What protesters really know.

[mobster]

Simple Q&A, enjoy the answers. Scroll down a little and pick a media player.
http://brain-terminal.com/video/nyc-2003-02-15/windowsmedia-hq.php

[East]

I wish he was around everytime I have to defend the United States from the stupidity of many of my countrymen. Last night for instance, I was out with my friends and a couple of guys from the states, and what do all my Canadian friends do? Start with the anti Bush, anti America bollocks. Disgusts me sometimes. I don't agree with everything Bush and the US does but they're still the good guys as far as I'm concerned.

[mobster]

Amen brother, none of us (I'll dare say) are war mongers, we just had 9/11 happen and really don't like going through that crap again. When you watch the video, it's actual protesters with their eyes glazed over when asked an intelligent question regarding the war. They protest just to protest. Absolutely no idea what to do, how to do it, or when to try. Just bitch about the "bombing of innocent bystanders" Thanks for taking the time to watch it.

[SpazzMunky]

The interviewer asks how long they would have weapons inspectors stay there. I suppose a valid counterquestion would be ' how long should we keep troops there?'

[Helios X]

I can say that over 95% of anti-war protestors are stupid liberal hippies that have no jobs and little to no education at all. *Nukes SF*

[mobster]

The thing is, the dude in question had no possible conception of time on how long they (inspectors) were already there, and then got THROWN OUT
He was just concerned that Saddam and his buddies in the Baath party had enough time to elude the "American infidels" who were there to "take over" HIS country. But dare show videos or pics of his lunatic sons mass murdering thousands of people...
Give me a break.
Bin Laden got us, and he was just a limited source of freak muslim radicals.
Imagine what SoDamn Insane would have eventually conjured up???
Again, the video speaks for itself.

[gilgoul]

Man, that was a good link, so I started to visit a little, this guys is a real Neo con Michael moore, and that is refreshing to hear an other voice :D

[Secret Squirrel]

The thing is, the dude in question had no possible conception of time on how long they (inspectors) were already there, and then got THROWN OUT


The inspectors werent thrown out in 1998. They left, after being advised by the U.S what was going to happen, a few hours before operation Desert Fox. The inspectors did not have the "mythological" trouble in Iraq from 1991 - 1997 (see UNSCOM Report October 1997 Annex 1 para.33 also check out UN Amorim Report - 27/03/1999 para.25 for a status report regarding Iraq's disarment around 1999). In fact, only 5 out of 427 inspectors cause minor delays, not serious problems. In Jan., 2003, Blix summarized the situation, in his own words, as Iraq has on the whole cooperated rather well so far. Access has been provided to all sites we have wanted to inspect. Arrangements and services for our plane and our helicopters have been good. The environment has been workable."

[mobster]

Um, Okay Secret Squirel....sure...whatever you say...yup...totally unfounded...Even Herman Munster agreed for awhile...

Kerry Said Saddam Hussein’s WMD “Are A Threat.” “I think Saddam Hussein’s weapons of mass destruction are a threat, and that’s why I voted to hold him accountable and to make certain that we disarm him. I think we need to …” (NPR’s “All Things Considered,” 3/19/03)
February 2003

Kerry Said Leaving Saddam Hussein “Unfettered With Nuclear Weapons Or Weapons Of Mass Destruction Is Unacceptable.” (Jill Lawrence, “War Issue Challenges Democratic Candidates,” USA Today, 2/12/03)

Kerry Described Secretary Of State Colin Powell’s Evidence Of WMD In Iraq As “Real And Compelling.” “[Kerry] said the Bush administration has taken too long to make its case for military action, ‘but nonetheless I am glad we’ve reached this moment in our diplomacy.’ Kerry added: ‘Convincing evidence of Saddam Hussein’s possession of weapons of mass destruction should trigger, I believe, a final ultimatum from the United Nations for a full, complete, immediate disarmament of those weapons by Iraq. Over the next hours, I will work with my colleagues in the Senate to fully examine the evidence offered by the secretary for a complete and close reading. But, on its face, the evidence against Saddam Hussein appears real and compelling.’” (Wayne Washington, “Kennedy, Others Question Timing Of Attack But Presidential Hopefuls Back War With Iraq,” The Boston Globe, 2/6/03)
January 2003

Kerry Said, “If You Don’t Believe Saddam Hussein Is A Threat With Nuclear Weapons, Then You Shouldn’t Vote For Me.” (Ronald Brownstein, “On Iraq, Kerry Appears Either Torn Or Shrewd,” Los Angeles Times, 1/31/03)

Kerry Described Threat Of Saddam Hussein With WMD As Real, But Not New. “[W]e need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime. We all know the litany of his offenses. He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently ****e to miscalculation. He miscalculated an eight-year war with Iran. He miscalculated the invasion of Kuwait. He miscalculated America’s response to that act of naked aggression. He miscalculated the result of setting oil rigs on fire. He miscalculated the impact of sending scuds into Israel and trying to assassinate an American President. He miscalculated his own military strength. He miscalculated the Arab world’s response to his misconduct. And now he is miscalculating America’s response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction. That is why the world, through the United Nations Security Council, has spoken with one voice, demanding that Iraq disclose its weapons programs and disarm.” (Sen. John Kerry, Remarks At Georgetown University, Washington, DC, 1/23/03)
October 2002

“Mr. Kerry … Said Iraq’s Weapons Of Mass Destruction Posed ‘A Real And Grave Threat’ To The United States.” (Dave Boyer, “Key Senators Of Both Parties Back Bush On Iraq War,” The Washington Times, 10/10/02)

Kerry Questioned Saddam’s Actions With Respect To His WMD Capability. “Why is Saddam Hussein pursuing weapons that most nations have agreed to limit or give up? Why is Saddam Hussein guilty of breaking his own cease-fire agreement with the international community? Why is Saddam Hussein attempting to develop nuclear weapons when most nations don’t even try, and responsible nations that have them attempt to limit their potential for disaster? Why did Saddam Hussein threaten and provoke? Why does he develop missiles that exceed allowable limits? Why did Saddam Hussein lie and deceive the inspection teams previously? Why did Saddam Hussein not account for all of the weapons of mass destruction which UNSCOM identified? Why is he seeking to develop unmanned airborne vehicles for delivery of biological agents? Does he do all of these things because he wants to live by international standards of behavior? Because he respects international law? Because he is a nice guy underneath it all and the world should trust him?” (Sen. John Kerry, Congressional Record, 10/9/02, p. S10171)

