F-14 question....

[DPGLAW]

I was just watching a show on the History Channel about the F-14. It was Modern Marvels, my question is the following. The show was speaking of how effective and deadly the Tomcat was during Iraqi Freedom, I thought that it was retirerd prior to this conflict. I may be wrong but I am just curious. They were talking about this software upgrade that was rushed to the theatre to upgrade the F-14 for precision bombing and that there were other upgrades for the model D F-14 that "are coming to the fighters soon" Which, if it was retired by this point makes no sense and even if it was not retired yet, but on it's way, that still makes no sense. Thanks to those who answer my quesiton.

Regards,
Daniel

[usa320]

F-14D's were used in OIF, and they are still being used onboard carriers in small numbers. They are dwindling though, and soon they will be gone.

[Midav]

Actually, USAF is using Tomcats now. I'll show you:

US fighters violate Iranian air space: report

Tehran, Jan 2, IRNA -- A US warplane has violated Iranian air space, this time a border edge near Afghanistan in the eastern province of Razavi Khorassan, in the latest spate of such overflights reported by the press.
According to the evening daily Kayhan, an American fighter entered Iranian air space Thursday night, flying over the southern border strip at Iran's Mousa-Abad region for several minutes.

The US warplane flew back to Afghanistan, from where it had entered the Iranian airspace, the paper added.

Kayhan further quoted an unknown source as saying that three US warplanes had again violated Iranian air space in the southwestern cities of Khorramshahr and Abadan near the Iraqi border.

"The three warplanes, of F-18 Hornets and F-16 Tomcats types, held overflights at high altitudes near the Khorramshahr and Abadan air borders.

"The circular maneuvering of the two American fighters indicated them as carrying out spying sorties and controlling the borders," the paper quoted the source as saying.

The report came less than a week after Iran's Air Force chief, Brigadier Karim Qavami was quoted as having ordered the forces under his command to open fire and shoot down any unidentified aircraft violating the country's air space.

"Given that the intrusion of enemy aircraft over Iran's air space is possible, all fighter jets of the country have been ordered by the Army chief to shoot them down in the event of sighting them," the daily Kayhan quoted Qavami as saying last Saturday.

The Air Force chief stressed that 'any flight (within Iranian air space) must be coordinated, or else it will be targeted', the daily added.

Iran has been wary of the occupation forces' presence on its doorsteps in Iraq and have had their movements under close scrutiny.

In August, press reports said that five US warplanes had entered Iran's air space from the southwestern Shalamcheh border and flown over the city of Khorramshahr.

According the Persian daily Seday-e Edalat, 'the jet fighters which flew at high speed and altitude, then headed to the Arvand River'.

"While the objective of the fighters' violation of Iranian air space is not known yet, some military specialists believe such moves are aimed at assessing the sensitivity of the Islamic Republic's anti-aircraft defense system," the paper said at the time.

In June, Iranian naval guards seized three British boats with eight crew in the country's territorial waters in Arvand river, which borders Iraq.

The servicemen, two Royal Navy sailors and six Royal Marine commandos, were later released.

Qavami also reiterated the readiness of the Iranian air force to confront any foreign threat to the country's nuclear sites.

"We have made planning not only for nuclear centers but also for sensitive and strategic sites," Kayhan quoted him as saying.

His statements came days after army chief General Mohammad Salimi was quoted as saying that the air force has been ordered to be prepared to defend the country's nuclear sites in the event of an attack.

"The air force has been ordered to protect the nuclear sites, using all its power," the daily Iran quoted Salimi as saying, adding the air force had temporarily suspended all its maneuvers in order to focus its capabilities on patrolling the skies over Iran.

Such statements have raised the stakes in a war of words amid foreign press speculation about possible Israeli and American attack on Iran's nuclear facilities.

Iranian military commanders have warned of grave consequences if any such attack takes place.

Israeli Defense Minister Shaoul Mofaz was cited to have tried to 'calm things down' concerning the possibility of the Zionist regime striking Iranian nuclear installations.

