Russia tells the US it has no right to lecture others on human rights

[CaptMorgan68]

Russia dismisses U.S. human rights report
MOSCOW
Fri Mar 12, 2010 12:32pm EST
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MOSCOW (*******) - Russia indignantly dismissed U.S. criticism of its human rights record on Friday, saying the United States was guilty of its own abuses from Afghanistan to "the streets of America."

In a statement laced with sarcasm, the Foreign Ministry said the main purpose of what it called the U.S. State Department's annual "opus" on human rights worldwide was to "solve the internal political problems of the American establishment."

The Russia section of the State Department report, released on Thursday, cited problems and abuses ranging from corruption and unfair elections to the killings of journalists who reported critically on the government.

This year's report came amid efforts to mend Russian-U.S. ties, which hit a post-Cold War low after Russia's war with U.S.-supported Georgia in August 2008.

The Russian Foreign Ministry said that despite those efforts, the United States was using human rights as a tool "to forward quite concrete, material foreign policy interests."

"Everything in the report fits tradition and ritual -- the approaches, the theses, the conclusions, the sources," it said. "In this area we noticed no big difference, despite the current (U.S.) administration's declared 'reset' in our relations."

As in past years, Russia said the United States had no right to lecture others. The Foreign Ministry said it was looking forward to a U.S. report on human rights in the United States and singled out U.S. military prisons in Afghanistan and Guantanamo Bay.

"It would be interesting to learn how (the State Department), which loves to moralize on the issue of human rights, would comment on torture and inhumane or humiliating treatment in the United States itself," the statement said.

"And not just the widely known cases in Bagram and the special prison in Guantanamo -- which, contrary to the administration's promises, just doesn't close -- but also in the prisons and on the streets of America," it said.

A report on rights in the United States should not omit "domestic violence leading to the murder of children, including those adopted in Russia," as well as "racism and xenophobia toward migrants, and Islamophobia," it said.

http://www.*******.com/article/idUSTRE62B37620100312

let the pissing match begin so to speak) or not....

[Breakfast in Vegas]

let the pissing match begin so to speak) or not....Pissing into the wind is, well... counter-productive.

[Russianlynxy]

Pissing into the wind

There's a good Russian proverb regarding this p-)

[Breakfast in Vegas]

There's a good Russian proverb regarding this p-)It's a universal theme... )

[custodes]

There's a good Russian proverb regarding this p-)

Stalin say: "Comrade who lives in glass house,dress in basement?"

[therifleman]

"domestic violence leading to the murder of children, including those adopted in Russia," as well as "racism and xenophobia toward migrants, and Islamophobia," it said.



http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk190/Winimperial/HA_HA_HA2C_OH_WOW.jpg
......................

[Russianlynxy]

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk190/Winimperial/HA_HA_HA2C_OH_WOW.jpg
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stupid right? now you get an idea of people's reactions to worldwide whining regarding Russia's "human rights"

[CaptMorgan68]

stupid right? now you get an idea of people's reactions to worldwide whining regarding Russia's "human rights"

Russia has problems with "human rights" for sure but the US is not the one to lecture on the topic really is what they are saying IMHO

[therifleman]

Its a double edged sword here. Neither country has a clean slate historically. Especially when you look at Stalinism at it's apex. Before Russia goes out decrying "racism" is America they should check whos currently in office. Russia also has a considerably large neo-nazi movement of their own to deal with.

[custodes]

The crimes of individuals are not the same as government policy/apparatchik approval.

[Breakfast in Vegas]

Russia has problems with "human rights" for sure but the US is not the one to lecture on the topic really is what they are saying IMHOI agree.

The overall message is correct, however the wording was rather moronic, as were the examples given.

But like I said, it's all pissing into the wind... but if it makes some senator and his constituency happy...

[therifleman]

The crimes of individuals are not the same as government policy/apparatchik approval.

Umm NKVD anyone?

