New to sportbikes but want one.

[Merik]

So guys, what do you suggest I should look at? Yeah I want to the racer look but I am a beginner so something really sweet and really f-ing fast is not an option. Also price is a big factor. Granted I am going to be getting a lot of change in my pocket in 3 months but I'd still like to keep it simple.

I did do some looking around on the web and came across a site called beinnger bikes. Havent looked at all the bikes and dont know a lot of what they are talking about but I did find this bike,
http://www.beginnerbikes.com/images/04rs5001action1.jpg
a 2004 Aprilia RS50. But I read some people's comments about and they said that it has no highway capability. What does that mean?

[Tranceaddict]

Granted I am going to be getting a lot of change in my pocket in 3 months

ahhh..the good part about being single again eh? :lol:

[Flagg]

Merik, couple of questions:

Where do you live and are there any restrictions placed on new riders(In many places new riders are only able to purchase small displacement, low power motorbikes)?

How much riding experience do you have?

What type of riding do you intend to do?

What is your budget?

What is your age/driving history(for insurance purposes)?

Do you have a lockable garage/storage space to leave it indoors when not in use?

I love the Aprilia RS50, I've had the opportunity to have a play on one, it's a hell of a bike........but it's only 50cc.....and you will outgrow it nearly instantly, unless you only intend to class race it.

If you're looking for a bike to gain experience on, I'd suggest buying second hand/used...that way if you have a spill...it will not bother you too much, and when you trade up for a bigger bike down the road.....it will not COST you much as your investment will be limited.

Consider an inexpensive 250cc bike........

[Uncle Sam]

I see you have been bitten by the Sport Bike bug...

Agreed with Flagg

Definitely go with something used, especially if you've never ridden before (So, if you lay it down for some reason, it won't break the bank to fix) Keep it below a 750cc, 400-600cc preferred. IMO 250cc will be outgrown very quickly, that's why at least a 400cc. Go through a motorcycle riders course in your state - AMA (http://www.ama-cycle.org/roadride/NewRider/index.asp) has a great one!. They work!

[Merik]

Yeah I am sure as hell planning on getting a used one. Just dont know what to get lol.

No experience, thats why just want to get something that is sweet, easy to learn on, and yet has just a tid bit of kick to it.

Well, if I get it while I am in AIT, then I will be doing a lil of cross country with it and local stuff. But more than likely just local driving with it.

My budget will probably be anything under $2000.


I am 19 and have been in one wreck(go figure). Kinda a wierd story bout that too. Cops didnt find me at fault but insurance did because I rear ended some one.

I have a garage yet it is not lockable. I do know that we are going to build a two car maybe three car garage/shop and it'll probably have lockable doors.

[Merik]

Been doing a lot of research on licenses, training courses, and of course bikes.

I am looking at maybe getting a 99-2000 Yamaha YZF-R6 with a 600cc engine. Read lots of reviews on it from guys who own them and I like what they have to say. Any thoughts on this bike from you guys that know them?

[FallenAngel]

Nice crotch-rocket. One peg up from the Rice-burning sushi sleds but I'll take my V8 powered muscle car (with its ****ty gas milage) anyday.

If you're set on buying one....I hear good things about Yamaha. Very good pricing and relatively reliable.

[Flagg]

Been doing a lot of research on licenses, training courses, and of course bikes.

I am looking at maybe getting a 99-2000 Yamaha YZF-R6 with a 600cc engine. Read lots of reviews on it from guys who own them and I like what they have to say. Any thoughts on this bike from you guys that know them?

The First Generation Yammie R6 is a great bike....when introduced it far surpassed anything else in the 600cc class at the time...it's one of the brands we represent.

It's quite a light bike...claimed weight is about 375 pounds if memory serves...but like many/most sport bikes.....the seat height is quite high.......so you run into a problem...if you're tall...you have a hard time fitting on the bike...if you're short...you fit great....but you're on your tip toes when stopped...

The R6 is a bit more sporty than other 600cc bikes....like the Hondas or Kawasakis of similiar year......so handling is more crisp, seating is more aggressive.....which makes it difficult if you're not always switched on....or you ride in traffic a lot.

