Task Force 121 to Afghanistan/Pakistan

[MetalBoy]

http://www.washtimes.com/national/20040223-012312-3087r.htm

The Pentagon is moving elements of a supersecret commando unit from Iraq to the Afghanistan theater to step up the hunt for Osama bin Laden.
A Defense Department official said there are two reasons for repositioning parts of Task Force 121: First, most high-value human targets in Iraq, including Saddam Hussein, have been caught or killed. Second, intelligence reports are increasing on the whereabouts of bin Laden, the terror leader behind the September 11 attacks.
"Iraq has become more of a policing problem than a hunt for high-value Iraqis," the defense official said. "Afghanistan is the place where 121 can do more."
Task forces typically change names when they move, so it is likely that the commando unit arriving in the Afghanistan-Pakistan region will take a new name.
Task Force 121 is a mix of Army Delta Force soldiers and Navy SEALs, transported on helicopters from the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment. The SEALs and soldiers are based at Joint Special Operations Command in Fort Bragg, N.C.
Delta-SEAL teams typically move into theater, practice missions and wait for military and CIA intelligence to provide the location of a target, such as Saddam.
The new task force to hunt bin Laden in the Afghanistan area likely will be led by a Navy SEAL who was toasted in Washington while working antiterrorism issues in the Bush administration. The Washington Times is withholding his name because of the secret nature of the operation.
Military sources said reports of bin Laden's movements are becoming more numerous as the fugitive Saudi, leader of the al Qaeda terrorist network, hides in the mountainous terrain straddling the Afghanistan-Pakistan border.
"They're getting better intelligence, and they've gotten better at fusing the intelligence," a second defense source said.
A CIA-military intelligence team conducted a similar operation in Iraq to catch Saddam. Officers made a schematic of family members and Ba'athist officials close to Saddam and questioned them on his whereabouts. The team hit pay dirt when a recently detained Iraqi revealed precise information on the ousted dictator's whereabouts on a farm south of Tikrit.
Task Force 121 joined a 4th Infantry Division unit Dec. 13 in raiding the farm and finding Saddam hidden in a hole.
The commando task force took Saddam to Tikrit in a Special Operations "Little Bird" helicopter before he was imprisoned in the Baghdad area.
Speculation that the United States is close to finding bin Laden heightened last month when military officers in Afghanistan predicted that the terror leader would be killed or captured by year's end.
"We have a variety of intelligence, and we're sure we're going to catch Osama bin Laden and [Taliban leader] Mullah [Mohammed] Omar this year," Army Lt. Col. Bryan Hilferty, spokesman for U.S. forces in Afghanistan, said in January. "We've learned lessons from Iraq, and we're getting improved intelligence from the Afghan people."
A few days earlier, Lt. Gen. David Barno, the top U.S. commander in Afghanistan, told the BBC: "You can be assured that we're putting a renewed emphasis on closing this out and bringing these two individuals to justice, as well as the other senior leadership of that organization. They represent a threat to the entire world, and they need to be destroyed."
Bin Laden is thought to be in the lawless tribal areas along the Pakistan-Afghanistan border. Officials say U.S. troops do not cross into Pakistan, leaving the hunt on the ground for bin Laden to the CIA and the Pakistan army.
But specific intelligence on bin Laden's whereabouts might prompt the use of a Delta-SEAL task force to raid his Pakistan hide-out, officials say.
Gen. John Abizaid, chief of U.S. Central Command, recently praised Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf's willingness to send troops into unfriendly tribal areas, where bin Laden reportedly is popular.
"I talk to him frequently," Gen. Abizaid said of Gen. Musharraf. "I just visited him the other day. I saw him after one of two assassination attempts. He knows that al Qaeda is trying to kill him, and he absolutely, positively wants to get the problem under control.
"But there are difficulties that he has that are associated with working in the tribal areas that he has to work through on his own," Gen. Abizaid said. Cool Beanshttp://www.TheForumz.com/images/icon_page/014.gif

[Nizark]

So what makes the delta-seal team so special? Besides being SOF operators, does the combined forces create a new diamention to TF 121?

[Argyll]

Hardly supersecret either by posting it's movements in a newspaper,talk about OPSEC ............yeah right :backhand:

[hood]

It'll all make a bad Chuck Norris made-for-tv movie some day. Unlike Saddam's capture though I don't think the next time (Bin Laden) will be as publicly viewable. We'll probably just see the video that the DoD puts out from the helmet cams which won't be much.

[Argyll]

It'll all make a bad Chuck Norris made-for-tv movie some day. Unlike Saddam's capture though I don't think the next time (Bin Laden) will be as publicly viewable. We'll probably just see the video that the DoD puts out from the helmet cams which won't be much.


