Big Business Wants To Ban Guns At Work

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

It seems its just not the "liberal communists" that are determined to strip Americans of their rights, BIG BUSINESS wants to deprive deprive gun owners of the right to carry weapons in their cars and trucks at work.
http://www.havegunwillvote.com/index.php?sec=news&id=254

[joe mama]

It seems its just not the "liberal communists" that are determined to strip Americans of their rights, BIG BUSINESS wants to deprive deprive gun owners of the right to carry weapons in their cars and trucks at work.
http://www.havegunwillvote.com/index.php?sec=news&id=254

The difference is some of these companies come at this from wanting to avoid being sued by someone that works for them who gets hurt in some kind of workplace violence incident. They're out to protect themselves financially. Others come at it from a political correctness point of view, thinking guns are evil and by saying "no guns", things will be safer. Do you seriously think the kind of person that would walk into work and shoot their co workers will be deterred by a policy written in an employee handbook that says "no guns"? There was a workplace shooting about 10 miles from where I live a few years ago. One of the people shot was licensed to carry, but not allowed to at work. If he'd been allowed to carry at work (the state trusted him enough to allow him to carry in public), and had been carrying the day the nut walked in shooting, would things have turned out different? Possibly. Not guaranteed, but possibly.

Some of you people from the UK and elsewhere seem to think American companies are giant fascist dictatorships - you'd be surprised to learn how much liberal PC crap they believe in and try to force on their workers. Like sending us to diversity training, so we won't hate any one group. Know what I learned in diversity training? That I didn't care about black lesbian eskimos before the class...but now I hate them just as much as I hate anyone else! There's diversity for ya! ;)

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

Some of you people from the UK and elsewhere seem to think American companies are giant fascist dictatorshipsNah we think all large companies are facist dictatorships not just the American corps, they try to sell that sugar coated PC **** here but no one takes any notice. When I first started in management the company I was with brought in consultants to try and smooth out my rough edges and shape me into something more appealing to our customers their efforts were in vain and it left me with a disdain for normal business practices, even today I still freak out my employers and co-workers.
p-)

[Oddbod]

"Are we promoting open firefights in the parking lot?" says Paul Viollis, president of Risk Control Strategies in New York. "For legislation to permit employees and contractors to bring loaded firearms to work in vehicles is blatantly irresponsible."

This is more of the "rivers of blood" drivel promulgated by the GFWs.

By banning employees from having firearms in their vehicles when parked on Company property, are these businesses potentially putting their employees lives at risk during their travel to & from work?

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

are these businesses potentially putting their employees lives at risk during their travel to & from work?Which makes me wonder of how often do you hear of Americans getting attacked or shot at on their way to or from work.

[askDNA]

Big Business is hardly American :| They sold their souls away to foreign interests a lonnnnnng time ago.

[Oddbod]

Big Business is hardly American :| They sold their souls away to foreign interests a lonnnnnng time ago.

Same here in the UK :(

When all the manufacturing jobs are gone, who is going to pay taxes to support all the Gov't employees?

Short term greed = long term misery.

[Pandy]

Big Business is hardly American :| They sold their souls away to foreign interests a lonnnnnng time ago.

Same here in the UK :(

When all the manufacturing jobs are gone, who is going to pay taxes to support all the Gov't employees?

Short term greed = long term misery.

Sounds like Yanks and Red-Coats need to get together for a beer... ;)

[Oddbod]

Big Business is hardly American :| They sold their souls away to foreign interests a lonnnnnng time ago.

Same here in the UK :(

When all the manufacturing jobs are gone, who is going to pay taxes to support all the Gov't employees?

Short term greed = long term misery.

Sounds like Yanks and Red-Coats need to get together for a beer... ;)

Those of us with our veyes wide open anyway :hug:

[obd]

Yes the world is closing in around the single white overweight balding male who dreams of one day taking his scoped assault rifle (with 75 round drum mag) to the office with him and hanging it on the wall cubicle right above his computer/ workspace.

[obd]

Oddbod wrote------>This is more of the "rivers of blood" drivel promulgated by the GFWs.By banning employees from having firearms in their vehicles when parked on Company property, are these businesses potentially putting their employees lives at risk during their travel to & from work?<-------------------"



Hey Oddbod, dont you think YOUR idea that banning them is "endangering the lives of workers to and from work" is the SAME "rivers of blood" drivel?!?!?! Do you really think its THAT dangerous going too and from work. Do you really NEED a shotgun to defend yourself on the way to work?!?! ROFLMAO!!