Kerry Called It “Naive To The Point Of Grave Danger” To Leave Saddam “To His Own Devices.” “It would be naive to the point of grave danger not to believe that, left to his own devices, Saddam Hussein will provoke, misjudge, or stumble into a future, more dangerous confrontation with the civilized world.” (Sen. John Kerry, Congressional Record, 10/9/02, p. S10171)

Kerry Said “Threat Of Saddam Hussein With Weapons Of Mass Destruction Is Real.” “The threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real, but as I said, it is not new. It has been with us since the end of that war, and particularly in the last 4 years we know after Operation Desert Fox failed to force him to reaccept them, that he has continued to build those weapons. He has had a free hand for 4 years to reconstitute these weapons, allowing the world, during the interval, to lose the focus we had on weapons of mass destruction and the issue of proliferation.” (Sen. John Kerry, Congressional Record, 10/9/02, p. S10171)

Kerry: “I Am Prepared To Hold Saddam Hussein Accountable And Destroy His Weapons Of Mass Destruction.” (Ronald Brownstein, “Democratic Presidential Hopefuls Differ On War In Iraq,” Los Angeles Times, 10/6/02)
September 2000

Kerry Said “There Is Nothing More Destabilizing Or Threatening [To The World] Than Weapons Of Mass Destruction.” “I think all of us are deeply concerned about the degree to which certain countries seem to be contributing to the potential of instability in the world. Obviously, there is nothing more destabilizing or threatening than weapons of mass destruction. We have spent an enormous amount of time and energy focused on Iraq, on Iran, on Russia, on loose nukes, on nuclear materials, and of course on China and on the issue of the transfer of technology to Pakistan.” (Sen. John Kerry, Congressional Record, 9/11/00, p. S8321)
December 1998

Kerry Defended Clinton’s 1998 Attacks Because Saddam “Is Pursuing … Weapons Of Mass Destruction.” “Americans need to really understand the gravity and legitimacy of what is happening with Saddam Hussein. He has been given every opportunity in the world to comply. The president does not control the schedule of UNSCOM. The president did not withdraw the UNSCOM inspectors. And the president did not, obviously, cut a deal with Saddam Hussein to do this at this moment. Saddam Hussein has not complied. Saddam Hussein is pursuing a program to build weapons of mass destruction.”(Sen. John Kerry, Press Conference, 12/16/98)
September 1998

Kerry Said, “‘We’re Going To Have To Make Some Fundamental Decisions About Whether To Follow A Policy Of Containment Or Deprive Iraq Of Its Weapons Of Mass Destruction.” (Eric Schmitt, “U.N. Arms Inspector Who Quit Is Told He Can’t Make Policy,” The New York Times, 9/4/98)
February 1998

Kerry Said Saddam Had Already Used WMD And Had Intent “To Do So” Again. “[T]here are set of principles here that are very large, larger in some measure than I think has been adequately conveyed, both internationally and certainly to the American people. Saddam Hussein has already used these weapons and has made it clear that he has the intent to continue to try, by virtue of his duplicity and secrecy, to continue to do so. That is a threat to the stability of the Middle East. It is a threat with respect to the potential of terrorist activities on a global basis. It is a threat even to regions near but not exactly in the Middle East.” (Sen. John Kerry, Press Conference, 2/23/98)

Kerry Said That If Saddam’s Weapon Capability Was Not Eliminated “We Will Be Called On To Send Our Ships And Our Troops At One Point In The Future Back To The Middle East.” “Saddam Hussein has violated … that standard [against using weapons of mass destruction] on several occasions previously and by most people's expectation, no matter what agreement we come up with, may well do so again. The greater likelihood is that we will be called on to send our ships and our troops at one point in the future back to the Middle East to stand up to the next crisis.” (Sen. John Kerry, Press Conference, 2/23/98)


You know, Squirrels are classified as rodents.

Just sayin' is all.

[Secret Squirrel]

I didnt comment on anything Kerry said, i was just pointing out your ignorance. ;)

[mobster]

Well, okay, I'll spell it out. I quit college on a dime, a teacher, an FBI agent and my counselor decided I wasn't "educated enough" for the field I wanted to approach. Last year I donated more to charity than my old teacher made in a whole year. I have a stupidly big house, a sound system in my own studio that rivals most clubs, a car that someone my age should not be driving and I've risen to a very high title in my company. To call me ignorant is rather..well uneducated. If you'd like to go head to head with me, I'd be happy to work with you on a PM basis, otherwise I will school you like a little bitch openly and make you look like the biggest retard that mother earth ever created. Darwin himself will not be able to classify you once I'm done with you.
I only am here to help.
best, Mobbie.

[Secret Squirrel]

Well, okay, I'll spell it out. I quit college on a dime, a teacher, an FBI agent and my counselor decided I wasn't "educated enough" for the field I wanted to approach. Last year I donated more to charity than my old teacher made in a whole year. I have a stupidly big house, a sound system in my own studio that rivals most clubs, a car that someone my age should not be driving and I've risen to a very high title in my company. To call me ignorant is rather..well uneducated. If you'd like to go head to head with me, I'd be happy to work with you on a PM basis, otherwise I will school you like a little bitch openly and make you look like the biggest retard that mother earth ever created. Darwin himself will not be able to classify you once I'm done with you.
I only am here to help.
best, Mobbie.

Thanks for your resume, but I'm not looking for anyone right now. ;) Yes I called you ignorant because you said the weapons inspectors were thrown out of Iraq. I posted primary documents that supported my claim that a certain part of your post was ignorant. If you feel you have to validate yourself by trying to impress a faceless stranger on an internet forum then you should channel some of your wealth into hiring a well qualified psychiatrist. ;)

[Sayeret]

My favorite part of the video is when that crazy elderly woman yells that the interviewer always lies.

