Deniability?

[saffron]

In isayeret.com ."Today, the Minimi Para and the Minimi SPW are in very limited use in few elite Israeli SF units, mainly for covert operations in which deniability is mandatory. "
What is "deniability"?deniability=camouflage?
:( Anyone can tall me?Thank you!

[Secret Squirrel]

Deniabilty means;
Possible to contradict or declare untrue: deniable accusations.
Being such that plausible disavowal or disclaimer is possible: “Covert action was deniable; a Pentagon program would not be” (Bob Woodward).


If i understand it correctly, "deniability" is refering to keeping things quiet on Israeli SF units operations. Basically if it come down to it, they can deny that their special forces were involved in an incident.

[saffron]

:| I think "deniability"in this is means:concealment.Right?
But in this."Other then the weight factor, the Minimi was also needed for another crucial reason - to be used in deep insertion covert operations, in which deniability is a must. For the same reason several IDF units used the Soviet made PK and RPD LMG. "
Why 'Soviet made PK and RPD LMG' = Minimi? If soldier arm RPD LMG for camouflage.Why soldier arm Minimi?Enemy could not be sure the person in front of them arm RPD LMG was enemy or friend.But if soldier arm Minimi LMG ,enemy can soon know.
:(

[Secret Squirrel]

:| I think "deniability"in this is means:concealment.Right?

Yes. Israel, if it has to, can deny that their SF forces did anything regarding a particular action. Like most countries, they try to keep their special forces out of the headlines and conceal them in a kind of fog.

[saffron]

But in this."Other then the weight factor, the Minimi was also needed for another crucial reason - to be used in deep insertion covert operations, in which deniability is a must. For the same reason several IDF units used the Soviet made PK and RPD LMG. "
Why 'Soviet made PK and RPD LMG' = Minimi? If soldier arm RPD LMG for camouflage.Why soldier arm Minimi?Enemy could not be sure the person in front of them arm RPD LMG was enemy or friend.But if soldier arm Minimi LMG ,enemy can soon know .
:(

[gilgoul]

But in this."Other then the weight factor, the Minimi was also needed for another crucial reason - to be used in deep insertion covert operations, in which deniability is a must. For the same reason several IDF units used the Soviet made PK and RPD LMG. "
Why 'Soviet made PK and RPD LMG' = Minimi? If soldier arm RPD LMG for camouflage.Why soldier arm Minimi?Enemy could not be sure the person in front of them arm RPD LMG was enemy or friend.But if soldier arm Minimi LMG ,enemy can soon know .
:(

Let`s put it simply.

If you do an action, and don`t want your people to be indentified as Israelis, you will use weapons that aren`t in regular service in your force.
For instance, we use 2 type of Light Machine Gun in Israel, the M58 MAG (mounted on jeeps, hummers and armoured vehicules), and the 5.56 mm Neguev LMG, that provides infantry (you can find it mounted althought it`s less common) machine gun fire.

So when our SF do actions and take a risk of being captured, killed or their equipement captured, we don`t want the target to have any evidence that the group was Israeli.
Deniability has nothing to do with camouflage, but is more of a "political" tool.

BTW, the PK and RPD whee used also by the golani brigade for a while, I don`t know their present status thought.

[saffron]

Secret Squirrel&gilgoul,Thank your very much!! :lol:

[Herrmannek]

:| I think "deniability"in this is means:concealment.Right?

Yes. Israel, if it has to, can deny that their SF forces did anything regarding a particular action. Like most countries, they try to keep their special forces out of the headlines and conceal them in a kind of fog.

THis is true reason why all non US specforces uses M-16 alike rifles.. They want to put blame on USA :)

[gilgoul]

:| I think "deniability"in this is means:concealment.Right?

Yes. Israel, if it has to, can deny that their SF forces did anything regarding a particular action. Like most countries, they try to keep their special forces out of the headlines and conceal them in a kind of fog.

THis is true reason why all non US specforces uses M-16 alike rifles.. They want to put blame on USA :)

LOL
Actually, since we use m16 family rifle to a large extend, I don`t think we`d use them to deny everything, maybe we could use FAMAS and blame the french p-)

[Herrmannek]

:| I think "deniability"in this is means:concealment.Right?

Yes. Israel, if it has to, can deny that their SF forces did anything regarding a particular action. Like most countries, they try to keep their special forces out of the headlines and conceal them in a kind of fog.

THis is true reason why all non US specforces uses M-16 alike rifles.. They want to put blame on USA :)

LOL
Actually, since we use m16 family rifle to a large extend, I don`t think we`d use them to deny everything, maybe we could use FAMAS and blame the french p-)

But I'm sure your SPEC guys will never bring galil to work because of that reason ;)

[Mark_Aspen]

...And we'll use Canadian or NZ Passports too. ;)

Sorry I couldn't help myself.

Yes. the deniability factor is to confuse the enemy about your origins. It goes to clothing too, tags ripped out, or using "captured" clothing and footware; someone else's candy or cigarettes. Although Marlboros are pretty universal now, but the guy wouldn't be carrying Time or Noblesse.

[gilgoul]

...And we'll use Canadian or NZ Passports too. ;)

Sorry I couldn't help myself.

Yes. the deniability factor is to confuse the enemy about your origins. It goes to clothing too, tags ripped out, or using "captured" clothing and footware; someone else's candy or cigarettes. Although Marlboros are pretty universal now, but the guy wouldn't be carrying Time or Noblesse.

It`s better for their health anyway, even Gauloise (pretty frequent in jordan and west bank) are better than Noblesse (I know, I smoked noblesse for years).