Question for the israelis...

[cut]

just out of intrest what would you do if you were palestian? fight for your nation or do nothing?

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Not to be a smart a$$ or anything, but what nation would a Palestinian fight for?

There's no nation of Palestine. The area regarded as "Palestine" has variousy belonged to many nations (i.e. the Ottoman Empire from the 14th century to 1917, then Britain after WWI, etc.)

As far as I know, they're fighting to establish one, in defiance of the UN mandated borders of Israel. As to whether they should be granted one is for smarter people than me to decide.

[ShotOver]

Yeah, there is no Palestine.

This thread will get the Israeli's all pissed off, you do know that... right?

[He219]

I think cut wants to sir up a Hornet's Nest, PT!
;)


And what is this 'defiance of UN mandated borders of Israel thing', 2Sheds_Jackson? The only borders the UN determined were never realized after the Arabs attacked following David Ben-Gurion declaration of the state of Israel on May 14, 1948.

http://www.npr.org/news/specials/mideast/history/images/map03_140.gif

Map of the United Nations Partition Plan of 1947.

[ShotOver]

He219, get over here and we'll sit and have a few brewski's and watch this ****... should be a tad bit entertaining.

[Javehn]

Sorry to disapoint you , guys , but nothing will happend here . If you want to know something , just run the search , you will find tons over tons of this debate , from all posible points of views .Sence you have serios number on you forum count , i bellieve you do know most of them .
If you wanna see some fighting over here , you would have to pay good bux .

[ShotOver]

Bugger :(

[Javehn]

Unless you interested to invest some funds , then i am shure we can work some fight out . ;) No Dollars , they are in **** . I will take Euro.

[ShotOver]

hahahaha, i'm sure there will be a good fight to watch somewhere on this forum... if not i'll start one.

[Javehn]

I was reffering to financial aid :oops: . Or small contribution , on that matter . p-)

[ShotOver]

What you need ze $$ for mate?

Live off the land, bushman style :)

[Mr. Nielsen]

And what is this 'defiance of UN mandated borders of Israel thing', 2Sheds_Jackson? The only borders the UN determined were never realized after the Arabs attacked following David Ben-Gurion declaration of the state of Israel on May 14, 1948.



It is equally true to say that Israel didn't accept the division plan and attacked the Palestinian areas. Basicly what happend was that Jordan, who had the strongest military forces of the arabs, and Israel divided the territory given to the Palestinians.

Here is another map showing the partition plan and the areas occupied by Israel, Jordan and Egypt.
http://www.stanford.edu/class/history187b/terrmap.gif

[He219]

Oh here we go PT!

I'll take you up on that Brewski if Javehn will join us!

:D

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Unless you interested to invest some funds , then i am shure we can work some fight out . ;) No Dollars , they are in **** . I will take Euro.

rofl Israel seems to have no problem accepting dollars...

[Javehn]

Unless you interested to invest some funds , then i am shure we can work some fight out . ;) No Dollars , they are in **** . I will take Euro.

rofl Israel seems to have no problem accepting dollars...

Chip shot bellow the belt . Too bad my balls made of steal . You cannot heart the mighty Javehn :)

And to live off the land is Bushman style , not our jews style . You must know all the joks about us --

-- Palestinian fighter running away from Jewish soldier, while shooting back on him . Israeli soldier rapidly close on the Palestinian . Palestinian shoot and run , Israeli soldier is running after him . Suddenly Palestinian fighter stops shooting and starts to yell "Allahu Akbar" . Israeli soldier ask him - "what's wrong ? ". Palestinian fighter reply -"I am all out of bullets , i think i will explode on you now " . Israeli soldier reply - " No problem , just for this day i have major ammo discount for you "...

[ShotOver]

hahahah, aaaaw... things are getting interesting... let's wait until the rest of the Israeli's wake up or check this topic.

[Roger Rabbit]

This reminds me of a great Monty Python sketch where people go to a room and pay someone to have an argument. Sheer genius.

[S'13]

Unless you interested to invest some funds , then i am shure we can work some fight out . ;) No Dollars , they are in **** . I will take Euro.

rofl Israel seems to have no problem accepting dollars...

