5 SFG

[astur]

Afghanistan

http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0034.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0035.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0041.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0039.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0046.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0027.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0028.jpg

Irak

http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0016.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0032.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0031.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0030.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0043.jpg
http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0048.jpg


hood, do you want high-res versions for the albums?

[He219]

Nice Pic's!

woot

[Herrmannek]

Usage limit. ****

[DE_Six]

Awesome!! :D

[Herrmannek]

Great :)

[96B]

I cant see them!

[Herrmannek]

He has transfer limit so come back later :)

[NcDeuce]

Whoa, nice pics...the best SF Group there is!

[Trigger]

A W E S O M E ! !


hood, do you want high-res versions for the albums?
does a bear sh!t in the woods? woot

[hood]

Hey there. Great pictures. Most definitely on the high-res versions. You can email them to webmaster@militaryphotos.net and I'll post them. Can you give more info on who took the pictures and where you got them? Just so I don't step on any toes. Thanks.

[new zealander]

great pics

[butkus]

agree with everyone else. great pics!

[Red]

nice pics weird to see a black guy in the 5th group,i did not know that they were black guys in the Special operations community in the US

[Seraphim]

nice pics weird to see a black guy in the 5th group,i did not know that they were black guys in the Special operations community in the US

Are you a racist or just plain ignorant?

[Red]

no i am actually not a racist, i was just curious because i have browsed through a lot of pics of special operations soldiers and i am yet to see a black man.

[Dennis G]

Great Photos

my Favs

http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0027.jpg


http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0028.jpg



http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0030.jpg

[HumanShield]

Afghanistan

http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0041.jpg



Got to love the guy in the middle. 1000 mile stare...

[JiJoMacLE45]

Welcome aboard Astur, great pictures.

Is it me or does the EOD guy look like Chester Bennington. What is it w/ me and celeb refs these days.

[Jack Mehoff]

nice pics weird to see a black guy in the 5th group,i did not know that they were black guys in the Special operations community in the US
You been smoking dope again son?

:roll:

[Red]

i did not mean to stir up controversy it is just that i felt that the blacks in the millitary did the cooking and administrative jobs,while the caucasians did the fighting and special operations things.It is evidenced by the pictures hosted on this site which show that all the special operations soldiers are white.i just want an answer, are there blacks in the special operations community?yes or no

[Tman]

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3d708b3127cce8f177ab515020000001610

20SF (ARNG) Afgan 2002
Note racial makeup.

[Red]

thank you now you have cleared up the doubt in my mind.i am learning new things everyday

[EvanL]

Ohh my god! An L.A. street gang. haha jk.
The army actively tries to recruit non whites into the SF's because especially hispanics can blend in better in the mideast than whites.

[Red]

i know but hispanics are classified as white

[Ratamacue]

Uh, no they're not.

[Red]

yes they are, there are bascially white but my real thing has to do more with the blacks.after this picture put up,i now believe that there are a little number of blacks in the special operations community

[ibstolidude]

http://members.fortunecity.com/astur/5THSFG0034.jpg

HK/Benelli M4 Super 90
love that shotgun!

go-go howitzer man.

[Fargin]

Got to love the guy in the middle. 1000 mile stare...

Actually looks more like the .001 stare to me. ;)

[JiJoMacLE45]

Are you out of your f*cking gord bendejho! :roll: ?

[Red]

no i dont want the older guys on this board to hate me, but at the same time i just wanted stuff clarified and tman did that for me,now there is no need to swear i understand ure discomfort with the subject matter and i will immediately drop it for the greater good of the forum.

[Ratamacue]

...i will immediately drop it for the greater good of the forum

Wow, you're so noble.

[Red]

thank you sir, and you are most gracious

[Jack Mehoff]

i did not mean to stir up controversy it is just that i felt that the blacks in the millitary did the cooking and administrative jobs,while the caucasians did the fighting and special operations things.It is evidenced by the pictures hosted on this site which show that all the special operations soldiers are white.i just want an answer, are there blacks in the special operations community?yes or no

This is a VOLUNTEER military. If they only FORCE/DRAFT white people to fight in a war then you can complain, but that never happen. Why are you complaining who doing what in a VOLUNTEER military? If you complain why blacks are over represented during Vietnam War then thats the difference story. We all know there were way too many blacks got drafted during Vietnam War.

