Mexico slams Georgia migrant law

[Ezekiel25:17]

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/img/printer_friendly/news_logo.gif
Mexico slams Georgia migrant law
The Mexican government has condemned a tough new immigration law passed in the US state of Georgia on Monday.
Presidential spokesman Ruben Aguilar said the legislation discriminated against Mexicans and that diplomats would monitor how it was applied.
The law, which will take effect next year, prevents illegal immigrants from receiving many social services.
It will also require police and employers to report undocumented workers to the Immigration Service.
Complex issue
The signing of the legislation comes amid deadlock in the US Congress about how to deal with illegal immigration, as well as nationwide protests by worried Latino groups.
"The referred legislation incurs discriminatory acts against the Mexican population and those of Mexican origin," Mr Aguilar said.
"It is a partial measure that fails to resolve the complex phenomenon of immigration between Mexico and the United States in an integral manner."
Since becoming Mexico's president in 2000, Vicente Fox has been pressing for reforms that would allow more Mexicans to work legally in the US.
'Not anti-immigrant'
Georgia Governor Sonny Perdue, who signed the bill, said it was intended to ensure that everyone who lives in Georgia abides by the laws there.
"It is our responsibility to ensure that our famous Georgia hospitality is not abused, that our taxpayers are not taken advantage of and that our citizens are protected," Mr Perdue.
"I want to make this clear: we are not, Georgia's government is not, and this bill is not anti-immigrant," Gov Perdue said.
The law, which will take effect in July 2007, will also impose prison terms for human trafficking and limit the services commercial companies can provide to illegal immigrants.
BBC correspondents say the move has come at a difficult time in the US as there have been country-wide protests over a federal immigration law currently being debated in the Senate.
"It is a punitive bill," said the president of the Georgia Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, Sara Gonzalez.
"This is a very complicated issue, and I don't see any good coming out of this."
There are an estimated 11 million undocumented workers in the US.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/americas/4921000.stm

Published: 2006/04/19 01:40:05 GMT

© BBC MMVI

Oh the irony!!!! Why doesn't Mehico tells us how they treat central and south Americans that come through Mehico? F*cking hypocrites!!!

Guess remittance money keeps the country afloat.

[shocker1]

This is a good law that was passed by my home state. When I was in high school you could get a part time job at any carpet plant and make $12 hr to start. Go around and mow grass for extra money but these days a teenager has a hard time finding a part time job. The carpet mills have been starting people at $8 hr now because of depressed wages. Mohawk Industries is just one example, they had stacks of fake social security cards to give to their illegal workers. When this law takes effect it will change the labor market in Georgia for the good. Here's a link to the bill.http://www.legis.ga.gov/legis/2005_06/fulltext/sb529.htm

[sir-chimp]

Presidential spokesman Ruben Aguilar said the legislation discriminated against Mexicans and that diplomats would monitor how it was applied.


f_uck mexico

Good for Georgia

[AOCBravo2004]

"It is a punitive bill," said the president of the Georgia Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, Sara Gonzalez.
"This is a very complicated issue, and I don't see any good coming out of this."

No good coming out of this??? HELLO!!! The less the state has to pay in benefits to illegals, the more money the state will have!!!

[chuckster]

I think what he REALLY means is, no good for Mexico.

[praetorian6]

The rest of the states should follow Georgia's lead.

Mexico can just fvcking get over it.

[sir-chimp]

If only the mexican government exercised the same "concern" for its citizens with in its own borders.

[praetorian6]

Or the same concern for the immigrants to their country.

[shocker1]

A little off topic. What is the deal with the media making the titles of geo-politics articles sound like wrestling matches? Country 1 SLAMS country 2 or country 2 BLASTS country 1. Mexico slams Georgia? Well Georgia pile drives Mexico,1,2,3.:backhand:

[Ezekiel25:17]

A little off topic. What is the deal with the media making the titles of geo-politics articles sound like wrestling matches? Country 1 SLAMS country 2 or country 2 BLASTS country 1. Mexico slams Georgia? Well Georgia pile drives Mexico,1,2,3.:backhand:

That really doesn't bother me. What does is how the news media or wire service refer to ILLEGAL immigrants as UNDOCUMENTED MIGRANTS :bash:

[chuckster]

Or the same concern for the immigrants to their country.

How about the CITIZENS of their own country. The only thing the Mexican government really cares about is soaking up whatever wealth they can glean from that nation and putting it into their OWN pockets. Improvement for the lot of the average Jose in Mexico, and the illegal immigrant problem, will only occur after there is major reform in the Mexican government.

[shocker1]

That really doesn't bother me. What does is how the news media or wire service refer to ILLEGAL immigrants as UNDOCUMENTED MIGRANTS :bash: Come on , they just forgot to file their documents.:) They are only illegal because they broke the law.

[Ezekiel25:17]

How about the CITIZENS of their own country. The only thing the Mexican government really cares about is soaking up whatever wealth they can glean from that nation and putting it into their OWN pockets. Improvement for the lot of the average Jose in Mexico, and the illegal immigrant problem, will only occur after there is major reform in the Mexican government.

x2. The only thing we can do about illegal immgration is tightn the borders. It will only be solve when Mexico does some major economic and social reform. Mexico is probably the only country that encourage it's citizen to leave.

