State of issue of SR-25s/Mark 11s

[Chops]

Howdy all

Can someone give me an update on US issue of the SR-25/Mark 11 to non SOCOM units? I've seen imagery of Cav snipers carrying it operationally.

And are the Rangers still using it? I remember being told ages ago that they'd had FTF issues and had dropped it. Anyone know the real deal?

regards, C

PS 390 views now and not a single answer? We have guys here claiming Ranger lineage- can anyone help me out here?

[SMGLee]

Mk11 is still being widely used by Us forces. I was just at KAC recently and I saw at least 50 Mk11 back in the shop for depot maintinance for Navy group.

KAC is tightly working on the SASS requirement. Semi Auto Sniper System will replace the M24 in the very near future.

http://photos.imageevent.com/smglee/cltactical/SASS-1.jpg

[Herrmannek]

haha , you got your answer :)

[One_A]

...Semi Auto Sniper System will replace the M24 in the very near future...


Not necessarily.

[chauncy republicans]

...Semi Auto Sniper System will replace the M24 in the very near future...


Not necessarily.
Yeah, I would'nt hold my breath.

[Whisper_44]

KAC is tightly working on the SASS requirement. Semi Auto Sniper System will replace the M24 in the very near future.

I wonder what Remington has to say about that?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v33/Whisper_44/Oa2/RemMPD308.jpg

[SMGLee]

KAC is tightly working on the SASS requirement. Semi Auto Sniper System will replace the M24 in the very near future.

I wonder what Remington has to say about that?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v33/Whisper_44/Oa2/RemMPD308.jpg

That is why it is competition.... KAC, Remington so on so forth are all working to win the SASS project.

[JoaMei]

But arent Semi-Automatic weapons less precise than Bolt action ones, especcialy in the sniping role?
For Designated Marksman they may be ok, but isnt 7.62x51 to weak for longer ranges anyway?

[PrincessRAR]

i wouldnt say to weak - it is nothing on a 50cal, but it depends on the circumstances...

you can peg a target up to 1.5km away on a good day..

[JoaMei]

i wouldnt say to weak - it is nothing on a 50cal, but it depends on the circumstances...

you can peg a target up to 1.5km away on a good day..

Are you sure about that? Because the current Rifles use .300 Winchester magnum and not the 7.62x51.

[SMGLee]

But arent Semi-Automatic weapons less precise than Bolt action ones, especcialy in the sniping role?
For Designated Marksman they may be ok, but isnt 7.62x51 to weak for longer ranges anyway?

Want to know more about the SASS, go to this link below,

LtCol David Lutz Retired at KAC is a very knowledgeable person and lots of learn from a guy that had a hand in the M16A2 design and getting FN M240 in the system for the infintry.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=228443

[JoaMei]

But arent Semi-Automatic weapons less precise than Bolt action ones, especcialy in the sniping role?
For Designated Marksman they may be ok, but isnt 7.62x51 to weak for longer ranges anyway?

Want to know more about the SASS, go to this link below,

LtCol David Lutz Retired at KAC is a very knowledgeable person and lots of learn from a guy that had a hand in the M16A2 design and getting FN M240 in the system for the infintry.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=228443


Any info about the other competitors? Are all candidates M-16 based models?

[SMGLee]

Any info about the other competitors? Are all candidates M-16 based models?

Remington/DPMS and KAC is two big name in this game...

I believe Cobb, Springfield, and a few other. M14 system is one that is being considered.

Check out the Crazy horse M14SE from Smith Enterprise, it is getting great result out to 1000m in harms way. I am currently building a Designated marksmen M14 out of Springfield M1a Scout with Leupold MR/T 1.5-5x20 illuminated SPR scope and Smith Ent. parts.


As far as semi auto sniper system compare to bolt gun, the new trend in the military is leaning toward fast follow up shots. as far as precision, military sniper aren't as precise as the LE sniper but shoot at much longer distance. like I mentioned, M14SE and MK14SEI with 21inch crazy horse barrel are getting great result over seas right now. some are seeing the 21 inch barrel to be too long of an option and are asking for 18 inch mid contour CH barrels. 2ID should be the first to receive the revised DM rifles.

