UN protecting a terrorist

[jdbjdb]

I'm thinking that Yasser Arafat's compound in Ramallah needs some work. A couple D9 Bulldozers, Merkava tanks should do just nicely.
Time to take Hamas founders wheel chair

[GazB]

Of course... it is Yasser Arafat that is the problem of course.

[usa320]

hell yes he is. Screw markavas and bulldozers... i think he should get a sneaky poison job, and we can just say he died of old age...

[Zach R.]

A flame thrower would do nicely.

[Mortimer]

sure he needs to be killed, however do you think the arabs would appreciate him being assaninated?....it would just further the bloodshed and hatred.

A peace keeping force needs to be sent into palestine, thats the answer i don't know why it hasn't been done yet.

[jdbjdb]

Arafat has said he wants to be a martyr so he's suicidal now, Arafat is getting old he knows it If he wants a state of his own and to be buried there, cause death isn't to far off what is he 80? he better get to work and disarm militants, or be buried in his real country Egypt

[jdbjdb]

A peace keeping force needs to be sent into palestine
peace keepers are not needed, and no palestine only Israel.

[Seiyuuki]

There is no PEACE to be KEEPer.

[Mortimer]

There is no PEACE to be KEEPer.

ahh yeah.....thats right....care to refrase that?

[jdbjdb]

The UN would just get in the way, what happened when peace keepers went to Lebanon 1983? 300 american soldiers murdered by Hizbollah and they still deserve an ass kicking for that. IDF's got it covered to bad IDF can't help out the Americans in Iraq

[citizen-k]

The UN would just get in the way, what happened when peace keepers went to Lebanon 1983? 300 american soldiers murdered by Hizbollah and they still deserve an ass kicking for that. IDF's got it covered to bad IDF can't help out the Americans in Iraq

It wasn't Hizbullah (Hizbullah was born ~15 years later) It was one of the Palestinians groups who did that... (Those who were under the command of dear Mr. Arafat)

[citizen-k]

sure he needs to be killed, however do you think the arabs would appreciate him being assaninated?....it would just further the bloodshed and hatred.

A peace keeping force needs to be sent into palestine, thats the answer i don't know why it hasn't been done yet.

"bloodshed and hatred" - unlick happiness and love today?

Arab countries don't give a f*** about Arafat or the Palestinians.
All they want is to find a place for the Palestininas they have in their countries - a place to kick them out to.
Palestine? the moon? New-York city? they don't give a damn - they hate each other more then they hate the Israelis.
(Ask your PAlestinian friend how many Palestinians were killed by the Jordanins, Egyptions, Syrians or Saudi-Arabians, you'll be surprised!)

The Jordaninan army alone killed in one day more Palestinians then Israel ever killed in 55 years. (Not that somebody cared - they were just Palestinians and it was impossible to accuse the Jews for it)

http://www.onwar.com/aced/data/bravo/blacksept1970.htm

[Adri]

yes arafat is a terrorist, but sharon is allso a terrorist...

so we have two terrorist, lets do it the "american way" (bomb the **** out of them bouth)

and da da, the problem is gone.

OR

just dont give a f***:

-usa stops giving israel aid
-and the world comunity bloks of bouth israel and palestin;
is kind of a "ho will survive" operation; and the rest of the world can watch it on tv !!! woot

"there is NO good side in a war"

[Mortimer]

yes arafat is a terrorist, but sharon is allso a terrorist...

so we have two terrorist, lets do it the "american way" (bomb the **** out of them bouth)

and da da, the problem is gone.

OR

just dont give a f***:

-usa stops giving israel aid
-and the world comunity bloks of bouth israel and palestin;
is kind of a "ho will survive" operation; and the rest of the world can watch it on tv !!! woot

"there is NO good side in a war"

yeah thats what i reckon, build a war around them both and just let them at it for a few years....MTV should take it up lol

[citizen-k]

yes arafat is a terrorist, but sharon is allso a terrorist...

so we have two terrorist, lets do it the "american way" (bomb the **** out of them bouth)

and da da, the problem is gone.

