Sweden: Double Standards in Freedom of Speech

[Jeremiah]

http://****france.com/images/i407/eurabia.jpg

Tuesday, October 11, 2005
Sweden: Double Standards in Freedom of Speech
fjordman.blogspot.co . . .
Malmö is, as my regular readers will know, probably the worst city in Scandinavia when it comes to Muslim immigration, and the urban district of Rosengård perhaps the worst ghetto in northern Europe. Buses are cancelled because of stone throwing, the municipality spends millions of dollars just on replacing broken windows at local schools, ambulances and the fire brigades hardly enter without police escort. Crime is endemic throughout parts of the city. A local police officer knows this all too well, of course, and grows angry when he sees the inaction by the authorities and the money wasted on welfare programs for people only creating trouble. But he's not allowed to say this, because that would be "racism."

Notice that the content of the email was indeed illegal by Swedish law. He was in fact prosecuted for a "though crime" stated in a private email, but was freed for the sole reason that he didn't intend his writings to be made public. If he had written this on a small blog, he would have been sentenced and thus dismissed from the police force by now. This law is intended to protect "ethnic minorities." Malmö will in a few years become the first major Scandinavian city with a Muslim majority, which means that Swedes will be an ethnic minority. Will the courts then ban hate speech against native Swedes? Somehow, I suspect not:

Hate mail policeman freed

The 43 year old Malmö police officer who sent an e-mail containing racist statements to council leader Ilmar Reepalu was freed on Tuesday by Malmö district court. According to the court, the policeman was not guilty of persecution of a minority group. In his email to Reepalu he referred to "criminals called Mohammed from Rosengård" and urged the council leader to withdraw the "massive subsidies to all the bloody foreigners in Malmö". The prosecutor had demanded a prison sentence or fine for the policeman. The personnel department of the National Police Board had already decided that he would be dismissed if he was found guilty of a serious offence. The court stated that the contents of the e-mail were offensive and degrading, but said that the police officer had had no intention of spreading his views more widely - despite the fact that the message became public when he sent it to the council leader.

At the same time in Sweden, Muslims openly flaunt their support for terror attacks aginst their own country, and Radio Islam has put Nazi literature such as Adolf Hitler's autobiography "Mein Kampf" online in several languages. They also say Jews are evil and should be "crushed". Apparently, if you are a Muslim, this is "freedom of speech":

Head of "Radio Islam" in Sweden: The Muslims' War is with the Jews

"Sweden's greatest author, Jan Myrdal, said to me: 'You Muslims may need our support, but we need your Jihad. Otherwise, whom will we support?' If there is no Jihad and resistance, who will the free people in the West support? There are free people in the West. The Zionist control of the media imposes a kind of media terrorism and hypocrisy, in such a way that many Swedes have a public opinion which they express on radio and TV. If [a Swede] wants to live a normal life and have work, he must claim to be Israel's friend and the enemy of Israel's enemies. But when you talk to regular Swedes, and even authors, privately, they are all against Israel and against the Zionist occupation. Nevertheless, if Israel finds itself in danger and if we become stronger than it, no Westerner will come to its defense. The Jews in the West – and this has become a tradition – have 100% complete control of the media, of the political parties, of the trade unions, and of the publishing houses. They politically control all the parties, from Right to Left. I am a Muslim. I am not a Communist or a Marxist. I oppose both Marxism and Communism. This analysis of yours is a Marxist-Communist analysis, because the Koran says that our battle is with the Jews. Zionism is not mentioned in the Koran. Our war is against the Jews."
http://fjordman.blogspot.com/

[EffJi]

I never realised that the name of the council leader's name was Ilmar Reepalu. Then I guess it's no surprise police officer was charged. Ever tried arguing with an immigrant in Sweden?

[dacanadianbomb]

Goodness that Jan Myrdal guy sure sounds like quite the basket case.