Chip shot bellow the belt . Too bad my balls made of steal . You cannot heart the mighty Javehn :)

And to live off the land is Bushman style , not our jews style . You must know all the joks about us --

-- Palestinian fighter running away from Jewish soldier, while shooting back on him . Israeli soldier rapidly close on the Palestinian . Palestinian shoot and run , Israeli soldier is running after him . Suddenly Palestinian fighter stops shooting and starts to yell "Allahu Akbar" . Israeli soldier ask him - "what's wrong ? ". Palestinian fighter reply -"I am all out of bullets , i think i will explode on you now " . Israeli soldier reply - " No problem , just for this day i have major ammo discount for you "...

Arab jokes:

Once there was a train, which was going peacefully on the rail-tracks. Suddenly the train deviated from the tracks, went onto the fields nearby and then came back on the tracks. The passengers were horrified.

On the next railway station the driver was caught : He was found to be an Arab.

He was questioned . He explained that there was a man standing on the tracks and he was not moving from there even after blowing the horn, flashing the lights etc.

The authorities questioned : Are you mad! Just to save the life of one person you put the lives of so many passengers in danger. You should have run that person over.

The Arab said : That is exactly what I had decided, but this idiot started running towards the field when the train got real close.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

An American, an Italian and an Arab were doing construction work on scaffolding on the 20th floor of a building...

They were eating lunch and the American said, "Corned beef and cabbage! If I get corned beef and cabbage one more time for lunch I'm going to jump off this building."

The Italian opened his lunch box and exclaimed, "Pasta again! If I get pasta one more time I'm going to jump off, too."

The Arab opened his lunch and said, "Dry bread and dates again. If I get dry bread and dates one more time I'm jumping too."

Next day - The American opens his lunch box, sees corned beef and cabbage and jumps to his death. The Italian opens his lunch, sees pasta and jumps too.

The Arab opens his lunch, sees dry bread and dates and jumps to his death also..

At the funeral..... The American's wife is weeping...She says, "If I'd known how really tired he was of corned beef and cabbage, I never would have given it to him again!

The Italian's wife also weeps and says " I could have given him pizza or lasagna! I didn't realize he hated pasta so much." Everyone turned and stared at the Arab's wife...

"Hey, don't look at me," she said, "He used to cook his own lunch!"

[2Sheds_Jackson]

looks like we enjoy kicking the beehive..... :)

[StarvingStudent47]

just out of intrest what would you do if you were palestian? fight for your nation or do nothing?

Well I'm an American, not an Israeli, but let me answer anyway.

I'd cap Yassir Arafat for stealing all my people's money and keeping us poor and ignorant so that we sign up for his murder squads more readily. And then I'd start working on Hamas, the murderous a-holes who deliberately subvert my people, keep us poor, and teach my children to throw their lives away.

And then I'd help establish a movement for peaceful coexistence alongside Israel. A "Partner for Peace." I'd volunteer to be part of a counter-terrorist police force, so that Israel wouldn't have to send its soldiers to prevent Palestinian terrorists from killing their children. And once we had kicked the sh*t out of Hamas and friends, I'd go before the Knesset and request recognition of an independent, peaceful Palestinian state. And I've got NO DOUBT they would agree.

And then, after PEACE had been established, we'd talk over the irritating details, like settlements and stuff. But I would NEVER EVER kill a bus-ful of children because someone had built a house on the wrong side of some line on some map. NEVER. Cut--would you blow up an elementary school in Anchorage if some Alaskans built apartment buildings over the border in northwest Canada? That's just not rational.

[Javehn]

Oh , wait , i have a good one -
Is rather old actually,and too much known ----

How many Arabs it takes to scrue a lamp ? 4
1 standing on the chair , and 3 guys spinning the chair arround .

Jewish cemmetery , funerall.
Jewish family standing over the grave , fother checks who is present from his family .

"Sara"-"here"
"Moshe"-"here"
"Itshak"-"here"
"Rivka"-"here"
"One second , one second , we keeps the store open then ?? "

[cut]

Sorry was a bit late on the pick up here

Palestine IS a NATION by the true definition of the word (a group of people that sees itself as having a national identity and is recognised as having one by other nations or nationstates), as is kurdistan, the basque country, Scotland. All these are nations without states (well scotland has a government but you get my drift). that's what I meant. Any israeli who knows the political definition would agree. After all palestinians are not israeli are they?


http://www.npr.org/news/specials/mideast/history/images/map03_140.gif
notice this map says proposed palestinian STATE, the NATION is already there.