OR

just dont give a f***:

-usa stops giving israel aid
-and the world comunity bloks of bouth israel and palestin;
is kind of a "ho will survive" operation; and the rest of the world can watch it on tv !!! woot

"there is NO good side in a war"

What makes Sharon (Who is a democratic elected prime minister) a terrorist?

It just makes you feel good saying it, huh?

[Adri]

I am talking abouth his time as a general.... you know the things you dont want to speek abouth....

[citizen-k]

I am talking abouth his time as a general.... you know the things you dont want to speek abouth....

Which one's? The time Christians slaughtered the Muslims and the world

accused the Jews? rofl

Or maybe it was the time he voted for bombing the Iraqi nuclear reactor?

(Think of 1991 WITH an Iraqi nuclear bomb) ;)

[Adri]

keyword: Sabra & Shatila

[citizen-k]

keyword: Sabra & Shatila
Thought so...

Christians are slaughtering the Muslims, as part of internal afair between them - and who's fault is it? The Jewish minister of defence, which is in war against 4-5 terror groups and the Syrian army...

It's not Lebanon's fault, Syrians fault - those who actually did it, no! it's Sharon's fault!

Try to express you anti-Jewish point of view in a more logical way...you know, big nose = big brain rofl

[Adri]

then who gave the orders ?

who got the blame from a israeli goverment comission ?

[Adri]

okey let me try to tell you my point of view:

you cald me an anti-jewish, do you think the arab would call you a "friend to all arabs" ?

you are blaming the arabs for not geting a peacefull solution.... do you realy think they are the only one who stops the peace down there ?

[citizen-k]

okey let me try to tell you my point of view:

you cald me an anti-jewish, do you think the arab would call you a "friend to all arabs" ?

you are blaming the arabs for not geting a peacefull solution.... do you realy think they are the only one who stops the peace down there ?

Do you know any one else who is blowing up school buses?

[ArmoredDov_D9]

then who gave the orders ?

who got the blame from a israeli goverment comission ?

Not Sharon, it was a Palestinian supported by Syria which was later assisnated by the Syrians (wonder why...).

In the investigation commission Sharon was blamed for not anticipating that removing his troops from that camps will cause the Christian Falangas to come in and run amok. No one ever suggested that Sharon have intiated the massacre or was an active part of it. It is only blamed for not preventing it. What Sharon did in Sabra and Shatila is very similiar to whaat Cofi Annan did in Ruwanda, but less severe.

[Adri]

okey let me try to tell you my point of view:

you cald me an anti-jewish, do you think the arab would call you a "friend to all arabs" ?

you are blaming the arabs for not geting a peacefull solution.... do you realy think they are the only one who stops the peace down there ?

Do you know any one else who is blowing up school buses?¨

no but I know of some rockets from F-16 hiting and killing children (yes I know the terrorist blows up children to, but I not suporting there way of warfar)

[Adri]

then who gave the orders ?

who got the blame from a israeli goverment comission ?

Not Sharon, it was a Palestinian supported by Syria which was later assisnated by the Syrians (wonder why...).

In the investigation commission Sharon was blamed for not anticipating that removing his troops from that camps will cause the Christian Falangas to come in and run amok. No one ever suggested that Sharon have intiated the massacre or was an active part of it. It is only blamed for not preventing it. What Sharon did in Sabra and Shatila is very similiar to whaat Cofi Annan did in Ruwanda, but less severe.

the comission found out that sharon knowed what that was going on inside the camp but didnt do any thing to stop it....

[citizen-k]

no but I know of some rockets from F-16 hiting and killing children (yes I know the terrorist blows up children to, but I not suporting there way of warfar)

Rockets ment to stop Palestinians terrorists from killing Israeli civilians.

Do you expect him to do nothing?
(You just said that the Sabra&Shatila are his fault since he knew and did nothing)

Hmm....so it's ok to look the other why when it comes to killing Jews (even if your Jewish yourself) but you should send your Jewish army to protect the muslims in case the Christians intend to hurt them? rofl

You people make me laugh...