How many special operation pictures you seen so far because I know there aren't many? I recommend you to join the REAL military to learn it yourself. Making concluded judgement over a few pictures deserve to get your ass :bash:

[Operation Ivy]

Nice pics!! :D


Benibo ur giving Maryland a bad name so i say u keep it on the down low :P

[Jack Mehoff]

i know but hispanics are classified as white


http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/avatar.php?userid=1769&dateline=1063874780 Good god, reading your post make me drop a few points on the IQ test. Yes, there is option Hispanic on the race survey :bash:

[Red]

I am sorry if i offended any of you i was narrowminded and should not have asked the question in the first place.

[NcDeuce]

Yeah dude, lots of minorities in Special Operations.

[Red]

thank you for the carification

[budanski]

"I think you guys were a little hard on the beav..."

[GLax]

heres some numbers on the diversity of the US Army according to the Soldiers almanacs from 2001-2002, srry but it doesnt break it down into which jobs each group occupies the most...

2001
Whites 58.7%
Blacks 26.4%
Hispanics 8.1%
other 6.8%

2002
Whites 58.4%
Blacks 26.4%
Hispanics 8.3%
other 6.9%

i think these numbers show that a more and more diverse community is trying to take advantage of the Army's (and military in general) college oppurtunites like the GI bill and College fund, nothin wrong with that. i dunno about the whole Vietnam thing, my uncle was there and i asked him about it one day and he said there were still 5 white guys to every black guy. but it coulda just been his unit (101st Airborne) and hispanics are their own ethnic group, theyre a mix between Spanish Europeans and Indian tribes of South America...

[Red]

cool

[HumanShield]

i did not mean to stir up controversy it is just that i felt that the blacks in the millitary did the cooking and administrative jobs,while the caucasians did the fighting and special operations things.It is evidenced by the pictures hosted on this site which show that all the special operations soldiers are white.i just want an answer, are there blacks in the special operations community?yes or no


wow....
and yes....

[MEGR]

I cant see the pics.. any other way to present them?

[budanski]

Have you tried emptying your browser cache?

[Vance]

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/gulf_war_2_iraqi_freedom_army_special_forces/ussf35

He looks black to me...

[96B]

In the photo section of "Inside Delta Force" there is a black guy in the 1982 picture of B Squadron.

I have yet to see the pictures because of the usage limit!

[Jack Mehoff]

Some people said there aren't too many blacks in the Navy Seal is because they can't swim. I still don't get it. What is skin color have anything to do with buoyancy? Maybe their "package" is too heavy and drag them down under the water :D All you need is a lot of endurance to be a good swimmer and black people got plenty of that, on the average anyway.

One thing I know for sure is those damn Puerto Rico dudes in basic training are awesome runners.

[MEGR]

"Have you tried emptying your browser cache?"

How do i do that??

[GLax]

i agree with you Mr tane Angel,in that there is an acute shortage of blacks in SOCCOM,and the reason in my opinion is bad publicity.In the black community Special operations guys are viewed as rednecks from the south who just wanna do some crazy stuff but we all know thats not true.The Special operations community needs to step up its advertising campaign to show the black folks that this is not a red neck association.I know many blacks who would love to join but have so many mis conceptions.Most people think that blacks are just liberals who r lazy but i can tell you there are a whole lot who can serve this nation proud all that needs to be done is for them to get good accurate information on what they can do for their country, not what their country can do for them.

just because they have mis conceptions doesnt mean the Army isnt advertising rite. if they think theyre a bunch of hill billy rednecks without ever giving it a try then its their own fault. it is after all an all volunteer force, i dont think the Army is gonna turn down a volunteer cuz he is black or hispanic or whatever. you can show somebody all the cool jobs there are in the Army, and all the oppurtunites there are, but its up to him/her to defeat his own worries about rednecks and hicks... hey, i'm a redneck, i work on a farm with cows and shoot squirels cuz its fun, you dont have to be scared of me, i'll jump in a foxhole with any American, cuz bottom line, we're all Americans :hug:

[hood]

Well, as someone who's always looking to put more pics up, I've noticed the same thing that benibo did. Independent of how many blacks there are in SF, they're not taking and putting out pictures of them. From all the ones in Afghanistan, I didn't see a single one. In Iraq there finally were a couple. Dunno... here's the only 2 I've found however.

