China, hitting back, slams US rights abuses

[ed316]

http://a.abcnews.com/images/site/printlogo.jpg


China, hitting back, slams US rights abuses





*******

BEIJING - China hit back at U.S. criticism of its human rights record on Thursday, unveiling its own report detailing U.S. rights abuses, while Chinese activists issued a critical look at their own country's restricted freedoms.
The Chinese report, issued by the State Council, or Cabinet, takes aim at U.S. democracy -- calling it "a game for the rich" -- the high murder rate, domestic wire tapping and detention of Iraqi reporters by U.S. forces in Iraq.
"We urge the United States government to face squarely their own human rights problems, reflect on their own actions, take practical measures and improve their human rights situation," the report, carried by the official Xinhua news agency, said.
Other abuses involved "secret snooping, police abuse, wrong convictions and the highest ratio of people behind bars," it said.
But a group of Chinese lawyers and rights activists said in their own report there were modest expansions of some freedoms in 2005, though many citizens' rights remained narrow, fragile or non-existent.
"Relative to economic development and social progress, the government has not done enough to actively protect and expand civic rights," said the report issued by the Open Constitution Initiative, an independent organization that investigates claims of rights violation and pushes policy change.
"Progress in Chinese citizens' political rights has been quite modest, and especially freedom of expression and of faith have become even more restricted," said the Chinese report, which was given to *******.
A prominent legal activist who helped write the report said it was intended to stimulate public debate among Chinese citizens, and to emphasize that they -- not Washington -- must be the engine of change.
The activist Xu Zhiyong told ******* the timing of the report's release, immediately after the U.S. State Department issued its 2006 human rights report that dwelt on China, was intended to send that message.
"We wanted to emphasize that Chinese citizens must be involved in these issues; that it's not just a matter for Washington or for diplomacy," he said.
CENSORSHIP
The U.S. State Department said on Wednesday that China had increased its censorship of the Internet and of media critics last year and that harassment and detention of those challenging the authorities had grown.
The annual report is usually swiftly rejected by China, which says its human rights definition differs from the West, insisting that the basic rights of its 1.3 billion people to food, clothing and housing take precedence over individual civil liberties.
"The United States has always boasted itself as the model of democracy and hawked its mode of democracy to the rest of the world, but in fact, American 'democracy' is always one for the wealthy and a 'game for the rich'," it said.
The United States should also "rectify their method of using human rights questions to create international confrontation," the report said.
"We disapprove of countries meddling in other countries' domestic affairs," added Chinese Foreign Minister Li Zhaoxing in reaction to the U.S. report, speaking to reporters on the sidelines of the annual meeting of parliament.
China's report quoted widely from U.S. media, including the Washington Post, New York Times and CNN, detailing human rights abuses.
Beijing often criticizes many of these same foreign media outlets for their biased coverage of China.
The report also quoted the Committee to Protect Journalists in detailing the cases of four Iraqi reporters locked away by the United States in Iraq.
The same group named China as the world's leading jailer of journalists for the seventh consecutive year in 2005 with 32 behind bars.
(Additional reporting by Chris Buckley)


Copyright 2006 ******* News Service. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
Copyright © 2006 ABC News Internet Ventures

[redflash]

this human rights thing never gets old, isnt it.

[J-10]

Full text of Human Rights Record of US in 2005:
http://english.gov.cn/2006-03/09/content_222900.htm

[kineret]

China telling US about human rights abuses lol. the world is flipped on its axes.

[redflash]

let it flip then.
mind your own business first.

[ed316]

mind your own business first.

Funny,that's what Taiwan says about China. There is no such thing as "mind your own business" in an age of globalization

[redflash]

whats that has to do with 'human rights, the old dead horse'
ok so there isnt any 'mind your own business' ... then why cant us take the 'blame', dont have the guts to stand for criticism?

[Ea$y-8]

China has a long record of human rights abuse they should not throw rocks when they live in a glass house.

[ed316]

whats that has to do with 'human rights, the old dead horse'

These reports come out every year. The "dead horse" gets ressurected every year.

[Digital Marine]

They should be the last ones to make a statement like that.

[redflash]

These reports come out every year. The "dead horse" gets ressurected every year. thats some strange fetishp-)

[ed316]

thats some strange fetishp-)

China is not the only one on the list. Many countries are on it every year.

[redflash]

China is not the only one on the list. Many countries are on it every year.so, are the yanks riding on the same horse too?

[kineret]

china and US are on fundamentally 2 different levels.

china is a rigid and controlled system. you cant protest, cant participate in rallies, and you will be imprisoned for criticizing the government.

this doesnt happen in US. whatever abuse may go on in guantanamo, it doesnt even compare to what goes on in china. its a joke to even compare the 2 in terms of personal freedoms and abuses, because its 2 different worlds. one is a communist regime with little or no freedoms the other is a democracy with guaranteed rights.

[ed316]

so, are the yanks riding on the same horse too?

US is on Amnesty's every year. China too.

[redflash]

china and US are on fundamentally 2 different levels.

china is a rigid and controlled system. you cant protest, cant participate in rallies, and you will be imprisoned for criticizing the government.

this doesnt happen in US. whatever abuse may go on in guantanamo, it doesnt even compare to what goes on in china. its a joke to even compare the 2 in terms of personal freedoms and abuses, because its 2 different worlds. one is a communist regime with little or no freedoms the other is a democracy with guaranteed rights.ever been to China?