[Oddbod]

Oddbod wrote------>This is more of the "rivers of blood" drivel promulgated by the GFWs.By banning employees from having firearms in their vehicles when parked on Company property, are these businesses potentially putting their employees lives at risk during their travel to & from work?<-------------------"



Hey Oddbod, dont you think YOUR idea that banning them is "endangering the lives of workers to and from work" is the SAME "rivers of blood" drivel?!?!?! Do you really think its THAT dangerous going too and from work. Do you really NEED a shotgun to defend yourself on the way to work?!?! ROFLMAO!!

I think the likelihood of someone having to defend themselves whilst travelling to, or from their place of employment is far greater than the chance of them going ape**** & using their CCW to attack fellow employees. :cantbeli:

[ElHombre]

It seems its just not the "liberal communists" that are determined to strip Americans of their rights, BIG BUSINESS wants to deprive deprive gun owners of the right to carry weapons in their cars and trucks at work.
http://www.havegunwillvote.com/index.php?sec=news&id=254

it's rather simple. if employees park their vehicles on a parking lot owned by a company, the company can set the rules for those vehicles. if they don't want guns to be seen in their lots, they can make a rule saying those vehicles will not be allowed. it is their property, after all.

you can always park your vehicle somewhere else.

i once worked at a place that had that rule. a manager's car was discovered to contain a gun. he was fired for violating stated company policy.

[obd]

Yeah no ****......gun owners are always whining and complaining about thier rights (which is fine with me) but then they dont want to respect other peoples rights to set the standards of what happens on their own freakin property!!! Ironic.

A private company should have every right to ban employees from taking firearms onto thier property. Considering all the recent cases of disgruntled employees shooting up office coworkers I think its a valid worry.

Not to mention there is simply no place for a rifle or assault rifle at the workplace.

[Legion]

It seems its just not the "liberal communists" that are determined to strip Americans of their rights, BIG BUSINESS wants to deprive deprive gun owners of the right to carry weapons in their cars and trucks at work.
http://www.havegunwillvote.com/index.php?sec=news&id=254

it's rather simple. if employees park their vehicles on a parking lot owned by a company, the company can set the rules for those vehicles. if they don't want guns to be seen in their lots, they can make a rule saying those vehicles will not be allowed. it is their property, after all.

you can always park your vehicle somewhere else.

i once worked at a place that had that rule. a manager's car was discovered to contain a gun. he was fired for violating stated company policy.
The fact of the matter is my vehicle is my property, no matter where it's parked. My employer has no authority of any kind to regulate what I carry inside it. Even a law enforcement officer has to have one of three things to search my vehicle: 1) Search Warrant 2) consent to search 3) probable cause (i.e. gun in plain view, smell of alcohol or drugs, etc). So tell me why should my employer have more authority than a LEO?

HB823 that is currently in the Texas senate has provisions for employers that the only way they can keep you from carrying in you car is to give you a guarantee of safety in your parking area. I'll bet banning handguns in vehicles sounds good to employers until they have to shell out money to keep you safe in their parking lot.

[Geezah]

I'm not allowed to bring firearms into the building I work in, I can leave it locked in my car but as my last car was half inched form the car park, I'm abit paras about doing that. Anyway, if I am attacked between the entrance and my car, I will sue Miller Valentine as they are denying my right to defend myself, and while doing so they have made no attempt to put on extra security.

Also the DEA work out of our building, there's some days you will come in and the building stinks of skunk, plus I've watched them load up in the past, they have an impressive arsenal upstairs.

[Geezah]

A private company should have every right to ban employees from taking firearms onto thier property. Considering all the recent cases of disgruntled employees shooting up office coworkers I think its a valid worry.

That's all well and dandy but if that is the case, then I want armed security making sure I will not become a disgruntled employees victim. Seeing as your so well versed on the ramdom attacks that have taken place in the workplace, how many of these attacks were by a person with his CCW?



Not to mention there is simply no place for a rifle or assault rifle at the workplace.

rofl Who on Earth is going to try and CCW a rifle rofl plus I do not own any ASSault rifles, as these are full auto/select fire and I do not have my Class III ;)

[BarkingSquirrel]

are these businesses potentially putting their employees lives at risk during their travel to & from work?Which makes me wonder of how often do you hear of Americans getting attacked or shot at on their way to or from work.Seems you've never heard of carjacking.

