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Beowulf
03-17-2005, 02:49 PM
The discussion in this thread: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=41497

Made me curious about rebreathers. I didn't want to hijack the thread...

I got this from howstuffworks.com:


In conventional SCUBA gear, when you breathe in through the mouthpiece you get a fresh lungful of air from the tank that you carry on your back. When you breathe out, the exhaled air goes out through the regulator into the water in the form of bubbles. A rebreather is a SCUBA device that allows you to breathe your own air over and over again and produce no bubbles. To allow you to re-breathe your air, the device must do the following:
Remove your exhaled carbon dioxide - This is accomplished through the use of a cannister of sodium hydroxide (Sofnolime). The carbon dioxide (gas) reacts with sodium hydroxide and calcium hydroxide to form calcium carbonate (solid).
Replace oxygen that you have consumed - Small tanks of pure oxygen or mixed gases (nitrogen-oxygen or helium-oxygen) inject fresh oxygen into the breathing loop.
Control the oxygen concentration in the breathing loop - Solid-state oxygen sensors monitor the partial pressure of oxygen in the breathing loop and send this information to a microprocessor that controls the oxygen-delivery system.
There are three types of rebreathers: oxygen, semi-closed circuit and closed circuit. Oxygen rebreathers carry a cylinder of pure oxygen as the only gas supply. They are limited to "no decompression" depths and carry a danger of oxygen toxicity. Semi-closed circuit rebreathers use gas mixtures as the gas supply. A diver using a semi-closed rebreather can go to greater depths without risking oxygen toxicity. Closed-circuit rebreathers carry both pure oxygen and mixed gases. They differ from semi-closed circuit rebreathers in the way that they maintain the oxygen concentration.
Rebreathers have several advantages compared to conventional SCUBA:

Better gas efficiency - Conventional SCUBA wastes oxygen, because we don't consume all of the oxygen in the air we inhale. rebreathers replace only the consumed oxygen, so they don't waste gas.
Lighter weight - Compressed air is 78-percent nitrogen, so most of the weight of air in conventional SCUBA is nitrogen. Rebreathers don't have to carry nitrogen along with the oxygen, so for the same amount of oxygen they can be lighter.
Less decompression - Because the nitrogen in the system, which is involved in "the bends", is kept to a minimum, decompression is less complicated and divers can stay down longer than with conventional SCUBA.
Silent - Rebreathers produce few or no bubbles, so they don't disturb marine life or reveal the diver's presence.
Rebreathers are considered to be advanced SCUBA gear, originally developed and typically used by the military, especially the U.S. Navy SEALs. Although they are not generally used by the beginning or average sport SCUBA diver, some advanced and commercial divers use rebreathers. Rebreathers are expensive (up to $15,000), and you must have specialized training to use them.

interesting stuff...

HooyahCQB
03-17-2005, 02:53 PM
Yep. The dive shop I go to has a couple. Very interesting rigs.

Beowulf
03-17-2005, 02:53 PM
found this as well:
from howstuffworks


...In humans breathing 100-percent oxygen at normal pressure, the following effects were observed:

Pulmonary edema (intensive-care patients on breathing machines at 30 hours or more exposure)

Decreases in the rate of gas exchange across the alveoli (intensive-care patients on breathing machines at 30 hours of exposure)

Chest pains that were worse during deep breathing (volunteers with 24 hours of exposure)

Decrease in the total volume of exchangeable air in the lung (vital capacity) by 17 percent (volunteers with 24 hours of exposure)

Local areas of collapsed alveoli when plugged by mucus, a condition called atelectasis (patients, volunteers). The oxygen entrapped in the plugged alveolus gets absorbed into the blood, no gas is left to keep the plugged alveolus inflated and it collapses. Mucus plugs happen normally but are cleared by coughing. Also, if alveoli become plugged during air breathing, the nitrogen entrapped in the alveoli keeps them inflated.

Blindness caused by inadequate development of the capillaries in the lens and retina of the eye (premature infants). Reducing the oxygen to 40 percent can prevent this blindness.

However, the astronauts in the Gemini and Apollo programs breathed 100-percent oxygen at reduced pressure for up to two weeks with no problems.

In contrast, when 100-percent oxygen is breathed under high pressure (above 3000 torr), acute oxygen poisoning can occur with these symptoms:
nausea
dizziness
muscles twitches
blurred vision
seizures/convulsions

Such high oxygen pressures can be experienced by military SCUBA divers using rebreathing devices, divers being treated for the bends in hyperbaric chambers or patients being treated for acute carbon monoxide poisoning. These patients must be carefully monitored during treatment.

Initiative
03-17-2005, 02:54 PM
Draeger is also the best maker of anesthesia machines.

Beowulf
03-17-2005, 03:05 PM
Draeger is also the best maker of anesthesia machines.

they got a pretty cool game here...

http://clients.wmteam.de/draeger/firefighter_en/index_fmx.php?link=http://www.draeger.com/ST/internet/US/en/Industries/Fire/fire_es.jsp

Flagg
03-17-2005, 06:04 PM
I love diving(especially for FREE crays/lobsters 2 hours up the beach) and I had a keen interest to learn more about rebreathers(particularly to see if semi-closed might suit as an option for my diving needs).

The guy who owns this website rocks(although it hasn't been updated in quite some time).

http://www.nobubblediving.com/

It has a excellent coverage and photos of Draeger and Soviet era military rebreathers.

It also has photos and description of a badass Naval Spetsnaz scooter acquired by the site owner:

http://www.nobubblediving.com/protei.htm

I was particularly intrigued by the Russian IDA-71 and Russia's approach to rebreathers.

Traditional rebreathers use a chemical to absorb EXCESS CO2 given off by the user during respiration. O2 is supplied by an O2 bottle trickling the gas into the system. It allows for very long underwater duration compared to open circuit SCUBA, but you are limited to shallow water operation.

The Russian approach was to use a chemical that instead of ABSORBING CO2, it PRODUCED O2. In theory it sounds like a pretty elegant design, except for the fact that the chemical becomes highly toxic and combustible if contaminated by water. That and the fact it contained asbestos :roll:

For a better description click here:

http://www.nobubblediving.com/ida71.offboard.htm

I don't know the author personally, but he took the time to help with my inquiries.

I wonder if Matchanu has any diving experiences or stories he'd be willing to share?

ibstolidude
03-17-2005, 06:10 PM
Draeger is also the best maker of anesthesia machines.

they got a pretty cool game here...

http://clients.wmteam.de/draeger/firefighter_en/index_fmx.php?link=http://www.draeger.com/ST/internet/US/en/Industries/Fire/fire_es.jsp
you are freaking bored!

Initiative
03-17-2005, 06:35 PM
Draeger is also the best maker of anesthesia machines.

they got a pretty cool game here...

http://clients.wmteam.de/draeger/firefighter_en/index_fmx.php?link=http://www.draeger.com/ST/internet/US/en/Industries/Fire/fire_es.jsp

:lol: Enjoying some Saint Patrick's Day beer?