If there is any Palestinian browsing this forum?

[Herrmannek]

Lately on this forum goes hot discussion about Palestnian-Israeli conflict, but we have here only a Israeli view on that matter so...if you are Palestinian and you want add something from yourself plz do it, and don't afraid or whathever most people here is open minded and want hear your 2 cents.
Thanks

[IDFM203]

Lately on this forum goes hot discussion about Palestnian-Israeli conflict, but we have here only a Israeli view on that matter so...if you are Palestinian and you want add something from yourself plz do it, and don't afraid or whathever most people here is open minded and want hear your 2 cents.
Thanksyes and we have also heard alot of the european view...

Yes in fact I would much more respect a Palestinians opinion then some of you who sprout your opinions from your safe houses back in Europe or in Canada.

It would actually be a very constructive debate. I am all for it.

[Saranof]

Lately on this forum goes hot discussion about Palestnian-Israeli conflict, but we have here only a Israeli view on that matter so...if you are Palestinian and you want add something from yourself plz do it, and don't afraid or whathever most people here is open minded and want hear your 2 cents.
Thanksyes and we have also heard alot of the european view...

Yes in fact I would much more respect a Palestinians opinion then some of you who sprout your opinions from your safe houses back in Europe or in Canada.

It would actually be a very constructive debate. I am all for it.


Yes, but I think most palestinians are in your concentration camps since 1949

[ArmoredDov_D9]

Lately on this forum goes hot discussion about Palestnian-Israeli conflict, but we have here only a Israeli view on that matter so...if you are Palestinian and you want add something from yourself plz do it, and don't afraid or whathever most people here is open minded and want hear your 2 cents.
Thanksyes and we have also heard alot of the european view...

Yes in fact I would much more respect a Palestinians opinion then some of you who sprout your opinions from your safe houses back in Europe or in Canada.

It would actually be a very constructive debate. I am all for it.


Yes, but I think most palestinians are in your concentration camps since 1949

LIER! This blood libel is outragous!
We never put the Palestinian in concentration camps!!! Hell, do you know what you are talking about or you are just queting antisemite propoganda?

There are refugees camps for Palestinians all OVER the ARAB world, including: Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Iraq, Saudi Arabia etc.
They all were built by the Arab, not by the "Elders of Zion". The refugees camps in the West Bank were built by Jordan (Israel took the WB only at 1967) and in the Gaza Strip by Egypt (Israel took the strip only at 1967) and they are NOT concentration camps!

[Herrmannek]

Plz stop doing this here. If you want you can support this petition or not , but don't start flame war here. I want to this disscussion was made in peacefull way.
Thanks

[Ichhabe]

Plz stop doing this here. If you want you can support this petition or not , but don't start flame war here. I want to this disscussion was made in peacefull way.
Thanks

The Road to Hell is paved with good intentions. Good luck! ;)

[ArmoredDov_D9]

To the subject: I be glad to hear Palestinian views and talk with people of the other side.

And those who want Palestinian view, here is a collum writen by Palestinian publicist:


In her September 19, 2003 column in the London-based Arabic daily Al-Sharq Al-Awsat titled , "Should Arafat Go?" columnist Huda Al-Husseini urged Arab countries and the Palestinian people to make it clear to Palestinian Authority Chairman Yasser Arafat that by clinging to power, he is preventing a solution to the Palestinian problem. The following are excerpts from Al-Husseini'sarticle: [1]


Arafat Has Become a Worn-Out Symbol That Has Lost Its Glory
"Yes, [Arafat should go], but not by expulsion, murder, or any other form of intervention by Israel.

"Why must Yasser Arafat leave his place in the Palestinian political arena? Because the Palestinian cause will never advance as long as he controls this arena.

"The solution to this problem relies on international elements, the most prominent of which are the U.S. and Israel. Arafat is not wanted – neither by the U.S. nor, most certainly, by Israel. Moreover, he has lost his legitimacy even in the eyes of the Europeans, and he is criticized in the Arab world too. It is true that Arafat is a symbol. But he has become a worn-out symbol that has lost its glory.

"In modern history, two prominent historic leaders have been symbols in the eyes of their people. The first was Nelson Mandela, who was imprisoned by South Africa's previous, racist regime – but no politician dared then to threaten to expel or kill him. The second leader was Xanana Gusmao, leader of the East Timor rebellion who was captured by the Indonesians. Then too, none of the Indonesian authorities dared to threaten him with expulsion or murder.

"But with Arafat the situation is different, because Israel's policy of threatening him with expulsion or murder has again placed him in the limelight. This policy does not attest to strategic thought; it is a blunder [for Israel], which Arafat has not figured out how to use in favor of the Palestinian cause, or for the good of the Palestinian people – but [only] in his own favor. This is because he thinks that he is the Palestinian cause and the Palestinian cause is him."

Arafat Turned His Back On a Palestinian State With East Jerusalem as Its Capital

"Arafat's expulsion would be a mistake, and his murder would be considered a crime. [But] his blowing kisses or flashing a V-sign is no better. This meaningless sign blocks the light at the end of the tunnel. Arafat has missed many opportunities… the most recent and obvious of which was the plan presented to him by the previous U.S. president, Bill Clinton, in 2000. Instead of accepting an opportunity that would lead to the end of the Israeli occupation, he turned his back on a Palestinian state with east Jerusalem as its capital…"

A Great Leader Knows When and How to Leave The Stage

"Arafat's problem is that he wants to prove that nothing will be realized without him, [while] it is obvious that nothing will be realized with him. He wants to preserve [national] principles, while in reality this concept no longer exists. [In reality,] national principles are represented by international forces and capital. Today no international force supports Arafat, and on the other hand he has lost all his capital – except perhaps for his secret bank accounts.

"There is another problem, for which the Arab countries are to blame. These countries are not openly telling Arafat the truth – which is that his insistence on remaining in the limelight will never bring about the realization of the Palestinians' aspirations.

"What Arafat needs is for the Arab states and the Palestinian people to talk to him frankly. As long as Arafat is the only element in the Palestinian Authority, Israel will continue to take advantage of this weak point – by means of Sharon or anyone else. Those who are enthused by the V-sign Arafat flashes will never notice that the limelight is being shifted from the Palestinian cause, the doors are closing in front of them, the settlements are spreading and expanding, and the fence continues to be built and continues to swallow up land.

"A great leader knows when and how to leave the stage – sometimes via his people, as happened to Winston Churchill, and sometimes via his wisdom, as happened to Nelson Mandela."


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[1] Al-Sharq Al-Awsat (London), September 19, 2003.

