Some history on John Kerry

[Tommy Gunn]

Leaflets passed out by the VVAW on their trip from NJ to PA
http://www.oz.net/~vvawai/images/leaflet.gif

John Kerry was one of the founders of the Vietnam Veteran's Against the War. The man is a turncoat.

[Tommy Gunn]

http://www.oz.net/~vvawai/images/ai-banner.gif (http://www.oz.net/~vvawai/)

click on the image above

[Tommy Gunn]

http://vikingphoenix.com/news/stn/2001/fonda_mugshot.jpg
Jane Fonda mugshot, clenched fist raised (communist salute)

In a speech to Duke University students in 1970, Fonda told the gathering, "If you understood what Communism was, you would hope and pray on your knees that we would someday become Communist."

[martinexsquaddie]

but of course "rambo"George was leading secret black ops downtown over hanoi when he was absent from the texas national guard rofl.

[mocking_loudly_died]

Who cares.

[Luxembourger]

I was told the big turkey President Bush was given at Baghdad Airport during his troop visits was made of plastic is that true?

[martinexsquaddie]

hey hanoi jane look s kinda cute :lol:

[Maj C]

You know Vietnam was a very divisive time for the states - almost as much as the Civil War...today 30 years later it's easy to point fingers and say who was right for doing what but I'm sure at the time people made the calls they did and really it's kind of wrong to play Monday morning quarterback with this.

Pat Conroy (Citadel alum and the son of the real Great Santini) protested the war and burned his draft card...he regrets it now realizing he should have gone but you know - they were all young then and young people do strange things sometimes...it's history.

A lot of people still love Bill Clinton - even though he wrote that he understood people who "loathed the military"...why was it ok for him to dodge the draft but not GW?

[hank]

Silly, because GW is a Republican and the standard is different in the media for Democrats and Republicans. Duh.

hank

[Trident-za]

Actually, I think it's because Clinton makes no attempt to say he did his duty. Thats not quite the same thing as saying "well, there might not be any evidence, and not 1 person who served with me has come forward, but really... trust me... I was there"

As an non-american who couldn't really give a damn about the eternal dem vs reb squable, I know which of the above scenarios seems the "least" dishonest/dishonorable to me....

P.S. the thing about none of Bush's supposed colleagues in arms coming forward is something I heard on the news this morning - dunno if its true or not.

[Rantanplan]

Your "Fake Turkey" avartar trivializes this accusations :lol:

[Rantanplan]

Btw: DAMN, THIS JANE FONDA WAS HOT!!!!!!

[Tengu]

In a speech to Duke University students in 1970, Fonda told the gathering, "If you understood what Communism was, you would hope and pray on your knees that we would someday become Communist."I so hate that hot bitch.
Speech reminds me of this: "a communist is someone who reads communism, an anti-communist is someone who understands communism"

[cut]

hey hanoi jane look s kinda cute :lol:

I agree

[duck]

Republican strategy change: Until now it was standard policy to spread "anonymous" e-mails praising Dubya as a Leader who truly cares about and almost loves his Military. Especially comparing his positive attitude to the (true or imagined) lack of interest the Clintons were showing and every time taking up the importance of personal experience in the Military.

Now, astonishing enough, Mac Owens writes a long piece in the NRO, the message being "No military experience is needed to be a succesful President and Commander-in Chief". Full 180-degree turn. And Ollie North takes up the Kerry mudslinging role some weeks after having called critics of Dubya "traitors".

Hehe, politics...

[Old300]

The turkey wasn't fake:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A33090-2003Dec3?language=printer

It wasn't for eating, either, but it wasn't plastic, it wasn't a set-up by the White House, and the President spent only a few seconds with it - almost all of his 2 hours at the airport was spent taking pictures with soldiers and serving them (real) food.

As for John Kerry, we (Americans, anyway) should be grateful for his service, but his actions after the war might have done more harm than the good that was done by his heroism. He said and did some disgusting things: symbolically renouncing his medals (he didn't actually throw them away, of course); accusing his comrades of atrocities (when the vast majority of them must have been innocent); and espousing an aggressively defeatist attitude (an oxymoron, yes, but true nonetheless) that probably helped ensure our defeat.

Whether the President's service in the National Guard is worse or better than Kerry's record of heroism and subsequent vituperative anti-Americanism will be an important issue in the coming election.

[Sixgun Symphony]

I think the GOP could have fielded a better candidate than George Bush back in 2000. Bush is weak. Bob Dole was good in his day, but he was just too old when he ran for the 1996 election.

Kerry, it seems as if Kerry decided that he was fighting on the wrong side in Vietnam. The guy is a pinko and I think that he very well might be the "Manchurian Candidate".