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/gulf_war_2_iraqi_freedom_army_special_forces/ussf35

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/gulf_war_2_iraqi_freedom_army_special_forces/aah

[FallenAngel]

The reason why there are so few black in ANY SF units 9Army, Navy, Marine, etc.) is because-- for some God-only-knows-reason-- they can't swim too well, and since swimming is a crucial part of being a member of SF....well, draw your own conclusion.

[superpeltor]

I think there is simply less black people in population which cause less people in military. Same goes for other races as well.

Good day!

[Herrmannek]

Everyone can swim, but some just don't know that :)

[Argyll]

Try looking in the Photos section there are coloured SF try looking in the Philippines section ;)

[Steve Andrews]

What's the truck with the grenade launcher? Pinzgauer?

[GRENDEL X]

To answer your question YES! There are all kinds of ethnic individuals in MI/SF. What world do you come from??? And yes we can swim! matter of fact I've been surfing for over 20yrs.

[Trigger]

there is an acute shortage of blacks in SOCCOM,and the reason in my opinion is bad publicity
I have to disagree. It's called an all volunteer force for a reason. If they (blacks/minorities) don't volunteer or can't perform to the required standards, then so be it. If they CHOOSE not to try out for those positions, then so be it. Yes it's always better to have people that can blend in better in different regions of the world, but to say that we need to have X number of this race in these positions or it 'looks' bad is extremely foolish. As long as they are getting the job done I don't care if they're green :D

[96B]

If somebody doesnt hurry up and send in the pictures to Hood I am going to start ******ly molesting people...

[Marshall]

If somebody doesnt hurry up and send in the pictures to Hood I am going to start ******ly molesting people...

Please start with benibo.

:hug:

[NcDeuce]

I used to think they there were only a handful of black Special Forces and Rangers guys and I asked my dad about it one day and he said that it's starting to get better. Since then, I've seen and talked to a few black SF dudes.

And yeah that swimming thing, here in the south you have tons of racist jokes like "Oh, Blacks are afraid of water". Well, I have no opinion on this statement, lol, it's just stupid. Besides I heard that they have scrapped the swimming qualifications for getting into SF due to its difficulty and the need for SF personnel.

[Trigger]

Great. Next they'll do away with that obsolete obstacle course thingy because there aren't enough fat guys in SF. That'll make it all 'better'. :cantbeli:

[Wildc@rd]

Guys,
The images are not available at this moment. Hood/Guys can you post the pics again? Are there any hi-res on those Astur posted?

regards,
Wildcard

[Jack Mehoff]

Great. Next they'll do away with that obsolete obstacle course thingy because there aren't enough fat guys in SF. That'll make it all 'better'. :cantbeli:

I don't know dude. A buddy of mine just went to Ft Bragg for Q-Course and he said only something 30% of all the trainees made it through Q-Course

[NcDeuce]

Back in the 80s, it was about 3%.

[Jack Mehoff]

Back in the 80s, it was about 3%.

I doubt it. Got any source? Not that long ago you can go to Selection and Q-Course right after basic and AIT. Now, you have to serve minimum amount of time in your assigned unit and have to obtain the rank of E-4. My buddy went in as an E-4(Corporal) and he was a 11C with the 82nd Abn

Note: the Green Beret song isn't a source either.

[Dmitri]

How do people drop out of the Q course? I thought that SFAS was the main washout course, and once you've proven that you got what it takes, they actually WANT you to pass... Anybody?

[MVSpartan117]

I really wanna see these pics!

[Seoulstriker]

Back in the 80s, it was about 3%.

I doubt it. Got any source? Not that long ago you can go to Selection and Q-Course right after basic and AIT. Now, you have to serve minimum amount of time in your assigned unit and have to obtain the rank of E-4. My buddy went in as an E-4(Corporal) and he was a 11C with the 82nd Abn

Note: the Green Beret song isn't a source either.

Jack Me Off, what is the Q-Course?

[NcDeuce]

I can't find any good articles which have the statistics from the 1980s, 90s, and so on. But here are a few new articles that have statistics on today's failure rates. They may not help but they have good information.

Until relatively recently, one could not enlist into the Special Forces. One had to be in the rank of E-4 to E-7 (for enlisted members) just to apply. That's still the requirement for those who are already in the service that want to apply for Special Forces. However, in the past year or two, the Army initiated the 18X (Special Forces) Enlistment Program.