[Adri]

you have full rigth to protect yourself, but was Sabra&Shatila protecting or some mad man getting out som anger ?

so back to the rocket ****:

first, I do not suport in any way how the terrorists attack civilian in israel.
but let me say it like this (but if they had attacked the army...):

you are a dad, you ony son is going to school.... bom he was to close to one of the terrorists.... afthe on hamas ask him if he wanst to go on a suicide mission, what do you think he anwser (how do you spell that?)

and than again:
you are a israeli bay going to school, all your friend sudenly gets blown op by the suicide terrorist (ofcours hamas would look on him as a freedom figther)
I would join the army the same day, if that happens to me.

there will never be an end to that war, and by killing the enemy they only grows stronger, that is on bouth sides !

and then take a look on my sig.

[ArmoredDov_D9]

then who gave the orders ?

who got the blame from a israeli goverment comission ?

Not Sharon, it was a Palestinian supported by Syria which was later assisnated by the Syrians (wonder why...).

In the investigation commission Sharon was blamed for not anticipating that removing his troops from that camps will cause the Christian Falangas to come in and run amok. No one ever suggested that Sharon have intiated the massacre or was an active part of it. It is only blamed for not preventing it. What Sharon did in Sabra and Shatila is very similiar to whaat Cofi Annan did in Ruwanda, but less severe.

the comission found out that sharon knowed what that was going on inside the camp but didnt do any thing to stop it....


From the Kahan Commity report:


In his testimony before us, and in statements he issued beforehand, the Minister of Defense also adopted the position that no one had imagined the Phalangists would carry out a massacre in the camps and that it was a tragedy that could not be foreseen. It was stressed by the Minister of Defense in his testimony, and argued in his behalf, that the director of Military Intelligence, who spent time with him and maintained contact with him on the days prior to the Phalangists' entry into the camps and at the time of their entry into the camps, did not indicate the danger of a massacre, and that no warning was received from the Mossad, which was responsible for the liaison with the Phalangists and also had special knowledge of the character of this force.

It is true that no clear warning Was provided by military intelligence or the Mossad about what might happen if the Phalangist forces entered the camps, and we will relate to this matter when we discuss the responsibility of the director of Military Intelligence and the head of the Mossad. But in our view, even without such warning, it is impossible to justify the Minister of Defense's disregard of the danger of a massacre. We will not repeat here what we have already said above about the widespread knowledge regarding the Phalangists' combat ethics, their feelings of hatred toward the Palestinians, and their leaders' plans for the future of the Palestinians when said leaders would assume power. Besides this general knowledge, the Defense Minister also had special reports from his not inconsiderable [number of] meetings with the Phalangist heads before Bashir's assassination.

And it comcludes:


It is our view that responsibility is to be imputed to the Minister of Defense for having disregarded the danger of acts of vengeance and bloodshed by the Phalangists against the population of the refugee camps, and having failed to take this danger into account when he decided to have the Phalangists enter the camps. In addition, responsibility is to be imputed to the Minister of Defense for not ordering appropriate measures for preventing or reducing the danger of massacre as a condition for the Phalangists' entry into the camps. These blunders constitute the non-fulfillment of a duty with which the Defense Minister was charged.

We do not believe that responsibility is to be imputed to the Defense Minister for not ordering the removal of the Phalangists from the camps when the first reports reached him about the acts of killing being committed there. As was detailed above, such reports initially reached the Defense Minister on Friday evening; but at the same time, he had heard from the Chief of Staff that the Phalangists' operation had been halted, that they had been ordered to leave the camps and that their departure would be effected by 5:00 a.m. Saturday. These preventive steps might well have seemed sufficient to the Defense Minister at that time, and it was not his duty to order additional steps to be taken, or to have the departure time moved up, a step which was of doubtful feasibility.

[Adri]

link ?

[ArmoredDov_D9]

http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/kahan.html

[Adri]

if I post an link wich says www.hamas.org/sharon rofl

would you belive in that ?

is so much bull****t on the internett so I cant take that as a good source....sorry

[citizen-k]

you have full rigth to protect yourself, but was Sabra&Shatila protecting or some mad man getting out som anger ?

so back to the rocket ****:

first, I do not suport in any way how the terrorists attack civilian in israel.
but let me say it like this (but if they had attacked the army...):

you are a dad, you ony son is going to school.... bom he was to close to one of the terrorists.... afthe on hamas ask him if he wanst to go on a suicide mission, what do you think he anwser (how do you spell that?)

and than again:
you are a israeli bay going to school, all your friend sudenly gets blown op by the suicide terrorist (ofcours hamas would look on him as a freedom figther)
I would join the army the same day, if that happens to me.

there will never be an end to that war, and by killing the enemy they only grows stronger, that is on bouth sides !

and then take a look on my sig.