[n4292936]

Mobster, thanks for once again satisfying your compulsive need to point out how much money you earn under the assumption that you'll impress. As it is you've only succeded in convincing most of us of your unfortunate endowment below the belt line.

[mocking_loudly_died]

How many times on the big bad Internet has some one declared humongous wealth and an overtly prevalent domineering intellectual capacity.

People of said fiscal nature surely are wasting away their productive life tapping down declarations of superiority– when is the time spent actually earning this amazingly uncontrollable wealth?

Fantastic.

[chauncy republicans]

How many times on the big bad Internet has some one declared humongous wealth and an overtly prevalent domineering intellectual capacity.

People of said fiscal nature surely are wasting away their productive life tapping down declarations of superiority– when is the time spent actually earning this amazingly uncontrollable wealth?

Fantastic.
Genius...

[mlrs84]

I can say that over 95% of anti-war protestors are stupid liberal hippies that have no jobs and little to no education at all. *Nukes SF*YES! Thats why almost every American Nobel prize winners have united to support Kerry. But I suppose the Nobel Prize doesn't mean that much to you since it's not American

[Vance]

The interviewer asks how long they would have weapons inspectors stay there. I suppose a valid counterquestion would be ' how long should we keep troops there?'
This video was made February 2003. We haven't invaded yet.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Well, okay, I'll spell it out. I quit college on a dime, a teacher, an FBI agent and my counselor decided I wasn't "educated enough" for the field I wanted to approach. Last year I donated more to charity than my old teacher made in a whole year. I have a stupidly big house, a sound system in my own studio that rivals most clubs, a car that someone my age should not be driving and I've risen to a very high title in my company. To call me ignorant is rather..well uneducated. If you'd like to go head to head with me, I'd be happy to work with you on a PM basis, otherwise I will school you like a little bitch openly and make you look like the biggest retard that mother earth ever created. Darwin himself will not be able to classify you once I'm done with you.
I only am here to help.
best, Mobbie.
Thanks for your resume, but I'm not looking for anyone right now. ;) Yes I called you ignorant because you said the weapons inspectors were thrown out of Iraq. I posted primary documents that supported my claim that a certain part of your post was ignorant. If you feel you have to validate yourself by trying to impress a faceless stranger on an internet forum then you should channel some of your wealth into hiring a well qualified psychiatrist. ;)

Heh heh, nice smackdown.

But now on to the "meat", and proof that you are a doofus:

(See in the red bold type 13 Nov 1997)


Chronology of UN inspections
Derived from an October 1998 UNSCOM document
3 Apr 1991
U.N. Security Council Resolution 687 (1991), Section C, declares that Iraq shall accept unconditionally, under international supervision, the "destruction, removal or rendering harmless" of its weapons of mass destruction and ballistic missiles with a range over 150 kilometers. Requires Iraq to make a declaration, within 15 days, of the location, amounts, and types of all such items.

10 Apr 1991
Iraq accepts Resolution 687.

18 Apr 1991
Iraq provides initial declaration required under Resolution 687. This declaration includes some chemical weapons and materials and 53 Al-Hussein and Scud type surface-to-surface ballistic missiles. Iraq declares it has no biological weapons program.

16 May 1991
Iraq submits revised declarations covering additional chemical weapons and a refinement of its missile declaration.

May 1991
Through an exchange of letters between U.N. Secretary General Boutros Boutros-Ghali and Iraqi Foreign Minister Tariq Aziz, Iraq accepts the privileges and immunities of the Special Commission (UNSCOM) and its personnel. These guarantees include the right of "unrestricted freedom of entry and exit without delay or hindrance of its personnel, property, supplies, equipment ..."

9 Jun 1991
UNSCOM conducts its first chemical weapons inspection.

Jun 1991
UNSCOM/IAEA inspectors try to intercept Iraqi vehicles loaded with nuclear related equipment (Calutrons). Iraqi personnel fire warning shots to prevent the inspectors from approaching the vehicles. The equipment is later seized and destroyed under international supervision.

17 Jun 1991
The Security Council adopts Resolution 699, which confirms that the Special Commission and the IAEA have the authority to conduct activities under section C of Resolution 687.

30 Jun 1991
UNSCOM conducts its first missile inspection.

2 Aug 1991
UNSCOM conducts its first biological weapons inspection.

15 Aug 1991
The Security Council adopts Resolution 707, demanding that Iraq immediately provide full, final and complete disclosures (FFCDs), as required by Resolution 687.

6 Sep 1991
The first heliborne UNSCOM inspection team is blocked by Iraq.

Sep 1991
IAEA inspectors find large amounts of documentation relating to Iraq's efforts to acquire nuclear weapons. The Iraqi officials confiscate some documents from the inspectors. The inspectors refuse to yield a second set of documents. In response, Iraq refuses to allow the team to leave the site with these documents. A four-day standoff ensues, during which the team remains in the parking lot of the site. Iraq permits the team to leave with the documents after a statement from the Security Council threatens enforcement actions.

11 Oct 1991
The Security Council adopts Resolution 715, which approves joint UNSCOM and IAEA plans for ongoing monitoring and verification. UNSCOM’s plan establishes that Iraq shall "accept unconditionally the inspectors and all other personnel designated by the Special Commission".

Oct 1991
Iraq states that it considers the Ongoing Monitoring and Verification Plans adopted by Resolution 715 to be unlawful and states that it is not ready to comply with Resolution 715.

Feb 1992
Iraq refuses to comply with an UNSCOM/IAEA decision to destroy certain facilities used in proscribed programs and related items. The Security Council condemns Iraq’s failure to comply with its obligations. Iraq finally agrees to destruction of those facilities and items.

19 Mar 1992
Iraq declares the existence of 89 previously undeclared ballistic missiles, chemical weapons and associated material. Iraq claims that it unilaterally destroyed most of these undeclared items in the summer of 1991, in violation of Resolution 687.

Apr 1992
Iraq calls for a halt to UNSCOM's aerial surveillance flights, stating that the aircraft and its pilot might be endangered. The President of the Security Council issues a statement reaffirming UNSCOM's right to conduct such flights. Iraq says that it does not intend to carry out any military action aimed at UNSCOM's aerial flights.

May 1992
Iraq provides its first FFCDs for its prohibited biological and missile programs. Iraq says it had only a defensive biological weapons program.

