Islam : Questions and answers

[Aziz]

I came across these forums and found out many held misconceptions concerning Islam. so I decided to open this thread.

First of all

Islam =Quran + Sunnah(hadiths)

Muslims=follower of Islam

Islam=Muslims is not right.

If you ask an al-qaida agent why they are commiting such acts they will say something about the Israel-Palestinian conflict and the Crusades.Period.

anyways the Kill verses of the Quran.....

go here.

http://http://www.load-islam.com/c/rebuttals/Misquoted

and this contains an explanation of Jihad

http://www.load-islam.com/c/Islam/JihadExplanation


Jihad=Struggle(any type)
Mujahideen=strugglers(any type)

as for Islamic countries and violation of human rights I will start with KSA later not now.all I can is that there are uncorrupt and corrupt people everywhere.


last of all if you want to know how Muslims believe in evolution you can go to the following sites :

www.islamicboard.ocm (http://www.islamicboard.ocm)
www.whyislam.org/forum/default.asp (http://www.whyislam.org/forum/default.asp)


I admit there are people whop believe in conspiracy theories but I don't.Some people do but most Maulanas are irritating.
we don't hate Jews.the hatred currently existing is due to the political matters not religious.

if you wanna ask questions please do so.I am not here to force my religion on yopu or something or evangelize.I am just here to answer questions.

[Inquisitor]

Selam Alejkum Aziz I'm a muslim but don't believe hadiths are necessary for Islam so I would say Islam=Quran but anyways don't worry good thread anyway

[spale]

Hi there

I've got a quick question.
Please don't think I'm being ironic, I would just like your opinion.


Why 80% of the World's conflicts have had Muslims involved in them??

You sound like reasonable guy so I wonder what your view is.
I spoke to many guys on this and heard many different theories.

Anyway, if you do think this question is out of order, just please ignore it and rest of you guys if Aziz doesn't reply to it, PLEASE respect his decision.

Thanks

[annihilation]

I was wondering what your views are on Wassabi (sp?) or what it is called that is practiced by Saudi Arabia. How does that compare with mainstream islam, if there is a difference.

[One]

Spale its all a religious war no matter what anyone says. It all goes back to the crusades and those days.

annihilation, wassabi is japanese you mean wahabi. Here is a definition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahabism


Inquisitor you cannot have the Quran without the hadith. The hadith explains the quran. Thats why there are different sects because different people interpret the Quran differently. And the hadith gives more detail because it has examples from the Prophet.

[annihilation]

Thank you ....

[kineret]

the problem is not with moderate muslims. the problem lies with the fact that so many muslims believe the Kuran is a 'perfect' and literal word of Allah, and therefore adapting Islam to modern life is impossible. Which means a 10th century version of the Sharia, where stoning, slavery and other goofy and backwards quirks are perfectly accepted in modern society.

add to this, there are manny nutty Muslims who believe in a pipe dream called Caliphate, and the concept of Dar al Harb and Dar al Islam. So if you arent Muslim, tough titties for you because there will always be war until youre converted by choice or by force. So there you go, there's your religion of Peace.

[Aziz]

Why 80% of the World's conflicts have had Muslims involved in them??

You sound like reasonable guy so I wonder what your view is.
I spoke to many guys on this and heard many different theories.

okay you guys deserve an answer.poverty exist in Muslim countries due to corrupt leadership.There is high unemployment and most young muslim youths in their own countries are deprived of social powers.they lead miserable lives.
hence such young men can easily be recruited by terrorist leaders.Watch Syriana ,it explains a lot.

I was wondering what your views are on Wassabi (sp?) or what it is called that is practiced by Saudi Arabia. How does that compare with mainstream islam, if there is a difference.

actually no.Wahabbism as you ppl call it rather started out as a political movement than being a religious one.The official religion of KSA is Sunni Islam and the school of thought is Hanbali(most extreme).

the problem is not with moderate muslims. the problem lies with the fact that so many muslims believe the Kuran is a 'perfect' and literal word of Allah, and therefore adapting Islam to modern life is impossible. Which means a 10th century version of the Sharia, where stoning, slavery and other goofy and backwards quirks are perfectly accepted in modern society.


First of all Islamic civilizations were the best ones during those years.Everything was perfect.I believe the Quran is perfect.

now the stoning.

adultery is regarded as a crime a heinous crime but we just don't alleged adulterers to death.Those who want to bring charges have to provide four reliable witnesses to prove a crime has been commited.
There are no punishment for suspected adukltery (but KSA does it anyways,Islamic or not).
Saudi Arabia got the lowest crime rates in the world.I mean I got uncles living there and they said people go to pray in mosques leaving their shops open and nothing gets stolen.Murders(with the exception of terrorist attacks) are low.

Islam was supposed to end slavery.Slavery at that time of the Prophet saws was a common thing .Muhammad(PBUH) told us to treat slaves nicely and humanely and free them if they wish.People in some Muslim countries do the opposite.

In theory there are many Islamic countries.In practice there aren't any.

add to this, there are manny nutty Muslims who believe in a pipe dream called Caliphate, and the concept of Dar al Harb and Dar al Islam. So if you arent Muslim, tough titties for you because there will always be war until youre converted by choice or by force. So there you go, there's your religion of Peace.

Nutty Muslims as you call them ain't peaceful but Islam is a religion of peace.I have studied it and I damn well know it.

Muslims really don't commit adultery.Some women who get raped are accused of fornication.

[One]

Islam outlines the way of life regardless of time. Giving your wife half what you own upon divorce doesnt matter if its the 30th century or 2nd century. Who said anything about slavery? As for the calipha what is the pope? or what is the purpose of the grand rabbi?

Seriosuly if you just want to hate and be ignorant then dont post.

[speckfire]

Women rights in Islam as per Ghada Jawsheer

http://www.wa7id-13.com/women_rights_in_islam

[Turhapuro]

What is moderate muslim?

Moderate muslim is more serious about religion than moderate american. And in secular western Europe, moderate american is considered to be way too religious.

Dont shoot the messenger.

[Aziz]

www.load-islam.com
www.islamicboard.com

these sites are good.