If I was a father and my neighbour was dealing terror activity near my son I would have shot him in the head.
When I was a kid and we had war around us (1982) my dad didn't let me get my head out of the shelter.
They send their kids to be humen shield for their terrorists and
Arafat is teaching/lecturing for Jihad and use of kids to do so.

I wasn't taught to kill arabs, they were (and still are) teaching their kids to kill Jews.

I wasn't sent to use as humen shield to our soldiers - they use their kids as humen shields.

According to you Bush is a terrorist as well (Iraq? Afghanistan?) so is the British PM and almost every leader of the free world - accusing Sharon only makes Arafats actions (which are the worse) look better. (which is, I guess, what you wish to achieve)

As a european I think you should be concerned about what did Arafat do with all the money you gave him (buying explosives and put it in his personal bank account while his poeple are starving) other then pointing out Sharon as the terrorist in this situation.

Sharon is a democratic elected leader, unlike Arafat who is a mass-murderer, terrorist, pedophile and a thief
******s
But, as many no-******s, you prefer that over a Jew, right?

(no-******s, rofl )

[citizen-k]

if I post an link wich says www.hamas.org/sharon rofl

would you belive in that ?

is so much bull****t on the internett so I cant take that as a good source....sorry

Compering US/Israel to Hamas realy shows us your real point of view...

You ask for a link, you got one - since it's not supporting your point of view you claim (all of a sudden) that the internet is not good enough (so why did you ask for a link?)

[Adri]

Norway have NEVER given money to arafat...

I know it is hard to se the trouth som let me start:

Norway is the county who are handing out the nobel peace price:
and I am not proud of giving it to arafat, he sould never have had it!

oh, hehe just so you know, the norvegian politicans did talk about giving Sharon the nobel peace price..... but they didnt cause the learn from that mistake with arafat....

there will not be peace in the palestinian-israel conflict if bouth sides are still shooting at each others and are terrorising each others.

now I dont know much about this but:
I know that the israeli bulldovzers are jaming palestinian houses, and ass I said I dont know much about this, but wouldent it be easyer if you started to live among each others ? wouldent it be easyer to under stand the "terrorist" then ?

[Adri]

if I post an link wich says www.hamas.org/sharon rofl

would you belive in that ?

is so much bull****t on the internett so I cant take that as a good source....sorry

Compering US/Israel to Hamas realy shows us your real point of view...

You ask for a link, you got one - since it's not supporting your point of view you claim (all of a sudden) that the internet is not good enough (so why did you ask for a link?)

no my question is:

if came whit a that type of a link would you belive in it ?

I havent said it isnt trouth cause I wasnt there so I cant say if is was good or bad, I can only say what I have heard

[citizen-k]

Norway have NEVER given money to arafat...

I know it is hard to se the trouth som let me start:

Norway is the county who are handing out the nobel peace price:
and I am not proud of giving it to arafat, he sould never have had it!

oh, hehe just so you know, the norvegian politicans did talk about giving Sharon the nobel peace price..... but they didnt cause the learn from that mistake with arafat....

there will not be peace in the palestinian-israel conflict if bouth sides are still shooting at each others and are terrorising each others.

now I dont know much about this but:
I know that the israeli bulldovzers are jaming palestinian houses, and ass I said I dont know much about this, but wouldent it be easyer if you started to live among each others ? wouldent it be easyer to under stand the "terrorist" then ?

You don't know much about many things dear...

