Join idf

[collegeboy]

Can you, as an european non-jew, join IDF? I have register at mahal2000 but i guess that its for jewish people. Plz, any israeli people, answer!

Why? Because idf is cool!

[Truthsayer]

Your lifelong dream of shooting kids is going to be fullfilled?

Otherwise, I have no clue as why you would want to go from college(?) into an war-zone.

[Argyll]

Why don't you join the country you were born in's Army?

Where's your sense of Patriotism laddie?

[Javehn]

First of all , that is the last time you talking about shooting the kids , you understand me ? Ignorant piss of **** .
Second , i think it is possible , thow i am pretty shure you wan't do something good , other then cleaning up potatos , or that sort of thing (that is very important , but is that really what you want ? ) . I will check that out . That is very cool that you want to volunteer , but do you ready for the crapy things on your head ?
If yes , how old are you , first of all ?

[Argyll]

Javehn,this is the internet people can say what they want about the IDF,and there's nothing you or your fellow Israeli's can do about it!

If you don't like it ignore it!

[collegeboy]

20yrs old. swedish citizen, didnt do military service here because of defense cuts.

[Javehn]

For me he can say whatever he wants , but except that matter , it is very painfull matter to me .

Ok , 20 years old , Sweden.. I will try to call today and to check this one out . A lot of burocratic nonsence will go long with that matter , just another warning .

[Argyll]

what can you do if someone insults the IDF ....................not a thing,get over it,it happens to every Army in the world,your's is no different!

[Javehn]

edit : For the sake of interest , how exactly did you joined the Mahal allready , and what you been talled ?

[IDFM203]

Javehn,this is the internet people can say what they want about the IDF,and there's nothing you or your fellow Israeli's can do about it!

If you don't like it ignore it!oh well then follow your own advice and not complain about it in the other thread.

gees mate, I am surprised at you :(

Shalom :D

[UkrainianAmerican]

20yrs old. swedish citizen, didnt do military service here because of defense cuts.
I think mustamato's feelings have been hurt right there. :hug:

[Chris1]

Truthsayer has a extremely poorly presented point
Do you want to potentially be put in extremely stressful situations "Because idf is cool!"

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

No , you don't understand that BBC can turn many things around ..

Javehn the BBC is not the single source of news for us in the UK, there are many others ITN has a fair amount of coverage on ME affairs and many here will use Israeli websites for news, me in included, anything in Hebrew I just Grab and keep until my Hebrew speaking lady friend comes round for coffee.

[Javehn]

Well , there is a story behind it , but i don't want to share it here . Not a nice story , for me at list .

P.S : You have Israeli girlfriend ? Do you feel sometimes her hot ME temper ;) ? Or the Scotish brave ladies are more temperate ?

[Argyll]

becuase IDF I knew he was not from Israel,and I wanted to know why he was wanting to join the IDF instead of his own Military!.
and I was merely pointing out to Javehn that as this is the internet,people can more or less say what they want about any orginaisation and there's not a damn thing anyone can do about it!
Lastly this thread has no bearing at all on the other threads,what I said was I was sick and tired of these threads going the way of the Israel V Palestine all the time..........has this one .............not yet? ;)

[collegeboy]

Well...i have always wanted to visit Israel and why not also get some adventure? I have served as an volunteer in various swedish military organizations, but didnt do my militaryservice (when i was 19) because of defense cuts.

College is boring and im young.

[Truthsayer]

Your lifelong dream of shooting kids is going to be fullfilled?

Otherwise, I have no clue as why you would want to go from college(?) into an war-zone.

To clarify:

I wanted HIM to answer these questions.

1) On the television mostly images of bombings or kids getting shot is seen. That doesn't mean the military itself likes this.

2) Anyone that claims "IDF is cool" and only have the above as reference...sounds like someone that would rather go into 'action' where the opponent is somewhat 'under-armed' instead of trying to become a police-officer or something, and really make a change for sociaty around themselfs.

Infact, it wasn't a hit and dig at IDF. At was at him.

[Javehn]

If you want to see action , i have to tell you the truth . The only action you will see , is to sort uniforms , and things like that ... I am sorry , but that is what happening , for most . It's because different burocratic problems , passport , insurance and so on stuff ..

[IDFM203]

Can you, as an european non-jew, join IDF? I have register at mahal2000 but i guess that its for jewish people. Plz, any israeli people, answer!

Why? Because idf is cool! while I appreciate your respect for the IDF (its cool) there is a lot more to the IDF then just to be cool.

The IDF is no camp nor is it any fun (well Paratrooping course was a bit fun :D ).

It’s a real and dangerous job being that the IDF is for the defense of Israel

If you share those sentiments than that’s very noble but if its just for the “cool factor” well perhaps its not right for you.



As for eligibility, well there are plenty of non-Jews in the IDF but they are citizens living there.

To be a foreign volunteer you need to be Jewish to join in the IDF.

However if you want to help out on a army base, well here is a program called Sar-El (http://www.sar-el.org/) and it’s a few week program for any foreigner, be it Jewish or not that wants to come and help out the IDF….I want to caution you though that this program is defiantly lacking in the “cool” factor ;)

Shalom :D

[Argyll]

and to add IDFM203,this thread is about the IDF,and I happen to be interested in them along with many many other Armed Forces,when I said the part about ignoring,it meant ignore the slur on the IDF as ,like I said,it's not like you can actually do anything about it .is it?

As for the other thread,It was about Syria/Iraq/WMD,but like all things ME it ends up down to the same old mudslinging,and it was and is getting tiresome ;)


Shalom buddy :D

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

If you want to see action , i have to tell you the truth . The only action you will see , is to sort uniforms , and things like that ... I am sorry , but that is what happening , for most . It's because different burocratic problems , passport , insurance and so on stuff ..

So is religion a barrier to joining the IDF or is it just nationality, can you attain citizenship of Israel and then join the IDF no matter what creed you belong to.

[IDFM203]

becuase IDF I knew he was not from Israel,and I wanted to know why he was wanting to join the IDF instead of his own Military!. I had no problem with that



and I was merely pointing out to Javehn that as this is the internet,people can more or less say what they want about any orginaisation and there's not a damn thing anyone can do about it! true I agree with that, in fact if you’ll notice I have never complained on this board nor ever asked for anyone to be banned.

The thing is that you complained about the Palestinians/Israeli threads as if we should stop people from commenting there, and to me that sounded a bit hypocritical when you now tell Javehn when he complains that he should not and should accapt it.

All I said was that you should follow your own advice ;)



Israel V Palestine all the time..........has this one .............not yet? ;) well thanks to Truthsayer it’s going in that direction.

Shalom :D

[Javehn]

If you can get Israeli citizenship you will be be drafted to IDF , if you are younger then 21 . Other cases , if you want to serve in combat units , and you are overseas , you have to volunteer and have jewish nationality . IDFM knows more about that process then me .

[Argyll]

The thing is that you complained about the Palestinians/Israeli threads as if we should stop people from commenting there, and to me that sounded a bit hypocritical when you now tell Javehn when he complains that he should not and should accapt it.


Wrong! What I said was that all these threads go the same way,I never insinuated that people should stop posting,nearly every single thread in this forum that has any context about the ME always seem to come to Israel V Palestine thing,and the main topic gets forgotten about,I never implied that people should stop posting otr ignoring,I'm inferring to keeping the topic on the right track,by keeping to the subject matter!!

[IDFM203]

If you want to see action , i have to tell you the truth . The only action you will see , is to sort uniforms , and things like that ... I am sorry , but that is what happening , for most . It's because different burocratic problems , passport , insurance and so on stuff ..

So is religion a barrier to joining the IDF or is it just nationality, can you attain citizenship of Israel and then join the IDF no matter what creed you belong to. again, if your a citizen of Israel, it doesn’t matter what religion or what nationality you came from, you can be in the IDF.

If you attain citizenship in a legal way, then yes you can join the IDF

There are Christians and Muslims serving in the IDF as we speak now.

The problems arise when it’s a foreign volunteer and not a citizen. For there only, you must be Jewish.

Shalom :D

[IDFM203]

Ok Argyll I got you, and while I disagree and stand by what I said to you, I think to continue now would just be a argument centered on different degrees of nuances and that could go on and on.

Lets leave it as it is.

I heard your point and you heard mine :D

Shalom mate :D

[California Joe]

I want to join the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders because kilts are cool and I have great legs.

Argyll simply said that you should ignore idiots because it's the internet and people can type anything they want and your threats of retaliation are hollow because they are in other countries and don't care what you think. How did you not understand that. It was not a slight against you or the IDF which from what I've observed on this forum is quite well thought of as a top notch military.

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

If you can attain citizenship of Israel (and for that you have to be jew. More or less )

Some Jewish guys I know have side slipped the subject of nationality entitlement in Israel and the rights of non Jews, a friend the one mentioned earlier has mentioned that its nearly impossible for a non Jew to have citizenship and enjoy the full rights of an Israeli but at the same time she says there have been exceptions?

[Argyll]

Thank you Joe,that's exactly what I meant ;)

Ignoring insults is different from subjects that degenerate into off topic posts!

[Javehn]

Thank you Joe , i understand you , and Argyll also , you are right . Just this matter is very problematic to me , but i am ignoring the nonsence .



Some Jewish guys I know have side slipped the subject of nationality entitlement in Israel and the rights of non Jews, a friend the one mentioned earlier has mentioned that its nearly impossible for a non Jew to have citizenship and enjoy the full rights of an Israeli but at the same time she says there have been exceptions?
Yes , that's why i said , more or less. It's mostly Russian emmigration to Israel , there is a fair amount of non-jews today in Israel (Russians) , that managed to get Israeli sitizenship, while digging long in they roots , and finding they had some great great great something , that was half a jew . Many of them managed to slip to Israel that way , because of the hard economical situation in Russia.

Also , don't laugh please , foreign football / bascetball players have a unic type of sitizenship for them , i don't remember how it is called .

Those are not full sitizens of Israel , however , many of them indeed got full citizenship , because they sons served in IDF in combat units , and even got killed in action .

[oldsoak]

I know Israel is cosmopolitan so religion cant be a problem when it comes to serving in the IDF, however I understand that the Israeli ethos is that a soldier must first and foremost be a citizen of Israel or a jew ( which qualifies you for citizenship of the Israel anyway ). Perhaps those Israelis on the forum can confirm/deny this. I have met people who feel quite passionately about Israel and are quite prepared to join the IDF should Israel ever be in crisis - I suppose a bit like some of the idealistic young men who joined the international brigade in Spain or the yanks who came over to join the RAF in the opening stages of WWII. There is a potential source of manpower and possibly skills for the IDF to tap into here, so I would not be suprised if the IDF had considered it at some time.
rgds

[IDFM203]

I want to join the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders because kilts are cool and I have great legs. . someone answer the question once and for all, do they wear something underneath or they go bear.