[Abyr]

Its a double edged sword here. Neither country has a clean slate historically. Especially when you look at Stalinism at it's apex. Before Russia goes out decrying "racism" is America they should check whos currently in office. Russia also has a considerably large neo-nazi movement of their own to deal with.
Without any connection to the topic, I would like to point out that racism is not necessary anti-black or anti-asian or anti-latino or whatever.
It can be anti-white also, so telling that there are no racism issues just because black guy sits in the president's chair is not very good argument. :)


P.S. For mentally challenged, I'm not stating US and A are second SA.

[Ataman]

Umm NKVD anyone?


It's about Russia and not about the SU.

[therifleman]

It's about Russia and not about the SU.

Well what was his comment directed at? Stalin? In that case its SU.

[custodes]

Well what was his comment directed at? Stalin? In that case its SU.

The Stalin joke was not serious. But,I do not see much difference between Stalin and Putin.A little maybe.

[Ataman]

The Stalin joke was not serious. But,I do not see much difference between Stalin and Putin.A little maybe.

Thanks for sharing your ignorance with us.

This is a great compliment to Stalin which he doesn't deserve at all.

[custodes]

Thanks for sharing your ignorance with us.

This is a great compliment to Stalin which he doesn't deserve at all.

Dictator man is dictator.

[kinney_bmx]

The Stalin joke was not serious. But,I do not see much difference between Stalin and Putin.A little maybe.
lol wut....

[Ataman]

Dictator man is dictator.

So you're calling Putin a dictator?
Seriously, stop watching FOX/CNN News.

[West Texican]

Mole hills are not equal to mountains.

[custodes]

Mole hills are not equal to mountains.

He may have a different job but,he will never leave.

[SBL]

Russia has no right to tell the United States that they have no right to lecture the world on human rights. So there.

[LineDoggie]

So you're calling Putin a dictator?
Seriously, stop watching FOX/CNN News.
I can't recall Fox ever calling Putin a Dictator.

[Kilgor]

I can't recall Fox ever calling Putin a Dictator.

shhh, dont ruin the baseless stereotype.

http://www.foxnews.com/search-results/search?q=putin+dictator

[Ataman]

I can't recall Fox ever calling Putin a Dictator.

Of course not, it's more subtle. They don't say it, they imply it and many people believe it.
But I don't intend to start a discussion about Fox News.

[Kilgor]

Of course not, it's more subtle. They don't say it, they imply it and many people believe it.
But I don't intend to start a discussion about Fox News.

because you dont have any proof thats why.

[TakeIt]

because you dont have any proof thats why. 2 minutes spend on search.

War shows that Putin is running things in Russia (http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2008Aug15/0,4670,RussiaPutininCharge,00.html)
'Don't Hold Your Breath' on Putin Leaving Politics (http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,579032,00.html)
Putin Hints at Return to the Kremlin (http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,549562,00.html)
Russian Orthodox Church a growing political force
Russian Police Arrest 100 in Anti-Kremlin Protests

And so on.

[Kilgor]

And can u post the sections where it "implies" putin is a dictator ?

[LineDoggie]

Of course not, it's more subtle. They don't say it, they imply it and many people believe it.
But I don't intend to start a discussion about Fox News.Aaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh, I see now. You receive special rays through the TV that tell you they said it.

[Ataman]

And can u post the sections where it "implies" putin is a dictator ?

War shows that Putin is running things in Russia (http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2008Aug15/0,4670,RussiaPutininCharge,00.html)

"The ongoing conflict has confirmed what has become increasingly obvious in recent weeks: Putin is still the one in charge."

So it says that he's the one in charge and running things although officially it can only be Medvedev. By hearing stuff like this over and over it creates a certain picture in your mind.

But let's get back to the actual topic.

[SevernayA]

Dictator man is dictator.
How many dictators have willing stepped down to a lesser position on their own accord? At the end of Putin's presidency he could have changed the constitution to allow himself to run for another term - the majority of Russia people would have supported this - but he didn't do it. He must be a **** dictator.