[kineret]

ever been to China?


never been. are you saying that openly criticizing the government or participating in democracy rallies is now allowed? i wasnt informed.

type 'tiananmen square' in google.cn and see what comes up. big brother even controls the internet.

[ed316]

ever been to China?

Can you protest? are you allowed to practise your religion or does it have to be government approved? Is your internet censored?

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO CRITISIZE YOUR GOVERNMENT?

Redflash, I bet you are a son of a party member.

[redflash]

never been. are you saying that openly criticizing the government or participating in democracy rallies is now allowed? i wasnt informed.

type 'tiananmen square' in google.cn and see what comes up. big brother even controls the internet.tiananmen square that was almost 20 years ago.
you must be on Mars for too long, still hang on this 20 yrs old ideal.

riticizing the government, of course, not like the US scale and type, but if you read newspapers and Chinese BBS etc, you will see many.
participating in democracy rallies, some, not that exterme. and like many other countries you need to register with the govt first.

[redflash]

Can you protest? are you allowed to practise your religion or does it have to be government approved? Is your internet censored?

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO CRITISIZE YOUR GOVERNMENT?

Redflash, I bet you are a son of a party member.
same question. ever been to China?

too bad, my father isnt a party member.

[ed316]

same question. ever been to China?

too bad, my father isnt a party member.

No. So now YOU anwser my question that I posted

Can you protest? are you allowed to practise your religion or does it have to be government approved? Is your internet censored?

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO CRITISIZE YOUR GOVERNMENT?

[redflash]

No. So now YOU anwser my question that I posted

Can you protest? are you allowed to practise your religion or does it have to be government approved? Is your internet censored?

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO CRITISIZE YOUR GOVERNMENT? read what i've posted above.

[kineret]

tiananmen square that was almost 20 years ago.
you must be on Mars for too long, still hang on this 20 yrs old ideal.

riticizing the government, of course, not like the US scale and type, but if you read newspapers and Chinese BBS etc, you will see many.
participating in democracy rallies, some, not that exterme. and like many other countries you need to register with the govt first.


freedom of speech is freedom speech, theres no such a thing as 'almost freedom of speech'. can i go down the street next to the government headquarters and carry a sign that says 'our government sucks, democracy now'? what would happen to you if you did?

not trying to lecture china on how it should run its own business, but china and US are fundamentally different when it comes to freedoms and human rights abuses.

[ed316]

read what i've posted above.

That's right you have shyt!! So anwser my question. A simple yes or no will do.

I'm waiting..................

[kineret]

heres just a small list of restrictions on freedoms in china


http://hrw.org/doc/?t=asia&c=china

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4319954.stm

looks like the chinese country side is ready for another revolution, hopefully a democratic one.

[redflash]

That's right you have shyt!! So anwser my question. A simple yes or no will do.

I'm waiting..................calm yourself down first. i have 'shyt' you want some?

[redflash]

heres just a small list of restrictions on freedoms in china


http://hrw.org/doc/?t=asia&c=china thank you very much
here are some from israel

http://hrw.org/doc?t=mideast&c=isrlpa

[ed316]

calm yourself down first. i have 'shyt' you want some?


Wow, still no anwser. You yourself know it that US and China are not the same when it comes to Human Rights.


i have 'shyt' you want some


rofl rofl . A response from someone who knows that he just got OWNED!!!

[redflash]

you sure love to use CAPS
owned? very funny, by what? you? good for you! you just won a "e-cookie"

[ed316]

you sure love to use CAPS
owned? very funny, by what? you? good for you! you just won a "e-cookie"

All I'm asking for is a simple yes or no. OWNED!!! You. If that "e-cookie" is made in China then I'm hesitant of the quality.

[kineret]

thank you very much
here are some from israel

http://hrw.org/doc?t=mideast&c=isrlpa


oh we violate stuff all the time. however, these arent issues of basic freedoms like china. these are issues of security and anti-terrorism. israel is a democracy with many political parties and guaranteed free speech. there is no connection between the 2.

[redflash]

All I'm asking for is a simple yes or no. OWNED!!! You. If that "e-cookie" is made in China then I'm hesitant of the quality.
how old are you?

[ed316]

how old are you?

Yes or No? That's all. I'm 30. Why are you avoiding my question? Is the party boss breathing down your neck?

How old are you?

[redflash]

oh we violate stuff all the time. however, these arent issues of basic freedoms like china. these are issues of security and anti-terrorism. israel is a democracy with many political parties and guaranteed free speech. there is no connection between the 2.
"we violate stuff all the time" so... whats this? blaming someone else to cover your own butt? i understand in certain cases, things must be done.
so far only you are trying to keep this thread discussion civil. lets talk with PMs.

[dangerdan87]

whats that has to do with 'human rights, the old dead horse'
ok so there isnt any 'mind your own business' ... then why cant us take the 'blame', dont have the guts to stand for criticism?

The way I see it, the US has bigger balls than your country, and most other countries....because they soley want the US to take the blame for everything...

