Chirac Rejects FM's Request to Add Hezbollah to Terror List

[Bluezoo]

Chirac rejects FM's request to add Hezbollah to EU terror list

By Aluf Benn, Haaretz Correspondent, The Associated Press and Haaretz Service

French President Jacques Chirac on Monday rebuffed Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom's request to add the militant Hezbollah organization to the European Union's list of terror organizations.

During a meeting with Shalom on Monday afternoon, Chirac said France's efforts in the coming weeks will be focused primarily on the democratic process in Lebanon and the upcoming elections to be held in two months.

Shalom made the request during a meeting with his French counterpart Michel Barnier earlier this month.

The EU will hold an initial discussion on the Israeli request, which is based on the danger posed by Hezbollah to new Palestinian Authority Chairman Mahmoud Abbas.

Both Israeli and Palestinian sources have accused the Hezbollah of trying to organize Palestinian attacks on Israelis, in order to torpedo the cease-fire understandings reached between Abbas and Prime Minister Ariel Sharon at Sharm el-Sheikh last week.

France has played the primary role in blocking the addition of the Hezbollah to the list to date.

Shalom asks France to use its influence in Arab world to promote warmer Arab-Israeli ties
Shalom asked France to use its influence in the Arab world to help promote better relations between Israel and Persian Gulf and North African nations.

Shalom, speaking after a meeting with President Jacques Chirac, said France could also play "a key role" in isolating groups set on disrupting peace efforts between Israelis and Palestinians.

"I asked the assistance of President Chirac to help us to have better relations with North African countries and the Gulf states," Shalom said, "and bring his influence among those countries in order to have better understanding between Israel [and those nations]."

Shalom also said he was "very encouraged" by the French government's recent efforts to crack down on anti-Semitism, and its "determination" to curb the activities of right-wing extremists.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/540152.html

[BlackRain]

The reason is that Iran is France largest trading partner in the Middle East and a source for much needed oil.


French Foreign Trade Minister Francois Loos said in Paris on Thursday that Iran ranks first among France Trade partners in the Middle East.

Source: http://www.payvand.com/news/04/oct/1126.html

If France adds this terrorist group to the list (even though they killed French soldiers in the past) it would affect French commerce. Hezbollah is a state-sponsored terrorist group by Iran.

[SHAM]

This is nothing new, show me a country that doesnt look over its own interests first?
This does'nt make it moraly correct ofcourse but it happens every day. People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones, and thats all of us, nobody in any country is exempt including mine own.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

That nutty French government just keeps on knockin' 'em out of the park! First they set up the US at the UN by outright lying to Powell (in order to keep their deal with Saddam & his oil bucks), then they drop sanctions against China for human rights violations they have not rectified so they can sell them weapons, and now this tidbit. Those crazy French, I dunno - I just can't stay mad at them.

[BarkingSquirrel]

This is nothing new, show me a country that doesnt look over its own interests first?Funny, when the US does it, it's an evil right-wing conspiracy. When someone else does it, its "nothing new".

Hypocrites make the world go round.

[roland]

So ? does that means Chirac support terrorism ?












:cantbeli:

[SHAM]

This is nothing new, show me a country that doesnt look over its own interests first?Funny, when the US does it, it's an evil right-wing conspiracy. When someone else does it, its "nothing new".

Hypocrites make the world go round.

Absolutely right, its the world we live in.

[BarkingSquirrel]

He's not moving against it, what other option does that leave?

[SHAM]

So ? does that means Chirac support terrorism ?












:cantbeli:


HaHa interesting concept, lets just say he supports french interests or others will begin to spin the "support terrorislm" line.

[roland]

He's not moving against it, what other option does that leave?

When the USA were making friend with the barbed nuts in Afganistan, we were fighting the Wahaby/Salafist terrorism on our soil and worked with the Algerians and the Moroccans to eradicate it. That was in the 90s.
We have no advice to recieve from you. You are so clumsy that's dangerous. No thanks. Better work with the other European country and Russia.

[BarkingSquirrel]

The only decent french fighters are the french foriegn legion, who by definition aren't french. You can talk about having to take advice when you're powerful enough to start a supposed "illegal" war with absolutely no repercussions.

Don't you have some african children to rape, get AIDS from, then lobby an international tax for to try and fix it?

Or perhaps you'd rather be invaded yet again.

[roland]

The only decent french fighters are the french foriegn legion, who by definition aren't french. You can talk about having to take advice when you're powerful enough to start a supposed "illegal" war with absolutely no repercussions.

Don't you have some african children to rape, get AIDS from, then lobby an international tax for to try and fix it?

rofl

[FaDeR_SP]

The French are funny.... :fork:

[Bluezoo]

That nutty French government just keeps on knockin' 'em out of the park! First they set up the US at the UN by outright lying to Powell (in order to keep their deal with Saddam & his oil bucks), then they drop sanctions against China for human rights violations they have not rectified so they can sell them weapons, and now this tidbit. Those crazy French, I dunno - I just can't stay mad at them.

