Does Israel control the US?

[aFgHaNibOi]

Does Israel control the US?
CAPITOL HILL, WASHINGTON, D.C.
OCTOBER 22, 2003

ADMIRAL THOMAS H. MOORER, UNITED STATES NAVY, (RET.)
FORMER CHAIRMAN, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF

GENERAL RAYMOND G. DAVIS, UNITED STATES MARINE CORPS, (MOH)*
FORMER ASSISTANT COMMANDANT OF THE MARINE CORPS

REAR ADMIRAL MERLIN STARING, UNITED STATES NAVY, (RET.)
FORMER JUDGE ADVOCATE GENERAL OF THE NAVY HH

AMBASSADOR JAMES AKINS, (RET.)
FORMER UNITED STATES AMBASSADOR TO SAUDI ARABIA


Chief Attorney of the 1967 Court of Inquiry
Captain Boston's Affidavit
Commonly Asked Questions about USS Liberty
Who are the Commissioners of this Independent Investigation?
We, the undersigned, having undertaken an independent investigation of Israel’s attack on USS Liberty, including eyewitness testimony from surviving crewmembers, a review of naval and other official records, an examination of official statements by the Israeli and American governments, a study of the conclusions of all previous official inquiries, and a consideration of important new evidence and recent statements from individuals having direct knowledge of the attack or the cover up, hereby find the following: **

1. That on June 8, 1967, after eight hours of aerial surveillance, Israel launched a two-hour air and naval attack against USS Liberty, the world’s most sophisticated intelligence ship, inflicting 34 dead and 172 wounded American servicemen (a casualty rate of seventy percent, in a crew of 294);

2. That the Israeli air attack lasted approximately 25 minutes, during which time unmarked Israeli aircraft dropped napalm canisters on USS Liberty's bridge, and fired 30mm cannons and rockets into our ship, causing 821 holes, more than 100 of which were rocket-size; survivors estimate 30 or more sorties were flown over the ship by a minimum of 12 attacking Israeli planes which were jamming all five American emergency radio channels;

3. That the torpedo boat attack involved not only the firing of torpedoes, but the machine-gunning of Liberty’s firefighters and stretcher-bearers as they struggled to save their ship and crew; the Israeli torpedo boats later returned to machine-gun at close range three of the Liberty’s life rafts that had been lowered into the water by survivors to rescue the most seriously wounded;

4. That there is compelling evidence that Israel’s attack was a deliberate attempt to destroy an American ship and kill her entire crew; evidence of such intent is supported by statements from Secretary of State Dean Rusk, Undersecretary of State George Ball, former CIA director Richard Helms, former NSA directors Lieutenant General William Odom, USA (Ret.), Admiral Bobby Ray Inman, USN (Ret.), and Marshal Carter; former NSA deputy directors Oliver Kirby and Major General John Morrison, USAF (Ret.); and former Ambassador Dwight Porter, U.S. Ambassador to Lebanon in 1967;

5. That in attacking USS Liberty, Israel committed acts of murder against American servicemen and an act of war against the United States;

6. That fearing conflict with Israel, the White House deliberately prevented the U.S. Navy from coming to the defense of USS Liberty by recalling Sixth Fleet military rescue support while the ship was under attack; evidence of the recall of rescue aircraft is supported by statements of Captain Joe Tully, Commanding Officer of the aircraft carrier USS Saratoga, and Rear Admiral Lawrence Geis, the Sixth Fleet carrier division commander, at the time of the attack; never before in American naval history has a rescue mission been cancelled when an American ship was under attack;

7. That although Liberty was saved from almost certain destruction through the heroic efforts of the ship’s Captain, William L. McGonagle (MOH), and his brave crew, surviving crewmembers were later threatened with “court-martial, imprisonment or worse” if they exposed the truth; and were abandoned by their own government;

8. That due to the influence of Israel’s powerful supporters in the United States, the White House deliberately covered up the facts of this attack from the American people;

9. That due to continuing pressure by the pro-Israel lobby in the United States, this attack remains the only serious naval incident that has never been thoroughly investigated by Congress; to this day, no surviving crewmember has been permitted to officially and publicly testify about the attack;

10. That there has been an official cover-up without precedent in American naval history; the existence of such a cover-up is now supported by statements of Rear Admiral Merlin Staring, USN (Ret.), former Judge Advocate General of the Navy; and Captain Ward Boston, USN, (Ret.), the chief counsel to the Navy’s 1967 Court of Inquiry of Liberty attack;

11. That the truth about Israel’s attack and subsequent White House cover-up continues to be officially concealed from the American people to the present day and is a national disgrace;

12. That a danger to our national security exists whenever our elected officials are willing to subordinate American interests to those of any foreign nation, and specifically are unwilling to challenge Israel’s interests when they conflict with American interests; this policy, evidenced by the failure to defend USS Liberty and the subsequent official cover-up of the Israeli attack, endangers the safety of Americans and the security of the United States.





We, the undersigned, hereby affix our hands and seals, this 22nd day of October, 2003.

Thomas H. Moorer
Former Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff


General of Marines Raymond G. Davis, USMC, MOH*


Merlin Staring
Rear Admiral Merlin Staring, USN, Ret.,
Former Judge Advocate General of the Navy,


James Akins
Ambassador James Akins, Ret.,
Former United States Ambassador to Saudi Arabia,

http://www.ussliberty.org/
http://www.ussliberty.org/

[Seoulstriker]

Does Isreal control the US?

yes. yes, they do.

[aFgHaNibOi]

Does Isreal control the US?

yes. yes, they do.

And you are proud of this? :(

[mack pl]

Israel control US, ohhhh **** :(

[hedgehog]

This actually happened? Well, considering the US went to war with Vietnam over the Maddox and let's not even mention P.H. Yes it's true..
:)

[IDFM203]

Here in your language ;)


First yes it does…..hell Jews control not only the U.S. but also the whole world :D

Why are you asking such an obvious question? ;) :roll:

Listen Afghani I can feel you being concerned for those brave U.S. sailors…………….oh wait that’s not the case…this has nothing to do with them nor do you really care about them…………….your just trying to show the that Israel controls the U.S………….got you ;) :roll:

As for a serious debate on the liberty (for we sure as hell aren’t going to get it here in this thread) Click here to a previous thread about it (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4684&highlight=uss+libert)

Shalom :D

[SeanAshi]

And you are proud of this?
aFgHaNibOi your country is next ;) prepare to be zionized

[oldsoak]

An Israeli friend tells me that if Israel did indeed control America, all Israel would now be living in California :) . They do have effective lobbyists though.

rgds

[IDFM203]

And you are proud of this?
aFgHaNibOi your country is next ;) prepare to be zionizedyeah we Jews are just dying to get the whole of Afghanistan next...hell we control most of the world already, we just need Afghanistan to complete the full takeover :D

Shalom :D

[aFgHaNibOi]

Here in your language ;)


First yes it does…..hell Jews control not only the U.S. but also the whole world :D

Why are you asking such an obvious question? ;) :roll:

Listen Afghani I can feel you being concerned for those brave U.S. sailors…………….oh wait that’s not the case…this has nothing to do with them nor do you really care about them…………….your just trying to show the that Israel controls the U.S………….got you ;) :roll:

As for a serious debate on the liberty (for we sure as hell aren’t going to get it here in this thread) Click here to a previous thread about it (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4684&highlight=uss+libert)

Shalom :D

Actually, I do find it sad that America didn't save those sailors :( . But thanks for the link and the red color. ;)

[aFgHaNibOi]

And you are proud of this?
aFgHaNibOi your country is next ;) prepare to be zionizedyeah we Jews are just dying to get the whole of Afghanistan next...hell we control most of the world already, we just need Afghanistan to complete the full takeover :D

Shalom :D

Not cool man. Why would you want Afghanistan? It's the end of the line, just ask the previous empires. ;)

[Uncle Sam]

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v56/deathdot/10_9_133.gif

[IDFM203]

Actually on second thought, you made me now realize that we have Afghanistan already :D . I mean we control the U.S. and guess who is controlling Afghanistan right now ;)

Shalom :D

[He219]

I'll have to second oldsoak's comment ...

:D

[SeanAshi]

aFgHaNibOi why are you people so scared of jews, zionist, Israel?

[IDFM203]

I'll have to second oldsoak's comment ...

:DI wont disagree with effective (effective because perhaps a lot there agree and have shared views and values……just a thought) lobbyists as well, but even more effective then anything we Jews can do are those 70 million Evangelical Christens that have more of a influence about Israel then any of the Jewish lobbyists.

Oh of course after they help Israel and acc. to them when after Jesus returns, all the Jews will…….. etc…. ;) …….(yeah we accept their help but we know what the real intentions of it are afterwards ;) )

Shalom :D

[aFgHaNibOi]

That's weak. All you guys respond with is a couple of smilies and some unrelated comments. Whatever though, may those fallen soldiers rest in peace.

[IDFM203]

That's weak. All you guys respond with is a couple of smilies and some unrelated comments. Whatever though, may those fallen soldiers rest in peace.

No what’s weak here is your fake crocodile tears over the unfortunate deaths of those U.S. sailors!!

Also what’s weak and sad is your use of those soldiers to make a political point that we all know is the real intention of your post and has nothing to do with any real concern of those sailors.

That’s whats really weak here :roll:


Shalom :D

[aFgHaNibOi]

That's weak. All you guys respond with is a couple of smilies and some unrelated comments. Whatever though, may those fallen soldiers rest in peace.