Right.. Next, I'm not trying to stir things up, I am genuinely intrested in finding out what israelis would do if they were palestian, for that matter what anyone would do? SS47 answer was what I'm looking for (although you did go for the foreigners point of view, would you kill george bush for wasting your money?).

[mustamato]

Not to be a smart a$$ or anything, but what nation would a Palestinian fight for?

And there is no difference between a nation and a state eh?

[UoUo]

Maybe i whould fight...but i will never ever kill children..or inncent people.

[cut]

I agree but it depends how desperate you are..

[mustamato]

Maybe i whould fight...but i will never ever kill children..or inncent people.

"Collateral damage"

[Javehn]

Ep ep ep , no throwing bones to dogs , UOUO . No throwing bones.
Let's see what will hapend here .They seems to know it all .. Let's see .

[cut]

Ep ep ep , no throwing bones to dogs , UOUO . No throwing bones.
Let's see what will hapend here .They seems to know it all .. Let's see .

so you don't know? you think arab jokes are better than my thread?

silly boy :bash:

[Javehn]

Yep. Because those subjects discusted here for a long time..silly boy .
That's not exactly serios question also , and so on . It seems also that you find the answers here by yourself . So ... you doing good work , continue .
You see only Arab jokes here , ha . Interesting .Maybe here you can find a part to your answer , you know . In every jok , there is serios part . Behind every clown hides serios man .

Just one serios sentence - every Israeli here had posted here more then enough info that you nead . It got receaved dismissing attitude over and over again . Enough , how much we can do it , you don't want to hear it , no problem , we don't need to write it .

[cut]

sorry S'13 is to blame there, not you.. the thing that has been discussed is all about who is right and so on or what is worse occupation or terrorism. I'm not asking about that, all I am saying is if you were palestian, what would you do, I find it hard to believe that anyone especially people on this site would chose not to fight for their people. If I were palestinian there is no doubt that I would be fighting israel, and if I was israeli I would fight the palestian terrorists

[cut]

Just one serios sentence - every Israeli here had posted here more then enough info that you nead . It got receaved dismissing attitude over and over again . Enough , how much we can do it , you don't want to hear it , no problem , we don't need to write it .

and every palestinian my full support no doubt?

[UoUo]

sorry S'13 is to blame there, not you.. the thing that has been discussed is all about who is right and so on or what is worse occupation or terrorism. I'm not asking about that, all I am saying is if you were palestian, what would you do, I find it hard to believe that anyone especially people on this site would chose not to fight for their people. If I were palestinian there is no doubt that I would be fighting israel, and if I was israeli I would fight the palestian terrorists

If you were palstinian you were blow up bus fall of jews ?

[cut]

Doubt it but I would probably throw rocks at tanks and perhaps more, but then brainwashing is a hard thing to beat. And I think I am no less predispositioned to avoid it than any palestian.

[UoUo]

Doubt it but I would probably throw rocks at tanks and perhaps more, but then brainwashing is a hard thing to beat. And I think I am no less predispositioned to avoid it than any palestian.

Ok....so i answer you ? we can't can now end this topic ?

[cut]

Fine, it's not as if I'm forcing it on you ignore it, the internet is free.

[mustamato]

[quote=cut]Ok....so i answer you ? we can't can now end this topic ?

Why? Because the questions are too difficult to answer? If it is so easy, why is there still a conflict that kills people everyday in Palestine?

And if so, is it then so "boring and not interesting" that it should just be ignored?

[Javehn]

No , i will answer to your question . Again .

Those questions been asked and answered . Most of them by people that was combat soldiers on IDF , and experiences most of things . The answers were ignored . Just to be later asked again .Just to be answered again . And the internal circle of life and chakra goes over and over again . Again.

[UoUo]

[quote=cut]Ok....so i answer you ? we can't can now end this topic ?

Why? Because the questions are too difficult to answer? If it is so easy, why is there still a conflict that kills people everyday in Palestine?

And if so, is it then so "boring and not interesting" that it should just be ignored?

:roll:

Read my post again...i did answer him...and pleas read javehn post.

[StarvingStudent47]

Right.. Next, I'm not trying to stir things up, I am genuinely intrested in finding out what israelis would do if they were palestian, for that matter what anyone would do? SS47 answer was what I'm looking for (although you did go for the foreigners point of view, would you kill george bush for wasting your money?).