[shocker1]

Mohawk Industries
Shawanna Kendrick (skendrick@newschannel9.com)
May 1,2006 The U-S Supreme Court could make a decision in about two weeks regarding a north Georgia company accused of hiring hundreds of illegal immigrants to save money.
Mohawk Industries denies knowing it had illegal workers on the payroll.
Last week, the Bush administration urged the Supreme Court to allow a lawsuit to go forward.
If that happens, the Dalton-based company could be sued for racketeering.

http://newschannel9.com/engine.pl?station=wtvc&id=4200&template=breakout_story1.shtml&dateformat=%M+%e,%Y

[Karmapolice]

makes me proud to be a Georgia boy.

[AOCBravo2004]

Mohawk Industries
Shawanna Kendrick (skendrick@newschannel9.com)
May 1,2006 http://newschannel9.com/engine.pl?station=wtvc&id=4200&template=breakout_story1.shtml&dateformat=%M+%e,%Y

This is the one concerning the RICO Statutes correct???

[Creeper]

I am not a 'Southerner' per sei, but I have ALOT of respect for Sonny.He is tough but fair. There will be more 'crackdowns' on Illegal hiring here in the 'peanut' state.
[get it- cracking two nuts in a shell!LMFAO]

[Laconian]

Good for GA. If the Feds aren't going to do anything, let the states get a whack at stopping or reducing illegal immigration or the amount of money they are wasting by supporting illegals.

[c46thva]

Way to go Georgia. Im not surprised to see a southern state step forward for states rights.

[tuercas]

no need to drop the F bombs

dont get too upset about Vicente Fox being negative against moves by GA to address illegal imigration. the Mex gvt is going to do what any gvt anywhere would do ,protect its citizens no matter what with pr statements, specially with elections 2 months away. GA is going to do what they need to do and if they are going for the companies first that use fake ssn cards and such, they are actually doing it in a logical manner.

[GAFES]

Mexico slams Georgia migrant law

Wouldn't be better to put it this way... ''Vicente Fox slams Georgia migrant law ''.



Sir chrimp stop insulting my country , no one here has insulted yours.
It feels great to throw **** sitting in front of your computer, right?
Pussy.

[sir-chimp]

Mexico slams Georgia migrant law

Wouldn't be better to put it this way... ''Vicente Fox slams Georgia migrant law ''.



Sir chrimp stop insulting my country , no one here has insulted yours.
It feels great to throw **** sitting in front of your computer, right?
Pussy.

if you feel Im insulting your country then tough titty partner

[AOCBravo2004]

Mexico slams Georgia migrant law

Wouldn't be better to put it this way... ''Vicente Fox slams Georgia migrant law"

No, because Mexico elected Vicente Fox to be it's representative.

[I'mOnlyHalfPolish]

i've got a new plan everyone, listen, it goes like this...put up a giant neon sign that says "ningunos vacíos!!!" and "sorry we're full" along the border

[East Scout]

f_uck mexico

Good for Georgia

X2.......Fuk'em....FOX interviewed this fuking asshole that was getting ready to jump the border for a roofing job in waiting for him in Virginia and he was asked if he knew he was breaking the law..He replied "Yes but i dont care. So what...Ill do what I want in Amerika" .......They have no respect for this country and Its laws..If they did this problem wouldnt exists........

[East Scout]

Mexico slams Georgia migrant law

Wouldn't be better to put it this way... ''Vicente Fox slams Georgia migrant law ''.



Sir chrimp stop insulting my country , no one here has insulted yours.
It feels great to throw **** sitting in front of your computer, right?
Pussy.


Dont get mad at us because Mexico is a third world cesspool and half your citizens want the fuk out.....Go tell Fox to quit giving your people a bad name..or just tell him to quit being a jerkoff and shut his fuking borders ..

[sct1886]

Mexico slams Georgia migrant law

Wouldn't be better to put it this way... ''Vicente Fox slams Georgia migrant law ''.



Sir chrimp stop insulting my country , no one here has insulted yours.
It feels great to throw **** sitting in front of your computer, right?
Pussy.
No one needs to insult your country. The state of affairs in Mexico speaks for itself. Your physically beautiful country has one of the most corrupt governments on the planet. Your police come into San Diego and steal cars. Your military facilitates smuggling of drugs into my country. The people of the U.S. are sick and tired of our tax dollars being used by ILLEGALS, sick of rising crime rates because of ILLEGALS, sick and tired of illegals causing auto accidents and not carrying insurance, sick and tired of ILLEGALS taking our jobs and depressing our wages, sick and tired of ILLEGALS picketing in the streets with Mexican flags and thier refusal to assimilate into our society and speak our language as my forefathers once did. Sick and tired of hearing of Azatlan. Actions speak louder than words and your countrymens actions are despicable... The inaction of your countrymen is what has caused your country to be a third world armpit and now they are trying to do it here. No one is being racist here. We are sick and tired of bad neighbors.

