The Norwegian army's replacement rifle for the AG3

[wiking]

I know that the norwegian army has been testing weapons for replaceing the AG3, is there anyone who knows if they've decided for one, or what rifles the choise is between now.
I am 18 right now, and will most likely be drafted and go in this summer or next year, can i expect to carry the AG3 or another rifle.

I've seen pictures of soldiers with the G36, and i know HJK used the C8 in A-stan, personally i hope they go for the G36.

[Ichhabe]

With the speed and determination that those who are in the position to decide what rifle our Grand Army is going to haul, expect your great grand children to run around with the AG-3. :D

[wiking]

With the speed and determination that those who are in the position to decide what rifle our Grand Army is going to haul, expect your great grand children to run around with the AG-3. :D

rofl rofl
"The Army way" isn't that what they call it.

[Ichhabe]

To be honest, I am actually amazed that we use such a high speed weapon as the AG-3.

http://www.elverumske.no/images/skarpskyting1.jpg

To be honest, this is what we still would have used if the decission-makers was not kicked in their ass from time to time and told to get a move on. :D

[wiking]

The 18 Lødig kammerlader would be kinda fun to use though, or the remington rolling block.

I'd settle for a Krag, but those Mausers we took from the germans and the army used till '52 and the navy even longer, those sucked. they got worned down so bad, that when my grandfather was in the navy sometime in the 50's he got half of his holes "keyhole hits" or whatever they call it, basically the bullet tumbled in the air and hit sideways instead of point first :lol:

But i'd really like the Garand (but i aint joining the sodding Royal Guard for it, they look nice and all that but HELL no if i'm gonna wear those wool unioforms in the summer.)
pluss i might not make the height requirements with my 170cm)

Is that a Baker rifle by the way, those things could kill a man at 700 yards, and that was in the very early 19 century and firing round bullets.

[Rakki]

I do believe they had to change their weapon after those muskets proved inadequate in 1939....

[Marsuitor]

I might be able to shed some light on this,
In very short, there's been three contenders, the G36, C8A2 and FN-F2000. The F2000 was recently kicked out of the competition, leaving the G36 and C8A2 (the Spes dudes for the most use SFW's which are very different from the plain C8, don't bet on seeing any of those in the regs). Most of the guys i've talked to who has tried out various stuff write the G36 (model KV i believe) as useless dribble. My squadron CO is an old battered dude who's had a finger in various testing, his favorite is the C8 for various reasons. However... the C8 is about triple the cost of one G36, go figure. Also the phasing in of new service rifle across the board has been delayed year and year again, with the set date per now being 2006-2007.
That's what i knew up until today.

Some of the new stuff i heard today however is the following, just loose stuff not compiled into a sensible block of text;
- The FN-F2000 is back in again and apparently topping the competition (the model with computerized aiming module etc.)
- Norway is not interested in moving away from 7.62 calibre.
- Norway wants to wait for 7.62 versions of the above rifles(!) <- Not likely
- Norway is looking into 6.5/6.7mm calibre stuff (XM-8 perhaps?)

^Very unconfirmed stuff mind you. Some armorer told me this during technical inspection today. Don't know why there was so many conflicting statements...

Now for the good stuff,
We are the first unit in the army to participate in an "enhanced AG-3" program starting some time in January hopefully. From what i've been told by my powers the kit has already been shopped and payed for. What this involves is our G3 being upgraded to include an aimpoint on every rifle, a RAS handrail and an Oerlikon module with a flashlight and IR laser in it. This should dramatically extend the life and service spectre of the G3 and keep people occupied until a proper replacement arrives. Our snipers have already got the package installed, but for them they have some big arse scope mounted and one of those harris bipods on their RAS.
That said, i've long since learned not to trust equipment promises until i physically have them in-hand, but for once i think things are shaping up good on the guns side of things. ;)

[Yeoman]

marucs;
you boys should get c8's. I love them bloody things. although I'd say you should get c7a2's, a very reliable weapon.
how come the c8 is triple the cost? like I can under stand more because it's pratically all metal. but damn, those g36's must be dirt cheap to make, cuz I know the price of a c8a2, and it's not a whole lot compared to alot of other weapons.
Greg

[wiking]

RAS type system on the AG3, sweet! :hug:

The way i've gotten it the C8 is basically an M4 carbine, so why would a carbine be competing against the G36, wich is a rifle? (correct me if i'm wrong.)