Jun 1992
Iraq provides its first FFCD for its prohibited chemical weapons program.

Jul 1992
UNSCOM begins destroying large quantities of Iraq's chemical weapons and their related production facilities.

6-29 Jul 1992
Iraq refuses an inspection team access to the Iraqi Ministry of Agriculture. UNSCOM said it had reliable information that the site contained archives related to proscribed activities. Inspectors gained access only after members of the Council threatened enforcement action.

Jan 1993
Iraq refuses to allow UNSCOM to use its own aircraft to fly into Iraq. Iraq begins making incursions into the demilitarized zone between Iraq and Kuwait and increases its military activity in the no-fly zones. The demilitarized zone and no-fly zones were created by the U.N. Security Council at the end of the 1990-91 Gulf War. The Security Council announces that Iraq's action is an "unacceptable and material breach" of Resolution 687 and warns Iraq of "serious consequences" if it continues. The statement leads to air raids on sites in southern Iraq by France, the UK and the US. On 19 January, Iraq informs UNSCOM that it will be able to resume its flights.

Jun-Jul 1993
Iraq refuses to allow UNSCOM inspectors to install remote-controlled monitoring cameras at two missile engine test stands. The Security Council issues a presidential statement, warning Iraq of "serious consequences" if it violates Resolution 687. Iraq subsequently agrees to permit installation of the monitoring cameras.

26 Nov 1993
Iraq accepts Resolution 715 and the plans for ongoing monitoring and verification. June 1994 UNSCOM completes the destruction of large quantities of chemical warfare agents and precursors and their production equipment. Sep/Oct 1994 Iraq sets a deadline of 10 October 1994 for the implementation of paragraph 22 of Resolution 687, refuses to withdraw its threat to halt cooperation with UNSCOM, and starts deploying troops in the direction of Kuwait. This action leads the United States to begin deploying troops to Kuwait.

15 Oct 1994
The Security Council adopts Resolution 949, which demands that Iraq "cooperate fully" with UNSCOM and that it withdraw all military units deployed to southern Iraq to their original positions. Iraq withdraws its forces and resumes working with UNSCOM.

Mar 1995
Iraq provides the second FFCD of its prohibited biological and chemical weapons programs.

1 Jul 1995
The culmination of an UNSCOM investigation forces Iraq to admit for the first time the existence of an offensive biological weapons program. However, Iraq denies that it has weaponized this capability.

Jul 1995
Iraq threatens to end all cooperation with UNSCOM and the IAEA if there is no progress towards the lifting of sanctions and the oil embargo by 31 August 1995.

Aug 1995
Iraq provides the third FFCD for its prohibited biological weapons program.

8 Aug 1995
General Hussein Kamel, Minister of Industry and Minerals and formerly Director of Iraq's Military Industrialization Corporation with responsibility for all of Iraq's weapons programs, leaves Iraq for Jordan. Iraq says that Hussein Kamel had hidden important information on the prohibited weapons programs from UNSCOM and the IAEA. Iraq withdraws its third biological FFCD and admits a far more extensive prohibited biological weapons program than previously admitted, including weaponization. Iraq also admits greater progress in its efforts to indigenously produce long-range missiles than it had previously declared. Iraq provides UNSCOM and the IAEA with large amounts of documentation related to its prohibited weapons programs which subsequently leads to further Iraqi disclosures concerning its production of the nerve agent VX and its development of a nuclear weapon. Iraq also informs UNSCOM that the deadline to halt its cooperation is withdrawn.

Nov 1995
Iraq provides second FFCD on its prohibited missile program.

Nov 1995
The government of Jordan intercepts a large shipment of high-grade missile components destined for Iraq. Iraq denies that it had sought to purchase these components, while acknowledging that some of them were in Iraq. An UNSCOM investigation concludes that Iraqi authorities and missile facilities have been involved in acquiring sophisticated guidance and control components for proscribed missiles. UNSCOM retrieves additional missile components, apparently disposed of by the Iraqis involved in the covert acquisition, from the Tigris River.

Mar 1996
Iraqi security forces refuse UNSCOM teams access to five sites designated for inspection. The teams enter the sites after delays of up to 17 hours.

19 Mar 1996
The Security Council issues a presidential statement expressing its concern over Iraq's behavior, which it terms "a clear violation of Iraq's obligations under relevant resolutions." The council also demands that Iraq allow UNSCOM teams immediate, unconditional and unrestricted access to all sites designated for inspection.

27 Mar 1996
Security Council Resolution 1051 approves the export/import monitoring mechanism for Iraq and demands that Iraq meet unconditionally all its obligations under the mechanism and cooperate fully with the Special Commission and the director-general of the IAEA.

May-Jun 1996
UNSCOM supervises the destruction of Al-Hakam, Iraq's main facility for producing biological warfare agents.

Jun 1996
Iraq denies UNSCOM teams access to sites under investigation for their involvement in the "concealment mechanism" for proscribed items.

12 Jun 1997
The Security Council adopts Resolution 1060, which terms Iraq's actions a clear violation of the provisions of the council's earlier resolutions. It also demands that Iraq grant "immediate and unrestricted access" to all sites designated for inspection by UNSCOM.

13 Jun 1996
Despite the adoption of Resolution 1060, Iraq again denies access to another inspection team. The council issues a presidential statement, which condemns the failure of Iraq to comply with that resolution. The council also asks that the UNSCOM executive chairman visit Baghdad to secure access to all sites the commission designates for inspection.

19-22 Jun
UNSCOM chief Rolf Ekeus visits Baghdad. UNSCOM and Iraq agree a joint statement and a 1996 joint program of action. Ekeus establishes plans for inspection of so-called "sensitive sites," attempting to take into account Iraq's legitimate security concerns.

22 Jun 1996
Iraq provides the fourth FFCD of its prohibited biological weapons program.

Jun 1996
Iraq provides third FFCD of its prohibited chemical weapons program.

Jul 1996
Iraq provides the third FFCD of its prohibited missile program.

Nov 1996
Iraq blocks UNSCOM from removing remnants of missile engines for in-depth analysis outside Iraq. The Security Council issues a Presidential statement in December 1996, which demands that Iraq allow UNSCOM to remove the destroyed missile engines from its territory.