[DE6]

Muslims really don't commit adultery.Some women who get raped are accused of fornication.

No offence to you and your religion, but I call BS on this one. Adultery is universal, and the condition of women in some muslim countries probably make it even easier for men.

[tuercas]

i have a question about the dietary restrictions for muslims. why is pork not allowed?

[annihilation]

i have a question about the dietary restrictions for muslims. why is pork not allowed?

I was told by a co-worker that is is because the pig is considered a dirty animal. It wallows in the mud and eats trash.

Muslims also don't think highly of the dog either. Which is sad considering they are man's best friend.

[annihilation]

I have one more question.

Why is it that most conflicts were islam is involved (in the movement), they are trying to create an Islamic state? It seems to me that Islam and policitics are too interconnected.

[kineret]

current global conflicts (Muslims vs. other faiths)


India - Pakistan (Kashmir)
South Phillipines (abu sayaf)
Indonesia - Bali and outer rim islands
Western China - muslim insurrections
Russia - Chechnia
Israel - Palestinians
Israel - Hezbollah
spread of al Qaeda, and copycat groups
North Africa - Darfur, Nigeria, Algeria, Libya

it seems there is a constant state of conflict between the muslim faith and all others.

[tuercas]

I was told by a co-worker that is is because the pig is considered a dirty animal. It wallows in the mud and eats trash.

Muslims also don't think highly of the dog either. Which is sad considering they are man's best friend.
i always tought that it was something similar to Kosher law where only animals that chew cud and have cloven hoofs may be eaten yet muslims may eat camel meat if prepared in a Halal manner even though the animal has toes , not hoofs.

i found an article on wikipedia where pork was characterised as unclean since they can wallow on their own filth but in a pinch may be eaten by muslims if nothing else is available.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_restrictions_on_the_consumption_of_pork

[Aziz]

dogs are allowed for some purposes though.

No offence to you and your religion, but I call BS on this one. Adultery is universal, and the condition of women in some muslim countries probably make it even easier for men.

sorry I wasn't elaborate but I meant that leadership in Muslim countries(not all) are usually corrupted.

[Aziz]

Why is it that most conflicts were islam is involved (in the movement), they are trying to create an Islamic state? It seems to me that Islam and policitics are too interconnected.

for power.yeah maybe.But its not that we bring Islam and politics together.Its that we live by religious laws.

current global conflicts (Muslims vs. other faiths)


India - Pakistan (Kashmir)
South Phillipines (abu sayaf)
Indonesia - Bali and outer rim islands
Western China - muslim insurrections
Russia - Chechnia
Israel - Palestinians
Israel - Hezbollah
spread of al Qaeda, and copycat groups
North Africa - Darfur, Nigeria, Algeria, Libya

it seems there is a constant state of conflict between the muslim faith and all others.

just becuz it involves Muslims doesn't mean Islam is responsible for it.I mean if a guy wears a flowing dress and sports a beard doesn't mean that guy is totally religious.its not Muslim faith vs Others.Its Muslims vs others.

[kineret]

for power.yeah maybe.But its not that we bring Islam and politics together.Its that we live by religious laws.



just becuz it involves Muslims doesn't mean Islam is responsible for it.I mean if a guy wears a flowing dress and sports a beard doesn't mean that guy is totally religious.its not Muslim faith vs Others.Its Muslims vs others.


Aziz, this makes no sense. Who are Muslims? People that follow the Muslim faith. What is faith? Its not a tangible thing, its a feeling, thought or actions by individuals. I think the problem with Islam, at least with Suni Islam, is that theres no central authority, so all the hadiths can be interpreted by any half wit sheik. In other religions you have a 'central' figure, Pope, Grand Ayatollah, Dalai Lama, etc, but here theres no figure to show the way so its very easy to distort Islam into an extremist, bloody and expansionist murder syndicate it has become at the hands of people like Zarkawi and Bin Laden.

[annihilation]

for power.yeah maybe.But its not that we bring Islam and politics together.Its that we live by religious laws.


Thanks for responding. Do these religious laws superceed a nation's law? What happened if there is a conflict?

[LazyLob]

....just becuz it involves Muslims doesn't mean Islam is responsible for it....


Which current conflicts involving Muslims does Islam not play a role?

[Apathy]

What is Gabriel's role in Islam?

[tsuri]

Does Islam allow Polygamy? (There was this turkish chicken farmer who offered his two wives instead of the infected chickens)

[kineret]

Does Islam allow Polygamy? (There was this turkish chicken farmer who offered his two wives instead of the infected chickens)


bin Laden has several wives himself. i think it depends on the strain of Islam. some cultures allow it some dont.

[One]

Does islam allow polygamy?

Yes. You can marry up to 4 wives if you can be equal among all of them, and if the wives allow you to. So before you marry the second you have to get the permission of the first. There are no other versions.


Why muslims dont eat pigs/dietary laws?

Pigs are considered unhealthy for the human body. Before you eat a cow, sheep whatever it has to be "butchered" and the blood drained. Cannot eat dead animals, and cannot kill birds that eat animals either (falcons, eagles, crows). If you are in an area where the only available food is pig then you will eat pig, if the only bird you see in the desert is an eagle and you have to eat it then you can eat it. Oh, no dogs, cats or pets.

Its not the dog thats dirty its their saliva. So dogs are okay as long as they dont lick you all over.


Gabriel
In Islam, Gabriel is the messenger angel. Gabriel talked to the Virgin Mary and told her about Jesus and Gabriel is the one that brought the words of God to Mohammed. Basicaly Gabriel was God's messenger to the prophets.


Muslims do not commit adultry?

Aziz I'm sorry bro but muslims are humans. Everyone commits adultry regarldess of race and religion. Its just that some people can control their urge more than others.

Which current conflicts involving Muslims does Islam not play a role?

The conflict in Palestine/Israel is not a muslim vs jews. There are christians, communists, atheists involved in it. The majority happens to be muslim yes thats true. The Israeli conflict is considered an arab conflict rather than a muslim one. If you want to go into details we could.

