Body armor?

[stuntman]

The USA uses Interceptor body armor with modular webbing! What do other countries use for body armor? ie.... UK uses Mark 4,5, what does france use, germany or any other countries thx!

[GearGod]

Will modular webbing replace alice type gear the world adopted since WW2?
Definitely. Would you rather buy gear which its pouches are pre-sewed on without you having any choice as to where the pouches will be placed? A modular system allows such a customization. Actually, its not replacing the already outdated LC-2 WWII gear:
http://special-warfare.net/data_base/305_load_bearing/alice_01/alice_05.jpg
Its replacing the previous-issue Enhanced Tactical Load Bearing Vest(ETLBV):
http://special-warfare.net/data_base/305_load_bearing/iifs_01/iifs_tlbv_2nd_03.jpg
Did you know the MOLLEII FLC is worn over the Interceptor?
http://special-warfare.net/data_base/303_protective/armor_02/interceptor_03.jpg
And is worn without the Interceptor Armor on recon missions:
http://special-warfare.net/data_base/305_load_bearing/molle_00/molle_2_vest_01/molle2_flc_15.jpg
Also, Special Forces use a SPEAR system... Once again consists of the Armor:
http://special-warfare.net/data_base/305_load_bearing/spear_elcs_00/spear_balcs_01/spear_balcs_10.jpg
And ELCS Vest over it:
http://special-warfare.net/data_base/305_load_bearing/spear_elcs_00/spear_elcs_vest_01/spear_elcs_12.jpg
Although I dont know what other coutries wear, I think I like what the british wear-- Ive seen this "Sgt Tunney" the infamous demolitions specialist w/ that Bullpup SA80 sport that british vest system... If anyone knows about british stuff tell me

[Sulph8]

The IDF has the Unified Ceramic Vest:

http://www.isayeret.com/vest/main-vest.gif

[stuntman]

Very nice keep it up! Im trying to collect foriegn body armor so some links please!

[GearGod]

Im trying to collect foriegn body armor
Why?

[stuntman]

Why?

To protect my self from gun collectors on this site! Smart man!
No its just a hobby just like collecting small arms, or uniforms or something like that! Clear?


http://gear-guru.net/paraclete.html#intercept
See!

[stuntman]

Some nice pics!
http://gear-guru.net/interceptor_front.jpg

[Nelson]

No one wears that stupid FLC anymore especially if you have the Interceptor. The FLC just sucks so much ass no one wants to wear it.

[GearGod]

No one wears that stupid FLC anymore especially if you have the Interceptor. The FLC just sucks so much ass no one wants to wear it.

Perhaps, but I saw 101st wear it and train with it before thier deployment on Iraq on that MTV show.. Here check out my post and watch that show on MTV: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1704&start=0

I also saw photos of 101st guys wear it on this website and that other defeneslink website

Why does it "suck so much ass" does it have some kind of 21st century hi-tech not to mention legendary bum suction type high speed technological device on this Fighting Load Carrier vest that you speak of?

[GearGod]

stuntman: Nice intercetor cover. What disturbs me and prevents myself from recharging my battery at night is the fact that the "troops" arent using these interceptor covers. They dont get the 3color desert covers. Marines are using the coyote brown cover... WHY!?!?!?! Why not use a marine MARPAT desert cover?

[Nelson]

The FLC has been discussed to death about why it sucks so bad so go look at Lightfighter or Assaultweb and find out.

The Marines use Coyote colors cause of supply, it is less expensive to make something using one spool of thread opposed to three spools of different thread.

[stuntman]

I dont think they use the threading method to make the camo its actually painted on in some kind of way! Im not really sure how though~!
http://www.paracletearmor.com/products/icv0007.gifhttp://gear-guru.net/interceptor_back.jpg
http://gear-guru.net/tims_vest_back_panel.jpghttp://gear-guru.net/tims_vest3.jpghttp://gear-guru.net/tims_vest_canteen_cover.jpg

[dez000]

Belgian webbing worn over the body armor (Don't know what type it is, looks like the type the UK Royal marines use):