Feb 1997
Iraq allows UNSCOM to remove the missile engines.

Jun 1997
Iraqi escorts on board an UNSCOM helicopter try to physically prevent the UNSCOM pilot from flying the helicopter in the direction of its intended destination. The Security Council issues a presidential statement, deploring the incident and demanding that Iraq permit UNSCOM to carry out its air operations anywhere in Iraq without interference of any kind.

21 Jun 1997
Iraq again blocks UNSCOM teams from entering certain sites for inspection.
21 Jun 1997
The Security Council adopts Resolution 1115, which condemns Iraq's actions and demands that Iraq allow UNSCOM's team immediate, unconditional and unrestricted access to any sites for inspection and officials for interviews. The council also calls for an additional report on Iraq's cooperation with the commission and suspends periodic sanctions reviews.

Sep 1997
Iraq provides a fifth FFCD for its prohibited biological weapons program.

13 Sep 1997
An Iraqi officer attacks an UNSCOM inspector on board an UNSCOM helicopter while the inspector was attempting to take photographs of unauthorized movement of Iraqi vehicles inside a site designated for inspection.
17 Sep 1997
The President of the Security Council makes a statement deploring the incidents and urging Iraq to cooperate fully with UNSCOM.

17 Sep 1997
While seeking access to a site declared by Iraq to be "sensitive," UNSCOM inspectors witness and videotape Iraqi guards moving files, burning documents, and dumping ash-filled waste cans into a nearby river.

Sep/Oct 1997
UNSCOM inspection teams are barred from three sites on the basis that the sites are "presidential sites," which Iraq says are off-limits to UNSCOM inspectors.
23 Oct 1997
The Security Council adopts Resolution 1134, which demands that Iraq cooperate fully with the Special Commission, continues the suspension of the periodic sanctions reviews, and contemplates additional sanctions pending a further report on Iraq's cooperation with UNSCOM.
Oct 1997
UNSCOM completes the destruction of additional large quantities of chemical weapons, related equipment, and precursor chemicals. Iraq had previously denied that some of the equipment had been used for chemical weapons production. Iraq admitted in May 1997, following an UNSCOM investigation, that some of the equipment had been used in the production of VX.

27 Oct 1997
Executive Chairman Richard Butler sends a letter to Deputy Prime Minister Tariq Aziz, suggesting the agenda for the forthcoming meetings in Baghdad. The letter proposes that Iraq address important outstanding issues, including warheads, VX, and biological weapons. It also mentions the need to review the "modalities for inspection of sensitive sites" to ensure that inspections are conducted in a credible manner.

29 Oct 1997
Iraqi Deputy Prime Minister Tariq Aziz sends a letter to the president of the Security Council, informing the council of policy decisions taken by the government of Iraq. The letter includes a decision not to deal with United States citizens working for UNSCOM, a demand that all personnel of United States nationality working with UNSCOM leave Iraq by a given deadline, and a request that UNSCOM withdraw its "cover" for the US U-2 "spy plane.".
29 Oct 1997
The Security Council issues a presidential statement condemning Iraq's decision and terming it "unacceptable." The statement also demands that Iraq cooperate fully, without restrictions or conditions, with UNSCOM, and warns of the serious consequences of Iraq's failure to comply immediately and fully with its obligations under relevant resolutions.

12 Nov 1997
The Security Council adopts Resolution 1137, condemning Iraq for continually violating its obligations, including its decision to seek to impose conditions on cooperation with UNSCOM. The resolution also imposes a travel restriction on Iraqi officials who are responsible for or participated in instances of non-compliance.

13 Nov 1997
Iraq demands that US citizens working for UNSCOM leave Iraq immediately. UNSCOM chief Richard Butler orders the majority of the UNSCOM personnel to withdraw from Iraq temporarily. A skeleton staff remains in Baghdad to maintain UNSCOM's premises and equipment.[/color]

13 Nov 1997
The Security Council issues a presidential statement condemning Iraq’s decision to expel UNSCOM inspectors of a specified nationality, and demanding that Iraq rescind its decision of 29 October 1997 and resume full cooperation with UNSCOM.

20 Nov 1997
Following intensive diplomatic action, Iraq accedes to an agreement with the Russian Federation providing for UNSCOM and its full complement of staff to resume work in Iraq. The commission’s personnel return to Iraq on 21 November and resume their inspections the following day.

21 Nov 1997
UNSCOM staff meets in emergency session in its New York headquarters to discuss ways to make the commission’s work more effective. The commission submits a report of the meeting to the Security Council.

3 Dec 1997
The Security Council endorses the conclusions and recommendations of the UNSCOM report.

17 Dec 1997
UNSCOM chief Richard Butler returns to New York from Iraq and reports to the Security Council that Iraq would not permit the commission’s inspectors into what it called "Presidential" or "Sovereign" sites, unrecognized by the council or by the commission.

22 Dec 1997
The Security Council issues a statement calling upon the government of Iraq to cooperate fully with the commission and stresses that failure by Iraq to provide immediate, unconditional and unrestricted access to any site is an unacceptable and clear violation of Security Council resolutions.

13 Jan 1998
UNSCOM chief Richard Butler reports to the Council that during the first day of an inspection, Iraq announced it was withdrawing its cooperation with the inspection team, claiming that the inspection team had too many individuals of US or UK nationality.

22 Jan 1998
Following a visit to Iraq, Richard Butler reports to the Security Council that despite the council’s statement insisting on unrestricted access to all sites, Iraq would not permit access to eight so-called presidential sites.

Early Feb 1998
A group of international experts and UNSCOM inspectors conduct two technical evaluation meetings (TEM) in Baghdad, reviewing Iraq’s VX and missile warhead programs. The report submitted to the Security Council states the group’s unanimous conclusion that Iraq has still not provided sufficient information for the commission to conclude that Iraq had undertaken all the disarmament steps required of it in these areas. The commission’s experts brief the Council on the outcome of these two TEMs in March 1998.