Well, you might as well add these:

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=38377

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/02/14/opinion/fenton/main673966.shtml

[BlackRain]

So ? does that means Chirac support terrorism ?












:cantbeli:


ADL to French President: Don't Legitimize Hezbollah

New York, NY, October 24, 2002... The Anti-Defamation League (ADL) today expressed concern that President Jacques Chirac of France had conferred legitimacy upon the Hezbollah terrorist leader Hassan Nasrallah while addressing the recent Francophone Summit in Lebanon, at which Nasrallah was present.


US Congress Urges EU to Add Hezbollah to Terriorist List

Sends Letter Praising French President Chirac For Fighting Anti-Semitism and Deciding to Ban al-Manar Television

(Washington, DC) - Today, Representatives Robert Wexler (D-FL), Ileana Ros-Lehtinen (R-FL), Gary Ackerman (D-NY), Dan Burton (R-IN), Eliot Engel (D-NY), Robert Menendez (D-NJ), Dennis Cardoza (D-CA), Joseph Crowley (D-NY), Anthony Weiner (D-NY), Benjamin Cardin (D-MD), James Oberstar (D-MN), Howard Berman (D-CA), Alcee Hastings (D-FL) and Jerrold Nadler (D-NY) sent a letter to French President Jacques Chirac praising his government's recent decision to ban al-Manar - the official television network of Hezbollah, a terrorist organization responsible for the deaths of innocent citizens throughout the world.

This past Monday, France’s highest administrative court issued a clear directive to the French-based Eutelsat company to shut down al-Manar broadcasts following accusations that its programs were anti-Semitic and could incite hatred. Earlier today, the US State Department officially designated al-Manar television as a terrorist organization.

The congressional letter requests that President Chirac take immediate steps to recommend that Hezbollah be added to the European Union's (EU) terrorist list, thereby precluding European funding for Hezbollah-related activities throughout the world. As one of the most widespread networks of global terror, Hezbollah supports, finances and cooperates with groups demarcated on the EU terrorist list, including the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, Hamas, the Palestinian Islamic Jihad, the Palestinian Liberation Front and the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine. Hezbollah has led a global campaign of terror for 22 years targeting Americans, Europeans, Israelis, Kuwaitis, Saudi Arabians, Argentineans and Russians, among others.

Since al-Manar's inception in 1991, its programming has been replete with vitriolic anti-Israel and anti-American sentiment as well as virulent anti-Jewish propaganda.

Hezbollah, which has claimed responsibility for numerous suicide bombings in Israel, uses al-Manar as a means to glorify Palestinian violence and to promote armed-resistance against Americans, Israelis and Jews. Hezbollah continues to use al-Manar as the mouthpiece of anti-Semitic messages, violence and terror, which has caused the deaths of many innocent individuals, and therefore it is critical that al-Manar be banned throughout Europe and Hezbollah be added to the EU's terrorist lists. (Please find a copy of the letter below)

Congressman Wexler serves on the House International Relations Committee and the House Judiciary Committee

[roland]

ADL to French President: Don't Legitimize Hezbollah

US Congress Urges EU to Add Hezbollah to Terriorist List


ah, if the ADL and US Congress says so .. and we didn't obey ? how fool :cantbeli: yep, funny french :fork:

Just the last one is a little funny, Black Rain. It had been discussed here
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=32606&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=16
and as you didn't said anything in the end I thought you were convinced by rational arguments. But no, or is it you are bad faith ?

Now, I know that al-Manar is banned in France. Is it banned in the states ? tell us ?

[2Sheds_Jackson]

As I see it, the issue really isn't one of "are the French bad". I mean, as has been said here - they are free to pursue their own agenda & push their own national interests.

Occasionally, everybody has to make a deal with the devil. When bullets are flying, nations have been known to partner with unsavory allies just to achieve victory. Sometimes, there just isn't much of a choice. But this seems to be different. The French, over the past 3 years or so, have formed a consistent pattern - and the stakes really haven't been that high. They're not in a war, they do not have lives at stake - they're not trying to promote democracy - not trying to contain dictators...all these actions seem to simply be about money & keeping the rich industrialists wealthy.

And the problem is that they cannot reasonably do the things they have - make the deals they have, and still be regarded as promoting traditional Western values. When they put arms exports over the promotion of human rights - when they refuse to recognize terrorist groups because it's bad for trade - these things damage their standing and move them ever more from the "us" column to the "them" column. Just my .02.

[RGRBOX]

Of cource he does, he's affraid of the back lash from the large % of Arabs that live in France. This also why they're affraid to do anything negative towards the Arabs in the Middle East...Oh! but they will not stop for anything in Africa. Man the French government are number 2 on my **** list of Governments that makes me sick!!! Nº 1 guess?

[Sharp]

The only decent french fighters are the french foriegn legion, who by definition aren't french.

It's not what think Mme Rice when she suck us for have our troops.


You can talk about having to take advice when you're powerful enough to start a supposed "illegal" war with absolutely no repercussions.