I like the idea of 7.62 over 5.56, i have little idea of why, but i guess it's those horror storys of ppl getting shot by 5.56 several times and then keep on fighting for a considerable time. (A.stan to mention one where such insidents were reported, usually due to M4+considerable range = Fooked up)
This is allso why i have a thing aganst the M16 design, i'd have to carry what they gave me, but if i did have to go into action with it, i would have no trust in it, and that is bad.

Marcus, your going to A-stan, how would you feel if you had no fait in the AG3 being able to effectively take down a target if u shot at it, or that it would even perform every time.

[Phil642]

Pleaaase choose FN2000 or anything from Herstal, a few people here are working in a long ancestral tradition of gunsmith, using now a up to date technology in order to build the weapons that fit perfectly ... ;)

[Marsuitor]

Marcus, your going to A-stan, how would you feel if you had no fait in the AG3 being able to effectively take down a target if u shot at it, or that it would even perform every time.
To put it this way, going to A-stan i'm extremely happy that i'm issued 7.62, stuff happens at range there and using low calibre would only make unhappy faces, on both sides.
However, what i have very little, or no faith in is a good deal of our office sitting powers who go on about only using issued kit, no modifying of weapons, using different kit is unprofessional (=bollocks), which is why someone on our level has gone through and demanded our rifles upgraded and modernized, which has amazingly gone through. I remember from my KFOR days the top argument against using custom optics on our G3 being that Norwegian soldiers usually scored the highest in marksmanship competitions, therefore there was no need for optics. How about that for fark sake! Things are going good now however and we're issued some really gucci kit not worth complaining about.
However if i was going somewhere overly built-up i probably wouldn't feel too comfortable with the G3, it's simply too long, heavy and cumbersome. But for now it's good stuff.

Phil,
Unfortunately i'm not in charge of procurement. If i know the Norwegian military correctly, they'll buy something that is bollocked from the start, say it's kosher and have everyone complain until something is done some years later. It's happened on just about every type of procurement, from webbing to our Leopard2 tanks. There are simply too many "besserwissers" hired in our military. ;)

Cheers,
Marcus

EDIT: Edited due to demand. The correct people know what's changed and have the original.

[Falco]

The way i've gotten it the C8 is basically an M4 carbine, so why would a carbine be competing against the G36, wich is a rifle? (correct me if i'm wrong.)


Not quite the C8A2 has a much heavier barrel than the M4. Take a look at the Diemaco web page.

http://www.diemaco.com/

[OldRecon]

RAS type system on the AG3, sweet! :hug:

The way i've gotten it the C8 is basically an M4 carbine, so why would a carbine be competing against the G36, wich is a rifle? (correct me if i'm wrong.)

I like the idea of 7.62 over 5.56, i have little idea of why, but i guess it's those horror storys of ppl getting shot by 5.56 several times and then keep on fighting for a considerable time. (A.stan to mention one where such insidents were reported, usually due to M4+considerable range = Fooked up)
This is allso why i have a thing aganst the M16 design, i'd have to carry what they gave me, but if i did have to go into action with it, i would have no trust in it, and that is bad.

Marcus, your going to A-stan, how would you feel if you had no fait in the AG3 being able to effectively take down a target if u shot at it, or that it would even perform every time.

Don't think the accuracy of the weapons have started to wander yet, and the 7,62 is quite powerful.
As for 5.56 weapons the FNC looks rather more solid and reliable than either the C8 or the G-36 in terms of basic structure.
If G-36 is as bad as rumours will have it, the choice between that one and the C8 looks like the choice between 2 less than ideal contenders.
The C8 may be the better contender, but Armalites have allways been flimsy crap and will allways be flimsy crap.
And compared to the Kalashnikovs, the assembly/disassembly of an armalite family weapon is downright "how to make a simple thing rather complicated".
Though as nearing "pension age" with regards to military service for my country, I'll guess I'll never fire either the old AG or some new 5.56 hi-tec (and am quite content and happy with that in fact :) )

[OldRecon]

...