It will cost a bit to fix, especially the fairing if dinged........but it could be a good choice.....just realise the bike is capable of about 150mph........which is quite a bit on the high side for a learner's bike ;)

I'd suggest having it checked out by a qualifed mechanic...especially brakes,tires,suspension...the things that will keep you alive.

After that........find some very experienced friends.......or find a riding school......having an experienced rider show you how to ride...by allowing you to follow him/her at a reasonable speed and discussing various things like emergency braking, obstacle avoidance, and handling/braking in wet weather is critical...

My favorite aviation expression applies to motorcycing:

There are old pilots

There are bold pilots

There are no old and bold pilots.

Enjoy....it's a blast...any more questions...feel free to PM

[Merik]

Dont recall where but I have heard that saying Flagg.

As the the high position of the seat, I read about that as well. My only draw-back on that is that I AM tall, 6'4" to be exact. Still it wont hurt to check out how I fit on one. Thanks for the advice.



Oh and FallenAngel I have the V-8 musclecar, 99' Mustang GT. ;)

[StarvingStudent47]

Don't start with an Aprilia RS50. Fantastic handling for a veteran on the track, but brutally impractical for all street use due the the tiny, two-stroke engine, crippling ergonomics, lack of total power, and did I mention two-stroke engine?

May I suggest a Suzuki SV650S? Much better for a first bike in my opinion. Linear, tractable V-twin power delivery won't kill a novice, but is way fun even for a veteran (I've been riding for...gosh, seven years now, and I still love my SV650. It was my third bike). Practical, inexpensive, versatile, affordable, and even somewhat sexy (though the 2002-and-before models were much more attractive, in my opinion--I like rounded lines, not angular lines). EDIT--after reading your price restrictions, a used SV650 or SV650S sounds to be EXACTLY what you're looking for. Buy one. You won't be sorry. Maybe tomorrow if I've got time I'll write a more lengthy review of the bike, and maybe post some pics.

If you're dead-set on Italian bikes, I'd suggest a Ducati 620 or 800 Supersport, or a 620 or 800 Monster.

I personally would not recommend a 600 Supersport (R6, CBR600RR, etc) as a first-bike. Some people (not me) say they're user-friendly, but they've got peaky powerbands that were really intended for tracks, not public roads, and all that bodywork is EXPENSIVE when you inevitably drop it in your first year. Sport-twins are the way to go in my opinion.

[StarvingStudent47]

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1091519714_sv650formfn.jpg

A few other thoughts. Forgive the preachiness.

1) Take an MSF beginner's course. The money it will save you in insurance and dings on the bike will pay for itself many times over. And you can't quantify avoided injuries.

2) I'd be dead twice-over if it weren't for a full-face helmet. Wear one every time you ride. HJC is a good brand if you're on a budget. High-end helmets like Shoei and Arai offer lighter weight, better ventilation, and nicer upholstery, but an HJC is just as safe in a crash. Never buy a used helmet. You don't know if the other person dropped it, ruining its structural integrity.

3) Leather saves skin. Denim doesn't. TRUST ME. Before you go riding in a tee-shirt and shorts, stop by your local ER and ask to see the coarse brushes they use to scrub the dirt out of road rash victims. Without anesthesia sometimes. So, at very least, get a leather jacket, gloves, and boots. If money permits, get a two-piece leather suit. The suit I'm wearing was under $500, if I remember correctly.

4) Check your ego at the door, or at least save it for the track. Not only is the street a dangerous place for you, but motorcyclists riding too fast ARE dangerous other people. Contrary to other beliefs. Reckless triple-digit-speed bikers can, and do, kill other bikers, bicyclists, and pedestrians. It took a head-on collision with a wild dog in a mountain canyon before I started to wise up. I made it. The dog didn't. What if that dog had instead been someone's kid?

[SeanAshi]

I have a Yamaha R1, my old bike was killed by some old lady in a bmw when she changed lines and didn't see me, I got road rash from hell.