[dacanadianbomb]

I also am governed by a internal rule that no firearms are allowed on the premises.
My work is on extra-territorial ground, so of course being an european representative office we must play it safe.
I have often wondered about the possibility of our office becoming a target for movements wishing to gain a political ear.Also because of our close proximity to embassies.

I would see it this way, the car is mine and noone can decide what I am allowed to have in there unless it is against a law. But I am parking on company grounds, and therefor I must abide by their rules in regards.
I am allowed to regulate the same on my grounds if I so choose.

Lifes hard sometimes.

[joe mama]

Here's my take on this: if it's private property, then they should be able to ban guns and other things. For example, we have the right to say "Bush is great" or "Bush is evil" or whatever, but you don't have the right to go on private property and say it - if it's private property, you can be asked to leave, and if you don't, the cops can remove you for trespassing.

Now, on the other hand, I'm opposed to the decision to ban guns, because it's done from a feel good perspective. Anyone that's going to snap and shot people is not going to be deterred by a policy that says "no guns". And if the state, and therefore the majority of the population, thru the actions of the elected representatives, approve of me carrying legally, then the company should be ok with it too.
We had a workplace violence incident here at my building. A former employee came to our building and assaulted two current employees at our front door, and then took off after one of them almost punched him out. They just happened to be outside at the time he showed up, if they weren't there's no reason to think he wouldn't have come up to our office door and entered (it was unlocked at the time). We have a "no weapons" policy in our employee handbook, however anybody that thinks that would have stopped him from bringing a weapon if he had chosen to is a fool, especially considering he didn't work for us anymore. If he had brought a weapon, either that day, or if he'd flipped out when he worked for us, and I had been armed (I'm the only person in the office that I know of licensed to ccw), I certainly would have had a greater chance of stopping him armed then I would unarmed.

Any worker that is unstable enough to flip out at work while armed and start blasting is just as likely to flip out and bring a weapon from home. If you think that because they'd have to bring it on another day or go home first they wouldn't do it, you're thinking the same kind of thing as the people who think no criminal will ever hurt you unless you resist them in some way.

Anyway, to recap: I'm very much in favor of the right of private property owners to ask anyone to leave for pretty much any reason (which is why I say the companies can say you can't be armed, and if you are, leave). But I'm very opposed to the reason why they exercise this right, as it's not based on realism, it's based on feelings. If they'd provide competent and adequate armed security, I'd be less opposed to the decision.

[Geezah]

We have a "no weapons" policy in our employee handbook, however anybody that thinks that would have stopped him from bringing a weapon if he had chosen to is a fool, especially considering he didn't work for us anymore.

You mean to say that those few words in a handbook won't stop someone bent on shooting up an office?

[joe mama]

We have a "no weapons" policy in our employee handbook, however anybody that thinks that would have stopped him from bringing a weapon if he had chosen to is a fool, especially considering he didn't work for us anymore.

You mean to say that those few words in a handbook won't stop someone bent on shooting up an office?

Of course they will! You're CLEARLY a redneck gun nut if you don't think those magical words will stop him!

[martinexsquaddie]

slightly odd discussion taking guns to work :roll:

[Geezah]

slightly odd discussion taking guns to work :roll:

Not really, the Police do it every day.

[martinexsquaddie]

yes but I don't think we are talking about police military jobs here

[Howitz]

Are there any articles someone can dig up where a CCW owner used his weapon to rob/threaten/otherwise go nutty? I don't think i've ever read one.

[joe mama]

slightly odd discussion taking guns to work
yes but I don't think we are talking about police military jobs here

The people who we're talking about, legal gun owners carrying (ccw or in their cars) their guns legally, don't just get magically transported from their safe little castle to their office, and don't always go straight home after work or straight to the office from home. Ok, ccw for normal people doesn't exist there, and that's fine, but it does here, and it's quite legal in many places. If the state trusts me to be licensed to ccw, what does it matter if I'm going out to dinner or to a movie or to work or food shopping? If I'm licensed to do it, and I decide I need or want to, wherever I'm going, that should be enough.

[Geezah]

I went to Krogers while carrying and surpise surprise, nothing happened. I felt like a big boy all for 1/2 an hour p-)

[joe mama]

I went to Krogers while carrying and surpise surprise, nothing happened. I felt like a big boy all for 1/2 an hour p-)

But why would you possibly need to carry while food shopping? And you realize it's just a miracle that you didn't flip out on that 86 year old woman that was slow getting her coupons out in the check out line and shoot her 96 times, right? After all, we're all so hot to be "tooled up!!!" so we can blast anyone that blinks at us, we're not just law abiding citizens taking some responsibility for our own safety with an effective tool for self defense...

