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View Full Version : U.S. special operations will fight in Philippines



hood
02-20-2003, 11:38 PM
Whoa nelly... This is going to be interesting...


WASHINGTON — Hundreds of U.S. special operations troops will soon join Philippine forces in combat operations against Abu Sayyaf rebels in the southern Philippines, defense officials said Thursday.

The American and Philippine governments agreed to an arrangement that will place U.S. troops in direct combat roles against the Abu Sayyaf for the first time since the U.S. military began advising the Philippine armed forces in counterterrorism tactics last year, the officials said.

The deal marks a major escalation of U.S. military involvement in the Philippines.

About 350 U.S. special operations forces, mostly Army Green Berets, will be involved in the offensive in the Sulu Archipelago, with much of the effort focused on the island of Jolo, the officials said, speaking on condition of anonymity. They will be supported by about 400 more U.S. troops based to the north in the port city of Zamboanga.

It was not immediately clear how many Philippine forces would be involved in the offensive.

In addition to the U.S. special operations forces and the support personnel, a team of about 1,000 Marines aboard Navy ships off the coast of the Sulu Archipelago will be available to respond on short notice with air power, logistics help and medical aid.

The Marines are part of the Okinawa-based 31st Marine Expeditionary Unit, and their lead ship is the USS Essex, based at Sasebo, Japan.

U.S. officials have said in recent days that they have new information showing a stronger link than previously believed between the Philippine rebels and other international terrorist groups.

The government of Philippine President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo said Monday that she had approved joint training with U.S. forces on Jolo, where some Abu Sayyaf rebels fled after the previous U.S.-Filippino effort last year to root them out of Basilan island, to the north of Jolo.

U.S. officials said the next offensive, to begin sometime in March at the Philippine government's choice, would go well beyond training to include direct combat roles for U.S. forces.

The purpose, one official said, is to "disrupt and defeat the Abu Sayyaf group." He said the effort had not time limit and would continue as long as both governments agree it is needed.

There are believed to be several hundred Abu Sayyaf rebels in the Philippines. Early this month the Philippine military announced it had greatly underestimated the number of Abu Sayyaf and warned it would take a long time to wipe them out.

A Department of National Defense report submitted to the Philippine Congress late last year placed their strength at 250, down from 800 in 2001. But Chief of Staff Gen. Dionisio Santiago acknowledged Feb. 5 that a recheck of military documents and figures showed a number closer to 500 -- most on the impoverished island of Jolo.

Several terrorist groups, some with suspected links to Al Qaeda such as the Islamic extremist network Jemaah Islamiyah, operate in the Philippines and there have been a series of deadly bombings, kidnappings and other attacks against both government and civilian targets. An Oct. 2 incident blamed on Abu Sayyaf killed three people, including a U.S. Green Beret in the port city of Zamboanga.

Pentagon officials say investigations following some of those attacks have turned up information indicating there may be a stronger than earlier believed link between the Abu Sayyaf and the Jemaah Islamiyah of Indonesia.

hood
02-20-2003, 11:40 PM
I guess what I don't understand, is that there's all these pictures on this site of tons of Philippine special forces and rangers all over the place. With all those able men, why do they need our help with this?

Kitsune
02-21-2003, 12:58 AM
Wasn't it like this how the war in Vietnam started?

Me, the eternal pessimist, I know. A ****ing job... but someone's got to do it ! p-)

hood
02-21-2003, 01:06 AM
well it's going to be interesting to see what happens. with an almost 100 percent special forces fighting force, it's going to be scary. jungle warfare sucks though. To quote the ever wise Vizzini: "Firstly, never fight a land war in Asia, and what's only slightly less well known is, never go up against a Sicilian when death is on the line. <maniacal laughter>"

FallenAngel
02-21-2003, 01:36 AM
yeah...this is alot how like Vietnam started...

...although, the Filinpinos aren't in the exact same position as the Vietmanese were though. A few hundred SF guys might actually do the job without the need of deploying thousands of regulars :)

robwarrior
02-21-2003, 07:45 AM
but there's only like 100 or less bandits in the area and their on the run... i think its a good idea for US troops to help the filipinos. that war has been going on for a more than a year now and i believe with the help of US troops it may come to a end.. to be honest i dont mind the US Military presence here in the Philippines... i wish they never kicked the bases out.