Source: http://www.memri.org/bin/latestnews.cgi?ID=SD57803

[army cadet_ngcsu]

Let the Israelis and Jews post what they think, after all, this is a forum. If you do not like what they have to say, then stop coming here. I enjoy reading what their opinions are, in fact...they are really not opinions, they are facts. They point out things in history that I have not known or heard of, because the media here in the US does not bother to show the facts. It takes two to make war, but one side is obviously making the situation worse, while the other is trying to make ammends. As Americans, we are a freedom loving people whose history is routed in promoting democracy. As Americans we should whole heartedly support Israel, as it is the Mideast's only true democracy.

GO ARMY!!!

[EvanL]

*buzzer* Wrong. Bahrain is a democracy believe it or not.

[IDFM203]

*buzzer* Wrong. Bahrain is a democracy believe it or not.Oh so in Bahrain a Jew can vote (if there are Jews allowed to even live there)?!? Or what about a Christian?!?

[Rantanplan]

PEACE

http://www.weberart.com/img_prod/bob/br0_lg.jpg

God bless my Friend.

[One?]

Well I'm not palestinian, but close, I'm lebanese.And as you all know Israel and Lebanon are not the best of friends. I will be glad to engage in any discussion as long as the person does not change the facts, and has knowledge of what he is talking about.

[EvanL]

One are you from Ottawa? Most lebanese canadians are from Ottawa thats why im asking.

[One?]

Ya I know there's a large community in Ottawa. But I live in toronto.

[IDFM203]

Ya I know there's a large community in Ottawa. But I live in toronto.Oh so your Lebanese...kief chalak :D

So your not Palestinian but are you Muslim or you a Lebanese Christian?!? I am just curious here.



(oh and of course Id expect you to not change any facts as well)


salem !! :D

[volfram]

Who heard about democracy in country under ocupation?

[One?]

Idf being a lebanese muslim or christien is the same. We are lebanese.


Volfram - if you are refering to lebanon yes it is a democracy and there is no occupation. The Syrian army is in lebanon because the lebanese government wants it that way. Actualy whats left is a couple sam sites in the north and thats about it.

Watching CNN too much brainwashes the average person. So don't believe what you see on TV.



Edit:

To answer your question I am a muslim, from southern lebanon (so if you served in the IDF you should know the area). I lost both my grandfathers to the IDF. And for some odd reason I love israeli and american gear and equipment, and that is how I stumbled across this amazing site.

[IDFM203]

Idf being a lebanese muslim or christien is the same. We are lebanese.

.Well of course when its comes to your pure hatred of Jews and Israel, both are the same :| (except for an extreme minority of Christians)

But you and I know that it is not the same. I mean heck there was a freaking civil war between both groups that ravaged that country in the mid seventies. Ther is no love affair between the Muslims and Christians.

So again are you Christian or Muslim?!?

[One?]

Idf i did asnwer your question in my previous post. I know there is no love affair but it was Muslims/Orthodox Christains vs Maronites or Hardcore catholics.

[IDFM203]

Idf i did asnwer your question in my previous post. I know there is no love affair but it was Muslims/Orthodox Christains vs Maronites or Hardcore catholics.Yeah sorry about that. I was writing my response to you on Microsoft word when you posted that edit of yours.

[warchild1/27scout]

i say the palestinians lost thier sorry excuse of occupation when they turned down the best offer in history and instead decided it was better to kill women and children. i say now we just burn thier **** kill em all. let allah sort em out.

[One?]

i say the palestinians lost thier sorry excuse of occupation when they turned down the best offer in history and instead decided it was better to kill women and children. i say now we just burn thier **** kill em all. let allah sort em out.

Is being racist all you got :) ?

[ArmoredDov_D9]

i say the palestinians lost thier sorry excuse of occupation when they turned down the best offer in history and instead decided it was better to kill women and children. i say now we just burn thier **** kill em all. let allah sort em out.

Is being racist all you got :) ?

What is racist about we he said? It is clear as the sun that the Palestians adopted the massacre of innocent civilians as a main tactic, sometimes even as a way of life. I don't see anything that can justify a blowing of a bus crowded with women and children or exploding into a Passover dinner full of elders.

Terrorism made Islam bad reputation. Check the thread about Sheik Yasin (Hamas leader) who announced that the USA declared war on Islam and justified every killing of US civilians.

[A$$MAN]

ArmoredDov
I noticed you promoted massive bulldozing, yet say nothing how the Israelis murdered an UNARMED AMERICAN PROTESTER. How courageous! So BOLD. To bite the very hand that feeds Israel; we do supply you with BILLIONS of dollars.
For the video that the protesters shot, after the Israeli bulldozed a ****E UNARMED American, she screamed, "My back! My back is broken!." While other unarmed Americans watched in horror, they moved out of the way realizing the Israeli govt would kill UNARMED CIVILIANS. Afterwhich, the Americans pleaded Israeli officials on scene to take the American to the hospital, they finally agreed after further arguements and after other Americans dug her out of the ground. The American, Racheal Corrie, died at the hospital.
Just want to hear you justify murdering an American.

[EvanL]

Wat was racist about it is that he made a comment about killing all people of one religion. its no different from the kind of comments the Nazis used to make.

[Seraphim]

ArmoredDov
I noticed you promoted massive bulldozing, yet say nothing how the Israelis murdered an UNARMED AMERICAN PROTESTER. How courageous! So BOLD. To bite the very hand that feeds Israel; we do supply you with BILLIONS of dollars.
For the video that the protesters shot, after the Israeli bulldozed a ****E UNARMED American, she screamed, "My back! My back is broken!." While other unarmed Americans watched in horror, they moved out of the way realizing the Israeli govt would kill UNARMED CIVILIANS. Afterwhich, the Americans pleaded Israeli officials on scene to take the American to the hospital, they finally agreed after further arguements and after other Americans dug her out of the ground. The American, Racheal Corrie, died at the hospital.
Just want to hear you justify murdering an American.


Standing in front of a bulldozer....hmmm
She was well aware of the risks of going there.

[One?]

It is very obvious that there are some users showing hatered. The only person that I respect is Idfm203, and if was to discuss anything with anyone it would be him.

It is people like you two who want the war to go on, you just showed what you realy want. "Kill'em all".

And there is no reason for me to reply to the racist comments because EvanLloyd and TYR already did.

[California Joe]

It's a curse many Americans have. Too much ****ing time on their hands.

[StarvingStudent47]

ArmoredDov
I noticed you promoted massive bulldozing, yet say nothing how the Israelis murdered an UNARMED AMERICAN PROTESTER. How courageous! So BOLD. To bite the very hand that feeds Israel; we do supply you with BILLIONS of dollars.
For the video that the protesters shot, after the Israeli bulldozed a ****E UNARMED American, she screamed, "My back! My back is broken!." While other unarmed Americans watched in horror, they moved out of the way realizing the Israeli govt would kill UNARMED CIVILIANS. Afterwhich, the Americans pleaded Israeli officials on scene to take the American to the hospital, they finally agreed after further arguements and after other Americans dug her out of the ground. The American, Racheal Corrie, died at the hospital.
Just want to hear you justify murdering an American.