[Luno]

we have already debated the Swedish cop in another thread


link
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=57553

[caridon]

I never realised that the name of the council leader's name was Ilmar Reepalu. Then I guess it's no surprise police officer was charged. Ever tried arguing with an immigrant in Sweden?

this is Ilmar
http://oldmalmo.malmo.se/pls/reg/mandat?lpszDispatcher=1002&lpszPol=1

He is not an imigrant.

/C

[caridon]

this fjordman type is a total nutcase and he has his facts wrong.

"He was in fact prosecuted for a "though crime" stated in a private email"

The email wasent private, it was public as all corespondense to public officials are public. (and i realy dont think a seniour police official can claim ignorance of this.)

"Radio Islam has put Nazi literature such as Adolf Hitler's autobiography "Mein Kampf" online in several languages. They also say Jews are evil and should be "crushed". Apparently, if you are a Muslim, this is "freedom of speech":"

Here he conveniently forgets that radio islams webpage is not located in sweden so we cannot do anything about it. (we did however convict the leader for "hets mot folkgrupp" for statments made on the radio. A fact fjordman "misses".

<sarcasm>
but we cant let facts get in the way of political rantings against the horrible imigrants that come and steal our jobbs and daughters
</sarcasm>

/C

[kinghk]

<sarcasm>
but we cant let facts get in the way of political rantings against the horrible imigrants that come and steal our jobbs and daughters
</sarcasm>


How many of the "horrible immigrants" actually has a job?

[Thor]

this fjordman type is a total nutcase and he has his facts wrong.

"He was in fact prosecuted for a "though crime" stated in a private email"

The email wasent private, it was public as all corespondense to public officials are public. (and i realy dont think a seniour police official can claim ignorance of this.)

"Radio Islam has put Nazi literature such as Adolf Hitler's autobiography "Mein Kampf" online in several languages. They also say Jews are evil and should be "crushed". Apparently, if you are a Muslim, this is "freedom of speech":"

Here he conveniently forgets that radio islams webpage is not located in sweden so we cannot do anything about it. (we did however convict the leader for "hets mot folkgrupp" for statments made on the radio. A fact fjordman "misses".

<sarcasm>
but we cant let facts get in the way of political rantings against the horrible imigrants that come and steal our jobbs and daughters
</sarcasm>

/C 1. Learn to use the quoting function.

2. Learn to face the facts that non-european immigrants are responsible for the majority of the attacks, murder and rapes, on swedes. This is almost on a war-like scale. Not to mention the fact these people are supported through the welfare system.

[Belrick]

Reap what you sow sweden. Enjoy your liberal politics.

[rolls]

Same could be said for New Zealand Belrick

[Belrick]

Yep, my apologies if i came across holier than thou :D

[PeterG]

2. Learn to face the facts that non-european immigrants are responsible for the majority of the attacks, murder and rapes, on swedes. This is almost on a war-like scale. Not to mention the fact these people are supported through the welfare system.

In Norway, we can still discuss such issues in newspaper webboards etc. - i understand you in effect can't in Sweden - we have swedish TV here, and the almost complete lack of critical views on immigration and the problems connected to it, is very obvious.It is PC gone wild.

I guess we're headed in the same direction in Norway.The left denied for many years the connection between the massive increase in violent crime and immigration - it simply wasn't true! It was a myth! When the police were finally allowed to release statistics a few years ago, they changed to " well, it is true - but the reason is that they get marginalized by society" - the debate still rages, and many left-wingers now feel that the best "solution" is to simply stop talking about it alltogether!

[caridon]

As usual the debate goes from the original topic to
"The evil imigrants" that are responsible for "all" crimes.

What Thor,fjordman and other's conveniently forgets is the little fact about
lies damned lies and statistics.

They look att all crime comitted by imigrants and compares to all swedes. and yes then the ratio of crimes are larger.