[Hollis]

Maybe we all could do better in the area of human rights.

[hskywalker]

China has just released the annual human rights record of USA.



I. On Life, Property and Personal Security

Widespread violent crimes in the United States posed threats to the lives, properties and personal security of its people.
In 2008, US residents experienced 4.9 million violent crimes, 16.3 million property crimes and 137,000 personal thefts, and the violent crime rate was 19.3 victimizations per 1,000 persons aged 12 or over, according to a report published by the US Department of Justice in September 2009 (Criminal Victimization 2008, US Department of Justice, http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov). In 2008, over 14 million arrests occurred for all offenses (except traffic violations) in the country, and the arrest rate for violent crime was 198.2 per 100,000 inhabitants (Crime in the United States, 2008, http://www.fbi.gov). In 2009, a total of 35 domestic homicides occurred in Philadelphia, a 67 percent increase from 2008 (The New York Times, December 30, 2009). In New York City, 461 murders were reported in 2009, and the crime rate was 1,151 cases per 100,000 people. San Antonio in Texas was deemed as the most dangerous among 25 US large cities with 2,538 crimes recorded per 100,000 people (The China Press, December 30, 2009). The murder rate rose 5.5 percent in towns with a population of 10,000 or fewer in 2008 (http://www.usatoday.com, June 1, 2009). Most of the United States' 15,000 annual murders occur in cities where they are concentrated in poorer neighborhoods (http://www.*******.com, October 7, 2009).
Below is the full text.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2010-03/12/content_9582821.htm

[JBH22]

USA is the beacon of democracy in this world but 1 thing i failed to understand when the US air force bombs civilian in Afghanistan its COLLATERAL DAMAGE but if it is another country its mass killing or genocide with CNN and BBC coming in to show the cruelty of the "aggressors"

As such i agree with Russia no country has the right to lecture another country about human rights etc.. Practice what you preach...

[Hollis]

China has just released the annual human rights record of USA.


http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2010-03/12/content_9582821.htm

No secret in the US, Crime reports come out every year complete with in depth analysis. Difference here is when the State does the crime.

Lots of information:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita

Also there is probably more, like how good is the reporting system. If a crime is not reported, then it does not become a stat.

[armored_diplomacy]

Russia has problems with "human rights" for sure but the US is not the one to lecture on the topic really is what they are saying IMHO

... x ... 2 ...


USA is the beacon of democracy in this world but 1 thing i failed to understand when the US air force bombs civilian in Afghanistan its COLLATERAL DAMAGE but if it is another country its mass killing or genocide with CNN and BBC coming in to show the cruelty of the "aggressors"

As such i agree with Russia no country has the right to lecture another country about human rights etc.. Practice what you preach...

... x ... 2 ... again.

[Clear_blues]

USA is the beacon of democracy in this world but 1 thing i failed to understand when the US air force bombs civilian in Afghanistan its COLLATERAL DAMAGE but if it is another country its mass killing or genocide with CNN and BBC coming in to show the cruelty of the "aggressors"

As such i agree with Russia no country has the right to lecture another country about human rights etc.. Practice what you preach...
not every action in another country that causes civilian deaths is labeled a genocide. The term "collateral damage" is an euphemism, something everyone throws around to limit negative public opinion.

[Hollis]

USA is the beacon of democracy in this world but 1 thing i failed to understand when the US air force bombs civilian in Afghanistan its COLLATERAL DAMAGE but if it is another country its mass killing or genocide with CNN and BBC coming in to show the cruelty of the "aggressors"




Google is your friend. You can look up word meanings.

"collateral damage n. Unintended damage, injuries, or deaths caused by an action, especially unintended civilian casualties caused by a military operation."

You can google the meaning of the other words.