Its one of life’s great mysteries that I would love to have solved once and for all ;) :D



Argyll simply said that you should ignore idiots because it's the internet and people can type anything they want and your threats of retaliation are hollow because they are in other countries and don't care what you think. How did you not understand that. . I fully understood that and I agreed with that from the start.

Remember I never complained about any posters here nor have I ever.

My gripe was my feeling of him not following his own advice to Javhen’s complaints where in another thread he apparently “complined” about postings in the Israeli/Palestinian thread and to me that was a bit hypocritical


Anyways I don’t want to go round and round on this for he already explained himslef to me already and I got him loud and clear.



It was not a slight against you or the IDF . I don’t know where this misunderstanding came from for no where did I think or accuse him of slighting the IDF.

My only problem before was the above.



which from what I've observed on this forum is quite well thought of as a top notch military. I appreciate the respect :D

Shalom :D

[Fioraon]

Why dont you join the Iraq Military. Doubt they will turn you down and you get to play on US toys.

[Javehn]

There is always the "Foreign battalion" , you can have some fun in Sierra Lionna perhaps ..

[Roger Rabbit]

I'm looking for something interesting to do this summer, that Sar-El thing looked good till i saw what you have to do.

[radon]

here is a fair amount of non-jews today in Israel (Russians) , that managed to get Israeli sitizenship, while digging long in they roots , and finding they had some great great great something , that was half a jew . Many of them managed to slip to Israel that way , because of the hard economical situation in Russia.

Then i also should apply for citizenship. Be prepared i am coming...rofl

[Argyll]

IDF M203 wrote

My gripe was my feeling of him not following his own advice to Javhen’s complaints where in another thread he apparently “complined” about postings in the Israeli/Palestinian thread and to me that was a bit hypocritical

Wrong again mate that WAS NOT a thread about Israel/Palestine it was about Syria having Iraqs WMD nothing whatsoever to do with the Israel/Palestine situation,but somewhere along the line it ended up as that,and to that I said it was pissing me off,and to that I said let's keep it on topic

The answer to your question about Kilts......commando all the way mate!!(nothing but fresh air!! ;) )

[Javehn]

The answer to your question about Kilts......commando all the way mate!!(nothing but fresh air!! )

I thought there is only Colt Commando , but now i know there is Kilt commando :) . All the way !

[gilgoul]

becuase IDF I knew he was not from Israel,and I wanted to know why he was wanting to join the IDF instead of his own Military!.
and I was merely pointing out to Javehn that as this is the internet,people can more or less say what they want about any orginaisation and there's not a damn thing anyone can do about it!
Lastly this thread has no bearing at all on the other threads,what I said was I was sick and tired of these threads going the way of the Israel V Palestine all the time..........has this one .............not yet? ;)

Cause i can tell you, for having served in FRench army, and now in the IDF, IDF is the freakin` best army went it comes to experience and care for the soldier `s life.

[IDFM203]

I'm looking for something interesting to do this summer, that Sar-El thing looked good till i saw what you have to do.This is not directed at you per say

hehe yep another kid (no offense mate ;) ) discovering what real help truly means.

gees I know some of you thought that you can bring all your BDU’s that you have for your airsoft games and “training” with you and go to Israel and join for three weeks and be in some IDF SF unit conducing operations in the west bank :roll:

Sorry to disappoint you but Sar El is as good as it gets ;) :D

Hey don’t worry you will have some free time (though not much ;) ) in between the work on the base to play any air soft game you like ;)


To Argyll, again I got you and we are into nuances and believe me I can go on about it a bit but like I said before, I think its best to leave it!! I mean there is no need to make our debate as long as some of those Israeli/Palestinian debates can go on for ;)

As for the kilts, wow the mystery is finally solved :D oh and your serious right?? *Inquisitive child’s voice* “b b but what about the wind blowing it up?” ;)

Shalom :D

[Argyll]

Kilts are warm enough in Winter and cool enough in summer!

[IDFM203]

Cause i can tell you, for having served in FRench army, and now in the IDF, IDF is the freakin` best army went it comes to experience and care for the soldier `s life.Amen!! :D

I see that you have been on for a little while but we never "spoke" yet.

shalom :D

So you were in the French military and in the IDF

Can you please explain.

Also where in the IDF were you in or was it just in "milluim"

[Jack Mehoff]

Javehn,this is the internet people can say what they want about the IDF,and there's nothing you or your fellow Israeli's can do about it!

If you don't like it ignore it!

Like when you "ignore" some dude when he talks smack about SAS? :lol: I'm too lazy to dig out that thread

[fantassin]

Comparing the army Gilgoul knew in 1996, that is an army of conscripts doing ten months of service in peacetime to an army that does three years in operational areas is pointless.

If Gilgoul had been part of a regular army unit during his time in the army, the comparison would have been valid.

A conscript doing three years is no longer a conscript; that's the basic term of enlistment of regular soldiers in many armies. He'll be more efficient that any army's conscript that does only ten months, or even a bit more but without operational experience.

Since, the FR army has become an all regular army. A comparison now would be more valid.

[Argyll]

Got me there Jack!
Cept he was historically and Militarily incorrect!
Javehn took exception to the post refering to the shooting of kids,but his answer was almost bordering on a threat,there is a difference when a remark is used to inlame,and when a fact is innacurate and incorrect,not only was he wrong about the SAS but that too of CAG!

Me I love the IDF ,they have great tactics,great kit and can rough it with the best!

[citizen-k]

I know Israel is cosmopolitan so religion cant be a problem when it comes to serving in the IDF, however I understand that the Israeli ethos is that a soldier must first and foremost be a citizen of Israel or a jew ( which qualifies you for citizenship of the Israel anyway ). Perhaps those Israelis on the forum can confirm/deny this. I have met people who feel quite passionately about Israel and are quite prepared to join the IDF should Israel ever be in crisis - I suppose a bit like some of the idealistic young men who joined the international brigade in Spain or the yanks who came over to join the RAF in the opening stages of WWII. There is a potential source of manpower and possibly skills for the IDF to tap into here, so I would not be suprised if the IDF had considered it at some time.
rgds

well, no.

except for poeple who lived in Israel before it was declared only Jews can get citizenship. (or people who married Jews for that matter)
In order to server in the IDF you must be a citizen of Israel - so if you weren't born here, you must be Jew in order to get that citizenship so you can join the army.
Now, many of the new immigrants from russia forged their birth certificate so they can immigrate - so now there are non-Jews in the army who weren't born in Israel.

In any case what you call religion/nationality is different in Israel and hard to translate or transform to the acceptable meaning.

By the way, Israeli arabs (who are citizens of Israel) do not have to join the army, and usualy if they want (not that I know of) are considered as "high security risk" due to their effection to Palestinians/Iraqis/Iranians.

Same goes for foreigners - even if you will gain citizenship or a permission to join the army, you will still be considered as a "security risk" and won't be able to join any SF unit, Intel or even regular infantry. (not mentioning the air force)

I have an "adopted" brother, who is an immigrant from russia, he is Jewish and he got his citizenship - but he was kicked out of an infantry unit because his family is still in Russia. (again, security risk)

[Argyll]

Is there an age limit for joining?
Would you have to learn Hebrew?

[Javehn]

Is there an age limit for joining?
Would you have to learn Hebrew?


About the age limit i really don't know , sence we had some nice volunteer "grandmas" in our base from UK , making different stuff (they food was A OK !) . They were pretty old (40's , don't offence old people !) .

About the Hebrew , one must pass something like basic training in place called "Mihve Ayalon" , where basic hebrew is tought .

[IDFM203]

Is there an age limit for joining?
Would you have to learn Hebrew? of course we are talking about if you are a citizen already (or if you moved to Israel and become one)…..

To be eligible to be drafted in the regular army (not the reserves that Israelis do after they are finished) I believe the age limit is 27 or 28 though I am not cretian of these exact ages though I know its close.

If one joins up after, he is drafted into the reserves and does like a three month “crash” basic training and then he is like a reservist that does about a month a year in less “hot” spots then what a younger conscript would be sent to.

As for Hebrew, well of course, you need to have at least a basic understanding of Hebrew. I mean how else can you function if you don’t understand what they are saying?!

Shalom :D

[mustamato]

Just curious, can I volunteer for IDF? Reservist with 10 months in the swedish military and a lot of university points (although I would of course have to start all over again with boot camp and crap). But would be fun to know theoretically if it is possible if I was to become talked into being a zionist by Javehn :)


In order to server in the IDF you must be a citizen of Israel - so if you weren't born here, you must be Jew in order to get that citizenship so you can join the army.


Oh never mind, saw this first now. Jews only :|

[IDFM203]

Just curious, can I volunteer for IDF? 23 years old and 10 months in the swedish military (although I would of course have to start all over again). yeah with that short training, your damn right you’ll have to start over!! :D



Oh never mind, saw this first now. Jews only :| In a region where the Arab nations that you love so much don’t have a single Jew in their armies and is forbidden to have any, the IDF having lots of Muslims and christens in their ranks is not a Jew only policy.

Again if you are a citizen of Israel even if you are not Jewish (there are over a million non Jewish Israeli citizens living in Israel) you can in fact be in the IDF


I mean last I checked, most armies in the world only accapt their own citizens into their militaries.

Yeah I guess according to your logic, they most all be racists as well :roll:

Shalom :D

[Javehn]

Just curious, can I volunteer for IDF? Reservist with 10 months in the swedish military and a lot of university points (although I would of course have to start all over again with boot camp and crap). But would be fun to know theoretically if it is possible if I was to become talked into being a zionist by Javehn :)


In order to server in the IDF you must be a citizen of Israel - so if you weren't born here, you must be Jew in order to get that citizenship so you can join the army.


Oh never mind, saw this first now. Jews only :|

So the system worked good on this case :D
No Mustamato for you . Come back , one year . p-)

[UoUo]

Just to add..an "Antizioinst" person is bull****...if toy an "Antizioinst" in israel...you are an Antiisraeli since almost all the israelis are zionist....even the left wing...