And if your from China...you need to shut your pie hole....we, the US, send a great deal of money to China and gives the Chinese jobs....

I honestly think we should not send China anymore or as much money as we are now. China is gaining power through our money.....and I HATE communism

[redflash]

Yes or No? That's all. I'm 30. Why are you avoiding my question? Is the party boss breathing down your neck?

How old are you? 30...rofl ok
im 24
and no, you didnt "owned". but you can still lie to yourself and dance all day for your e-cookie 'victory'

[redflash]

The way I see it, the US has bigger balls than your country, and most other countries....because they soley want the US to take the blame for everything...

And if your from China...you need to shut your pie hole....we, the US, send a great deal of money to China and gives the Chinese jobs....

I honestly think we should not send China anymore or as much money as we are now. China is gaining power through our money.....and I HATE communism
you can send mails to Mr.Bush and order him to stop the trades

[ed316]

30...rofl ok
im 24
and no, you didnt "owned". but you can still lie to yourself and dance all day for your e-cookie 'victory'

YES or NO?



Can you protest? are you allowed to practise your religion or does it have to be government approved? Is your internet censored?

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO CRITISIZE YOUR GOVERNMENT?

Why do you avoid it?


Like I said OWNED

Surely a medical doctor like you can anwser my simple qyuestion. You must be smart to be a 24 year old doctor. So just anwser my question.

[kineret]

"we violate stuff all the time" so... whats this? blaming someone else to cover your own butt? i understand in certain cases, things must be done.
so far only you are trying to keep this thread discussion civil. lets talk with PMs.


hey look, i have tremendous respect for china, in terms of their history, culture and their current economic power. however, i distinguish countries between democracies and everything else. to me personally, freedom to speak, to criticize, to read what i want and think what i want are absolutes. there is no middle ground. i think china is heading slowly towards democracy just like they slowly drifted toward captialism, instead of the debunked and inefficient communist central-planned economy. the shift toward capitalism is the only reason that chinese communists are still in power. this is whats keeping them alive.

[redflash]

YES or NO?



Can you protest? are you allowed to practise your religion or does it have to be government approved? Is your internet censored?

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO CRITISIZE YOUR GOVERNMENT?

Why do you avoid it?


Like I said OWNED

Surely a medical doctor like you can anwser my simple qyuestion. You must be smart to be a 24 year old doctor. So just anwser my question.
NO ( you are one annoying 30 year old bugger)
like i said, read i've posted above.

for that 'owned ' thing. hey i told you many times already, you can dance and sing all day for you e-cookie 'victory'.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Just another case of China trying to deflect criticism by pointing fingers the other way. Amnesty International could write me up for human rights abuses too - I don't let my kids watch South Park, and that's clearly a violation of their innate human rights. But that doesn't compare to the fact that for instance, China employs thousands of people to block Internet content.

No system is perfect, but there is no comparing the two.

Systemic/policy US human rights "abuses" are conceptual in nature, and live in the courtroom while lawyers try to decide if being served non-culturally sensitive meals constitutes "abuse".

Chinese human rights abuse involves stealing land from farmers, the suppression of workers unions, jail sentences for speaking against the government, strict censorship, government control of the media, repression and jail time for religion. It's all roses, smiles and handshakes when you tow the line, but if you dare to sniff the air of freedom, you are very quickly corrected. And let's not forget that they have the millions in free Taiwan in their crosshairs, and threaten to begin killing them if they dare to declare themselves free.

[kineret]

No system is perfect, but there is no comparing the two.
]


yup. exactly. sure US may have some human rights abuses like the abu Graib prison scandal, but the media is free to report it, free to critisize, people are free to protest those abuses and demand that government heads are fired over them. this is impossible in communist china. the 2 countries are simply not equal.

[ed316]

NO ( you are one annoying 30 year old bugger)
like i said, read i've posted above.

for that 'owned ' thing. hey i told you many times already, you can dance and sing all day for you e-cookie 'victory'.

Is that how a 24 year old doctor acts? China is full of shyt!! Just like you.

Thank you for anwsering my question and have a good day living in a Chinese democracy(PRC).


People's Republic of China(PRC)

a republic is a state (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State) whose political organization rests on the principle that the citizens or electorate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electorate) constitute the ultimate root of legitimacy and sovereignty (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereignty)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic


Why are Chinese not allowed to elect their leader?

[kineret]

China is full of shyt!! Just like you.
?


dude, you need to calm down.

[ed316]

dude, you need to calm down.

I'm calm. I think you tell that to our Red friend.

Is he not full of it if he thinks China and the US is the same when it comes to Human Rights?

[deagle]

name calling by either side goes nowhere. ONly thing for sure is they're both right and wrong, and BOTH our guilty.

[epc]

tiananmen square that was almost 20 years ago.
you must be on Mars for too long, still hang on this 20 yrs old ideal.

riticizing the government, of course, not like the US scale and type, but if you read newspapers and Chinese BBS etc, you will see many.
participating in democracy rallies, some, not that exterme. and like many other countries you need to register with the govt first.

I go to China many times for work. Official newspapers, TV news and China-based Chinese BBS do not criticize the Chinese Communist Party and the central government, or question their policies, period. If you thought otherwise, you were a fool.

