Winter war (Soviet Union vs Finland)

[Kingpin]

Just found this site
http://www.mannerheim-line.com

A lot of information about Winter war and Mannerheim line in particular (in English and in Russian)

[wreck]

Ayay, as a Finn I say this is a good topic :)

Just read a book which is a collection of russian politruks? diarys, he was in the division that got annihilated in Lemetti. Interesting reading and was a good glimpse of how things were seen from the other side.


Edit:
http://www.winterwar.com/

[wreck]

Hmm, maybe this topic could be the right place to post some pictures from Salpa-linja, the last defence line. Visited that place last summer on my trip to east finland.

[mustamato]

This is a good one, what happened from day to day:

http://www2.mil.fi/perustietoa/talvisota/images/frontpage_top_390x300.jpg
http://www2.mil.fi/perustietoa/talvisota_eng/index.html

Winter war told in pictures by mustamato

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391130IhmisetSuojautuvat.jpg
War begins, Soviet Union bombs Helsinki, according
to Molotov in Moscow radio they only "drop bread to the
starving finnish people".

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391130PommitustenTuhoja.jpg
Molotovs bread killed 90 civilians only in Helsinki the first day

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/4001MolotovinLeip%E4kori.jpg
Molotovs "breadbaskets" which dropped a large number of smaller
bombs as can be seen.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391130xVen%E4l%E4isetYlitt%E4m%E4ss%E4Rajajokea.jpg
Soviet infantry crossing the border to Finland 30th November 1939.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391201LaatokanPohjoispuolellaSotilaita.jpg
Finnish soldiers, the equipment was a disaster, many of the soldiers had
their own civilian clothes under the snow suits

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391201PetsamonTykistoaVuodelta1887.jpg
"Finnish equipment was a disaster" part II. Gun m/1887.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391202KuusisenHallituksenPerustaminen.jpg
Finnish traitor and communist Otto Ville Kuusinen forms a "new government",
however this was not taken seriously by anyone. Stalin also gave it a "new
finnish army", this was not set into action, it was only intended as a parade
unit in Helsinki after the war had been won

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391206ItsenaisyyspaivanaAlasAmmuttuSB2.jpg
Downed Soviet SB-2 bomber. The finns were surprised over that the Soviet
Air Force could keep flying, even though it could be -50 Celsius

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391207KollaanTaistelijatAsemissa.jpg
Finnish soldier in the snow, this was to be a extremely cold winter,
as have already been said, it could be as cold as -50 Celsius! However
it stayed at a steady -20/30 most of the winter

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391214KaatuneitaNeuvostosotilaita.jpg
Battle of Tolvarjärvi, one of the fiercest battles in the beginning of the war,
it was all down to close combat, handgrenades and knifes in some places,
300 finnish casualties, 1000 soviet. Fallen Red Army soldiers in the picture

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391224VapaaehtoisiaAmerikasta.jpg
American volunteers departs for Finland, actually more volunteered than
to the spanish civil war, but in reality just less than 10.000 (scandinavians)
came to Finland before the war ended.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/3912Tarkka-ampujanPysayttamaAuto.jpg
Finnish sniper stopped this whole column. The russian forces were heavily
mechanized which was not good in the finnish terrain since they had to
use the roads. Thus they could easily get surrounded, and the endless columns
was then "cut to pieces" (fi. motti), and each one of these smaller remains
was encircled and then killed of or starved to death. This finnish tactics worked
very well.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/400228RuotsalaisiaVapaaehtoisia.jpg
The swedish volunteers had excellent equipment for the day

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/4002PikakivaariTulittaa.jpg
Lahti-Saloranta m/26 LMG, "a greande doesn´t hit in the same place twice"

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/4002SummanPuolustajia.jpg
In the south there was finnish static defence in this "Mannerheim Line",
that often just looked like this. But since the Soviets couldn´t break it, in
their propaganda they said that it was eaven more fortified than the Maginot
Line.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/400313RauhaTullut.jpg
However, tiny Finland against mighty Soviet Union, after 105 days Finland
agreed to harsh peace agreements, flag on half pole. Independence was retained
and russians got territories that they didn´t win with blood, but just with the
signing of a paper. This pissed many finns of that wanted revenge. Well,
there was a another war 1941-44, but that´s another story :)

How many people was killed is not known. The finnish numbers are very
exact, just from my head it´s about 23.000. The Soviet KIA´s are not known,
the russian official statistics is pure BS, but the most credible numbers are
from "G.F.Krivosheev "The Secret stamp has removed: casualties of the
Soviet Armed Forces in wars and military conflicts", Moscow, 1993", where
he puts the Soviet killed in the Winter war to 126 875.