Rachel Corrie was a member of the International Solidariy Movement, which has aided and abetted terrorists in the past and never condemned those actions. And nobody made her stand in front of a bulldozer with a raised blade (read: driver can't see directly ahead). So, as an American, I can't say I'm terribly upset over her death. It's not a good thing, but it's hardly the most heartbreaking thing I've heard of.

I am curious why Rachel Corrie supporters fail to mention that dozens of American citizens are killed each year in Israel during Palestinian terrorist attacks. I believe that roughly ~35 Americans have been killed this year by Palestinian terrorists, but I'd have to double-check that number. I do know for certain that a 14-year-old American girl (Abagail Litle) who was in Israel as part of a program to bring Israeli and Palestinian children together in peace and open discourse, was murdered in a terrorist attack one week after Rachel Corrie committed suicide. And I didn't hear a freakin' PEEP from all the people screaming about Corrie's death. Abagail Litle was a true PEACE activist--someone we can all respect--and all the Arafat fans and all the Noam Chomsky types pretended she was never murdered.

And to our good ol' buddy Sheikh Yassin: You want a piece of the Red White and Blue? Come git some!

[StarvingStudent47]

It is very obvious that there are some users showing hatered. The only person that I respect is Idfm203, and if was to discuss anything with anyone it would be him.

It is people like you two who want the war to go on, you just showed what you realy want. "Kill'em all".

And there is no reason for me to reply to the racist comments because EvanLloyd and TYR already did.

I agree that there is too much bigotry on these boards, aimed at many groups. I'll just talk about anti-Arab and anti-Islam sentiments here, though. Hatred of terrorists is good. I hate 'em as much as everyone else, and more than many. But as soon as we start talking about all Arabs, all Muslims, any useful message is lost. Even in the darkest hours, we must never lose sight that some of the civilians living under evil dictators are not evil themselves.

In the middle of this century, the United States realized this. We made it clear that we were out to get Adolph Hitler and the Nazis, not all Germans. And once we had wiped out the Nazi menace, we extended open arms of friendship to Germany, and we are still very close today. The dispute over Iraq is really a small blip and does not shake the fact that we are still very close friends with Germany today.

This is the path that we should all be pursuing towards Arabs and the Arab world. Kill the terrorists, extend open arms of friendship to the rest.

[EvanL]

In the middle of this century, the United States realized this. We made it clear that we were out to get Adolph Hitler and the Nazis, not all Germans.



So now its only the americans that did that? gee we will have to start re-writing the history books.

[StarvingStudent47]

So now its only the americans that did that? gee we will have to start re-writing the history books.

Sorry, I misspoke there. America, Canada, Britain, etc did that. However, the USSR did not do so as they rolled through eastern Germany. I specifically avoided the term "the Allies" to differentiate between the Eastern and Western fronts of WWII Europe. I intended no slight towards Canada or other countries that aided on the Western Front. If serious offense was taken, I apologize.

[IDFM203]

The American, Racheal Corrie, died at the hospital.


oh you mean this American....yeah the one burning the AMERICN FLAG in a FOREIGN land on FOREIGN soil….really an “American” that all Americans can be proud of……..NOT!!!!
http://www.geocities.com/rachav/rachel-corrie-flag-02.jpg
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg

[FuzziWuzzi]

http://www.egon.nu/img/arkiv/koala/full-metal-1.jpg

If Racheal Corrie, was an Australian - born and bred.....
....the soldier would have definitely been charged and kicked out, and his unit would not be given the citation they've since received.

...way it is boys and girls... p-)

[ArmoredDov_D9]

i say the palestinians lost thier sorry excuse of occupation when they turned down the best offer in history and instead decided it was better to kill women and children. i say now we just burn thier **** kill em all. let allah sort em out.

Wat was racist about it is that he made a comment about killing all people of one religion. its no different from the kind of comments the Nazis used to make.

My bad. I missed read the statement. I didn't see the last part (1 pm... almost fell asleep and that's why in my reply I also didn't react to it). The call to kill all Muslims indiscreamently is indeed racist.

The part that marked in red is indeed racist and I'm sorry I missed it before. I don't how this kind of threads passed the forum Rules. I hope all things are cleared now. Sorry of their misunderstanding and if anyone got hurt.

[ArmoredDov_D9]

ArmoredDov
I noticed you promoted massive bulldozing, yet say nothing how the Israelis murdered an UNARMED AMERICAN PROTESTER. How courageous! So BOLD. To bite the very hand that feeds Israel; we do supply you with BILLIONS of dollars.
For the video that the protesters shot, after the Israeli bulldozed a ****E UNARMED American, she screamed, "My back! My back is broken!." While other unarmed Americans watched in horror, they moved out of the way realizing the Israeli govt would kill UNARMED CIVILIANS. Afterwhich, the Americans pleaded Israeli officials on scene to take the American to the hospital, they finally agreed after further arguements and after other Americans dug her out of the ground. The American, Racheal Corrie, died at the hospital.
Just want to hear you justify murdering an American.

I don't justify murder of innocent American but she wasn't innocent and there wasn't any murder. It was an accident. Autopsy on Rachel corpse found that she was killed from a falling debris the bulldozer accidently moved and struck her head and upper torso. She wasn't crushed under the bulldozer as the ISM claims.
ISM eye accounts are full of lies. They contradicts each others and say different things about what happened.

Rachel Corrie behaved recklessly and put everyone's life in danger. When you sit in front of a 4-meter armoured bulldozer (the armour cab limits the sight-field) you prompt yourself into trouble. The driver claimed he didn't see her. According to the different eye witness she did sat\stand\knelt in front of the blade in the blindspot of the bulldozer.

http://hydepark.co.il/hydepark/upload01/030914_143656-24_proportions01.jpg

This diagram shows (yellow strip is human height) the hugh size of the bulldozer and the limits in its sight because of the armoured cab.
A military police investigation cleared the bulldozer-operator and the soldiers in the area from all fault.

[FuzziWuzzi]

Regardless........
http://www.egon.nu/img/arkiv/koala/full-metal-1.jpg

IF Racheal Corrie, was an Australian - born and bred.....
....the soldier would have definitely been charged and kicked out,
and his unit would not be given the citation they've since received.

...way it is boys and girls... p-)



http://www.cobweb.nl/wcoumans/mup11.jpg
FOZZIE : "....Who would love a BEAR without FUR ? .............
....................
....................
Oh, ......Woka, Woka, Wokaa ....." :cantbeli:

[Fargin]

I was not there, so I cannot tell you who is truthing. But here an alternative to the IDF truth.