[SMGLee]

...Semi Auto Sniper System will replace the M24 in the very near future...


Not necessarily.
Yeah, I would'nt hold my breath.

Read the requirement and you will understand I usually don't post internet rumor, just facts from very reliable sources.

[JoaMei]

Any info about the other competitors? Are all candidates M-16 based models?

Remington/DPMS and KAC is two big name in this game...

I believe Cobb, Springfield, and a few other.

Check out the Crazy horse M14SE from Smith Enterprise, it is getting great result out to 1000m in harms way. I am currently building a Designated marksmen M14 out of Springfield M1a Scout with Leupold MR/T 1.5-5x20 illuminated SPR scope.

Isnt the Barrel to short for that?

[SMGLee]

with the optic option and the barrel length, i am looking for shots out to 600m. I am a horrible shooter, I am lucky if I can hit a wall at 600m. :lol:

another pic of the KAC SASS entry

http://photos.imageevent.com/smglee/cltactical/SASS-1_1.jpg

Some pics of my M1a Scout MOD
http://photos.imageevent.com/smglee/cltactical/M1a-004.jpg
Smith Ent EDM picatinny rail scope mount with EDM low profile scope rings and Extended bolt release.

http://photos.imageevent.com/smglee/cltactical/M1a-007.jpg
Gas Lock ring with HK sytle ghost ring and Vortex G6 direct connect flash hider

http://photos.imageevent.com/smglee/cltactical/M1a-010.jpg

[maw]

barrel length: you don't need a longer barrel. out of the 20" obermeyer barrel in the mk11, m118lr is still supersonic @ 1000 yards. that gives you an idea of the effective range. a longer barrel compromises mout. it's already a pretty nose heavy rifle, slap on a bipod and a peq-2/vital2 etc and snap shooting drills become an event.

accuracy: the military deals in minute of man. however, the mk11 is still a suprisingly accurate blaster (if i told you, you wouldn't believe me).

Rangers: had problems with them early on and dismissed the platform. kac did some tweaking. nsw took the gun for a spin and determined that "the mk11 was more reliable in over the beach operations then the m21". the platform has been deployed with socom army and nsw units. even the marines showed interest, subsequently the Rangers have gone back for a second look. that's all i know. personally, i have a deep admiration for the usmc sniper program, i'd be really interested to hear that particular branch's opinions on the platform. imho, the Rangers have more pressing supporting fire individual weapon issues to worry about.

who uses the mk11: everyone, from tier 1 units to the doe guys who protect your local nuclear power station.

smglee: thanks for the pics. nice rail integrated front buis and it looks like the stock is adjustable for lop. also noticed the recessed mag release and the oversized charging handle. kac will get it. unless they go with the lowest bidder in which case dpms it is (which would be sad because a precision rifle is not meant to be some mass produced junket). who makes the scope/rings? looks like a loopy. mob six went with nightforce and they ain't looking back.

[SMGLee]

smglee: thanks for the pics. nice rail integrated front buis and it looks like the stock is adjustable for lop. also noticed the recessed mag release and the oversized charging handle. kac will get it. unless they go with the lowest bidder in which case dpms it is (which would be sad because a precision rifle is not meant to be some mass produced junket). who makes the scope/rings? looks like a loopy. mob six went with nightforce and they ain't looking back.

Maw,

That mount is a KAC SASS design, it has a dual wing nut fastener and it is build with the SASS requirement in mind. the rifle is suppose to be airdropped with the scope detached in a seperate hard case that will fit within the weapon hard case along with the rifle, drag bag, suppressor and all the magazines and do da.... one very difficult task at least for designer.

Leupold made that scope especially for KAC, notice that funky finish, it is undergoing different process to anaodizing aluminum in dark flat earth.