Under this program, an applicant will be trained as an Infantry (11B) Soldier, then sent to jump school (parachute training). He will then be guaranteed the opportunity to TRY OUT for Special Forces. This means he will have to complete the Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS) program, which has a very high wash-out rate, even for experienced soldiers. If, by some chance, the wet-behind-the-ears recruit can make it through SFAS, he must graduate the Special Forces Qualification Course, which (depending on the exact Special Forces Job he is training for) is between 24 and 57 weeks long.

Finally, he must learn a foreign language at the Defense Language Institute. Depending on language, this training can take up to a year. If he fails any part of this training & selection process, he is immediately reclassified as an 11B Infantry.

And a little known secret: The Army knows that the vast majority of those who sign up on the 18X Special Forces Enlistment Program will fail. However, lots of young high-school recruits walk into the Army Recruiting Office and want to be the next "Rambo." The 18X programs gives the Army a fairly significant pool of "volunteers" who will ultimately become Infantry Troops.



Army Lt. Col. Marvin Meek, professor and chairman of military science, agrees that Special Forces candidates are a rare breed.

Out of the 140-some cadets that he oversees, only 20 are seriously thinking about the Special Forces.

“All 20 of them are extremely patriotic, all 20 of them have a feeling of service to something greater than them, in other words serving their country … as do all of our people who are commissioned,” Meek said. “But they want to do it to a greater degree, in an environment that is more extreme, that is more challenging and that is more rewarding.”



One-third or fewer of the soldiers and sailors who enter Army Green Beret and Navy SEAL selection programs graduate. At the Air Force special-operations indoctrination course, called "Superman School," about 10 percent finish.



Failure rates for blacks and Latinos have risen in recent years at Navy SEAL and Army Special Forces schools, military records show. The Air Force doesn' t track students' race in its air commando training.

During six of the past seven years, the graduation rate of blacks in SEAL training has been one-third to one-half that of white sailors, while the Latino graduation rate largely has been a few percentage points less than the rate for whites.

But percentages are just one measure. Over the past seven years, 1,133 whites completed SEAL training, compared with 20 blacks and 103 Latinos.

Often, a class will start with only one or two black trainees.

With so few blacks attempting SEAL training, retired Navy SEAL Capt. Everett Greene noted that most African-Americans have no role models or cohorts during training.

Several minority officers said black men often do their best when they can bond with other blacks in school, social or work settings.

Without that companionship or bond, Greene added, "the ones and twos become zeros very quick."

At Fort Bragg, N.C., where the Army trains Green Berets, black graduation rates have been slightly higher than those of whites for two of the past three years for the initial Green Beret training, the 24-day Special Forces Assessment and Selection course.

But the story is very different during the longer, follow-up Special Forces Qualification Course, known as the "Q course," where prospective Green Berets learn skills like blowing up bridges, firing a mortar or treating wounds.

Blacks fared much worse than whites, Latinos and other minority groups.

Between 1997 and 1999, about 53 percent of African-Americans who earlier completed the assessment course passed the follow-up Q course, compared with 71 percent of whites and 62 percent of Latinos.

[Dmitri]

I still don't see why so many fail the Q course. The instructors, or so I heard, are not really suppose to keep testing your abilities so hard after SFAS.

[Ichhabe]

To answer your question YES! There are all kinds of ethnic individuals in MI/SF. What world do you come from??? And yes we can swim! matter of fact I've been surfing for over 20yrs.

Technically, surfing ain't swimming.

You see, when you swim, you swim. Your body is in the water.

When surfing, you are on some sort of board. Above the water.

You don't need to be able to know how to swim, if you only want to surf. But it help if you fall in the water. ;)

[Red]

i know a lot of guys who are good swimmers and are black,skin color has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with wheter a person can swim or not.Give me a break.A lot of people just carouse these forums posting all these statistics up in here like they are absolute truths.Blacks compared to white dont have access to as many public ammenities.All you mondern day Robert Mcnamara's with your staistics go do some research on who has more access to stuff like pools etc.And i never argued that blacks are overrepresented in the military,as far as i am concerned any one can join i dont care what race.We just have to move past this notion of race ie.blacks cant swim,maybe it's a joke to the racist who tell them, but you have a problem when you find it funny.

[hood]

well, I've got a copy of the pics that were up here, but not different versions. I'm waiting on a response from astur concerning getting those existing ones back up locally, as I wouldn't want to do that without permission.