Don't you have some african children to rape, get AIDS from, then lobby an international tax for to try and fix it?


Can we say that this soldiers are "decent", from wich side are they ?

http://www.chez.com/frenzy/images/torture_chien_opt.jpg
http://www.chez.com/frenzy/images/torture_pyramide_2.jpg
http://www.chez.com/frenzy/images/torture_pyramide.jpg
http://www.chez.com/frenzy/images/torture_lynndie_1_opt.jpg
http://www.chez.com/frenzy/images/lynndie_england_3_opt.jpg
http://www.chez.com/frenzy/images/torture_boite_opt.jpg
http://www.chez.com/frenzy/images/torture_sabrina_1_opt.jpg
http://permanent.nouvelobs.com/photos/20040824.OBS7493.jpg

God bless the freedom soldiers.

Next time forget your lessons and arrogance.

[BlackRain]

Now, I know that al-Manar is banned in France. Is it banned in the states ? tell us ?

Glad you asked.

A State Department spokesperson claimed that action against Al-Manar was justified because “terrorist activity” by Hezbollah was linked to “incitement” by Al-Manar television. “The designation is to put Al-Manar Television on the terrorist exclusion list because of its incitement of terrorist activity. Our law says that the organization can be put on the list if it commits or incites to commit any terrorist activity, and that is what we’ve found them,” said Richard Boucher.

The terrorist exclusion list (TEL), authorized by Section 411 of the USA PATRIOT Act of 2001, authorizes the exclusion and deportation of aliens who support terrorist organizations. According to the State Department’s website, TEL also deters donation or contributions to named organizations, heightens public awareness and knowledge of terrorist organizations, alerts other governments to U.S. concerns about organizations engaged in terrorist activities, and stigmatizes and isolates designated terrorist organizations.

Intelsat satellite company had stopped relaying the station's signal to USA audiences. In addition, Arabsat, a Saudi owned satellite company, and Globecast, a French owned satellite company, sell al-Manar to various satellite providers around the globe. On December 13, 2004, the Council of State asked Eutelsat to put an end to the broadcasting of Al Manar over the French territory.


Inciting Violence against Americans:



Al-Manar programming has called on Jihadis to kill American soldiers in Iraq. One video proclaims: “Down with the mother of terrorism! America threatens in vain, an occupying army of invaders. Nothing remains but rifles and suicide bombers” The video ends with an image of a suicide bomber's belt detonating.


In one Al-Manar video, the Statue of Liberty transforms into a knife-wielding ghoul drenched in blood.


Another compares the United States to Nazi Germany and ends with a split screen of President Bush and Adolf Hitler.


Hizballah's leader Hassan Nasrallah uses Al-Manar call for “Death to America” and denounces America as the “Great Satan” and a “beast that is hungry for power and hungry for blood.”


Hizballah's Trail of Terror:



Until the al-Qaeda attacks of September 11, Hizballah had killed more Americans than any other terrorist organization.


Hizballah was behind1983 suicide bombing of the U.S. Marine barracks in Lebanon that claimed 241 American lives.


Hizballah was involved in the 1985 hijacking of TWA Flight 587 during which a U.S. Navy diver was executed.


Hizballah has been linked to the 1996 attack against the Khobar Towers in Saudi Arabia that killed 19 Americans and wounded hundreds more.

[Bluezoo]

As I see it, the issue really isn't one of "are the French bad". I mean, as has been said here - they are free to pursue their own agenda & push their own national interests.

Occasionally, everybody has to make a deal with the devil. When bullets are flying, nations have been known to partner with unsavory allies just to achieve victory. Sometimes, there just isn't much of a choice. But this seems to be different. The French, over the past 3 years or so, have formed a consistent pattern - and the stakes really haven't been that high. They're not in a war, they do not have lives at stake - they're not trying to promote democracy - not trying to contain dictators...all these actions seem to simply be about money & keeping the rich industrialists wealthy.

And the problem is that they cannot reasonably do the things they have - make the deals they have, and still be regarded as promoting traditional Western values. When they put arms exports over the promotion of human rights - when they refuse to recognize terrorist groups because it's bad for trade - these things damage their standing and move them ever more from the "us" column to the "them" column. Just my .02.

Agreed!

[Sayeret]

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=38379

[Bluezoo]

The only decent french fighters are the french foriegn legion, who by definition aren't french.

It's not what think Mme Rice when she suck us for have our troops.


You can talk about having to take advice when you're powerful enough to start a supposed "illegal" war with absolutely no repercussions.

Don't you have some african children to rape, get AIDS from, then lobby an international tax for to try and fix it?


Can we say that this soldiers are "decent", from wich side are they ?

God bless the freedom soldiers.

Next time forget your lessons and arrogance.