Phil,
Unfortunately i'm not in charge of procurement. If i know the Norwegian military correctly, they'll buy something that is bollocked from the start, say it's kosher and have everyone complain until something is done some years later. It's happened on just about every type of procurement, from webbing to our Leopard2 tanks. There are simply too many ****heads hired in our military. ;)

Cheers,
Marcus

Isn't Bertel O. Steen, the guy that otherwise make a living of importing and selling Mercedes cars, a major mid-hand/broker with regards to equipment procurements to our armed forces and the police?
The Police force in Oslo appears to have been less than happy with the cars he sold them a few years back.
Guess you'll never buy a Merc ever from now on, in a guesture of disgust at the rotten stuff he makes you suffice with in the army from now on Marcus :lol:.
Anyway crap equipment or not continue to stay safe and have a "good one" abroad.

[Stavka]

AG3 any day of the week.

As a medic in the swedish homeguard, his majesty the king has seen it fit for me to be issued a G3, and I love it. 7.62 power, reliable, accurate, in short wonderful.

[Marsuitor]

Isn't Bertel O. Steen, the guy that otherwise make a living of importing and selling Mercedes cars, a major mid-hand/broker with regards to equipment procurements to our armed forces and the police?
The Police force in Oslo appears to have been less than happy with the cars he sold them a few years back.
Guess you'll never buy a Merc ever from now on, in a guesture of disgust at the rotten stuff he makes you suffice with in the army from now on Marcus :lol:.
Anyway crap equipment or not continue to stay safe and have a "good one" abroad.
I wouldn't know if he's the guy, but if, then DEATH TO THE INFIDEL! :lol:
Seriously, i've never heard of that dude, but if it's as you say, someone upright and good standing should beat him with a stick and send him to Africa, then take over the job as procurer. It's quite obvious that someone is making good cash on leading the three-starred double stripe, chair-shaped arse officers of our military far away from sense on the procurement front.
Argh, leave the keyboard now i'm having a heart attack... hehe

Cheers all,
Marcus

EDIT: Edited due to demand. The correct people know what's changed and have the original.

[Tænxer]

I must say I was a bit gobsmacked when I read the G36 refered to as "useless dribble" (not saying your friends are not telling the truth, though, marcus). I've personally tried both the G36KV (and C) and C8A2 on the range, and used the G3 when I served a few years back. I also own the ugly sibling of the G36 (SL8), and I dare say the reliability of the G36 is better than of the G3. I've had hickups (FTF & FTE) more than once with the G3 (and don't blame the user ;) ), but that have never happened to with my SL8 or the G36s I've had a go at (keeping in mind that I try to keep my SL8 away from mud-pools, obstacle courses and such, different from what the G3s have to go through every year). We're all somewhat skeptical about the plastic gun, and have heard stories about stocks breaking in the cold and receivers melting. The stock shouldn't break, of course, but you can still fire the rifle even if it does. All that takes to render a G3 more or less useless is a hard nok to the tube above the barrel, which will make the bolt carrier jam. And, yes, I've seen that happen as well. And as for the receiver melting; you'd need the ammo from your whole squad and a steady flow of full magazines which you all fire fullauto to see that happen. It's not designed to be a MG3 :)

I've been in direct contact with some of the top brass conducting the tests several times, and according to them, the C8 SFW costs about 3 times as much as the C8A2. I doubt, however, that the C8A2 costs 3 times as much as the G36. The G36 sells for about USD 700 each, and I really wouldn't put my money on a bet saying the C8A2 costs more than USD2000...

Barrel lengths: The new G36KV has a 14.5" barrel. As will the C8A2 if adopted.

From my lasts talk with the guys (june this year), it was apparent nothing else than 5,56 would be considered. XM8 was not an option (this is said to be a deal between HK and US only). The task the is to test to see what rifles (plural) are suitable for the Norwegian armed forces, and preferably make a suggestion to which rifle (singular) should be acquired. However, what rifle we'll end up with is also the result of negotiations, both political and financial. We should furthermore not forget that the armed forces have to phase out more weapons in the future. For example, the MG3 is too heavy/cumbersome for the SAW-role. We have no SAW/LMG, exept for the Minimi used by the SF-guys. Diemaco does not offer a SAW comparable to Minimi and HK MG4. It is not impossible that future contracts will have their impact on what rifle the regular norwegian grunt will be issued if or when the G3 is phased out.