You mention other countries too. True there are muslims fighting there but it isnt the result of a Muslim uprising. They are independant groups funded by the same organization. Why was it okay for jews to call for an independant state (Israel), but its not okay for muslims to call for independance in chechneya?

Now lets look at who is supporting the wars in southeast asia, afghanistan, kashmir etc.. It all goes back to one ideology and one group. The ideology is salafi/wahabi and the group is al-qaeda. Maybe not alqaeda directly but people who share the same beliefs.

Every decade has its wars. The last 10 years was dominated by maybe the muslims rising up from oppression (in some countries), and the years before that muslims were not involved. They did not start WW1, WW2, Vietnam, Korea, they did not colonize half the world in the 20th and 19th century.

[LazyLob]

Which current conflicts involving Muslims does Islam not play a role?

My question is in the present tense.

The conflict in Palestine/Israel is not a muslim vs jews. There are christians, communists, atheists involved in it. The majority happens to be muslim yes thats true. The Israeli conflict is considered an arab conflict rather than a muslim one. If you want to go into details we could.

Why do Hamas want Seville? Does Saudi give money to this conflict? Why?

You mention other countries too. True there are muslims fighting there but it isnt the result of a Muslim uprising.

But does Islam play a role? Which conflicts?

They are independant groups funded by the same organization

Independent from who. Does that make any difference to my question?

Why was it okay for jews to call for an independant state (Israel), but its not okay for muslims to call for independance in chechneya?

Ibn al-Khattab, Shamil Basayev are both secular? Hmmmmmm. Does Saudi give money to this conflict? Why?

Now lets look at who is supporting the wars in southeast asia, afghanistan, kashmir etc.. It all goes back to one ideology and one group. The ideology is salafi/wahabi and the group is al-qaeda. Maybe not alqaeda directly but people who share the same beliefs.

Yet they believe they are true Muslims that will impose Islam on the rest of the world. They are also considered heroes by the majority of the Muslim world. So Islam does play a role.

Every decade has its wars. The last 10 years was dominated by maybe the muslims rising up from oppression (in some countries), and the years before that muslims were not involved. They did not start WW1, WW2, Vietnam, Korea, they did not colonize half the world in the 20th and 19th century.

Wooooaaah, hold onto your horses mate. You are prickly. No one accused the Muslims of starting WW1, WW2, Vietnam or Korea. Or is this your way of bending the needle on my BS meter?

But early Muslim expansion was very violent. These were, how shall I put it, Muslim “crusades” that killed and slaughtered. So, yes Islam did colonize by the sword but earlier starting in the 7th Century. Probably the world’s first large scale military expansion of an ideology or faith. You started going back in time not me.

For Aziz this period of time was “perfect” yet Europeans still get beaten about the head with the crusades. I cannot yet understand Aziz’s statement “....just becuz it involves Muslims doesn't mean Islam is responsible for it....”

I can understand Islam not being the cause or the reason for the Palestinian conflict, but that has now changed.

[Rebel 7]

Many people wonder why Islam allows multiple wives. Although it states clearly that God prefers one wife as the most suitable option, He allows multiple wives. Why? Back during the time when Islam was revealed, wars were fought by hands and primitive weapons and many men died (in the hundreds of thousands) in the battle. The result was a huge mess not just in terms of blood and guts but also in terms of the aftershocks to the society and especially the widows. Due to the conservative nature of societies back then, women didn't have as much rights and so could not seek out work and afford to earn a living for themselves and their children. Now, when the husband (who was a soldier/warrior) died on the battlefield, you didn't have have benefit packages and the like to give the wife (in addition to the fact that society made it hard for her to attain work and earn a living on her own), so she was pretty much left stranded to begging, prostitution and the like to earn a living. In order to counter this, Islam made clear that in such circumstances where wars lead to a high reduction in the ratio of men to women, that men would be allowed to have multiple wives but must seek permission from their first wife. This was to prevent a woman from having to resort to destroying her honour and dignity out of necessity to earn a living for herself and her children (ie. by resorting to prostitution and begging, etc.). In no way was this a nod by God that men are allowed to marry so they can have sex with more "legit" partners, etc. and God made this very clear by stating that men who marry multiple wives in order to satisfy their sexual appetities will be punished.

[Rebel 7]

When people ask questions like "Why does Islam play a role in every war a country with a Muslim government fights in?!"...it makes one wonder if they have really thought about their question. Why? Because everyone wants God on their side and religion is a powerful motivator and driving force (more so than nationalism at times). Whether their war is legit or not, religion and the government's constant spew of religious slogans (usually completely out of context) to justify themselves is an attempt to keep their Muslim population on THEIR OWN side.

One the first things any intelligent leader does is find something every or the majority of citizens in his country hold very sacred and share a common interest in. For many Muslim countries...this thing is religion. Now for the US and other countries with a highly dispersed group of citizens with varying backgrounds and faiths and some with no faith, nationalism is used. The key here is to find a driving force to keep your population on your side and motivated about going to war and winning. For Muslim countries and their governments who have a huge Muslim population, that driving force is religion (Islam). For countries that aren't in the same boat (ie. the US, European countries, etc.), that driving force is nationalism and words like "Justice," and "Freedom."

If you look at the Iraq-Iran war, Afghanistan's civial war, the sectarian violence in Pakistan, the violence against Shia Muslims in Iraq, all of these acts and the perpetrators of these acts use ISLAM to justify violence on MUSLIMS! Now, again in simple English, this does NOT mean that Islam endorses the killing of Muslims or any innocent person for that matter just because some moron with a turban, beard and a rusty AK gets up and yells "God is great" after shooting off a few rounds.

[Scottie]

current global conflicts (Muslims vs. other faiths)


India - Pakistan (Kashmir)
South Phillipines (abu sayaf)
Indonesia - Bali and outer rim islands
Western China - muslim insurrections
Russia - Chechnia
Israel - Palestinians
Israel - Hezbollah
spread of al Qaeda, and copycat groups
North Africa - Darfur, Nigeria, Algeria, Libya

it seems there is a constant state of conflict between the muslim faith and all others.