15-18 Feb 1998
In order to understand the scope (size and perimeters) of the eight presidential sites which Iraq had declared off-limits to inspectors, Secretary General Kofi Annan sends a technical survey team to Iraq. The report of this mission is forwarded to the council.

20-23 Feb 1998
Annan visits Iraq. As a result of his meetings, the United Nations and Iraq agree to terms of a memorandum of understanding (MoU), which is signed on 23 February 1998. Annan secures Iraq’s pledge that it accepts all relevant Security Council resolutions, and will cooperate fully with UNSCOM and the IAEA. The MoU obligates Iraq to provide UNSCOM and the IAEA immediate, unconditional and unrestricted access for their inspections. The United Nations reiterates the commitment of all member states to respect the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Iraq. The MoU also includes a pledge by the commission to respect the legitimate concerns of Iraq relating to national security, sovereignty and dignity. The MoU further provides for the establishment of special procedures that would apply to initial and subsequent entries at the eight presidential sites. The MoU finally provides for the appointment of a Commissioner to head the special group established to oversee inspections at presidential sites. Annan appoints Ambassador Jayantha Dhanapala to this position.

2 Mar 1998
Security Council Resolution 1154 endorses the provisions of the MoU.

9 Mar 1998
Procedures for initial and subsequent entry to the presidential sites are drawn up and presented to the Security Council.

20-27 Mar 1998
The commission and Iraq conduct a further technical evaluation meeting (TEM) in Vienna dealing with all aspects of Iraq’s biological weapons program.

4 Apr 1998
The initial entry to the eight presidential sites is completed by mission UNSCOM 243.

8 Apr 1998
The report of the biological weapons TEM is transmitted to the council. Following this TEM, experts unanimously conclude that Iraq’s declaration on its biological weapons program is incomplete and inadequate.

15 Apr 1998
Annan submits the report of the Special Group on the visit to presidential sites.

6 May 1998
Richard Butler informs the council that UNSCOM’s access to sites is sufficiently restored that the travel ban called for in Resolution 1137 (1998) can be terminated.

3-4 Jun 1998
At the council’s request, experts from UNSCOM’s New York staff provide a technical briefing to the Security Council in informal session. Following the briefing, Executive Chairman Richard Butler gives council members an informal paper outlining disarmament issues the Commission considered unresolved according to the terms of Security Council Resolution 687 (1991).

14 Jun 1998
Richard Butler and Tariq Aziz agree to a six-week schedule for work on certain outstanding disarmament issues.

3 Aug 1998
During Richard Butler’s visit to Baghdad, Tariq Aziz demands that UNSCOM certify to the Security Council that Iraq has complied with requirements of Section C of Resolution 687 (1991). Butler responds that he is not in a position to do so, and Aziz suspends the talks.

5 Aug 1998
The Revolutionary Command Council and the Ba’ath Party Command decide to stop cooperating with UNSCOM and the IAEA until the Security Council agrees to lift the oil embargo as a first step towards ending sanctions. They further demand that the Security Council reorganize UNSCOM and move it to either Geneva or Vienna. In the interim, Iraq would permit monitoring under Resolution 715 (1991).

6 Aug 1998
Richard Butler briefs the Security Council on Iraq’s position and the results of his talks in Baghdad. The Security Council’s President terms Iraq’s actions "totally unacceptable."

12 Aug 1998
Richard Butler informs the Security Council that in addition to halting all disarmament actions, Iraq’s interference with monitoring functions has impaired the effectiveness of the monitoring system. UNSCOM therefore cannot continue to provide the Security Council with the same level of assurances of Iraq’s compliance with its obligations not to reestablish its proscribed weapons programs.

18 Aug 1998
A letter from the president of the Security Council reiterates the council’s support for UNSCOM to carry out its mandate and notes that Iraq is obliged to provide UNSCOM with cooperation necessary for it to conduct inspections.

19 Aug 1998
Richard Butler sends a letter to Tariq Aziz proposing that Iraq and UNSCOM resume the full range of activity. Aziz rejects the proposal, telling the press that Iraq does not trust the Executive Chairman or the [color=red]elements dominating UNSCOM, and that it does not believe there is any use in resuming work with them.

3 Sep 1998
Richard Butler briefs the Security Council on the status of UNSCOM’s work in Iraq, including three incidents where Iraq has placed further limits on the Commission’s monitoring activities.

9 Sep 1998
Security Council Resolution 1194 (1998) unanimously condemns Iraq’s decision to suspend cooperation with UNSCOM, terming Iraq’s actions a totally unacceptable contravention of Iraq’s obligations. It demands that Iraq rescind its decision and decides not to conduct 60-day sanctions reviews until Iraq rescinds its 5 August decision and the commission reports to the council that it is satisfied that it has been able to exercise its full range of activities, including inspections.

6 Oct 1998
UNSCOM submits its semi-annual report to the Security Council.

13 Oct 1998
Richard Butler briefs the Security Council on the commission’s semi-annual report

So as you can see, UN inspectors were in fact ejected by Saddam. Were they UN inspectors? Yes. Were they ejected by Saddam? Yes. And so that means that UN inspectors were ejected by Saddam.

Later, he also complained of too many UK inspectors. In fact, what he was trying to do was construct a UN inspection force comprised of this pals from France, Russia, and Germany. He would systematically eject those whose home country was hostile (US/UK), then under "intense diplomatic pressure, would agree to the "full compliment" of inspectors. Thus building the team of his own choosing. The fox watching the henhouse, as it were.

Very clever of that guy, Saddam.

By creating an inspection team comprised of the same people who were benefiting from the oil-for-food scheme, he could be assured that things would go his way, and the boat would not be rocked.

And then the US and UK had to go and ruin everybody's fun.

[king_nothing100]

Pussies, half the people who protested here, were just doing it to get out of school or work, they couldn't have given two ****s if we bombed the country to the stoneage or not. People who thinks it's all about oil are mainly armchair generals who don't know ****, and if brains were petrol they wouldn't have enough to power an ant's moped half way round the circumfrance of a penny. "Yes its all about oil, thats why were bathing in oil, and have crude oil fountains, on every street corner, and that petrol cost 1p to the gallen!" ****ing wake up. Why didn't they know if he had chem weapons or not when you protest, you kinda should know facts from both sides, they must be too blindsighted and not know about Halabja on any other of the other **** that went down in that country.