Bulldozers are demolishing houses of suicide bombers so the next suicide bomber will be stoped by his family (and so he will think twice knowing that doing so will leave his family without a house)

If they were swiss or Norwegians, maybe - but they are PALESTINIANS!!!
They like nothig better then the smell of fresh blood pumping from somebody...
Burn child murderers who seek nothing but their next target, and until their leadership will teach them otherwise - we will demolish their houses and bomb their terror headquarters!!!
You can give them another 1000 nobel prizes, it won't change the fact of what they are.

As for us, we don't need the prize as Israelis - we have far then enough of it as Jews!!! rofl

[Adri]

If they were swiss or Norwegians, maybe - but they are PALESTINIANS!!!
They like nothig better then the smell of fresh blood pumping from somebody...
Burn child murderers who seek nothing but their next target, and until their leadership will teach them otherwise - we will demolish their houses and bomb their terror headquarters!!!
You can give them another 1000 nobel prizes, it won't change the fact of what they are.


that is why peace is a strange word down there....
bouth palestinians and israels (not all) tinks like this....

putt this up agains each other with a apache on one side and a suicide bomber on the other side....

http://www.markfiore.com/animation/globe.html <--- just an funny flash ;)

[Adri]

In 1983, Sharon resigned as Defense Minister after a government commission found him indirectly responsible for the September 1982 massacre of Palestinians at the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps by Lebanese Christians.


this is based on ( http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/biography/sharon.html ) "your" page, now still this page says he was a part of what that was going on (still its an page giving the israeli perspective)

but you havent come up whit any thing showing arafat IS a terrorist...

(I belive he is a terrorist, and so do I belive sharon is a terrorist, its just for fun that I want to see if you can come up whit something)

[ArmoredDov_D9]

In 1983, Sharon resigned as Defense Minister after a government commission found him indirectly responsible for the September 1982 massacre of Palestinians at the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps by Lebanese Christians.


this is based on ( http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/biography/sharon.html ) "your" page, now still this page says he was a part of what that was going on (still its an page giving the israeli perspective)

but you havent come up whit any thing showing arafat IS a terrorist...

(I belive he is a terrorist, and so do I belive sharon is a terrorist, its just for fun that I want to see if you can come up whit something)

You read only the final conclusion and ignore the rest. Watch carefully, the commission found that Sharon was "indirectly responsible " for the massacre but when you sponsering or planing this massacre you are directly responsible for it. No one ever claimed that Sharon ordered the massacre, nor planned it or helped it. Read again the commission report.

http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/intro.html

This source is rather reliable, unlike Hamas propoganda site. I'm conviced that if you search for the official report you'll be conviced. Much of the material I do have is in books you can't read (mainly because of language) and can't be linked (ink & paper).



now I dont know much about this but:
I know that the israeli bulldovzers are jaming palestinian houses, and ass I said I dont know much about this, but wouldent it be easyer if you started to live among each others ? wouldent it be easyer to under stand the "terrorist" then ?
Did you heard about the 1929 Hebron massacre?
More than 60 peaceful Jews were slaughters by raging Arab mob who raped the Jewish women, burnt houses and mutilated the bodies of the slains.

[Adri]

again you didnt anwser my question: "but you havent come up whit any thing showing arafat IS a terrorist... "

well we aint getting any way whit the Sabra and Shatila camp, cause I will not belive it befor I see it with my own eyes or hear it from a reliable source... and I dont find that page a reliabel source.

unfortanly for this forum, there isnt any palestinians her to tell there side of the case....

[ArmoredDov_D9]

again you didnt anwser my question: "but you havent come up whit any thing showing arafat IS a terrorist... "

There were sized doccuments from Arafat's compunds proving he sponsered terrorist attacks against Israelis. Piles of illegal weapons were capture there also.


well we aint getting any way whit the Sabra and Shatila camp, cause I will not belive it befor I see it with my own eyes or hear it from a reliable source... and I dont find that page a reliabel source.