[brokenlegdrunk]

USA is the beacon of democracy in this world but 1 thing i failed to understand when the US air force bombs civilian in Afghanistan its COLLATERAL DAMAGE but if it is another country its mass killing or genocide with CNN and BBC coming in to show the cruelty of the "aggressors"

As such i agree with Russia no country has the right to lecture another country about human rights etc.. Practice what you preach...


lol yes yes we all know the US is trying to kill off every last Afghani and god hell the Americans must stop killing off news reporters who speak out against its govt as well that way they can keep there violations hidden

[cn_habs]

The US' record is not as bad as organized crimes in Russia, but she still has no right to lecture others as one of the worst abusers.

[brokenlegdrunk]

The US' record is not as bad as organized crimes in Russia, but she still has no right to lecture others as one of the worst abusers.

worst abuser of what exactly?

[Fat Lazy American]

How many dictators have willing stepped down to a lesser position on their own accord?

That's actually a fairly standard maneuver. Sometimes they continue to wield the real power from their supposedly lesser position, sometimes they really do cede power, more or less.

I wouldn't say that makes Putin a dictator, though. But that's not very good evidence against. Mao was only head of state of China for a couple years.

[CaptMorgan68]

That's actually a fairly standard maneuver. Sometimes they continue to wield the real power from their supposedly lesser position, sometimes they really do cede power, more or less.

I wouldn't say that makes Putin a dictator, though. But that's not very good evidence against. Mao was only head of state of China for a couple years.

Putin is a dictator with high public approval ratings) But then again he did relinquish control of the presidency and as much as he prepped the PM seat in Russia the President wields far greater power and it was a risky move for a dictator to make I must say.... Well we'll see what happens when the next elections come.... I highly doubt Putin is gonna go for Presidency again... I would watch a guy like Mironov, head of 'opposition' Just Russia party.... the Kremlin gray cardinals seem to be prepping him for the big time.... He could be next in line after Medvedev....

[JBH22]

Google is your friend. You can look up word meanings.

"collateral damage n. Unintended damage, injuries, or deaths caused by an action, especially unintended civilian casualties caused by a military operation."

You can google the meaning of the other words.


not every action in another country that causes civilian deaths is labeled a genocide. The term "collateral damage" is an euphemism, something everyone throws around to limit negative public opinion.

i agree that not everything is wrong about USA it could be worst if another country would be currently in place of US thingsbutthen you can't ignore that a country that preaches human rights does the following


Used chemical warfare in Vietnam which stills harms that country http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/VNchemical.htm
Native people were deported from Diego Garcia to make place for a US base in the Indian Ocean and repeated attempts for these people to return on their island have been refused by UK and US http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depopulation_of_Diego_Garcia
Pretext to go for Iraq war was to look for WMD which until now has not been found
As to collateral damage in Afghanistan even if it is unintentional is it acceptable??

I agree that any nation would do anything to protect its interest but then no need to preach human rights and the usual blah blah seems useless


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFMQz6AN3B0
Putin explains it best so check it out

[Ryder]

lol yes yes we all know the US is trying to kill off every last Afghani and god hell the Americans must stop killing off news reporters who speak out against its govt as well that way they can keep there violations hidden

So, are you saying that the Russian government is behind these reporter killings?

[Abyr]

The Stalin joke was not serious. But,I do not see much difference between Stalin and Putin.A little maybe.

True story.


http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/2980/macleans001.jpg

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/102/macleans002.jpg

[Tank34]

The Stalin joke was not serious. But,I do not see much difference between Stalin and Putin.A little maybe.
Stalin was much more effective manager. Putin barely can sustain what was left from Stalin system. Rampart corruptioners, whom would meet its end during Stalin era in Gulag camps as enemy of the peoples now feel safe. And very short life of political enemies under Stalin regime. So nope it is very big mistake that Stalin and Putin are common.

[LineDoggie]

The US' record is not as bad as organized crimes in Russia, but she still has no right to lecture others as one of the worst abusers. Right, we sell our prisoners organs after removing them in death vans


Oh Wait......

[haze99]

To the Russian Foreign Minister, Oh really?