[mustamato]

Just curious, can I volunteer for IDF? Reservist with 10 months in the swedish military and a lot of university points (although I would of course have to start all over again with boot camp and crap). But would be fun to know theoretically if it is possible if I was to become talked into being a zionist by Javehn :)


In order to server in the IDF you must be a citizen of Israel - so if you weren't born here, you must be Jew in order to get that citizenship so you can join the army.


Oh never mind, saw this first now. Jews only :|

So the system worked good on this case :D
No Mustamato for you . Come back , one year . p-)

Come back?

[wholagun]

It is possible to join IDF cause i remember last year Jewish student clubs ie Hallel ( I think thats how you spell it) handed out fliers on seveal campuses here in Canada including mine (Queens) and they got in trouble because its illegal to ask people in Canada to join other countries. They are free to join but you can't solicit. Although its illegal to solicit the govn't didn't take any action nor did the campuses they just got a warning ( i belive not 100% sure).

But how would that work would you have to learn Hebrew or would you be put into an english speaking unit? Also would you be second rate in terms of treatmetn and equipment. I can see how nations in an army will/can get better treatment in terms of equipment and duties then say foreign nations severing in the same army.

[oldsoak]

I appreciate the Israeli situation is unique in that its the only state where a particular religious belief guarantees you citizenship. I also appreciate the security considerations that apply to the defence of Israel are shaped by the nature of the opposition . I was hoping that the IDF would have the attiude of "all those who love us are welcome here ". The UK for all its faults does accept citizens of commonwealth countries ( and from the Republic of Ireland ) into its armed forces - obviously there are security checks and some might not get cleared above a certain level - but we have benefitted greatly from these soldiers. surely there must be a place for those who wish to serve Israel in the the IDF, no ?
rgds

[Javehn]

If you are indeed Jewish guy , and you want to join IDF , you comming to Israel , have some "pre- basic training" in place called Mihve Ayalon , where you learn basic Hebrew (something like 2-6 month) . Then you are joining the training of your unit with everybody else . The volunteer doing the same as citizens , eating the same , and having the same equipment . I had one french volunteer driver in my unit , pretty funny guy (god awfull driver ) . He was treated just like everybody else .

If you are not Jewish guy , but stil want to contribute to IDF , there is a place for them also in IDF , but not in any fighting unit , or some sensitive unit whatsoever .There are actually many Swedish non Jewish civilians that coming to contribute to IDF .
The link of SAR-EL : http://www.sar-el.org/
Mahal2000 program (for jews that aren't Israeli citizens) : http://www.mahal2000.com/

[IDFM203]

i remember last year Jewish student clubs ie Hallel ( I think thats how you spell it) handed out fliers on seveal campuses here in Canada including mine (Queens) and they got in trouble because its illegal to ask people in Canada to join other countries. yeah I know about this, I read it was the Palestinians and other Arabs on the campus that complained to the schools, oh and before it was those same Palestinians and Arab students rioting in the streets, and breaking glass and throwing bottles, when a former prime Minster tried to speak at a university in Montreal.

They sure know what it means to have peaceful protests there in Canada :roll:

Oh wait, they were justified, hell it was the Canadian police that were oppressing them ;) . (As the excuse for that probably goes :roll: )


But how would that work would you have to learn Hebrew or would you be put into an english speaking unit? there is no such thing as an English-speaking unit.

You must know Hebrew.

Also if you join there are no special foreign designated units or any foreign legion types of things,. A foreigner that is Jewish that comes in to the military, goes to a regular unit with Israelis and gets the same equipments and standards as other Israelis get.

Just btw those flyers that hillel was handing out was for a program called Mahal (http://www.mahal2000.com/) and its not a foreign unit but rather simply a statues of a shortened time frame (14 months as opposed to what most Israelis do, three years). But be clear that there too they go to regular unit and serve just like a regular Israeli do with the same equipments, just they leave a bit earlier then what a regular Israeli stays in for.



If you are not Jewish guy , but stil want to contribute to IDF , there is a place for them also in IDF , but not in any fighting unit , or some sensitive unit whatsoever .There are actually many Swedish non Jewish civilians that coming to contribute to IDF . I just want to clarify this statement. First even if your not Jewish but are a citizen of Israel, you can serve in the IDF even in a combat unit (though it’s a longer process to do so).

Now if you are a non Jewish foreign volunteer then I think your only option is that Sar El program and that’s not considered in the Idf but rather a program to help out for a few weeks to the IDF.

Though if Javhen is talking about something else, then he should be clearer for I am not aware of anything else.

Shalom :D

[oldsoak]

In effect what is being said is that a jew would be less of a security risk than a non jew. A pity there is that distinction, but hey ho.
rgds

[IDFM203]

In effect what is being said is that a jew would be less of a security risk than a non jew. A pity there is that distinction, but hey ho.
rgds well its a sad reality that we must consider that real possibility :(

with lots of enemies and coupled with our past history, it forces us to weigh those considerations!!

Though I do want to say again, there are lots of non-Jews in the IDF, just that they are citizens of Israel and not non-citizens foreign volunteers.

Shalom :D

[Fox2]

Ok, two questions for Javehn, IDFM203, and crew.

Numer einz.

I believe I asked this question once before, about non-Jews not having citizen rights, etc. but let me elaborate...

I have a friend who is serving in the IDF reserve, as a military policeman. He's a Messianic Jew. It has been told to me that he does not have the right to vote because he is a Messianic Jew. But he is still a citizen.

Now, it was not told to me by he himself, but by mutual relations. So, could this be possible? I'm not trying to dig at the IDF or Israel, because I love both. I am just curious.


Question two.

I am an American. My father is a Christian Israeli (of Arabian ethnicity). He is an Israeli citizen by birth, but was forced to leave the country before he conscripted. I think that due to him being a citizen, that may pass down to me, but am not certain.

Now, is there any chance, if I felt the desire, that I could join the IDF/IAF given that background?

[Javehn]

In effect what is being said is that a jew would be less of a security risk than a non jew. A pity there is that distinction, but hey ho.
rgds

Perhaps you being sarcastic , but this is serious matter , and many leackages been in IDF, and in overall all Israeli defence institute , because some people just had wrong relations .
Every single Jew and non Jew , and in short Israeli citizen or foreign volunteer passing throw security checks and debriefs . Nothing wrong with that , it's just a painfull lesson that learned . I am fully jew for last 2000 years (someone of my ancestors can lie offcorse) , and i can't join several units in IDF .
If you want to learn what can happend , if you let everybody to serve in IDF - http://english.pravda.ru/main/2003/01/15/42060_.html

[UkrainianAmerican]

Ok, two questions for Javehn, IDFM203, and crew.

Numer einz.

I believe I asked this question once before, about non-Jews not having citizen rights, etc. but let me elaborate...

I have a friend who is serving in the IDF reserve, as a military policeman. He's a Messianic Jew. It has been told to me that he does not have the right to vote because he is a Messianic Jew. But he is still a citizen.

Now, it was not told to me by he himself, but by mutual relations. So, could this be possible? I'm not trying to dig at the IDF or Israel, because I love both. I am just curious.


Question two.

I am an American. My father is a Christian Israeli (of Arabian ethnicity). He is an Israeli citizen by birth, but was forced to leave the country before he conscripted. I think that due to him being a citizen, that may pass down to me, but am not certain.

Now, is there any chance, if I felt the desire, that I could join the IDF/IAF given that background?
Who forced your father out of the country?

[Fox2]

Who forced your father out of the country?

It's a bit sensitive to speak of, but let's just say the Palestinians didn't like the family.

[UkrainianAmerican]

Who forced your father out of the country?

It's a bit sensitive to speak of, but let's just say the Palestinians didn't like the family.
O, sorry.

[IDFM203]

Ok, two questions for Javehn, IDFM203, and crew.

Numer einz.

I believe I asked this question once before, about non-Jews not having citizen rights, etc. but let me elaborate...

I have a friend who is serving in the IDF reserve, as a military policeman. He's a Messianic Jew. It has been told to me that he does not have the right to vote because he is a Messianic Jew. But he is still a citizen. I find that strange being that even Arabs and Christians citizens are able (and do) to vote….and last I checked, they didn’t consider themselves Jewish at all ;)

You ask if its possible, well I don’t know nor do I work for the ministry that handles citizens issues, though it seems highly unlikely that he wouldnt be allowed to vote if he is in fact a recognized citezen (under the laws of Israel on what it takes to be a citizen) which seems like he is do to the fact as you say that he is serving in the IDF.



The second question is a bit more complicated and I don’t think that I am qualified to answer. (I can try but I think its best to have a experts opinion on it)

hope that helps somewhat.....

Shalom :D

[Fox2]

Thank you, IDFM203 for your response.

I believe the problem with the voting is not that he is not orthodox Jewish, but that he converted from Judaism to Christianity and that is looked down upon or so, and seen as an act of "separating oneself" from the Jewish state. I don't know the specifics, to be quite honest, but was just curious if any of you had known of anything similar.

[Javehn]

Thank you, IDFM203 for your response.

I believe the problem with the voting is not that he is not orthodox Jewish, but that he converted from Judaism to Christianity and that is looked down upon or so, and seen as an act of "separating oneself" from the Jewish state. I don't know the specifics, to be quite honest, but was just curious if any of you had known of anything similar.

Strange story , very strange . There is a community of Cristian Mesianic jews , and simliar Je---va vitnesses converted jews living in Jerusalem . They all entitled to vote , perhaps what he ment that he is not interested in voting . As long as someone is a citizen , he entitled to vote .

[Fox2]

Thanks for your answer, Javehn.

Again, I do not know the specifics. I too thought it was quite curious for such a cosmopolitan nation as Israel.

Anyway, thanks for your answers, all.

[citizen-k]

Just curious, can I volunteer for IDF? Reservist with 10 months in the swedish military and a lot of university points (although I would of course have to start all over again with boot camp and crap). But would be fun to know theoretically if it is possible if I was to become talked into being a zionist by Javehn :)


In order to server in the IDF you must be a citizen of Israel - so if you weren't born here, you must be Jew in order to get that citizenship so you can join the army.


Oh never mind, saw this first now. Jews only :|

No, citizens of Israel only. (And if you are not a citizen of Israel NOW then yes, Jews only - but the IDF has many non-Jews soldiors who were born in Israel)

[citizen-k]

In effect what is being said is that a jew would be less of a security risk than a non jew. A pity there is that distinction, but hey ho.
rgds

Non Jew arabs, there are many non-Jewish soldiors who are not a "security risk" and they serve in SF units, high ranked positions, Air force etc...