"He who doesn’t shout the truth, when he knows the truth, make himself an accomplice of liars and falsifiers! "
Charles PEGUY

http://www.algerie-francaise.org/english/bouquin-traduit.jpg

Gee, I wonder who has forgotten the lessons of arrogance? Why not look at this:

The Torture of Algiers
Adam Shatz, The New York Review Of Books - November 21, 2002

In the fall of 1957, Louisette lghilahriz, a twenty-year-old soldier in the Front de Libération Nationale (FLN), the Algerian nationalist underground seeking to end French rule, was captured by French paratroopers on the outskirts of Algiers. Badly wounded in battle, she was transferred to a prison in the capital, where she spent the next three months under interrogation. According to lghilahriz, now a psychologist and a grandmother of three, she was stripped naked, raped, and tortured repeatedly, before being rescued by a French military doctor who found her huddled in a pool of excrement and menstrual blood. ;)

In the summer of 2000, lghilahriz spoke of her torture for the first time in an interview with Florence Beaugé, Le Monde's correspondent in Algiers . Thanks to Beaugé's story, which ran on the paper's front page, lghilahriz became the catalyst of a debate about the legacy of the French-Algerian war -a largely French debate, but one that is beginning to have ripple effects on the other side of the Mediterranean .

lghilahriz's testimony was especially powerful because of who she is. A student of the work of Victor Hugo and a fluent speaker of French, she has far more in common with her French contemporaries than with the bearded fundamentalists who waged jihad in her country throughout the 1990s, often singling out secular, professional women for assassination. What made her interview particularly poignant was that she seemed to be moved less by rage at her jailers than by gratitude to the doctor who saved her. She told Beaugé she broke her silence in the hope of finding Dr. Francis Richaud. (He had died in 1997.) At the same time, lghilahriz did not hesitate to name the officers in attendance during her ordeal, most notably Jacques Massu, the head of the 10th division of paratroopers and a trusted ally of De Gaulle. Her charges provoked an uproar. A distinguished :roll: ninety-four-year- old retired general, Massu has long acknowledged the use of torture by the French army, and his reply to lghilahriz was remarkably temperate. Although he said he did not recall witnessing her torture, he said her testimony was otherwise credible, and that he knew the doctor to whom she paid such moving tribute. "Torture," he told Le Monde, "isn't indispensable in times of war, and one can very well do without it. When l look back on Algeria, it saddens me... One could have done things differently." Massu's peers were furious. General Marcel Bigeard, who was also accused of torture by lghilahriz, and who is said to have thrown Algerian prisoners from helicopters during the war, called her remarks a "tissue of lies." :roll: But the most explosive reply of ail came from Paul Aussaresses, an obscure, eighty- four-year-old general, in an interview with Le Monde in the fall of 2000......

....In his memoirs, Services Spéciaux: Algérie 1955-1957, which was published in the spring of 2001 and which has now been translated into English as The Battle of the Casbah, he writes of his exploits in graphic, often gleeful detail .He is eager to take credit for France's "victory" in the Casbah, but the credit, he admits, is not his alone. As he points out, ail the major parties backed the war, even, for a time, the Communists. Far from being vigilante "excesses," as France's political class has long maintained, torture and other war crimes were widespread, systematic, and largely approved by the government, which had acquired special powers in a unanimous parliamentary vote in early 1956. Aussaresses says he reported to one Judge Jean Berard, an emissary of François Mitterrand, who was then the minister of justice in Guy Mollet's cabinet. Berard "covered our actions.... l had an excellent relationship with him, with nothing to hide."

If torture inspires widespread condemnation in France today, as it did not during the war, ifs partly because one can no longer defend it as an unfortunate necessity. France's defeat made a mockery of that argument. A scathing cartoon of Aussaresses in Charlie Hebdo, the French humor magazine, may have put it best: "Yes, torture was necessary!" Aussaresses exclaims. "Without it, we would have lost Algeria."

The question now is: Were these French soldiers put in jail?

For the full copy of this article: http://www.algeria-watch.de/farticle/analyse/shatz_torture.htm

Sounds familiar? Go to this: http://www.ipsnews.org/interna.asp?idnews=24395

and http://www.algerie-francaise.org/english/index.shtml

[roland]

I see blue zob. The French tortured in Algeria so the American can too right ?

Sharp: si je peux me permettre, l'autre abrutit s'etait assez ridiculisé tout seul. ça marche plus de nos jours son "argument" à la con.

[Bluezoo]

I see blue zob. The French tortured in Algeria so the American can too right ?

Sharp: si je peux me permettre, l'autre abrutit s'etait assez ridiculisé tout seul. ça marche plus de nos jours son "argument" à la con.

" The French tortured in Algeria so the American can too right ?"

Roland, get your English right. ;) rofl

Just to get this straight, stop recycling the matter of Abu Garib because SOME of your troops are not holier than the Americans. It is sickening when you post those pictures when you and Sharp also have skeletons in your closet.

Now, to answer your question: I cannot speak for the Americans because I am not one.

On my personal opinion, I think torture is wrong. It does not make things right to say that since the French did it in Algeria, it gave ANYBODY the right to employ it in times of war.