[Dmitri]

i know a lot of guys who are good swimmers and are black,skin color has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with wheter a person can swim or notwell, I'm not a racist and I definately don't know if its true or not about different races swimming differently, but I am yet to see one African-American to get prizes in Olympicss or even swimming there(might be wrong though)[/code]

[hood]

well, as benibo mentioned, minorities on the average, have less access to pools and other facilities which would usually fall under luxury items. for the first half of my childhood, I lived in a far less economically sound neighborhood. The thought of having an olympic sized swimming pool was laughable.

[Dmitri]

Well, I don't know where in Georgia any olympic size pools are (except Atlanta), but the ones in my town I've seen people of all shape, color and size. I don't see why any person, unless he just doesn't possess the sanitary standards, can be denied pool access.

[Red]

For the most part, Blacks do not have the money or the time to worry about swimming because they have to make money to pay bills and keep their kids in school.This is something i cant explain to you because you need to experience it to understand it.Just .I know a lot of you guys here are cool guys but the world is sure not a cool place especially when you are not white.A point to note though,a lot of the problems with recruiting standards in SF as it regards to blacks are caused by the blacks themselves,if you feel you have the call to serve,you must not let anyone stop you no matter what.It is at that point in time that as a black man you must stand up to the occasion and prove the statisticians wrong.It can also be applied to society in general, all this talk of slave reparations and the mentality that the white man owes the black man has to go in order for there to be real progress for the black man.In my opinion the worst enemy of a black man is a black man.

[96B]

Short of physical abnormalities, the ONLY possible reason why blacks or anybody for that matter would not be able to swim good or at all would be a lack of access to a pool or pond etc. I grew up with a pool and have been swimming since I was 3. When I was 8, a black family moved in next to us with three sons. They swam about as good as rocks when they first started with me and by the time we were all about 14, they could swim just as fast if not faster and were perfectly comfortable in the water. Short of telling my boring life story, the point is as long as you are healthy and do not have a certain abnormality, virtually anybody can be taught to swim so this bs about race means nothing. It can be compared to saying black people are not smart, well you have to consider the fact that many cannot afford a higher education. Physical ability is an individual basis, whereas personality can sometimes be cultural.

[Red]

thank you for understanding

[Jack Mehoff]

Short of physical abnormalities, the ONLY possible reason why blacks or anybody for that matter would not be able to swim good or at all would be a lack of access to a pool or pond etc. I grew up with a pool and have been swimming since I was 3. When I was 8, a black family moved in next to us with three sons. They swam about as good as rocks when they first started with me and by the time we were all about 14, they could swim just as fast if not faster and were perfectly comfortable in the water. Not like growing up story means a damn but the point is as long as you are healthy and do not have a certain abnormality, virtually anybody can be taught to swim so this bs about race means nothing. It can be compared to saying black people are not smart, well you have to consider the fact that many cannot afford a higher education. Physical ability is an individual basis, whereas personality can sometimes be cultural.

I agree. I still don't see how skin color have anything to do with buoyancy. Swimming is very EASY to learn and it doesn't take a lot of practice, but swim for 2 miles straight is hard because you need to be in great shape to do that.

[Red]

I can tell you once you are able to dispel any funky notion about the millitary, you will have a rash of diverse people trying out for things such as SF.That is what SF inparts into its people-brotherhood.

[Red]

i also want to point out something to you all, the US in regards to minorities in SF or the millitary in general have a very good record,the rest of the world that love to bash the USA on race issues are the ones with the problems.Lets take Europe for example-look through all the photos on the websites on european armies and count how many blacks you see-i think maybe its next to none.The minorities know that the US millitary wil take care of them no matter what unlike some of our european brethren who have what i call institutionalized racism.How many blacks do you see in polands army?but the best polish soccer player is black.All i am saying is that the USA has come a VERY LONG WAY and it's the rest of the so called civilized world that needs to chatch up.

[GLax]

yea but thats not because they dont want them in, its really cuz they dont have them. i know that polish soccer player your talking about and when i first saw him i was dumbfounded... i said to myself, 'a black guy in eastern europe?' but hey, there he was. i think that europe overall is just 'lacking' black guys compared to the US...

[hood]

Ok, Astur has sent in the hi-res versions of the ones he posted before, and I've put them in the appropriate sections. Thanks to Astur for some fine photos.