Well remember that many muslim countries lack proper education, low and poor education can lead to being persuaded to believe false accusations. The country I live in has got a good education and has a small population and has the second largest LNG wells in the world. The same goes for countries like Saudi, Oman, UAE...
I also beleive democracy plays a role, as we can see in the countries like iraq, iran, etc. Theocracy in iran. A strong religious based government can easily have an impact on the lower educated people, aswell as other classes.

And then you can get muslims living in countries that provide good education where they seem to prosper.

[One]

Lazylob i said that WW2, WW1 were NOT started by muslims. Each decade has its own wars and conflicts. It happens that this era is dominated by muslims. (I wasn't accusing you of anything, it was just a statement)

If you read my post those groups in chechneya, kashmir, indonesia etc.. are all supported by the same people. Yes they are saudis and saudi clerics you are correct I did not deny that. The reason is simple. The salafi sect of islam is spreading realy fast. And it happens that saudis are salafis and they have the money to open schools in those countries. So if you open a school, you educate the people a certain way they will do what you ask of them. The sect preaches realy violent methods such as killling anyone who isnt a muslim, and even killing muslims who are not in the same sect as you. And they have the extreme laws like wearing the burka, stoning, honor killing and all that. Is it the majority of the muslims? I dont think so.

Why do Hamas want Seville? Does Saudi give money to this conflict? Why?

Hamas is a muslim organization and they get funded by whoever wants to give them money and weapons. Do they want to turn palestine into an islamic state? Why do they fight under the muslim flag? Well, they share the same beliefs, ideology, and believe that at the end they will be rewarded, motiviation and simply because they want God on their side. Israelis pray to God before going to war, US soldeirs Pray to God before war its simply because God is a powerful and everyone wants to believe he is helping them not the other side.


PS: I'm not attacking anyone so please don't take my comments the wrong way. We're just having a discussion.

[One]

Forgot to mention the war in bosnia. Muslims were involved but they didnt start the war. They were being attacked.

[Esszett]

Cool, interesting thread.

@ Aziz:
You metioned that you studied Islam. Does that mean that you studied it at a religious school/ university?
And if you did, does that make you an Imam automatically?
It's kind of hard for me to understand the system/structure in a Muslim community since Islam lacks an official church. So how does one become a muslim cleric?

And yet another question: Is it true that there are no "official" translations of the Q'ran (,Koran, or whatever the spelling is in English)?
I heard that many muslims learn to recite certain important Surahs without knowing what they actually mean because they don't speak Arabic.

Thanks in andvance.

[shaheen]

For a Muslim to become an imam he has to be able to recite verses from the quran by heart to lead prayers and some ahadith

the reason Muslims and I mean Sunni Muslims don’t have a official imam or as you said official church is so that we can freely question the imams and debate with them in issues that concern us I use to be such a wise ass when I was in school with my Islamic teachers but they always gave me prove and assurance to what they said of what they said and second of all to have a grand ayatollah like the shia will only intimidate the followers from questioning the fatwa’s or teachings and they’ll follow what ever is said blindly
I hope that answers the Q

[Apathy]

Do you believe that God (Christian) and Allah are the same god?

[Esszett]

For a Muslim to become an imam he has to be able to recite verses from the quran by heart to lead prayers and some ahadith

Sorry, but could you elaborate a little further please?
I'm not too sure what "reciting verses from the quran by heart to lead prayers and some ahabith" means.
Does it mean he only has to be able to recite them or has he actually be able to interprete them and what they mean? And what kind of education is necessary?


the reason Muslims and I mean Sunni Muslims don’t have a official imam or as you said official church is so that we can freely question the imams and debate with them in issues that concern us I use to be such a wise ass when I was in school with my Islamic teachers but they always gave me prove and assurance to what they said of what they said and second of all to have a grand ayatollah like the shia will only intimidate the followers from questioning the fatwa’s or teachings and they’ll follow what ever is said blindly
I hope that answers the Q

Sounds logical to me. Thanks so far.
But this leads me to the following question: Is that the main difference between Sunni and Shi'ite Muslims or are there more differences?
I ask because this is kind of similar to Catholics and Protestants. Catholics believe in the Dogma of the Holy Church and (most) Protestants believe the Bible has to be interpreted by anyone himself, what was the reason why Luther translated the Bible (if I understand right; I am Catholic myself).

[Ayura]

Sorry, but could you elaborate a little further please?
I'm not too sure what "reciting verses from the quran by heart to lead prayers and some ahabith" means.
Does it mean he only has to be able to recite them or has he actually be able to interprete them and what they mean? And what kind of education is necessary?


Salam.

It means that in order to become an Imam, you have to know the Qu'ran and you know to know a certain amount of Hadith to become one. My local scholar knows about 3000 different Hadiths in total.


But this leads me to the following question: Is that the main difference between Sunni and Shi'ite Muslims or are there more differences?


The main difference is that Sunni's believe that the head of the Khalifah should be elected (a person fit for the job) whereas Shias believe it should be like a monachry, people who are in the same bloodline as Muhammad (pbuh).

Salam.

[Ayura]

Do you believe that God (Christian) and Allah are the same god?


Why did you emphasise the word "Allah." Arabic-speaking Christians use the word Allah and in the Arabic Bible, you find the word Allah instead of God.

[Don Pascual]

Does it mean he only has to be able to recite them or has he actually be able to interprete them and what they mean? And what kind of education is necessary?

To somebody be able to interpret correctly the koran and the sunnah, he must undergo some formal education at an islamic university. Is is similar to a law school: the kuran and the sunnah are like the constitution, and you also learn the proper way to interpret the laws.

[Don Pascual]

Do you believe that God (Christian) and Allah are the same god?

As Ayura replied, Allah is just the arabic word for God. But you probably is asking if, in essence, they are the same entity. Well, I dont know what christian clerics says, but most muslim think it is the same entity, unfortunately I dont have any fonts at the moment to try to explain this better (and my english also doesn't help...)

[Esszett]

Salam.

It means that in order to become an Imam, you have to know the Qu'ran and you know to know a certain amount of Hadith to become one. My local scholar knows about 3000 different Hadiths in total.