G36KV new version (www.stud.ntnu.no/~tomaslh/g36kv)

not saying I know best, but with so many contradictory rumors in circulation, I'd hesitate in stating I know for sure what rifle will become the next one issued to the regs.

-t

[Heinzi]

I used both the G3 and the G36 in dirty enviroment :D

The g36 ist much more resistant to dirt. It kind of sealed of. If you want to make the g36 dirty inside you have to push the dirt down the barrel ;)

I know of one (in my unit) who managed to break the stock. But you can use the g36 without stock, too. The kickback is not that hard, and the protection west absorbs most of it ;)

[wiking]

Seeing as we have so many "veterans" of the norwegian army here, this might be a good time to ask a question i've been wanting to hear the answer to.

A friend of mine, who is way more into all things about the norwegian army than me, (he's in HVU or is it UHV it's written) told me a story that is said to have happened while british troops were on summer excersize in Northern Norway. They forgot to bring mosquito repellent, and borrowed some from us. The story says that Norwegian the "mygg stick" had a chemical reaction to the plastic parts or the SA80 rifle. To what extent i don't know.

Anyone who can veryfy\deny this story?

[Werewolf01]

Seeing as we have so many "veterans" of the norwegian army here, this might be a good time to ask a question i've been wanting to hear the answer to.

A friend of mine, who is way more into all things about the norwegian army than me, (he's in HVU or is it UHV it's written) told me a story that is said to have happened while british troops were on summer excersize in Northern Norway. They forgot to bring mosquito repellent, and borrowed some from us. The story says that Norwegian the "mygg stick" had a chemical reaction to the plastic parts or the SA80 rifle. To what extent i don't know.

Anyone who can veryfy\deny this story?

I know that USGI insect repellent (at least the older stuff 1994 and earlier) definitely 'melted' plastic. I think that's why I never put it on my skin.....

Personally I would rather have a 7.62 mm weapon. 5.56 just doesn't get the job done well enough often enough. I also lacks the effective range (althoughI have shot matches @ 600 + yards, it hits like a bee sting or an ant bite, it will kill or immobilize, but it takes too long unless its a cranial shot ), it does not have nearly as good penetration, and if you are well practiced with your weapon, it really doesn't offer a TOT advantage.

[wiking]

Seeing as we have so many "veterans" of the norwegian army here, this might be a good time to ask a question i've been wanting to hear the answer to.

A friend of mine, who is way more into all things about the norwegian army than me, (he's in HVU or is it UHV it's written) told me a story that is said to have happened while british troops were on summer excersize in Northern Norway. They forgot to bring mosquito repellent, and borrowed some from us. The story says that Norwegian the "mygg stick" had a chemical reaction to the plastic parts or the SA80 rifle. To what extent i don't know.

Anyone who can veryfy\deny this story?

I know that USGI insect repellent (at least the older stuff 1994 and earlier) definitely 'melted' plastic. I think that's why I never put it on my skin.....

Personally I would rather have a 7.62 mm weapon. 5.56 just doesn't get the job done well enough often enough. I also lacks the effective range (althoughI have shot matches @ 600 + yards, it hits like a bee sting or an ant bite, it will kill or immobilize, but it takes too long unless its a cranial shot ), it does not have nearly as good penetration, and if you are well practiced with your weapon, it really doesn't offer a TOT advantage.

So it's possible that story is true? I allways thought it a bit to wild that insect repellent could melt plastic.

Personally i've never fired 5.56 or 7.62, but i'm an avid reader of various things, and among that are the things written about the bad sides of the 5.56

I've said it before, including in this tread, that if and\or when i join and if i have to carry a 5.56 caliber weapon, and\or an M16 or similar, i will never have confidence in the performance (or lack thereof) of the weapon or the bullet.
This i would call one of the worst things for a soldier, to be doing a difficult and life endangering job, when he does not trust the only tool available to perform that job and to keep himself alive, to work proper.

[Werewolf01]

Seeing as we have so many "veterans" of the norwegian army here, this might be a good time to ask a question i've been wanting to hear the answer to.