[Flagg]

Hey StarvingStudent...if you're ever in NZ and want a job selling bikes......you're hired! ;)

[martinexsquaddie]

buy a fireblade not
buy one and your have lost your licence or be dead by the end of the week :(

[Merik]

Starving Student,

1)Want a sporty-looking bike like everyone else lol.
2) I am sure as hell getting a jacket ad gloves, I know that for sure. Im not be a dumbass around this stuff, not even cocky. I know you guys will say that its tempting but I have decent control over that stuff for the most part.
3)A MSF course is already on the list of "to-do" things either before or right when I get a bike.
4)The one thing about the Yamaha's that I was wondering about is the expenses I would have to put into bodywork and stuff like that. In fact I was wondering about for all bikes lol.

Thanks for the advice.

[StarvingStudent47]

1)Want a sporty-looking bike like everyone else lol.


Is this not sporty-looking enough? ;) This is a 2002 SV650S (I don't know the owner, I just googled the picture)

http://www.almet.org/ImagesMaterial/Almet/14/300673_040114091455.JPG

The term "supersport" refers specifically to 600cc inline-four bikes designed for AMA Supersport and World Supersport racing (except for the Ducati "SuperSports," which is Duc's street-oriented sportbike line). These include the CBR600RR and the YZF-R6. That's what I was saying when I said that I didn't recommend a "supersport" as a first bike. Not saying I don't think you should ride a "sportbike" (which is a more general term).

If you don't like the SV650S, some other options in your price range, which are also practical and not widowmakers like the first-generation R6, are the YZF600R and the CBR600F3 or F4. In addition to having better ergonomics than the current supersports, these bikes have more torquey, linear powerbands, and more stable, less twitchy handling. These make them more suitable as first bikes. Yet a half-decade ago they were being raced by the best, so you certainly won't get bored of them quickly. I'll write more about them when I have time, I'm at work right now. The YZF600R is particularly a good choice for a tall guy like yourself.

I'd really stay away from the R6 and the GSXR-600 as a first bike.

YZF600R:
http://www.fagesportes.hpg.ig.com.br/YZF600R.jpg

CBR600F3:
http://www.twobros.com/Exhaust/Honda/005-070407.jpg

CBR600F4:
http://104net.com.tw/0289921585/CBR600F4%5B1%5D.jpg

Like I said, I'd recommend the SV650S before any of these, but if you're dead-set on an inline-four 600, any of these would serve you better than an R6.

[Merik]

I looked at 600R's last night my friend and I have to say I am interested in those as well.


Ok, ok. I'll check out that Suzuki a little more. Whenever you get the chance though I'd love to hear more about from ya.

I think I had a friend that had a CBR600, not sure if it was a F3 or F4 though.

But yeah its like we talked about earlier, my height would definatly be an issue with any bike. And Im guessing by the way you keep talking about the R6 it wouldnt be good lol.

[StarvingStudent47]

The in-depth SV650 review:

First off, a history of the different models. The bike was introduced in 1999, originally naked version only for the US market (Canada had the -S only, and Europe had both). The very first batch had a recall for oil pump problems. There have been no problems since then, but if you're buying a 1999, ask if it was one of the bikes recalled, and if so, ask if it was in fact serviced to fix the problem. In 2001, I think, the -S version was introduced to the US market as well. The S version has lower clip-on handlebars and higher, more rear-set footpegs, slightly higher gearing, and a half-fairing. The engine, frame, and suspension are identical. In 2002, the front forks were changed from non-adjustable to adjustable for preload. In 2003, a new generation of the SV650 and SV650S was introduced. The bike switched from carbs to fuel injection, got a new frame, and got a much more angular look (which I think is crap). One magazine complained that the new model vibrated a lot more than the old one, but this may have been just one bad test bike. I haven't heard that complaint elsewhere.

ENGINE:

The SV650 is turbine-smooth. I can't remember any vibration ever. It's pretty tame below 3500rpm, though it doesn't have trouble getting off the line at low RPMs like some race-oriented sportbikes. It pulls pretty well from 3500-5000rpm, but the real fun starts at 5k. From 5k to 9k, the bike accelerates very rapidly. It isn't the sort of arm-wrenching blast that you get from a literbike, but you still accelerate very rapidly. You look at the speedo and say "wow, I had no idea I was going that fast already!" The engine reaches a peak horsepower of roughly 70 real-wheel hp at 9000rpm, though the redline isn't until 10,500.