The main difference is that Sunni's believe that the head of the Khalifah should be elected (a person fit for the job) whereas Shias believe it should be like a monachry, people who are in the same bloodline as Muhammad (pbuh).

Salam.


Thanks very much (maybe more questions to come).

[Esszett]

To somebody be able to interpret correctly the koran and the sunnah, he must undergo some formal education at an islamic university. Is is similar to a law school: the kuran and the sunnah are like the constitution, and you also learn the proper way to interpret the laws.

Ah, ok, makes sense to me.
Also many thanks to you.

[Threelions]

current global conflicts (Muslims vs. other faiths)


India - Pakistan (Kashmir)
South Phillipines (abu sayaf)
Indonesia - Bali and outer rim islands
Western China - muslim insurrections
Russia - Chechnia
Israel - Palestinians
Israel - Hezbollah
spread of al Qaeda, and copycat groups
North Africa - Darfur, Nigeria, Algeria, Libya

it seems there is a constant state of conflict between the muslim faith and all others.

Im not a muslim, or a jew, or a christian, so i would hope my opinion would be quite unbiased.

I think you are mixing up many factors that dont belong together. The kashmir conflict is a national conflict, not a religious one. The other thing i have noticed in many of these "wars" you have listed is a constant factor of a minority group strggling for self determination. For instance the chechens, palestinians, Darfur, and the groups in china. These groups to me are using religion to strength their resolve in a guest to be their own nation.

Second, the earlier comment that muslims, or islam was involved in 80% of the worlds conflicts is utter garbage. In the context of individuals of a faith being involved in a conflict, then one could probably argue that 100% of conflicts are christian....

Further to that christians have probably been envolved in a far greater number of confliscts around the world, both in the name of christianity and be default of the people caught in those conflicts.

i do believe that Islam is a peacful religion, as i believe most religions are. However, people interpret old documents ina variety of ways, and this is mainly caused by subtle changes in the documents themselves, and in the understanding of a particular language. the outcome of this linguistic change over decades is that the original context can be totally lost.

The other factor that is leading you to beleieve that islam is not peaceful has everything to do with the economic conditions in which many of the Islamic nations dwell. Unfortunately poverty can bread hatred faster then any other factor. When one cant seem to better their situation they may need to find the reason behind it. this leads a person to find an enemy.

There are a tonne of factors at work, but at its root Islam is as violent as christianity or the jewish faith.

Cheers,
Paul

[Apathy]

[/I]

As Ayura replied, Allah is just the arabic word for God. But you probably is asking if, in essence, they are the same entity. Well, I dont know what christian clerics says, but most muslim think it is the same entity, unfortunately I dont have any fonts at the moment to try to explain this better (and my english also doesn't help...)

Thanks for the info.

[daily666]

I think the separation between Shia and Sunni is not the point in terms of violence. Look at Iraq, the Sunni are very violent and they are supported by AQ, while the Shia militias run by the Ayatollahs (Al-Sadr?) are as dangerous as the Sunni/AQ insurgency. As Threelions said some conflicts were not started on religous basis. That's what I wanted to point out. They turned into religious conflicts fuelled by the fight for autonomy/independence (Chechnya, Kashmir, Palestine). The extremist Islamic groups used the misery of the fighters to promote their way of Islam among the poor people from those places. That's why we see such people like Khattab in Chechnya or Al-Zarqawi in Iraq, that's why we see Iran sponsored Hamas in PA. And one more thing considering the influence of Imams. While I was in Egypt some people told me that fanatism and extremism is the fault of imams who preach their violent way of Islam (Egypt is a Sunni Islam country) and there is nobody to argue with them because people are so uneducated some are not even able to read. So what to argue about when their whole knowledge of Isalm is the knowledge given by (mostly) one imam.

[One]

For a Muslim to become an imam he has to be able to recite verses from the quran by heart to lead prayers and some ahadith

the reason Muslims and I mean Sunni Muslims don’t have a official imam or as you said official church is so that we can freely question the imams and debate with them in issues that concern us I use to be such a wise ass when I was in school with my Islamic teachers but they always gave me prove and assurance to what they said of what they said and second of all to have a grand ayatollah like the shia will only intimidate the followers from questioning the fatwa’s or teachings and they’ll follow what ever is said blindly
I hope that answers the Q


umm that is not true. Every mosque has an imam, and if you speak arabic you will know what the word imam means and if you have been to mosque you will also see an imam. Its islamic law to have an imam in every mosque. You say you cannot argue with the ayatollah? Heh shia fatwas are taken in councel not by 1 person. We have the "majlis il shia il aala" the high shia council for a reason. Shias dont have emirs. Where wahabis, salafis and what not all have emirs whose word is law and cannot be argued.


To become an imam you do not have to memorize the Quran. You have to learn Islamic Law, the Quran, hadith etc... You go to school for years and years.

Shias do not follow blindly infact shias are the most open minded out of all sects and have the most fiqh in islam. And dont forget that the teacher of all sunnis was a shiite. Imam Jaafer el Sadiq taught all the Imams that sunnis follow today.



The main difference is that Sunni's believe that the head of the Khalifah should be elected (a person fit for the job) whereas Shias believe it should be like a monachry, people who are in the same bloodline as Muhammad (pbuh).



No that is not true either. There is a difference in Imams. There is an imam in a mosque (pastor), there is the imam of a nation, etc..There are different words for each one. The 12 imams that are from mohammeds bloodline (according to shia) where supposed to become the leaders of the nation. Today there are no 12 imams (well actualy there is 1 left). So whoever is found fit to become the highest leader (Pope i guess) will be elected. But each country will have its own imam because each country has its own rules etc... So there is no central power anywhere.


See you are mixing up words that have more than one meaning and making them sound as if they were the same thing.

[Ayura]

umm that is not true. Every mosque has an imam, and if you speak arabic you will know what the word imam means and if you have been to mosque you will also see an imam. Its islamic law to have an imam in every mosque. You say you cannot argue with the ayatollah? Heh shia fatwas are taken in councel not by 1 person. We have the "majlis il shia il aala" the high shia council for a reason. Shias dont have emirs. Where wahabis, salafis and what not all have emirs whose word is law and cannot be argued.