Now, let me ask you one simple question just to meet this issue head on: Were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians ever put to jail like some of the Americans involved in Abu Garib? ;)

[roland]

Roland, get your English right. ;) rofl

yeah, that would be nice if you could correct my post before I send them. We can continue the conversation in french though.



Were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians ever put to jail like some of the Americans involved in Abu Garib? ;)
Can't you post without so many colors, we're not blind.
Well none were put in jail afaik. We are not stupid enough to let those who did this dirty business take photos.
But I agree with you, torture, not only is bad, it's also counter productive as it makes you lose on the moral ground. And the moral ground is where all wars are won.

[RGRBOX]

As I see it, the issue really isn't one of "are the French bad". I mean, as has been said here - they are free to pursue their own agenda & push their own national interests.

Occasionally, everybody has to make a deal with the devil. When bullets are flying, nations have been known to partner with unsavory allies just to achieve victory. Sometimes, there just isn't much of a choice. But this seems to be different. The French, over the past 3 years or so, have formed a consistent pattern - and the stakes really haven't been that high. They're not in a war, they do not have lives at stake - they're not trying to promote democracy - not trying to contain dictators...all these actions seem to simply be about money & keeping the rich industrialists wealthy.

And the problem is that they cannot reasonably do the things they have - make the deals they have, and still be regarded as promoting traditional Western values. When they put arms exports over the promotion of human rights - when they refuse to recognize terrorist groups because it's bad for trade - these things damage their standing and move them ever more from the "us" column to the "them" column. Just my .02.

Agreed!

I have to share the roads with them everyday, and I can say that they drive like ****...

[Bluezoo]

Roland, get your English right. ;) rofl

yeah, that would be nice if you could correct my post before I send them. We can continue the conversation in french though.



Were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians ever put to jail like some of the Americans involved in Abu Garib? ;)
Can't you post without so many colors, we're not blind.
Well none were put in jail afaik. We are not stupid enough to let those who did this dirty business take photos.
But I agree with you, torture, not only is bad, it's also counter productive as it makes you lose on the moral ground. And the moral ground is where all wars are won.

"yeah, that would be nice if you could correct my post before I send them. We can continue the conversation in french though."

Ok. I am sorry. I also make mistakes . Continue in French? Sorry, I am just a lowly scribe. ;)

"Well none were put in jail afaik".

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)

"We are not stupid enough to let those who did this dirty business take photos"

Perhaps there were no digital cameras then? rofl

Seriously, pictures only make things graphic. Torture is torture and it is wrong. Proof can readily be obtained through the admissions of Jacques Massu, General Marcel Bigeard and the testimony of the families of these victims and victims themselves such as Louisette lghilahriz.

My next question is: Did the French government acknowledge publicly its "mistakes" (torture etc.) in Algeria and have they made reparations to the victims or their families?

"But I agree with you, torture, not only is bad, it's also counter productive as it makes you lose on the moral ground. And the moral ground is where all wars are won."

Agreed!

[RGRBOX]

Roland, get your English right. ;) rofl

yeah, that would be nice if you could correct my post before I send them. We can continue the conversation in french though.



Were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians ever put to jail like some of the Americans involved in Abu Garib? ;)
Can't you post without so many colors, we're not blind.
Well none were put in jail afaik. We are not stupid enough to let those who did this dirty business take photos.
But I agree with you, torture, not only is bad, it's also counter productive as it makes you lose on the moral ground. And the moral ground is where all wars are won.

"yeah, that would be nice if you could correct my post before I send them. We can continue the conversation in french though."

Ok. I am sorry. I also make mistakes . Continue in French? Sorry, I am just a lowly scribe. ;)

"Well none were put in jail afaik".

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)

"We are not stupid enough to let those who did this dirty business take photos"

Perhaps there were no digital cameras then? rofl

Seriously, pictures only make things graphic. Torture is torture and it is wrong. Proof can readily be obtained through the admissions of Jacques Massu, General Marcel Bigeard and the testimony of the families of these victims and victims themselves such as Louisette lghilahriz.

My next question is: Did the French government acknowledge publicly its "mistakes" (torture etc.) in Algeria and have they made reparations to the victims or their families?

Yes they did, go to France and see all the Algerians living there off of the welfare state...

"But I agree with you, torture, not only is bad, it's also counter productive as it makes you lose on the moral ground. And the moral ground is where all wars are won."

How would the French know that, they've never won any wars...

Agreed!

[roland]

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)


nooooo ! don't tell me you believe Abu Garib is the personal initiative of a bunch of lost soldiers :cantbeli:
LOL what a naive moron you are !

[RGRBOX]

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)


nooooo ! don't tell me you believe Abu Garib is the personal initiative of a bunch of lost soldiers :cantbeli:
LOL what a naive moron you are !

No crap, If anyone should be tried and fried for this, then it should be the Chain of Command. Not a couple of Sp4. You can't tell me that the higher up's knew nothing about this....

[Bluezoo]

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)


nooooo ! don't tell me you believe Abu Garib is the personal initiative of a bunch of lost soldiers :cantbeli:
LOL what a naive moron you are !