Interesting thoughts there Hood!
Have you wondered why there were no helmet cams used in Saddams capture,considering he was HV1 target,yet they used helmet cams on the Dam raid and also the Lynch rescue?

[scm77]

I think that if they capture bin laden he will be MORE viewable. This is the guy who was responsible for the deaths of 3000 people. Americans aren't just going to settle for a video of him being checked for fleas.

Saddam is going to get a trial in Iraq. I think if they capture Bin Laden they should have a trial in New York, but I doubt that would ever happen.

[Argyll]

I think that if they capture bin laden he will be MORE viewable. This is the guy who was responsible for the deaths of 3000 people. Americans aren't just going to settle for a video of him being checked for fleas.

Saddam is going to get a trial in Iraq. I think if they capture Bin Laden they should have a trial in New York, but I doubt that would ever happen.


Will a trial make any difference?he's going to be put to death anyway.
same as Saddam,rather than waste Millions of Dollars on Security for a trial,that the outcome is obvious before it gets that far?
I'd rather spend .50 cents on a 9mm round,to do a job that could cost Millions of taxpayers money

[vward]

Who needs Task Force 121 when the British SAS will do the job with far fewer men and less ballyhoo. Hell, they may have already captured him if the rumours circulating have it right. Check Google News!

[Sir Zach of R.]

Ahahahahaa. Get a life. I don't really give a damn about who catches him, just as long as that bastard burns in hell. Does it really matter who catches him? CIA, CAG, Devgru, SEALs, SAS, bla bla, 82nd A. Who really gives a f***? :bash:

[crazyman]

if we ever do catch bin laden, i'd love to bring him here to NYC. can't say he stands much chance of living long enough in the city to make it to court though

[obd]

Argyl, I have a feeling things are "released" to the press for a reason. they may be trying to drum up terrorist "chatter" or get Bin Laden to change position if he fears we know where he is or have narrowed his position. ITs a pretty standard tactic to try to fluch someone out. In fact, the very fact that we say "We know where he is and we are going to get him" may mean we know little and are tryging this tactic to get him to move and thus become more expossed to attack. Just a thought Argyl. Im not saying I know, but iIm just trying to say that's possible at least............

Also we may really know where he is and have him boxed into a specific are and we may need him to move around a bit to see him and pinpoint him for a strike. We may be trying to expose his supporters who will no doubt be talking. Remmember, this will be important to the terror world and those who think we arnt focused on them may talk a little too openly about it and thus be expossed themselves. This isnt all about Osama. He isnt really the "terror mastermind", his underlings were. What makes him a value is his figurehead status, his money, and his truly remarkable ability to organize disparate groups of terrorists.

By the way, one foiled plot was to fly a plane into Big Ben and the Eifel Tower. You hear any knows on that in Britain???

[Argyll]

Thats right,I forgot that OBL gets his "Sunday Express" delivered to him personally by the editor.
It is not a standard tactic to give out information as to the whereabouts and composition of Special Forces units,that is called compromising the Operation

Considering his followers will no doubt have passed on the info that his mobile phone calls and radio messages are being "listened into "I don't think he that stupid to use them,considering this was splashed allover the net

[shrek]

He "does" still use his cell/satcom phones. They code everything, use common everyday conversations to pass info and yes they know that we are listening to it all. They have no choice!! Word of mouth doesn't work in that part of the world.

It "is" a common tactic to broadcast reports that SpecOp units are moving to try and increase chatter or make someone nervous and move. Just remember, there are a hundred other times when that unit moves that you don't hear about. Or perhaps they're not moving at all, perhaps they don't really exist in the form that is broadcast. How are we to know the levels of deception used? Have any of you ever seen Task Force 11/16 or any other?

Just thought yall would like to know!!

later

[Argyll]

He "does" still use his cell/satcom phones. They code everything, use common everyday conversations to pass info and yes they know that we are listening to it all. They have no choice!! Word of mouth doesn't work in that part of the world.

It "is" a common tactic to broadcast reports that SpecOp units are moving to try and increase chatter or make someone nervous and move. Just remember, there are a hundred other times when that unit moves that you don't hear about. Or perhaps they're not moving at all, perhaps they don't really exist in the form that is broadcast. How are we to know the levels of deception used? Have any of you ever seen Task Force 11/16 or any other?

Just thought yall would like to know!!



later

Thanks for that Shrek,I know your background ;) I guess it's Just the Good old Brits who don't broadcast the locations of their SF for the reasons I mentioned above ;)

[NcDeuce]

He "does" still use his cell/satcom phones. They code everything, use common everyday conversations to pass info and yes they know that we are listening to it all. They have no choice!! Word of mouth doesn't work in that part of the world.