* Belgian Para-commandos in Kosovo (no body armor)

http://www.mil.be/armycomp/view_gall_large.asp?ID=4369
http://www.mil.be/armycomp/view_gall_large.asp?ID=4377£

Belgian body armor, with pouches put on directly:

http://www.mil.be/isaf/view_gall_large.asp?ID=5138
http://www.mil.be/isaf/view_gall_large.asp?ID=4245
http://www.mil.be/isaf/view_gall_large.asp?ID=4242
http://users.pandora.be/crazy.eddy/opleiding/mir9.JPG

Wasn't able to find one with the webbing over the body armor, i do have some tapes of it at home and photos too, but i don't have a scanner to scane me in :p

[stoli_dude]

That 2nd picture of the Kosovo set: is that from a little Albanian school in a village just a few km southeast of the Serbian town of Gracinica? It sits at the base of a mountain that had at one time held a radio rely site for a SWEBAT.

[stuntman]

Dam nice pics but the body armor looks like a pasgt vest and it looks like alice gear, minus the lbv (british style)

[Zach R.]

Adam,are you OBSESSED!?Dude,I am really serious.STOP WATCHING MTV AND GO TO THE LIBRARY!Or watch history channel or something.They could have just been wearing it for training.I've seen the 82nd train with old M60E3s even though they switched to the M240B.Get my drift,quit watching MTV,go checkout some books,and try the history channel.If nothing is on,try researching it on the internet.I'm not trying to start an arguement,but dude,TEAR YOURSELF AWAY FROM THE TV AND READ SOME BOOKS!

[stuntman]

what does france use, germany or any other countries thx

[seventy6er]

german body armor

click here (http://www.seventy6er.de/einsatz/einsatz_07.htm)


[/url]

[Sabre]

Will modular systems replace current load carrying systems?

I hope not. No offense to americans here but your LC2 (or whatever its designation is) is not well designed/worn properly (ie always round your arse and flopping around!). In that respect modular systems are better.

However, can you really be bothered to move around your pouches to suit the mission? If you are an infantry soldier, then you need to carry in your webbing certain things. They will seldom change:

-Magazines (not the glossy type!)
-cleaning kit
-water bottles
-24 hours of food
-some way of cooking that food/making a brew
-1st aid kit
-comms cord
-binos
-cable ties/tape
-bits and bobs you want to carry etc, mainly bullets and water though

Of course personal preference dictates how/where you stow that kit, but any mission will require it. As far as extras go (claymores, specialist equipment) they all go in your daysack/rucksack. Your webbing should be set up and contain what you need to enable you to operate for around 24 hours doing whatever you are tasked to do (longer in the case of better trained personnel, recce, SF etc). Odd items or very necessary items like compass (spoon!) should just go in your pockets (including grenades).

The point is that there is no need change the contents/arrangement of webbing drastically for any mission (except urban warfare, where webbing is often too big and clumsy->then just use a chest rig stowed in your rucksack and whip it out before, and fill it with mags, grenades and water, all you need). The idea of specially designed pouches for different individual equipment is not new. Look at US WW2 kit. There were different set-ups for Garand/BAR/M1, you name it. A better approach was the British one. One set of massive ammo pouches big enough to take Bren Mags (not very well designed as they were meant to sit high on the chest, making lying ****e uncomfortable). Simple but effective.

It's the same now. British PLCE has a few types of pouch. Most commonly, blokes will only have three different types: 2xAmmo (6 mags in each), 2xUtility (just that, bung what you want in them) and a waterbottle pouch (same size as utility, but pointlessly different). Whack a bungee round them and a strap through the loops on the back to keep them in place and they'll stay put when running. Even now that there is an issue assault vest (better for vehicles and urban), webbing still is preferred by many.

adambalhetchet, if you want to know more about the new vest or other british kit then ask me.

[MACT-1]

Something to think about. Most everyone states that MOLLE is better because it's modular. However, 99% of the MOLLE setups I see are worn in much the same manner that "unmodular" vests, LBV and LCE are already worn. Can't you place pouches anywhere you want on a web belt?? That makes it just as modular as any Blackhawk vest.
My question. Why pay the extra money to set up modular gear in "old school" fashions? Mag pouches always in the same place reguardless of choice. Buttpack, canteens, holster etc, etc, usually found in the same place reguardless of MOLLE or unMOLLE.
I have tried them all. Personal favorite is LBV. Gotta love the padded shoulders when not in body armor. Pick yours and train gentlemen. Later.