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/gulf_war_2_iraqi_freedom_army_special_forces?page=3

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/special_forces-afghanistan?page=6

Clicking a second time on each one in the gallery gets the original hi-res version.

[GRENDEL X]

Sure surfing is not swimming but on occasion you can get "pitched" by a wave and then you have to swim for it LOL! The point I'm making is that wether a person can or cannot swim has nothing to do with skin color, case in point I've known caucasian persons in my old unit who could not swim. In most cases the lack of swim knowledge had to do with being landlocked with no one willing or ablel to teach them how. Did I metion I dive also? :lol:

[TP]

B-Company, 3rd Battalion, 20th Special Forces Group, ABN.
http://www.adoptaplatoon.org/galleries/teampict5.jpg

[MVSpartan117]

Why type of trucks are those? Why we seeing SF use civilian vehicles so much all the sudden?

[hood]

A quick look through the SF Afghanistan gallery shows quite a few Toyotas in use.

[GLax]

Sure surfing is not swimming but on occasion you can get "pitched" by a wave and then you have to swim for it LOL! The point I'm making is that wether a person can or cannot swim has nothing to do with skin color, case in point I've known caucasian persons in my old unit who could not swim. In most cases the lack of swim knowledge had to do with being landlocked with no one willing or ablel to teach them how. Did I metion I dive also? :lol:

i think that settles that dispute. BTW, where do you surf? ive always wanted to try it but the pond in the woods isnt exatcly that good for it :D, fun to swim in though i must say...

[ibstolidude]

HMMWV s stick out even from a distance.

Their parts need to be flown in for teams/units located in remote areas v/s the interchangable parts of the Toyota.

The toyota is several FEET narrower than the HMMWV making it a little more suited for tight crowded streets in older ****stickistan cities.

[Seraphim]

I think they are Toyota Tundra's.

[MSG Dman]

The Toyota is used for only one reason, they are EVERYWHERE over there. If you drive into Kabul, every other vehicle is a Toyota pickup. At the begining of the war most of these were loaded with locals carrying weapons. Our SF blend in perfectly in these trucks, especially when wearing local clothing.

[ibstolidude]

I think they are Toyota Tundra's.
although there are Tundra's. mostly they are Tacoma and local procurred Land Cruisers

[GLax]

yep, toyota tundra with club cabs... prolly got some nice pickup too, light weight chassis with a v6 can haul ass. to add to the fact that i dont think its possible for toyotas to break down, you can drive those things FOREVER! not bad on gas mileage either. i was thinkin about gettin one but i'm gonna wait till i figure out where the Army is gonna send me first...

[soldierandy]

ok ok guys with the whole race issue. Just look at demographics and you will see why there are less blacks in SF than in the rest of the army. And to settle the swimming issue: Blacks genetically make great athletes. Look at the lineups for the Olympics. Which sports do they excel at? Virtually all of the sprinters are black - except the greek guy that won the 200m but he is a freak exception. Long distance runners are Ethiopian. Kenyan/ North African. Do they lack access to tracks? And how many do you see in swimming events? virtually none. Is the sport of swimming racist? Then black communities in the US, UK and Europe are almost exclusively urban, inner city folk that are not that well off either. They will join the army for the perks but as far as starting climbing mountains and living it out in the freezing cold I am not so sure. SF guy usually would be someone who loves the outdoors, esp. mountainous terrain and feels comfortable in operating in extreme climates you don't find in cities. If he is a townie then it would be someone who culturarly at least will head for the mountains and the ocean at every opportunity.

Any takers on that?

[Henk]

To begin all people (races and sexes) are equal but not the same.
Having said this ain't it so that most african americans have short muscles, wich makes them very quick at short distances. On the other hand most whites have long muscles wich is better at the long distances.
Special Forces are all about endurance (long road marches with heavy loads ect. ect.)

_________________________
The best weapon is the mind

[Seraphim]

Whats this about short muscles?
I dont think the length of muscles have to do with anything. Its if they have fast or slow twitch muscles.