No what’s weak here is your fake crocodile tears over the unfortunate deaths of those U.S. sailors!!

Also what’s weak and sad is your use of those soldiers to make a political point that we all know is the real intention of your post and has nothing to do with any real concern of those sailors.

That’s whats really weak here :roll:


Shalom :D

O.K. man, I didn't know that you could read people's minds and tell them what they are thinking and what they really feel. Oh, I forgot, you are the chosen race. :roll:

[SeanAshi]

;) :cantbeli: :hug:

[SeanAshi]

Frienly fire incidents happen in a time of war, the Liberty got orders from the NSA to stay about 100miles (160km) of the coast, joint chiefs of staff told them to be about 15 miles (24km) off the coast, mistakes happend on both sides.

[IDFM203]

That's weak. All you guys respond with is a couple of smilies and some unrelated comments. Whatever though, may those fallen soldiers rest in peace.

No what’s weak here is your fake crocodile tears over the unfortunate deaths of those U.S. sailors!!

Also what’s weak and sad is your use of those soldiers to make a political point that we all know is the real intention of your post and has nothing to do with any real concern of those sailors.

That’s whats really weak here :roll:


Shalom :D

O.K. man, I didn't know that you could read people's minds and tell them what they are thinking and what they really feel. Oh, I forgot, you are the chosen race. :roll:



hehe ;) wow its not about controlling any mind here, simply its preatty clear and obvious!!......wait………..actually on second thought………..yes not only do we control the whole world we also control everyone’s minds...yes all this because we are the chosen people.

*putting mind reading mode on afgani now......reading his thoughts*

"hate Jews....hate IDFM203........Jews control Afghanistan.....must run back to fight the evil Zionists....hmm hungry....must have pudding........hmm *** with a donkey...........;)

*turns off mind reading mode*

ewwww ;)

Shalom :D

[UkrainianAmerican]

That's weak. All you guys respond with is a couple of smilies and some unrelated comments. Whatever though, may those fallen soldiers rest in peace.

No what’s weak here is your fake crocodile tears over the unfortunate deaths of those U.S. sailors!!

Also what’s weak and sad is your use of those soldiers to make a political point that we all know is the real intention of your post and has nothing to do with any real concern of those sailors.

That’s whats really weak here :roll:


Shalom :D

O.K. man, I didn't know that you could read people's minds and tell them what they are thinking and what they really feel. Oh, I forgot, you are the chosen race. :roll:


special ed in action

[SeanAshi]

IDFM203 don't forget the stereotype, jews control all the money ;)

[Pille1234]

*putting mind reading mode on afgani now......reading his thoughts*

"hate Jews....hate IDFM203........Jews control Afghanistan.....must run back to fight the evil Zionists....hmm hungry....must have pudding........hmm *** with a donkey...........;)

*turns off mind reading mode*

ewwww ;)

Shalom :D

rofl at least you have a chosen sense of humor rofl
good reply :D

[bigisraeli]

is this question anisimtism ? I think it is , you konw why? because those kinds of questions used to been asked in the early 20th century when people blamed the jews for all the trabules in the world . what the **** are you thinking to your self , we are not controling anyone we are just trying to survive and to have friends in the world , with who ever wants our friendship , we don't rule the world , we are just part of it , the fact the most jews are smart and are secssesful is just part of who we are , our relationship with the U.S.A. in my opinon is a friendly one nathing else no one is controling any one .

[alexbmn]

dammit they are on to us again. There must be a mole in the ZOG or maybe one of the Elders of Zion is a double agent.

[Mr. Nielsen]

"control" is a very strong word, and undoubtedly not the right one. I'm sure if it was decided not to make Israel publicly responsible for the attack it was a US government decision. Then one might ask why they would not do it? Apart from the possible influence of Israeli supporters , the answer might be the cold war. Israel was after all on the side of the west.

A later example.

In 1987, during the Iraq-Iran war, the USS Stark was hit by Exocet missilies fired by Iraqi air planes. Iraq said it was a mistake (and I don't know any motive to attack a US ship), and the US accepted it. At the time Iran was considered the great danger not Iraq, so any US military retribution would have aided the Iranians.

Just some thoughts.

[SeanAshi]

In 1987, during the Iraq-Iran war, the USS Stark was hit by Exocet missilies fired by Iraqi air planes. Iraq said it was a mistake (and I don't know any motive to attack a US ship), and the US accepted it. At the time Iran was considered the great danger not Iraq, so any US military retribution would have aided the Iranians.

Was that the time when we blew that Iranian airliner out of the sky by mistake?

[soma]

See the germans weren't wrong about the jews :lol: :backhand:

[ChuckThunder]

Weird... there is a show about the U.S.S. Liberty incident on the history Channel right now...

[SeanAshi]

http://www.ussliberty.org/

[SeanAshi]

See the germans weren't wrong about the jews
WHAT!?

[Mr. Nielsen]

In 1987, during the Iraq-Iran war, the USS Stark was hit by Exocet missilies fired by Iraqi air planes. Iraq said it was a mistake (and I don't know any motive to attack a US ship), and the US accepted it. At the time Iran was considered the great danger not Iraq, so any US military retribution would have aided the Iranians.

Was that the time when we blew that Iranian airliner out of the sky by mistake?

That was year later. The USS Stark was hit on 17.may 1987 and Iran Air Flight 655 was shot down on 3. july 1988.

The following article examines the path to the screw up (the Iranians will probably never be convinced it was a mistake).

http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5260/vince.html

[BlackRain]

Frienly fire incidents happen in a time of war, the Liberty got orders from the NSA to stay about 100miles (160km) of the coast, joint chiefs of staff told them to be about 15 miles (24km) off the coast, mistakes happend on both sides.

If you read the history of the Liberty, listen to the Captain and its crew's account of the attack; you will see this was not an accident but a deliberate attack.

http://www.ussliberty.org/


This web site is dedicated to the memory of thirty-four fine young men who gave their lives on June 8, 1967, defending the USS Liberty
against a sustained air and sea attack by the armed forces of the State of Israel.

During the Six Day War between Israel and the Arab States, the American intelligence ship USS Liberty was attacked for 75 minutes in international waters by Israeli aircraft and motor torpedo boats. Thirty-four men died and 172 were wounded.

The attack has been a matter of controversy ever since. Survivors and many key government officials including Secretary of State Dean Rusk and former JCS Chairman Admiral Thomas Moorer say it was
no accident. Israel and its supporters insist it was a "tragic case of misidentification" and charge that the survivors are either lying or too emotionally involved to see the truth.

Israel claims they mistook our ship for the out-of-service Egyptian horse carrier El Quseir and that we brought the attack upon ourselves by operating in a war zone without displaying a flag. Not so. We were in international waters, far from any fighting, and flew a bright, clean, new American flag.

The flag we flew is on display at the National Cryptologic Museum,
Fort Meade, Maryland and can be seen there, or in the USS Liberty Images Archive.

Our commanding officer, Captain William Loren McGonagle, received the Congressional Medal of Honor for conspicuous gallantry and intrepedity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty during the attack.
The Congressional Medal of Honor is the highest award our country can bestow. To avoid embarrassing our attackers, Captain McGonagle's Medal of Honor was presented in a quiet ceremony in the Washington Navy Yard instead of in the White House by the President as is customary.

[UoUo]

1 simple que' why the **** whould israel want to attack an American war...and to **** with a world super power that support us.
not metion that me allerdy been at war in that time with Egept Syria Jordan..and force from iraq.

yeah...really make sense.

[soma]

See the germans weren't wrong about the jews
WHAT!?

Sarcasm my friend, -> rofl :lol:

[IDFM203]

If you read the history of the Liberty, listen to the Captain and its crew's account of the attack; you will see this was not an accident but a deliberate attack.

http://www.ussliberty.org/

ahh so it all starts again (for the thousandth time)… :roll:

Well I will try not to go into it all again (for the whole debate Click Here and read all the pages……. (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4684&highlight=uss+libert))

Ill simply say that there is no proof to anything but most likely everything leads to a accident which is defintly plausible in the fog of a all out war…while I certainly regret the loss of those sailors (and Israel has apologized then and did pay restitution to the families) that website that you brought down and the liberty survivors cant read the mind of the pilots (don’t you know, acc. to Afghani only Jews have that power ;) ) and as such cant tell us anything if Israel deliberately did this or not.

For a complete detailed overview of what happened, Click here (http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/liberty1.html)



rofl at least you have a chosen sense of humor rofl
good reply :DI usually don’t have that sense of humor ;) ….I guess all it took was Afghni to bring out my “chosen” humor ;)

Glad you liked it :D

Shalom :D

[BlackRain]

The reason put forward for the attack on the listening post ship Liberty are:

Blind the US intelligence gathering in the region. Israel was planning to seize the Golan Heights from Syria during UN broked truce.

Others say it was to prevent Liberty from intercepting communications dealing with an alleged Israeli massacre of Egyptian POWs in the Sinai under the command of a young Ariel Sharon.

Another hypothesis is blame the attack on Egypt and draw the U.S. into the 1967 war.

The intention of the attacking forces were to sink the ship and kill the crew. The crews life boats were destroyed by Israel torpedo boats and anyone topside was targeted. When non-encrypted messages were sent and received by the Liberty that the Sixth Fleet had launched jets the attacked was stopped. At no point did Israeli forces lend assistance or help survivors.



Survivors of one of the most hotly disputed incidents in American military history - the Israeli attack on the USS Liberty spy-ship in 1967 - on Monday accused the US authorities, past and present, of a cover-up in backing Israeli claims that it was a tragic mistake.