There you go again. You are asking for my personal opinion and I answered you candidly. Am I saying that my opinion is right? No, that is why it is an opinion. If you have a better perspective, then by all means, share it. But it is what I believe. Do you understand this? :cantbeli:

Does Liberte Egalite Fraternite ring a bell? ;)

You pontificate about the rights of these prisoners and yet, you brazenly forget that even the Abu Garib guards also have rights. If you want to broaden your witch-hunt, be my guest. BUT, ANYBODY being accused of a crime is presumed innocent until proven guilty. ;)

On the other hand, you are so quick to accuse an entire army based on your speculations, ASSumptions, misplaced pride and parochial biases. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk...are you a devoted follower of the Jean Paul Marat or the Jacobins? rofl

Now, you say that I am naive. Put your money where your mouth is. Let me challenge you if you have the brains or the balls to prove that Abu Garib went even further up, because if you have PROOF (evidence), if you understand this term, you could be the next star witness in the U.S. Senate! rofl

Assuming without admitting that the prosecution of these American soldiers did not go far enough to include your alleged higher authorities, AT LEAST it is a start. Justice is still an evolving process which is being served.

Let me turn the table and boy, you better come up with answers and not skirt this question: Why were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians never put to jail ?

Political accomodation? Pride? ;)

[Bluezoo]

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)


nooooo ! don't tell me you believe Abu Garib is the personal initiative of a bunch of lost soldiers :cantbeli:
LOL what a naive moron you are !

No crap, If anyone should be tried and fried for this, then it should be the Chain of Command. Not a couple of Sp4. You can't tell me that the higher up's knew nothing about this....


Please, the theory of Chain of Command or perhaps, command responsibility, "Common Plan" was only used in the Spandau Trial to establish a link to convict Hitler's generals to the crimes related to the Second WW. With all due respect, you cannot use this theory today without risking your case being quashed right at the onset of the trial. ;)

[johnyjee]

The only decent french fighters are the french foriegn legion, who by definition aren't french. You can talk about having to take advice when you're powerful enough to start a supposed "illegal" war with absolutely no repercussions.

Don't you have some african children to rape, get AIDS from, then lobby an international tax for to try and fix it?

rofl
funny :lol:

another funny thing here : http://www.political-comedy-central.com/wtc/wtc_jump2.jpg[/url]

[roland]

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)


nooooo ! don't tell me you believe Abu Garib is the personal initiative of a bunch of lost soldiers :cantbeli:
LOL what a naive moron you are !


There you go again. You are asking for my personal opinion and I answered you candidly. Am I saying that my opinion is right? No, that is why it is an opinion. If you have a better perspective, then by all means, share it. But it is what I believe. Do you understand this? :cantbeli:

Does Liberte Egalite Fraternite ring a bell? ;)

You pontificate about the rights of these prisoners and yet, you brazenly forget that even the Abu Garib guards also have rights. If you want to broaden your witch-hunt, be my guest. BUT, ANYBODY being accused of a crime is presumed innocent until proven guilty. ;)

On the other hand, you are so quick to accuse an entire army based on your speculations, ASSumptions, misplaced pride and parochial biases. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk...are you a devoted follower of the Jean Paul Marat or the Jacobins? rofl

Now, you say that I am naive. Put your money where your mouth is. Let me challenge you if you have the brains or the balls to prove that Abu Garib went even further up, because if you have PROOF (evidence), if you understand this term, you could be the next star witness in the U.S. Senate! rofl

Assuming without admitting that the prosecution of these American soldiers did not go far enough to include your alleged higher authorities, AT LEAST it is a start. Justice is still an evolving process which is being served.

Let me turn the table and boy, you better come up with answers and not skirt this question: Why were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians never put to jail ?

Political accomodation? Pride? ;)

Your soap is quite undigestible.
Of course that was a mistake.
[check your Inbox]

[RGRBOX]

Interesting. At least the Americans had the decency to prosecute those involved in Abu Garib and put them in jail. So, think looooong and haaaard before you start posting pictures about Abu Garib because the act of the few does NOT reflect the rest of the armed forces. ;)


nooooo ! don't tell me you believe Abu Garib is the personal initiative of a bunch of lost soldiers :cantbeli:
LOL what a naive moron you are !


There you go again. You are asking for my personal opinion and I answered you candidly. Am I saying that my opinion is right? No, that is why it is an opinion. If you have a better perspective, then by all means, share it. But it is what I believe. Do you understand this? :cantbeli:

Does Liberte Egalite Fraternite ring a bell? ;)

You pontificate about the rights of these prisoners and yet, you brazenly forget that even the Abu Garib guards also have rights. If you want to broaden your witch-hunt, be my guest. BUT, ANYBODY being accused of a crime is presumed innocent until proven guilty. ;)

On the other hand, you are so quick to accuse an entire army based on your speculations, ASSumptions, misplaced pride and parochial biases. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk...are you a devoted follower of the Jean Paul Marat or the Jacobins? rofl

Now, you say that I am naive. Put your money where your mouth is. Let me challenge you if you have the brains or the balls to prove that Abu Garib went even further up, because if you have PROOF (evidence), if you understand this term, you could be the next star witness in the U.S. Senate! rofl

Assuming without admitting that the prosecution of these American soldiers did not go far enough to include your alleged higher authorities, AT LEAST it is a start. Justice is still an evolving process which is being served.