Corrupt local government officials are sometimes reported, but those guys were never exposed by investigative journalism. And the reporting is always done in the way that the individual official is criticized, but not the system that put this official in power or allowed him to stay in power for so long. See the difference?

Foreign-based Chinese BBS do criticize, but you can't access them from within China. Thanks to US companies, it is becoming more and more difficult to get around the Chinese national firewall.

Sometimes I wanted to access Taiwan's government websites for some commercial trade data for work while in China, nope, can't do it. Blocked.

If you are an ordinary guy wanting to use internet for silly or officially-approved stuff, you will be fine. If you fancy yourself a critical thinker, forget it. BTW, **** is also officially banned on Chinese internet, but it's still easier to find **** than politically-incorrect information on internet in China.

Can you read Chinese? Go to www.wforum.com/wmf. A pretty nationalistic BBS. Very pro-PRC and anti-US. Ironically, you can't access it from China. Banned. And its server is actually based in the US (CA, I believe).

Oh yeah, if you lived through the period of Tiananmen, you would never say that it was "old, 20 years ago", and people shouldn't "hang on to it." PRC is still very much hanging onto what happened in WW2 with Japan. You never hear anyone say, "let it go, it's 60 years ago."


Wake up and stop being "so simple, so naive" (quote from Jiang Zemin, ex-Chinese president, to HK reporters who were asking him questions he didn't like).

[TacoDelRio]

Good post! :)

[J-10]

I go to China many times for work. Official newspapers, TV news and China-based Chinese BBS do not criticize the Chinese Communist Party and the central government, or question their policies, period. If you thought otherwise, you were a fool.

Corrupt local government officials are sometimes reported, but those guys were never exposed by investigative journalism. And the reporting is always done in the way that the individual official is criticized, but not the system that put this official in power or allowed him to stay in power for so long. See the difference?

...

A mass of posts are criticizing the system(China), and pro US style democracy comments is very easy to find in Chinese BBS.
http://bbs.bokee.com/p881159.html

[Kilgor]

A mass of posts are criticizing the system(China), and pro US style democracy comments is very easy to find in Chinese BBS.
http://bbs.bokee.com/p881159.html

Wait about in the newspapers, and on tv ?

[magantosh]

china and US are on fundamentally 2 different levels.

china is a rigid and controlled system. you cant protest, cant participate in rallies, and you will be imprisoned for criticizing the government.

this doesnt happen in US. whatever abuse may go on in guantanamo, it doesnt even compare to what goes on in china. its a joke to even compare the 2 in terms of personal freedoms and abuses, because its 2 different worlds. one is a communist regime with little or no freedoms the other is a democracy with guaranteed rights.


you didn't know China at all, have been there?

it is so funny...

[LaoSexMachine]

you didn't know China at all, have been there?

it is so funny...

I haven't been there. Tell me how much civil liberties they have.

[magantosh]

oh we violate stuff all the time. however, these arent issues of basic freedoms like china. these are issues of security and anti-terrorism. israel is a democracy with many political parties and guaranteed free speech. there is no connection between the 2.


hehe, you are professor in how to kill the palestinian.



before the independence of Isreal, you also make the person bomb against the ruler--- UK, so the palesinian are copying what you've done~

[sir-chimp]

lol .

[LaoSexMachine]

Looks like redflash has a different account.

[jedisponge]

China slamming the US for "rights abuses" is as silly as Libya chairing the UN Human Rights Commission.

And good post to ebc; +imaginary rep.

Also, I've been to China. Does that automatically make me an expert on all things China? Fine, I say China has developed a chair that hovers, like Yoda's. Whoop-de-doo...

[kineret]

hehe, you are professor in how to kill the palestinian.



before the independence of Isreal, you also make the person bomb against the ruler--- UK, so the palesinian are copying what you've done~


lol thanks for the history lesson professor. now kindly go f-ck yourself.

[Redux]

Wait about in the newspapers, and on tv ?

yea, at least in HK news. theres a bit of friction between local Hk govt and govt in mainland china

[magantosh]

lol thanks for the history lesson professor. now kindly go f-ck yourself.


u r so rude, Isreal all like this?



history can't cheat anyone

[kineret]

u r so rude, Isreal all like this?



history can't cheat anyone


yes, we are all like this. now as i said, kindly go f-uck yourself before i put a jihad on you.

[magantosh]

Looks like redflash has a different account.


definitely not, but i'm a chinese

[magantosh]

yes, we are all like this. now as i said, kindly go f-uck yourself before i put a jihad on you.




u always f-uck yourself ? by what ? banana?


asssshole~

[STIG]

Human rights indeed...you fellas got a really nice way for birth control. stab iodine injections into a newborn baby or a pregnant woman and voila one less baby to worry about.Hats off to you:roll:


It has been calculated that between 1971 and 1985 alone there were some 100 million coercive birth-control "operations" in China, including forced sterilisations and forced abortions (Dr John Aird, Slaughter of the Innocents, AEI Press, 1991). In 1983 a massive campaign of compulsory birth control surgeries was carried out, which reportedly produced 14 million abortions, 21 million sterilisations and 18 million IUD insertions. This campaign was directed by the then minister-in-charge of the State Family Planning Commission (SFPC), Qian Xinzhong.