[oldsoak]

Lo Javehn, - no, I would'nt be sarcastic about this. Its just a pity that Israel has to make distinctions in this area. I can see why the distinctions are made, but in a way I feel sad that they are. Jews have suffered exclusion for no reason other than they were Jewish, despite being good citizens of the countries in which they lived. So it seems a pity that they in turn would have to exclude others on the basis that it is the safest course of action. :(

[Javehn]

oldsoak , the distinctions are made after the guy passed threw security checkout . Its not like they take someone and say - "He is British , so he doesn't go in " . Someone is passing threw security check ups , just like every jew , non jew, and every camel that serving the IDF ( camels also serve in IDF , yes indeed :) ) . Offcorse , you would agree that if Palestinian from territories will come and say - " I want to enlist to IDF " , you will imidiattly understand that something is fishy .
At the begining of IDF , many peoples that wanted to serve , served without much of a check up . The lesson because of that was bad - read the link that i gave above . In order not to repeat that , that is what must to be done . It's would be very good if there where peace on earth , no spies , racists , terrorists , infiltrators , colaborators , green peace and so on . But they do exist , and they do try to infiltrate IDF , because we do have many enemies . Sad but reality .

But one day , there will be peace . I will invite you to my new house with a balcony and a pool then ...

[IDFM203]

Jews have suffered exclusion for no reason other than they were Jewish, despite being good citizens of the countries in which they lived. So it seems a pity that they in turn would have to exclude others on the basis that it is the safest course of action. :( again the IDF is not excluding any of its citizens that want to join, even if they are not Jewish.

all citizens of Israel, be it Jewish ones or non Jewish ones, can serve in the IDF !!



The IDF is perhaps excluding foreign non-citizens volunteers just like most militaries in the world do the same thing to foreign volunteers that want to join their militaries.

In their case as in ours, you must be a citizen of that perspective country to join, that is all.

Its that simple!!

Shalom :D

[citizen-k]

Those arabs who are not serving - don't server becasue they don't want to! (Because their first home vacation will be their last...)

[oldsoak]

Javehn said

But one day , there will be peace . I will invite you to my new house with a balcony and a pool then ...

- look forward to it ! :) may it be soon - I'll bring the beers !

IDFM203 - I understand ! :)

[IDFM203]

...

- look forward to it ! :) may it be soon - I'll bring the beers ! that’s good for as I said in another thread, you don’t want to drink Israeli beer (I am pretty pro Israel but even I have to concede that Israeli beer is sh*t ;) )

Any good stuff on that island of yours that you can bring over? ;)


IDFM203 - I understand ! :) phew that took a while ;) :D


Shalom mate :D

[Nondescript]

Why don't you join the country you were born in's Army?

Where's your sense of Patriotism laddie?

I might be a bit late to answer this question.
When you're between 18 and 24 you get called to do some tests to see if you're suitable for the military, you'll only get one opportunity to do the tests. If you are found suitable you'll get an assignment according to your qualifications. With todays budgetcuts there are alot of people that are past over. Sometime later you'll called on and get to do your time, ranging between 7,5 months and 17,5 months depending on what your supposed to do.

After you've finished your service you can apply to become an active duty officer (the only way to work in the army on a daily basis, 3 years of education), reserve officer (you get called on when there is a need to fill, 1 year of education), you can choose to go on a peacekeeping mission (lasting 6 months but as of this year 12 months is optional) or you can join a home guard unit.

Nowadays there is a program for those who didn't get selected, if they want to they can do 3 months of basic-training. If they do this they can apply for peacekeeping missions or join the home guard, but I don't think they can become officers. Earlier you had to have atleast 10 months of servicetime to become an officer, maybe it has changed now.

I hope I wasn't to unclear.

[oldsoak]

Good stuff to bring over ? I was told you guys had everything ! :lol:


1 Better climate - good for barbeques
2 Good beaches
3 I'm told the night life is excellent
4 Some amazing scenery + history
5 Good looking women

So the beer isnt good ? But I've given you 5 reasons why Israel must have good beer.... :lol:

[AirZone]

I am an American. My father is a Christian Israeli (of Arabian ethnicity). He is an Israeli citizen by birth, but was forced to leave the country before he conscripted. I think that due to him being a citizen, that may pass down to me, but am not certain.

Now, is there any chance, if I felt the desire, that I could join the IDF/IAF given that background?

AFAIK(but i can be wrong), you are an israeli citizen :hug: i mean.. your father is an israeli citizen afterall...
but about joining IDF/IAF, like idf said its all about security check ups that you pass...

If its importent to you i think you should invstigate more.. good luck woot

[AirZone]

Good stuff to bring over ? I was told you guys had everything ! :lol:


1 Better climate - good for barbeques
2 Good beaches
3 I'm told the night life is excellent
4 Some amazing scenery + history
5 Good looking women

So the beer isnt good ? But I've given you 5 reasons why Israel must have good beer.... :lol:

Well... you cant compete with the British/Irish/Scotish beer mate woot :hug: you are TEH R0xx0r!!!!!111 when it comes to beer.. am i right ? woot

[Fox2]

AFAIK(but i can be wrong), you are an israeli citizen :hug: i mean.. your father is an israeli citizen afterall...
but about joining IDF/IAF, like idf said its all about security check ups that you pass...

If its importent to you i think you should invstigate more.. good luck woot

Thanks :hug:

As I said, I'm an American, and serving my own country comes first. But hey, give me a decade or two. You never know. :D

[oldsoak]

Some British beers are very good, but I must concede that the Belgians are probably the best ! ( Germans ans some French beers are pretty good as well . I understand Israelis are amongst the most widely travelled people next to the Aussies and Kiwis ? - ( First Israelis I met was when I was diving in New Zealand ) - in which case you have no excuse not to visit Europe and sample the beers. !

[StarvingStudent47]

CollegeBoy:

Have you thought about joining the United States military?

1) You don't have to be a United States citizen or a member of any specific religion.

2) You've expressed a desire to be "in the sh-t," well, if you join the United States Army you can be pretty sure you'll be "in the sh-t" in Iraq pretty soon. I'm not saying you're going to be doing house-to-house counter-insurgency raids, but pretty much every job in Iraq carries real risk right now.

3) Our gear is cooler than the IDF's gear ;) The USA ain't exactly cutting its defense budget anytime soon, so if you're bothered by militaries that are pressed for funds, the Red White and Blue might be for you.

4) As a practical thing--you already speak English, and this way you wouldn't have to learn Hebrew (not that learning Hebrew is a bad thing, but it ain't the easiest language on the planet).

[Fox2]

Damn, SS47. You should be a recruiter. :lol:

To that I will add: "Join the Air Force in the next five minutes and receive a free fuzzy die! A value of 19.99! Perfect for hanging by the RWR!"

[gilgoul]

Cause i can tell you, for having served in FRench army, and now in the IDF, IDF is the freakin` best army went it comes to experience and care for the soldier `s life.Amen!! :D

I see that you have been on for a little while but we never "spoke" yet.

shalom :D

So you were in the French military and in the IDF

Can you please explain.

Also where in the IDF were you in or was it just in "milluim"

Shalom,,

I did my service in France in 1993/*94, as a team leader of a recon squad of the armour division ( something like a PALSAR ), there I was sent to diferent location, notabily in south america at the french "colony" called Guyane, where we stayed for a while with the foreign legion regiment 3 REI.
I then came back to regular life, thinking about Alya, and finally doing it in 2001. I then volunteered for SADIR but wasn`t accepted due to my age (I was 28 at the time), so I went to do the shortened service שלב ב, volunterred for a few more month, came back to work trying to join a field unit, and in between doing my regular miluim.
:D

[gilgoul]

CollegeBoy:

Have you thought about joining the United States military?

1) You don't have to be a United States citizen or a member of any specific religion.

2) You've expressed a desire to be "in the sh-t," well, if you join the United States Army you can be pretty sure you'll be "in the sh-t" in Iraq pretty soon. I'm not saying you're going to be doing house-to-house counter-insurgency raids, but pretty much every job in Iraq carries real risk right now.

3) Our gear is cooler than the IDF's gear ;) The USA ain't exactly cutting its defense budget anytime soon, so if you're bothered by militaries that are pressed for funds, the Red White and Blue might be for you.

4) As a practical thing--you already speak English, and this way you wouldn't have to learn Hebrew (not that learning Hebrew is a bad thing, but it ain't the easiest language on the planet).

Really?

You do`nt have to be a USA citizen to enlist?
please explain that to me further

[collegeboy]

Thanks for the info StarvingStudent47!

Actually i have thought about joining either the US military, IDF or FFL.

But:

1. FFL is FIVE yrs. I really doubt that i will manage that whitout longing for home.

2. I am now trying to get permission to do the Swedish conscript test a second time. During my year only about 44% did do their military service. So its all about having the right results the right day and speaking with the right guy. Thats sad with the swedish military; they only want women becasue of its political agenda.

2. Regarding the US military: Both the US Army and USMC is interesting.
It really doesnt matter which one it will be.

;)

/REgards

Collegeboy

[Fox2]

Good Tuesday morning, everyone. (at least those in GMT -5 time zone)


2. Regarding the US military: Both the US Army and USMC is interesting.
It really doesnt matter which one it will be.


If you love water, go Marines.

If you hate water, go Army.

However, if you like breathing air...go Air Force!

:D

Ok that was rather biased.



Really?

You do`nt have to be a USA citizen to enlist?
please explain that to me further

To enlist in the US Army as Active Duty personnel, you must be:

• Between the ages of 17 and 34
• A U.S. Citizen or Permanent Resident Alien
• Healthy and in good physical condition
• In good moral standing

To join the Reserves, you only need to be a registered alien.

You must be a full US citizen to be an officer.

[gilgoul]

Comparing the army Gilgoul knew in 1996, that is an army of conscripts doing ten months of service in peacetime to an army that does three years in operational areas is pointless.

If Gilgoul had been part of a regular army unit during his time in the army, the comparison would have been valid.

A conscript doing three years is no longer a conscript; that's the basic term of enlistment of regular soldiers in many armies. He'll be more efficient that any army's conscript that does only ten months, or even a bit more but without operational experience.

Since, the FR army has become an all regular army. A comparison now would be more valid.

