Success story for immigrant

[Ordie]

Juvenal Chavez came to America illegally from his native Mexico when he was 24.
He had no money, a vague plan to be a scientist and only a bit of English to get by on. Twenty-seven years later he's legal, speaks fluent English and is living large as the owner and operator of a chain of 20 Mexican supermarkets based in San Jose, with two more scheduled to open this year.


Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/06/11/BUQB1JQT67.DTL#ixzz1PHlM4G1x

[Stormz_STA]

If you enter the U.S. illegally how do you then become a legal resident?

[0rphie]

He wanted become a scientist and became a store owner. Where is success? He could legalize by arranging a marriage to an American citizen.

[usmcprincipal]

I always enjoy reading about someone's success, but is there a larger point you're trying to make?

[plato]

He wanted become a scientist and became a store owner. Where is success? He could legalize by arranging a marriage to an American citizen.

His stores employ 3000 workers. I would call that a success. http://www.mipueblofoods.com/about/about.html

[cbreedon]

it says his stores cater to the growing hispanic population.... where are they coming from?

[Ordie]

it says his stores cater to the growing hispanic population.... where are they coming from?

He's tapping into geographically underserved markets ignored by the big boxes, mainstream stores such as Safeway and foodies stores such as whole foods.

I'm willing to bet if he opens commercial banks with the same concept, he'll do well.

[plato]

Yeah, what is your larger point? There are millions of success stories from immigrants. Why did you pick this one?

[eskachig]

If you enter the U.S. illegally how do you then become a legal resident?
This report outlines many of the ways:
http://www.ppic.org/content/pubs/cacounts/CC_608JHCC.pdf

Exceptions for illegal immigrants are made sometimes, based on family situation (including relatives), and job skills. But it seems like the easiest way to do it is to go back home and apply.


He wanted become a scientist and became a store owner. Where is success?
Clearly his plans changed - but he still became a successful business owner, generating jobs and revenue for the local economy. I think that qualifies.

Edit, weirdly enough, from the same report:

Notwithstanding their lack of education and English language skills, illegal border crossers have among the highest rates of employment, along with nonresident workers and students. These three pathways show employment levels in the 70 percent range—far higher than the overall average of 56 percent. New arrivals (40%) and nonresident visitors (47%) have the lowest employment levels.
It makes sense based on my experience - when there is no work illegals tend to go back home.

[Mr.K]

He wanted become a scientist and became a store owner. Where is success? He could legalize by arranging a marriage to an American citizen.
Beats me. Well he became a successful store owner, but clearly his American dream of becoming a scientist didn't happen.

[eskachig]

Beats me. Well he became a successful store owner, but clearly his American dream of becoming a scientist didn't happen.
As a kid I wanted to be an interplanetary biologist. Clearly, success will forever elude me.

[HollywoodMarine]

He's tapping into geographically underserved markets ignored by the big boxes, mainstream stores such as Safeway and foodies stores such as whole foods.
So what? I can buy the same corn tortillas, and jalapeños at any Vons, while not having to bump into those lead tainted piñatas hanging overhead at all Pisa markets.

[Soldat_Américain]

Dude...you don't have your grandma make your corn tortillas...twice a year pretty sweet...otherwise they're cheap at La Tolteca.

[Navel Lint]

So what? I can buy the same corn tortillas, and jalapeños at any Vons, while not having to bump into those lead tainted piñatas hanging overhead at all Pisa markets.

Thought you liked hitting piñatas?p-)

[eskachig]

So what? I can buy the same corn tortillas, and jalapeños at any Vons, while not having to bump into those lead tainted piñatas hanging overhead at all Pisa markets.
Nobody is forcing you to go to ethnic markets. But here in SF I regularly shop at Russian and Chinese stores - as a Russian immigrant myself I need my steady source of Baltika and Pelmeni.

Regardless, the fact that he has customers and is expanding, shows that the business model is working.

[HollywoodMarine]

Nobody is forcing you to go to ethnic markets.
Who freggin said anyone was forcing me? Did you not understand a word that I posted? You... can... buy... ethnic... foods... at... most... super... marketsss!

[Stormz_STA]

You seem to be very angry, HM.

You haven't had pussy lately? :|

[HollywoodMarine]

It was either that, or lock my caps. You silly foreigners. :roll:

[TheBroncos]

Juvenal Chavez came to America illegally from his native Mexico when he was 24.
He had no money, a vague plan to be a scientist and only a bit of English to get by on. Twenty-seven years later he's legal, speaks fluent English and is living large as the owner and operator of a chain of 20 Mexican supermarkets based in San Jose, with two more scheduled to open this year.


Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/06/11/BUQB1JQT67.DTL#ixzz1PHlM4G1x

Yet, folks like yourself and this administration have managed to downplay and outcast the legal immigrants like myself who came here through legal channel and become employers to many many other Americans. Stop treating and elevate the illegals to the same standard as us! Sorry Ordie, one successful guy who hitched a citizen doesn't portray the real American dreams for the LEGAL immigrants!

It's only news if he/she was illegal then become legal through loopholes?

[LineDoggie]

Yeah, what is your larger point? There are millions of success stories from immigrants. Why did you pick this one?Because Ordie has ties to the Illegal Immigrant community.

[Soldat_Américain]

You could have just said he was hispanic.

[Elbs]

Who freggin said anyone was forcing me? Did you not understand a word that I posted? You... can... buy... ethnic... foods... at... most... super... marketsss!

I had the misfortune of having to stop at one of these ethnic Mexican stores to buy a few energy drinks since it was the closest place open. The smell inside was unbelievable. It was like someone had straight up taken a massive sh*t right at the front entrance... my guess is it was rotting meat + the smell of cooking grease.

It's a ****ty neighborhood, but jeez, most of these joints smell terrible.

[Felipe S. Xicotencatl]

He wanted become a scientist and became a store owner. Where is success? He could legalize by arranging a marriage to an American citizen.

Well said!!! The point is this guys a total loser and a failure. He wanted to become a scientist and ended up a lowly supermarket chain owner with only twenty stores and 3000 employees. Pfffffffft! Anybody could do that. It's not like he opened Walmart or something!

[eskachig]

Who freggin said anyone was forcing me? Did you not understand a word that I posted? You... can... buy... ethnic... foods... at... most... super... marketsss!
Oh I see what you mean. The selection usually sucks in all honesty - but anyway, point is, if people didn't prefer his stores for that kind of shopping then they would also be getting their stuff at Vons (well, we don't have those around here, but we have Safeway). As it is, if he's growing in this economy that means he's providing a service that's in demand.


I had the misfortune of having to stop at one of these ethnic Mexican stores to buy a few energy drinks since it was the closest place open. The smell inside was unbelievable. It was like someone had straight up taken a massive sh*t right at the front entrance... my guess is it was rotting meat + the smell of cooking grease.

It's a ****ty neighborhood, but jeez, most of these joints smell terrible.
Hahaha that, my friend, might've been a front :)

We had one of those when I was growing up in Santa Cruz - empty shelves, expired products... totally not on the level. Most of the successful Mexican markets and carnecerias I've been to are quite different.

[LineDoggie]

You could have just said he was hispanic.If one is dumb enough to believe illegal aliens are all hispanic. Substantial numbers come from asia and ireland. years ago we had a ship ground off Queens Rockaway beach called the ss golden venture. it was loaded with Chinese illegal aliens who started jumping overboard and trying to make it to shore.

An illegal alien can be any race, any nationality, except US)

[Felipe S. Xicotencatl]

An illegal alien can be any race, any nationality, except US)

They can be U.S., if they're in another country. I've met a few in Mexico. One in a town called Sayulita on the coast of Nayarit, who came, fell in love with the place and decided to stay. She started off selling handmade jewelry in the town plaza back in the early nineties (and overstaying her visa) and now owns her own store and home. I bought a piece from her a couple of years ago. I believe she eventualy became a citizen.

[Soldat_Américain]

If one is dumb enough to believe illegal aliens are all hispanic. Substantial numbers come from asia and ireland. years ago we had a ship ground off Queens Rockaway beach called the ss golden venture. it was loaded with Chinese illegal aliens who started jumping overboard and trying to make it to shore.

An illegal alien can be any race, any nationality, except US)

You understand that the article is about a hispanic and ordie is hispanic...I'm just sayin'.

[LineDoggie]

They can be U.S., if they're in another country. I've met a few in Mexico. One in a town called Sayulita on the coast of Nayarit, who came, fell in love with the place and decided to stay. She started off selling handmade jewelry in the town plaza back in the early nineties (and overstaying her visa) and now owns her own store and home. I bought a piece from her a couple of years ago. I believe she eventualy became a citizen.Most people understood we are talking about illegal aliens in the USA. By the way what is Mexican codified law and punishment for illegal immigration to Mexico?

[cbreedon]

He's tapping into geographically underserved markets ignored by the big boxes, mainstream stores such as Safeway and foodies stores such as whole foods.

I'm willing to bet if he opens commercial banks with the same concept, he'll do well.