[soprano]

NO ( you are one annoying 30 year old bugger)
like i said, read i've posted above.

for that 'owned ' thing. hey i told you many times already, you can dance and sing all day for you e-cookie 'victory'.


"I'll kill a commuist for fun." -TONY Montana

[redflash]

"I'll kill a commuist for fun." -TONY Montana
bring it on. im waiting for you.

[gsm]

Wake up and stop being "so simple, so naive" (quote from Jiang Zemin, ex-Chinese president, to HK reporters who were asking him questions he didn't like).
very classy

[BMF_EOD]

I think a bit a maturity is due here.

Redflash, I think your communist viewpoints will fall on deaf ears with the majority of the forum members. Save yourself some time and go to a party meeting and talk about how great you have it there. (yes I Have been to Beijing).

The rest of you should be ashamed for taking part of the same bullshyte we all hate and complain about.

Be part of the solution.

[Durandal]

ever been to China?

I have and if Tiananmen Square Square was so old then the government should have no problems letting people bitch about how thousands were MURDERED.

Don't get me started.

I am all about goodwill and economic and democratic opportunities but let's face it, China sucks when it comes to human rights.

If its not one thing its another...












http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/LPIPOD04/BN9523_15~Socialist-Statue-On-Tiananmen-Square-Beijing-China-Posters.jpg
Heil Mao...

[budgie]

While it's rather hypocritical of China - with her broad and institutionalised abuses - to hit back at America, one must concede in the light of Guantanamo that America is hardly the beacon of virtue that it once was.

[Durandal]

While it's rather hypocritical of China - with her broad and institutionalised abuses - to hit back at America, one must concede in the light of Guantanamo that America is hardly the beacon of virtue that it once was.

Guantanamo? THAT is our comparison? How can you sit there and say "Well, the U.S. has GITMO, so who are we to criticize?"

[ed316]

While it's rather hypocritical of China - with her broad and institutionalised abuses - to hit back at America, one must concede in the light of Guantanamo that America is hardly the beacon of virtue that it once was.

Were you at Gitmo? Please enlighten us on what you saw with your own eyes.

America is not perfect and has it's fair share but nothing like China. Comparing China's abuse against American's is apples to oranges.

[blue104]

China has the longest continuous civilisation on earth. And it has never been democratic. Arrogant Westerners must never think that they can oppose democracy on a nation that probably doesn't want it.

The world is not a western democratic liberal lake. Maybe you westerners can learn from the the very successful Singaporean government, which is rather undemocratic and totally unrepentant about it.

Lee Kuan Yew would laugh at you pro-democracy types.

[ed316]

China has the longest continuous civilisation on earth. And it has never been democratic. Arrogant Westerners must never think that they can oppose democracy on a nation that probably doesn't want it.

The world is not a western democratic liberal lake. Maybe you westerners can learn from the the very successful Singaporean government, which is rather undemocratic and totally unrepentant about it.

Lee Kuan Yew would laugh at you pro-democracy types.

Great! Now go back and read your little red book.

[kineret]

China has the longest continuous civilisation on earth. And it has never been democratic. Arrogant Westerners must never think that they can oppose democracy on a nation that probably doesn't want it.

The world is not a western democratic liberal lake. Maybe you westerners can learn from the the very successful Singaporean government, which is rather undemocratic and totally unrepentant about it.

Lee Kuan Yew would laugh at you pro-democracy types.


what the hell are you talking about? Singapre is a democracy

perhaps its a different flavor than a western european democracy, but its a democracy.

from wikipedia

Singapore is a republic with a Westminster system of a unicameral parliamentary government, with the bulk of the executive powers resting in the hands of a cabinet of ministers led by a prime minister. The office of the president was, historically, a ceremonial one as head of state, but the Constitution was amended in 1991 to create the position of a popularly elected president and also to grant the president veto powers in a few key decisions such as the use of the national reserves and the appointment of key judiciary positions. The legislative branch of government is the Parliament.



does this sound like the Chinese system to you?

[blue104]

Do you have a brain? You haven't bothered to refute my argument. Most people living in Singapore think liberal western democracy is a joke.

China is growing at 10% per annum economically. They double their economic output every 7.5 years. America grows at 3% per annum on average and takes 24 years to double its economic output. China's economy has just surpassed Britain's GNP. China will overtake america's GNP in 30 years with a dictatorship at the helm.

Bully for China haters. this post directed at ed316.

[redflash]

blue104, leave this thread, with ed316, 'white can be black'
hey, lads, if you hate china so much, throw everything made in china away in your house. "the money you spent will help them make missles"

[redflash]

I have and if Tiananmen Square Square was so old then the government should have no problems letting people bitch about how thousands were MURDERED.

Don't get me started.

I am all about goodwill and economic and democratic opportunities but let's face it, China sucks when it comes to human rights.

If its not one thing its another...












http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/LPIPOD04/BN9523_15%7ESocialist-Statue-On-Tiananmen-Square-Beijing-China-Posters.jpg
Heil Mao...

sure, heil Mao, better Mao than Jiangp-)
whatever you say. you are no better than ed

[blue104]

No point argueing with China haters red flash. They want a new cold war.