A friend of mine, who is way more into all things about the norwegian army than me, (he's in HVU or is it UHV it's written) told me a story that is said to have happened while british troops were on summer excersize in Northern Norway. They forgot to bring mosquito repellent, and borrowed some from us. The story says that Norwegian the "mygg stick" had a chemical reaction to the plastic parts or the SA80 rifle. To what extent i don't know.

Anyone who can veryfy\deny this story?

I know that USGI insect repellent (at least the older stuff 1994 and earlier) definitely 'melted' plastic. I think that's why I never put it on my skin.....

Personally I would rather have a 7.62 mm weapon. 5.56 just doesn't get the job done well enough often enough. I also lacks the effective range (althoughI have shot matches @ 600 + yards, it hits like a bee sting or an ant bite, it will kill or immobilize, but it takes too long unless its a cranial shot ), it does not have nearly as good penetration, and if you are well practiced with your weapon, it really doesn't offer a TOT advantage.

So it's possible that story is true? I allways thought it a bit to wild that insect repellent could melt plastic.

Personally i've never fired 5.56 or 7.62, but i'm an avid reader of various things, and among that are the things written about the bad sides of the 5.56

I've said it before, including in this tread, that if and\or when i join and if i have to carry a 5.56 caliber weapon, and\or an M16 or similar, i will never have confidence in the performance (or lack thereof) of the weapon or the bullet.
This i would call one of the worst things for a soldier, to be doing a difficult and life endangering job, when he does not trust the only tool available to perform that job and to keep himself alive, to work proper.

My personal experiences with the M16/M4 series are mixed. I have seen about every sort of malfunction possible occur in one at one time or another. You can make them more reliable, but all the extra parts, etc. end up costing quite a bit. It wouldn't be my first choice for cold or sandy climates. I personallt think Norway is much better off sticking with the G3, which, again in my opinion is a much better weapon than the M16. 5.56 mm is deadly when the shots are well placed...for the most part, but it tends to cause less terminal damage in the current ss109 load which was designed to defeat helmets and or body armor, and wound, not kill. The M193 55 gr load is much more deadly as is the new 73 gr load, or so I hear. The 6.8 looks very promising. I guess I am on old fogey to an extent, but I still believe .22 caliber weapons are for killing groundhogs, rabbits, and squirrels that don't shoot back. Frankly, if it came down to it, I would much rather have an AK47 or some variant (Valmet, etc.) in 7.62x39 than an M16.

[wiking]

Norway is defenitely not a country suited for an M16\M4 weapon.
What we really should do is to manufacture our own weapon and SAW\LMG suitable for the Norwegian terrain and climate.

The winter in Norway can range from the very mild, almost frost and snow free winter of south western norway (vestlandet) where i live - to the extreme cold of North Norway's arctic tundra.

Units like MJK, who operate on and near the sea, and therefore risking water and humidity easy access to the weapon + the bad effects of salt water air, would defenitely be bad for an M16 family weapon.
Wasn't the saying that "as long as it doesn't get wet, you'll be allright."

30-40 degrees below celsius, atleast in effective temperature when taking the wind into account, probably isn't the best for any weapon, but to my knowledge the M16 family is a bit more sensitive than most weapons.

Truth is we might not be fighting a war in Norway untill any weapon of today, even those of the wildest fiction, is made\invented and decleered obsolete.
But as we are not capable of seeing much more than 3-4-5 years into the future with reasonable accuracy, in less than 10 years i might be fighting an invasion by a forign nation.

Norway has a tradition of not only making our own weapons, but being among the first nation to go from the traditional over to something new.
Like trading over to chamber loaders instead of muzzle loaders, going to brass instead of paper cartridges, bolt action and magazine bolt actions. But as we entered the 20th century we lost alot of this, and now we no longer produce our own rifle, wich i find horrible.

[Werewolf01]

Norway is defenitely not a country suited for an M16\M4 weapon.
What we really should do is to manufacture our own weapon and SAW\LMG suitable for the Norwegian terrain and climate.

The winter in Norway can range from the very mild, almost frost and snow free winter of south western norway (vestlandet) where i live - to the extreme cold of North Norway's arctic tundra.