[Henk]

Some serious reading,

Blacks with a West African ancestry generally have:


relatively less subcutaneous fat on arms and legs and proportionately more lean body and muscle mass, broader shoulders, larger quadriceps, and bigger, more developed musculature in general;
denser, shallower chests;
higher center of gravity, generally shorter sitting height, narrower hips, and lighter calves;
longer arm span and "distal elongation of segments" - the hand is relatively longer than the forearm, which in turn is relatively longer than the upper arm; the foot is relatively longer than the tibia (leg), which is relatively longer than the thigh;
faster patellar tendon reflex;
greater body density, which is likely due to higher bone mineral density and heavier bone mass at all stages in life, including infancy (despite evidence of lower calcium intake and a higher prevalence of lactose intolerance, which prevents consumption of dairy products);
modestly, but significantly, higher levels of plasma testosterone (3-19 percent), which is anabolic, theoretically contributing to greater muscle mass, lower fat, and the ability to perform at a higher level of intensity with quicker recovery;
a higher percentage of fast-twitch muscles and more anaerobic enzymes, which can translate into more explosive energy.

Relative advantages in these physiological and biomechanical characteristics are a gold mine for athletes who compete in such anaerobic activities as football, basketball, and sprinting, sports in which West African blacks clearly excel. However, they also pose problems for athletes who might want to compete as swimmers (heavier skeletons and smaller chest cavities could be drags on performance) or in cold-weather and endurance sports. Central West African athletes are more susceptible to fatigue than whites and East Africans, in effect making them relatively poor candidates for aerobic sports.

White athletes appear to have a physique between central West Africans and East Africans. They have more endurance but less explosive running and jumping ability than West Africans; they tend to be quicker than East Africans but have less endurance.

Still, it should not be forgotten that ancestry is not destiny. "From a biomechanical perspective, the answer is 'yes,' race and ethnicity do matter," says Lindsay Carter, a physical anthropologist at San Diego State University who has studied thousands of Olympic-level athletes over the years. "All of the large-scale studies show it, and the data goes back more than a hundred years." But he adds a critical caveat. It is critical to remember that no individual athlete can succeed without the X factor - the lucky spin of the roulette wheel of genetics matched with considerable dedication and sport smarts. "There are far too many variables to make blanket statements about the deterministic quality of genetics," Carter says. "Nature provides an average advantage, yes. But that says nothing about any individual competitor."

Special Forces are all about endurance (long road marches with heavy loads ect. ect.) but the strongest bodypart to make it is between your ears.


_________________________
The best weapon is the mind.

[Seraphim]

What about asians?

[NcDeuce]

Physical attributes have nothing to do with it. If you want something bad enough, you will work and train for that goal. Most of the people in Special Operations units are white, yes. Almost every group or work enviroment is mostly white, why does this particular case surprise people? There are many others...Asians, Blacks, Europeans, Hispanics, etc. Some may be half Asian or half Hispanic and so on. Who cares about the color of someone's skin, if he's SF, he's SF.

[Jack Mehoff]

To begin all people (races and sexes) are equal but not the same.
Having said this ain't it so that most african americans have short muscles, wich makes them very quick at short distances. On the other hand most whites have long muscles wich is better at the long distances.
Special Forces are all about endurance (long road marches with heavy loads ect. ect.)

_________________________
The best weapon is the mind

rofl this is not a joke, right? Some of the fastest people in the world at long distance running(marathon) are African from Nigeria or Kenya or, whatever. Some of the fastest people I served with in the military are either Puerto Rican or blacks. Those guys can run/ruck forever or it seem like it. You should go out and live with those guys for 4 years and come back here and tell me rofl

[Red]

well, i have to say that it does not matter what color you are,if you put your mind to it you can do it.This whole race isue is like a hot needle.i dont know why people on both sides cant just let the issue of race die down.Example would be Jesse Jackson and Rush Limbaugh

[soldierandy]

best SF soldiers are the Brits.

[Jack Mehoff]

best SF soldiers are the Brits.

Opinions are like assholes, everybody got one


BTW, best SF soldiers are Americans

[SneakyPete]

I still don't see why so many fail the Q course. The instructors, or so I heard, are not really suppose to keep testing your abilities so hard after SFAS.

You ought to find some better sources to listen to.

[NcDeuce]

rofl Oh my.

[soldierandy]

British infantry is better than yank SF. Americans can't even play rugby without bloody body armour.

[Jack Mehoff]

British infantry is better than yank SF. Americans can't even play rugby without bloody body armour.

But one U.S. soldier worth TWO Royal marines commandos

[JF45]

British infantry is better than yank SF. Americans can't even play rugby without bloody body armour.
Can anyone make any kind of logical sense out of that? That's less an argument than just bunch of words you threw together that happened to form a sentence. Sounds like that Futurama quote:

"If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate."