The PLA will defend China's dignity.

[redflash]

of course they will. but i'd love to see some special people here will fight with them face to face. =)
他们恨他们的，咱们做自己的。 ok. wheres my personal translator?

[ed316]

Do you have a brain? You haven't bothered to refute my argument. Most people living in Singapore think liberal western democracy is a joke.

China is growing at 10% per annum economically. They double their economic output every 7.5 years. America grows at 3% per annum on average and takes 24 years to double its economic output. China's economy has just surpassed Britain's GNP. China will overtake america's GNP in 30 years with a dictatorship at the helm.

Bully for China haters. this post directed at ed316.

Great that you love communism so much. The gap between the rich and poor in China will have to be fix before it will ever surpass America if not it we will see the results. US is China's biggest trading partner. China is a manafactured base economy while US is a consumer we will see. Remember if people don't buy the job is not there.


China will overtake america's GNP in 30 years with a dictatorship at the helm

This is great that you have an economic crystal ball. We have a saying in America, "Don't count your chickens before they hatch". There is many forces at play in the world. Like I said enjoy reading your little red book, redflash.

[ed316]

No point argueing with China haters red flash. They want a new cold war.

The PLA will defend China's dignity.

Taiwan .

[redflash]

why did you say taiwan? ^^^
what about it, if PLA want to take over taiwan it will be in their hands in matter of days. ( now you can spread more 'omg they are a threat" )

as always, your hate blinded your only eye ed316, do not mix "love communism" with " love your country"
no on cares about communism in China.

[ed316]

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/img/printer_friendly/news_logo.gif
China's poor pose threat to wealthy future
By Chris Bowlby
Analysis, Radio 4
Look at China from a distance, and those huge new skyscrapers in places like Shanghai may dominate the view.


They symbolise rapid recent growth, glitzy cities and factories flooding the world with consumer goods.
Look beyond, however, and another China comes into focus - where hundreds of millions still live in poverty, and where a communist government struggles with the contradictions of running a capitalist economy.
Last week the Chinese premier, Wen Jiabao, warned the National People's congress in Beijing of "deep-seated conflicts" and promised to spend more to ease the urban-rural divide.
Resentment and assertiveness
Oxford political scientist Steve Tsang says China is a "brittle" place.

There are fears that China's going to become the first country to get old before it gets rich
Anthropologist Elisabeth Croll

It looks strong from the outside but "the situation can disintegrate very quickly".
The communists hope continued rapid economic growth will permit their continued hold on to power.
But they are now caught between the resentment of those left behind by the boom and the assertiveness of a new middle class.
Political freedom
Take Beijing's recent deal with Google.
On the one hand, a symbol of China continuing to embrace the global economy.
But Google had to agree to block access to politically sensitive websites, something the government's 30,000 "Online police" struggle to do.
Chris Berry, a specialist on the Chinese media, points out that there are an estimated three million Chinese bloggers.
Their writings are full of criticism of official corruption and environmental cover-ups.
Economic freedom granted by the government encourages political freedom, which Beijing finds highly embarrassing.
Safety net
Pressure of a different kind comes from rural areas.
Anthropologist Elisabeth Croll, who has been visiting China regularly for several decades, says around 400 million Chinese are still living on $2 a day.
Migration and TV have made them more aware than ever of how their richer compatriots are prospering.
Demography is also posing problems.
The notorious 'one child' policy has left a population rapidly ageing.
There are fears, says Professor Croll, "that China's going to become the first country to get old before it gets rich".
Because of all this, the government dare not expose many state-owned enterprises to the rigours of the free market, as they provide not just jobs but a vital social safety net too.
They remain a huge drag on the economy.
China's impact
Chinese people, says Mr Berry, are divided between those who think their future is Californian and those who think it will be more like Russia - a place where the transition from communism has been far from happy.
Pessimists see a Chinese state ever more unstable, perhaps resorting to nationalism if it feels its power slipping and old tensions with neighbours like Taiwan and Japan come to the fore.
Some foreign investors, says Goldman Sachs chief economist Jim O'Neill, "wouldn't want to go anywhere near China", while others feel "you just can't ignore it and you have to be there".
Such is China's size that, if its growth continues smoothly, it will continue to have a huge global impact.
But its impact might be very different if the Chinas of rich and poor, young and old, communist and capitalist cannot be reconciled. 'Analysis - China's Challenge'. Broadcast on BBC Radio 4 at 8.30pm on 9 March, repeated at 9.30pm on 12 March.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/business/4784094.stm

Published: 2006/03/08 23:37:32 GMT

© BBC MMVI

[ed316]

why did you say taiwan? ^^^

as always, your hate blinded your only eye ed316, do not mix "love communism" with " love your country"
no on cares about communism in China.

No, it's not hate. I just get my news UNCENSORED that's all. So I have a different perspective.

[Ea$y-8]

Mao was more evil that Hitler, even der fuhrer himself said so!!

http://www.wku.edu/Library/onlinexh/sanders/cartoons/periscope/mao_hitler.jpg

[redflash]

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/img/printer_friendly/news_logo.gif
China's poor pose threat to wealthy future
By Chris Bowlby
Analysis, Radio 4
Look at China from a distance, and those huge new skyscrapers in places like Shanghai may dominate the view.