Units like MJK, who operate on and near the sea, and therefore risking water and humidity easy access to the weapon + the bad effects of salt water air, would defenitely be bad for an M16 family weapon.
Wasn't the saying that "as long as it doesn't get wet, you'll be allright."

30-40 degrees below celsius, atleast in effective temperature when taking the wind into account, probably isn't the best for any weapon, but to my knowledge the M16 family is a bit more sensitive than most weapons.

Truth is we might not be fighting a war in Norway untill any weapon of today, even those of the wildest fiction, is made\invented and decleered obsolete.
But as we are not capable of seeing much more than 3-4-5 years into the future with reasonable accuracy, in less than 10 years i might be fighting an invasion by a forign nation.

Norway has a tradition of not only making our own weapons, but being among the first nation to go from the traditional over to something new.
Like trading over to chamber loaders instead of muzzle loaders, going to brass instead of paper cartridges, bolt action and magazine bolt actions. But as we entered the 20th century we lost alot of this, and now we no longer produce our own rifle, wich i find horrible.

Every country should at least have the ability to manufacture its won small arms. I would hope that the leadership of Norway would see fit to at east buy you new G3's rather than replace them with something inferior. Historically, when you have absolutely nothing to worry about, it probably means you are getting ready to be attacked and caught with your pants down. Ref: 9/11/01

[wiking]

Norway is defenitely not a country suited for an M16\M4 weapon.
What we really should do is to manufacture our own weapon and SAW\LMG suitable for the Norwegian terrain and climate.

The winter in Norway can range from the very mild, almost frost and snow free winter of south western norway (vestlandet) where i live - to the extreme cold of North Norway's arctic tundra.

Units like MJK, who operate on and near the sea, and therefore risking water and humidity easy access to the weapon + the bad effects of salt water air, would defenitely be bad for an M16 family weapon.
Wasn't the saying that "as long as it doesn't get wet, you'll be allright."

30-40 degrees below celsius, atleast in effective temperature when taking the wind into account, probably isn't the best for any weapon, but to my knowledge the M16 family is a bit more sensitive than most weapons.

Truth is we might not be fighting a war in Norway untill any weapon of today, even those of the wildest fiction, is made\invented and decleered obsolete.
But as we are not capable of seeing much more than 3-4-5 years into the future with reasonable accuracy, in less than 10 years i might be fighting an invasion by a forign nation.

Norway has a tradition of not only making our own weapons, but being among the first nation to go from the traditional over to something new.
Like trading over to chamber loaders instead of muzzle loaders, going to brass instead of paper cartridges, bolt action and magazine bolt actions. But as we entered the 20th century we lost alot of this, and now we no longer produce our own rifle, wich i find horrible.

Every country should at least have the ability to manufacture its won small arms. I would hope that the leadership of Norway would see fit to at east buy you new G3's rather than replace them with something inferior. Historically, when you have absolutely nothing to worry about, it probably means you are getting ready to be attacked and caught with your pants down. Ref: 9/11/01

Or April 9th 1940

[Fudge]

And who will invade us? Sweden? We were invaded 65 years ago. I doubt it'll happen again.

Norways largest threat today is terror. Al Qaeda has infact stated in a videotape that Norway is on the Top 5 list of enemy countries.

And the Diemaco has had several internal changes, making the rifle more reliable. Hell, it works in Canada, so it'll work in Norway too (terrain is pretty much identical).

Fudge

[wiking]

And who will invade us? Sweden? We were invaded 65 years ago. I doubt it'll happen again.

Norways largest threat today is terror. Al Qaeda has infact stated in a videotape that Norway is on the Top 5 list of enemy countries.

And the Diemaco has had several internal changes, making the rifle more reliable. Hell, it works in Canada, so it'll work in Norway too (terrain is pretty much identical).

Fudge



But within 5 years, give or take, we have no idea what the world will look like or who might be a potential enemy then.

We didn't expect a German invasion in 1935, but 5 years later there it was.

[Thor]

Most of the guys i've talked to who has tried out various stuff write the G36 (model KV i believe) as useless dribble.
Yeah, those conscripts know their ****.. It's interesting to see that many top units with practically unlimited budgets prefer the G36KV.