Nightforce is definitely getting a lot of rave review in the spec ops copmmunity. I ran into some guys running around with S&B short dot on their M4s. that is one impressive piece of glass.

Lots of M14 in the hands of the Rangers nowadays. I need to confirm with KAC to find out if Rangers has gone back to the Mk11.

[maw]

interesting req's on the rings/scope.

when the mk11 was first deployed, the first things changed were the rings (badger) and the charging handle (badger or pri).

s&b make some sweet glass. that s&b short dot is on the verge of becoming the "it" cqb scope. my only real beef with s&b is that they only make reticles in mili rads and not moa's. imho, if your shooting long distance moa's make the math that much simpler (consequently faster) then dealing with centimeter clicks.

if only leitner wise could come out with a piston conversion for the sr25...

you know pat rogers, ask him how the crazy horses are holding up in class.

i think someone had a question about cops using the sr25. imho, that would be a very bad choice for a police sniper. fire support, fine. but not precision police sniping. police snipers always talk about the cold bore zero etc... every first round i've fired out of a sr25 has been a complete zinger (as much as 3-5 moa). a military sniper can pop one in the berm or what not but a police sniper is accountable for every round and very often needs that first round to be spot on. that first bolt release loaded round is always chambered differently from the subsequent gas cycle loaded rounds. that difference is a liability.

[One_A]

...Semi Auto Sniper System will replace the M24 in the very near future...


Not necessarily.
Yeah, I would'nt hold my breath.

Read the requirement and you will understand I usually don't post internet rumor, just facts from very reliable sources.

I never said you were posting rumor. I don't bother with rumor either. I just walk over to the project lead for the SASS program and ask.

[Geezah]

I am currently building a Designated marksmen M14 out of Springfield M1a Scout with Leupold MR/T 1.5-5x20 illuminated SPR scope and Smith Ent. parts.



I'm wanting to replace my Eotech on my Dissapator, and was looking at the Leupold MR/T 1.5-5X20 but then moved towards the IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT. Have you any experience with the IOR CRT and is it worth investing in or should I focus on the Leupold?

[SMGLee]

I never said you were posting rumor. I don't bother with rumor either. I just walk over to the project lead for the SASS program and ask.

Hey, good enough for me.. :)



I'm wanting to replace my Eotech on my Dissapator, and was looking at the Leupold MR/T 1.5-5X20 but then moved towards the IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT. Have you any experience with the IOR CRT and is it worth investing in or should I focus on the Leupold?

I never like the eye relief on the IOR M2 scope, I never tried the CRT. it is less expensive then the Lupy and from what I remember the glass quality is on par with Lupy. heavy sucker...

[Geezah]

I'm wanting to replace my Eotech on my Dissapator, and was looking at the Leupold MR/T 1.5-5X20 but then moved towards the IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT. Have you any experience with the IOR CRT and is it worth investing in or should I focus on the Leupold?

I never like the eye relief on the IOR M2 scope, I never tried the CRT. it is less expensive then the Lupy and from what I remember the glass quality is on par with Lupy. heavy sucker...

The reason I started swaying more towards the IOR is due to cost(my Wife has a bad habit of shopping/spending too much), but I also heard the illuminated reticle on the CRT was hard to see during the day?
Not trying to flame Leupold, but I have no experience with either and I didn't get the best response on AR15.Com.

[SMGLee]

MRT is what it is for 800 dollars. it is not a ACOG because the reticle is not brightly lit like the BAC on a TA31 but in day light, 1.5x is not too bad, it is a lot like using an AUG circle at 1.5x. it is fast and it is very easy to pick up. I like the Lupy a lot better then the IOR M2 but like I said, I have not try the CRT.

Peeps at ARFcom has given a good review on the lupy, the feedback is not as positive as S&B shortdot but then again you know the difference between the short dot and the Lupy, it is about 1700 dollars.

For what you need, the CRT or the Lupy will do just fine.....

[Geezah]

Thanks for that SMGLee ;)