Emotions boiled over in the basement of the State Department as the Office of the Historian opened a public conference on the six-day Arab-Israeli war with heated debate over newly released intercepts from the archives of the secretive National Security Agency.

Most of the basic facts are undisputed. On June 8 1967, Israeli aircraft and
later torpedo boats struck the Liberty just off the Mediterranean coast,
killing 34 crew and wounding 172. The ship, one of the world's most
sophisticated listening vessels but only lightly armed, limped into port.

From there the controversy begins. An immediate US Navy court of
Inquiry backed the Israeli claim that it had been mistaken for an
Egyptian warship. The US accepted $12m (£6.5m) in compensation.

While some historians have accepted this, survivors and a varied group of
academics and former military officials insist the attack was deliberate.

"You're trying to whitewash it," one survivor shouted from the audience as
Marc Susser, the State Department's historian, acted as moderator and sought to keep order, refusing to allow speeches from the floor. Even debate on the panel of invited historians descended into acrimony with one contributor accused of being an Israeli agent.

Two recent developments added fuel to the controversy.

Last week Ward Boston, a naval captain who acted as senior legal counsel for the Navy's court of inquiry in 1967, signed an affidavit declaring that the late Admiral Isaac Kidd, president of the court, had told him that President Lyndon Johnson and Robert McNamara, defence secretary, had ordered a cover-up.

And on Monday, David Hatch, the National Security Agency's own historian, elaborated on the recently declassified NSA material, the first time the eavesdropping agency had released real voice intercepts.

Mr Hatch confessed that the information "doesn't settle much". But his
analysis of the conversations between an Israeli air controller and two
helicopter pilots "suggested strongly" that the Israelis did not know at
first they were attacking a US vessel, although there was mention of a US
flag flying.

He also regretted that the new NSA material did not clarify why the Liberty
had not received orders sent to it to leave a war zone.

Joseph Lentini, a survivor who has spent the past 36 years researching the
tragedy, told reporters he remained convinced that the attack was
deliberate.

He admits it is hard to understand why the Israelis would want to sink a
ship of its closest ally at a time of war. Conspiracy theories abound.


Response Jim C:

The why of the attack was documented thoroughly in James Bamford's book
"Body of Secrets: Anatomy of the Ultra-Secret National Sercurity Agency",
Doubleday, NY, 2001. and it is not some kind of "conspiracy theory." I
should note that Bamford's first book on the NSA called "The Puzzle Palace" brought the wrath of NSA down on him. Later, when Bamford's scholarship could not be impeached, NSA started giving him direct access to NSA and even intercepts which he used in this book and now he even lectures to NSA personnel inside the NSA, in NSA facilities, on the history of the NSA. (If you can't threaten them, then co-opt them) What is also interesting is why NSA would release to Bamford the intercepts that he used to write and document what is below:

>From Bamford:

"Although no one on the ship knew it at the time, the Liberty had suddenly
trespassed into a private horror. At that very moment, near the minaret at
El Arish, Israeli forces were engaged in a criminal slaughter...(pp.200-201)

As the Liberty sat within eyeshot of El Arish, eavesdropping on surrounding
communications, Israeli soldiers turned the town into a slaughterhouse,
systematically butchering their prisoners. In the shadow of the El Arish
mosque, they lined up about sixty unarmed Egyptian prisoners, hands tied
behind their backs, and then opened fire with machine guns until the pale
desert turned red. 'I saw a line of prisoners, civilians and military', said
Abdelsalam Moussa, one of those who dug the graves, 'and they opened fire at them all at once. When they were dead, they told us to bury them.'. Nearby, a group of Israelis gunned down thirty more prisoners and then ordered some Bedouins to cover them with sand.

In still another incident at El Arish, the Israeli journalist Gabi Bron saw
about 150 Egyptian POWs sitting on the ground, crowded together with their hands held at the back of their necks. 'The Egyptian prisoners of war were ordered to dig pits and then army police shot them to death', Broin said. ' I witnessed the executions with my own eyes on the morning of June 8th, in the airport area of El Arish.'

The Israeli military historian Aryeh Yitzhaki, who worked in the army's
history department after the war, said he and other officers collected
testimony from dozens of soldiers who admitted killing POWs. According to
Yitzhaki, Israeli troops killed, in cold blood, as many as 1,000 Egyptian
prisoners in the Sinai including some 400 in the sand dunes of El Arish.

Ironically, Ariel Sharon, who was capturing territory south of El Arish at
the time of the slaughter, had been close to massacres during other
conflicts. One of his men during the Suez crisis in 1956, Arye Biro, now a
retired brigadier general, recently admitted the unprovoked killing of 49
prisoners of war in the Sinai in 1956. 'I had my Karl Gustav [weapon] I had taken from the Egyptian. My officer had an Uzi. Th Egyptian prisoners were sitting there with their faces turned to us. We turned to them with our
loaded guns and shot them. Magazine after magazine. They didn't get a chance to react.' At another point, Biro said, he found Egyptian soldiers prostrate with thirst. He said that after taunting them by pouring water from his canteen into the sand, he killed them. 'If I were to be put on trial for what I did,' he said, 'then it would be necessary to put on trial at least
one-half the Israeli army, which, in similar circumstances, did what I did.'
Sharon who says he learned of the 1956 prisoner shootings only after they
happened, refused to say whether he took any disciplinary action against
those involved, or even objected to the killings...(pp.201-203)

Into this sea of lies, deception and slaughter said the USS Liberty, an
enormous American spy factory loaded with $10.2 million worth of the latest eavesdropping gear. At 10:39 A.M. the minaret at El Arish was logged at seventeen miles away, at bearing 189 degrees. Sailing at five knots, the Liberty was practically treading water.

By 10:55 AM, senior Israeli officials knew for certain that they had an
American electronic spy in their midst. Not only was the ship clearly
visible to the forces at El Arish, it had been positively identified by
Israeli naval headquarters... The report said that the ship cruising slowly
off El Arish was 'an electromagnetic audio-surveillance ship of the U.S.
Navy named Liberty, whose marking was GTR-5.'

Not only did the ship have a 'GTR-5' painted broadly on both sides of its
bow and stern, it also had its name painted in large, bold, black letters:
'U.S.S. Liberty.' (pp. 203-204)


Note: What the Israeli's didn't know is that in addition to the Liberty
recording Israeli radio chatter revealing the ongoing massacres of POWs at El Arish, there was also an EC-121 aircraft doing the same thing. They went after the Liberty to stop the surveillance and destroy what had been
recorded thinking that the Liberty was the only witness. They didn't know
that the EC-121 also had gathered the evidence including evidence from radio intercepts that the Israelis knew exactly who they were going after and why they were doing it.

This obviously was many years ago and the USA and Israel are good allies. However, if in the future; the radio intercepts are ever declassified and released to the public, it will lead to strained diplomatic relations.

Have a good weekend to all!

[Ichhabe]

That's weak. All you guys respond with is a couple of smilies and some unrelated comments. Whatever though, may those fallen soldiers rest in peace.

No what’s weak here is your fake crocodile tears over the unfortunate deaths of those U.S. sailors!!

Also what’s weak and sad is your use of those soldiers to make a political point that we all know is the real intention of your post and has nothing to do with any real concern of those sailors.

That’s whats really weak here




Shalom :D

O.K. man, I didn't know that you could read people's minds and tell them what they are thinking and what they really feel. Oh, I forgot, you are the chosen race. :roll:



I just don't understand why you make a thread like that.

As I see it; you are now knee deep in ****. More postings from you on this topic will only make you go deeper.


How does it feel to stand knee deep in your own smelly ****?

What kind of a retard question and topic of this thread is that??

What is your agenda???

Man, I'm flabbergasted that people comes up with such ideas in the first place.

Not even in my days as a Pro-PLO I would have had such ideas even strafe my head...

[UoUo]

The reason put forward for the attack on the listening post ship Liberty are:

Blind the US intelligence gathering in the region. Israel was planning to seize the Golan Heights from Syria during UN broked truce.

Others say it was to prevent Liberty from intercepting communications dealing with an alleged Israeli massacre of Egyptian POWs in the Sinai under the command of a young Ariel Sharon.

Another hypothesis is blame the attack on Egypt and draw the U.S. into the 1967 war.

The intention of the attacking forces were to sink the ship and kill the crew. The crews life boats were destroyed by Israel torpedo boats and anyone topside was targeted. When non-encrypted messages were sent and received by the Liberty that the Sixth Fleet had launched jets the attacked was stopped. At no point did Israeli forces lend assistance or help survivors.



Survivors of one of the most hotly disputed incidents in American military history - the Israeli attack on the USS Liberty spy-ship in 1967 - on Monday accused the US authorities, past and present, of a cover-up in backing Israeli claims that it was a tragic mistake.

Emotions boiled over in the basement of the State Department as the Office of the Historian opened a public conference on the six-day Arab-Israeli war with heated debate over newly released intercepts from the archives of the secretive National Security Agency.

Most of the basic facts are undisputed. On June 8 1967, Israeli aircraft and
later torpedo boats struck the Liberty just off the Mediterranean coast,
killing 34 crew and wounding 172. The ship, one of the world's most
sophisticated listening vessels but only lightly armed, limped into port.

From there the controversy begins. An immediate US Navy court of
Inquiry backed the Israeli claim that it had been mistaken for an
Egyptian warship. The US accepted $12m (£6.5m) in compensation.

While some historians have accepted this, survivors and a varied group of
academics and former military officials insist the attack was deliberate.