[Royal]

Seeing as we have so many "veterans" of the norwegian army here, this might be a good time to ask a question i've been wanting to hear the answer to.

A friend of mine, who is way more into all things about the norwegian army than me, (he's in HVU or is it UHV it's written) told me a story that is said to have happened while british troops were on summer excersize in Northern Norway. They forgot to bring mosquito repellent, and borrowed some from us. The story says that Norwegian the "mygg stick" had a chemical reaction to the plastic parts or the SA80 rifle. To what extent i don't know.

Anyone who can veryfy\deny this story?

I know that USGI insect repellent (at least the older stuff 1994 and earlier) definitely 'melted' plastic. I think that's why I never put it on my skin.....


The DEET based repellants certainly melted the 'furniture' of the L85 when they first came in - something that should've come up in the jungle trails - hey ho.

[Sabre]

Seeing as we have so many "veterans" of the norwegian army here, this might be a good time to ask a question i've been wanting to hear the answer to.

A friend of mine, who is way more into all things about the norwegian army than me, (he's in HVU or is it UHV it's written) told me a story that is said to have happened while british troops were on summer excersize in Northern Norway. They forgot to bring mosquito repellent, and borrowed some from us. The story says that Norwegian the "mygg stick" had a chemical reaction to the plastic parts or the SA80 rifle. To what extent i don't know.

Anyone who can veryfy\deny this story?

I know that USGI insect repellent (at least the older stuff 1994 and earlier) definitely 'melted' plastic. I think that's why I never put it on my skin.....


The DEET based repellants certainly melted the 'furniture' of the L85 when they first came in - something that should've come up in the jungle trails - hey ho.

I think it did, I know some blokes who trialled the L85 in the trees and they literally fell to pieces in their hands. Improvements were made, but i think the usual MoD response of "Shhhh!!! By the time anyone else notices, we'll have bought them all and it'll be too late!" applied. :roll:

Personally, I don't see any reason for Norway to change to 5.56. The Norwegian terrain lends itself to long-range engagements (especially in the mountains) where a more accurate, more powerful weapon is best. The whole army is used to it, scaled for it and appears (if this board is anything to go by) to be content with it. Perhaps a modernisation programme could be purchased 'off-the-shelf' if one exists, or carbine versions held in stock for deployments to mainly built up areas (peacekeeping ops for example). Honestly, if it aint broke, don't fix it! There are still old schoolers in the British Army who'd rather have the SLR than the A2.

BTW, Norway kicks arse. Just came back from a holiday there. Went to Jottunheimen and went over some glaciers and up some peaks. Went up Galdhoppingen too (been up Glittertind last year) and froze my arse off! There was a lot more snow than I expected for June!

[wiking]

Norway should purchase a license on the G3 from HK and start modernizing it. AS you say, norway is suited for long range infantry engagements.

Sabre, you've been to Norway.
I'll (hopefully) be going to the UK some time (don't know where exactly, Northern England and\or Scotland and maybe Ireland.)

I see you enjoyed it, spread the word mate (but shut up about the prices of pints here, that's a national secret p-) )

[fantassin]

how come the c8 is triple the cost?

HK has lost some contracts recently (ie the huge contract to equip the French Gendarmerie, police and customs with some 220,000 HK USPs) because of inflated prices.

On that contract, SIG was 25 euros cheaper per pistol than HK; it must have taught them a hard lesson than they aren't ready to forget anytime soon.

[TuNeRsHaRk]

Is Kjk still testing the G36C or are they actually using it now?

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/Norwegian_Military/kjk_tr_na_3_8951a.jpg

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/Norwegian_Military/kjk_tr_na_5_8953a.jpg

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/Norwegian_Military/kjk_tr_na_6_8954a.jpg

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/Norwegian_Military/kjk_tr_na_7_8955a.jpg

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/Norwegian_Military/kjk_tr_na_8_8956a.jpg

[wiking]

those pics are years old, i've got them on my HD and they've been there for a couple of years perhaps.

[TuNeRsHaRk]

those pics are years old, i've got them on my HD and they've been there for a couple of years perhaps.

yeah they came from this site but i was just wondering if theyve started using the g36c yet