[admar2]

British infantry is better than yank SF. Americans can't even play rugby without bloody body armour.

and your opinion is worth as much as any other idiot that revives a thread that has been forgotten for almost 60 days.

:bash:

[Machine]

Hey SoldierRandy, I heard several Limes and kiwis say this ignorant statement as if to imply Rugy has the same level of impact as American Football. Rugby is a tought sport, and you must be tough to play it no doubt. But that fact is in Rugby you basically tackle. In American Football you HIT and tackle. Unless you have played in the NFL none of us can even imagine the level of impact they experience. That is why they wear helmets, etc. Its a double edged sword, the better the padding the greater the hitting. As the technology has developed over the years in Am Football's equipment did you know that the number of impact related injuries as increased? This is a fact. Take your best pro Rugy player have him strap up and take a full hit from Ray Lewis, it will be impace unlike anything he's experienced. OR a blind-side hit on a QB standing looking the other direction or a punt coverage man chasing a returner only to get blasted from a blocker crossing in his lane. Sorry, but these hits cannot be rivaled in Rugby for the fact that skulls would crack, jaws would break etc. I know, you will say "well they have" and I am sure that is true from time to time, but in Am FB, this velocity of hitting happens daily. Again, Rugby is tough, but please, don't fool yourself!

[bison]

according to some of my reading, during veitnam, one out of every ten citizens was black, yet two out of every five combat fatalities were black. this clearly shows that there were as many if not more blacks doing dangerous jobs during that conflict... just my thoughts...

[redhawk_six]

British infantry is better than yank SF. Americans can't even play rugby without bloody body armour.

You dug this up for that?
:bash:

As stated before, opinions are like assholes, everyone's got one, but not everyone likes to hear about them.

[James]

I am a Yank, and I can kick the ass of any Brit living today! :P

[soldierandy]

I was just bored so I thought I'd mess with you my dear cousins. Who is better of the two armies is really trivial as we are the only ones that will fight wars nowadays anyway.

[Saranof]

Nobody answer him, he's only 13

[soldierandy]

Sweden? What has Sweden got to with anything? esp nothing to do with sense of humour..

[redhawk_six]

I was just bored so I thought I'd mess with you my dear cousins. Who is better of the two armies is really trivial as we are the only ones that will fight wars nowadays anyway.

Geee... thanks for giving credit to all your allies who helped you in Afghanistan and Iraq.... No, don't keep thanking us... It's too much, really....

Sure, lets just forget all those other countries who lost men and women over there, fighting along side you. They didn't matter anyway, eh?
Guess there was no point to sending a large Canadian force over to afghanistan after all, since you and the US are the only ones who fight.

[/sarcasm] :roll:

I know that it was probably just a joke, but it's not funny, not at all.
:bash:

[Jack Mehoff]

Canadian armed forces is in Iraq?

[ST4]

I still cannot see the photos.

[wholagun]

I still cannot see the photos.

Yeah same here, what gives?

[[AFSOC]]

Canadian armed forces is in Iraq?

No...just exchange officers

There's CAnadian forces in AFghanistan

[soldierandy]

OOooooops, ok ok my dear friends. I have the utmost respect as a professional soldier for our brothers in arms from Canada, Australia, New Zealand who have always traditionally fought alongside the British and US armed forces in this and the past century's wars. Also I would have to mention the countries that do actively now participate, operate and lose lives in the new theatres of operations on this war on terror such as Poland, Spain, Italy that have sent their young men in danger for a better world. I am not being sarcastic gentlemen I mean this.

However my point was that the US and the UK are the countries that have the political, as opposed to just the military will, to impress action and enforce change such as a decision to go to war in the first place. I should also mention that there are countries that are engaged in war as well such as Russia and Israel with also great loss of life and incredible acts of bravery.

Mine was an attempt in friendly rivalry and humour such as you find in all military messes across the globe. I am hoping that that hasn't been lost on you. Rivalry is part of army life. In the UK, A coy slags off B coy, Paras slag off Marines, and all together slag off the americans or whoever. I am sure in the States same happens between Rangers, Marine Recon, Airborne, Delta, Seals, Force Recon, Green Berets, FAST, Force Recon or whoever. We don't take these things seriously although they end usually in bar brawls with a few drinks added in for fun as a sense of humour is on issue in British army kit. I hope the same goes for the armies you fine gentlemen come from.