Sorry fantassin, no intention to bragg, but the EED had a good reputation in its time, made of VSL and career usually motivated people.
As for the level of professionalism, we got the occasion to have some fun in BArcelonnette, canjuers and Regina.
About Operational experience, we were the conscript unit with the most days out for the year 94, and not the Vigipirate thing.
About casualties too, 3 seriously injured in combat during For****u deployment, 24 injured light, in Guyane, 1 dead and 8 seriously injured.
Still, appart Kourou, where we were drilled by local instructors, i was appalled by the restrictions and aberrations of a training offered by people who never seen a loaded weapon out of the firing range.
I m sure that today, the french army is on a better level than ever, the materiel, even if sometimes of poor quality, is getting better, and France is on the good way, and i`ve trained and seen people of a very high level of profesionalism.
But when it comes to the esprit de corp, the sense of responsability, the freedom of initiative left to the soldier, the trust up and down the chain of command, I can tell you that Tsahal is an incredible army.
As a reservist, I might get more freedom of decision than a BCH chef d`equipe responsible for a patrol.
My personal weapon is constantly on my back, wich means that i get more accointed to it than any soldier taking it out of the armory for the monthly or even weekly shooting cession.
You re for sure right, the army i knew ten years ago is not the army that exist today.
I just ask you to respect the litle experience that me and my class earned during those 18 month, the pain of those injured (often because of stupid decisions) , and the good value that we had at the time , even if it`s belittled by the all pro new Armee de Terre.
:|

[Alpha Leader]

Hey Collegeboy
join FFL and try to get into 2REP
there you can jump parashute and dive and
do your fighting on land.
5 yrs is a short time when you having fun.By the way
you can always go home on leave after some months(year).
anyway good luck on your choise.
Hilsen søta bror i Norge.

[volfram]

To enlist in the US Army as Active Duty personnel, you must be:

• Between the ages of 17 and 34
• A U.S. Citizen or Permanent Resident Alien
• Healthy and in good physical condition
• In good moral standing

To join the Reserves, you only need to be a registered alien.

You must be a full US citizen to be an officer.
What is the diverence between permanent resident alien and registered alien?

[Fox2]

What is the diverence between permanent resident alien and registered alien?

Paperwork. Lots and lots of paperwork.

[IDFM203]

To oldsoak

Those five things you listed about Israel are all quite true indeed (I like the way you put it :D ), still it would be nice if you brought over some homegrown Irish or some British brew……………..it can only add to the fun ;)

To starving student47

gee thanks ;) for making this now sound like we are a bunch of sports team owners and collgeboy is some prized free agent and we are all bidding higher for him or making our bids sound more appealing to him.

I mean now I am supposed to counter with “hey join the IDF, where you get the best combat training in the world that even the U.S. Marines rely on” ;) :D

Oh and as for "cooler gear” well I guess its all in the eye of each individual’s taste and as such I can understand your partiality to U.S. gear, I on the other hand think the opposite of your preference and I prefer proven Israeli homegrown gear or modified (“better”) U.S. gear over U.S. gear simply due to the fact that Israeli homegrown gear is of the highest battle field tested quality and the personnel add on’s to its U.S. and israeli stuff, give it that "battle warry look" and to me that adds more of a individual’s personal character to his own personal “kit” as opposed to simply looking like he just unwrapped everything from the store….not to mention that those Israeli vests are without a doubt the best on the market :D

And the new Tavor………etc… :D

To gilgoul

Thanks for your reply

Too bad they didn’t take you in SADIR, you look like you can defiantly hack there……..I wasn’t sure if the cut off age was 28 or 27 and I guess its 27 from your answer.

As for “Shelav bet”, I don’t know much about it…….I would love to hear more about it. (I was in SADIR so it’s not of interest to me but I know some people in other places that might be interested)

What I do know is that its for older (I guess after 27) people that make “aliyah” and Shalav bet training is three months (correct?) and that gives them a basic rudimentary level of how to be a soldier in the IDF and then you do a month a year in reserves (again correct?)……more then that I am not that familiar with details…if there is more, please share that info (of course without violating any of our OPSEC rules ;) ).

Shalom :D

[Javehn]

We have better babes . That suppose to sum it all .

[Fox2]

Just a little humor my insanely-patriotic-but-highly-respectable, Israeli friend. p-)

Sure, you can give 'em some CAR-15s, Tavors, Galil, etc....


BUT DO YOU HAVE FUZZY DICE!?


If not, please step aside.

Thank you, and come again to "Uncle Sam's CRAAAAAAZZZY Used Jet Lot"



;)

[OldRecon]

Foreigners in IDF :roll:.
During a fracas near the village of Ebel el Saqi in Lebanon between UNIFIL and IDF some time during the mid/late 80's, the Norwegian UNIFIL battalion there tried to stop a Merkava tank from entering the village by barring the road with a VAB (like trying to stop 50 tonnes on tracks with 10 tonnes on wheels).
Yet the Merkava struggled a bit with pushing back the Norwegian APC, so the tank stops and the driver of the thing pops his head out and shouts to the Norwegians: "Hej grabbar, flytta på er!". rofl
The guy was in fact a Swedish jew doing military service in IDF, though he had lived all his life in Sweden up to joining IDF. Think it was something expected from him, if he wanted to remain with his congregation back home in Sweden or something of that order.
There were also rumours around at my time "down there", of Norwegians working for Israeli intelligence by listening in on the Norwegian part og the UNIFIL radio net (at least we took that for granted). Pretty easy job for those listening in anyway, as we didn't do all that much to make life difficult for them with frequent change of call signs and the like.
Besides most of the net was operated with trusty old mono-frequency AN-PRC-77 VHF's (interestingly I noted that one of the "elite" soldiers pictured on the isayeret site had an AN-PRC-77 or 25 in his back pack).
Also saw another documentary on Swedish telly recently in part about pill eating Israelis doing rave parties in the dessert, where there during one short sequence was a guy talking to the camera saying something like "hey I'm a jew from France here in Israel doing service in the Israeli army, for MY COUNTRY".
An interesting program to watch, yet I couldn't help but feel sorry for those ravers out there in the dessert. Literaly a sad bunch of ostriches sticking their head in the sand trying to deny the realities of their existence.

And lastly a somewhat philosphical question:

If a black guy from Liberia can become a neo-nazi in Sweden (you don't think that's possible, well then ask the Swedes in here for further detail rofl), why can't a non jew foreigner become a combat soldier in the IDF? :roll:
Just wondering :roll:.

[OldRecon]

As for Israeli beer, didn't think the maccabe was all that bad.
(as far as I can remember). Though not in the same class as Tuborg or Carlsberg.

[Fox2]

why can't a non jew foreigner become a combat soldier in the IDF?
Just wondering .

Security. Comparing Israeli and Swedish recruiting is like comparing low-yield nuclear warheads to firecrackers (no offense intended).

The IDF is in a constantly changing security situation. If you've ever been to an Israeli airport (and I have), you'll understand that security must be tight. They're under constant threat of attacks, whether they be by a national military or Jihad Joe.

As has been said in this thread, Gentiles (as in non-Jews) do infact serve in the IDF, but only if they have citizenship. It is because they have proven themselves to be a citizen of Israel and therefore loyal. They are not as likely as a foreigner to be a security risk.

Sweden (or any of the countries in that region), on the other hand, hasn't truly been under threat of an invasion since the end of the Cold War. The security situations are apples to oranges.

It would be like the United States or Britain having a policy that any foreigner (whether Muslim, Christian, or not) could serve in their military.

Even with our current restrictions, we've all seen that infiltrators can and will plot against the organization they are members of. (See Guantanamo Bay leaks)

Just trying to explain that it's not some religious discrimination. And I mean no offense to Swedish members to this board, just trying to give a comparative example.

[IDFM203]

Just a little humor my insanely-patriotic-but-highly-respectable, Israeli friend. p-) ….and proud of it ;)

Oh and I really liked the way you it put my insanely-patriotic-but-respectable (for now I leave out the highly ;) )- American friend :D

Hey believe me on this forum, all members are insanely patriotic to his or her perspective nations.


BUT DO YOU HAVE FUZZY DICE!? hehe…. yeah I guess that pitch sold our free agent Collgeboy ;)

Its all about those damn FUZZY DICE ;)

Oh and what the hell are those?? (if its those things for the car then I got you, but if its something else, then what??)

To old Recon.

Damn OldRecon you have such a sad tone with all those :roll: or are a overtly ecstatic tone with these rofl try to throw in a couple of these :D every now and then…it couldn’t hurt ;) :D

anyways………


Foreigners in IDF :roll:.
During a fracas near the village of Ebel el Saqi in Lebanon between UNIFIL and IDF some time during the mid/late 80's, the Norwegian UNIFIL battalion there tried to stop a Merkava tank from entering the village by barring the road with a VAB (like trying to stop 50 tonnes on tracks with 10 tonnes on wheels).
Yet the Merkava struggled a bit with pushing back the Norwegian APC, so the tank stops and the driver of the thing pops his head out and shouts to the Norwegians: "Hej grabbar, flytta på er!". rofl
The guy was in fact a Swedish jew doing military service in IDF, though he had lived all his life in Sweden up to joining IDF. Think it was something expected from him, if he wanted to remain with his congregation back home in Sweden or something of that order. funny story :D …….oh and what does "Hej grabbar, flytta på er!" mean??

Oh and it wasn’t expected of him and no he wouldn’t be kicked out of his congregation if he didn’t go (gees where did you get that silly idea :roll: )……it was simply his own decision…..while there are some Swedish Jewish soldiers in the IDF most Swedish Jews don’t go and there is no expectation for them to do so.




Oh and there is a black neo nazi in Sweden, explain?? (I am really curious)

As for your philosophical question, besides Fox2’s answer and what’s been said before about all citizens being in the IDF (even non Jews) I answer by saying yeah your question must only be a philosophical question for in a practical reality, having a neo nazi or one with those views or the chance for that to happen in the IDF is just the right thing to do in fantasy land, not in any practical reality that Israel faces.

Again, all citizens of Israel, even non jewish ones, are eligible to be in the IDF.

Non citizens are not, just like the policy of most militaries in the world.

Simple as that!!



There were also rumours around at my time "down there", of Norwegians working for Israeli intelligence by listening in on the Norwegian part og the UNIFIL radio net (at least we took that for granted). and at the same token there were rumors that some UN personal were listning into IDF transmission and even giving it over to ……. ;) (I actually think there was a couple of real stories like that and not just mere rumers)



As for Israeli beer, didn't think the maccabe was all that bad.
hehe yeah you must have been back from some really long and brutal patrol, for other then that, I cant see how you can say that ;)

Irony is that you are in fact arguing for Israeli beer and I am arguing against it.