To become an imam you do not have to memorize the Quran. You have to learn Islamic Law, the Quran, hadith etc... You go to school for years and years.

Shias do not follow blindly infact shias are the most open minded out of all sects and have the most fiqh in islam. And dont forget that the teacher of all sunnis was a shiite. Imam Jaafer el Sadiq taught all the Imams that sunnis follow today.




No that is not true either. There is a difference in Imams. There is an imam in a mosque (pastor), there is the imam of a nation, etc..There are different words for each one. The 12 imams that are from mohammeds bloodline (according to shia) where supposed to become the leaders of the nation. Today there are no 12 imams (well actualy there is 1 left). So whoever is found fit to become the highest leader (Pope i guess) will be elected. But each country will have its own imam because each country has its own rules etc... So there is no central power anywhere.


See you are mixing up words that have more than one meaning and making them sound as if they were the same thing.


I was just speaking from a basic standpoint :)

[Skeletor]

current global conflicts (Muslims vs. other faiths)


India - Pakistan (Kashmir)
South Phillipines (abu sayaf)
Indonesia - Bali and outer rim islands
Western China - muslim insurrections
Russia - Chechnia
Israel - Palestinians
Israel - Hezbollah
spread of al Qaeda, and copycat groups
North Africa - Darfur, Nigeria, Algeria, Libya

it seems there is a constant state of conflict between the muslim faith and all others.

Kashmir = Nationalist/independence struggle with religious undertones.
Chechyna = Nationalist/independence struggle with religious undertones.
Palestine = Nationalist/independence struggle with religious undertones.

Can't say I know much about the others but think of it this way. During the stand off between the Soviet Union and the US they would give aid to anyone who claimed to be on the same side, ie a nation says their democratic (even if they arn't really) the US gives them money or a nation says their Communist/Socialist they get money from the Soviets. Nationalist struggles in the developing world would either claim to be or become Comunist/Socialist in order to recieve weapons, money and advisors from the Soviet Union. With the collapse of the Soviet Union this is no longer possible. Now Nationalist struggles within Muslim nations can ask for aid from the Saudi Wahhabi establishment. If granted this it opens the door for the spread of Wahhabi into the conflict and thus the conflict becomes a religious conflict as it is distorted.

[shaheen]

When I say imam I mean the one who leads prayers which any one can do all you need to know is some and I emphasize on the word some quaranic verses some times I would lead prayers and I never went to an Islamic school

As for ppl who issue fatwa’s well that’s another case

Salafis and wahabis and me being one I can assure you we don’t have emirs who we must follow blindly that is only in a case of war even then we are obliged to follow a leader who has the most military and combat experience even if he wasn’t such a good Muslim but can still give a victory

As for jafar al sadeq he was a Sunni and we can argue for ever but no need to go any further

And I thought shia didn’t follow the same ahadith books as Sunnis

As for me saying that Shia follow there imams blindly is from a personal experience

[One]

shaheen bro Jaafer al sadiq is the 6th Imam from the bloodline. Wether he is a shia or sunni to me it makes no difference we are all muslims. But he was the teacher of all the sunni scholars. Oh and by the way ali is not God nor my prophet just incase no one cleared that misconception.

Imam Ali Al-Murtatha(as)
Imam Hassan Al-Mujtaba(as)
Imam Hussein Al-Shaheed(as)
Imam Zain Al-Abdeen Al-Shujjad(as)
Imam Mohammed Al-Bakir(as)
Imam Jaffar Al-Sadiq(as)
Imam Musa Al-Kathum(as)
Imam Ali Al-Reda(as)
Imam Mohammed Al-Jawad(as)
Imam Ali Al-Hadi(as)
Imam Hassan Al-Askari(as)
Imam Mehdi Al-Muntadar(as)


And I thought shia didn’t follow the same ahadith books as Sunnis



Why not? It's not like they made up their own version. A hadith is a hadith they were written years before sunnis and shias.


Shaheen, are you a salafi?

[shaheen]

A salafi follows the four imam’s al hanbli, al hanfei, al malaki, al shafi

So yes I consider myself a salafi im not a radical to any of the four imams school cause there only humans who make mistakes

A hadith can be weak or strong depending on the guy who narrated it and the repeatability of it

A Shia friend of mine told me that they don’t follow the ahadith that were narrated from al bukhari and you know he’s one of the pillars of narrators

[Don Pascual]

Like the sunnis, the shia have different schools too. The school that the brother One mentioned is the most popular, the school of the twelve imans (don't know the proper name, but I supouse it is the jaffariaa school). Other schools have a diferent number of imans, and even differ from who are those imans. For example, there are the zaidi, who belive there was only 4 imans (Ali, Husain, Zain and Zaid), the Ismailis (Hasan, Husain, zain, al-Baqir, Jafar, Ismail, Muhammad al-Mahdi), the nizari (that follow the ismaili succecion line, but these line isn't stoped with iman al-Mahdi and continue until today).
The sunnis had a large number of imans, but while time was passing by, the minor schools had been aggregated by the 4 largest schools, that are:
*The hanafi school: founded by iman Abu Hanifa. It is the most liberal school, giving much credit to logical and personal interpretation of the koran and the sunna.
*The maliki school: founded by iman al-Malik.It gives much credit to the called "pratice of Medina", because iman Malik tought that, as the Profet Muhammad have lived and preached mostly in Medina, thair citizens were closest to the true teachings than any others. It is a moderate school.
*The shafi achool: founded by iman Shafi. It gives much credit to what the sunnah and the koran says, using personal interpretation and logic as the last resource, when there is no hadith or versicle in the koran to guide us in some subject. It is and conservative school.
*The hanbali school: Founded by iman Ibn Hanbal. It despises the personal interpretations and the annalitic analisis and logic to interpret the koran and the sunnah, reliyng only in the holy scriptures. Is the most conservative school.
I i did some mistake, please correct me.

[Andreas]

Religion is the root to most evil in the world.

I dont belive in anything peticular, if some higher power created us, well goody. But I dont realy care. I live a good life, with no pressure to follow any other rules than the basic laws of my comunity/Country.