"You're trying to whitewash it," one survivor shouted from the audience as
Marc Susser, the State Department's historian, acted as moderator and sought to keep order, refusing to allow speeches from the floor. Even debate on the panel of invited historians descended into acrimony with one contributor accused of being an Israeli agent.

Two recent developments added fuel to the controversy.

Last week Ward Boston, a naval captain who acted as senior legal counsel for the Navy's court of inquiry in 1967, signed an affidavit declaring that the late Admiral Isaac Kidd, president of the court, had told him that President Lyndon Johnson and Robert McNamara, defence secretary, had ordered a cover-up.

And on Monday, David Hatch, the National Security Agency's own historian, elaborated on the recently declassified NSA material, the first time the eavesdropping agency had released real voice intercepts.

Mr Hatch confessed that the information "doesn't settle much". But his
analysis of the conversations between an Israeli air controller and two
helicopter pilots "suggested strongly" that the Israelis did not know at
first they were attacking a US vessel, although there was mention of a US
flag flying.

He also regretted that the new NSA material did not clarify why the Liberty
had not received orders sent to it to leave a war zone.

Joseph Lentini, a survivor who has spent the past 36 years researching the
tragedy, told reporters he remained convinced that the attack was
deliberate.

He admits it is hard to understand why the Israelis would want to sink a
ship of its closest ally at a time of war. Conspiracy theories abound.


Response Jim C:

The why of the attack was documented thoroughly in James Bamford's book
"Body of Secrets: Anatomy of the Ultra-Secret National Sercurity Agency",
Doubleday, NY, 2001. and it is not some kind of "conspiracy theory." I
should note that Bamford's first book on the NSA called "The Puzzle Palace" brought the wrath of NSA down on him. Later, when Bamford's scholarship could not be impeached, NSA started giving him direct access to NSA and even intercepts which he used in this book and now he even lectures to NSA personnel inside the NSA, in NSA facilities, on the history of the NSA. (If you can't threaten them, then co-opt them) What is also interesting is why NSA would release to Bamford the intercepts that he used to write and document what is below:

>From Bamford:

"Although no one on the ship knew it at the time, the Liberty had suddenly
trespassed into a private horror. At that very moment, near the minaret at
El Arish, Israeli forces were engaged in a criminal slaughter...(pp.200-201)

As the Liberty sat within eyeshot of El Arish, eavesdropping on surrounding
communications, Israeli soldiers turned the town into a slaughterhouse,
systematically butchering their prisoners. In the shadow of the El Arish
mosque, they lined up about sixty unarmed Egyptian prisoners, hands tied
behind their backs, and then opened fire with machine guns until the pale
desert turned red. 'I saw a line of prisoners, civilians and military', said
Abdelsalam Moussa, one of those who dug the graves, 'and they opened fire at them all at once. When they were dead, they told us to bury them.'. Nearby, a group of Israelis gunned down thirty more prisoners and then ordered some Bedouins to cover them with sand.

In still another incident at El Arish, the Israeli journalist Gabi Bron saw
about 150 Egyptian POWs sitting on the ground, crowded together with their hands held at the back of their necks. 'The Egyptian prisoners of war were ordered to dig pits and then army police shot them to death', Broin said. ' I witnessed the executions with my own eyes on the morning of June 8th, in the airport area of El Arish.'

The Israeli military historian Aryeh Yitzhaki, who worked in the army's
history department after the war, said he and other officers collected
testimony from dozens of soldiers who admitted killing POWs. According to
Yitzhaki, Israeli troops killed, in cold blood, as many as 1,000 Egyptian
prisoners in the Sinai including some 400 in the sand dunes of El Arish.

Ironically, Ariel Sharon, who was capturing territory south of El Arish at
the time of the slaughter, had been close to massacres during other
conflicts. One of his men during the Suez crisis in 1956, Arye Biro, now a
retired brigadier general, recently admitted the unprovoked killing of 49
prisoners of war in the Sinai in 1956. 'I had my Karl Gustav [weapon] I had taken from the Egyptian. My officer had an Uzi. Th Egyptian prisoners were sitting there with their faces turned to us. We turned to them with our
loaded guns and shot them. Magazine after magazine. They didn't get a chance to react.' At another point, Biro said, he found Egyptian soldiers prostrate with thirst. He said that after taunting them by pouring water from his canteen into the sand, he killed them. 'If I were to be put on trial for what I did,' he said, 'then it would be necessary to put on trial at least
one-half the Israeli army, which, in similar circumstances, did what I did.'
Sharon who says he learned of the 1956 prisoner shootings only after they
happened, refused to say whether he took any disciplinary action against
those involved, or even objected to the killings...(pp.201-203)

Into this sea of lies, deception and slaughter said the USS Liberty, an
enormous American spy factory loaded with $10.2 million worth of the latest eavesdropping gear. At 10:39 A.M. the minaret at El Arish was logged at seventeen miles away, at bearing 189 degrees. Sailing at five knots, the Liberty was practically treading water.

By 10:55 AM, senior Israeli officials knew for certain that they had an
American electronic spy in their midst. Not only was the ship clearly
visible to the forces at El Arish, it had been positively identified by
Israeli naval headquarters... The report said that the ship cruising slowly
off El Arish was 'an electromagnetic audio-surveillance ship of the U.S.
Navy named Liberty, whose marking was GTR-5.'

Not only did the ship have a 'GTR-5' painted broadly on both sides of its
bow and stern, it also had its name painted in large, bold, black letters:
'U.S.S. Liberty.' (pp. 203-204)


Note: What the Israeli's didn't know is that in addition to the Liberty
recording Israeli radio chatter revealing the ongoing massacres of POWs at El Arish, there was also an EC-121 aircraft doing the same thing. They went after the Liberty to stop the surveillance and destroy what had been
recorded thinking that the Liberty was the only witness. They didn't know
that the EC-121 also had gathered the evidence including evidence from radio intercepts that the Israelis knew exactly who they were going after and why they were doing it.

This obviously was many years ago and the USA and Israel are good allies. However, if in the future; the radio intercepts are ever declassified and released to the public, it will lead to strained diplomatic relations.

Have a good weekend to all!

Nazi.com ?

[IDFM203]

Ill just answer this paragraph for everything else is simply ridicules, not to mention not a shred of proof to it!!



The intention of the attacking forces were to sink the ship and kill the crew. if that was the intention why didn’t it happen?


The crews life boats were destroyed by Israel torpedo boats and anyone topside was targeted. that is not true!!……yes torpedo boats did attack the ship as well, but they did so after they thought that this “Egyptian” ship was attacking them.

Remember this was in the midst of a all out war!!


When non-encrypted messages were sent and received by the Liberty that the Sixth Fleet had launched jets the attacked was stopped. Israel had plenty of time from the start of the attack till it stopped to destroy it if that was its intention.

The fact is that the Israeli planes did not even have the proper ammunition to destroy this ship.

There was no such intention to set out and destroy a American spy ship



At no point did Israeli forces lend assistance or help survivors. complete utter lie!!

When Israel relised it was an American ship it stopped and even sent over planes to ask for assistence and I belive even sent over a medivac helicopeter (though not a 100 percent sure on the medivac)



However, if in the future; the radio intercepts are ever declassified and released to the public, it will lead to strained diplomatic relations. NSA transcripts were recently declassified and it exonerated Israel and further confirmed it was a accident!!



Now a question that I always had.........Just curious btw, what was that spy ship doing there in the first place.??

In truth I too am curious to know if there is a cover up and why the U.S. has (if it did in fact)


P.S. nice post Ichhabe :D ,…even though you were always a PLO sympathizer ;) :roll:

Shalom :D

[BlackRain]

What was the USS Liberty doing there?

USS Liberty was attacked for 75 minutes in international waters 13 miles off the coast. The ship had the legal right under international law to be there.


What Israeli weapons were capable of sinking the USS Liberty?

http://www.ussliberty.org/g/lg/tt-holeb.jpg
Photo: 40 foot hole in side of USS Liberty from torpedo attack.

The official court of inquiry attempts to answer this. Capt. Ward Boston, the senior legal counsel for the Navy's Court of Inquiry into the attack on the Liberty. His statement was read by Rear Adm. Merlin Staring, a former judge advocate general of the Navy. Following are portions of what he read.


The late Admiral Isaac Kidd and I were given only one week to gather evidence for the Navy's official investigation. Despite the short amount of time we were given, we gathered a vast amount of evidence, including hours of heartbreaking testimony from the young survivors.
The evidence was clear. Both Adm. Kidd and I believed with certainty that this attack, which killed 34 American sailors and injured 172 others, was a deliberate effort to sink an American ship and murder its entire crew. I am certain that the Israeli pilots that undertook the attack, as well as their superiors who had ordered the attack, were aware that the ship was American.

I saw our flag, which had visibly identified the ship as American, riddled with bullet holes, and heard testimony that made it clear that the Israelis intended that there be no survivors. Not only did the Israelis attack the ship for over two hours with napalm, gunfire and hundreds of rockets and missiles, Israeli torpedo boats machine-gunned three life boats that had been launched in an attempt to save the crew – a war crime.

Listen friend, you don't have to believe anything I have quoted. But you may want to listen to the men who were actually there in their own words. It you go here http://www.ussliberty.org/voices.htm you can listen to the ships crew describe what happened to them.

Example: Survivor Halbardier describes Israeli machinegunning of Liberty's life rafts, a war crime under international law. http://www.ussliberty.org/audio/2hlbdier.ram


This is my shred of proof!