"We have to calm things down concerning the so-called intentions attributed to Israel of attacking Iran," AFP quoted Mofaz as saying.

http://www.payvand.com/news/05/jan/1004.html

rofl J/k of course. Thought ya'll would get a kick out of it :D

[Midav]

Before I take off, I wonder why it says three American fighters, then suddenly it's two....? p-)

[Little J]

Think the last F14 sqn stands-down to the F/A-18 F in 2007 (or somewhere close to it). Also think the A model has already gone (will have to have a look to confirm)

[BadKarma26]

I seem to recall that in the first Gulf War the Air Force had in excess of 30 air victories. The navy had around 2. (I could be mistaken)

[fantassin]

That's probably the best known F-14 strike of OIF...


Mistaken airstrike leaves 18 Kurds dead

By Mark McDonald, Ken Dilanian and Jessica Guynn; Mercury News

In the latest ''friendly fire'' episode of the Iraq war, American planes apparently fired by mistake on Kurdish guerrillas and U.S. special-forces soldiers Sunday, killing at least 18 Kurds and injuring about 80 people.

Four Americans also were believed to have died in the attack. U.S. officers from the 173rd Airborne Brigade at Bashur airfield in northern Iraq said U.S. special-forces soldiers were killed, but gave no details.

Despite Sunday's incident, friendly-fire deaths are lower than they were during the 1991 Persian Gulf War, Pentagon officials and defense analysts said.

''This campaign has yielded fewer friendly-fire deaths,'' said Air Force spokesman William Bodie, than other conflicts ''in military history, given the intensity of the war and the intertwining of so many coalition forces.''

The U.S. Central Command said in a brief statement about Sunday's incident: ''Coalition aircraft were conducting close air-support missions at the time, and were in coordination with ground forces. The circumstances contributing to the incident are under investigation.''

Among those killed was a translator for the British Broadcasting Corp., Kamran Abdul Razzaq.

Wagih Barzani, the Kurdish special-forces commander and the younger brother of the powerful Kurdish leader Massoud Barzani, was critically injured. He was flown by helicopter to Bashur airfield, where he was treated and evacuated to a military hospital in Germany. He was in stable but serious condition with a shrapnel injury to the brain, said Lt. Col. Harry Stinger, commander of the 250th Forward Surgical Team.

The incident occurred near Dibakan, a town recently liberated by Kurdish guerrillas about 30 miles southeast of Mosul, Iraq's third-largest city.

About 18 vehicles in the U.S. and Kurdish convoy, including military transports and journalists' vans, were headed to Dibakan when the commander of the U.S. team reportedly called in an airstrike. It was believed he had seen an Iraqi tank that had targeted the convoy.

BBC ''World Affairs'' editor John Simpson, who was in the convoy, said he saw two U.S. F-14 jets come in low. What followed, he said, was ''every type of horror'' as vehicles and bodies burned around him. Razzaq, the BBC translator, died of blood loss after losing his legs in the bombing.

''I saw the bomb coming out of one of the planes, just one bomb, and then extraordinarily I saw it as it came down beside me,'' Simpson said. ''It was painted white and red and it crashed into the ground about 10 yards from where I was standing.''

Several of the vehicles had been carrying ammunition and rockets, which exploded in fires caused by the bombing. TV footage showed a dozen burned, twisted hulks of cars and trucks.

Five British combatants have been killed and dozens of U.S. soldiers injured by friendly fire, the military's term for accidental attacks on its troops. The U.S. military is still investigating the combat deaths of nine Marines near An-Nasiriyah on March 23.

The toll is lower than it was in Afghanistan, where at least 47 allied soldiers were killed in friendly-fire incidents, including four Canadians who were killed when a U.S. Air National Guard F-16 missed its target.