HOWEVER. if you separate imigrants and swedes into groups ased on employment , income ect you se that the imigrants are only marginaly overrepresented in the groups.
The reason imigrants as a whole are overrepresented is that they are overrepresented in the groups that comit many crimes (unemplyed, homeless ect)

When you understand this you realise that the problem is not the imigrants themself it is the societys inability to integrate them.
sole that problem and the crime problem (mostly) go away.

But fjordman et all cant say this because it would force them to examine themselvs and their actions instead of just ranting against imigrants.

/C

[caridon]

1. Learn to use the quoting function.

2. Learn to face the facts that non-european immigrants are responsible for the majority of the attacks, murder and rapes, on swedes. This is almost on a war-like scale. Not to mention the fact these people are supported through the welfare system.

1) I know about the quoting system and use it when I find it apropriate.

2.2) learn to come with comments that are relevant to the post you are replying to. instead of your canned "all imigrants are evil criminals supported by welfare"
reply.

lastly. give me some statistics (with proper social groupings breakdown) that proves your statement.

/C

[PeterG]

As usual the debate goes from the original topic to
"The evil imigrants" that are responsible for "all" crimes.

What Thor,fjordman and other's conveniently forgets is the little fact about
lies damned lies and statistics.

They look att all crime comitted by imigrants and compares to all swedes. and yes then the ratio of crimes are larger.

HOWEVER. if you separate imigrants and swedes into groups ased on employment , income ect you se that the imigrants are only marginaly overrepresented in the groups.
The reason imigrants as a whole are overrepresented is that they are overrepresented in the groups that comit many crimes (unemplyed, homeless ect)

When you understand this you realise that the problem is not the imigrants themself it is the societys inability to integrate them.
sole that problem and the crime problem (mostly) go away.

But fjordman et all cant say this because it would force them to examine themselvs and their actions instead of just ranting against imigrants.

/C

80-90% of immigrants here in Norway,don't finish the language courses they are offered.Thousands of children of immigrants are sendt to countries like Pakistan for years on end by their parents - Many DO NOT put in the necessary effort to integrate into our society.And when the inevitable happens: They find it difficult to find jobs, since they don't bother to learn the language, or learn how to function in our society etc. - it is because of 'racism'! That's rich!
I have heard a female Norwegian anthropologist say in the media also, that 'Norwegian women should acknowledge that we live in a multicultural society now, and therefore dress more aproprietely' - as a measure against all the rapes commited by immigrants/asylum seekers.( something like 70-75% of all rapes ) - so even rapes are OUR fault, since our women 'dress provocatively'!

I wouldn't be surprised at all if some-left wingers started accusing survivors of suicide bombings, 'racist' for surviving, when the 'multicultural' bomber clearly wanted them dead!

[Mailman]

Same could be said for New Zealand Belrick

You could...but then you would be an ignorant ****er if you did :D

Mailman

[caridon]

80-90% of immigrants here in Norway,don't finish the language courses they are offered.Thousands of children of immigrants are sendt to countries like Pakistan for years on end by their parents - Many DO NOT put in the necessary effort to integrate into our society.And when the inevitable happens: They find it difficult to find jobs, since they don't bother to learn the language, or learn how to function in our society etc. - it is because of 'racism'! That's rich!
I have heard a female Norwegian anthropologist say in the media also, that 'Norwegian women should acknowledge that we live in a multicultural society now, and therefore dress more aproprietely' - as a measure against all the rapes commited by immigrants/asylum seekers.( something like 70-75% of all rapes ) - so even rapes are OUR fault, since our women 'dress provocatively'!

I wouldn't be surprised at all if some-left wingers started accusing survivors of suicide bombings, 'racist' for surviving, when the 'multicultural' bomber clearly wanted them dead!

I said nothing about racism. I said that the problem was the socuetys inability to integrate the imigrants. I have not placed any blame just pointed to the real problem.