Let me turn the table and boy, you better come up with answers and not skirt this question: Why were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians never put to jail ?

Political accomodation? Pride? ;)

YEA! What he said...

[Bluezoo]

The only decent french fighters are the french foriegn legion, who by definition aren't french. You can talk about having to take advice when you're powerful enough to start a supposed "illegal" war with absolutely no repercussions.

Don't you have some african children to rape, get AIDS from, then lobby an international tax for to try and fix it?

rofl
funny :lol:

another funny thing here : http://www.political-comedy-central.com/wtc/wtc_jump2.jpg[/url]

What's funny about this? Dude, you are sick! There were Canadians who died in 9-11. :fork:

[RGRBOX]

The only decent french fighters are the french foriegn legion, who by definition aren't french. You can talk about having to take advice when you're powerful enough to start a supposed "illegal" war with absolutely no repercussions.

Don't you have some african children to rape, get AIDS from, then lobby an international tax for to try and fix it?

rofl
funny :lol:

another funny thing here : http://www.political-comedy-central.com/wtc/wtc_jump2.jpg[/url]

What's funny about this? Dude, you are sick! There were Canadians who died in 9-11. :fork:

What's so funny about the death of someone. You must watch too much TV and play too many Video Games, I've seen death first hand and respect it too much to play with it like it's some kind of game. Get a life, and pull you head out, MAC.... :cantbeli:

[roland]

@johnyjee

Incompréhension. Si tu lis le thread en entier, tu verras que en fait je me foutais de la réponse de l'autre abrutit.
Ce thread est vraiment partit en live, je pense que le petit trou du cul de blue zob a fini par foutre la merde. c'est ce qu'il veut, c'est un troll.

[johnyjee]

@johnyjee

Incompréhension. Si tu lis le thread en entier, tu verras que en fait je me foutais de la réponse de l'autre abrutit.
Ce thread est vraiment partit en live, je pense que le petit trou du cul de blue zob a fini par foutre la merde. c'est ce qu'il veut, c'est un troll.
ouais, mais tu c pkoi jai poster ceci? eux, il parent sur leurs " la france a perdu une guerre " alors ils se foutent de nous pendant des siecle, et bien eux ils peuvent bien aller sacheter de nouvelles tours rofl rofl

[Bluezoo]

@johnyjee

Incompréhension. Si tu lis le thread en entier, tu verras que en fait je me foutais de la réponse de l'autre abrutit.
Ce thread est vraiment partit en live, je pense que le petit trou du cul de blue zob a fini par foutre la merde. c'est ce qu'il veut, c'est un troll.

Do not hide under the skirt of your French native tongues if you cannot meet the issues head on. Don't worry, bullets would not be flying in this thread so, there is no need to retreat or surrender?

IF YOU HAVE THE BALLS, WHY NOT WRITE IT IN ENGLISH SO THAT I MAY RETURN THE FAVOR AND REPLY ACCORDINGLY. :P

Speaking of comprehension, please read the rules of this forum. ;)

[RGRBOX]

@johnyjee

Incompréhension. Si tu lis le thread en entier, tu verras que en fait je me foutais de la réponse de l'autre abrutit.
Ce thread est vraiment partit en live, je pense que le petit trou du cul de blue zob a fini par foutre la merde. c'est ce qu'il veut, c'est un troll.

Do not hide under the skirt of your French native tongues if you cannot meet the issues head on. Don't worry, bullets would not be flying in this thread so, there is no need to retreat or surrender?

IF YOU HAVE THE BALLS, WHY NOT WRITE IT IN ENGLISH SO THAT I MAY RETURN THE FAVOR AND REPLY ACCORDINGLY. :P

Speaking of comprehension, please read the rules of this forum. ;)

Il est pas grave, come d'abitude les Francé parle du merde...

As you can see it's not my native language but, because I live over here, I do understand... Not worth reading accually, the French are just showing why Blue, isn't their true color, but Yellow.... Viva, Los Vegas!!!!

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

Whats this! Americans running off at the mouth over France's refusal to consider Hizbollah as a terror group, I give you http://noraid.org/ all your dollar donations are tax deductable so that should make easy on the pocket when you pony up some terror money for the cause. C*nts. :|

[roland]

Do not hide under the skirt of your French native tongues if you cannot meet the issues head on. Don't worry, bullets would not be flying in this thread so, there is no need to retreat or surrender?

IF YOU HAVE THE BALLS, WHY NOT WRITE IT IN ENGLISH SO THAT I MAY RETURN THE FAVOR AND REPLY ACCORDINGLY. :P

Speaking of comprehension, please read the rules of this forum. ;)

yawn.
and what's the question ?