A U.S. Army War College study in 1995 estimated that between 13 percent and 24 percent of U.S. combat casualties in the 20th century were killed or wounded by comrades. Experts say it is nearly impossible to prevent casualties caused by human or mechanical error on the dispersed and chaotic modern battlefield.

This war is even more conducive to friendly-fire casualties, said Andrew Krepinevich Jr., a defense strategist with the independent Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments, because forces are ''spread out in little pockets and islands in different parts of the country.''

Such incidents are a regrettable but inevitable cost of war, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld said last week. ''There has been friendly fire in every war in the history of mankind,'' he said. ''There are portions of this battle space that are enormously complex, and human beings are human beings and things are going to happen.''

But the bombing of Kurdish and U.S. forces 30 miles southeast of Mosul on Sunday led critics to question whether the Pentagon has done enough to reduce the risk.

''It is puzzling that a dozen years after the gulf war highlighted friendly-fire casualties, the Pentagon has still not implemented a high-tech combat identification system for ground forces,'' said John Pike, a defense analyst with Global Security.org.

Concern over friendly-fire deaths soared during the Persian Gulf War, when 24 percent of the 146 American soldiers who died were killed by fellow soldiers, one of the highest percentages in modern warfare. The Pentagon last year scrapped technology designed to avoid friendly-fire deaths because it was too costly, Pike said.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.


Copyright © 2003, San Jose Mercury News

[DPGLAW]

Thanks alot for the answer guys...

Regards,
Daniel

[Argyll]

I seem to recall that in the first Gulf War the Air Force had in excess of 30 air victories. The navy had around 2. (I could be mistaken)

Both from F/A18's ;)

and as far as I'm aware there were NO US SOF caualties in the Blue on blue in the North

[Little J]

I seem to recall that in the first Gulf War the Air Force had in excess of 30 air victories. The navy had around 2. (I could be mistaken)


Believe that the Navy was p****d off with the AirForce back then, coz the AWAC's would send f15's to intercept everything, leaving nothing to the rest of the coalition.

[jedisponge]

That's probably the best known F-14 strike of OIF...


Mistaken airstrike leaves 18 Kurds dead

By Mark McDonald, Ken Dilanian and Jessica Guynn; Mercury News

In the latest ''friendly fire'' episode of the Iraq war, American planes apparently fired by mistake on Kurdish guerrillas and U.S. special-forces soldiers Sunday, killing at least 18 Kurds and injuring about 80 people.

Four Americans also were believed to have died in the attack. U.S. officers from the 173rd Airborne Brigade at Bashur airfield in northern Iraq said U.S. special-forces soldiers were killed, but gave no details.

Despite Sunday's incident, friendly-fire deaths are lower than they were during the 1991 Persian Gulf War, Pentagon officials and defense analysts said.

''This campaign has yielded fewer friendly-fire deaths,'' said Air Force spokesman William Bodie, than other conflicts ''in military history, given the intensity of the war and the intertwining of so many coalition forces.''

The U.S. Central Command said in a brief statement about Sunday's incident: ''Coalition aircraft were conducting close air-support missions at the time, and were in coordination with ground forces. The circumstances contributing to the incident are under investigation.''

Among those killed was a translator for the British Broadcasting Corp., Kamran Abdul Razzaq.

Wagih Barzani, the Kurdish special-forces commander and the younger brother of the powerful Kurdish leader Massoud Barzani, was critically injured. He was flown by helicopter to Bashur airfield, where he was treated and evacuated to a military hospital in Germany. He was in stable but serious condition with a shrapnel injury to the brain, said Lt. Col. Harry Stinger, commander of the 250th Forward Surgical Team.

The incident occurred near Dibakan, a town recently liberated by Kurdish guerrillas about 30 miles southeast of Mosul, Iraq's third-largest city.

About 18 vehicles in the U.S. and Kurdish convoy, including military transports and journalists' vans, were headed to Dibakan when the commander of the U.S. team reportedly called in an airstrike. It was believed he had seen an Iraqi tank that had targeted the convoy.