They symbolise rapid recent growth, glitzy cities and factories flooding the world with consumer goods.
Look beyond, however, and another China comes into focus - where hundreds of millions still live in poverty, and where a communist government struggles with the contradictions of running a capitalist economy.
Last week the Chinese premier, Wen Jiabao, warned the National People's congress in Beijing of "deep-seated conflicts" and promised to spend more to ease the urban-rural divide.
Resentment and assertiveness
Oxford political scientist Steve Tsang says China is a "brittle" place.

There are fears that China's going to become the first country to get old before it gets rich
Anthropologist Elisabeth Croll

It looks strong from the outside but "the situation can disintegrate very quickly".
The communists hope continued rapid economic growth will permit their continued hold on to power.
But they are now caught between the resentment of those left behind by the boom and the assertiveness of a new middle class.
Political freedom
Take Beijing's recent deal with Google.
On the one hand, a symbol of China continuing to embrace the global economy.
But Google had to agree to block access to politically sensitive websites, something the government's 30,000 "Online police" struggle to do.
Chris Berry, a specialist on the Chinese media, points out that there are an estimated three million Chinese bloggers.
Their writings are full of criticism of official corruption and environmental cover-ups.
Economic freedom granted by the government encourages political freedom, which Beijing finds highly embarrassing.
Safety net
Pressure of a different kind comes from rural areas.
Anthropologist Elisabeth Croll, who has been visiting China regularly for several decades, says around 400 million Chinese are still living on $2 a day.
Migration and TV have made them more aware than ever of how their richer compatriots are prospering.
Demography is also posing problems.
The notorious 'one child' policy has left a population rapidly ageing.
There are fears, says Professor Croll, "that China's going to become the first country to get old before it gets rich".
Because of all this, the government dare not expose many state-owned enterprises to the rigours of the free market, as they provide not just jobs but a vital social safety net too.
They remain a huge drag on the economy.
China's impact
Chinese people, says Mr Berry, are divided between those who think their future is Californian and those who think it will be more like Russia - a place where the transition from communism has been far from happy.
Pessimists see a Chinese state ever more unstable, perhaps resorting to nationalism if it feels its power slipping and old tensions with neighbours like Taiwan and Japan come to the fore.
Some foreign investors, says Goldman Sachs chief economist Jim O'Neill, "wouldn't want to go anywhere near China", while others feel "you just can't ignore it and you have to be there".
Such is China's size that, if its growth continues smoothly, it will continue to have a huge global impact.
But its impact might be very different if the Chinas of rich and poor, young and old, communist and capitalist cannot be reconciled. 'Analysis - China's Challenge'. Broadcast on BBC Radio 4 at 8.30pm on 9 March, repeated at 9.30pm on 12 March.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/business/4784094.stm

Published: 2006/03/08 23:37:32 GMT

© BBC MMVI
this is a thread about yanks breaking human rights, not 'education on how poor China is"
since China is so poor.. they cant afford any weapon, thus they are not your 'threat' yet you are still crying out lound for attention.
rather pathetic isnt it?

[ed316]

this is a thread about yanks breaking human rights, not 'education on how poor China is"
since China is so poor.. they cant afford any weapon, thus they are not your 'threat' yet you are still crying out lound for attention.
rather pathetic isnt it?

That's where you are wrong. China is spending alot on weapons. Didn't the government control news told you that?

[redflash]

Mao was more evil that Hitler, even der fuhrer himself says so!!

http://www.wku.edu/Library/onlinexh/sanders/cartoons/periscope/mao_hitler.jpg
roflrofl welcome to 1960s

[redflash]

That's where you are wrong. China is spending alot on weapons. Didn't the government control news told you that?
yet, in your eyes, the us military will crash them "in the matter of hours"
so why are you so afraid of them?

[ed316]

yet, in your eyes, the us military will crash them "in the matter of hours"
so why are you so afraid of them?

US don't crash we crush. I don't fear China. I love Chinese culture. My favorite Chinese is General Tsao.

Please show me where I said we will crush China in hours.

[kineret]

My favorite Chinese is General Tsao.



lol

that guy is delicious!!

[epc]

A mass of posts are criticizing the system(China), and pro US style democracy comments is very easy to find in Chinese BBS.
http://bbs.bokee.com/p881159.html

Hi J-10:

I am unable to view the page in either Firefox or IE. Regardless, I stand by my statement by my position:

Bokee blog server I believe is within China. However, if anyone posted comments challenging the 1-party system or questioning the party (for example, challenging the party policy and position on issues such as Taiwan independence, Falunggung religious sect, or Tiananmen Square "incident"), and if Bokee did not remove the post in a timely manner, then Bokee would be in clear and direct violation of the relevant laws promulgated by People's Congress.

Again, by law all website administrators and internet cafes have to be registered with local public security bureaus. Draw your own conclusions.

[Seiyuuki]

China is growing at 10% per annum economically. They double their economic output every 7.5 years. America grows at 3% per annum on average and takes 24 years to double its economic output. China's economy has just surpassed Britain's GNP. China will overtake america's GNP in 30 years with a dictatorship at the helm.

The word is "overheating," get use to it because you'll be in for a rude awakening.

[Durandal]

sure, heil Mao, better Mao than Jiangp-)
whatever you say. you are no better than ed


Ahh and that is where you make your mistake, thinking that Ed and I are somehow similar.

My criticism is based on the likely deaths and imprisonment of friends who wanted civil rights and representation. Their version, not mine. It is not a tall order to respect human dignity, property ownership, the right to a fair trial, and no persecution for speech.

But the tanks came anyways.

I think what is sad is that you actually seem to bask in the glow of tyranny.

blue said that we were criticizing one of the oldest civilizations on earth. Big deal. I hardly call it civilized a ruling class minority has kept the Chinese people enslaved for 5000 years be they Han Kings, Mongols, Imperialists, or Communists. The things your culture has contributed to the world have done more wonders to the world than within your own borders.

I love China, that's why I studied your culture and language in the 80s, but you have to do something about your government.

You are right though, western style democracy might never work in China. Then again it might. Of course, with your attitude who needs ANY representation. You culture is one of chattel and you seem to enjoy maintaining the status quo.

Mooo.

[ed316]

At least we like guns, Durandel.

[Durandal]

At least we like guns, Durandel.

That we do.

[Kilgor]

Great! Now go back and read your little red book.

the pages would be all stuck together...

[Dalamara]

Man reading through some of these posts is ridiculous. I am Chinese. I was born there, and I was raised there.

My father was jailed for two years simply for attending a pro-democracy rally. He was fired from his job, which was teaching at the local university.

Now tell me when has this EVER happened in the U.S.? China doesn't have human rights problems... riiight.

[ed316]

Welcome, Dalamara

[Clarsachier]

While it's rather hypocritical of China - with her broad and institutionalised abuses - to hit back at America, one must concede in the light of Guantanamo that America is hardly the beacon of virtue that it once was.

Good point.

[M1A2U2]

give me a call when you can elect a leader. Then we will talk about human rights abuses.

[ElHombre]

give me a call when you can elect a leader. Then we will talk about human rights abuses.

that's telling those americans!

oh, wait...

[ed316]

Isn't it lovely how you can critisize the US government with out fear. Bet you can't do that in China.

[Sam_168]

lol

that guy is delicious!!
hahahahaaaaaaaa

[Belrick]

Ive bemoaned it before but i'll say it again.
The USA on 11/9/2001 were the chosen leaders of the Western civilization. They had the track record to be given that role but those f**kers called neo-cons squandered a historic opportunity.

All i can say is i told you so 3 years. Now we are at the point that China of all nations is quite within it's right to point out the US poor civil rights record.

Shame America, you not only failed yourselves as leaders of democracy and civil freedoms (you f**kers can now justify gestapo type tactics!) but you failed our way of lives that will surely fall if you fall. (An even thats become a when not if)

I lament the loss :(

[Durandal]

Ive bemoaned it before but i'll say it again.
The USA on 11/9/2001 were the chosen leaders of the Western civilization. They had the track record to be given that role but those f**kers called neo-cons squandered a historic opportunity.

All i can say is i told you so 3 years. Now we are at the point that China of all nations is quite within it's right to point out the US poor civil rights record.

Shame America, you not only failed yourselves as leaders of democracy and civil freedoms (you f**kers can now justify gestapo type tactics!) but you failed our way of lives that will surely fall if you fall. (An even thats become a when not if)

I lament the loss :(

Go ahead, have China as your world leader in freedom and civil rights. :roll:

[redflash]

p-)why not?

[blue104]

You all live in China for extended period. After a while the spirit of spring and autuum will prevail over you. You will be at peace with yourself's.

You will be contented member of society and at ease with self. Civil liberties irrelevant then.

[ed316]

You all live in China for extended period. After a while the spirit of spring and autuum will prevail over you. You will be at peace with yourself's.

You will be contented member of society and at ease with self. Civil liberties irrelevant then.


So says a communist minder. If it's so great then why all the Chinese illegals comming to America. I don't see Americans hiding in shipping container and hoping for a better life IN CHINA. Take your communist propaganda somewhere else.

[Durandal]

You all live in China for extended period. After a while the spirit of spring and autuum will prevail over you. You will be at peace with yourself's.

You will be contented member of society and at ease with self. Civil liberties irrelevant then.

Yeah, and Soylent Green is good for you!

Oh, and take your Lao Tzu bull$hit somewhere else. Nothing but petty words to placate the people under an authoritarian rule, be it 450 BC or 2005 AD.

[Durandal]

p-)why not?

rofl

Have China lead the world in human rights and freedoms is sort of like letting Iran lead the world in Christendom.

Funny $hit man.

[BarkingSquirrel]

Damn Durandal, I came here expecting it and you failed me :hug:

[Durandal]

Damn Durandal, I came here expecting it and you failed me :hug:

Oh, no, dude, going to make a special one for this...maybe two for this and another thread.

Going to have to get some Photoshop on maybe...

[BarkingSquirrel]

Lemme know if you do, I'll send you the template.

[Durandal]

Lemme know if you do, I'll send you the template.

Naw, just the image. You are doing such a fine job! Team work brother!

[Durandal]

give me a call when you can elect a leader. Then we will talk about human rights abuses.

That pretty much sums up this thread...