(To Fox2...hey I am not as insanely patriotic as you think ;) )


Shalom :D

[mustamato]

Foreigners in IDF :roll:.
During a fracas near the village of Ebel el Saqi in Lebanon between UNIFIL and IDF some time during the mid/late 80's, the Norwegian UNIFIL battalion there tried to stop a Merkava tank from entering the village by barring the road with a VAB (like trying to stop 50 tonnes on tracks with 10 tonnes on wheels).
Yet the Merkava struggled a bit with pushing back the Norwegian APC, so the tank stops and the driver of the thing pops his head out and shouts to the Norwegians: "Hej grabbar, flytta på er!". rofl
The guy was in fact a Swedish jew doing military service in IDF, though he had lived all his life in Sweden up to joining IDF. Think it was something expected from him, if he wanted to remain with his congregation back home in Sweden or something of that order. funny story :D …….oh and what does "Hej grabbar, flytta på er!" mean??

rofl rofl rofl

It means, "Hey guys, move away". About that "black neo nazi":

http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/0401/13/NYHETER-13s14jackie.jpg
Jackie Arklöf

This is a guy that hanged around as young with the VAM (Vitt ariskt motstånd = white arian resistance). He did his military service in a ranger unit (K4), he had officers dreams but the he was considered to be not intelligent enough, he was used as a "mule", a strong soldier that could carry much stuff, but not do anything else really. During the war in Yugoslavia he was a mercenary, did some fighting. He sent a bloody serbian cap to his stepfather as "look at this, I´m so proud", the stepfather wasn´t all that happy. He just wondered what kind of insane murderer he had raised.

Later on he was a guard at a prison camp and did some very nasty stuff. So after the war he was convicted in Croatia I think it was, but Sweden sent a request so that he could sit of his time in Sweden, but on the arrival to Sweden he was released (don´t ask me why).

1999 there was a robbery in a small swedish village bank. There was bad communications, one police officer got shot at with a Uzi and got a handgrenade thrown after him. Somehow two other police officers didn´t got to know that so they followed the three robbers car. The car they chased had stopped. There was a firefight where one of the robbers were hit. And the two police officers got hit as well. So this Jackie finished them of with his pistol in cold blood.

It can also be nooted that during his arrest a police officer shot him in the back while he was laying down and did nothing (according to the witnesses). So I guess the police officer showed his feelings about the man. He didn´t die though, sits in swedish prison now and will do that for a looong time.

[Fox2]

Oh and I really liked the way you it put my insanely-patriotic-but-respectable (for now I leave out the highly )- American friend

Why, I oughta... :P ;)

Hey, it's natural to be patriotic. Not a bad character trait. Hence why it is respectable! :D




Oh and what the hell are those?? (if its those things for the car then I got you, but if its something else, then what??)

Yes, you got it right. The fuzzy dice that hang on the car rearview mirror. Add neon lights and hydraulic suspension, slap some "MADE IN TAIWAN" labels on it. Hell, now you are a hipster with the young'uns.









....










Here is the proof that the USAF is better than any military branch ANYWHERE, kids.


http://www.xbox-connection.com/hostedimages/HipA10.jpg






Patriotism is a well and good thing.

Until you mess with fuzzy dice. Because then it means

WAR

[California Joe]

Insanely argumentative maybe.

[IDFM203]

To mustamato

Thanks for your post :D (boy I never thought I’d be saying that to you ;) )

hell interesting story, I mean a black Swedish neo nazi rofl , hell I wasnt even aware that there were any black people in Sweden. :lol: (are there??)




Here is the proof that the USAF is better than any military branch ANYWHERE,
True true, though USAF pilots might not get those very top honors (though perhaps not the best ;) , they are very good in their own right)


Insanely argumentative maybe. now now joe, be nice ;)

I haven’t really argued with you…yet ;)

Hell I actually agree with a lot of what you have had to say in the past :D

Now to those that put forth inflammatory and false and negative remarks, well perhaps my style might be as you suggest.

Gee that’s a unique character trait in response on this forum ;) :roll:

Shalom :D

[Fox2]

Damn you and your IAF propaganda! <----------------- Inflammatory and negative.


;)


Come back to me when you fly against the USAF and not the USN!


Someday, IDFM203, someday. I will show you! :P


;) :D






No, but seriously, yes, you are right. The IAF is probably one of the most active Air Forces in the world, and therefore one of the most experienced. Although I would like to see comparative data as to how many flight hours the USAF or USN gets versus the IAF on a average pilot by pilot basis.

Personally, I am of the opinion that the two Air Forces have different objectives and on top of that different circumstances. In war, not everything is 1 vs 1, man versus man. It's always got other factors besides just technology and pilot skill.

I am also of the personal opinion that in average pilot skill, our two countries are similar, if not the same. Both countries have been through a number of wars, and so have much experience to include into training. Also, pilots of both air forces have high numbers of flight hours.

So, overall, how about we just say, "We're both on the same team, we're both equally skilled. And we both kick serious ass." ;)

[IDFM203]

Damn you and your IAF propaganda! <----------------- Inflammatory and negative.


;) hehe ;)

Yeah but I like you so ill take it easy on you :D ….at least for now ;)


Come back to me when you fly against the USAF and not the USN! yeah a IAF “success” “score” of 220 to 20!! against the USN, somehow I don’t think that the USAF is THAT much better then their USN counterparts ;)

Hell not only are you now making "inflammatory and negetive" ;) statements aginst the IAF, your also doing the same aginst the USN.

You best not run into any USN folks back where your at ;)




Someday, IDFM203, someday. I will show you! :P


;) :D Anytime my friend, any time…………………. :D

Shalom :D

[Fox2]

Yeah but I like you so ill take it easy on you :D ….at least for now ;)



I am quivering in fear. :roll: ;) :D





yeah a IAF “success” “score” of 220 to 20!! against the USN, somehow I don’t think that the USAF is THAT much better then their USN counterparts ;)



Pfff. Need I remind you of that thread about the restrictions put on the USN? Hm? HM!?





Hell not only are you now making "inflammatory and negetive" ;) statements aginst the IAF, your also doing the same aginst the USN.

You best not run into any USN folks back where your at ;)



Nah, I know a lot of USN flight jocks. All nice fellows. :D

But, hey, let's face reality... They are over-aggressive in a fight. :lol:

(Joke ;) )



Anytime my friend, any time…………………

Ok, you hop in your F-16I, I'll take my F-22. Meet you at high noon at the OK Corral. :D

Hell, I'll even give you a chance! I'll take the A-10A! :D ;)



(Oh, also note all my statements are not inflammatory! Check the last paragraph or two of my previous post! :D )

[IDFM203]

No, but seriously, yes, you are right. The IAF is probably one of the most active Air Forces in the world, and therefore one of the most experienced. Although I would like to see comparative data as to how many flight hours the USAF or USN gets versus the IAF on a average pilot by pilot basis. what, while I am at it do you also want to see their daily flight logs or how about their various tactics or even the times of the day or night that they are in the air..etc.. ;)

Seriously it’s a clear OPSEC violation to give out numbers in the IDF or the IAF (like how many this or how many that).

Just btw I was not in the IAF myself, However I do have a friend that was in somewhat, he made it through midway of training till he got dropped (making it that far was a big accomplishment!!) and I have friends in that branch (though not pilots) and I have read a lot about the IAF so I have a idea of the numbers and from what I know, IAF pilots have some of the most training hours in the air amongst anyone.

Other then that, you’ll have to draw your own conclusions ;)


Personally, I am of the opinion that the two Air Forces have different objectives and on top of that different circumstances. In war, not everything is 1 vs 1, man versus man. It's always got other factors besides just technology and pilot skill. yeah I agree with you :D

I was referring to pilot skills and that’s it.

Listen the size and scope of the USAF is much bigger then the IAF and plus the USAF with their B2 bombers or their stealth F117a’s and their new and awesome F22 (which I don’t think that the IAF will be receiving :( ), there is no doubt that the USAF as a whole is a better branch


So, overall, how about we just say, "We're both on the same team,
True :D


we're both equally skilled. well maybee ;) , ill just say that it’s a very hard argument (almost impossible to prove) on which has more skill, though Ill say that the IAF has two things going for it to give it the edge in this “debate”.

It has a much higher success rate in terms of percentages and ratios in the amount of air to air (which in a lot of ways, determines a pilots skill) engagements that the IAF has faced in modern times (the past fifty years) then the USAF

Secondly those joint exercises between both nations where in mock air to air battles, the IAF pilots have been dominant over the U.S. pilots.



And we both kick serious ass." ;) couldn’t agree with you anymore :D

See joe, I am not as insanely argumentative as you thought I am ;)


Yeah but I like you so ill take it easy on you :D ….at least for now ;)


I am quivering in fear. :roll: ;) :D As you should be ;) :D




“yeah a IAF “success” “score” of 220 to 20!! against the USN, somehow I don’t think that the USAF is THAT much better then their USN counterparts ;) “


Pfff. Need I remind you of that thread about the restrictions put on the USN? Hm? HM!? yeah you can bring that up again…I’m game ;) :D

Those unconfirmed restrictions (not to mention in that thread only being able to hear one side for the IAF side cant speak openly about it) cant negate the 220 to 20 thrashing.

No amount of excuses cant excuse that lopsided result ;)

Anytime my friend, any time…………………
Ok, you hop in your F-16I, I'll take my F-22. Meet you at high noon at the OK Corral. :D

Hell, I'll even give you a chance! I'll take the A-10A! :D ;) yeah well I already somewhat addressed the F-16I and the F-22 on top.

Now give me a F-16I against you in the same F-16I and you’ll learn what those USN boys learnt ;)

(The internet is hard to convey but suffice to say that I am carrying on in a mutual respect and friendly manner…….to me this is just a little ribbing amongst friends ;) :D )

Shalom :D

[Fox2]

what, while I am at it do you also want to see their daily flight logs or how about their various tactics or even the times of the day or night that they are in the air..etc.. ;)

Seriously it’s a clear OPSEC violation to give out numbers in the IDF or the IAF (like how many this or how many that).

Other then that, you’ll have to draw your own conclusions ;)


Well, uh, yeah. I wasn't asking for exact numbers, smarty pants. ;) Just saying that it would be interesting to see the comparison.


there is no doubt that the USAF as a whole is a better branch


And I ask you, was there ever any doubt?! ;)



It has a much higher success rate in terms of percentages and ratios in the amount of air to air (which in a lot of ways, determines a pilots skill) engagements that the IAF has faced in modern times (the past fifty years) then the USAF

Secondly those joint exercises between both nations where in mock air to air battles, the IAF pilots have been dominant over the U.S. pilots.