There is a finnish saying, "1 finn is as good as 10 russians,
it only becomes problem when the 11th comes" :)

[Kingpin]

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391206ItsenaisyyspaivanaAlasAmmuttuSB2.jpg
Downed Soviet SB-2 bomber. The finns were surprised over that the Soviet
Air Force could keep flying, even though it could be -50 Celsius


Now according to Pentagon officials it is called "controlled landing". :)

[Herrmannek]

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391206ItsenaisyyspaivanaAlasAmmuttuSB2.jpg
Downed Soviet SB-2 bomber. The finns were surprised over that the Soviet
Air Force could keep flying, even though it could be -50 Celsius


Now according to Pentagon officials it is called "controlled landing". :)
Press notice:
"With the help of experienced crue plane managed to crash on enemy territory. We are proud to announce our craft achieved this success without any help of opposing forces"

[mustamato]

Haha! More "controlled landings" from the finnish front (the two first pics from Continuation war)

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Jatkosota/Rintama/410625SuomenlinnaAmpuuIT-tulta.jpg
Finnish AA firing from Helsinki

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Jatkosota/Rintama/43IlmapuolustusValonheitinY%F6ss%E4.jpg

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391201IlmatorjunnanTuhoamaPommikoneHelsingissa.jpg
Another soviet SB-2

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/400106JormaSarvantoOsiaYhdest%E4AlasammutustaSBsta.jpg
Fighter pilot Jorma Sarvanto shot down six Soviet bombers in world
record time, only in four minutes, when he flew a Fokker D.XXi in January
1940. In photo remains of one of the shot down bombers.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/4001AlasammuttuPolikarpovR_5.jpg
Recon Polikarpov R-5

______________________

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/400107RaatteenTiePakkasenUhri.jpg
Russian soldier frozen to death, like a statue :|

Most be hell to fight in such cold.

[Kingpin]

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/391206ItsenaisyyspaivanaAlasAmmuttuSB2.jpg
Downed Soviet SB-2 bomber. The finns were surprised over that the Soviet
Air Force could keep flying, even though it could be -50 Celsius


Now according to Pentagon officials it is called "controlled landing". :)
Press notice:
"With the help of the experienced crue plane managed to crash on enemy territory. We are proud to anounce our craft acheved this succes without any help of oposing forces"

Well, according to your signature... (but i'm also not very strong in English :) )
experienced crew (without 'the')
announce
achieved
success
from opposing
:) Hope i didn't make new mistakes

[Herrmannek]

Well, according to your signature... (but i'm also not very strong in English :))
experienced crew (without 'the')
announce
achieved
success
from opposing
:) Hope i didn't make new mistakes

Thanks...About mistakes..I can't help you :)...

[wreck]

Something in Finnish, sorry:

Jäbät, rajoittakaa sitä kuolleiden venäläisten kuvien postaamista. Ei se olisi kiva kuolleita finskejäkään nähdä, eikö? Muutenkin koitetaan pysyä objektiivisella kannalla, ei mennä liiallisuuksiin hehkuttamisessa ;)

[Dalleer]

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/400228RuotsalaisiaVapaaehtoisia.jpg

Ah yes, the Swedish volunteers...

What was the name that the Swedish "operated" under in those days, "frivilligt" or something?

Got any more pics on those Swedish volunteers, btw?

EDIT: Wreck puhuu asiaa, antaa niiden kuolleiden venäläisten kuvien nyt olla. Jos ei muun, niin ainakin sen takia että "itäiset serkut" ei provosoituisi.

[wholagun]

this is why you don't fvck with Russia they wil fight when its -60 outside. :cantbeli:

I feel the Finnish pain Soviet Union was a pain in the ass.

[Dalleer]

this is why you don't fvck with Russia they wil fight when its -60 outside.

The same deal goes down with us, we'll just add another layer of sweaters if needed...

[Sergei]

This is a very interesting site and its creator Bair can sometimes be found at Axis Forum and VIF2 forum.

BTW, I saw some pictures of disabled by Finnish artillery, a trial SMK tank which sealed its fate in the Soviet Mech corps. Instead a KV-1 design was pushed into production. Could any of you find those pictures of disabled SMK tank?


regards,

[mustamato]

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/400228RuotsalaisiaVapaaehtoisia.jpg

Ah yes, the Swedish volunteers...

What was the name that the Swedish "operated" under in those days, "frivilligt" or something?

Got any more pics on those Swedish volunteers, btw?

EDIT: Wreck puhuu asiaa, antaa niiden kuolleiden venäläisten kuvien nyt olla. Jos ei muun, niin ainakin sen takia että "itäiset serkut" ei provosoituisi.