[Sixgun Symphony]

How come Jane Fonda was never prosecuted? We prosecuted Axis Sally and Tokyo Rose back in WWII. So how come Hanoi Jane got off the hook?

[Argyll]

Have any of you crowd who are bashing Kerry or even Bush for that matter,served your country and took the incoming,that thousands of men and women who serve ,do on a daily basis?
If not then you are in no position to judge a man who did,countless times!

[Sixgun Symphony]

Have any of you crowd who are bashing Kerry or even Bush for that matter,served your country and took the incoming,that thousands of men and women who serve ,do on a daily basis?
If not then you are in no position to judge a man who did,countless times!

I was in the navy, never came under fire like Kerry did. Kerry fought well, but his actions that followed his tour of duty will also be judged by voters.

Might I point out that Benedict Arnold was a war hero in the war for American independance before he turned? Benedict Arnold's bravery under fire do not excuse his treason.

[Russian Texan]

I was in the navy,

You don't mean this navy
http://www.officialvillagepeople.com/We%20Are%20Family%20page/images/023_23.jpg

Do you?

http://www.esato.com/ringtones/polyphonic/index.php/c=Village+People,id=10642

I am sorry man, it's the first thing that comes to mind when someone says navy rofl rofl rofl no disrespect, just a joke :lol:

In the Navy, la la la la la la :)

[Sixgun Symphony]

Oh hell no!

I got out just before Bill Clinton and his "Don't ask, don't tell" policy went into effect.

[James]

John Kerry was one of the founders of the Vietnam Veteran's Against the War. The man is a turncoat.

How does that make him a turncoat? At the very least, he had first hand experience about something he was protesting against.

Just curious...

[James]

How come Jane Fonda was never prosecuted? We prosecuted Axis Sally and Tokyo Rose back in WWII. So how come Hanoi Jane got off the hook?

Well... we have this crazy thing in our Bill of Rights called the 1st Amendment.
Aside from that, what was Jane Fonda charged with?

[Tommy Gunn]

How come Jane Fonda was never prosecuted? We prosecuted Axis Sally and Tokyo Rose back in WWII. So how come Hanoi Jane got off the hook?

Well... we have this crazy thing in our Bill of Rights called the 1st Amendment.
Aside from that, what was Jane Fonda charged with?

Both Axis Salley and Tokyo Rose were American citizens. You must think it was their 1st Amendment Right to do what they did in WWII, eh?

[Gringo]

Too many god damn commies on this board.

[hank]

Commies? What makes you hink that b/c somebody supports Jane Fonda's beliefs about North Vietnam makes the supporter a commie? As a group we really need to try to stop with the labeling, it is tiresome. Just b/c somebody disagrees with the US position during the Vietnwm does not make them a commie - the right to have and communicate dissenting opinions is hardly a communist ideal. I think we ultimatley did the right thing in Vietnam, but I have the benefit of not being subject to the draft at the time. Hard to say definitively how any of us would have reacted to a draft, but whatever our current thoughts are about that war, out thoughts are certainly benefited by the wisdom of hindsight, don't you think?

What Jane Fonda did that was WRONG was to go to North Vietnam while we were at war with them. The speech thing was OK under any standard, but I imagine that the visit is what Sixgun is referring to. For once I have to say that I agree. There is a huge difference b/w verbally saying that the Vietnam war is wrong and going to Hanoi at the height of the conflict and (if I rememebr right) actually seeing some American POWs on one of the 'tours'. Is my memory serving me correctly on this, that the impetus for the prosecution of those women during WWII was that they went to Japan and Germany and actively participated in those radio broadcasts? I don't rememebr why nobody ever tried to prosecute Jane for going to NV, but it would likely have been a very unpopular prosecution in the 60s/70s.

Vietnam is/was divisive and while I do not like Kerry for many reasons, it seems a little disingenuous to question his views at this late date, considering that he killed and saw Americans die first hand while in Vietnam. Turncoat is a pretty strong word to describe a decorated Vietnam Vet who chooses to disagree with the US position. I always question the credentials and the motivations of people who label Kerry a turncoat, especially when those people did not or could not have been forced to go to Vitenam.

Frankly, I have never really seen a correlation between being a war hero and being a good president. Some of our greatest war heroes have been terrible or mediocre presidents. Grant, Eisenhower - neither particularly successful. Just a thought.

hank

[Gringo]

Wearing US iniforms covered with pro-communist propaganda during a protest?

However I never said that all the people that were against the war in Vietnam was a communist.

[hank]

Too many god damn commies on this board.

Sorry, when you said "on this board" I thought you meant on this board. If you refer to the actual protestors who advocate communism then I hope you can see the confusion on my part. I have not "seen" anybody on this board to know what they wear while they post.

hank

[vitiaz]

"John Kerry was one of the founders of the Vietnam Veteran's Against the War. The man is a turncoat."