[Resurrection]

I was kind of confused on whether you wanted pics of webbings or body armor, so here they are both.


Swedish Armed Forces


http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/7962/10011647fl.jpg
Stridsväst 2000 (Combat Vest 2000)

http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/7099/w051012046us.jpg
In use in Liberia

http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/5522/w051212031wg.jpg
Another better view of the Stridsväst 2000



http://www.plutonen.com/images/kroppskydd94.jpg
Kroppsskydd 94 (Body Armor 94). Shown with the removable extra plates both front and back. With the ceramic plates, it protects against 5.56 mm and 7.62 mm AP rounds.

[Argyll]

Who in the fcuk resurected a post almost 3 years old?

MERRY CHRISTMAS MILPHOTOS MEMBERS

[ABNINF]

lol, Merry Christmas. He probably figured that he'd get in trouble, or flamed by long time member saying " We had this discussion 2 years ago, use the search noob.", or something along those lines :-)

[Dalleer]

Here's some Finnish fragmentation-vests / bullet-proof vests:

http://tietokannat.mil.fi/kalustoesittely/media/1112074354_BallistinensuojaPIENI.JPG

The New M/05 - "Flak vest"

http://www.mil.fi/laitokset/talv/image16.jpg

The current fragmentation vest

http://www.mil.fi/laitokset/talv/image17.jpg

Current bullet-proof vest

http://tietokannat.mil.fi/kalustoesittely/media/1112074277_Taistelijanvaat1PIENI.JPG

For comparison , here's the new M/05 modular combat vest

[Kekkonen]

For comparison , here's the new M/05 modular combat vest

It's good that it have PALS because there are zillions of pouches on the market that uses that, but I would like to see it having a belt as well (as on for example Stridsväst 2000 which on the hand doesn't have PALS).

http://www.finn-savotta.fi/uploads/liivietu.jpg

http://www.patriotoutfitters.com/img/products/12400/12443.GIF
Compare to Blackhawk Strike DOAV

[akmarksman]

Hmm..
I would like it to be up to the end-user..ie lance corporal in a foxhole..

Personal preference would be Armor first,then some drop-leg pouches,with a dump pouch on the other leg.Maybe x2 double mag pouch on the armor.

What is your take on the battle rattle?

[op centre]

the major problem with these chest webbing style rigs is try laying down flat on your chest on the ground and you run into trouble don't you.

It looks good but on a practical level the standard belt webbing is a better set up for infantry operations. Becouse when those rounds start to vip over your head you will want to get as close to the ground as you can get.

[dacanadianbomb]

Finally I see the reason why the SPEAR armour has sideways facing webbing on the front.

There will never be a fit all, fit anywhere, fit everything solution for carrying gear. You have to look at the tradeoffs of each setup and decide which one fits your better.Having all your stuff attached to your hips isnt going to help when you spend 80% of your time driving in a vehicle.

Theres one thing I wonder about with modular stuff, is what is the possibility of having to aid a buddy when he is hit, and he has his med kit in another place .You have to spend time looking for it, even if its only a few seconds.
IE , if he possibly has a spine injury, and is lieing on his med kit, because its on his bak and not on his front/side.
But a real medic would be able to comment on whether this would be a problem or not, since my thoughts or nothing but theory, without practical basis.

[Sidka]

here the CF one

Tactical Vest
http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/Chief_Land_Staff/Clothe_the_soldier/hab/images/Photos/7001.gif

http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/Chief_Land_Staff/Clothe_the_soldier/hab/images/Photos/2002.jpg

[Angelwings]

There has been 2 different body armor vests in the FDF during the 90s. See the pic below. Neither of them are flak vests or fragmentation vests. They look very much alike and they are both called a "protective vest" and they consist of soft armor insert and ceramic plates. They provide protection from shrapnel and rifle caliber weps including AP ammo, and have a very basic integration to load bearing equipment. The end result is one bulky setup.

http://www.mil.fi/laitokset/talv/image16.jpg


The new system has several versions. Some of them have protective vest similar to the old one(above) and separate equipment vest that is PALS compatible. This is a very good thing as it enables soldiers to buy standard MOLLE/PALS equipment such as BHI and the likes for relatively cheap and put it on their issued vest.