Now I call upon you to provide a link to the
NSA transcripts were recently declassified and it exonerated Israel and further confirmed it was a accident!!

[IDFM203]

What was the USS Liberty doing there?

USS Liberty was attacked for 75 minutes in international waters 13 miles off the coast. The ship had the legal right under international law to be there.

no I know all about legal law….that’s not what I was asking.

What was that spy ship doing in waters in a war zone in middle of a all out war??

This question has nothing to do with whether they had the right to be there or not.


What Israeli weapons were capable of sinking the USS Liberty?yes and to this you didn’t show me anything…all you did was show me a pic of the side of the ship.

Again if Israel had set out to intentionally destroy that ship how come the planes did not have the proper bombs to take out a ship??


Also the attack was defiantly long enough to sink that ship if indeed Israel had set out to do so……it did not!!

Now of course after the IAF planes were diverted from missions to go after this “Egyptian” ship, it did try to sink it but it did not have the proper ammunition for it had not set out to destroy any ships that day.


Israeli torpedo boats machine-gunned three life boats that had been launched in an attempt to save the crew – a war crime. again those torpedo boats were being attacked by what it thought was an enemy Egyptian ship………that spy ship was in a war zone in midst of a all out war, of course those torpedo boats thought it a Egyptian ship…hell why would there be a American ship there?…as far as they knew, there wasn’t supposed to be any American ship for at least a 100 miles off the cost.


Listen friend, you don't have to believe anything I have quoted. but yet you wont listen nor believe what any Israeli says :roll: …I mean the Israeli pilots who did this and who most defiantly know if they were doing this on purpose or not,.yeah their voices should never be heard as well :roll:


But you may want to listen to the men who were actually there in their own words. It you go here http://www.ussliberty.org/voices.htm you can listen to the ships crew describe what happened to them. yes they were attacked by Israeli planes, no one is disputing that……what we are disputing is whether it was deliberate or not and nothing the survivors say or saw can claim that they knew what the pilots were thinking to know if they had set out to deliberately attack this ship!!


This is my shred of proof! no all you brought was proof that Israel attacked that ship…. you did not bring one single shred of proof that Israel deliberately did it or that they did it for the reasons that you suggested before (which are frankly absurd :roll: )




Now I call upon you to provide a link to the NSA transcripts were recently declassified and it exonerated Israel and further confirmed it was a accident!! here you go........

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/07/09/uss.liberty.tapes/index.html

Here you put down all you info so here is a bit of mine that you should read.

I guess like your request for me to believe what your links say I ask you to show me the same courtesy as to what I bring down.


The Israeli attack on the USS Liberty was a grievous error, largely attributable to the fact that it occurred in the midst of the confusion of a full-scale war in 1967. Ten official United States investigations and three official Israeli inquiries have all conclusively established the attack was a tragic mistake.
On June 8, 1967, the fourth day of the Six-Day War, the Israeli high command received reports that Israeli troops in El Arish were being fired upon from the sea, presumably by an Egyptian vessel, as they had a day before. The United States had announced that it had no naval forces within hundreds of miles of the battle front on the floor of the United Nations a few days earlier; however, the USS Liberty, an American intelligence ship assigned to monitor the fighting, arrived in the area, 14 miles off the Sinai coast, as a result of a series of United States communication failures, whereby messages directing the ship not to approach within 100 miles were not received by the Liberty. The Israelis mistakenly thought this was the ship doing the shelling and war planes and torpedo boats attacked, killing 34 members of the Liberty's crew and wounding 171.
Numerous mistakes were made by both the United States and Israel. For example, the Liberty was first reported — incorrectly, as it turned out — to be cruising at 30 knots (it was later recalculated to be 28 knots). Under Israeli (and U.S.) naval doctrine at the time, a ship proceeding at that speed was presumed to be a warship. The sea was calm and the U.S. Navy Court of Inquiry found that the Liberty's flag was very likely drooped and not discernible; moreover, members of the crew, including the Captain, Commander William McGonagle, testified that the flag was knocked down after the first or second assault.
According to Israeli Chief of Staff Yitzhak Rabin's memoirs, there were standing orders to attack any unidentified vessel near the shore.1 The day fighting began, Israel had asked that American ships be removed from its coast or that it be notified of the precise location of U.S. vessels.2 The Sixth Fleet was moved because President Johnson feared being drawn into a confrontation with the Soviet Union. He also ordered that no aircraft be sent near Sinai.
A CIA report on the incident issued June 13, 1967, also found that an overzealous pilot could mistake the Liberty for an Egyptian ship, the El Quseir. After the air raid, Israeli torpedo boats identified the Liberty as an Egyptian naval vessel. When the Liberty began shooting at the Israelis, they responded with the torpedo attack, which killed 28 of the sailors.
Initially, the Israelis were terrified that they had attacked a Soviet ship and might have provoked the Soviets to join the fighting.3 Once the Israelis were sure what had happened, they reported the incident to the U.S. Embassy in Tel Aviv and offered to provide a helicopter for the Americans to fly out to the ship and any help they required to evacuate the injured and salvage the ship. The offer was accepted and a U.S. naval attaché was flown to the Liberty.
Many of the survivors of the Liberty remain bitter, and are convinced the attack was deliberate as they make clear on their web site. In 1991, columnists Rowland Evans and Robert Novak trumpeted their discovery of an American who said he had been in the Israeli war room when the decision was made to knowingly attack the American ship.4 In fact, that individual, Seth Mintz, wrote a letter to the Washington Post on November 9, 1991, in which he said he was misquoted by Evans and Novak and that the attack, was, in fact, a "case of mistaken identity." Moreover, the man who Mintz originally said had been with him, a Gen. Benni Matti, does not exist.
Also, contrary to claims that an Israeli pilot identified the ship as American on a radio tape, no one has ever produced this tape. In fact, the official Israeli Air Force tape clearly established that no such identification of the ship was made by the Israeli pilots prior to the attack. It also indicates that once the pilots became concerned about the identity of the ship, by virtue of reading its hull number, they terminated the attack. The tapes do not contain any statement suggesting the pilots saw a U.S. flag before the attack.5 Critics claimed the Israeli tape was doctored, but the National Security Agency of the United States released formerly top secret transcripts in July 2003 that confirmed the Israeli version.
A U.S. spy plane was sent to the area as soon as the NSA learned of the attack on the Liberty and recorded the conversations of two Israeli Air Force helicopter pilots, which took place between 2:30 and 3:37 p.m. on June 8. The orders radioed to the pilots by their supervisor at the Hatzor base instructing them to search for Egyptian survivors from the "Egyptian warship" that had just been bombed were also recorded by the NSA. "Pay attention. The ship is now identified as Egyptian," the pilots were informed. Nine minutes later, Hatzor told the pilots the ship was believed to be an Egyptian cargo ship. At 3:07, the pilots were first told the ship might not be Egyptian and were instructed to search for survivors and inform the base immediately the nationality of the first person they rescued. It was not until 3:12 that one of the pilots reported that he saw an American flag flying over the ship at which point he was instructed to verify if it was indeed a U.S. vessel.6
In October 2003, the first Israeli pilot to reach the ship broke his 36-year silence on the attack. Brig.-Gen. Yiftah Spector, a triple ace, who shot down 15 enemy aircraft and took part in the 1981 raid on the Iraqi nuclear reactor, said he had been told an Egyptian ship was off the Gaza coast. "This ship positively did not have any symbol or flag that I could see. What I was concerned with was that it was not one of ours. I looked for the symbol of our navy, which was a large white cross on its deck. This was not there, so it wasn't one of ours." The Jerusalem Post obtained a recording of Spector's radio transmission in which he said, "I can't identify it, but in any case it's a military ship."7
Spector's plane was not armed with bombs or, he said, he would have sunk the Liberty. Instead he fired 30mm armor piercing rounds that led the American survivors to believe they had been under rocket attack. His first pass ignited a fire, which caused the ship to billow black smoke that Spector thought was a ruse to conceal the ship. Spector acknowledged in the Post interview that he made a mistake, and said he admitted it when called to testify in an inquiry by a U.S. senator. "I'm sorry for the mistake," he said. "Years later my mates dropped flowers on the site where the ship was attacked."
None of Israel's accusers can explain why Israel would deliberately attack an American ship at a time when the United States was Israel's only friend and supporter in the world. Confusion in a long line of communications, which occurred in a tense atmosphere on both the American and Israeli sides (five messages from the Joint Chiefs of Staff for the ship to remain at least 25 miles — the last four said 100 miles — off the Egyptian coast arrived after the attack was over) is a more probable explanation.
Accidents caused by “friendly fire” are common in wartime. In 1988, the U.S. Navy mistakenly downed an Iranian passenger plane, killing 290 civilians. During the Gulf War, 35 of the 148 Americans who died in battle were killed by “friendly fire.” In April 1994, two U.S. Black Hawk helicopters with large U.S. flags painted on each side were shot down by U.S. Air Force F-15s on a clear day in the “no fly” zone of Iraq, killing 26 people. In April 2002, an American F-16 dropped a bomb that killed four Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan. In fact, the day before the Liberty was attacked, Israeli pilots accidentally bombed one of their own armored columns.8
Retired Admiral, Shlomo Erell, who was Chief of the Navy in Israel in June 1967, told the Associated Press (June 5, 1977): “No one would ever have dreamt that an American ship would be there. Even the United States didn't know where its ship was. We were advised by the proper authorities that there was no American ship within 100 miles.”
Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara told Congress on July 26, 1967: “It was the conclusion of the investigatory body, headed by an admiral of the Navy in whom we have great confidence, that the attack was not intentional.”
In 1987, McNamara repeated his belief that the attack was a mistake, telling a caller on the “Larry King Show” that he had seen nothing in the 20 years since to change his mind that there had been no “coverup.”8
Israel apologized for the tragedy and paid nearly $13 million in humanitarian reparations to the United States and to the families of the victims in amounts established by the U.S. State Department. The matter was officially closed between the two governments by an exchange of diplomatic notes on December 17, 1987. http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/liberty.html

Shalom :D

.

