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rokus2595
01-12-2004, 08:22 PM
U.S. Soldiers Kill 2 Iraqis After Bomb Explodes Near Convoy
By EDWARD WONG

AGHDAD, Iraq, Jan. 12 — American soldiers killed an Iraqi man and a boy tonight and wounded four others in a car that was driving behind their convoy after a roadside bomb went off nearby, according to witnesses, a police official and relatives of the family in the car.

The soldiers, traveling in a convoy of two Humvees, opened fire on the family, who were riding in a dark blue station wagon, after the bomb exploded, on Palestine Street about 300 yards from the Oil Ministry, witnesses said.

The family's driver, a man whose first name was Haider, was killed, as was a 10-year-old boy named Mustafa in the seat beside the driver, family members, a neighbor and a police officer said. Mustafa's mother and two of his siblings and his aunt were injured and taken to local hospitals.

"You want to know the truth?" said Lt. Muhammad Ali, a policeman who was driving away from Al Kindi hospital with several colleagues after taking one of the women there. "I'll tell you the truth. The Americans did this. I know after this conversation they will fire me from my job, but that's what happened."

By the end of the day, in violence around the country involving the American military, one American soldier and 9 Iraqis had been killed and 10 Iraqis and 2 American soldiers wounded.

A soldier at the scene of the Palestine Street violence in Baghdad said that the bomb had killed two Iraqi civilians and wounded two others and that they had been in the blue station wagon. Capt. Jason P. Beck, a spokesman for the First Armored Division, which controls most of Baghdad, said three hours after the incident that he had not received a report of the episode.

Earlier in the day, a roadside bomb in Baghdad killed a soldier in the First Armored Division and wounded two others, military officials said.

The military also said that soldiers killed 7 of about 40 members of a gang of smugglers that was siphoning oil from a pipeline south of Samarra, a stronghold of guerrilla fighters that lies 60 miles north of Baghdad.

At about 9 local time tonight, suspected guerrilla fighters fired rockets in Sadr City, a sprawling Shiite slum of 2.2 million people in northeastern Baghdad, Captain Beck said. Later, suspected insurgents fired two mortar rounds at the Baghdad Hotel on the east bank of the Tigris River but failed to hit anything, a hotel guard said.

The events outside the Oil Ministry also took place about 9 p.m., when a bomb exploded on the median of Palestine Street after the two Humvees had passed it, said Feras Ali, 42, a resident on the block. The explosion shattered the windows of nearby houses.

The Humvees, which witnesses said did not appear to be damaged, then turned in the wide road, which was slick from a driving rainstorm, they said.

Soldiers opened fire on the family in a station wagon traveling behind them, said the witnesses, relatives of the victims and Lt. Ali, the police officer. The station wagon crashed into a wall about 200 feet past where the bomb had exploded, and soldiers soon began pulling bodies out, the witnesses said.

At about 9:20 p.m., more than two dozen soldiers from the First Armored Division were walking around the scene, inspecting the wrecked car, the ground and the area of the median where the bomb had exploded. One soldier warned a reporter and a photographer to leave the area, saying that "something is about to happen that you won't like." A couple of armored vehicles sat on Palestine Street, blocking several lanes as rain continued to fall.

At nearby Al Kindi hospital, in the room where three of the wounded from the car were being treated, a woman yelled at a visitor and a Palestinian interpreter as soon as they walked in. "God curse the Americans!" shouted the woman, a relative of the victims. "God curse those who brought them to us!"

The woman's husband, Muhammad Abdul Rahman, 40, said his sister-in-law, Stabrak Abdul Wahab, was the mother of the family in the car and had been taken to a neurological hospital to be treated for her wounds. Mustafa, the child killed, was her son. Stabrak's sister, Hiyam Abdul Wahab, sat on a bed with a dazed expression on her face, a thick white gauze bandage stained with blood wrapped around her forehead.

Next to her sat two more of Stabrak's children, a boy and a girl, both also injured. Mr. Abdul Rahman's wife passed a bottle of water among the wounded.

"Hey Muhammad, come over here," she said frantically. "There's a bullet in her leg and in her chest. She's bleeding very badly."

Mr. Abdul Rahman said to the visitor: "The Americans shot them, but look, the problem now is there's no one to take care of them. There are no doctors, no treatment. This is horrible."

A nurse said that Stabrak Abdul Wahab had been treated in the same hospital for asthma earlier in the evening and had left with her three children and her sister. That was when they ran into the American convoy, she added.

Also today, riots continued in southern of Iraq, as about 400 protesters marched on a government building in the city of Kut to demand jobs, The Associated Press reported. Someone in the crowd threw a grenade at Ukrainian soldiers and Iraqi policemen guarding the building, wounding five people, an official said. Ukrainian soldiers then fired into the air to disperse the crowd, he added, and wounded one protester.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/12/international/middleeast/12CND-IRAQ.html?hp

UkrainianAmerican
01-12-2004, 08:26 PM
I am not condoning the soldiers actions, since I wasnt there when the incident occured, but provided the is %100 true, perhaps he didnt want to get a "child-murderer" laber from Al JEEZ and Co.