[Mongrel]

What I noticed is the legions of "human shield" candidates that where planning on jumping on planes to go stand on the Iraq border, and prevent a war...they seemed to never show up.

Does anyone know what happend to thes idiots?

I'm sure if any did show up the reality of the situation might have shocked some sense into them the first time they came accross a person hanging from a lamp post in Iraq.

One thing that really made me mad was seeing in our City protestors with their Mochas in hand stepping over homeless people to protest the war...like get your priorities straight folks. :slap:

Cheers!
M.

[Secret Squirrel]

Richard Butler (I assume you know who is he?) ordered his inspectors to evacuate Baghdad, in anticipation of a military attack, on Tuesday night, Dec 1998. Maybe you should argue with him? ;) Also, maybe you could link to the document (October 1998 UNSCOM document, and no not the website that contains what you quoted) that contains the above information?

edit: just incase you didnt know, Saddam's paranoia about American and British spies and possible assassination attempts (I'm sure Saddam never forgot how the Baath party came into power with help from the CIA in 1963) werent unfounded as both CIA and MI6 personnel were "placed" within UN inspection teams without the UN's knowledge. I'm not trying to spin Saddam into a good guy or anything (an impossible task), i'm just understanding the historial context.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Richard Butler (I assume you know who is he?) ordered his inspectors to evacuate Baghdad, in anticipation of a military attack, on Tuesday night, Dec 1998. Maybe you should argue with him? ;) Also, maybe you could link to the document (October 1998 UNSCOM document, and no not the website that contains what you quoted) that contains the above information?

edit: just incase you didnt know, Saddam's paranoia about American and British spies and possible assassination attempts (I'm sure Saddam never forgot how the Baath party came into power with help from the CIA in 1963) werent unfounded as both CIA and MI6 personnel were "placed" within UN inspection teams without the UN's knowledge. I'm not trying to spin Saddam into a good guy or anything (an impossible task), i'm just understanding the historial context.

As I said, - Iraq ordered UN inspectors out - end of discussion. You can cite the fact that Butler then ordered his people to drive to the airport, but that is meaningless. Butler was not going to imprison them, Saddam was.

You are at once denying that he ejected the inspectors, and justifying him in doing so? So did he, or didn't he?

The info I posted came from http://cns.miis.edu/research/iraq/uns_chro.htm ...but by now you should know that anything I post is as accurate as if it came from God's own accountant, and needs no verification ;)

You can say that you're not trying to spin Saddam into a good guy - but you are unquestionably trying to validate his actions. This long long long list of Iraq's violations of UN mandates is all the historical context that anybody should need.

Of course, the UN wasn't concerned about that, since the UN's actual goal was the indefinite prolongation of Iraq's "probation" - they had no interest in resolving anything. An end to the endless UN supervision meant an end to the oil-for-food gravy train.

It's pretty clear that Saddam and his Euro-allies had hatched a plan wherein Iraq would be supervised by a Euro-centric UN team, everybody would make money, the US and UK would be kept out. Everybody is happy, we all play along, oil money flows like water, the people of Iraq continue to get the shaft, and we all look the other way.

Guess they hadn't counted on the US & UK not playing ball.

As somebody who likes to point out dirty secrets, I'm surprised you haven't picked up on this. Personally, I'm pissed off at the Bush administration for hushing all of this up. Apparently they're more interested in rebuilding Cold-War era relationships than they are in exposing the realities that exist. Once again, money rules the day & let's get back to business as usual. Feh - some things never change.

[Trigger]

Did you hear that?

That was the sound of 2Sheds ripping Squirrel a new one...twice...with no lube.

[mrfloppy]

...but by now you should know that anything I post is as accurate as if it came from God's own accountant, and needs no verification ;)

It's pretty clear that Saddam and his Euro-allies had hatched a plan wherein Iraq would be supervised by a Euro-centric UN team, everybody would make money, the US and UK would be kept out. Everybody is happy, we all play along, oil money flows like water, the people of Iraq continue to get the shaft, and we all look the other way.

Guess they hadn't counted on the US & UK not playing ball.

As somebody who likes to point out dirty secrets, I'm surprised you haven't picked up on this. Personally, I'm pissed off at the Bush administration for hushing all of this up. Apparently they're more interested in rebuilding Cold-War era relationships than they are in exposing the realities that exist. Once again, money rules the day & let's get back to business as usual. Feh - some things never change.

Saddam and his Euro-allies? From which website did you copy this funny conspiracy theory? I am sure that God's own accountant also provides you with proof for this one.........

[Secret Squirrel]

As I said, - Iraq ordered UN inspectors out - end of discussion. You can cite the fact that Butler then ordered his people to drive to the airport, but that is meaningless. Butler was not going to imprison them, Saddam was.

Saddam kicked them out in Dec 1998? :roll: I believe the long post you quoted doesnt even go to November 1998, not to mention december. ;)


You are at once denying that he ejected the inspectors, and justifying him in doing so? So did he, or didn't he?

I'm saying that he didnt kick out the inspectors in Dec 1998. I also commented on your pity party regarding Saddam's objection to U.S and British inspectors.


The info I posted came from http://cns.miis.edu/research/iraq/uns_chro.htm ...but by now you should know that anything I post is as accurate as if it came from God's own accountant, and needs no verification ;)

I would still like to see this document that your post came from, mostly out of curiousity and also because I cant seem to locate such a document. Call me paranoid, but after Bush cited a Atomic Energy Commission document from 1998 as a reason for war (which said document does not exist according to Mark Gwozdecky, head of the group), i like to read the primary source. ;)


You can say that you're not trying to spin Saddam into a good guy - but you are unquestionably trying to validate his actions. This long long long list of Iraq's violations of UN mandates is all the historical context that anybody should need.

Actually your "shock and awe" list isnt all the historical context someone needs. Try digging a little deeper into the story, you might surprise yourself.


Of course, the UN wasn't concerned about that, since the UN's actual goal was the indefinite prolongation of Iraq's "probation" - they had no interest in resolving anything. An end to the endless UN supervision meant an end to the oil-for-food gravy train.

