SWAT,MOUT or Urban Warfare Gurus?

[MCWARPIG]

Looking to brush up on some MOUT tactics for my unit. I am putting a training schedule together and wanted some references and ideas from some trade experts.
What FMs or publications can you point me to and what training have you had that you really learned from.
Keep in mind I want to train a reserve MP platoon. We have the basic skill levels but want to sharpen them and focus our training. We want to use a weekend to do this and possibly build on it.
I have thought about doing some "shoot/don't shoot" scenarios to practice ROE stuff; some urban patrols and actions on contact; defend built up positions;etc. Thoughts???

[Apogee]

you have the "MOUT / Room clearing" update to FM 7-6, right Warpig?

[MCWARPIG]

Negative.
My command has been so unsupporting of our training requests that we have been stuck training MSR support and PSD missions.
We finally have gotten fed up and are going to try and corner the brass and force them to let us train MOUT.
I will have that update by the end of the week though. Thanks SCUBA.

[Javehn]

You serious ? Seams you have some hard headed command . I don't know if it will work in your place, but raise hell to get some training accessories .

If you ready to have some long reading , i can give you some links . My advice to you is to print them out , it will be much easier for you to understand and get notes .

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/3-06/index.html
Urban Operation .

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/3-06-11/toc.htm
Combined Arms Urban operation . On that matter , if you need more info , PM me , i can tell you some things , that aren't on this manual .

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/90-10-1/default.htm
An infantryman guide to Combat in Build Areas.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/90-10/toc.htm
MOUT

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/19-10/toc.htm
MILITARY POLICE LAW AND ORDER OPERATIONS

[MCWARPIG]

Thanks.. I will print them.

I am pretty sure my platoon has these FM's in the CP somewhere but I think I will generate a copy for myself.

As far as the issue with my command... well when soldiers start leaving the Unit to train with another.. he will get the picture. I will do my best to put this together right now and see if they support us.

[ibstolidude]

check your PM's

[MCWARPIG]

Got it. Also, some units in my state have purchased painball markers and gear to train with. I am going to put a proposal together for us to do the same. Any one else done this and how has it worked out?
My main point for the proposal is to add flexibility to the training schedule and to cut cost. (paintball cost vs 556 blanks)

[duck]

How about a scenario similar to what the six killed British MPs had to endure near Basra? Patrol turned to confrontation turned to siege by hostile mob. Limited ammunition, setting up communications under fire and pressure, fortifying a building under fire and pressure. Alternative outcomes depending on actions taken by the patrol.Just a thought.

[MCWARPIG]

Crawl first.. then walk.. then run. But thanks. There are a few scenarios that I have already lined up. That is similar to one of them.

[MCWARPIG]

Just checked out lightfighter forum.. great site but a whole lot to go through.. I have my work cut out.

[ibstolidude]

more DOD sources inbound
check your PM

[OzMan]

I am in no way an expert (only 16), but I have a book which may offer some help, though rather small. The book "The Art of High Risk Entry" is kinda geared towards SWAT teams and CQB, but I thought it offered some pretty good common sense tips to improve the team. It's only about 70 or so pages long, but has good diagrams to explain the reading. It's written in the same style as Sun Tzu's "The Art of War" and Bruce Lee's "The Tao of Jeet Kun Do", no paragraphs, just individual phrases, right to the point.

My two cents. :roll:

[CX20]

Warpig I can offer information on use of force issues, public order situations, basic room clearing and searching of persons/properties. I can provide some scenarios and training tips. Only problem is that this training is from a British perspective, but the majority of it should be universal.

Eagle, I like the hooley bar in your avatar. I have one just like that. :lol:

[MCWARPIG]

I might like that info.. I am hoping to go on a British exchange op in the summer. (if it doesn't interfere with my marriage.. or honeymoon for that matter!)