There is also a version that has PALS webbing directly on the protective vest. Below is a pic of the type of system. It is not yet issued but it should be in the next 2 years.

http://tietokannat.mil.fi/kalustoesittely/media/1112074277_Taistelijanvaat1PIENI.JPG

It's a good direction were going but not perfect. Several units need specialized gear that could have been provided in this 05 system. Also some of the old gear was lost eventhough feedback from the field just asked them back with minor mods.

[Dalleer]

Neither of them are flak vests or fragmentation vests.

You shouldn't shoot the messenger when I'm only telling you what the page itself described these two vests as. Blame mil.fi and send them hate-mail , not my describitions.

[Angelwings]

I actually quessed you took it from a mil site. I have talked to the project members and the head goons are difficult heads up in the clouds. As to these particular vests, I have used both of the old protective vests and I'm in a test unit that has had the 05 gear for a long time. I have a closet full of proto 05 gear. Which is kinda nice though ;)


You shouldn't shoot the messenger when I'm only telling you what the page itself described these two vests as. Blame mil.fi and send them hate-mail , not my describitions.

[Crewdog]

Since I have not seen it truely addressed as of yet I will say that the idea behind modularity is not so you can put your pouches anywhere you want. Most units have a basic loadout and directive as to where you place your modular pouches. This is what helps the medic out when he needs to patch that sucking chest wound you just recieved. The idea behind modularity is to tailor each vest for that particular individuals role in the squad. Weather it be rifleman, grenadier or medic. There are basic pouch sets offered for each role. This does cut down on having to carring four different vest systems in supply when all you need to do is remove the double 30 rounder pouches and put two saw pouches in their place. Or four medical pouches or just add a few double 40mm pouches.

In true nature, the older ALICE gear was modular for the most part. It may have not been as comfortable as some of the newer stuff but hey, it carried all the basics of combat, bullets, frags and water.

[joka]

I actually quessed you took it from a mil site. I have talked to the project members and the head goons are difficult heads up in the clouds. As to these particular vests, I have used both of the old protective vests and I'm in a test unit that has had the 05 gear for a long time. I have a closet full of proto 05 gear. Which is kinda nice though ;)

Pictures, or it isn't true p-)

(Feel free to complement the M05 thread) (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=43221)

[op centre]

Finally I see the reason why the SPEAR armour has sideways facing webbing on the front.

There will never be a fit all, fit anywhere, fit everything solution for carrying gear. You have to look at the tradeoffs of each setup and decide which one fits your better.Having all your stuff attached to your hips isnt going to help when you spend 80% of your time driving in a vehicle.

Theres one thing I wonder about with modular stuff, is what is the possibility of having to aid a buddy when he is hit, and he has his med kit in another place .You have to spend time looking for it, even if its only a few seconds.
IE , if he possibly has a spine injury, and is lieing on his med kit, because its on his bak and not on his front/side.
But a real medic would be able to comment on whether this would be a problem or not, since my thoughts or nothing but theory, without practical basis.That is why in australia we carry our medkit in our right hand leg pocket and mapping equipment in the left or that is what we did in vietnam. wheather or not we do it still i don't know. But that is why your combat trouser have leg pockets. So you know were everyones medkit is at all times. Were? Right hand leg pocket.

[sups]

Here is Finnish m05 type vest with KASI-simulator (without any magazine pockets etc). Allways when you have used those new vest's (when we train with simulators) it is horrible to put back on that old finnish army combat belt. :D

http://koti.mbnet.fi/~turkis/test.jpg

[Kekkonen]

Here is Finnish m05 type vest with KASI-simulator (without any magazine pockets etc). Allways when you have used those new vest's (when we train with simulators) it is horrible to put back on that old finnish army combat belt. :D

http://koti.mbnet.fi/~turkis/test.jpg

Interesting.

And also, is the Camelback something that is tested and might become standard?