Actually, it's been the U.S's foreign policy that wanted to prolong Iraq's "probation" as long as Saddam was in power. I guess Halliburton replaced that scandal quite nicely.


It's pretty clear that Saddam and his Euro-allies had hatched a plan wherein Iraq would be supervised by a Euro-centric UN team, everybody would make money, the US and UK would be kept out. Everybody is happy, we all play along, oil money flows like water, the people of Iraq continue to get the shaft, and we all look the other way.

Guess they hadn't counted on the US & UK not playing ball.

By your logic the U.S and U.K got jealous and invaded so they could play ball too. The weapons inspectors aka spies put in Iraq by the U.S and British did more harm than good and proved to be a focal point for tensions.


As somebody who likes to point out dirty secrets, I'm surprised you haven't picked up on this. Personally, I'm pissed off at the Bush administration for hushing all of this up. Apparently they're more interested in rebuilding Cold-War era relationships than they are in exposing the realities that exist. Once again, money rules the day & let's get back to business as usual. Feh - some things never change.


Did you hear that?

That was the sound of 2Sheds ripping Squirrel a new one...twice...with no lube.

Shouldnt you be hiding in a closet somewhere? Ah the maturity you express in your posts never cease to amaze me Trigger. ;)

[achilles]

Amen brother, none of us (I'll dare say) are war mongers, we just had 9/11 happen and really don't like going through that crap again. When you watch the video, it's actual protesters with their eyes glazed over when asked an intelligent question regarding the war. They protest just to protest. Absolutely no idea what to do, how to do it, or when to try. Just bitch about the "bombing of innocent bystanders" Thanks for taking the time to watch it.

I watched the video and i have to say that it was very interesting and fun. It definitely showed the ignorance and incapability of some people to argue about what they are protesting. However, everyday people like the ones in the video are not all educated and definitely are not policy makers so i understand the fact that they cannot propose alternative solutions as opposed to a war. All they want to say and express is their disagreement with the specific war and Bush's choices.
Besides, the video showed only say...30 protestor? how many were they? A few thousand? i dont know really but i am sure the sample is not large enough to condemn protestors and what they know....
Anyway it is a fact that we hear a great deal of bull**** from some protestors...

[Macs.]

What I noticed is the legions of "human shield" candidates that where planning on jumping on planes to go stand on the Iraq border, and prevent a war...they seemed to never show up.

Does anyone know what happend to thes idiots?


They are all dead. ;)

[Trigger]

Did you hear that?

That was the sound of 2Sheds ripping Squirrel a new one...twice...with no lube.

Shouldnt you be hiding in a closet somewhere? Ah the maturity you express in your posts never cease to amaze me Trigger. ;)
Then I shall continue to amaze you. *flicks booger*

[Sayeret]

What I noticed is the legions of "human shield" candidates that where planning on jumping on planes to go stand on the Iraq border, and prevent a war...they seemed to never show up.

The "human shields" left Iraq pretty soon after they arrived, they were worried they would be killed and left.

[Beowulf]

Richard Butler (I assume you know who is he?) ordered his inspectors to evacuate Baghdad, in anticipation of a military attack, on Tuesday night, Dec 1998. Maybe you should argue with him? ;)

Richard butler also wrote "The Greatest Threat: Iraq, Weapons of Mass Destruction, and the Crisis of Global Security" http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1586480391/qid=1090989570/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/002-9005712-4593617?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

I have a copy on my bookshelf at home, read it before the war, it is rather interesting read.

[Mongrel]

The "human shields" left Iraq pretty soon after they arrived, they were worried they would be killed and left.

I guess Reality can be a cruel Bitch sometimes eh?
I Wish CNN covered them leaving.

Cheers!
M.

[Secret Squirrel]

The "human shields" left Iraq pretty soon after they arrived, they were worried they would be killed and left.

I guess Reality can be a cruel Bitch sometimes eh?
I Wish CNN covered them leaving.

Cheers!
M.

Some info on Human Shields leaving...
http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/03/sprj.irq.human.shields/index.html

Former Iraqi minister of (dis)Information trying to claim the U.S bombed two buses that contained Human Shields :roll: ...
http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/04/01/otsc.irq.brahimi/index.html

[Mongrel]

Thanx for the links I can't belive I missed them.
I esp' love this part from the first link:


Abdul al-Hashimi, head of Saddam Hussein's Peace and Solidarity Organization, ordered the volunteers to disperse to nine sites in Baghdad or leave, Britain's broadsheet newspaper, Daily Telegraph reported. Most of the activists thought they would be "shielding" schools or hospitals, but instead found themselves assigned to power stations, oil refineries and water purification plants.


What a bunch of knobs!
rofl

[mobster]

Like I said, just watch the video. It really speaks for itself.

[dacanadianbomb]

Lol,
" CNN exlusive :
Ten human shield protesters were found shielding a target they werent expecting to protect; Saddam Husseins wheels "

" I dont know what he was thinking, I wanted to protect a school, not a 1993 mazda 626 ," said one of the human shields. " Although Joe, now he got the real hard stuff, he has to human shield Baghdad Bobs port-a-pottie....... and believe you me Mrs theres a lot of sh*t flying around there" the shield further commented.

[Beowulf]

Lol,
" CNN exlusive :
Ten human shield protesters were found shielding a target they werent expecting to protect; Saddam Husseins wheels "

" I dont know what he was thinking, I wanted to protect a school, not a 1993 mazda 626 ," said one of the human shields. " Although Joe, now he got the real hard stuff, he has to human shield Baghdad Bobs port-a-pottie....... and believe you me Mrs theres a lot of sh*t flying around there" the shield further commented.

that's pretty funny

[ArmyRanger]

Wow people really dont have any fu**ing clue

[SpazzMunky]

The interviewer asks how long they would have weapons inspectors stay there. I suppose a valid counterquestion would be ' how long should we keep troops there?'
This video was made February 2003. We haven't invaded yet.
Even then, people knew that if we invaded, we would be occupying Iraq for a while. Hell, look at how long we were in Germany and Japan, we're still there. (even if we arent needed.) Point is, weapons inspectors would have made sure Iraq wasn't a threat, with considerably less manpower, bloodshed, and commitment needed.