[OzMan]

CX20, I wish I could have one. I spend hours drooling over them as I flip through the pages of my Blachhawk Industries catalog, but the 'rents would suspect something of a $200+ forcible entry tool just laying around. And I've never actually seen anyone use one, except for prying open doors at car accidents. I've been kinda guessing when it comes to breaching doors, busting locks, etc. I know all of the components (duckbill, lock pike, standard and metal cutting claws), but not sure of the exact tactics of employing them.

Prolly shouldn't anyway, I'm just some punk teenager from Kansas...

[SABER 2-3]

Warpig,

Private Message me and I will put you on track. Include contact info for verification of affiliation and what type of mission profile you wish to train for. I will ensure that all info is authorized under Dept. of Defense directive and the service branch you fall under. I can also guide you to the resources needed to do this right, after all part of my job is to help establish these type of programs for DoD assets.

[Sir Zach of R.]

CX20, I wish I could have one. I spend hours drooling over them as I flip through the pages of my Blachhawk Industries catalog, but the 'rents would suspect something of a $200+ forcible entry tool just laying around. And I've never actually seen anyone use one, except for prying open doors at car accidents. I've been kinda guessing when it comes to breaching doors, busting locks, etc. I know all of the components (duckbill, lock pike, standard and metal cutting claws), but not sure of the exact tactics of employing them.

Prolly shouldn't anyway, I'm just some punk teenager from Kansas...

You live in Olathe? Sweet! I live in Wichita!

[OzMan]

Damn straight...

This place is alright, except the weathermen suck. They said on Friday that we were supposed to get "The Storm of the Century" this last weekend, accumulating up to 18 inches of snow, with a small mix of ice. It's now Monday, and we have yet to get a drop of snow. And yesterday it rained. Not freezing rain, but rain.

[SABER 2-3]

Eagle 1-1,

Ditch the operator qoute, and what is your facination w/ H-Tools all about? Maybe you should be a Fireman.

[OzMan]

F*** you too buddy. Got a problem? Speak on it.

[SABER 2-3]

Easy killer...I'm a bleeder.
So you might wanna think twice about using your mouth as your primary weapon.
My problem is not w/ your love of manual entry tools (just wondering why), it's w/ that static your sending under your posts. Its not true and its not helping.
I know: use your imaginary hooligan-bar on an imaginary mission to remove (by any force needed) that imaginary operators qoute.

[OzMan]

Out of all of the sigs you could've picked on, you picked mine (just wondering why)? You don't pick the ones about supporting terrorism by buying oil, or anything else? Do you pick at people who quote movies when they say lines that aren't true? For instance, when people say "Yippee-kye-aye Mother F***er", do you shut them down by saying, "No one would really say that"? Come on...

The quote in my sig was not said by me, or a real operator. I'm in the process of writing a book, and it deals with a more extreme, troubled look at the life of an operator. I've spent quite a considerable amount of time talking to various operators (former Navy SEALs, my cousin who is Army SF, former and current CCTs and PJs, and various policemen and SWAT officers) who were willing to talk to me about their life, and I MAGNIFIED their experiences and their mindset with a character in my book.The character who utters that quote is in a different mindset than most. It's one of the more powerful quotes from the book, and I didn't see anything wrong with plugging myself in my sig.

If it's not true (which it may very well be), then you tell me what it should say to make it true. And while you're at it, if you've got a problem with me taking a liking to H-Tools, then you better start wreaking havoc in the airsoft section, for them playing with toy guns. But if you're not, then back off.

And no, I'm not removing it. Not for you.

[MCWARPIG]

F*** you too buddy. Got a problem? Speak on it.
I have a problem, and I’ll “speak on it”…Denzel.
Don’t be a poser. It is good to see you have an interest in what we do. But, coming on like you have some credibility or background is annoying. Do what you want to boy. I just think you will get more out of this forum if you know where you stand. Right now, your standing on someone’s toes. There are a lot of other young whelps that contribute in their own way… most, know the boundaries though.