Seriously, I feel realy free in comparison with people who have any form of religion in their life...

[Ayura]

Religion is the root to most evil in the world.

I dont belive in anything peticular, if some higher power created us, well goody. But I dont realy care. I live a good life, with no pressure to follow any other rules than the basic laws of my comunity/Country.

Seriously, I feel realy free in comparison with people who have any form of religion in their life...


So, people like me are just mindless prisoners? Pseudo-intellectual zombies?

I ask you, do you go to work? College? Pay taxes? Free to massacre without fear of punishment? Fly?

Do some thinking and ponder upon the notion "free".

Also, you state, that "religion is the root to most evil in the world." What about the passion of land ownership? Have secular idealogies been free from war?

I'm glad you lead a good life, keep doing so. But hypocracy is evil. Ponder.



...And a happy Salam to you :)

[Clearday-TRForce]

Why 80% of the World's conflicts have had Muslims involved in them??

Not one reason,many reasons;

-Yes and Muslims involved with other relegion members in conflicts? it is the other side of money.
-Yes coz Muslims dont have enough ability to understand Islam except
Turkey.
-Yes coz Muslims are living on petrol sources. Welfare.




regards,
CDTRF

[Saranof]

So, people like me are just mindless prisoners? Pseudo-intellectual zombies?

I ask you, do you go to work? College? Pay taxes? Free to massacre without fear of punishment? Fly?

Do some thinking and ponder upon the notion "free".

Also, you state, that "religion is the root to most evil in the world." What about the passion of land ownership? Have secular idealogies been free from war?

I'm glad you lead a good life, keep doing so. But hypocracy is evil. Ponder.



...And a happy Salam to you :)


I think what he means is that he is free in the sense that he can do things deemed "immoral" by your and other religions, and not be afraid of some god poking him in the arse with flames for it.

[Ameen]

Muslims dont have enough ability to understand Islam except
Turkey.


You have to be kidding me? I don't even know if I should reply to that comment.

[Andreas]

I think what he means is that he is free in the sense that he can do things deemed "immoral" by your and other religions, and not be afraid of some god poking him in the arse with flames for it.

Thats correct.
May I also add that I am tollorant towards other religions. People should be free to belive what they want, but strictly speaking for myself I feel free in comparison with the way I see many people are living their lives all ower the world.
Be it, Super christian Americans, or Muslims or Jews.
I dont realy care what they belive, or how they live their lives.
Im just stating that for my part I feel free in comparison..

Cheers
Andreas

[RBIH_Troop]

I have one more question.

Why is it that most conflicts were islam is involved (in the movement), they are trying to create an Islamic state? It seems to me that Islam and policitics are too interconnected.

No my friend. All of that is lie's. Remember what people said about Bosnia? That Bosnia would become a Fundamentalist state. Turn's out that Bosnia today is extremly Democratic. And all Wahabie's living in Bosnia have no problem with that if you ask me.

[RBIH_Troop]

current global conflicts (Muslims vs. other faiths)


India - Pakistan (Kashmir)
South Phillipines (abu sayaf)
Indonesia - Bali and outer rim islands
Western China - muslim insurrections
Russia - Chechnia
Israel - Palestinians
Israel - Hezbollah
spread of al Qaeda, and copycat groups
North Africa - Darfur, Nigeria, Algeria, Libya

it seems there is a constant state of conflict between the muslim faith and all others.


Well offcoure there will be alot of conflict's in muslim state's. I mean Islam is a huge religion which many nation's follow. But some not all of those conflict's are not started by muslim's but by invasion's by other countries.

[RBIH_Troop]

Forgot to mention the war in bosnia. Muslims were involved but they didnt start the war. They were being attacked.

Exactly. Same goes for many other Muslim nation's involved in war.

[Esszett]

No my friend. All of that is lie's. Remember what people said about Bosnia? That Bosnia would become a Fundamentalist state. Turn's out that Bosnia today is extremly Democratic. And all Wahabie's living in Bosnia have no problem with that if you ask me.

There are Wahabies in Bosnia? Is that the traditional "orientation" of the Bosnian Muslims?
Or did they become Wahabies after the Saudis built so much mosques in Bosnia?
I have to say that from all Muslims the Wahabies are the only ones I am really concerned about since they seem to be very extremist.
I know they will say that they are peaceful and tolerant and stuff but I don't really believe them when I look at Saudi Arabia.

[RBIH_Troop]

Aziz, this makes no sense. Who are Muslims? People that follow the Muslim faith. What is faith? Its not a tangible thing, its a feeling, thought or actions by individuals. I think the problem with Islam, at least with Suni Islam, is that theres no central authority, so all the hadiths can be interpreted by any half wit sheik. In other religions you have a 'central' figure, Pope, Grand Ayatollah, Dalai Lama, etc, but here theres no figure to show the way so its very easy to distort Islam into an extremist, bloody and expansionist murder syndicate it has become at the hands of people like Zarkawi and Bin Laden.

Bin Laden nor Zarqawi have the power to turn Islam into something it is not. When bad people like that Jewish religious man who commited that shooting in the mosque somewhat year's ago, nobody has the right to say that he turned Judaism into something bad. After all he is one person out of many other good Jewish people. The same goes for OBL and Zarqawi.

[RBIH_Troop]

There are Wahabies in Bosnia? Is that the traditional "orientation" of the Bosnian Muslims?
Or did they become Wahabies after the Saudis built so much mosques in Bosnia?
I have to say that from all Muslims the Wahabies are the only ones I am really concerned about since they seem to be very extremist.
I know they will say that they are peaceful and tolerant and stuff but I don't really believe them when I look at Saudi Arabia.

No. Nearly all Bosnian's are VERY modern. Bosnian muslim's are not known to be religious. But there are wahabie's living in Bosnia who just want to live a peaceful life. Many of them go to Saudi Mosque's like the Mosque which was named after Fahd. But the Wahabie's respect the Bosnian Democratic government. And many of them feel quite welcomed in Bosnia. The Wahabie's really don't mind living in a very modern nation. They just choose their own way of following Islam and I don't really mind them.