[ElHombre]

The fact of the matter is my vehicle is my property, no matter where it's parked.

by that logic, you should let a drug user into your home with all the crack he can carry in his pockets. after all, its his clothes.


My employer has no authority of any kind to regulate what I carry inside it

it's their lot. they can say what can be on it or in the cars that are in it. if you don't like it, get your own lot.

[joe mama]

The fact of the matter is my vehicle is my property, no matter where it's parked.

by that logic, you should let a drug user into your home with all the crack he can carry in his pockets. after all, its his clothes.

Except for the minor fact that the crack he's carrying is illegal, and we're talking about LEGALLY carried guns.


My employer has no authority of any kind to regulate what I carry inside it

it's their lot. they can say what can be on it or in the cars that are in it. if you don't like it, get your own lot.

I do agree with you on this one, from a private property owners rights point of view. I think it's a stupid decision, but we don't just have the right to do smart things, we have the right to do stupid things to. It's like the stores that post signs saying NO CCW (or whatever). I support their right to do it, but I don't support their choice.

[Legion]

The fact of the matter is my vehicle is my property, no matter where it's parked.

by that logic, you should let a drug user into your home with all the crack he can carry in his pockets. after all, its his clothes.


My employer has no authority of any kind to regulate what I carry inside it

it's their lot. they can say what can be on it or in the cars that are in it. if you don't like it, get your own lot.

My point is this, just as the parking area is the property of your employer, your vehicle is your property. Just as your employer can dictate what goes on on their property, you can do the same. That is part of what HB823 is trying to address.
Here's the deal, when my employer guarantees my safe passage to and from their private property in writing with a large monetary benefit for my family in the case of my death in a violent crime, then I will rethink my attitude.

[Geezah]

My employer has no authority of any kind to regulate what I carry inside it

it's their lot. they can say what can be on it or in the cars that are in it. if you don't like it, get your own lot.

I do agree with you on this one, from a private property owners rights point of view. I think it's a stupid decision, but we don't just have the right to do smart things, we have the right to do stupid things to. It's like the stores that post signs saying NO CCW (or whatever). I support their right to do it, but I don't support their choice.

A company has a right to impose it's rules and regulations on those that work for them but if they are to deny an individual a certain right, then they should make sure that there are no repercussions when denying the individual of certain rights...............I.E. Armed Security should be on hand 24/7 to provide protection for that individual.

On the subject of stores that do not support my rights, I respect their wishes and shop elsewhere ;)

[ElHombre]

if i have a business, i don't want to scare off potential customers with the sight of guns in the cars of the employees. i have a feeling that business owners are going to have this bill quietly strangled.

[Geezah]

if i have a business, i don't want to scare off potential customers with the sight of guns in the cars of the employees. i have a feeling that business owners are going to have this bill quietly strangled.

When you lock a firearm in a car, it isn't locked in plain sight :cantbeli: so the only way someone else would see the firearm is if they were in it uninvited.

I think I know which side of the fence your on........with all your scaremongering.

[ElHombre]

scaremongering, my a$$. if word gets out that a business allows firearms to be carried in their parking lots, locked away or not, more customers will stay away than shop there thinking they're safe and the business will die. since the owners don't want this to happen, they will make it a point to announce that they do not permit firearms on their property. period.

[Geezah]

scaremongering, my a$$. if word gets out that a business allows firearms to be carried in their parking lots, locked away or not, more customers will stay away than shop there thinking they're safe and the business will die. since the owners don't want this to happen, they will make it a point to announce that they do not permit firearms on their property. period.

rofl

Man.......you're funny.......please provide proof?

[Legion]

scaremongering, my a$$. if word gets out that a business allows firearms to be carried in their parking lots, locked away or not, more customers will stay away than shop there thinking they're safe and the business will die. since the owners don't want this to happen, they will make it a point to announce that they do not permit firearms on their property. period.

For those of us who don't work in retail, I don't think this will be an issue. Besides that the majority of retail stores do not have "NoCHL" signage. The only place that I can recall seeing one in the recent past is Six Flags. So more than likely you are shopping at some point next to a CHL holder that is carrying and don't even know it. Does this keep people from patronizing the places without signage, no.

[joe mama]

scaremongering, my a$$. if word gets out that a business allows firearms to be carried in their parking lots, locked away or not, more customers will stay away than shop there thinking they're safe and the business will die. since the owners don't want this to happen, they will make it a point to announce that they do not permit firearms on their property. period.