[Bluezoo]

Do not hide under the skirt of your French native tongues if you cannot meet the issues head on. Don't worry, bullets would not be flying in this thread so, there is no need to retreat or surrender?

IF YOU HAVE THE BALLS, WHY NOT WRITE IT IN ENGLISH SO THAT I MAY RETURN THE FAVOR AND REPLY ACCORDINGLY. :P

Speaking of comprehension, please read the rules of this forum. ;)

yawn.
and what's the question ?

Tsk, tsk, tsk, you obviously need to brush up your English reading and comprehension skills. The question is in front of your computer screen!

But to facilitate things, in case you have a difficult time following the thread, I asked you this question to wit:

1. Why were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians never put to jail ?

And do you consider this as your answer or are you skirting the issue?

"Your soap is quite undigestible.
Of course that was a mistake. "

Thereafter, Monsieur Johnyjee posted the picture which appears to be a man falling from the 9-11 Twin Towers. He "thinks" it is "funny". With all due respect, this is the hight of poor taste or the sign of a sick mind! As a result, I asked him this question which he has not answered thus far:

2. "What's funny about this? ...."

Thereafter, Monsieur Roland and Monsieur Johnyjee started to speak in French. I don't mind, heck you can have the fine dinning or disner chit chat for yourselves,BUT when the two of you start dropping my name, please have the balls to direct your ire in English and address it to me, rather than veil it between the two of you as lovers, in the secrecy of your French tongue. ;) rofl

To summarize, there are TWO questions and no answers. If you are man enough, consider the paragraph preceding as a challenge. p-)

[roland]

Do not hide under the skirt of your French native tongues if you cannot meet the issues head on. Don't worry, bullets would not be flying in this thread so, there is no need to retreat or surrender?

IF YOU HAVE THE BALLS, WHY NOT WRITE IT IN ENGLISH SO THAT I MAY RETURN THE FAVOR AND REPLY ACCORDINGLY. :P

Speaking of comprehension, please read the rules of this forum. ;)

yawn.
and what's the question ?

Tsk, tsk, tsk, you obviously need to brush up your English reading and comprehension skills. The question is in front of your computer screen!

But to facilitate things, in case you are have a difficult time following the thread, I asked you this question to wit:

1. Why were those French political figures, generals, troopers and whomsoever implicated in the torture of Algerians never put to jail ?

And do you consider this as your answer or are you skirting the issue?

"Your soap is quite undigestible.
Of course that was a mistake. "

Thereafter, Monsieur Johnyjee posted the picture which appears to be a man falling from the 9-11 Twin Towers. He "thinks" it is "funny". With all due respect, this is the hight of poor taste or the sign of a sick mind! As a result, I asked him this question which he has not answered thus far:

2. "What's funny about this? ...."

Thereafter, Monsieur Roland and Monsieur Johnyjee started to speak in French. I don't mind, heck you can have the fine dinning or disner chit chat for yourselves,BUT when the two of you start dropping my name, please have the balls to direct your ire in English and address it to me, rather than veil it between the two of you as lovers, in the secrecy of your French tongue. ;) rofl

To summarize, there are TWO questions and no answers. If you are man enough, consider the paragraph preceding as a challenge. p-)

Care to ask your question politely and clearly ? spare me all the colors, laughing smileys and sarcasm. I'm not a garbage collector, I don't want to sort the garbage you write before I can answer. Retry, I'm sure you can.

[Thor]

I don't think Hezbollah should be added to the terror list. They're the modern day PLO and got great public support. You can't eradicate them.

I've said it before and I say it again: you can critizise both the US and France for having double standards.

As for France having interests in Iran, so do the US.

[Bluezoo]

Roland wrote:


Care to ask your question politely and clearly ? spare me all the colors, laughing smileys and sarcasm. I'm not a garbage collector, I don't want to sort the garbage you write before I can answer. Retry, I'm sure you can.

Politely? :roll: Why don't you read your posts and find out who has been short of this demeanor?

Clearly? :cantbeli: How clear can it get when I even summarized the questions. If spoonfeeding does not work, sorry, I cannot go further and chew it for you. The fault is not among the stars but in yourselves that you are underlings!

Garbage collector? I did not know you would see yourself as such because I did not, directly or unwittingly say that in my posts.

Spare me of your malarkey if you like to pity yourself or skirt the two questions posted above.

[roland]

Tell us bluezoo: is web browsing part of your therapy ? tell your doctor it doesn't do you any good :petting:

[Bluezoo]

Tell us bluezoo: is web browsing part of your therapy ? tell your doctor it doesn't do you any good :petting:

So, you are now a doctor? rofl quack quack quack rofl

Web browsing? And what exactly were you doing when you posted this? rofl

Again, you are becoming very creative in dodging or skirting the issues. Why am I not surprised. :roll: Well, perhaps vegetating and procastinating is passed from one generation to another in your part of the world.

You waste my time.

Adeu, Trolland, ehem, I mean Monsieur Roland. ;)