It "is" a common tactic to broadcast reports that SpecOp units are moving to try and increase chatter or make someone nervous and move. Just remember, there are a hundred other times when that unit moves that you don't hear about. Or perhaps they're not moving at all, perhaps they don't really exist in the form that is broadcast. How are we to know the levels of deception used? Have any of you ever seen Task Force 11/16 or any other?


^ Word

[shrek]

Argyll,

What's your background (just ballpark). From reading some of your stuff you sound like a man that "knows".


p.s. No sarcasm here, I have served with SAS units from Brit and Aus and have the utmost respect for them all. Their training methods far surpass ours in several areas as does ours theirs in some cases. We have tried in the past to get together and share info but the Red tape is so long you'll retire before it happens. When we were over, the SEALs (Sleep Eat And Lift wts) would go on about two missions a month, We would go on about 4 to 6. The SAS boys, (no ****) would go out and stay for two weeks at a time and get helicopter resupplies to sustain. Talk about ballsosteel! One note though, the Aussie guys, man did they need to learn to shower occasionally.

later

De O P

[Argyll]

PM on its way

[sethen]

It'll all make a bad Chuck Norris made-for-tv movie some day. Unlike Saddam's capture though I don't think the next time (Bin Laden) will be as publicly viewable. We'll probably just see the video that the DoD puts out from the helmet cams which won't be much.


Interesting thoughts there Hood!
Have you wondered why there were no helmet cams used in Saddams capture,considering he was HV1 target,yet they used helmet cams on the Dam raid and also the Lynch rescue?

Argyll>>> From what I have gathered th SF didn't catch Saddam! It was just plain straight leg 4TH I.D. infantry, hence no fancy cams on helmets or pics of troops with high speed gear!

[NcDeuce]

It'll all make a bad Chuck Norris made-for-tv movie some day. Unlike Saddam's capture though I don't think the next time (Bin Laden) will be as publicly viewable. We'll probably just see the video that the DoD puts out from the helmet cams which won't be much.


Interesting thoughts there Hood!
Have you wondered why there were no helmet cams used in Saddams capture,considering he was HV1 target,yet they used helmet cams on the Dam raid and also the Lynch rescue?

Argyll>>> From what I have gathered th SF didn't catch Saddam! It was just plain straight leg 4TH I.D. infantry, hence no fancy cams on helmets or pics of troops with high speed gear!

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/operation_red_dawn/acf.jpg

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/operation_red_dawn/abz.jpg

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/operation_red_dawn/aca.sized.jpg

4th ID in the last image. They weren't the only ones involved though, as you can see in the first two images.

[Argyll]

It'll all make a bad Chuck Norris made-for-tv movie some day. Unlike Saddam's capture though I don't think the next time (Bin Laden) will be as publicly viewable. We'll probably just see the video that the DoD puts out from the helmet cams which won't be much.


Interesting thoughts there Hood!
Have you wondered why there were no helmet cams used in Saddams capture,considering he was HV1 target,yet they used helmet cams on the Dam raid and also the Lynch rescue?

Argyll>>> From what I have gathered th SF didn't catch Saddam! It was just plain straight leg 4TH I.D. infantry, hence no fancy cams on helmets or pics of troops with high speed gear!


Trust me on this,there were other's involved on this Op. ;)

[usa320]

Who needs Task Force 121 when the British SAS will do the job with far fewer men and less ballyhoo. Hell, they may have already captured him if the rumours circulating have it right. Check Google News!

Task Force 121 does have SAS members.

Its comprised of the best from Delta, Devgru, SAS, SASR and more than likely coordinates with CIA SOG teams...

I think it makes sense to send these guys to Afghanistan. They did an AWESOME job in Iraq capturing the head honcho and killing the sons... Hopefully tehy use what they learned there to clean up in Afghanistan.

for the first time in a while i think Bin Laden is within our reach.

[Argyll]

Who needs Task Force 121 when the British SAS will do the job with far fewer men and less ballyhoo. Hell, they may have already captured him if the rumours circulating have it right. Check Google News!

Task Force 121 does have SAS members.

Its comprised of the best from Delta, Devgru, SAS, SASR and more than likely coordinates with CIA SOG teams...

I think it makes sense to send these guys to Afghanistan. They did an AWESOME job in Iraq capturing the head honcho and killing the sons... Hopefully tehy use what they learned there to clean up in Afghanistan.

for the first time in a while i think Bin Laden is within our reach.



Damn 320 I couldn't have said it better myself ;)

[shrek]

Just look at the short video they released of the hole he was hiding in. Notice the boots that the guy making the video is wearing when he looks down with the camera, If i'm not mistaken they're Vasque (sp?) which are one of the most popular among SF operators. Not allowed among the INF DIV's guys, unfortunately!!

[ibstolidude]

Or perhaps they're not moving at all, perhaps they don't really exist in the form that is broadcast. How are we to know the levels of deception used? Have any of you ever seen Task Force 11/16 or any other? What are you trying to say?