WARNING GRAFICAL CONTENT (http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1248.shtml)

[Tom.G]

Lately on this forum goes hot discussion about Palestnian-Israeli conflict, but we have here only a Israeli view on that matter so...if you are Palestinian and you want add something from yourself plz do it, and don't afraid or whathever most people here is open minded and want hear your 2 cents.
Thanksyes and we have also heard alot of the european view...

Yes in fact I would much more respect a Palestinians opinion then some of you who sprout your opinions from your safe houses back in Europe or in Canada.

It would actually be a very constructive debate. I am all for it.


Yes, but I think most palestinians are in your concentration camps since 1949

LIER! This blood libel is outragous!
We never put the Palestinian in concentration camps!!! Hell, do you know what you are talking about or you are just queting antisemite propoganda?

There are refugees camps for Palestinians all OVER the ARAB world, including: Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Iraq, Saudi Arabia etc.
They all were built by the Arab, not by the "Elders of Zion". The refugees camps in the West Bank were built by Jordan (Israel took the WB only at 1967) and in the Gaza Strip by Egypt (Israel took the strip only at 1967) and they are NOT concentration camps!

No you call them Refugee camps.

[budanski]

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20030925/capt.nn10609251102.mideast_israel_palestinians_nn106.jpg

Rachel Corries Parents meets Arafat
Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat (news - web sites) receives a framed portrait of American peace activist Rachel Corrie from her parents Cindy and Craig Corrie at Arafat's office in the West Bank town of Ramallah Thursday Sept. 25, 2003. Corrie was run over and crushed to death by an Israeli army bulldozer on March 16, 2003, while she was trying to stop it from tearing down a building in the Rafah refugee camp, witnesses said. (AP Photo/Hussein Hussein, HO)

"Yasser, this picture is SOOOO lovely, and she's wearing the same diaper on her head that we buried her in..."

That girl was an idiot and her death was nothing more than mother nature throwing a little chlorine into the gene pool to stop her from breeding more idiots.

[ArmoredDov_D9]

Lately on this forum goes hot discussion about Palestnian-Israeli conflict, but we have here only a Israeli view on that matter so...if you are Palestinian and you want add something from yourself plz do it, and don't afraid or whathever most people here is open minded and want hear your 2 cents.
Thanksyes and we have also heard alot of the european view...

Yes in fact I would much more respect a Palestinians opinion then some of you who sprout your opinions from your safe houses back in Europe or in Canada.

It would actually be a very constructive debate. I am all for it.

Yes, but I think most palestinians are in your concentration camps since 1949

LIER! This blood libel is outragous!
We never put the Palestinian in concentration camps!!! Hell, do you know what you are talking about or you are just queting antisemite propoganda?

There are refugees camps for Palestinians all OVER the ARAB world, including: Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Iraq, Saudi Arabia etc.
They all were built by the Arab, not by the "Elders of Zion". The refugees camps in the West Bank were built by Jordan (Israel took the WB only at 1967) and in the Gaza Strip by Egypt (Israel took the strip only at 1967) and they are NOT concentration camps!

No you call them Refugee camps.

Refugee camps were built by the Arabs. Please explain to me how Israel is guilty in the refugee camps in Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Jordan and Egypt. How exactly did Israel built them?

BTW - do you know that Arfat got billions of dollar from the US, UN and EU to dismantle the refugee camps in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip? Do you want to go what Arafat did with those funds? Ask the International Munitary Fund ( http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3845 ).

And moreover, refugees camp are very different from concentration camps, very different. So spare us the falsey propoganda. Here's the fact, deal with them.

[A$$MAN]

Rachel Corrie was a member of the International Solidariy Movement, which has aided and abetted terrorists in the past and never condemned those actions.She was UNARMED and my fellow Americans were using a BULLHORN pleading the bulldozer to stop. And the bulldozer didn't come up to the house at a perfect angle and not see a group of American protesters standing in front of the house in which the Israelis destroyed. That's a ridiculous arguement, "I didn't see twenty protesters and didn't hear a bullhorn."

I am curious why Rachel Corrie supporters fail to mention that dozens of American citizens are killed each year in Israel during Palestinian terrorist attacks. I'm not talking about the Palestinians, I'm asking YOU, an ISRAELI, why MURDER an American.

[ArmoredDov_D9]

Rachel Corrie was a member of the International Solidariy Movement, which has aided and abetted terrorists in the past and never condemned those actions.She was UNARMED and my fellow Americans were using a BULLHORN pleading the bulldozer to stop. And the bulldozer didn't come up to the house at a perfect angle and not see a group of American protesters standing in front of the house in which the Israelis destroyed. That's a ridiculous arguement, "I didn't see twenty protesters and didn't hear a bullhorn."

I am curious why Rachel Corrie supporters fail to mention that dozens of American citizens are killed each year in Israel during Palestinian terrorist attacks. I'm not talking about the Palestinians, I'm asking YOU, an ISRAELI, why MURDER an American.

1. When Rachel was hurt she was apart from the other protesters and didn't held the bullhorn.

2. The bulldozer driver didn't see her. It doesn't matter if you are armed or not, when you run between the dead spot of heavy bulldozer clearing out shrubbery and debris... there will be troubles, and accidents are likely to occure. And accident did happen.

3. We didn't murder her. She acted recklessly and foolishly and jumped in front of a hugh dozer who didn't see her and accidently moved a debris that struck her head.

[Seraphim]

I'm not talking about the Palestinians, I'm asking YOU, an ISRAELI, why MURDER an American.

Was he at the controls of the bulldozer? No

[IDFM203]

I'm not talking about the Palestinians, I'm asking YOU, an ISRAELI, why MURDER an American.

Was he at the controls of the bulldozer? No

oh and also he(starvingstudent47.......go read his profile,he is from Eugene, OR, USA)is not ISRAELI but he is an AMERICAN!!!

thats much more then you can say for her....
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg

[StarvingStudent47]

I'm not talking about the Palestinians, I'm asking YOU, an ISRAELI, why MURDER an American.

Look under my name. See where I'm from. I'm born and raised in the US of A. I eat bacon cheeseburgers. I speak one language, and that's English. I'm just speaking up for one of our allies. If Rachel Corrie was in Britain, as part of a group that aids IRA bombers, I'd be just as unconcerned about her death.

American citizenship does not make someone any less guilty when they are part of an organization that aids and abets terrorism.

[A$$MAN]

1. When Rachel was hurt she was apart from the other protesters and didn't held the bullhorn. That's a lie and you know it. Ive seen the video. The American protesters including Rachel where in a group with another American using a bullhorn.
HURT you guys severed her spinal and crushed most of her backbones.


2. The bulldozer driver didn't see her. It doesn't matter if you are armed or not, when you run between the dead spot of heavy bulldozer clearing out shrubbery and debris... Again, twisted. She stood there and was not running, chanting for the bulldozer to stop.


