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J-10
02-17-2005, 03:48 AM
Radio silence for Iraq tanks
16 February 2005

Challenger tanks and Warrior fighting vehicles in Iraq are not to be fitted with the new Bowman radio system when it is deployed, due to problems with headsets and intercoms

The Army's heavily delayed digital radio system is ready to be deployed in Iraq but cannot be fitted to tanks and armoured fighting vehicles, it emerged on 15 February 2005.

The £2.1bn Bowman system is to be used in Iraq next month by the 12th Mechanised Brigade, but due to problems with radio headsets it cannot be installed in Challenger 2 tanks or Warrior vehicles.

The project has been delayed as the Ministry of Defence (MoD) and supplier General Dynamics could not resolve a problem with the tanks' intercom system, which meant that soldiers could not hear properly over their headsets. The MoD was planning to use old headsets as a cost saving move but they proved incompatible with the intercom which often stops working.

"This isn't a specific problem of Bowman itself but its really to do with the new intercom equipment in the Warrior vehicles and the Challenger 2. They weren't able to get the equipment installed in time," an MoD spokesperson told Government Computing News.

"This is being worked on at the moment and the idea is that it's ready for the 7th and 8th brigades when they also start to use the system later on in the year. The problem was really all about putting a new system in existing vehicles. It's the sort of issue that tends to affect many of these types of complex procurements."

Earlier testing in Canada had shown the system to be inadequate in several key areas. The MoD found that when it was installed in some vehicles such as Land Rovers its weight caused the axles to break. In addition, it was initially delivered with headsets that did not fit over helmets, and the programming system was initially found to be too inflexible for combat use.

During testing in 2004, there were difficulties with getting the combat management system software and some of the battlefield information system applications to run over Bowman.

There have also been worries over the levels of radiation feared to be emitted by Bowman. During testing the MoD had to release guidelines to soldiers not to stand within six feet of a vehicle when the system is in operation. They were also advised not to use the system at full power as the radiation Bowman emits was found to exceed standards set by the National Radiological Protection Board.

Senior officers have admited that they are disappointed that the system will not be used in the tanks and Warrior vehicle.

"We wanted to take the Warriors converted. We wanted to take the Challengers converted, of course we did. But we had to make that call," one senior officer told a press briefing.

Bowman is often cited as a prime example of IT project failure. The original contract with BAE systems was scrapped in 1999 due to lengthy delays. Soldiers in previous conflicts including Kosovo and Afghanistan resorted to using mobile phones because of the inadequacies of the existing Clansman radio system.
From (http://rds.yahoo.com/S=53720272/K=tanks/v=2/SID=e/l=NSR/R=1/SIG=13aqvcocc/EXP=1108716002/*-http%3A//www.kablenet.com/kd.nsf/Frontpage/058973F1F740A8F580256FAA003915E7?OpenDocument)

James
02-17-2005, 04:18 AM
Earlier testing in Canada had shown the system to be inadequate in several key areas. The MoD found that when it was installed in some vehicles such as Land Rovers its weight caused the axles to break. In addition, it was initially delivered with headsets that did not fit over helmets, and the programming system was initially found to be too inflexible for combat use.

There have also been worries over the levels of radiation feared to be emitted by Bowman. During testing the MoD had to release guidelines to soldiers not to stand within six feet of a vehicle when the system is in operation. They were also advised not to use the system at full power as the radiation Bowman emits was found to exceed standards set by the National Radiological Protection Board.


:| WTF kind of comms gear is this? Better to use an old AN/PRC 77...

Frost
02-17-2005, 05:47 AM
WTF kind of comms gear is this?
x2 This is nuts! If it's that bad, than better stick with the old stuff which works

khukuri
02-17-2005, 07:05 AM
WTF kind of comms gear is this?
x2 This is nuts! If it's that bad, than better stick with the old stuff which works

Deplying it with units back in the states is one thing. But with units in iraq?! Thats crazy whatever it is. theres ALWAYS problem when you deploy new hardware, thats why you have to test it first.

sp2c
02-17-2005, 07:52 AM
WTF kind of comms gear is this?
x2 This is nuts! If it's that bad, than better stick with the old stuff which works

Deplying it with units back in the states is one thing. But with units in iraq?! Thats crazy whatever it is. theres ALWAYS problem when you deploy new hardware, thats why you have to test it first.

the US does not have Challenger tanks ;)

anyways the title is a bit suspicious, it makes it sound like the tanks and ifv's are driving around without communications systems which doesn't seem right they just don't get the latest gizmo yet because it doesn't work yet

Stolly
02-17-2005, 03:20 PM
Sounds like they tried to get old headsets to work with the new system to save money, and its ended up not working.

Gyles84
02-17-2005, 03:30 PM
All hail the British MOD. They work such wonders. :slap:

Michael RVR
02-17-2005, 08:48 PM
It sounds like more of a GD screwup to me, though i'm sure both parties are part to blame.

mi35d
02-17-2005, 08:57 PM
Hey! Shouldn't "Limey" be posting this story? Oh, wait - it's knocking Brit equipment not US. p-)

PsihoKeke
02-18-2005, 02:56 AM
January 10, 2005: Britain is having yet another major disaster with the introduction of a new army radio. The Bowman line of tactical radios was developed to replace the 1980s era Clansman series. The Bowman radios were to be more secure, capable of handling digital data, easier to use and so on. Didn’t work out that way. The Bowmans weigh three times as much as the ones they are replacing (15 pounds, versus five), and that’s without the control unit that was to fit around the operators wrist. This came in at 4.4 pounds, and was wisely dropped as unworkable. But the Bowmans have other problems, like sometimes causing radiation burns on the operator when transmitting. The $3.7 billion dollar project was so flawed that the Director of Infantry refused to accept the radios. He was overruled by the government, and came out and said so. He told the troops to hang on to their cell phones.

This is not the first time the British have had problems with tactical radios. They were slow to adopt FM for tactical radios. Although FM was only developed during the 1930s, the United States was quick to realize that the better quality sound on FM solved the problem with various types of noise (electronic and otherwise) radio users had to contend with in combat situations. The U.S. went into World War II with FM tactical radios. But even the radios the British did introduce during World War II had serious technical problems. These problems continued during the Cold War, although the Clansman series of radios turned out pretty well.

Found it onhttp://www.strategypage.com/

martinexsquaddie
02-18-2005, 04:21 AM
BETTER
OFF
WITH
MAP
AND
NOKIA
make sure you get a contract with plenty of free minutes your going to need them(':(')
reason why staying with clansman isn't an option is because its about 30 years out of date and ****e.