Putting up a sign that says "we don't permit firearms on our property" is the same as putting up a sign that says "We only allow criminals to carry firearms on our property, since only law abiding gun owners carrying legally will pay any attention to our policy banning firearms. Attention criminals: the chance of you encountering armed resistance to your crime on this property is less than properties without this important sign."

[Geezah]

scaremongering, my a$$. if word gets out that a business allows firearms to be carried in their parking lots, locked away or not, more customers will stay away than shop there thinking they're safe and the business will die. since the owners don't want this to happen, they will make it a point to announce that they do not permit firearms on their property. period.

Putting up a sign that says "we don't permit firearms on our property" is the same as putting up a sign that says "We only allow criminals to carry firearms on our property, since only law abiding gun owners carrying legally will pay any attention to our policy banning firearms. Attention criminals: the chance of you encountering armed resistance to your crime on this property is less than properties without this important sign."

I'll post some stories later, where the "No Guns Allowed" signs have had the opposite affect rofl

They may as well put up a sign that says "Defenseless Sheep Inside"

[Geezah]

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/461_1115216070_nocrime(small).jpg

[Legion]

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/461_1115216070_nocrime(small).jpg

So that criminal there, is that a really ugly woman or a dude in chicks clothing? rofl

[joe mama]

So that criminal there, is that a really ugly woman or a dude in chicks clothing? rofl

I think being that ugly is a criminal offense in most countries. And the reason certain countries insist on covering their women's faces...

[vryhpyammoadded]

Big deal, it’s a companies right to ban guns on its own property and in the Pizza hut guys case, his car becomes a company’s legal responsibility when he delivers.
On the other hand, keeping a legally obtained, registered and stowed gun in your car on a company parking lot is not in any way illegal. Any attempt to restrict this is in violation of the Constitution. Companies attempting to violate the Constitution should suffer the consequences…

Yeh right, US companies hardly ever suffer more than a scolding and wrist slap. Maybe that’s why some poor yahoo with an AK occasionally blows away his boss and half the department now and then? I’d bet this alone is about half of there reasoning to ban.

Legalize dueling instead ;)

[joe mama]

...On the other hand, keeping a legally obtained, registered and stowed gun in your car on a company parking lot is not in any way illegal. Any attempt to restrict this is in violation of the Constitution...

While I disagree with the decision to ban guns on their property, I have to disagree with you here. You have the right to bear arms, and you may be licensed to ccw or it may be legal to keep it in your car, however you have no RIGHT to be on their private property, and they can bar anyone they want from it, or make conditions on when you're allowed. Again, I can't say it enough, I think the decision to ban guns is stupid (without providing adequate competent armed security), however, if it's private property, they can ban damn near anything they want. You shouldn't have to put up with a PETA protestor standing on your front lawn screeching at you while you grill a steak if you don't want to - even though he's excercising his right to free speech, he's only welcome on your property on your terms.

[Legion]

...On the other hand, keeping a legally obtained, registered and stowed gun in your car on a company parking lot is not in any way illegal. Any attempt to restrict this is in violation of the Constitution...

While I disagree with the decision to ban guns on their property, I have to disagree with you here. You have the right to bear arms, and you may be licensed to ccw or it may be legal to keep it in your car, however you have no RIGHT to be on their private property, and they can bar anyone they want from it, or make conditions on when you're allowed. Again, I can't say it enough, I think the decision to ban guns is stupid (without providing adequate competent armed security), however, if it's private property, they can ban damn near anything they want. You shouldn't have to put up with a PETA protestor standing on your front lawn screeching at you while you grill a steak if you don't want to - even though he's excercising his right to free speech, he's only welcome on your property on your terms.

Well, then again if nobody tells, nobody will know but you and me.http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y85/qwkzx2/secret.gif

[joe mama]

Well, then again if nobody tells, nobody will know but you and me.http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y85/qwkzx2/secret.gif

If you mean if nobody tells when you beat that PETA protestor to death with a pork chop, then you can count on me not to tell. If I get me one of them grilled pork chops, that is...

[Legion]

Well, then again if nobody tells, nobody will know but you and me.http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y85/qwkzx2/secret.gif

If you mean if nobody tells when you beat that PETA protestor to death with a pork chop, then you can count on me not to tell. If I get me one of them grilled pork chops, that is...

Sh!t man, I'd be like Uncle Rico with that steak in Napoleon Dynamite, with you in the background sayin' "That's what I'm talkin' about".