Just thought yall would like to know!!

later

[shrek]

What I'm trying to say is that during a war, deception is probably the most often used and poorly understood tool used. You don't have to be there, just make them think you're going to be there. If the enemy moves because of a comment made about a unit of ours moving, they expose themselves to prying eyes, they use expendable resources that have to be replaced and they chatter like teenage girls on the airwaves. Must we actually move or even have the unit that we said we were going to move into place, hell no! If you let it into the open that your unit is going somewhere, but instead covertly go somewhere else, you are essentially and somewhat tactically in two places at once.
Example: A common ploy that we used on several occasions in a certain part of the world was to send a messenger ahead to tell the townspeople to have local food prepared for our arrival and stay. This would get the town buzzing and of course eventually filter down to the tangos. Who, would subsequently stop operating in the area or leave altogether. You guessed it, we weren’t going anywhere near that town anytime soon, however, the team sitting snugly in the hills above it listening and watching now knew the five W’s of that whole valley. The scene played out in front of their eyes like a movie set. Vehicles leave town not to return, food delivery increases to areas outside of town, etc. Why? Because we simply let it be known that our super secret squirrel team was coming their way.
The terrorist of this world use deception every day that effects our very lives. Must they attack America? Hell no! All they have to do is “say” and let it into the open that they’re going to attack America. What do we do, cancel flights, increase security, slow our people down and spend money we don’t have, therefore affecting our lives and our economy in the worst of ways. Why? Not because they bombed another building, no, simply because they said that they were going to bomb another building. Deception complete!

[ibstolidude]

What I'm trying to say is that during a war, deception is probably the most often used and poorly understood tool used. You don't have to be there, just make them think you're going to be there. If the enemy moves because of a comment made about a unit of ours moving, they expose themselves to prying eyes, they use expendable resources that have to be replaced and they chatter like teenage girls on the airwaves. Must we actually move or even have the unit that we said we were going to move into place, hell no! If you let it into the open that your unit is going somewhere, but instead covertly go somewhere else, you are essentially and somewhat tactically in two places at once.
Example: A common ploy that we used on several occasions in a certain part of the world was to send a messenger ahead to tell the townspeople to have local food prepared for our arrival and stay. This would get the town buzzing and of course eventually filter down to the tangos. Who, would subsequently stop operating in the area or leave altogether. You guessed it, we weren’t going anywhere near that town anytime soon, however, the team sitting snugly in the hills above it listening and watching now knew the five W’s of that whole valley. The scene played out in front of their eyes like a movie set. Vehicles leave town not to return, food delivery increases to areas outside of town, etc. Why? Because we simply let it be known that our super secret squirrel team was coming their way.
The terrorist of this world use deception every day that effects our very lives. Must they attack America? Hell no! All they have to do is “say” and let it into the open that they’re going to attack America. What do we do, cancel flights, increase security, slow our people down and spend money we don’t have, therefore affecting our lives and our economy in the worst of ways. Why? Not because they bombed another building, no, simply because they said that they were going to bomb another building. Deception complete!

I am fairly well versed in the art of the Ruse..

I was specifically asking in reference to the comments:
Have any of you ever seen Task Force 11/16 or any other?

[MK133]

Who needs Task Force 121 when the British SAS will do the job with far fewer men and less ballyhoo. Hell, they may have already captured him if the rumours circulating have it right. Check Google News!

what else are they going to do?

[shrek]

Task force 11 and 16 were in existence recently. I was asking if anyone had ever actually seen them in action? If not, did they really even exist, ghost units have been created before.....

[California Joe]

If a tree falls in the forest.....

[ibstolidude]

Task force 11 and 16 were in existence recently. I was asking if anyone had ever actually seen them in action? If not, did they really even exist, ghost units have been created before..... Sorry I just wasn't sure what you were asking. thanks.

[786mine]

Hardly supersecret either by posting it's movements in a newspaper,talk about OPSEC ............yeah right :backhand:

:cantbeli:

[SABER 2-3]

Task force 11 and 16 were in existence recently. I was asking if anyone had ever actually seen them in action? If not, did they really even exist, ghost units have been created before.....



Recon by imaginary fire...
Great tactic ask the guys in SEAL Team (pick a high number); I can tell you for a fact that there is a TF-11 and TF-16 as well as a JTF-11 and JTF-16, if they are fire and manuvering right now; no clue!

[XASA]

Hardly supersecret either by posting it's movements in a newspaper,talk about OPSEC ............yeah right :backhand:

:cantbeli:

Why is this NOOB regurgitating old threads and setting a new record of 38 posts in one day? Try contributing something useful because the last thing militaryphotos.net needs is another spammer.