We didn't murder her. She acted recklessly and foolishly and jumped in front of a hugh dozer who didn't see her and accidently moved a debris that struck her head. And Israel didn't act recklessly...
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/16/rafah.death/index.html
Notice the "debris", then notice how the Israelis bulldozed her into the ground.

[One?]

cool so peace activists are terrorists now? So what does corrie do? Oh wait a minute I think she's the one that makes the bombs, yup she's the one.

I say we let those palestinians die, because they dont deserve to live, and everyone that tries to help prevent their death should be called a terrorist.

[A$$MAN]

I'm not talking about the Palestinians, I'm asking YOU, an ISRAELI, why MURDER an American.

Look under my name. See where I'm from. I'm born and raised in the US of A. I eat bacon cheeseburgers. I speak one language, and that's English. I'm just speaking up for one of our allies. If Rachel Corrie was in Britain, as part of a group that aids IRA bombers, I'd be just as unconcerned about her death.

American citizenship does not make someone any less guilty when they are part of an organization that aids and abets terrorism.
HOLD ON. Likening an UNARMED American to an IRA bomber is an excellent example of stupidity.
Did she bomb a bus or a bulldozer? Did she strap a packful of explosive on her back? I'll denounce the cowards who use violence as means to settle disputes. But not the nonviolent peaceful demonstrator. If you are an American where's the justice in Rachel's murder.
And sorry for calling an Israeli, I forgot to look over to Avatar.

[IDFM203]

You know “peace” activist is a bit of a fallacy.. Here if she is that in your eyes then I will say it this way.

That peace soldier was there going after a murderer or his house that was being used to murder people and it was that murderer protector who stood in the way thus if successful in preventing the destruction of that house, that house will now be used to murder more people or more homicide bombers will kill more with out any fear of retribution.

oh and agian, this girl was an american?!? did she consider herself one?!?
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg

[ArmoredDov_D9]

That's a lie and you know it. Ive seen the video. The American protesters including Rachel where in a group with another American using a bullhorn.
HURT you guys severed her spinal and crushed most of her backbones.

The video from the incident were broadcast in prime-time TV show. It is clearly seen that Corrie was seperate from the others. It is also seen that the bulldozer shovel is full with dirt and rubbles.

An autopsy of Rachel’s corpse approves the above:


Israel’s Judge Advocate’s Office investigated the incident and concluded that the driver of the bulldozer never saw or heard Corrie because she was standing behind debris that obstructed the view of the driver whose field of view was limited by the small armored windows of his cab. An autopsy found that the cause of Corrie’s death was falling debris. (Jerusalem Post, June 26, 2003).



Again, twisted. She stood there and was not running, chanting for the bulldozer to stop.

Hell, God knows what she did there. "Ran" is sort of speak, don't take it literally. Some eyewitness claimed she "sat in front of the bulldozer" (Richaard), others claimed she "was kneeling" and those accounts contradict each others.
Now, you said she yelled... Well, when you are inside of a D9 dozer in work you can't here people shouts. Do you know how much noise the engine makes?


Having spent a fair amount of time around armoured vehicles, however, I'm not convinced [Corrie's megaphone] would have made much difference. IDF bulldozers--in this case a Caterpillar D9--are large, noisy and heavily armoured, and the driver is probably wearing hearing protection against the engine noise; you'd probably need Nigel Tufnel's custom amps to make yourself heard inside the cab from outside. Moreover, the view from the cab is severely restricted...The most plausible scenario, to my mind, is that the driver advanced slowly, expecting Ms. Corrie to chicken out in time; she lost her footing and in doing so was lost to the driver's view. Assuming she'd gotten out of the way, he continued moving forward, with fatal results.

Source: http://www.blarg.net/~minsq/NCArchive/00000019.htm


Notice the "debris", then notice how the Israelis bulldozed her into the ground.
I saw the pictures. Corrie seems pretty well for a person that claimed to be crushed under 70 tons bulldozer. Let me show you how Rachel supposed to look if the bulldozer did ran over her:
http://www.political-comedy-central.com/mil/military-1%202.jpg
She was looking excatly like the jeep in the picture.

[ArmoredDov_D9]

You know “peace” activist is a bit of a fallacy.. Here if she is that in your eyes then I will say it this way.

That peace soldier was there going after a murderer or his house that was being used to murder people and it was that murderer protector who stood in the way thus if successful in preventing the destruction of that house, that house will now be used to murder more people or more homicide bombers will kill more with out any fear of retribution.

oh and agian, this girl was an american?!? did she consider herself one?!?
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg
http://www.honestreporting.com/graphics/articles/corrie.jpg

Why dealing with minors?


Islamic Jihad terrorist was arrested at ISM offices in Jenin
http://www.idf.il/english/announcements/2003/march/27z.stm


March 27, 2003
Shadi Soukia, a Senior Member of the Islamic Jihad in Jenin was Arrested in the Offices of the International Soldiarity Movement
Shadi Soukia, a senior member of the Islamic Jihad in Jenin and who was involved in the planning of several suicide attacks that were thwarted by security forces was arrested in the course of IDF operations in Jenin when he was hiding in the offices of the International Solidarity Movement (ISM).

Acting on intelligence information that a terrorist was hiding in a compound in which a building is used by international organizations (the Red Cross, Doctors Without Borders, and the International Soldiarity Movement) in Jenin, IDF forces, in the evening hours, searched the compound. During the course of the search, the wanted terrorist's accomplice gave himself up and two Kalashnikov rifles were found.

The terrorist was arrested as he hid in the offices of the International Solidarity Movement (ISM). Two foreign activists of the ISM organization tried to assist the wanted terrorist in evading IDF forces. A pistol was found in close proximity.

This is not the first time that terrorists make use of compound and properties of international and humanitarian organizations in the framework of terrorist activity, and particularly to hide from security forces.

Terrorists place the organizations, their workers and property in danger and hamper their ability to carry out humanitarian activities.

Shadi Soukia, born in 1983, single, and a resident of Jenin, is one of the senior Islamic Jihad activists in Jenin. He was involved in the preparation and targeting of several suicide bombing attacks that were thwarted by security services, including, the recruitment and preparation of a suicide bomber in September 2002 who planned to carry out and attack a bus in northern Israel, planning of a suicide attack in October 2002, and the planning of a suicide attack using a suitcase bomb in February 2003. Moreover, Sukia was involved in laying explosive devices and numerous shooting attacks against security forces and Israeli communities in the area.

[StarvingStudent47]

cool so peace activists are terrorists now? So what does corrie do? Oh wait a minute I think she's the one that makes the bombs, yup she's the one.

I say we let those palestinians die, because they dont deserve to live, and everyone that tries to help prevent their death should be called a terrorist.