I guess Kerry has also been 'double dipping' with an intern too... woot

[Mechanical Ambush]

Commies? What makes you hink that b/c somebody supports Jane Fonda's beliefs about North Vietnam makes the supporter a commie? hank

that's a no-brainer!
:bash:

[hank]

Well then you won't mind articulating it for me. I obviously am not smart enough to make the connection. I might disagree with jane but still go to her rally or listen to her.

I'd like you to write out how people who listne to Jane are necesarily commies. In all seriousness.

hank

[Old300]

Have y'all heard about this?

www.drudgereport.com

Since Kerry's only real selling point was "electability", he could be in serious trouble. And, therefore, so would Bush: John Edwards would be a much tougher general election opponent than Kerry.

So for all you Bush haters, terrorists, Baathist thugs, and sundry dictators out there: today is a good day.

As for the rest of us, it's bad news.

[True_Patriot]

It is so easy to put labels and espouse hate mongering attitude toward the labled groups. Hitler and his Nazi cronies tried it and it worked for them.

Name calling, such as "Commies" or "Liberal ( fill in the blank )", is so easy to do but it doesn't add to the democratic process and healthy discussion of issues that are important to our great nation.

[XASA]

Gee, Matt Drudge is digging up dirt on Kerry, too. What a surprise! One gets the feeling that all this Kerry bashing will backfire. American voters aren't dumb; afterall, they didn't elect Bush the first time, either :lol:

[Jack Mehoff]

Hell, i'm half Vietnamese and I don't even like those son of bitches up north

[admar2]

Have any of you crowd who are bashing Kerry or even Bush for that matter,served your country and took the incoming,that thousands of men and women who serve ,do on a daily basis?
If not then you are in no position to judge a man who did,countless times!


actually I have served and received a purple heart, albeit for minor injuries. Khobar Towers. However I was sidelined for more days (2 weeks) from duty than Kerry was for all three of his purple hearts combined. (reportedly 2 duty days)

my wounds further concreted my belief that we need a leader that will stand up to terrorists and defend this county, not rely on polls to decide whether or not to attack, and not wait for the UN to grant us permission to act. Kerry MAY have been a war hero, but since then he has been on the WRONG side of every proposal to cut defense, end weapons programs, and fund our intelligence services.

[admar2]

Gee, Matt Drudge is digging up dirt on Kerry, too. What a surprise! One gets the feeling that all this Kerry bashing will backfire. American voters aren't dumb; afterall, they didn't elect Bush the first time, either :lol:

how about you actually read the blurb on drudge's site before running off at the mouth.

http://www.drudgereport.com/mattjk1.htm


Intrigue surrounds a woman who recently fled the country, reportedly at the prodding of Kerry, the DRUDGE REPORT has learned.

A serious investigation of the woman and the nature of her relationship with Sen. John Kerry has been underway at TIME magazine, ABC NEWS, the WASHINGTON POST, THE HILL and the ASSOCIATED PRESS, where the woman in question once worked.



sounds like someone besides drudge is doing the digging. :-*$

[hank]

Yo, mechanical ambush. Want to elaborate or are you done after you get to label people? Here is a label for you. idiot

hank

[James]

How come Jane Fonda was never prosecuted? We prosecuted Axis Sally and Tokyo Rose back in WWII. So how come Hanoi Jane got off the hook?

Well... we have this crazy thing in our Bill of Rights called the 1st Amendment.
Aside from that, what was Jane Fonda charged with?

Both Axis Salley and Tokyo Rose were American citizens. You must think it was their 1st Amendment Right to do what they did in WWII, eh?

Ouch! A stinging rebuke...

No, I don't believe that they were excercising their 1st Amendment rights.

Ikuko Toguri was charged with and convicted for treason against the United States for aiding the Japanese government during WWII.

Mildred Gillars was charge with and convicted for trason for aiding Nazi Germany during WWII.

I believe that it is common knowledge that Jane Fonda was (and is) an American citizen. Now, please answer my original question, rather than trying to hide behind asinine comments.

What was Jane Fonda charged with? What should she have been prosecuted for? Before you shoot your mouth off, let me remind you that a state of war did not exist between the United States and North Vietnam during the war, so I don't think she could be charged with treason.

[Tommy Gunn]

Before you shoot your mouth off, let me remind you that a state of war did not exist between the United States and North Vietnam during the war, so I don't think she could be charged with treason.

It was a war all the same and Jane Fonda was with the enemy. That makes her a traitor.

[duck]

You forgot Ollie North off the "traitor" list. The man sold weapons to the Axis of Evil, shock and horror.