[mocking_loudly_died]

Didn't I warn people about more Israeli threads!

I said IDFM203 would come on and bombard people with facts and then I would die in an unrelated **** incident.

Hmmm.....well I'm off to meet my fate.

[IDFM203]

Didn't I warn people about more Israeli threads!

I said IDFM203 would come on and bombard people with facts and then I would die in an unrelated **** incident.

Hmmm.....well I'm off to meet my fate.hehe :lol: …hey if you read the whole thread you’ll see I really tried hard to avoid brining down any real info….but man there is only so much prodding I can take ;)

Btw I thought you had already died from the previous unrelated **** accident after the last time I bombarded this forum with facts ;)

I hope this time, at least its good ****...hey might as well go out with a bang ;) :lol:

Shalom :D

[SeanAshi]

We know that Israel didn't intentionally attack the USS Libery, there were mistakes on both sides, the Liberty was there to eavesdrop on the war, the Liberty was in the wrong place, they were to close to the shore, terrirble mistake resulted in the deaths of many American sailors, friendly fire incidents happen, Gulf war in 91, Afghanistan, Iraq. Canadian, British troops killed by The United States which we truly regret, I'm sure their familys feel the way the families of the Liberty feel. Hopefully in the future we have better technology to prevent things like this.

[BlackRain]

Not all of the NSA transcripts have been released to the public. The only ones available are from after the attack. To read and hear what is available: http://www.nsa.gov/docs/efoia/released/liberty.html

[sethen]

Yes, Israelis control America through fundalmentalist southern proxies! Why is it that all recent American presidents have been from the south? Sephardic jewry has ruled The South liked royalty since the pre-colonial times. B'nai B'rith, Scottish Rite Freemasonry, corruption and Zionism. Nothing can be done to this rule through baptists proxie force. Don't even think about harming those precious Juden! Deputy Sheriff Jedd Clampette and the gang will drive in from the county seat and "GIT CHA" Just know when you are surrounded by enemy proxies! :fork:


As for Afghanistan, Israel was running weapons into the area around '98. This was publicly stated in Soldier of Fortune. I think that it was an effort to SUPPORT the Taliban as a PROXIE to counter Iran. Iran and the Taliban were at each others throats constantly. As for Judaising Afghanistan its too late, the Pashtuns already claim to be one of the lost tribes of Israel. Arriving via the Silk Road. MOSEKHEL "The People of Moses."

Oi Vey Baby!!!!! rofl

[Cambridge Rabbit]

Israel gave us Natalie Portman, and we gave them control of our government and our military. If you ask me, that's a fair deal.

Hell, they can take all of our natural resources, wealth, military equipment, AND the state of California if they just give us a few more Portmans.

woot

[Sayeret]

Thats naive Israel doesn't control the US. The Arabs who hate Israel and the US say that but thats not true. The US doesn't control Israel either. They both work together on things such as fighting terrorism.

[hank]

Yes, Israelis control America through fundalmentalist southern proxies! Why is it that all recent American presidents have been from the south? Sephardic jewry has ruled The South liked royalty since the pre-colonial times. B'nai B'rith, Scottish Rite Freemasonry, corruption and Zionism. Nothing can be done to this rule through baptists proxie force. Don't even think about harming those precious Juden! Deputy Sheriff Jedd Clampette and the gang will drive in from the county seat and "GIT CHA" Just know when you are surrounded by enemy proxies! :fork:


As for Afghanistan, Israel was running weapons into the area around '98. This was publicly stated in Soldier of Fortune. I think that it was an effort to SUPPORT the Taliban as a PROXIE to counter Iran. Iran and the Taliban were at each others throats constantly. As for Judaising Afghanistan its too late, the Pashtuns already claim to be one of the lost tribes of Israel. Arriving via the Silk Road. MOSEKHEL "The People of Moses."

Oi Vey Baby!!!!! rofl

This gets better all the time! Sephardic jewry? In the south? Where are you from and where did you get this?

hank

[Cael]

I was gonna ask the same thing.

Natalie Portman... she's mine.

[California Joe]

This may be the most retarded thread since Adam left.

[UkrainianAmerican]

This may be the most retarded thread since Adam left.
Not only that, but the topic is misspelled as well.

[mustamato]

USrael. Oh how inpolitically correct rofl

As I´ve understood it there is a powerfull jewish lobby in Washington DC,
and not to mention that many of the actual leaders are jewish as well,
Kerry has some jewsish blood and he might even be president soon,
Clark (not in the presidential race anymore though) is a jew, Albright
was a jew and so forth.

And being jewish they are sure as hell not anti-Israeli atleast.

[IDFM203]

Ahh of course mustamato shows up :roll: ……I am baffled it took him this long ;) ……oh well.

Here keep this quiet......its only between me and you ;) …..shh………..ok are you ready……here it is…….President bush has Jewish blood as well ;)

*briefly putting mind reading mode on mustamato for his quick thoughts on my startling revelation*

“yes that explains everything………I knew my feelings were right…..boy that IDFM203, he finnlay confirmed one of my theories that I had all along…………….. …………………… …………… ……………… ………………….

*Ends mind reading mode for things were starting to go blank over there* ;)




You know this whole Jews control this, Jews have all the money, jews etc… reminds me of a old famous Jewish joke.

It’s the year 1965 and there is this Russian Jew sitting in a park bench in Israel reading a Russian newspaper.

In middle of him reading this paper, another Russian jew walks by and immediately stops in shock…”hey”, he screams, “what are you doing reading a Russian paper, its always full of lies and propaganda against Jews??” The Russian Jew that was reading it looks up and says “ when I first got to Israel a few years back, I never would have done this, for all I did was read the Israeli papers, but I soon realized that everyday in those Israeli papers all I read about is how the economy is in bad shape, how inflation is skyrocketing, how there is no peace, how there are terrorist attacks all the time, how the Arabs want to destroy us, how etc..Now when I read the papers, I only read the Russian papers for in there all I read is how Jews have all the money, how Jews are very powerful, how Jews control everything……its more uplifiting and I simply feel better reading the Russian paper’s then I do the Israeli one’s."

Shalom ;)

[mustamato]

rofl rofl rofl

Another joke:

You know IDFM203, during the Winter War, 1939-40, Soviet Union vs. Finland,
the finns held Finlands 2nd largest city during the war, but in the peace agreement
they had to leave it, so they did. The official Soviet propaganda claimed that the
city was taken in battle. The Soviet soldiers made fun of that, and there
was a popular joke amongst them:

"There were only two finns left in town when we marched in, "finance
and Finkelstein, and they were the same person" :)

Well anyway, this "jews controll the world via ZoG" is not a new claim, or
anything like that. I don´t think that Israel controls USA, that claim is just
too much. But I do believe that the jews have more power in USA than they
should have, there are in example more moslems in USA than there are jews,
and the moslems don´t control **** there. But that´s the way it is, especially
considered that christianity and jews religion is the same **** basically, while
islam is not. The explanation I have for the jewish influence comes from the
medieval catholic Europe. Up until the 16th century it was not allowed by
the christan church to trade with money, so the jews did it instead and made
big money and big influence, hence all these Goldbergs, Silversteins and
so forth. I don´t think the influence will last many generations more. But
of course we are all dead then anyway.

[Uninen]

About the USS Liberty..

I seriously think that it was attacked on purpose, as they were too close to Israeli shores, and also because i suspect that they had intercepted some Israeli communications involving their Nuclear Weapons which were at the time a big, big secret.. but today, they arent fooling anybody.. :)

[sethen]

[quote=sethen]Yes, Israelis control America through fundalmentalist southern proxies! Why is it that all recent American presidents have been from the south? Sephardic jewry has ruled The South liked royalty since the pre-colonial times. B'nai B'rith, Scottish Rite Freemasonry, corruption and Zionism. Nothing can be done to this rule through baptists proxie force. Don't even think about harming those precious Juden! Deputy Sheriff Jedd Clampette and the gang will drive in from the county seat and "GIT CHA" Just know when you are surrounded by enemy proxies! :fork:


As for Afghanistan, Israel was running weapons into the area around '98. This was publicly stated in Soldier of Fortune. I think that it was an effort to SUPPORT the Taliban as a PROXIE to counter Iran. Iran and the Taliban were at each others throats constantly. As for Judaising Afghanistan its too late, the Pashtuns already claim to be one of the lost tribes of Israel. Arriving via the Silk Road. MOSEKHEL "The People of Moses."

Oi Vey Baby!!!!! rofl

Question: This gets better all the time! Sephardic jewry? In the south? Where are you from and where did you get this?