Kitsune
02-21-2003, 09:04 AM
Funny thing is: The Phillipinos are historically dam warriorlike. Much more so than the Vietnamese... which were underestimated at first. Even back in the late 19th century westerners made the following observation: When a warrior over there wanted to commit suicide he went down to the streets and simply started to kill people until he himself was killed. Phillipinos called this "running amok" (originally this was done with sword or something. The Americans adopted this local custom and changed it by using guns in it.)
Also the Americans got a lot of problems with the muslim Moro tribe on the Phillipins. It is said that their fanatism and habit of fighting on after being shot was the reason for the introduction of higher calibred firearms to the U.S. forces.
But I do not know wether Abu Sayyaf see themselves as followers of the Moro tradition.

robwarrior
02-21-2003, 09:29 AM
"amok" is filipino meaning looking for trouble, i doubt it if the abu's are like the moros or see themselves as followers take for exmple the rescue of the burnhams when the sct rangers opened fire at the tangos they ran like a bat out of hell. btw's is anyone here a member of the US armed forces? i have something to ask regarding recruitment.

blancitaloca
02-21-2003, 09:32 AM
I think my boyfriend is over there. He is in the army's special forces. I know he is probably psyched as hell about all this, but it scares the crap out of me. Even the mention of the word Vietnam sends chills down my spine. I know this is a dumb question, but since things have changed and now they are going into combat with the Philippine army... will he still get a mid tour leave? I know I am sounding selfish and the like, but I am terrified that I won't see him again...

robwarrior
02-21-2003, 09:42 AM
well honestly i doubt it if there will ever be major battle against the abu sayyaf.. there such a small group less than a hundread jus very elusive thats why is so hard to eliminate them. the terrain is terrible and the bandits are experts in ther home turf.. it jus needs sophisticated weapons & equiptment and a lot of personnel to win this war...

blancitaloca
02-21-2003, 09:47 AM
guerilla warfare is pretty structured. these guys know their terrain better than the back of their hands. they are skilled at ambushes and overtaking large groups of enemy soldiers. it makes me nervous that our special forces are there.

robwarrior
02-21-2003, 10:13 AM
true. i agree,but ure special forces are better trained and better equiped..

blancitaloca
02-21-2003, 10:19 AM
i agree with you too... exactly the reason they are paying us millions of dollars to train the philippine military. and hey, do you have any idea about the question I previously asked about his mid-tour leave? and thanks...

robwarrior
02-21-2003, 10:30 AM
re: mid tour leave? i guess they do.

Kitsune
02-21-2003, 10:32 AM
blancitaloca...
I am deeply sorry if I scared you by mentioning Vietnam.
There would be no use in denying that something can happen, but in fact casualties in the U.S. Special Forces are very low, so the danger is not that great. Of course this does not entirely take away the uncertainty and the fear... This is what many soldiers wives are going through and is it often not recognized by many how bad their suffering really is.

May God protect you and your loved ones!

Apogee
02-21-2003, 10:56 AM
Thats some good stuff that SF is going to go do some DA ops. Although UW is their bread and butter, its always good to see an ODA running a raid.

blancitaloca
02-21-2003, 11:46 AM
can you please explain the acronyms?

JiJoMacLE45
02-21-2003, 12:22 PM
SF-Special Forces(Green Berets)
UW-unconventional warfare(the training of foreign forces)
DA-direct action(raids, etc)
ODA-operational detachment alpha(the basic SF unit, usually 12 men)

robwarrior
02-24-2003, 02:41 AM
its about time!!!

96B
02-24-2003, 06:53 AM
Im a little ignorant about the specific situation in the Phillipines so if I am off fill me in... USSF are over there aiding the Fillipino military in fighting the Abu Sayyaaf, yes there is jungle warfare going on but I was under the impression that the main targets were the terrorists cells and camps etc? Well if this is the case, how does this relate in any way to Vietnam other than jungle warfare? Besides if it even does we've got a better president now than then and certainly a better military, I am not worried with it at all in that aspect.

grendel
02-24-2003, 08:40 AM
The Green Berets will have to do a lot of "hearts & minds" to be successful in this campaign. Good luck to them! woot

Here's some useful info on the history of the Moros:
http://www.bakbakan.com/swishkb.html

And what's going on in the Philippines:
http://www.inq7.net/

robwarrior
02-28-2003, 01:11 AM
grendel, jus wanted to ask u are u filipino also? thnks!!

grendel
02-28-2003, 05:56 AM
grendel, jus wanted to ask u are u filipino also? thnks!!

Kumusta, robwarrior

Yes, I was born in the Phils.
{now naturalised Australian}

Regards :D