Many inline-four 600cc owners will point out that their bikes make a bit over 100hp, whereas the SV650 makes only 70. What they won't mention (in addition to the fact that their bikes are close to 50% more expensive new) is that the SV makes MORE horsepower than any SuperSport on the market until about 7500 or 8000rpm. In my opinion, this makes the SV's engine superior in nearly every real-world situation, though of course it's much slower at the racetrack or in long straights. Good torque and linear powerband really matter on both city streets and tight mountain canyons, much more than peak horsepower.

HANDLING:

The SV is very quick-steering, though it doesn't have any nasty habits like dropping into corners. But folks coming from bigger bikes are often caught off-guard. A friend of mine who owns an FZ1 (not exactly a pig) described the SV as handling like a 250. I thought his FZ1 handled like an oil tanker when I switched over from the SV for a bit. The handling is nearly telepathic: you think left, you go left. It doesn't require nearly as much conscious input as many other bikes I have ridden.

No one I know of has ever criticized the SV650's frame, and with good cause. It kicks ass. It could handle a 100hp engine easy.

The SV has received some criticism for its suspension. True, it's softer than a SuperSport, and less adjustable. Most SS bikes are adjustable for preload, damping, and compression front and rear. The SV is adjustible for preload only, front and rear. As for the adjustment, I point out that 95% of bike owners don't know how to properly tune all three characteristics at once, and often make the bike handle worse by messing with them. As for the softness: true. There's no doubt. At 75+ mph, the SV will squat in corners, especially if the rider isn't a featherweight. On the track, this is a real liability, and track riders often swap out the SV's suspension for GSXR600 forks and shock. HOWEVER, once again the SV is better in the real world. at 0-75mph, that softer suspension soaks up pavement cracks, frost heaves, and other real-world regularities which would have a Ducati 748 pounding your tailbone like a prison roommate, and would send and R6 into headshake like a heroin junkie going cold-turkey.

Besides, if you're unsatisfied in the long run, it's easier to make an SV's supension track-friendly than it is to make an R6 rough-pavement-friendly.

Finally, many SuperSports amplify your inputs, including tiny mistaken inputs that all novices make. Let's remember that the CBR600 is ridden by the likes of Miguel Duhamel. It's not a "novice's bike." The SV doesn't ignore inputs like many retro bikes and heavy musclebikes, but it doesn't amplify them like cutting-edge sportbikes either. You don't lean over farther than you intended. A slight over-application of front brake in a corner is much less likely to cause a highside (nasty crash where the bike stands up very rapidly and throws you like a rodeo bull) than, say, an R6.

ERGONOMICS:

The SV650 isn't a huge bike. I'm 5'6", 145 lbs, and I think the bike fits me "well." Though my cousin, who's closer to 6', also likes his. The SV650S has more arm room but less legroom.

The R6 on the other hand, feels a bit small even for me. Nuff said. Of other SuperSports, the CBR600 fit me pretty well, and the YZF600R and the ZX-6R (not the new ultra-angular one--the old one that looked like an X-Files alien from head-on) felt too big to me, so they might fit you well if an SV feels too small.

The SV seat is as good as you can expect on a sporty bike. It's much much thicker than the ultra-thin "racing pads" that you see on the latest generation of SuperSports. If you don't like the SV's seat, a vast aftermarket is available, but I think it's just fine.

The naked version subjects you to a lot of windblast. I got a flyscreen for it (didn't have it yet when that pic was taken) and that helped a LOT. The -S model has better wind protection, though some prefer to mount a higher screen (this is true for all sportbikes though).

RELIABILITY AND MAINTAINENCE:

I once left this bike outside for four months straight through a Colorado winter, with nothing but a tarp protecting it from the elements. The battery was pretty weak afterward, but I hooked it up to a trickle-charger, opened the choke, tapped the starter, and it roared to life. No sputtering, no running on one cylinder, etc.

I have never had any mechanical problems whatsoever with the bike. The only time it went to a shop for unscheduled work was the time I ran over a screw and blew my front tire. And you can't fault the bike for that.

The SV is not raced professionally, but is a major fan with club racers. If they can't make the engine blow up, neither can you. No engine is 100% perfect, but I'm unaware of any sporty engine that's significantly better than the SV650's, and I know of a TON that are worse.