1) I wouldn't kill him for wasting my money, but I'd kill him for convincing entire generations of American children to strap bombs to their chest and try and kill other children as they themselves die. The entire idea is just plain barbaric.

2) People who defend Palestinian terrorism seem to justify it because "what else would you do if you were living in an impoverished situation like Jenin?" So I just took that idea (which is far more Palestinian than American) and aimed the violence at the root cause of the poverty.

[StarvingStudent47]

Doubt it but I would probably throw rocks at tanks and perhaps more, but then brainwashing is a hard thing to beat. And I think I am no less predispositioned to avoid it than any palestian.

So what would you do if you knew someone else was going to blow up a bus full of Israeli children? Would you do the RIGHT thing, and stop them, or would you look the other way?

People standing up against the barbaric actions of their fellow countrymen isn't so strange. Look at Oscar Schindler (or Rommel, for that matter). Look at the Air Cav officer who used a threat of lethal force to stop the My Lai Massacre. Yet I've never seen this sort of action from a Palestinian. Would you step up and do the right thing, or would you give the Hamas murders your tacit consent?

[Whistler]

Maybe i whould fight...but i will never ever kill children..or inncent people.

Amen!

Its one thing to fight for your country, its another to willfully drive a bomb into a cafe full of kids and women.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

It is amazing to watch the situation & try to imagine the mindset that can carry out or plan such barbaric attacks. In such societies, people blindly follow authority figures, be they political or religious.

I see the major problem being the "leadership" of the Hammas type groups & in some cases the greedy parents of the bombers. Children are not born wanting to disintegrate themselves all over a street corner for the glory of Allah. They are convinced to do it. Both the organization leaders & the parents of the bombers reap great rewards when these kids die - whether or not it actually does any good for the "movement".

In fact, it's become an industry. The family gets a package deal of money, medical care, a nice framed picture, and a decorative flag for the street with their splattered kids' picture. I can just see the parents at the neighborhood Bombs-R-Us, picking out which package to go with. "Oh honey, you know you're more useful to us dead than alive. Don't you want us to have nice things? Plus you get to be with Fluffy again..."

The various terrorist groups' leaders get power, status, money, recognition etc.. Their organizations sole purpose is to conduct war on Israel. Therefore, their real objective is to not end the war because it would mean the end of their organization, status, etc.

So they perpetuate the conflict in order to justify their own existence & glorify themselves. Hardly the life a good Muslim would choose. They're traitors to their own people.

[StarvingStudent47]

It is amazing to watch the situation & try to imagine the mindset that can carry out or plan such barbaric attacks. In such societies, people blindly follow authority figures, be they political or religious.

I see the major problem being the "leadership" of the Hammas type groups & in some cases the greedy parents of the bombers. Children are not born wanting to disintegrate themselves all over a street corner for the glory of Allah. They are convinced to do it. Both the organization leaders & the parents of the bombers reap great rewards when these kids die - whether or not it actually does any good for the "movement".

In fact, it's become an industry. The family gets a package deal of money, medical care, a nice framed picture, and a decorative flag for the street with their splattered kids' picture. I can just see the parents at the neighborhood Bombs-R-Us, picking out which package to go with. "Oh honey, you know you're more useful to us dead than alive. Don't you want us to have nice things? Plus you get to be with Fluffy again..."

The various terrorist groups' leaders get power, status, money, recognition etc.. Their organizations sole purpose is to conduct war on Israel. Therefore, their real objective is to not end the war because it would mean the end of their organization, status, etc.

So they perpetuate the conflict in order to justify their own existence & glorify themselves. Hardly the life a good Muslim would choose. They're traitors to their own people.

Exactly. No race is "inherently" hateful. But Hamas-run schools in the West Bank and Gaza Strip indoctrinate hate just as much as Hitler Youth programs in Nazi Germany did. They completely brainwash the next generation. And how did the free world finally end Hitler Youth brainwashing? Not by negotiating with the Nazis...

Terrorists are like Nazis; Palestinians are like Germans. You don't "save Germany" by tolerating Nazis. You can't save Palestinians by tolerating Hamas. For the long term good of Germans and non-Germans alike, the Nazis had to be wiped out. For the long term good of Palestinian and non-Palestinian alike, Hamas must be wiped out.

[One?]

Unless you interested to invest some funds , then i am shure we can work some fight out . ;) No Dollars , they are in **** . I will take Euro.


I suppose you're gonna split that money....right? :roll: