Help - ID this bolt action rifle?

[Jacknola]

Can anyone help identify what rifle is this Afshar tribesman in Iran carrying? Thanks.

http://inlinethumb44.webshots.com/44651/2695622040103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/2695622040103673033vWzOdp)

http://inlinethumb14.webshots.com/45133/2496828780103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/2496828780103673033sjCOka)

http://inlinethumb14.webshots.com/47181/2144833680103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/2144833680103673033kPjblP)

[Hollis]

It is a Mauser. From the sling hole in the stock, a K98, But the bold is straight? The carry sling looks to be added. Bayonet mounting K98 or Yugo. It could have been played with or is just a Yugo or something similar.

[maurice]

i think its a copy of a mauser many contries like turkey copied it and the turkish mauser looks exactly like that with the straight out bolt but its probably some other copy.

[Hollis]

i think its a copy of a mauser many contries like turkey copied it and the turkish mauser looks exactly like that with the straight out bolt but its probably some other copy.


Turkish Mausers do not have the same bayonet fastener like the Yugo or K98. If the top of the receiver was more visible, one might be able to determine what exactly it is.

[gaijinsamurai]

Could it be a Persian Mauser? They were built by Brno in Czechoslovakia, if I remember correctly. Very nice varients of the Mauser. I wish I had bought one about 15 years ago, when you could buy them with matching serial # bayonets.

[Chiptox]

It is a Mauser. From the sling hole in the stock, a K98, But the bold is straight? The carry sling looks to be added. Bayonet mounting K98 or Yugo. It could have been played with or is just a Yugo or something similar.
The Czechs built Mausers for Iran in the '30s. The 98/29. It has a straight bolt.

http://public.fotki.com/ptrthgr8/mausers/persian/

[maurice]

it does look like the persian copy and that would be more likely than the turkish one but its still hard to tell..

[Hollis]

That would seem reasonable. Thanks Chiptox and Maurics

[gaijinsamurai]

That would seem reasonable. Thanks Chiptox and Maurics

I was the first to guess Persian Mauser! :(

[Hollis]

I was the first to guess Persian Mauser! :(

What was your name again? Thanks BTW.

One thing for certain, it looks like the user kept pretty good care of the rifle.

[Jacknola]

Thanks gentlemen. That is a nice identification, and an unusual weapon. I was truly perplexed, trying to make it into some type of Lee or medford enfield or something. Are the apparent 5-round stripper clips in the leather pouches consistent with this identification? This picture is circa late 1990s... and rifle has obviously been handed down for 70 years or so, carefully and exquizitely cared for.

[Chiptox]

I was the first to guess Persian Mauser! :(
Only by a minute. and I had a link. So there. :p


Jacknola, according to my old copy of The Book of Rifles it has a 5rd non-detachable box magazine. I'd say it's a match.

[gaijinsamurai]

Hey, a minute is a minute, and I could have posted a link too!!!

:)

[gaijinsamurai]

Seriously, though

Those Persian Mausers are nice rifles, and highly esteemed by collectors and Mauser enthusiasts.
One of my uncles is a collector of Mauser rifles (as well as Broomhandle pistols and Lugers) and has a Persian Mauser (along with an Iranian wife). It is a very nice rifle.

[Migs]

It looks like a Mosin Nagant. See where the bolt is straight and the buttplate is screwed on?

[Arnie100]

I believe it's a Persian Mauser! Look at the front sight!

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/9069/mauser1898b.jpg (http://img37.imageshack.us/i/mauser1898b.jpg/)

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/11/mauser1898.jpg (http://img37.imageshack.us/i/mauser1898.jpg/)

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/2754/mauser898a.jpg (http://img37.imageshack.us/i/mauser898a.jpg/)

[Jacknola]

It's nice to have a place to get such questions answered. I was about to ask if the odd way the strap was configured was a personal adaptation or regulation. The pictures just posted by Arnie seem to indicate it was the regular configuration. I would have had a hard time figuring out the routing for the strap given the location of three strap hinges… but I’m no weapons expert.

http://inlinethumb34.webshots.com/47201/2927677900103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/2927677900103673033ksIukL)

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/9069/mauser1898b.jpg (http://img37.imageshack.us/i/mauser1898b.jpg/)

[James]

That partial loop makes me think of the stacking swivel on a Garand.

[dangerdan87]

Mausers stay in better shape usually in the arid environment. Every one I came across in Iraq was pristine. Even the Persian carbine we used for the door handle for our room in Iraqi-plaster-house in our FOB

[Hollis]

Thanks gentlemen. That is a nice identification, and an unusual weapon. I was truly perplexed, trying to make it into some type of Lee or medford enfield or something. Are the apparent 5-round stripper clips in the leather pouches consistent with this identification? This picture is circa late 1990s... and rifle has obviously been handed down for 70 years or so, carefully and exquizitely cared for.


5 round stripper clips are common for Mauser.

[Jacknola]

I am not very knowlegable about Mausers. But one thing catches my eye... this model includes four, (4 !!), sling swivels. So much for looking for weight savings in the 1930s. It also may be a graphic illustration of parade ground requirments ... "vee must haf des swivel der or vee vill noot be able to stack dee arms in dee propor vay!"

http://inlinethumb63.webshots.com/46398/2155479070103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/2155479070103673033PdNvXt)

[Chiptox]

what you have to remember is that this is a full length RIFLE! it's a "updated" 98 mauser that was itself just shedding the old blackpowder ways. it has none of that carbine (the k in 98k that the germans favored) nonsense. that makes it long. really really long. if you ran out of ammo it would be too big to use as a club. shaq could use it as a crutch if he broke his leg. if you were cold you could burn it and be warm all winter. *insert some other dumb analogy asserting it's massive size relative to modern arms*

it's a big rifle. so i can only assume that their fondness for swivels has something to do with the mechanics of balancing the darn thing while carrying it.

[Jurinko]

Looks like Czechoslovak vz.24 (=Mk.24), Mauser-based pre-WWII rifle. But the fist and third sling swivels are abundant, and vz.24 had wood cover on the front top of the barrel (this one gets it bare as Mauser). Straight bolt lever is typical vz.24.

[dangerdan87]

Looks like Czechoslovak vz.24 (=Mk.24), Mauser-based pre-WWII rifle. But the fist and third sling swivels are abundant, and vz.24 had wood cover on the front top of the barrel (this one gets it bare as Mauser). Straight bolt lever is typical vz.24.

Thats because pretty much all Mausers are based off the Vz.24. Thats definatly a Persian. Came across a metric crap ton of these, Mod 98's, and Turks in Iraq.

The Persian Mausers were made by the Brno factory, among other Mausers. There are alot of different models/types of Mausers.

German Gew. 88 (US Marines used this rifle at one point in time)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ee/German_GEW_88.jpg
German Gew. 98 (WWI era)
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y119/blasterboy82/Curio%20Relics/Mausers/GEW98-1.jpg
German Mod. 98 (WWII era)
http://www.aliparsa.com/brno/kar98k.jpg
Vz. 24
http://www.mauser98k.internetdsl.pl/vz24/14.jpg
1938 Turkish Mauser
http://www.collectiblefirearms.com/Pictures/mau_0464-03.JPG
Persian Mauser
http://www.aliparsa.com/brno/boland.jpg
Persian Mauser crest
http://www.aliparsa.com/brno/crest.jpg


Gew. 88 Used my US Marines around 1900
http://www.users.fast.net/%7Ekragmeister/gew88/usmcgew1.jpg

[California Joe]

Looks like Czechoslovak vz.24 (=Mk.24), Mauser-based pre-WWII rifle. But the fist and third sling swivels are abundant, and vz.24 had wood cover on the front top of the barrel (this one gets it bare as Mauser). Straight bolt lever is typical vz.24.

Did you even bother to read the rest of this thread before posting? You know, the part where it was already positively identified?

[Andreas]

Not related but that red leather chestrig is all kinds of awesome.

