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View Full Version : Courage on the battlefield: Modern wars vs. Ancient wars


Benny
03-12-2005, 09:56 PM
Many times I questioned myself if a infantry soldier fighting in the Napoleonic wars or during the American Civil War was braver than a soldier fighting in a modern war (considering "modern wars" as the ones fought since the beginning of WWII)?

On one side, you have a battlefield that required soldiers to march or stand in a solid formation, armed only with a musket and a bayonet, facing enemy artillery, cavalry, fighting face to face with enemy infantry, with no proper medical aid in case of injury, subject to strict discipline, bad logistics, required to obey order blindly, fearing officers from a superior social background and, many times, without any basic education, simply ignoring the political or national interests that dictated them to fight and die on the battlefield.

On the other side, on a modern war, we have soldiers fighting with the help of technology, killing and dying without seeing the enemy, politically motivated, counting with good logistics and medical assistance in case of injury, not ignoring the motives of the war that they are fighting, etc, etc.

Or is it that maybe the courage required from an infantry soldier isn't much different nowadays than that that was required 200 years ago?

Or could it be that, afterall, and in spite of technological advances introduced on the modern battlefield, the basic human requirements that make a good infantry soldier, and the difficulties which they face haven't changed that much since them?

Of course that one can question if the ACW or WWI (just to mention some) shouldn't be considered modern wars, where technology and industrial power played a fundamental role (long range rifles instead of muskets, machine guns, modern artillery, tanks and airplanes were introduced before WWII), but let's just say, without pretending to be profound on this matter, that I consider these to be technological wars fought with obsolete tactics.

Myself, If I was given the oportunity to chose, I would chose a modern battlefield.

Anyway, I hope some of you consider this an interesting topic.

digrar
03-12-2005, 10:29 PM
I find it difficult to differentiate between the two lines of soldiers who charge at each other and hack each other with swords or spears, to the diggers who jumped out of a trench stormed across a tennis court sized battlefield into machine gun fire, or the Infantrymen who walked through jungles of South East Asia with ambush or mines/ booby traps only a step away. I wouldn't like to put one above the others.

James
03-12-2005, 11:57 PM
I find it difficult to differentiate between the two lines of soldiers who charge at each other and hack each other with swords or spears, to the diggers who jumped out of a trench stormed across a tennis court sized battlefield into machine gun fire, or the Infantrymen who walked through jungles of South East Asia with ambush or mines/ booby traps only a step away. I wouldn't like to put one above the others.

Yeah...

I would rather not be shot at AT ALL, never mind if it is a musket, machine gun, or 122mm rocket :| .

I think soldiers today know a lot more about the risks they face than soldiers in the past, but that doesn't make them braver, just better informed.

piesmatt
03-13-2005, 03:29 PM
The idea of facing death will always remain in any war. But I think that it would have just sucked a lot more the further back you go. Hundreds of people being disemboweled by sword and pike or knowing you have to cross the wire amid machine gun fire and mustard gas takes a lot of courage to deal with. Even for the troops in the rear, ailments such as diarrhea and Dysentary have always run rampant. You can take away some of the human element of war, and make it safer and more comfortable, but war is still hell.

Para
03-13-2005, 06:41 PM
A battle in Napoleonic times would last for a day, although a war could go on for years. Like today you stand and fight for your mates and to survive the battle, for as a soldier that is your main concern. Your greatest worry is a nasty wound which will take ages to kill you, the other is letting your mates down. Man has thought up so many more ways to kill each other these days than they had in days gone by. You might no longer advance in squares, but just think of the weapons than can brought to bear on an attacking force. NO the men haven't changed just weapons have.

IAF
03-13-2005, 10:47 PM
warfare before gunpowder was more cruel and intimate in a way you had to charge at your foe and chop him up with your sword, with his blood and guts spilling right before your eyes.

It's amazing our forebears who engaged in such bloody warfare did not stay traumatized for long. Roman legionaries retired and went into farming and raising families. King David of Israel hacked into his foes in the field of battle and then went on to write the Psalms

Para
03-14-2005, 08:39 AM
IAF

You have obviously not used a bayonet in action or set about some one with trenching tool

IAF
03-14-2005, 09:27 AM
IAF

You have obviously not used a bayonet in action or set about some one with trenching tool

You mean use a bayonet in anger or charged at an enemy soldier? Not yet...