Answer: South Carolina was the RICHEST Colony from the Original 13. Charleston was not only the center of the slave trade but was a haven for Sephardic Jews fleeing Spain via England. It is also the home of Reform Judaism. Born and raised in the South. I got the information from open sources, try it! ;) Do a search on yahoo for "Why Albert Pikes Statue must Fall." by Anton Chiatkin! For those who are uncritical and subscribe to "concensus reality" and already have your minds made up will be un-phased. As for those who suspect everything and everyone, this will be an eye opener! :)

Yankel Rosenbaum R.I.P p-)

[UkrainianAmerican]

USrael. Oh how inpolitically correct rofl

As I´ve understood it there is a powerfull jewish lobby in Washington DC,
and not to mention that many of the actual leaders are jewish as well,
Kerry has some jewsish blood and he might even be president soon,
Clark (not in the presidential race anymore though) is a jew, Albright
was a jew and so forth.

And being jewish they are sure as hell not anti-Israeli atleast.
Clark is Jewish? hahahahaha.
As for "powerful" zionist lobby, how about the muslim lobbies? They seem pretty powerful to me. Especial CAIR (Council on AMerican-Islamic relations)
O, and dont worry, Kerry isnt going to be a president.

[UkrainianAmerican]

rofl rofl rofl

Another joke:

You know IDFM203, during the Winter War, 1939-40, Soviet Union vs. Finland,
the finns held Finlands 2nd largest city during the war, but in the peace agreement
they had to leave it, so they did. The official Soviet propaganda claimed that the
city was taken in battle. The Soviet soldiers made fun of that, and there
was a popular joke amongst them:

"There were only two finns left in town when we marched in, "finance
and Finkelstein, and they were the same person" :)

Well anyway, this "jews controll the world via ZoG" is not a new claim, or
anything like that. I don´t think that Israel controls USA, that claim is just
too much. But I do believe that the jews have more power in USA than they
should have, there are in example more moslems in USA than there are jews,
and the moslems don´t control **** there. But that´s the way it is, especially
considered that christianity and jews religion is the same **** basically, while
islam is not. The explanation I have for the jewish influence comes from the
medieval catholic Europe. Up until the 16th century it was not allowed by
the christan church to trade with money, so the jews did it instead and made
big money and big influence, hence all these Goldbergs, Silversteins and
so forth. I don´t think the influence will last many generations more. But
of course we are all dead then anyway.
So you gonna set up influence "quotas"?
WTF is WRONG with you?

[IDFM203]

About the USS Liberty..

I seriously think that it was attacked on purpose, as they were too close to Israeli shores, and also because i suspect that they had intercepted some Israeli communications involving their Nuclear Weapons which were at the time a big, big secret.. but today, they arent fooling anybody.. :) haha :lol: of course YOU think it was deliberate…geez no surprise there :roll:

What’s ridicules is you reasoning :lol:

Believe me Israel wasn’t fooling no one.

Hell the U.S. knew about a program by the early sixties already and Israel knew that already.

Something tells me that you don’t really believe that’s the reason (and while you wrongly believe it was deliberate, you don’t have any real theory so you simply brought this up), just simply you wanted to mention Israel’s nukes ;)

Wait hold on, I have a call.

“hello”

Yes this is the minister of defense, I am awaiting your orders

“yeah ok prepare to launch in twenty minutes at Helsinki”

where?

“You know were union and mustamato most probably live.

The secret is out and we must destroy them before they tell other’s”

ok

;) :lol:



Boy this thread is fun :P

Shalom :D

[S'13]

Wait hold on, I have a call.

“hello”

Yes this is the minister of defense, I am awaiting your orders

“yeah ok prepare to launch in twenty minutes at Helsinki”

where?

“You know were union and mustamato most probably live.

The secret is out and we must destroy them before they tell other’s”

ok

;) :lol:



Boy this thread is fun :P

Shalom :D

rofl rofl rofl rofl

I think it would be much better if we sent Sayeret Matkal to take them out...

Would be a lot more discreet, that's for sure ;)

[hank]

Sethen - where to begin?

You think that the death a visiting hasidic rabbi in a tough NY neighborhood and a subsequent acquittal is evidence of some conspiracy? How so? Elaborate b/c I don't follow.

Murder is hard to convict people of and there are so many cases of injustice in murder cases that I can't even list examples. Look at what happened in IL where more than half the guys on death row had their DNA tests done and it showed serious flaws in the verdicts rendered. Criminal justice is IMPERFECT. That's just the way it is.

Getting a trend from one decision is irresponsible.

What about Pike? I read several articles about the guy, he was a Klansman. So what? I don't see the correlation b/w the Klan, the slave trade before the Civil War and your allegation that Jews "control" the South.

I have lived in TN, MS, TX, FL, and again TN - for all the 33 years of my life. I have never seen any Jewish influence in the state or local governments of any of those places that was more than coincidental. My hometown, Milan, TN - where I graduated high school, had a non-practicing Jewish mayor who ate eggs and bacon at Bob's Diner about 4 days a week! I have drunk enough beer with his son Brian to float several battleships.

Anti-Semitism by any name or rationalization is evil. If you read this crap and believe it you should be ashamed of yourself.

If you make an allegation like you did then it is incumbent on you to back it up with facts lest you be of the same ilk as Hitler and any of the other famous anti-semites before and after him. These articles re: Pike and Rosenbaum dod not qualify. I await a detailed response.

I don't want to jump to any conclusions but I think I smell someone who might buy into the idea of tri-lateral commission and the resulting conspiracy. I might be wrong, if so, feel free to tell me.

hank

[California Joe]

Dear Hank, I'm glad you showed up here. I enjoy reading what you write. There are mental people on the internet. Just sayin'. Your pal, me.

[UkrainianAmerican]

Re hank,
Just a small correction: theres nothing against drinking beer (or any alcohol) in Judaism.

[hank]

I hear you brother. It makes me feel warm in the special place ;) to try and be the voice of reason when I can. I guess it is a little scary that I often end up being the voice of reason, but somebody has to do it.

By the way, how is your new yamika (sp?)? Mine got rejected by the local authorities because it did not comply with the Torah. I've been looking on line but to no avail. I'll keep you posted. Good luck.

hank

[IDFM203]

Good response there hank :D ..I actually ignored his post for when they get that ridicules, I find it better to just leave it alone for they look as ridicules on their own and there is no need for me to point out the obvious ;)

But hey you live in the south so go ahead.


One thing I find perplexing is what does Yankel Rosenbaum (may he rest in peace) have to do with Jews controlling anything :roll: .. He was a Hassidic Jews that was stabbed to death in a time in crown heights which is in Brooklyn NY when there was three days of a pogrom (ok Ill be PC, Ill call it a riot ;) ) against the Jewish community there, after a Hassidic person was driving behind the Hassidic rabbi and accidentally hit and killed a black child.

The killer of Yankel Rosenbaum (who witnesses from the black mob said that he said, “there is a Jew” “get him” ) got an extremely light sentence (I am not sure but I believe the conviction might have even been thrown out on some technicality). I mean hell the Mayer at the time didn’t even send in the police for at least a day, even though there were mobs of blacks attacking stores and assaulting Jews

Gee if anything it just shows a lack of any Jewish power that there was a extremely slow police response and that the killer of this Jew wasn’t convicted.

Belive me, I am not following this reference as well :roll:

Shalom y'all ;)

[hank]

idfm203 - thanks for not tooling on me about the yakima joke. My sense of humor is a little twisted sometimes.

I don't get that correlation, either. (between Rosenbaum and a Jewish conspiracy, that is).

Do you understand the Pike thing. Is there any correlation between masons and Jews? I don't get that either.

By the way, my WWII vet grandfather who is a horrible anti-semite by the way I am ashamed to admit, was in the Scottish Rite and plays the bagpipes.

hank

[hank]

RussianAmerican - duly noted. ;) Wouldn't matter anyway, though, because Israel doesn't have any of our old battleships. Yet.

hank

[IDFM203]

idfm203 - thanks for not tooling on me about the yakima joke.
My sense of humor is a little twisted sometimes. hey a little humor is no problem ;) …I can handle it (just check over this whole thread to see how I am taking this anti Jewish crap :D …I don’t believe I have had this much fun on this forum since I joined up ;) :D )

Also, what authorities?? Judaism has more different types of “authorities” then I can keep track of ;)



I don't get that correlation, either. (between Rosenbaum and a Jewish conspiracy, that is).

Do you understand the Pike thing. Is there any correlation between masons and Jews? I don't get that either. I don’t know anything about pike.
About the masons, yeah that’s famous…yeah we control the world through underground meetings :roll:

Anways its too ridicules for me to even offer up a real response.


I mean hell Jews controlling the south is one of the funniest things I have seen on this board rofl ….nuff said :lol:



By the way, my WWII vet grandfather who is a horrible anti-semite by the way I am ashamed to admit, was in the Scottish Rite and plays the bagpipes.

Hank unlike others here, I judge each individual based on their actions and words alone and what your grandfather did or say has no bearing on what you did or say.

Anyways in truth I don’t care even if you or others were Anti Semitic…this isn’t fifty years ago where Jews get hit and they stay down, no this time we get back up swinging.

(I didn’t serve in the IDF to get hit and not fight back ;) )

Shalom :D

[California Joe]

I didn't think the Freemasons liked Jews any more than they liked Catholics. Hey, wait a minute, now they sound like the Methodists, who are really Baptists that can read. This thread is on dope. According to the DaVinci Code there are far better conspiracies to worry about. Dis you know Jack the Ripper was an artist? Believe it. Not that I'd do anything to famgirl but draw her or anything... ;)

Duke of Wellington and Marshal Michel Ney were Masons....Hmmmmmm

[hank]

Well, I see that my little joke about the hat didn't go over. I will explain it anyway, b/c it was kinda funny. What I meant was that Joe and I wanted to wear the Jewish skull cap but when we went to our local police stations to get them approved, Andy Griffith would not approve of our yamika. Trying a little backhanded stab at sethen's comment about Southern law enforcement. The thought being that in the South, our police regulate what kind of yamika we wear. The reality is that in Milan, TN or other small southern towns a sheriff or policeman is very unlikely to know what a yamika is. ;)

hank

[hank]

I get the outfit and the bagpipes when the old guy croaks. I'll post a picture. As if.

hank

[California Joe]

What is the correct spelling of that hat anyhoo? Yarmulke right? Tell me what I've won Rod Roddy.....