[Jacknola]

I thought so too... and was about to ask if this was homemade (Afshar tribesmen were/are very craft oriented), or was a issue item. I suspect it was an issue item, possibly for some special guard unit. He has 100 rounds in 5-round clips, each in it's own leather holder.

http://inlinethumb14.webshots.com/45133/2496828780103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/2496828780103673033sjCOka)
http://inlinethumb44.webshots.com/44651/2695622040103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/2695622040103673033vWzOdp)

The Afshar women-folk weave some extrodinary rugs. I have a collection ... here is one of my favorites. By the way, those are opium poppies in the field of the rug.

http://inlinethumb64.webshots.com/43775/2913140040103673033S600x600Q85.jpg (http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/photo/2913140040103673033lrjSOK)

If interested, pictures of my Afshar rug collection are here

http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/album/563905792GTCQgG

[Ought Six]

It the Persian Mauser chambered for 7.92x57mm? Were they made in Germany to an Iranian contract, or license-produced in Iran?

That ammo harness is a really nice piece of work. Looks like he is carrying close to 150 rounds. From the look of him, I would not want to be in range if he was pissed at me.

[gaijinsamurai]

Read the pervious posts in the thread.

[gaijinsamurai]

Nice collection of rugs, Jacknola.

I've got a couple of Baluchi tribal carpets and a Tabriz.
Would love to have a nice Nain-produced carpet.

[dangerdan87]

It the Persian Mauser chambered for 7.92x57mm? Were they made in Germany to an Iranian contract, or license-produced in Iran?


Yes, 7.62x57 or otherwise known as 8mm Mauser or 8x57 (The first Gew 88s and Gew 98s were .323 bore 7.92x57. They updated the caliber to .318 and most, if not all, of your Mauser rifles are .318 bore).
The Persian Mauser was made under license by CZ at the Brno factory in Czechoslovakia.

[big_les]

The Gew88 mentioned above is not actually a Mauser.

[Ought Six]

gs:
"Read the pervious posts in the thread."Actually, I had, but I missed this in dd's post #34:
"The Persian Mausers were made by the Brno factory, among other Mausers. There are alot of different models/types of Mausers."My error.


=========================================================

dd:

Thanks for the info! :)

I was unaware that 7.92x57mm and 8x57mm were actually different calibers, and that 8x57mm was closer to .30 cal.

[Hollis]

The Gew88 mentioned above is not actually a Mauser.


It is also called 88 Commission. Though if you look for parts, they will be under the Mauser selection at Numrich. It was developed by the Arms commission, not Mauser. In that post the only rifle that I don't have is the Persian Mauser.

[dangerdan87]

The G88 isnt a Mauser, I know. But its in the Mauser family.

[Chiptox]

The G88 isnt a Mauser, I know. But its in the Mauser family.
I thought it was more closely related to the Mannlicher.

[Hollis]

I thought it was more closely related to the Mannlicher.


See how it was developed by the Arms Commission, maybe. I don't know what all the designs that was used to build that rifle. One aspect was the ammo, it was 8mm, but a slightly smaller bullet than the 8 mm later used. Many of those rifles had new barrels installed. This happened to Mausers made at the time too, such as the '86 Turkish Mauser. The new barrels are marked with a "S" or something like that. It would be very wise to mic the barrel to be sure.

[dangerdan87]

See how it was developed by the Arms Commission, maybe. I don't know what all the designs that was used to build that rifle. One aspect was the ammo, it was 8mm, but a slightly smaller bullet than the 8 mm later used. Many of those rifles had new barrels installed. This happened to Mausers made at the time too, such as the '86 Turkish Mauser. The new barrels are marked with a "S" or something like that. It would be very wise to mic the barrel to be sure.

If memory serves me correctly, the Gew 88 has a .318 bore (8x57 J). Later they rebarreled them to a .323 bore (8x57 JS). They would mark the receiver with an "S" after the rebarrel. Your most common Mausers are .323 bore (those that are 8mm anyway). The 8x57 J is lower in pressure than the JS.
I used to know all this, but its been a few years (I was researching for Mausers because I was and still am building a custom rifle from a Mauser action.