HOLD ON. Likening an UNARMED American to an IRA bomber is an excellent example of stupidity.
Did she bomb a bus or a bulldozer? Did she strap a packful of explosive on her back? I'll denounce the cowards who use violence as means to settle disputes. But not the nonviolent peaceful demonstrator. If you are an American where's the justice in Rachel's murder.
And sorry for calling an Israeli, I forgot to look over to Avatar.

Read my post again. I didn't say that she WAS a bomber. I said her organization AIDS them. International Solidarity Movement are not actively terrorists, but they actively harbor them. Some people (most notably Pres Bush) believe that no distinction should be made between terrorists and those who harbor them. It is that reasoning that allows me to condemn ISM and their agents, including Rachel Corrie. I am not condemning all Palestinians (shoot, Rachel Corrie isn't a Palestinian to begin with). I am condemning those who harbor terrorists and indoctrinate young children with hate. That is what Rachel Corrie was actively doing.

[Adri]

tips to you all:

don`t post replies.... and sudenly they can sitt there talking about how good they`re post is, and how much you lie...
(wich is just bull**** cause you dont lie/know fore sure *lie*)

[One?]

American's opposing the Vietnam war burnt the american flag. SO just because she burnt the flag doesn't mean she is not an american. And why the hell are we arguing if she is american or not?


Isn't she a human? YOU JUSTIFY KILLING HUMANS OPPOSING WAR?

[Fargin]

This is getting a tad emotional for me.

[Argyll]

Hell yes Jane Fonda went to Vietnam and burned the flag,and posed on AAA weapons,but I'll bet you all watched her in "Barberella"!!?
There are plenty of Americans who burnt the flags ,it just means that they are against that Governments Policies,and will not support it I guess!
But burning a flag does not immediately make you a non American or does it?
Being a Patriot means a lot to some folks,but being state puppets mean the same to lots of them too!

[IDFM203]

Isn't she a human? YOU JUSTIFY KILLING HUMANS OPPOSING WAR?No, I justify the killings of people who help out murderers.

You know there is a famous saying” the getaway driver is as complicit as the bank robber” meaning that not only the one who commits the actual deed is guilty but so are those that help them.

I will repost my last post to further my point…..” You know “peace” activist is a bit of a fallacy.. Here if she is that in your eyes then I will say it this way.

That peace soldier was there with his peacedozer going after a murderer or his house that was being used to murder people and it was that murderer protector (Rachel corrie) who stood in the way, thus if successful in preventing the destruction of that house, that house will now be used to murder more people or more homicide bombers will kill more with out any fear of retribution.”

[warchild1/27scout]

if she was over there in the west bank protecting terrorists she should die. she is not an american anymore. if you bleeding heart libs arent part of the solution youre part of the problem. everybody's so afraid that they are gonna get the first amendment card pulled on theem they don't call these people what they are. they are traiters. we are at war with terrorists if you have sympathy for terrorists and act on it you are a traiter. it pisses me off they hide behind our countries laws so they can sit back and trash it. other than that have a good day :)

[One?]

Retribution? I seriously have to laugh at that. You think they will ever stop??? Its been going on for 50 years and it will go on for another 50 years. Wether you destroy his home or not you will always have bombers, you cannot stop them even with your highest security (as the case was a couple weeks ago).

As long as Israelis kill palestinian children the other side has to suffer the same consequences. And suicide bombings are the only tool that the palestinians have. They do not have state of the art tanks or planes but they have mobile bombs.

So if she was standing infront of a house trying to protect the old lady and her kids from living in a camp or on the street, that makes her a terrorist. But you know what, when you destroy that house, his son will grow up to hold a gun or strap a bomb on himself to avenge his father's death.

And building the new berlin wall will not stop them either. You treat palestinians the same way hitler treated the jews. You beat them, torture them, destroy their homes etc.. Maybe the only difference is that israeli's did not activate the "final solution", concentration camps that is. Although some poeple on this forum have suggested "killing them all".

This isn't new to me (the hatered). And I know what the zionist doctrine is all about I know that Israel has no borders and I know that the flag represents the 2 rivers. And if you tell me that you don't believe israel should be the land between the nile and the euphrates then you are lying to yourself. You know that you don't want any arab in palestine, wether they are muslim or christian because they will only disturb the expansion of the state.

[baimer]

You know that you don't want any arab in palestine, wether they are muslim or christian because they will only disturb the expansion of the state.
Want or don't want it doesn't matter. 17% of israeli population are palestinian arabs, ~80% of them are muslim. They live in Israel and never will leave for Palestine or for any other arab country. Despite the fact that they aren't treated as equals in israel society (after 55 years of standoff between jews and arabs it's quite understandable).
You really think that we (the jews) are ready to give up on 1.5 million tax payers? :lol:

[S'13]

Retribution? I seriously have to laugh at that. You think they will ever stop??? Its been going on for 50 years and it will go on for another 50 years. Wether you destroy his home or not you will always have bombers, you cannot stop them even with your highest security (as the case was a couple weeks ago).

As long as Israelis kill palestinian children the other side has to suffer the same consequences. And suicide bombings are the only tool that the palestinians have. They do not have state of the art tanks or planes but they have mobile bombs.

So if she was standing infront of a house trying to protect the old lady and her kids from living in a camp or on the street, that makes her a terrorist. But you know what, when you destroy that house, his son will grow up to hold a gun or strap a bomb on himself to avenge his father's death.

And building the new berlin wall will not stop them either. You treat palestinians the same way hitler treated the jews. You beat them, torture them, destroy their homes etc.. Maybe the only difference is that israeli's did not activate the "final solution", concentration camps that is. Although some poeple on this forum have suggested "killing them all".

This isn't new to me (the hatered). And I know what the zionist doctrine is all about I know that Israel has no borders and I know that the flag represents the 2 rivers. And if you tell me that you don't believe israel should be the land between the nile and the euphrates then you are lying to yourself. You know that you don't want any arab in palestine, wether they are muslim or christian because they will only disturb the expansion of the state.


First of all, if you look in the history books you will see that it was the Arabs who wanted to annihilate Israel back in 1948, 1956, 1967 and 1973. The Arabs never acknowledged Israels existence. Terror has been used by Arabs since before Israels existence till this day and not only since the Six Day War and the Occupation. Using the Holocaust in Arab propaganda isn't new and isn't worthy of a response.
I belive the Palestinians should get a state but only as part of a peace agreement. But as long as they continue with there terror campaign this will not happen. The Arabs should understand they will get nothing by blowing up buses and Café's. The Palestinians should learn from there Egyption brothers who got land back not by war but by a peace agreement. By the way, the flag represents the crossing of the red sea in the time of the Exodus out of Egypt. Saying we want to expand our borders is very hypocritical, after all the Arabs are the bigest Imperialists that ever lived by taken over the whole Med east (in the time of H'alif Omar) when they are originally from Saudi Arabia. Who hasn't heard of the Arab dream of Greater Palestine (from the Galilee in the north to the Negev in the south). And lets not forget throwing the Jews into the Mediterranean. As for Rachel Corrie, she was protecting a house used by Arab terrorists. The IDF doesn't just destroy houses for no reason. And if what you said about Israeli policy towards the Arabs was true, there wouldn't be any Arabs left to blow themselfs up on Israels streets.