I will concede about the first point, yes. You guys definitely have the higher percentage. But it can get confusing if you start taking into account the fact that before the late 1940's, the IAF didn't have an average percentage. That and the USAF (in different forms) has existed almost as long as flight has. Of course, still it does not disprove what you say, but just something to ponder.

But I will say that yes, you guys have an amazing record! I would almost go on to say that some victories were miraculous in scope!


About the second point, yes, if those victories were indeed "220 to 20," that would definitely be a strong point. But, like you said about the restrictions, it's only really hearsay and rumor, because those types of things are not really publicly released. As was mentioned in the other thread, I think, in the end, it's not a "contest" but a learning experience. Losing is a good thing. So uh...in a twisted way, if we really lost that "tournament," we infact won said "tournament!" So ha! :P



Now give me a F-16I against you in the same F-16I and you’ll learn what those USN boys learnt ;)

Ha! Ha, I say! Remember, being a paratrooper only means you know how to float, not fly! ;) :lol:


to me this is just a little ribbing amongst friends ;) :D


Likewise :D



Shalom :D

And I will close the same also, but with a little Floridian twist...

Shalom, ya'll :D

[Javehn]

Idf is better . I think i said that somewhere in here allready ;) ... 1)We have the babes ; 2)We have bebilicios babes 3)Our babes are the best 4)Did i mentioned the babes ?
and 5) Our tankers kick ass on your tankers , without any small doubt . Some small exersice in 2000 between our platoon and some US marines ... And guess what . Yes . I don't know lot about the planes , but we surtainly opened some can of whopass for them . Yes sery bob , yes indeed .

Shalom , y'all :P :P . I am studying for hard hard exams ...

P.S : Drink more , live longer .

[Fox2]

Idf is better . I think i said that somewhere in here allready ;) ... 1)We have the babes ; 2)We have bebilicios babes 3)Our babes are the best 4)Did i mentioned the babes ?
and 5) Our tankers kick ass on your tankers , without any small doubt . Some small exersice in 2000 between our platoon and some US marines ... And guess what . Yes .

Shalom , y'all :P :P . I am studying for hard hard exams ...

P.S : Drink more , live longer .

See, the good thing about the USMC and Army... All the woman are ugly! No distractions! I can imagine that many Israeli tank drivers have problems with distractions. ;)

[Javehn]

Idf is better . I think i said that somewhere in here allready ;) ... 1)We have the babes ; 2)We have bebilicios babes 3)Our babes are the best 4)Did i mentioned the babes ?
and 5) Our tankers kick ass on your tankers , without any small doubt . Some small exersice in 2000 between our platoon and some US marines ... And guess what . Yes .

Shalom , y'all :P :P . I am studying for hard hard exams ...

P.S : Drink more , live longer .

See, the good thing about the USMC and Army... All the woman are ugly! No distractions! I can imagine that many Israeli tank drivers have problems with distractions. ;)

Well , according to the "JAG" series , that somehow i pretty much loved , they have pretty much "nice" ladies . Yea , Cmdr "Sara Mc'nzee" shure kick some ass . If you do have women like that in USMC , hello sery Bob ! I am joining in !!

And by the way , our tank driver instructor ladies have the most ugliest look , according to the job . You have to be big and ugly to drive in Merkava , and to press the huge brakes .

I , by the way , nice and pretty . p-)

Shalom, y'all.

[California Joe]

Get a room.

What? Someone had to say it. ;)

[IDFM203]

"what, while I am at it do you also want to see their daily flight logs or how about their various tactics or even the times of the day or night that they are in the air..etc.. ;)

Seriously it’s a clear OPSEC violation to give out numbers in the IDF or the IAF (like how many this or how many that).

Other then that, you’ll have to draw your own conclusions ;) "


Well, uh, yeah. I wasn't asking for exact numbers, smarty pants. ;) Just saying that it would be interesting to see the comparison. …and if I could tell you it would just further my point ;)

Its better that you don’t know, at least you can assume in your own mind that its not any higher then your guys amounts…you know it allows you to sleep better ;) :D (boy I have to admit that this is getting a bit childish but what the heck, I can use a breather from all of the “serious” debates on this forum ;) )


there is no doubt that the USAF as a whole is a better branch

And I ask you, was there ever any doubt?! ;) hehe ;) but give us the same size and scope (not to mention those B2’ and the F22), and you’ll see better results with our boys ;) :D (though yours are quite impressive as well).


.
I will concede about the first point, yes. You guys definitely have the higher percentage. But it can get confusing if you start taking into account the fact that before the late 1940's, the IAF didn't have an average percentage. that’s why I said in modern times in the past fifty years……(basically after the late 40’s)


That and the USAF (in different forms) has existed almost as long as flight has. Of course, still it does not disprove what you say, but just something to ponder. An amazing point to ponder indeed, but yeah your right, it still doesn’t disprove my point :D


I think, in the end, it's not a "contest" but a learning experience. Losing is a good thing. So uh...in a twisted way, if we really lost that "tournament," we infact won said "tournament!" So ha! :P hey we were there to teach you guys, that’s why you pay us the big money ;) :D

Now give me a F-16I against you in the same F-16I and you’ll learn what those USN boys learnt ;)


Ha! Ha, I say! Remember, being a paratrooper only means you know how to float, not fly! ;) :lol: hehe :D …..and our "landings" aren’t as smooth as the pilots way of doing it ;)

Ok so perhaps me in a plane wont cut it, but mono a mono on the ground, well that’s whole a different story :D


Just curious were you a service member in the U.S. military or the USAF??


To Javehn, while the tanks did great, certian combat infantry units did great as well as well in previous mock exercises and mock battles ;) :D (one of my commanders in basic training participated in one of them)

Shalom :D

[IDFM203]

See, the good thing about the USMC and Army... All the woman are ugly! No distractions! I can imagine that many Israeli tank drivers have problems with distractions. ;) I cant speak for the tank corp. but in the combat infantry ranks we don’t have that problem for besides there being no women except for those few instructors, most of them are not any real distraction if you know what I mean… ;)

Its actually a known “fact” (well fact is what we call it for we are convinced of it, but its really just our guess) that all the pretty women are sent and serve in the air force……believe me that branch is the most pampered branch in the IDF and no one even comes close.

Damn air force p-)

Shalom :D

[Javehn]

bellieve me , the thing you had with ladies in infantry , we have it 1000 times worth in armor . But thank god every different base have some nice girls there ....

By the way , something off topic . IDFM203 , take a look on the tanks movie on militarymovies site . Man , i creamed my pance 4 times in a row , damnit that is one serious funky ass movie . Just to see what tanks can do ... YEHAAA.

Now if someone is getting enlisted in every army in the world , ask to be tankers and nothing else . You do that !! DJ Javehn is watching ya !!

[Fox2]

(boy I have to admit that this is getting a bit childish but what the heck, I can use a breather from all of the “serious” debates on this forum ;) )



I agree, it is getting a tad "immature." But it's better than the,
:fork: :-*$ You anti-semitic, assmuch-tasting, camel-toed, bitch-eyed, zionistic, wanton warmonger, homo****** monkey! stuff that goes on in other threads.



hehe :D …..and our "landings" aren’t as smooth as the pilots way of doing it ;)

Ok so perhaps me in a plane wont cut it, but mono a mono on the ground, well that’s whole a different story :D

Hey now, this was a discussion of pilot skill! You can't cheat like that! ;)

As long as it is non-lethal combat, sure, I'm game! Because, you know...If it's lethal...Well, then someone dies. And that's not good for continuing debate! :D


Just curious were you a service member in the U.S. military or the USAF??

No. I apologize if I gave that impression. I am a civilian pilot who will very soon be joining the ranks of the USAF.


Get a room.

What? Someone had to say it.

There is no doubt left in my mind now that you are the Satan incarnate.

[California Joe]

WooHoo. Look at me I'm Satan. *wagging pointed tail*

[Javehn]

Satan , he is a satan ... he is a satan ... Playa playa ... ( just one cool movie from da hood , don't remember the name yo ) .NWA rules !!

Fox2 , you are a pilot ?? That's cool ! What kinda pilot you are ?

And who is cooler , Navy fly boys , or Air force cocky pilots ?? (Want to start flame on Air force-Navy issue ) . And which one you wanna be ?

[IDFM203]

bellieve me , the thing you had with ladies in infantry , we have it 1000 times worth in armor . But thank god every different base have some nice girls there .... I am not so sure about that...believe me what I saw wasn’t much to distract anyone ;)

Though I will admit that I remember one of the fitness inductors in basic training was pretty hot, we sure liked running after her :P


By the way , something off topic . IDFM203 , take a look on the tanks movie on militarymovies site . Man , i creamed my pance 4 times in a row , damnit that is one serious funky ass movie . Ill take a look…are there any IDF ones…if not can you find any good ones?.



Now if someone is getting enlisted in every army in the world , ask to be tankers and nothing else . You do that !! DJ Javehn is watching ya !! while the tank corp is very good indeed and while that might be your choice and advice to others, nonetheless its not the preferred choice for most Israelis…hell you know very well that besides a pilot, you know where most prefer to go ;) , and rightfully so :D …….

*Must resist the urge to going any further* ;) again take it to the PM level if we are going to go any further.





“hehe :D …..and our "landings" aren’t as smooth as the pilots way of doing it ;) “

Ok so perhaps me in a plane wont cut it, but mono a mono on the ground, well that’s whole a different story :D “


Hey now, this was a discussion of pilot skill! You can't cheat like that! ;) well it was first a pilot discussion about real fighter pilots, then when it turned into us flying the planes well that’s a whole different story ;)

like you said before somewhat, I just know how to jump out of them and float so my whole thinking is a bit different then what a pilot is thiking ;)





As long as it is non-lethal combat, sure, I'm game! Because, you know...If it's lethal...Well, then someone dies. And that's not good for continuing debate! :D well non lethal fighting can turn into lethal if you know how to do it ;) …oh and don’t worry after its over I’ll find new people to continue the debate with ;)



Just curious were you a service member in the U.S. military or the USAF??

No. I apologize if I gave that impression. I am a civilian pilot who will very soon be joining the ranks of the USAF. no need to apologize mate :D ……so what kind of planes have you flown?