I dont have any simple solutions and i doubt that there are any. it is a complex problem and will probably have a complex solution (and will be implemented badly,by ineficient politichans ect)

as for the rest of your idiotic rant i'l just ignore it and pretend that you are smarter than that type of crap and BS.

/C

[kinghk]

I said nothing about racism. I said that the problem was the socuetys inability to integrate the imigrants. I have not placed any blame just pointed to the real problem.

as for the rest of your idiotic rant i'l just ignore it and pretend that you are smarter than that type of crap and BS.

You have this typical arrogant politically correct attitude. It is the societys fault that the immigrants fail to intergrate and anyone who claims something else is an racist/asshole/idiot. Is this all you are able to reply with? Are you unable to see why immigrants fail to get work when they are unable to communicate with the locals because they don't show up on language courses? Why is it always everyone except the immigrants to blame because they are out of work and commits too much crime?

[Laworkerbee]

caridon

"When you understand this you realise that the problem is not the imigrants themself it is the societys inability to integrate them.
sole that problem and the crime problem (mostly) go away."

This goes back to exactly what PeterG was saying!

Perhaps if you stop talking about it the problem will go away caridon, who's fault is it that immigrants were let in but not integrated?.

[PeterG]

'Society' can't integrate an immigrant - it can only offer the immigrant some help in this respect - they have to integrate themselves by participating in society.I have a friend and colleague originally from Iran, who left his home at 15 and eventually ended up here.He put in the necessary effort himself by accepting education, and using this education to his advantage.Many, many others DO NOT BOTHER - and suffer the consequences, by ending up unemployed or in minimum-wage jobs.(Though many are unemployed by choice as well).This is not 'societys failure to integrate them' - It is CHOICES made by these individuals.

[khukuri]

this fjordman type is a total nutcase and he has his facts wrong.

"He was in fact prosecuted for a "though crime" stated in a private email"

The email wasent private, it was public as all corespondense to public officials are public. (and i realy dont think a seniour police official can claim ignorance of this.)

"Radio Islam has put Nazi literature such as Adolf Hitler's autobiography "Mein Kampf" online in several languages. They also say Jews are evil and should be "crushed". Apparently, if you are a Muslim, this is "freedom of speech":"

Here he conveniently forgets that radio islams webpage is not located in sweden so we cannot do anything about it. (we did however convict the leader for "hets mot folkgrupp" for statments made on the radio. A fact fjordman "misses".

<sarcasm>
but we cant let facts get in the way of political rantings against the horrible imigrants that come and steal our jobbs and daughters
</sarcasm>


/C


actually, the radio islam dude got convicted when he had his radio in sweden, :).

[M203]

Caridon: I have experience of the immigrants of roseng&#229;rd and the problem is that they dont want to integrate... They dont want swedish culture, they dont want to know swedish. You must understand that they are quite comfortable living with social welfare.

They have to make an effort to integrate, but the problem is they dont want to. Why do you think they are building a paralell community in the form of islamic center...muslim school teaching muslim values, muslim day care teaching muslim values etc etc

Somewhere between 2010-2030 we will have a muslim majority in Malm&#246;
shortly after a muslim party in registered in Malm&#246;
shortly after that a fatwah from islamic center tells muslims to vote for that party.
Shortly after Malm&#246; is run by a muslim party

/Say no to islam

For swedes http://www.jihadimalmo.blogspot.com/

[eucalyptus]

Caridon: I have experience of the immigrants of roseng&#229;rd and the problem is that they dont want to integrate... They dont want swedish culture, they dont want to know swedish. You must understand that they are quite comfortable living with social welfare.