[One?]

We can go back in hitory I can take you back the days of prophet Mohamed ands how you who started betraying and fighting who. If you go back to the battle of the trenches the Muslims were betrayed by the Jews. Although they helped them at one point in time. The Jews decided to betray (well actualy not all of them but one tribe pursuaded the others.) So ever since that day when the Jews betrayed the muslims the love affair vanished.


"There is no such thing as a Palestinian people... It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn't exist." -- Golda Meir Statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.


"We shall try to spirit the penniless population across the border by procuring employment for it in the transit countries,while denying it any employment in our own country .... expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly." -- Theodore Herzl (from Rafael Patai, Ed. The Complete Diaries of Theodore Herzl, Vol I)


need more?

[EvanL]

http://www.luhring-design.com/photography/series/shut-up/shut-up-statement.jpg

http://ungido.org/palestine_israel_flag.jpg

[One?]

Evan you can only shut up for so long but when things are taken too far then you should talk.

[EvanL]

It wasnt directed at you alone man dont worry.

[JiJoMacLE45]

TYR, you know I luv ya and respect your opinion bro, but just b/c Rachel Corrie was an American does not make her incapable of being an idiot. She's one of the dozens of Americans who have lost their lives in this fighting, most of whom have lost their lives at the hands of Palestinian terrorists. How come their stories are never told? Where are the rallies in support of bringing their killers to justice? College students in night clubs, tourists sitting in a cafe drinking coffee, families on a bus while in country visiting relatives, and in an instant, their futures are extinguished. They are as much victims of terrorism as those we lost on September 11th. Rachel Corrie willingly and knowingly put herself in the path of that bulldozer and by doing so accepted the risk that came with it. I wouldn't waste my sympathy on someone who seals their own fate. Save it for the real victims.

[baimer]

"There is no such thing as a Palestinian people... It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn't exist." -- Golda Meir Statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.

on March 31, 1977, the Dutch newspaper Trouw published an interview with PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein. Here's what he said:


The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.

For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.

[One?]

"There is no such thing as a Palestinian people... It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn't exist." -- Golda Meir Statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.

on March 31, 1977, the Dutch newspaper Trouw published an interview with PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein. Here's what he said:


The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.

For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.


An average person with no knowledge would believe this crap. The PLO does not represent me as an Arab or all of palestine they represent some palestinians. But the state of Israel was born on Zionism, and Zahir Mohsin is not the Prime Minister of Palestine but Golda Meir was the PM of Israel. Also Golda Meir said arabs do not exist in 69 while Mohsin said what he said in 77. So technicaly he said it after Meir's comment. Clearly the zionists started it first.



And the Arab countries invaded Israel due to the zionist doctrine wich called for kicking out all the arabs from palestine. I can sit here and list hundreds of quotes from Herzl's diaries, and other leading zionists that call for killing arabs and kicking them out.

[S'13]

We can go back in hitory I can take you back the days of prophet Mohamed ands how you who started betraying and fighting who. If you go back to the battle of the trenches the Muslims were betrayed by the Jews. Although they helped them at one point in time. The Jews decided to betray (well actualy not all of them but one tribe pursuaded the others.) So ever since that day when the Jews betrayed the muslims the love affair vanished.

After the Arabs creatrd there great empire which stretched from the Atlantic coast in Africa to the Indus river, they wanted to change society and enforce Islam. This they did the same way they built there empire... with force. This was because everywhere they went the Arab armies met Christian and Jewish communitys which were well established. The Arabs couldn't ignore these communitys or come to terms with there existence and tried to convert them to Islam, many of the Jews and Christians refused. This is one reason for the Arabs hate of the Jews and Christians.
The second reason was Muhameds own conflicts with the Jewish tribes in Saudi Arabia. In the first years of Islam in Saudi Arabia Muhamed wanted to earn the support of the the Jewish tribes. The Jews rejected him since they didn't belive he was a profit. This led to a series of militery clashes between Muhameds growing army and the Jewish tribes. In the Beginning the Jewish tribes militry force posed a real threat to Muhameds Army and also to the future of Islam. As time went on the Arab armies had the upper hand and the conflict ended with a Jewish defeat and a massacre of the Jews. One of turning points in the conflict was a peace agreement between the Jews and the Arab Muslims. The agreement was signed for a period of ten years, however when the Arabs got strong enough to overpower the Jews and massacre them two years later they violated the one sided agreement. This act has been used by the Arabs to this very day in order to Justify the violation of agreements, and to justify Muslim terror. So please, I ask of you not to change historical facts.

[S'13]

And the Arab countries invaded Israel due to the zionist doctrine wich called for kicking out all the arabs from palestine. I can sit here and list hundreds of quotes from Herzl's diaries, and other leading zionists that call for killing arabs and kicking them

You know, reading this I don't know if I should cry or if I should laugh. The Arabs were those who rejected the UN Proposal of two states, one Arab and the other Jewish. While the Jews accepted it the Arabs were geting ready to throw the Jews into the sea and get them off "Muslim holy land". Herzl actually wanted to share the land with the Arabs, I know this from reading his books. I hope your not planing to take out quotes from "The Protocols of the Eldars of Zion". :|

[Spine]

if she was over there in the west bank protecting terrorists she should die. she is not an american anymore. if you bleeding heart libs arent part of the solution youre part of the problem. everybody's so afraid that they are gonna get the first amendment card pulled on theem they don't call these people what they are. they are traiters. we are at war with terrorists if you have sympathy for terrorists and act on it you are a traiter. it pisses me off they hide behind our countries laws so they can sit back and trash it. other than that have a good day :)

Haha, nice one. Learning how to spell is a good idea too.

[One?]

1) S13 no the Muslims did not hate the Christians infact when the Pagans wanted to kill the first muslims they went to africa (I cant remember the Kings name but he was christian). The King accepted them, and he let them live freely because when the muslims shared their beliefs with the christians they found out alot of similarities.

2) When the Persians invaded the Christians in what now is known as syria and lebanon the Mulsim helped them out. Why? Because they both believe in the same God, and they felt its their duty to help them.