BBC ''World Affairs'' editor John Simpson, who was in the convoy, said he saw two U.S. F-14 jets come in low. What followed, he said, was ''every type of horror'' as vehicles and bodies burned around him. Razzaq, the BBC translator, died of blood loss after losing his legs in the bombing.

''I saw the bomb coming out of one of the planes, just one bomb, and then extraordinarily I saw it as it came down beside me,'' Simpson said. ''It was painted white and red and it crashed into the ground about 10 yards from where I was standing.''

Several of the vehicles had been carrying ammunition and rockets, which exploded in fires caused by the bombing. TV footage showed a dozen burned, twisted hulks of cars and trucks.

Five British combatants have been killed and dozens of U.S. soldiers injured by friendly fire, the military's term for accidental attacks on its troops. The U.S. military is still investigating the combat deaths of nine Marines near An-Nasiriyah on March 23.

The toll is lower than it was in Afghanistan, where at least 47 allied soldiers were killed in friendly-fire incidents, including four Canadians who were killed when a U.S. Air National Guard F-16 missed its target.

A U.S. Army War College study in 1995 estimated that between 13 percent and 24 percent of U.S. combat casualties in the 20th century were killed or wounded by comrades. Experts say it is nearly impossible to prevent casualties caused by human or mechanical error on the dispersed and chaotic modern battlefield.

This war is even more conducive to friendly-fire casualties, said Andrew Krepinevich Jr., a defense strategist with the independent Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments, because forces are ''spread out in little pockets and islands in different parts of the country.''

Such incidents are a regrettable but inevitable cost of war, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld said last week. ''There has been friendly fire in every war in the history of mankind,'' he said. ''There are portions of this battle space that are enormously complex, and human beings are human beings and things are going to happen.''

But the bombing of Kurdish and U.S. forces 30 miles southeast of Mosul on Sunday led critics to question whether the Pentagon has done enough to reduce the risk.

''It is puzzling that a dozen years after the gulf war highlighted friendly-fire casualties, the Pentagon has still not implemented a high-tech combat identification system for ground forces,'' said John Pike, a defense analyst with Global Security.org.

Concern over friendly-fire deaths soared during the Persian Gulf War, when 24 percent of the 146 American soldiers who died were killed by fellow soldiers, one of the highest percentages in modern warfare. The Pentagon last year scrapped technology designed to avoid friendly-fire deaths because it was too costly, Pike said.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.


Copyright © 2003, San Jose Mercury News
Thank you fatassasin for your ever helpful posts. I don't know whether we should pity you or be happy that you have a nice niche here.

[fantassin]

You can't blame me for the fact a British TV crew filmed the whole scene, from the guiding of LGBs by an SF team on to hull-down T55s to the "blue on blue"; that's why it was the best know bombing made by F-14s, both because it was filmed from the beginning to the end (and played time and again on cable news) and because of its sad end.

And don't worry about my niche.

[usa320]

Dont blame the tomcat, it was the SOF team that had painted the target.



"Given that the intrusion of enemy aircraft over Iran's air space is possible, all fighter jets of the country have been ordered by the Army chief to shoot them down in the event of sighting them

What? i thought they were UFO's.

:roll:

Im sorry, but for Iran to shoot down a US Air Force plane, would A) be extremely difficult and B) be the second worse mistake iran has every made, second only to the hostage crisis, which put them on our ****list in the first place.

Chances are, they were Recon sorties, looking for any movement of enemy forces between Iran and Iraq/Afghanistan. its about bloody time we started taking a closer look at the borders, and if Iran doesnt like it, they can stuff it up their asses.


Also think the A model has already gone (will have to have a look to confirm)

I reckon only D and B models remain in service, and perhaps a handful of A+ models. But the A models are gone for the most part, rightfully so, their engines were crap.

[fantassin]

To answer all your questions on F-14s and OIF, wait until April 2005 and get this book....


http://www.ospreypublishing.com/title_detail.php/title=S8030