[Tank34]

Right, we sell our prisoners organs after removing them in death vans
Oh Wait......
What do you mean? Russia have maratory on death penalty from 1996 year.
And even during soviet times from 1962 to 1989 there was 22067 death penalties. 96 % of which were for murders.

[LineDoggie]

What do you mean? Russia have maratory on death penalty from 1996 year.
And even during soviet times from 1962 to 1989 there was 22067 death penalties. 96 % of which were for murders.Not Russia, the Glorious Peoples Republic of China does that.

[Motukka]

The point of the article is kind of moot. If there are legitimate concerns about human rights, these claims stand on their own, regardless of the actions of the accuser.
Two wrongs don't make a right.

[zema_06]

in this matter i think russia is right, the us has absolutely no right to tell others about human rights, lately the even accused europe of violating human rights...

[Lector]

Do not judge, and you will not be judged
Luke 6:37

[Wahnsinn]

USA is the beacon of democracy in this world



What planet do you live on? Half the world doesn't want America's democracy yet the US government insists upon pushing US style democracy onto certain countries (such as Afghanistan) where this democracy has never existed and the people would rather continue in their traditional way of tribal stuff or whatever they want.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

The point of the article is kind of moot. If there are legitimate concerns about human rights, these claims stand on their own, regardless of the actions of the accuser.
Two wrongs don't make a right.

You noticed that too huh? In logical terms, what we have here are a couple of logical fallacies - "poisoning the well" (a logical fallacy in which unfavorable information (whether true or false) is presented about a person in order to discredit what they say) combined with a good ol' "red herring" (topic A is under discussion, topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A [when it's not actually relevant at all], then topic A is abandoned). It's no substitute for a valid argument.

I don't feel too bad though. Putin's kids did exactly the same thing to him when he told them to stop sh*tting in their pants.

[annihilation]

America should mind its own business I guess. As long as we keep our freedoms and right secure, that is all that matters in the end.

[JBH22]

What planet do you live on? Half the world doesn't want America's democracy yet the US government insists upon pushing US style democracy onto certain countries (such as Afghanistan) where this democracy has never existed and the people would rather continue in their traditional way of tribal stuff or whatever they want.

I BELIEVE you are literate you should have read the whole post then comment.

[Hollis]

??
[/LIST]

I agree that any nation would do anything to protect its interest but then no need to preach human rights and the usual blah blah seems useless



As 2 sheds pointed out, why poison the well, maybe this is something we can all do better.

Your 4 points on violations only seems to diminish your post and maybe a attempt to throw this post off topic and poison the well.

point 1) I know why AO was used, what was known at the time and what was found out later. That one is arguable as a human rights abuse, because the intent was not there.

point 2) That one is arguable.

point 3) LOL, that has been covered multiple times on this forum. Only shows your bias as does point 4 does. Let's forget about all the other reasons. I would suggest using google again and read the UN resolution, there was more than one reason. BTW do you seriously believed the Kurds who where slaughter in mass, were faking it? (NO ANSWER is needed, this has been covered on this forum before)

Point 4) again, your on a military forum and write this point? If the US/NATO was not concerned they would not spend billions to develop and use weapons that are more surgical in nature and constantly rework the ROE that often places their own soldiers at greater risk to minimize harming innocent people.

Maybe it would be wise it you stayed on topic.

[BloodyTalon]

China has just released the annual human rights record of USA.


http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2010-03/12/content_9582821.htm
rofl rofl rofl rofl holy ****, it's watching a meth addict criticize someone for drinking too much coffee.

[SoSo]

Without any connection to the topic, I would like to point out that racism is not necessary anti-black or anti-asian or anti-latino or whatever.
It can be anti-white also, so telling that there are no racism issues just because black guy sits in the president's chair is not very good argument. :)


P.S. For mentally challenged, I'm not stating US and A are second SA.

But according to Monica Conyers, black people can't be racist!

http://btx3.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/monica-conyers-right-hook.jpg


Come on, guys, you know you're happy to see her face again!