3) The Muslims never wanted to kill Jews or Christians because they weren't allowed to. Since Muslims believe in the same prophets as the Jews and Christians they cannot kill them. While spreading the Empire the citizens on each country had the choice either to convert, fight, or just live peacefully. Some chose to convert, some chose to fight and the others chose to live peacefully. And examples would be the Christians all over the arab world.

4) The Muslims did no fear the arab tribes but they wanted to work with them. Because the Jews where the only ones that believed in God in that area. But the Jews hated the Muslims so they thought of a way to take them out. What they did was promise the Muslims that they will become their allies and in time of war they will help them out. Well when war came they JOINED the opposing army. When the muslims knew they were betrayed the started a war against them. And that was when Khaibar fell.

5) Don't try to make people think that Muslims hate the Christians, because they don't. There is more about the Virgin Mary in the Quran than you can find in the Bible.

So it was the Jews who started the betrayal and brought the war among themselves. (by that I don't mean today's war.)

---------------------------------------------


Herzl actually wanted to share the land with the Arabs

We shall try to spirit the penniless population across the border by procuring employment for it in the transit countries,while denying it any employment in our own country .... expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly." -- Theodore Herzl (from Rafael Patai, Ed. The Complete Diaries of Theodore Herzl, Vol I)


How exactly did he want to share the land?


[/b][/quote]

[S'13]

We shall try to spirit the penniless population across the border by procuring employment for it in the transit countries,while denying it any employment in our own country .... expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly." -- Theodore Herzl (from Rafael Patai, Ed. The Complete Diaries of Theodore Herzl, Vol I)


How exactly did he want to share the land?

Herzl wanted two states, one which would only be a Jewish state and the other would only be An Arab state. This is how he wanted to share the land, he didn't want Arabs to live in the Jewish state but to live in there own Arab state. This almost happened in 1948 but we all know what did happen in the end...

[S'13]

And the Arab countries invaded Israel due to the zionist doctrine wich called for kicking out all the arabs from palestine.

"In the midst of wanton aggression, we yet call upon the Arab inhabitants of the State of Israel to return to the ways of peace and play their part in the development of the State, with full and equalcitizenship and due representation in its bodies and institutions - provisional or permanent.

We offer peace and unity to all the neighboring states and their peoples, and invite them tocooperate with the independent Jewish nation for the common good of all." (Declaration of Israel's Independence 1948)

[One?]

He wanted to make two states by KICIKING OUT the arabs from the soon to be Jewish state.

[S'13]

He wanted to make two states by KICIKING OUT the arabs from the soon to be Jewish state.

Strange, I remember it was the Arabs who wanted to "kick out" the Jews, actully they wanted to extermanate them.

[perdurabo]

hey ppl you are all here want to end this conflict?
it dosen't metter who started the metter is who is going to end this!
I see 3solutions
1.Finally all ppl learn how to live in peace
2a.Jews kill all arabs
2b.Arabs kill all jews
3.let's nuke'em all
I'am for 1 but choice is yours men who live there only you can make it end!

[One?]

He wanted to make two states by KICIKING OUT the arabs from the soon to be Jewish state.

Strange, I remember it was the Arabs who wanted to "kick out" the Jews, actully they wanted to extermanate them.

Dude how hard is it. Now if your playing dumb its alright but how the hell did Herzl want to create 2 seperate states? If you have arabs inhabiting an area. And the jews want a piece of that area. What will they do? Are they gonna ask them nicely to get out of there so they can make their own country?

[S'13]

Dude how hard is it. Now if your playing dumb its alright but how the hell did Herzl want to create 2 seperate states? If you have arabs inhabiting an area. And the jews want a piece of that area. What will they do? Are they gonna ask them nicely to get out of there so they can make their own country?


The states were to be created according to the demography. where there were more Arabs then Jews there would be an Arab state and where there were more Jews then Arabs there would be a Jewish state. The Arabs in The Jewish state could turn into citizens or move (maybe even by force) to the Arab state, and the same thing with the Jews who lived in the Arab state. This was the UN Partition, but did the Arabs agree to it? not only did they want to throw all the Jews from there land, they wanted exterminate all of them. I hate to think what would have happened if the 5 Arab armies weren't deafeted. It would have been a second Holocaust only Instead of 6000,000 murdered Jews we would have 600,000.

[Adri]

question was "is there any palestinian browsing this forum"

the anwser is simple "no"

no lets follow the topic so every one say "NO" in sted of
"blah blah....and they did that....blah blah my father is stronger than your father ! blah blah"

[Golani68]

S13 no the Muslims did not hate the Christians

One
What year was all this
We are talking about the present

A saying I have heard on the streets of Jerusalem
First we come for you on saturday the Jews
and on sunday we get the Christians

Why is it the palestinian authority cannot stop the terrorist groups
or control its people from doing what they do cross border attacks
do they want to stop them

This is the key for the roadmap to peace
If the palestinian authority could show they are total control of they
people why would Israel have to attack

[Golani68]

S13 no the Muslims did not hate the Christians

One
What year was all this
We are talking about the present

A saying I have heard on the streets of Jerusalem
First we come for you on saturday the Jews
and on sunday we get the Christians

Why is it the palestinian authority cannot stop the terrorist groups
or control its people from doing what they do cross border attacks
do they want to stop them

This is the key for the roadmap to peace
If the palestinian authority could show they are total control of they
people why would Israel have to attack

[One?]

S13 no the Muslims did not hate the Christians

One
What year was all this
We are talking about the present

A saying I have heard on the streets of Jerusalem
First we come for you on saturday the Jews
and on sunday we get the Christians

Why is it the palestinian authority cannot stop the terrorist groups
or control its people from doing what they do cross border attacks
do they want to stop them

This is the key for the roadmap to peace
If the palestinian authority could show they are total control of they
people why would Israel have to attack




Come for the Christians on sunday? haahah that is realy funny.

Orthodox Christians (the ones found in palestine) have been fighting along side the muslims ever since the Crusades. Even till now the Christians still support the resistance, they don't go on suicide missions but they carry arms and fight. Priests helped the fighters during the seige. They gave them food and water. And during the seige everyone said they are doing so because they are under gunpoint. Well after the seiga was over they talked to more then one priest and they said they helped them because THEY wanted to.

I see what you are trying to do though. You are trying to get the christians to stand with you.

And if you read the whole thread you will know why I went back to the year 400.

You obviously don't know the facts about Islam other than what you hear on TV and what people tell you.


And Adri im an Arab.

[Golani68]

one
its true I have heard arabs say it myself

and I am not trying to make anyone stand with anyone

[Herrmannek]

Golani plz try to not post same post twice

[One?]

I think he posted twice by mistake (its been done before with these style of forums).

Golani do you speak arabic?

[Herrmannek]

I know it was mistake but happened few times, and Golanie please try don't refresh after submit nor push back and then push submit again. :)