I'm not sure if you read this, but


The Commission determined that the massacre at Sabra and Shatilla was carried out by a Phalangist unit, acting on its own but its entry was known to Israel. No Israeli was directly responsible for the events which occurred in the camps. But the Commission asserted that Israel had indirect responsibility for the massacre since the I.D.F. held the area, Mr. Begin was found responsible for not exercising greater involvement and awareness in the matter of introducing the Phalangists into the camps. Mr. Sharon was found responsible for ignoring the danger of bloodshed and revenge when he approved the entry of the Phalangists into the camps as well as not taking appropriate measures to prevent bloodshed. Mr. Shamir erred by not taking action after being alerted by communications Minister Zippori. Chief of Staff Eitan did not give the appropriate orders to prevent the massacre. The Commission recommended that the Defense Minister resign, that the Director of Military Intelligence not continue in his post and other senior officers be removed. Full text follows:

And in the bottom it writes


This report was signed on 7 February 1983.

Yitzhak Kahan
Commission Chairman
Aharon Barak
Commission Member
Yona Efrat
Commission Member

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Israeli Foreign Ministry

So this is a transcript of the report.

Another copy of the Kahan report you can find at the site of Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs.
http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0ign0

[jdbjdb]

Or maybe it was the time he voted for bombing the Iraqi nuclear reactor?
two more that need to be desposed of in North Korea, Iran, lately been hearing Syria begining to get in the game.

[Adri]

Or maybe it was the time he voted for bombing the Iraqi nuclear reactor?
two more that need to be desposed of in North Korea, Iran, lately been hearing Syria begining to get in the game.

woho lets have a nucler flame war !!! ;)

I am proud of my countrys no when usa ask if we did want nuclear weapon during the cold war.
its an easy thing, if a nuclear war sudenly start then it doesnt matter who that have and who that doesnt have nuclear, we are all fuc**ed any way...so who cares...

[He219]

I will have to agree that Arafat supports militant opposition to the occupation and to the creation of Israel itself, due to the forced and voluntary flight (http://www.npr.org/news/specials/mideast/history/transcripts/part-three.partition-20021002.html) of indigenous Palestinians he represents from Arab-Zionist fighting in May of 1948, an exiled populus prevented from returning to their native homes since Ben-Gurion announced the establishment of the independent state of Israel.

Alleged complicity in terrorist involvements makes negotiations for Peace with him seem unatainable. However, he is an internationally recognized representative of the Palestinian populus in it's effort to establish an independent homeland free of Israeli subjugation, as reaffirmed by the UN General Assembly in a 133-4 vote, with 15 abstentions, adopting a resolution demanding that the Jewish state not carry out a policy to "remove" Arafat.

Even Ariel Sharon, according to the Kahan Commission of Inquiry (http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/kahan.html), was found indirectly responsible as Defense Minister in 1982 for the massacre of 800 Palestinian civilians in the Sabra and Shatilla Refugee Camps by the Lebanese Christian Phalangist militia, led by Elias Hobeikain, during Israel's invasion of Southern Lebanon. Israel instituted the panel's recommendations, including the dismissal of Defense Minister Ariel Sharon and Gen. Raful Eitan, the Army Chief of Staff.

The Palestinian populus' loathing toward Ariel Sharon's tainted hardline and draconian policies toward indigenous Arabs is paralleled by Israel's loathing of Yassir Arafat's support for militant resistance and terrorist compliity.

This is the reason I feel that both leaders must be replaced and represented by moderates for the possibility of resuming any credible peace process.

[Adri]

I totaly agree whit he219 !, but please dont make a flame war...again

[citizen-k]

"was found indirectly responsible as Defense Minister in 1982 for the massacre of 800 Palestinian civilians in the Sabra and Shatilla Refugee Camps by the Lebanese Christian Phalangist militia"

Same as Bush is indirectly responsible for the wedding ACCIDENT?

It was war, the IDF was in WAR against another ARMY when someone

ELSE commited the crime - Arafat is a terrorist HIMSELF who is

commanding to commit terror action HIMSELF by his OWN ARMY against

CIVILIANS with the PURPOSE of killing CIVILIANS.

Sharon might go home next ELECTIONS because Israel is a DEMOCRACY,

unlike Palestine Authority which will be under Arafat's command until the

day he DIES.

Arafat DESTROYED the peace process BEFORE Sharon became the PM of

Israel, and will keep destroy it after Sharon will lose the elections (if he

will lose them)


We have already tried to have peace without Sharon - now it is time to try

doing it without Arafat.