My point is that the "growing Hispanic market" has a large percentage of illegals which he also was, so his success has been based of him and many others breaking the law. So to me it is not a success story for this country... Good for him, I guess but a failure of our immigration & border policy

[LineDoggie]

You understand that the article is about a hispanic and ordie is hispanic...I'm just sayin'.
Except again you can be an illegal and Irish, Asian, etc.

[Soldat_Américain]

But in this case it's about a hispanic...specific case.

[Ordie]

You understand that the article is about a hispanic and ordie is hispanic...I'm just sayin'.

Given the propensity for negative economic news.
I'd thought I would post a feel good story every once in a while. Especially in areas long neglected by mainstream corporatations.

[Ordie]

Except again you can be an undocumented and Irish, Asian, etc.

You are correct sir.

A former drinking buddy at Ireland's 32 Pub in San Francisco was not only an undocumented immigrant but a fugitive from the Maze prison in Northern Ireland.
I didn't know until the FBI caught up with him.

[HollywoodMarine]

A former drinking buddy at Ireland's 32 Pub in San Francisco was not only an undocumented immigrant but a fugitive from the Maze prison in Northern Ireland. I didn't know until the FBI caught up with him.http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y35/Dragonwiz/clipart/whistle.gif
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r96/dr-azazel/rat.jpg

[pieisawesome]

So if you are illegal and Hispanic, Ordie will defend you?

But if you are illegal and Irish, Ordie will call the FBI on you?

[HollywoodMarine]

You ever hear Ordie defend non-Hispanic illegals on these threads? That would be the first for me.

[Rahlgd]

Glad for his succes but there are more legal Mexican immigrants that become succeses and they're largely ignored while this case is put on a pedistal.

[Ordie]

Glad for his succes but there are more legal Mexican immigrants that become succeses and they're largely ignored while this case is put on a pedistal.

If only Mexico had strict anti-trust laws to prevent monopolies and the rule of law that everyone respects, there would be endless entrepenurial opportunities for would be emigrants.

[Rahlgd]

If only Mexico had strict anti-trust laws to prevent monopolies and the rule of law that everyone respects, there would be endless entrepenurial opportunities for would be emigrants.

The Mexican government needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. This is only one example of the fact that Mexico is still held back by the self serving rule of a minority ruling class that ostracizes everyone outside of it's circle. I know I sound like some retard college student blaring the benefits of communism and that's not what i'm trying to sound like but in Mexico it is 100% true in all sectors of society. They really need to drop all the ****ing racialist mentalities in their society too.

[DaveDash]

Ordie the key point you really are missing from the immigration issue is the following:

It's not fair.

It doesn't matter if illegals contribute positively or negatively to the US, it doesn't matter if they are hard working patriotic Americans or any of that. It's just not fair.

For me to work and live in the US, I'd have to shell out in excess of $750,000 to start a business, wait years to get a green card via chance, or marry an American. I'd love the freedom to work and live over there.

It's not fair, and it's not right, for someone to just waltz over the border, no matter what their intentions are.

[Ordie]

I agree that the current immigration system is not fair.

It's not fair that we give green cards to Cubans that cross the Border while Russian medical professional wait for years.

It's not fair that we gave visas to 9-11 terrorist, while we deny working visas for Chinese university graduates in the United States.

Immigration policy must be reformed and be based on the economic, educational and social needs of the country. This guy was one out of the 12 million undocumented immigrants who created 3,000 jobs. Imagine how many jobs woulg be created if we give more like him the freedom to fail.

[DaveDash]

Yeah well the wheels of bureaucracy in the US are extremely slow to turn unfortunately. It's pretty obvious immigration reform is needed, but due to the country being so divided on the issue it's going to remain like this for some time.

Many many many wasted opportunities.

It's also the principal though. While that guy did a lot of good and created 3,000 jobs, he didn't have the right to do it. To put an it an extreme context - if I have a company that makes illegal perscription drugs yet I employ 3,000 people, is that right?

[IconOfEvi]

If you enter the U.S. illegally how do you then become a legal resident?

I believe, judging by what I can tell, that he was part of the first amnesty in the 80s(?), that was of course supposed to be the LAST ONE, and that border security would be TOP NOTCH after

Also, Ordie - his supermarkets cater to an emigre subsect. What does every other American gain out of his stores or buisness model? Nothing

[0rphie]

I believe the story does not pass the smell test. First had the guy wanted to become a scientist he would apply for a position at a scientific institution or a university. Which would most likely get him a J-1 visa. People who aspire to become scientists do not have to climb the fence of run through desert to become one in this country.
I wonder how many of those claimed 3000 workers are legal? What is the percentage of legal residents or US citizens are among his customers? Or he simple provide jobs to illegals to feed more illegals?