They have to make an effort to integrate, but the problem is they dont want to. Why do you think they are building a paralell community in the form of islamic center...muslim school teaching muslim values, muslim day care teaching muslim values etc etc

Somewhere between 2010-2030 we will have a muslim majority in Malm&#246;
shortly after a muslim party in registered in Malm&#246;
shortly after that a fatwah from islamic center tells muslims to vote for that party.
Shortly after Malm&#246; is run by a muslim party

/Say no to islam

For swedes http://www.jihadimalmo.blogspot.com/

Whats wrong with that? You know when someone integrates, it doesn&#180;t meen that that they change their religion. What do you meen by expirience of Roseng&#229;rd? Mostly older people 50+ have hard time learning forgein languages, I have an uncle, his wife and 4 cousins living in Roseng&#229;rd. All of them speak swedish, only one that couldnt speak was my grandmother. In forgein countries people tend to stick togather due to having to speak to people with same expiriences and have a recognisable face. It&#180;s not as if they can move somewhere else, when you move to sweden you have to pick a lowrent appartment and most of those are in as expected immirgant populated areas.

/say no to idiots like you

[khukuri]

Caridon: I have experience of the immigrants of rosengård and the problem is that they dont want to integrate... They dont want swedish culture, they dont want to know swedish. You must understand that they are quite comfortable living with social welfare.

They have to make an effort to integrate, but the problem is they dont want to. Why do you think they are building a paralell community in the form of islamic center...muslim school teaching muslim values, muslim day care teaching muslim values etc etc

Somewhere between 2010-2030 we will have a muslim majority in Malmö
shortly after a muslim party in registered in Malmö
shortly after that a fatwah from islamic center tells muslims to vote for that party.
Shortly after Malmö is run by a muslim party

/Say no to islam

For swedes http://www.jihadimalmo.blogspot.com/


I live in malmö and lived in rosengård and youre ridicilous. Sure there a lot of immigrants in malmo but its not like its easy for them to integrate. What do you ant them to do, go to limhamn and knock on doors saying hi we want to be friends?

And youre hole islamophobia hiysteria is conspiracy is ridicilous too. Theres only a few bunch of the older people that are still stricts on islam. Most of the "elders" accept that their kids are growing up in sweden and becoming more swedish for every day that goes. Youre comments are taken out of your ass, mine are taken from my reality, my life.

[sickofpretenders]

Hey lenin, I hear rumours of muslim immigrants not allowing their daughters to school in case they lose their islam/meet a local viking boy etc etc. Does any or much of that go on that you have seen, or do all kids go to swedish school?

[khukuri]

Hey lenin, I hear rumours of muslim immigrants not allowing their daughters to school in case they lose their islam/meet a local viking boy etc etc. Does any or much of that go on that you have seen, or do all kids go to swedish school?

Never heard of it? Is there anything special youre refering to? Parent here dont have such big right that theycan decide whether kids go to school or not.
But of course she would get trouble, sadly. But thats not just among muslims, many people from immigrant countries dont have the same view on relationships as modern europe.
But its changing...

[Kekkonen]

I live in malmö and lived in rosengård and youre ridicilous. Sure there a lot of immigrants in malmo but its not like its easy for them to integrate. What do you ant them to do, go to limhamn and knock on doors saying hi we want to be friends?

And youre hole islamophobia hiysteria is conspiracy is ridicilous too. Theres only a few bunch of the older people that are still stricts on islam. Most of the "elders" accept that their kids are growing up in sweden and becoming more swedish for every day that goes. Youre comments are taken out of your ass, mine are taken from my reality, my life.

Although I agree with you about the often second generation "moslem" immigrants not being way too fundamentalistic I think M203 is right when he talks about some kind of immigrant party. Although I doubt that it would be very islamistic, I rather think it would be some kind of general party of/for immigrants. New parties pop up in Sweden, for the feminists, for the elders, for the sick etc.

Now immigrants are not very active in politics in Sweden, but when they too realize that they can form their own party, and have some populistic views they can attract a lot of voters in places like Malmö, and in places like Malmö not many immigrants have to vote for them either before they get seats in the local authority. And then I guess they will soon get the 4% needed to get into the parliament.

Where they would surely gang up with the social democrats/leftists/greens. And wow... then what?