(Juu, jätetäänpä)

About the swedish volunteers, SFK, "Svenska frivilligkåren" that is. If you understand swedish then here is a good page. If you don´t then there is atleast a bunch of pictures. My fingers is all frozen up and have to make some food now so I don´t post any pictures, I´ll find a bunch of SFK and post them later.

http://www.tendens.se/nicolas/index3.html

[Dalleer]

About the swedish volunteers, SFK, "Svenska frivilligkåren" that is. If you understand swedish then here is a good page. If you don´t then there is atleast a bunch of pictures.

I can read Swedish fairly good, but that's only fairly. But I'll see what I can dig up from this stuff...

[Operation Ivy]

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Talvisota/Rintama/4001MolotovinLeip%E4kori.jpg

;)

[RuSoKaR]

There is a finnish saying, "1 finn is as good as 10 russians,
it only becomes problem when the 11th comes"

Well it's also like you need to have 10 attacking soldiers to take our one in the defence.

But Finnish did a good job over there, defending their country from the communis, also wasn't the leader on Finnland during that time was one of the high commanders in Russian Empire?

[Sixgun Symphony]

I read some things about the Finn snipers, notably Simo Häyhä and Suko Kolkka. Incredible stories, Simo Häyhä was said to have used iron sights rather than a scope to make some very long distance shots.

http://snipercountry.com/sniphistory.htm

[mustamato]

wasn't the leader on Finnland during that time was one of the high commanders in Russian Empire?

http://www.mannerheim.fi/valokuva/05/btranss.jpg
C.G.E. Mannerheim (left) during the first world war, as a
russian general on the eastern front

He also took part in the Japanese-Russian war in 1904. So he knew quite
much about russians I guess. He returned to Finland when they declared
independency from Russia, he became the leader of the "white forces"
during the finnish civil war. More than 35.000 people were killed in the finnish
civil war, most of them from starving to death in prison camps after the
white forces had defeated the reds. Many were executed as well, the atrocities
ended first when the british threatened to bomb Helsinki. So Mannerheim
was not very liked by the working class finns back in the days. It was
really first during world war 2 he got some respect back when he showed
his skills as a military leader.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Jatkosota/Rintama/4206MannerheiminSyntym%E4p%E4iv%E4Hitler%26Mannerheim.jpg
The first world war corpral Hitler did his only visit to a non-occupied
country during Mannerheims 75th birthday 1942. The corpral met the general.
It´s quite obvious that Hitler respected this older "father-like" and also
noble baron Mannerheim. Mannerheim didn´t respect Hitler though.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Jatkosota/Rintama/4206MannerheiminSyntym%E4p%E4iv%E4SuomalaisupseerienEsittely%E4.jpg

http://www.schneeland.com/kuvat/helsinki/mannerheim.jpg
Mannerheim today

[wreck]

wasn't the leader on Finnland during that time was one of the high commanders in Russian Empire?

http://www.mannerheim.fi/valokuva/05/btranss.jpg
C.G.E. Mannerheim (left) during the first world war, as a
russian general on the eastern front

He also took part in the Japanese-Russian war in 1904. So he knew quite
much about russians I guess. He returned to Finland when they declared
independency from Russia, he became the leader of the "white forces"
during the finnish civil war. More than 35.000 people were killed in the finnish
civil war, most of them from starving to death in prison camps after the
white forces had defeated the reds. Many were executed as well, the atrocities
ended first when the british threatened to bomb Helsinki. So Mannerheim
was not very liked by the working class finns back in the days. It was
really first during world war 2 he got some respect back when he showed
his skills as a military leader.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Jatkosota/Rintama/4206MannerheiminSyntym%E4p%E4iv%E4Hitler%26Mannerheim.jpg
The first world war corpral Hitler did his only visit to a non-occupied
country during Mannerheims 75th birthday 1942. The corpral met the general.
It´s quite obvious that Hitler respected this older "father-like" and also
noble baron Mannerheim. Mannerheim didn´t respect Hitler though.

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Jatkosota/Rintama/4206MannerheiminSyntym%E4p%E4iv%E4SuomalaisupseerienEsittely%E4.jpg

http://www.schneeland.com/kuvat/helsinki/mannerheim.jpg
Mannerheim today
Great post mustamato woot

[RuSoKaR]

Well if onlky in other regions of the Russian empire there would be people like hinm who would fight against reds.

btw he was sent to the Russo-Japance war by his own request, and he even lead some expeditiond in the Central Asia.
Great person.

[Kaos]

Suomi Finland Perkkele!!!
:D