[Ordie]

Supermarket subset are a reality even in the non ethnic areas.

People now shop at Costco or Sam's Clubs for bulky items, Trader Joes for frozen foods, Safeway or Luckys for last minute items, Target stores because the food is there and don't want to run extra errands, farmers market on the weekends to look like a cool foodie and 7-11 for that emergency pack of cigarettes.

Finding a niche and good location is business 101. This guy figured it out because he understood and listened to his customers. He also understands that his customers do not have the mobility or time to drive or take transit to make multiple errands. So he'll provide the best value and services as possible to keep them happy.

[Chulo]

His stores employ 3000 workers. I would call that a success. http://www.mipueblofoods.com/about/about.html
drug cartels make Billions a year and employ tens of thousands, same type of success

[Ordie]

drug cartels make Billions a year and employ tens of thousands, same type of success

But no dignity.

[FlintHillBilly]

But no dignity.

Depends on who you ask or how you look at it. For them its dignity for those affected you are correct, no dignity.

[Chulo]

But no dignity.
Yea, thats why movies like Scarface are not such a big impact on society, or how Cartels in Mexico have songs written about them. Dignity seems to be a personal context label.

[eskachig]

Also, Ordie - his supermarkets cater to an emigre subsect. What does every other American gain out of his stores or buisness model? Nothing
That's ridiculous. What do you get out of any business that doesn't cater to your specific wants? Consumer spending, tax revenue, jobs, etc.


I believe the story does not pass the smell test. First had the guy wanted to become a scientist he would apply for a position at a scientific institution or a university. Which would most likely get him a J-1 visa. People who aspire to become scientists do not have to climb the fence of run through desert to become one in this country.
Somehow I doubt that his plan was particularly detailed - or, as you said, he would have stayed in mexico, gone to a university, and tried the academic route.


drug cartels make Billions a year and employ tens of thousands, same type of success
Hahaha yes exactly the same.

[plato]

drug cartels make Billions a year and employ tens of thousands, same type of success

NOT the same type of success. GET REAL!

[Chulo]

NOT the same type of success. GET REAL!

It is the success story of an illegal immigrant right? something "Illegal" is still a crime as far as i know

[plato]

It is the success story of an illegal immigrant right? something "Illegal" is still a crime as far as i know

and he IS a legal productive resident. Do you know that?

[Chulo]

and he IS a legal productive resident. Do you know that?
And he broke the law to get where he is. Same thing as what the cartels are doing when they work to improve their towns and villages. Do the ends justify the means?

[Ordie]

And he broke the law to get where he is.

So do many people everyday by speeding over the limit.

[PEMM]

^ You just compared speeding to illegally entering a country.

[Chulo]

So do many people everyday by speeding over the limit.
Yea, and when they get caught, they face the consequences, whats your point?

[DaveDash]

Ordie.

It doesn't matter if he came up for the cure for cancer while in the states.

He knowingly did something wrong and unfair, and by doing so he contributed to the problem, not helped solve it.

People need to respect the law, that's the ENTIRE reason our society functions today and is not chaos or anarachy. Sometimes the law isn't the best it could be, but you change the system from WITHIN.

You seem to have this opinion that the law can be flaunted as YOU judge or as YOU see fit. We have courts, we have justice systems, we don't live in dictatorships. The law deserves a certain degree of respect in our societies, even the ones you disagree with.

You can't have your cake and eat it too, Ordie.

Back to the drug analogy, I think pot is pretty harmless, but if someone created a legit business on the back of selling home grown pot, that wouldn't be right either.

[Ordie]

What's done is done, and an immigration judge or governmental policy deemed this guy legal.
Now it's payback time, and this guy doing it in a big way by creating jobs for the economy.

[DaveDash]

What's done is done, and an immigration judge or governmental policy deemed this guy legal.
Now it's payback time, and this guy doing it in a big way by creating jobs for the economy.

I do agree that in practice (not in principle) that these guys are pretty much hard working Americans contributing to the country they love. There is a good family guy episode that sums up this quite well.

But you can see why this upsets people, particulary those who waited years to get legal citizenship via the proper route.

Let's say I want to become a legal US citizen (and I wouldn't mind), should I just follow in this mans footsteps then? What kind of message does this send? "Break the law, it's OK!".

[Chulo]

What's done is done, and an immigration judge or governmental policy deemed this guy legal.
Now it's payback time, and this guy doing it in a big way by creating jobs for the economy.
Yea.. Madoff should be let out of jail since he can create a ton of jobs