TriggerPuller
01-12-2004, 09:25 PM
maybe it's not a good idea to drive behind a convoy full of military personell with weapons. Just a thought.

TP

UkrainianAmerican
01-12-2004, 09:29 PM
maybe it's not a good idea to drive behind a convoy full of military personell with weapons. Just a thought.

TP
Thats not too good for a persons health, IMHO.

usa320
01-12-2004, 09:47 PM
My guesses are, the cop is bull****ting, still brainwashed by saddams chronies, and in that case, yes, he should lose his job.

Or 2, the US Soldiers set up a barricade or checkpoint in the area around the bombing, and the station wagon failed to stop.

Tane Angle
01-12-2004, 09:56 PM
Or maybe he didn't want to know himself that he'd done it. It will probably haunt him for the rest of his life. My condolences to them all.

Ballistic
01-12-2004, 10:07 PM
I'm normally on the US' side regarding matters such as this, but this seems a little too odd. I mean, how many people said they saw them (US soldiers) shoot the civilians in the car ? Granted a roadside bomb went off (which was obviously the catalyst for this whole episode) and perhaps the soldiers were looking for something to shoot back at, the civilian car travelling close behind would have been a prime target. Don't get me wrong, the US military has some of the finest young men and women serving in it, but I think they are too damn trigger happy for their own good in some situations.

Civilians should not be dying like this over there. My guess is the soldiers got jittery and needed something to shoot. Although blame should not be placed entirely on the US soldiers in this case, it's those bastards laying the bombs that are causing so much terror in Iraq and provoking the soldiers to resort to drastic measures. Thats how I see it anyway, but with conflicting reports, it's hard to tell who is telling the truth.

Rest in Piece to those fallen, both military and civilian.

George W. Bush
01-12-2004, 11:24 PM
Yes, God curse the Americans for putting that bomb in the median and then detonating it.

They probably though the dudes in the station wagon detonated it remotely, hence the shuetzing.

RIP to the Iraqi boy whos dumb father was driving near the convoy

AFG
01-13-2004, 12:08 AM
Yes, God curse the Americans for putting that bomb in the median and then detonating it.

They probably though the dudes in the station wagon detonated it remotely, hence the shuetzing.

RIP to the Iraqi boy whos dumb father was driving near the convoy :bash:

16 OBr SpN
01-13-2004, 01:01 AM
They probably though the dudes in the station wagon detonated it remotely, hence the shuetzing.


Of course, driving behind a column you are about to blow up indeed sounds very realistic... :cantbeli:
Man, you should write a book on guerilla tactics! :lol:

As for your comments about the dead, at least have some respect.

Regards,
16 OBr SpN

martinexsquaddie
01-13-2004, 03:29 AM
One thing car fails to stop at a checkpoint or someone gets caught in crossfire.
another thing if US squaddies are so crap if they get scared they just start shooting anything that moves :(
so if I ever have the misfortune to see a us military convoy in the UK i should seek cover immediatly don't you have ROE ? midy you the usaf has just started bombing the Uk so what do I know

Caribou Kid
01-13-2004, 08:33 AM
<south park Uncle Jimbo voice>"Look out, Ned! They're comin' right for us!!"<south park Uncle Jimbo voice>


Duck....and Cover...
Duck....and cover...

Ichhabe
01-13-2004, 11:53 AM
Yes, God curse the Americans for putting that bomb in the median and then detonating it.

They probably though the dudes in the station wagon detonated it remotely, hence the shuetzing.

RIP to the Iraqi boy whos dumb father was driving near the convoy

You are really a smartie guy. Do you have smart you never used?
Do you have smart to spare?

fantassin
01-13-2004, 03:55 PM
Provoking an over-reaction from the occupation troops is a cardinal rule of terrorism (if you are on the coalition side) or resistance (if you are not).

Once the troops have commited some sort of over reaction and killed innocent civilians, it's so much easier to recruit new volunteers...the French resistance did just that at the beginning of the occupation to gather more support through hatred of the Germans


BTW, I am not comparing the German occupation of France and the coalition occupation of Iraq....

Trident-za
01-13-2004, 04:49 PM
Provoking an over-reaction from the occupation troops is a cardinal rule of terrorism (if you are on the coalition side) or resistance (if you are not).



Well, if this is their plan - it seems to be working - unfortunately.... I know this comment won't go done well with some of the people on this forum, but overreacting (and accidental civilian deaths) seem to be a fairly regular thing. (I obviously don't know just how often/seldom it happens).

Comments like:


maybe it's not a good idea to drive behind a convoy full of military personell with weapons. Just a thought.

... are troubling. While its most definitely true, I'm not sure that driving behind a US convoy makes one a "legitimate" target. It is their country afterall, and driving behind a convoy is not a criminal offence.

P.S. I don't know enough about this particular incident to have an opinion one way or the other - I'm mentioning a few principles only.