[IDFM203]

Well, I see that my little joke about the hat didn't go over. I will explain it anyway, b/c it was kinda funny. What I meant was that Joe and I wanted to wear the Jewish skull cap but when we went to our local police stations to get them approved, Andy Griffith would not approve of our yamika. Trying a little backhanded stab at sethen's comment about Southern law enforcement. The thought being that in the South, our police regulate what kind of yamika we wear. The reality is that in Milan, TN or other small southern towns a sheriff or policeman is very unlikely to know what a yamika is. ;)

hankoops :oops: I was indeed a little slow on the uptake there :oops:

I thought you were referring to the “Jewish authorities” and that they control everything and because you are not Jewish they didn’t allow you to wear it.

Hey what I thought was a bit funny as well ;)



I belive its actually Yarmulkah

“im sooooory” “you don’t win the car” “but at least you get the hand deterignet and also you can win money in the spin of the weel coming up after the break.” ;) :D

Shalom :D

[StarvingStudent47]

Four points I'd like to make.

1) Wesley Clark is a Baptist, or maybe a Methodist, if my memory serves me correctly. That's a form of CHRISTIANITY, Mustamato.

2) Judaism lets you drink all you want. And thank Yahweh for that, because, as Benjamin Franklin once said, "Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants to see us happy."

3) I understood the spelling to be "yarmulke." But for years I spelled it "Yamaka" because that's how you ****ounce it. By the way, I showed up at my grandfather's funeral, and a bunch of people didn't have yarmulkes. Luckily, someone had thought ahead and brought a big bag of New York Yankee's caps. Covering your head is covering your head, right? Besides, my grandfather liked the Yankees, I'm sure he would have gotten a kick out of that ;)

3) This thread is the dumbest thing I've ever seen.

[California Joe]

Well dammit IDFM I was close. :D

[IDFM203]

Well dammit IDFM I was close. :DWell you were close enough to lose out on a brand new Cadillac Escalade but close enough to win the hand detergent ;)

Yeah reeeeel close there buddy p-)


Shalom :D

[Javehn]

"I am shomer ****ing Shabes " .

[StarvingStudent47]

Well dammit IDFM I was close. :DWell you were close enough to lose out on a brand new Cadillac Escalade but close enough to win the hand detergent ;)

Yeah reeeeel close there buddy p-)


Shalom :D

Sorry IDFM, I'm going to have to side with California Joe here. He wins the Escalade after all. Why someone would WANT one of those beats the hell out of me, though.

http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Judaism/Kippah.html

Kippah (Yarmulke)

Even Google agrees. If you type in "yarmulkah," it asks "did you mean yarmulke?"

[California Joe]

WooHoo! Go me. woot

[IDFM203]

Well if you type it my way you get a lots of sites with it.

Anyways you might be right

ok damn he gets the Escalade........ I guess it is I that is stuck with whats now used up hand detergent ;) .......oh well

*puts head down in shame and walks away*

(but ill be back ;) you can be sure of it p-) )

[Javehn]

This google is dumb guy . It's Yarmolka , first of all , in Russian Polan Yedish and so on . And Yammaha on English i think . I think it's time to throw out the google guy from his job .

[StarvingStudent47]

This is fantastic. Three different Jews insist that this word is spelled three different ways. I guess this proves that Hebrew doesn't translate into the Latin alphabet very well at all (not like we didn't know that already).

[hank]

Come on ss47 - its not that bad. Some of this stuff is really funny. Humor has value. I mean, when you woke up this morning you did not know that the entire state of South Carolina was conspiring with the Freemasons to kill rabbis from Israel when they visit NY and then get the juries to vote no, did you? Come on admit it, it could happen.

hank

[IDFM203]

This is fantastic. Three different Jews insist that this word is spelled three different ways. I guess this proves that Hebrew doesn't translate into the Latin alphabet very well at all (not like we didn't know that already).haha :lol: this reminds me of the famous joke of when you put three Jews into a room to discuss one thing they come out with fifty different opinions :lol:

Shalom :D

[Javehn]

How about the evil spirits of south confideration ?? It still allive , no ?? Underground slavery perhaps ?I bet that they had a pact with Zionist Elders , And Greenpeace also plays important role in this dark game .

[California Joe]

*Driving away in new Escalade with really soft hands*

[StarvingStudent47]

How about the evil spirits of south confideration ?? It still allive , no ?? Underground slavery perhaps ?I bet that they had a pact with Zionist Elders , And Greenpeace also plays important role in this dark game .

And let's not forget the Zionist domination of Toys R Us. Ever notice that giant nose on Geoffrey the Giraffe? Yeah, that's what I thought.

[IDFM203]

Ok time to drop the ultimate bombshell :lol:

Are you all ready..

Yeah here it comes.

The master of this universe, Hood........ is Jewish!!

*Sits back to wait for everything to implode here*

p-) p-)

Shalom :D

[UkrainianAmerican]

This is fantastic. Three different Jews insist that this word is spelled three different ways. I guess this proves that Hebrew doesn't translate into the Latin alphabet very well at all (not like we didn't know that already).
Russhn Jooz are olveys ze korektest!

[hank]

Dude, that is it. I am going to South Carolina right now and kill the very first hasidic rabbi from Israel that I see. The prophecy is fulfilled. You guys start working on the jury pool.

hank

[Dalleer]

think it would be much better if we sent Sayeret Matkal to take them out...

Would be a lot more discreet, that's for sure

Too bad that Mr. Mustamato doesn't live in Finland, and I doubt that you can find Mr. Uninen from Helsinki either. You'd probably just end up capturing these two in error...


http://www.iltalehti.fi/julkkisporssi/m/andy_mccoy/20010709_jumandy_mccoy-4.jpg

[Javehn]

I still don't get one thing . Mustamato is Swedish , or Finnish ? Which one of them is Mustamato ??? Also , does Finnish sounds like Swedish ? Sorry for my complete ignorance on that matter .

I had a chat with Zion Elders . They are letting the use of Nuclear arsenal , that is placed in the Indian ocean in Israeli illegal undersea settlement . We will deploy them in Worp 5 .

And if we talking about this , i think that mr Spok was jew. I mean long ears - long nose , dry sence of humor - jewish bussiness aproach . Klingons also probably have blood conection to semit race .

[Dalleer]

Mustamato is Swedish , or Finnish ? Which one of them is Mustamato ??? Also , does Finnish sounds like Swedish ? Sorry for my complete ignorance on that matter .

Finnish does not sound like Swedish, although we have several words that sound quite similar.

If you'd like to compare Finnish to some language, Estonian would surely be the one (Now, don't ask me on what does Estonian sound like?).



Which one of them is Mustamato ???

Which one is which one from where?

What comes to Mr. Mustamato, he lives in Sweden but is very much Finnish, as far as I've understood...

[UkrainianAmerican]

I still don't get one thing . Mustamato is Swedish , or Finnish ? Which one of them is Mustamato ??? Also , does Finnish sounds like Swedish ? Sorry for my complete ignorance on that matter .

I had a chat with Zion Elders . They are letting the use of Nuclear arsenal , that is placed in the Indian ocean in Israeli illegal undersea settlement . We will deploy them in Worp 5 .

And if we talking about this , i think that mr Spok was jew. I mean long ears - long nose , dry sence of humor - jewish bussiness aproach . Klingons also probably have blood conection to semit race .
Leonard Nimoy IS a jew. (really he is)

[California Joe]

I know. I heard it in Adam Sandlers Hannukha song........Hey, how do you spell that holiday anyway? ;)

[duck]

The USS Enterprise is one big Kibbuz, and one to allow interracial relationships on top of it all. ;) Lucky to have the conservatve Klingons to balance all that liberal trash in the series. Now, are the Klingons pro-life or not?

[California Joe]

Yes, they are pro life but much like the Spartans they leave the lame and infirm infants to die on the crags of Mt. Graglachttt.

[StarvingStudent47]

I know. I heard it in Adam Sandlers Hannukha song........Hey, how do you spell that holiday anyway? ;)

It's spelled "Hanukkah," unless IDFM says it's spelled "Hanukkah," in which case it's spelled "Chanukkah."

Adam Sandler rocks.

[UkrainianAmerican]

I know. I heard it in Adam Sandlers Hannukha song........Hey, how do you spell that holiday anyway? ;)

It's spelled "Hanukkah," unless IDFM says it's spelled "Hanukkah," in which case it's spelled "Chanukkah."

Adam Sandler rocks.
RONG!
The RUSHN VEY RULEZ!
XAHYKA!

[Ichhabe]

Javehn asked:


Also , does Finnish sounds like Swedish ?


Some few words sound like Swedish.

Listening to the Finnish language is, well lets just say it: very difficult.

Belive it or not: The Swedish language is closer to Persian, spoken in Iran than to the Finnish language just across the border.

For me, the Finnish language sounds like a machine gun salvo. It is hard and effective. And it do works for them living in Finland. ;)