Oh and good luck on your future in the USAF :D

Shalom :D

[Fox2]

well non lethal fighting can turn into lethal if you know how to do it …oh and don’t worry after its over I’ll find new people to continue the debate with

I now have no doubt you are so evil you must be the Satan incarnate's bitch. ;) :D

Hey, any of you airsoft peoples! You want some real fun action? Bring your airsoft guns, and help me to defeat IDFM203!

I cannot be held responsible for serious injury or death as a result of your own actions.




Fox2 , you are a pilot ?? That's cool ! What kinda pilot you are ?

so what kind of planes have you flown?

Mostly smaller planes. Cessna 172s, and Piper models and some twin-engine props.

Also some helicopters like the Robinson R44. One of my most memorable experiences as a pilot, however, has been that I have had the honor to fly a retired UH-1H Iroquois helicopter!



I have never had any stick time with the larger jets (airliners, business jets), but I don't think that's for me anyway.

As Gene Hackman said in a recent movie: "You want to patrol the friendly skies in a BUS?!"

Although it's unfortunate because the income of some airline captains makes me think it would ease some financial troubles!



So, basically, that is my history. :D I want to serve my country, and I figure, "Hell, I've got the skills, I should be a pilot."



And who is cooler , Navy fly boys , or Air force cocky pilots ?? (Want to start flame on Air force-Navy issue ) . And which one you wanna be ?

All joking aside, I know a couple Navy pilots, and they are top-notch. Very professional. You have to be squared away to live on a ship for 6 months straight, fly every day (although that is not a disadvantage), and then perform carrier landings in pitching seas at all times of day.

That being said, Air Force has to be cooler. Sure, they are "land-lubbers," but no one kicks ass like the Air Force. The Navy doesn't have B-52s, F-22s, F-16s, or A-10s! They have F-18s, and F-14s!.


Upon enlisting in the Air Force, if I wanted to fly fixed-wing aircraft, I think I would try and go for "mudmoving" with the A-10.

Otherwise, I'd opt to be a chopper pilot. USAF Search and Rescue sounds pretty good. I've always liked helping folks, so, it might be a good choice for me.


Oh and good luck on your future in the USAF

Thanks :D

[Javehn]

Respect to Fox2 , and nothing less !! May you have good luck there , and be excellent pilot in Air Force , on some fine F16 . If you want some airsoft thingie , i am also pretty good at it , i think at list . We would kick many asses !! We will kick some , as long as you bringing the weapons , and stuff ... We will teach you the new meaning of pain ( at list for virtual ) . We all reincarnation of the GREAT LUCCIFER HIMSELF HAHAHAHAHA THE BEAST 666 THE RULLER OF THE UNDER WORLD !!!
Sorry , must be from all the exams i having ... :|


I am not so sure about that...believe me what I saw wasn’t much to distract anyone

**** , i ment to say worse , not worth . Our girls were ugly as hell , and to look directly at them was much horrific , then to look directly at the son . We were the lowest on the girls rank in all army i think ... :(


Ill take a look…are there any IDF ones…if not can you find any good ones?.

I have the same one about the IDF tank battalion life , and tank range in my computer , and i am trying to upload this on my new server (i am tottal dumbass on computers and internet . Total dumbass , as a shoe ) . Offcorse , no luck meanwhile , and the movie is also funky good !!

By the way , didn't tried to proove something , just to show what can 2 single tanks perform . Fire fire sabot!!

I have a friend , that have amazing , and i mean amazing combat footages on his video . I staring a lot on his films also ... But he does have some very surrealistic unreal footages , and they got so famous that the brigade commander watched them specialy . He captured some ATGM , missiles , and mortar attacks on IDF posts from very close vicinity , again something unbellivable . Unfortunatly , he don't want to post it over the net , for once , and for twice , he is allready back in his old state (that's Ukraine) . Too bad , too focken bad .

[Fox2]

Respect to Fox2 , and nothing less !! May you have good luck there , and be excellent pilot in Air Force , on some fine F16 . If you want some airsoft thingie , i am also pretty good at it , i think at list . We would kick many asses !! We will kick some , as long as you bringing the weapons , and stuff ... We will teach you the new meaning of pain ( at list for virtual ) . We all reincarnation of the GREAT LUCCIFER HIMSELF HAHAHAHAHA THE BEAST 666 THE RULLER OF THE UNDER WORLD !!!


Thanks :D

Hm... I have been reading some about this airsoft, and it seems like fun. Do you play it? Is there a big "following" in Israel?




**** , i ment to say worse , not worth . Our girls were ugly as hell , and to look directly at them was much horrific , then to look directly at the son . We were the lowest on the girls rank in all army i think ... :(

Hey, Javehn, you ever think maybe that the job of sitting in a small, tight, loud space with 4 sweaty men is not going to appeal to feminine women? ;)

Oh, and for the same reason, most of the time USMC women are not that pretty either :P So forget that JAG and stuff. *** sells.

[IDFM203]

well non lethal fighting can turn into lethal if you know how to do it …oh and don’t worry after its over I’ll find new people to continue the debate with

I now have no doubt you are so evil you must be the Satan incarnate's bitch. ;) :D
Ooh getting a bit testy there :( ;)


Hey, any of you airsoft peoples! You want some real fun action? Bring your airsoft guns, and help me to defeat IDFM203! so I see that you need some help!! (thanks for the compliment :D ).

Hey get all the airsofters and all the help you need, as long as I can bring along my personal weapon I am fine with it (I am sure you can guess what my personal weapon was based on my screen name)


I cannot be held responsible for serious injury or death as a result of your own actions. Good as long as you don’t have your parents holding me responsible for what happens to you as well. ;)



As for your flying…yeah like Javehn said, much respect to you and again I wish you good luck in your future at the AF :D

Shalom :D

[Fox2]

As for your flying…yeah like Javehn said, much respect to you and again I wish you good luck in your future at the AF :D

Shalom :D

Thank you very much. :D

But I have forbade myself from responding to any content above this because it is pure, unadulterated evil.

Ok, maybe I will respond ;) ...

High explosive dual purpose rounds don't exactly count as non-lethal now do they?! :P :)

Unless it was a marker round, in which case it would most likely knock me unconscious upon striking the head. :oops: How's that for a hangover! :P



Good as long as you don’t have your parents holding me responsible for what happens to you as well.

I don't need no stinkin' permission slip to get myself killed.

(But that was originally to the brave souls who attempted to attack you and your M203 with bb guns :lol: ) Yes, I can see them lining up now!

Shalom, ya'll :D

[gilgoul]

To gilgoul

Thanks for your reply

Too bad they didn’t take you in SADIR, you look like you can defiantly hack there……..I wasn’t sure if the cut off age was 28 or 27 and I guess its 27 from your answer.

As for “Shelav bet”, I don’t know much about it…….I would love to hear more about it. (I was in SADIR so it’s not of interest to me but I know some people in other places that might be interested)

What I do know is that its for older (I guess after 27) people that make “aliyah” and Shalav bet training is three months (correct?) and that gives them a basic rudimentary level of how to be a soldier in the IDF and then you do a month a year in reserves (again correct?)……more then that I am not that familiar with details…if there is more, please share that info (of course without violating any of our OPSEC rules ;) ).

Shalom :D


Shalom


Shlav bet, as you explained it, is for the old folks like me, wether they wanted or not to be drafted.
The basic training is really basic, usually in this jobniks training base of the south, before going to your specialty course, that is usually much more interresting and fun. I did it in a non combattant research and rescue Unit in a base of the merkaz.
The important aspect of shlav bet, that to my knoledge is completely ignore by most of the yong jobnicks officers I encounterred, is the fact that a lot of human ressource is wasted, for instance aproximately half of my unit were former personnel of field unit from their country of origin, and among the former soviet block olim, a lot of highly qualified/experienced personnels that are ready to serve on any kind of combat mission, but are not given the opportunity to do so :( .
For instance, a friend of mine, also from france, who served as a sniperin the alpinist unit 27 BCA, and spent 6 month in yugoslavia soing counter sniping job ( he flabergasted everyone one base by putting 3/3 bullets in a 1/2 shekel coin at 40 meters with a regular training M16)founds himself being a rescue operator, not that the job is worthless, far from that, but this guy could be much better with a m24 than with a shovel.
In any way, the yearly call brings you to do more military job, I was for instance based for a month or so in the south doing border patrol, as a MAGIST, or sometimes maning check points in calm areas.
Far from the duvdevan job, close enough to get the adrenaline shooting up once in a while, and thats enough for my old heart
;) , even if I think i would be very happy to join any kind of filed unit, even artillery :|

Have a very good day

[IDFM203]

Shalom


Shlav bet, as you explained it, is for the old folks like me, wether they wanted or not to be drafted.
The basic training is really basic, usually in this jobniks training base of the south, before going to your specialty course, that is usually much more interresting and fun. I did it in a non combattant research and rescue Unit in a base of the merkaz.
The important aspect of shlav bet, that to my knoledge is completely ignore by most of the yong jobnicks officers I encounterred, is the fact that a lot of human ressource is wasted, for instance aproximately half of my unit were former personnel of field unit from their country of origin, and among the former soviet block olim, a lot of highly qualified/experienced personnels that are ready to serve on any kind of combat mission, but are not given the opportunity to do so :( .
For instance, a friend of mine, also from france, who served as a sniperin the alpinist unit 27 BCA, and spent 6 month in yugoslavia soing counter sniping job ( he flabergasted everyone one base by putting 3/3 bullets in a 1/2 shekel coin at 40 meters with a regular training M16)founds himself being a rescue operator, not that the job is worthless, far from that, but this guy could be much better with a m24 than with a shovel.
In any way, the yearly call brings you to do more military job, I was for instance based for a month or so in the south doing border patrol, as a MAGIST, or sometimes maning check points in calm areas.
Far from the duvdevan job, close enough to get the adrenaline shooting up once in a while, and thats enough for my old heart
;) , even if I think i would be very happy to join any kind of filed unit, even artillery :|

Have a very good day Now now don’t get carried away with that “even artillery” ;)

So your training level is as high as 02? (Correct?)


Boy that is a real shame that they don’t recognize your or anyone’s else’s prior military service….you’d think they would……..geez I don’t know what to say to that.

I did read though that they had some former Russian special forces snipers now living in Israel and they allowed them to become instructors. so they did recognize it somewhat but yeah they should do a better job of getting more involved for those that have prior military service. (And of course can still hack it ;) )

Ahh so you’re a Magist :D …..I love that weapon…a bit heavy but it defiantly packs a powerful punch ;)

Thanks for explaining Shelav bet to me.

Shalom :D