[RBIH_Troop]

It's good to explain Islam to people who are confused at such time's. Thank's for the thread Aziz!

[Ayura]

It's good to explain Islam to people who are confused at such time's. Thank's for the thread Aziz!


I said it before, I'll say it again.


Co-operation breeds progression. Competition breeds regression.


Salam :)

[Dervish]

shaheen bro Jaafer al sadiq is the 6th Imam from the bloodline. Wether he is a shia or sunni to me it makes no difference we are all muslims. But he was the teacher of all the sunni scholars. Oh and by the way ali is not God nor my prophet just incase no one cleared that misconception.

Imam Ali Al-Murtatha(as)
Imam Hassan Al-Mujtaba(as)
Imam Hussein Al-Shaheed(as)
Imam Zain Al-Abdeen Al-Shujjad(as)
Imam Mohammed Al-Bakir(as)
Imam Jaffar Al-Sadiq(as)
Imam Musa Al-Kathum(as)
Imam Ali Al-Reda(as)
Imam Mohammed Al-Jawad(as)
Imam Ali Al-Hadi(as)
Imam Hassan Al-Askari(as)
Imam Mehdi Al-Muntadar(as)

This 12 imams are the leader of awliya of there time.
They are from prophets blood. Ahl al bayt are special.

Imam Jaffar Al Sadiq (as) has a higher maqam than Imam Shafii, Maliki, Hanbali, Hanafi.

Imam Shafii say "visiting Imams Jaffar Al Sadiq maqam is attiriyak al mujarab"
(grave) (medicine experience)
------------------
I am Sunni ;)
------------------
Not everybody with beard and hijab fear Allah and walk straight path.

[Aziz]

I have studied Islam from Islamic sources.I have studied the Quran and some hadiths ,Islamic jurispundence.Mostly from the internet and other books written by Islamic scholars.In modern times we don't need to go to Madrasas to learn about Islam.when we are about 7 or 6 we have Maulanas teach us the Suras of the Quran,teach us how to pray and also how to read Arabic.Somehow all Muslim kids in Muslim countries are taught by Madrasa mullahs.

Learning about Islam means receiving the knowledge and the message it doesn't matter who you learn from.It matters whether you get the true message or not.

Not everybody with beard and hijab fear Allah and walk straight path.

That is something everyone should know.

[derkrieger]

This 12 imams are the leader of awliya of there time.
They are from prophets blood. Ahl al bayt are special.

Imam Jaffar Al Sadiq (as) has a higher maqam than Imam Shafii, Maliki, Hanbali, Hanafi.

Imam Shafii say "visiting Imams Jaffar Al Sadiq maqam is attiriyak al mujarab"
(grave) (medicine experience)
------------------
I am Sunni ;)
------------------
Not everybody with beard and hijab fear Allah and walk straight path.
There is no such thing as 12 Imams ( as an institution) in Quran, this is BS and man-made. You can not show me even one reliable proof of that stemming from trustworthy 1st degree source.
That said these people are real scholars and practitioners, who left thousands of pages of top-brass scientific research in Islam-related affairs. The (religious-scholastic) leadership positions of these individuals are beyond reasonable doubt, though. No hard feelings I hope.

[Vivelamorte]

There is no such thing as 12 Imams ( as an institution) in Quran, this is BS and man-made. You can not show me even one reliable proof of that stemming from trustworthy 1st degree source.
That said these people are real scholars and practitioners, who left thousands of pages of top-brass scientific research in Islam-related affairs. The (religious-scholastic) leadership positions of these individuals are beyond reasonable doubt, though. No hard feelings I hope.

No, not in Quran, but in Shi'itism, if I got it right. According to my material, it is indeed manmade.

[derkrieger]

in der Tat !!
How could we- mortal humans- know that someone has a higher maqam (position, I would say) than another one. Who is better and worse, only God knows that and will so decide on the judgment day.

[derkrieger]

I have some Q's on my learned friends, especially regarding laws of war in Islam, being myself devoid of relevant info..
1) Is it allowed to kill -intentionally and directly- civilians and children in battle?
2) How should we, the western World, see these suicide attacks? is it sthg political or sthg. religious? does Islam allow and/or encourage such suicide-attacks?
thanks

[Ayura]

I have some Q's on my learned friends, especially regarding laws of war in Islam, being myself devoid of relevant info..
1) Is it allowed to kill -intentionally and directly- civilians and children in battle?
2) How should we, the western World, see these suicide attacks? is it sthg political or sthg. religious? does Islam allow and/or encourage such suicide-attacks?
thanks


Salam Derkrieger, thank you for your questions :)

1. No, it isn't allowed to intentionally kill and direct attack civilians and children in battle.

Relavent quotes taken from the Noble Qu'ran and Hadith:

If any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people. - Quran 5:32

"You are neither hard-hearted nor of fierce character, nor one who shouts in the markets. You do not return evil for evil, but excuse and forgive." - Hadith Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 362

"Do not kill any old person, any child or any woman" (Hadith Abu Dawud).


You may find this next quote to be vey interesting:

Speech by Abu Bakr, Mohammed's closest friend and first successor, to an Islamic army set out for Syria: "Stop, O people, that I may give you ten rules for your guidance in the battlefield. Do not commit treachery or deviate from the right path. You must not mutilate dead bodies. Neither kill a child, nor a woman, nor an aged man. Bring no harm to the trees, nor burn them with fire, especially those which are fruitful. Slay not any of the enemy's flock, save for your food. You are likely to pass by people who have devoted their lives to monastic services; leave them alone."


2. Suicide is forbidden (Haram) and is one of the worst crimes in Islam. However, there is a huge mix up between Martydom (honourable death) and Suicide Bombing (non-honourable). Martydom is 'death' in rightous and justifiable combat. An example is during Prophet Muhammad's (pbuh) time, some of the Sahabah (people who lived and saw the prophet) who would fight in war would get stabbed by the opponants spear and the Sahabah would carry on walking through the spear to reach their opponant. This is honourable. Suicide bombing market places full of innocent people isn't.


I hope I have answered your questions, if you have anymore feel free to ask :)

Salam.