Query on the IDF AH-1 Cobras

[junglejim]

Would anybody happen to know how much life those choppers have? There's been talks that it would be my country who would be the next recipient of those things. from what I've been reading that equipment was worked hard by the IDF. I'm just trying to see how long would it take before i see these choppers in our museums due to structural fatigue.

Thanks! If sensitive info, then nevermind. PM me if you have questions.

[Dinges]

Most aircraft and helicopters , both military and civilian are constantly upgraded using extensive service regimes. So basically the one that came out of the factory after some years most of it have been replaced or are scheduled for replacement.

Concerning the IDF AH-1's. Most structural members I expect are monitored for fatigue and replaced accordingly by IAI as they have license to reproduce structural members according to specs. We all know to what high level of preparedness the IDF work. So I expect these birds to be fine.

http://www.iai.co.il/16871-17876-en/Business_Areas_Military_Helicopter_Maintenance.aspx?btl=1

[junglejim]

Thanks, Prion. The news just came out in the press when our SecDef mentioned it, so most in another forum are iffy about it since it will be a government to government deal instead of bidding.

[Ambassador]

If you are talking about the Philippines, expect very high frequency of cannibalization of the Cobras after a few years.

[Dinges]

Gov to gov does not really make a difference from bidding. Before the deal goes through the two parties will agree on a MoU that are very specific and detailed down to the brass tacks. These deals are comprehensive and obviously contains full service history. So it is not the seller so much at fault if it all goes pear-shaped. That honour should go to the buyer.

[junglejim]

Gov to gov does not really make a difference from bidding. Before the deal goes through the two parties will agree on a MoU that are very specific and detailed down to the brass tacks. These deals are comprehensive and obviously contains full service history. So it is not the seller so much at fault if it all goes pear-shaped. That honour should go to the buyer.


Oh believe me nobody will be blaming the Israelis if this deal will end up as a lemon, I can guarantee you that.

[junglejim]

If you are talking about the Philippines, expect very high frequency of cannibalization of the Cobras after a few years.


Uhumm, and you are so sure about this because? You based it in the 80's or the media right? I'll have you know the P.A.F. actually does Depot level maintenance of their choppers from the skids up. What i am more worried about is the airframe of the AH-1's. They seem like they are well used in a lot of conflicts and might not have the life expectancy we wished we had. It was in competition with more MG-530 Firefoxes, which for me was a smarter choice, but im not a flyboy.

[RoyB]

Hey, the IAF's Cobras are pretty old, but they serve well and have gone through several modernization programs over the years.
Can you share some sources about Israel selling some of its AH-1's to the Philippines?

[junglejim]

DND rushing acquisition of Navy vessels
(The Philippine Star) Updated May 16, 2010 12:00 AM

http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=575688&publicationSubCategoryId=63 (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=575688&publicationSubCategoryId=63)

MANILA, Philippines - Outgoing Defense Secretary Norberto Gonzales is rushing the acquisition of one or two multi-role vessels through a government-to-government contract at a cost of from P5 billion to P10 billion.

“I hope it is not considered a midnight purchase. We will try to have it finalized,” Gonzales said in an ambush interview at the Philippine Navy headquarters yesterday. He was at the Navy headquarters to formally install as new Navy Flag Officer in Command in an acting capacity Rear Admiral Danilo Cortez, who replaced retired Vice Admiral Ferdinand Golez.

To fast track documentation and acquisition of the vessels, Gonzales also announced that he was “borrowing” Golez from his family to be his defense consultant.

“I asked him (Golez) to render his services to the Defense department for him to see all the aspects of the modernization program, particularly for the Navy,” Gonzales said. It was not clear how long Golez would serve as consultant.

Gonzales said the vessels would likely come from South Korea or Singapore.

Several quarters have been questioning Gonzales’ motives in setting aside public bidding in favor of government-to-government deals in the acquisition of military vehicles and equipment.

With barely 45 days left in office as Defense chief, Gonzales stressed that a government-to-government transaction is the fastest way to acquire the needed equipment for the Armed Forces’ modernization.

He said a government-to-government deal, instead of a private contract, is a guarantee against corruption.

He added that the vessels could be delivered within two years from signing of contract.

The acquisition would be funded from the budget for military modernization in 2009 and this year totaling P10 billion.

“The AFP already has a list of what should be acquired in 2009, so we’re looking at 2009 and 2010 because it’s already 2010,” he said.

Aside from the P10 billion, Gonzales said a multi-year “obligational authority” from Congress would ensure funds for the procurement and purchases by the Defense department.

“There’s already an approved list of acquisition for 2009 and for 2010. Once these lists are approved and (government-to-government contract) signed, delivery would be within two years,” Gonzales.

He added that several night attack helicopters for the Air Force are already due for delivery.

The STAR learned that these attack helicopters were reconditioned Cobra combat helicopters which the Defense department purchased for more than P3 billion from Israel.

The government-to-government procurement has drawn suspicion because the units acquired were not new contrary to President Arroyo’s instructions.

“What we’ve got are reconditioned, not brand new,” a defense insider said.

c/o radrick from Timawa.net and some sources.

[junglejim]

Just an add On: The P.A.F. has been looking at those I.A.F. choppers since 2006 and have actually evaluated them.