The SV650 has much lower maintainence costs than many sporty bikes. First off, since it's a twin, it only has 8 valves to adjust instead of 16. Second, it's easy to get to the engine, because it has less bodywork than many sporty bikes, and the gas tank rotates upward like a car hood (awesome trick that, don't know why more folks don't use it).

IMAGE:

The SV has an (unfair) reputation as a "girl's bike." I think it's a fantastic bike, but some ego-laden 17-year-olds won't give you any respect. A lot of other people like it though--there was even an SV "cult" for a few years, rabid folks like me who adored the bike. Check out these links favored by members of the SV cult. And yes, the vast majority of SV riders, like the vast majority of all motorcyclists, are guys.
http://www.svrider.com
http://www.sv650.org

That's all I can think of for now.

[Flagg]

The SV is a great bike......I've had faster lap times on it than a number of other litre class bikes...simply because it handles well......doesn't intimidate, and inspires confidence......

I wouldn't change out the suspension...no need

Swap out the springs and seals upfront(good idea to do regardless as the only mechanical problem my workshop has found with them is weeping seals) for a stiffer set........and add a fork brace.

The rear's not bad....

I disagree with the R6 assessment.......it's low-RPM power may not be as tractable as an SV(important for novices), but I disagree on it's handling "quirks".

I've had to brake/maneuver an R6 at speed, in the wet, in a sweeper.....I was half expecting to wind up in the trees.......but the bike did it's bit....the steering may be a bit quick for my taste....but I'd have a hard time faulting it after spending quite a bit of time on it and it's contemporaries.......

Just my .02 Cents


The SV has an (unfair) reputation as a "girl's bike." I think it's a fantastic bike, but some ego-laden 17-year-olds won't give you any respect.

Agreed and unjustified.....most people put on an SV will likely be faster, quicker than on an Inline-4 motored bike....specifications don't win races....performance does

Have you seen the NEW SV650S?

[StarvingStudent47]

Flagg--

Reports of R6 headshake are second-hand, and thus should be treated with a small grain of salt. I've sat on one but never ridden one. Should have made that a disclaimer.

Yeah, I've seen the new SVS. It's BRUTALLY ugly in my opinion. Yikes.

By the way, I'm not sure when I'll ever find myself in New Zealand, but if I do, and I need a job, I'll look you up :)

[Flagg]

I've seen a couple of the new SVs......sharper lines, not as graceful as the previous generation.....but the word is they're pretty damn good bikes....

But we don't have the Suzuki franchise so I haven't ridden one yet....

Can I interest you in an R1?

Special deal for you mate ;)

[Merik]

I was on my way home today from work in another city and decided to drop into the local bike dealer since its right there on the way. I looked at an SV1000 and a SV650S. Holy hell that 650S looooks absolutly gorgeous. But what I dont understand is what does the S stand for? Like what is the difference between an 650 and 650S?

Damn SS, I think you just got a you a new Suzuki owner ;)

[StarvingStudent47]

I was on my way home today from work in another city and decided to drop into the local bike dealer since its right there on the way. I looked at an SV1000 and a SV650S. Holy hell that 650S looooks absolutly gorgeous. But what I dont understand is what does the S stand for? Like what is the difference between an 650 and 650S?

Damn SS, I think you just got a you a new Suzuki owner ;)

Word. You won't be sorry, it's an awesome bike.

The S version has lower clip-on handlebars and higher, more rear-set footpegs, slightly higher gearing (due to a slightly different rear sprocket), and a half-fairing. The no-S version has higher tubular handlebars and a round chrome headlamp (no fairing). The engine, frame, and suspension are 100% identical.

Now it's time for me to take my SV out for a spin. It's been a bit too long :)

[StarvingStudent47]

Can I interest you in an R1?

Special deal for you mate ;)

The R1 is a close runner-up to the Benelli Tornado for best-looking bike on the market, in my opinion. BUT I'm just not a liter-bike guy. I don't need or want the extra power, and I'm physically too small for literbikes. Given that I never go above like 90mph, I'd rather have a small-displacement bike and use a lot of its power, than own a large-displacement bike and use a small fraction of its power. You know?

If I had unlimited money, I could see myself on a VFR or an R1100S, but not really an R1. I'm just too tame. I'm not Valentino Rossi, I'm the quiet Jewish boy next door, you know?