the same, so I think your logic stinks.

These Marine officers were not some lieutenants fresh out of college. Those were captains. Went through officer training and flight school. Reviewed and promoted twice to captaincy. So what did they do? Broke flight safety rules. And then destroyed evidence to hide their culpability. You cannot say what they did was honorable. And how can anyone say their action did not tarnish the Corps is beyond me.

Perhaps the US military culture is different from what I imagined. To me, when I wear a uniform, I represent the organization. And anything I do or say while wearing the uniform represents and reflects the organization, period. But hey, that was what I was taught when I was in the first grade, when I started to wear the uniform of my elementary school. And heaven help me if I was loitering in a video arcade near school in uniform and a teacher saw me. Then again, that was in a different county, culture and continent.

Sorry if my values are too harsh and not applicable to the US military.
1. It was an accident. They didn't intentionally kill 20 people.
2. Was their behavior afterward disgraceful? Yes. Should all Marines walk around shamefaced because of the actions of a few? No.
3. Thanks for sharing your opinions on what uniforms represent. I'm sure you were just as pompous in your first grade uniform. But hey, I'm sure you folks in whatever country you live in are superior to and have higher values and morals than the average Marine.
4. Sorry if my flippant, sarcastic comment went over your inflated ego.

[Macs.]

1. It was an accident. They didn't intentionally kill 20 people.


But they did intentionally fly that low, and did know the risks. They are fully responsible for murdering 20 people, and its a shame that they didn't get a real punishment.

[Jack Mehoff]

Murder?

[Trigger]

1. It was an accident. They didn't intentionally kill 20 people.


But they did intentionally fly that low, and did know the risks. They are fully responsible for murdering 20 people, and its a shame that they didn't get a real punishment.
Yes they're responsible. No it's not murder.
If you're speeding down the street, exceeding the speed limit and hit someone in the crosswalk, it's an accident.
I do agree that they should have been punished though.

[Hydro]

1. It was an accident. They didn't intentionally kill 20 people.


But they did intentionally fly that low, and did know the risks. They are fully responsible for murdering 20 people, and its a shame that they didn't get a real punishment.
Yes they're responsible. No it's not murder.


Very true. They didn't set out to kill 20 people on purpose, ergo not murder. They are responsible for those deaths though, much like a drunk bus driver, if he crashes and kills passengers, it's not murder, but he's fully responsible for the deaths and should face up to the consequences.

[ZeroPositive]

involuntary manslaughter

[Herrmannek]

1. It was an accident. They didn't intentionally kill 20 people.


But they did intentionally fly that low, and did know the risks. They are fully responsible for murdering 20 people, and its a shame that they didn't get a real punishment.
Yes they're responsible. No it's not murder.


Very true. They didn't set out to kill 20 people on purpose, ergo not murder. They are responsible for those deaths though, much like a drunk bus driver, if he crashes and kills passengers, it's not murder, but he's fully responsible for the deaths and should face up to the consequences.

This is semantics... They knew what they do and what risk is... Stupidity isn't pallation.... I have sad experience with such people, they do more harm to society than intentious murderes...

[Hydro]

1. It was an accident. They didn't intentionally kill 20 people.


But they did intentionally fly that low, and did know the risks. They are fully responsible for murdering 20 people, and its a shame that they didn't get a real punishment.
Yes they're responsible. No it's not murder.


Very true. They didn't set out to kill 20 people on purpose, ergo not murder. They are responsible for those deaths though, much like a drunk bus driver, if he crashes and kills passengers, it's not murder, but he's fully responsible for the deaths and should face up to the consequences.

This is semantics... They knew what they do and what risk is... Stupidity isn't pallation.... I have sad experience with such people, they do more harm to society than intentious murderes...

I see what you're getting at, and I fully understand. Stupid people get other people killed, I've seen it myself. It's just they're not murderers, this isn't to play down the outright stupidity of what they did, and what a tragedy it was though.

They're not murderers, just bloody stupid idiots who took the lives of many for nothing. They have to live with that, and yes, they should've been SEVERELY punished.

The mere fact they tried to cover up the incident is enough to see that they knew exactly what they were doing.

[ZeroPositive]

involuntary manslaughter
is what I feel about what they did... they brought shame to the USMC!!

[Herrmannek]

involuntary manslaughter
is what I feel about what they did... they brought shame to the USMC!!
Volountary or not, this was avoidable and they had all data/knowledge to do so... "Hung them*", sorry, pay fair dough to victim's familes and case closed...




*I'm not for capital punishment

BTW how you are classifing piromaniac who burn to ground house with people inside, he also don't kill them intentionaly, but you know **** happens....