[evanfitz]

Proud to be from Georgia.

[chuckster]

No one is being racist here. We are sick and tired of bad neighbors.

Amen to that!

[shocker1]

No one needs to insult your country. The state of affairs in Mexico speaks for itself. Your physically beautiful country has one of the most corrupt governments on the planet. Your police come into San Diego and steal cars. Your military facilitates smuggling of drugs into my country. The people of the U.S. are sick and tired of our tax dollars being used by ILLEGALS, sick of rising crime rates because of ILLEGALS, sick and tired of illegals causing auto accidents and not carrying insurance, sick and tired of ILLEGALS taking our jobs and depressing our wages, sick and tired of ILLEGALS picketing in the streets with Mexican flags and thier refusal to assimilate into our society and speak our language as my forefathers once did. Sick and tired of hearing of Azatlan. Actions speak louder than words and your countrymens actions are despicable... The inaction of your countrymen is what has caused your country to be a third world armpit and now they are trying to do it here. No one is being racist here. We are sick and tired of bad neighbors. Reading your post helped vent some anger.. Thanks Well said

[mattnwnc03]

screw mexico, they have no say in what we do.

[Creeper]

no need to drop the F bombs

dont get too upset about Vicente Fox being negative against moves by GA to address illegal imigration. the Mex gvt is going to do what any gvt anywhere would do ,protect its citizens no matter what with pr statements, specially with elections 2 months away. GA is going to do what they need to do and if they are going for the companies first that use fake ssn cards and such, they are actually doing it in a logical manner.

Yes, there is a great need to drop 'bombas muy grandes '. Your country's politics, military,economics and wordly image, collectively, is CHUM.

"Protect its citzens." LMFAO TACO BOY! Sure, they are citzens in Mex. however, here in Ga. they are 'Illegals'. Your prez is 'aiding and abetting' criminal behavior. Disgusting!

the pending question: Why can't your prez/government develop an economy within the borders to substainate its citizens? Until it happens, bombs will continue to fall!
LMFAO!

[Arsenal]

Score 1 for Georgia! Now if we could just get rid of Cythia McKinney...

[tuercas]

LMFAO TACO BOY!
great . personally insulting me will surely solve your immigration problems.

the pending question: Why can't your prez/government develop an economy within the borders to substainate its citizens? Until it happens, bombs will continue to fall!
LMFAO!
Rather than just ignoring you , i will offer you a brief explanation of the reasons behind mexico's economic troubles and the reasons behind the immigration.

mexico has had problems for a while , after all the country only really got going after the 1910's revolution. then the country had healty growth. this changed in the early 80's . Mexico still had huge debts to the US dating back to pre revolution times and to the expropriation of the oil industry in the 30's, the US governmets under carter and then reagan called in the debts. Mexico had no currency to pay these debts or at least pay the interest. in response to this pressure and to attempt to pay the interests on the debt, The government of president Portillo decided to float the currency and depend on petro dollars. this could not have ocurred on a worst time,this was around 82-84 when the world oil industry suffered a huge glut of crude and oil was not worth much. the Peso plummeted from an exchange rate of 12 old pesos per dollar to $1000 old pesos per dollar in less than one year and did not stop falling. the economy was hit hard , this episode was called the "crisis"

because mexican industry had become poorer due to the crisis, the gvt opened up the market to foreign investment in the hopes of bringing in more capital, foreing companies moved in and bough former nationalised industries, like telmex (comunications) and Dina (heavy trucks) many people lost their jobs because of this in industry but the agriculture sector was still relatively safe. this changed with NAFTA.

Nafta would have in theory made Mexico a prefered partner in trade with the US , this was going to bring in capital from a secure source and many manufacturing jobs. some jobs came in , at least temporarily, the bigest impact was from US agricultural products . Mexican agriculture, which is mostly small farmers, could not compete with cheap US grains and meat from usd giants ADM and Cargill so farmers became destitute in massive numbers. some of these unemployed farmers went to the cities but mostly headed north causing the mass immigration of the 90's.

there is essentially no easy solution to this situation, other than venezuela style revolution or a waving of the national debt by the IMF or by the US, which wont happen. the Peso is so attached to the dollar that unataching it would make it plumet harder, which did happen in the mid 90's when the peso was momentarily attached to the german mark. Mexico is not in a position to repeal NAFTA to rescue the agriculture sector . now its even geting worse because of the influx of cheap chinese products from the direction of the US because of NAFTA, mexican manufacturers are folding, adding to the exodus.

Mexico's woes does benefit some in the US , companies in labor intensive industries like construction and agriculture benefit from an iflux of a low wage work with no benefits or taxes. The state Georgia relied on this in the mid 90's with all the infrastructure that was modernised for the 96 olympics.

knowing this reality, you can hopefully understand why the mex government will try to keep the remitances from expats flowing. this does not make it rigth but it will explain the rhetoric from the president. it is all rhetoric though, Mex cannot influense the policies of the US or its states.

[sct1886]

Tuercas: Good post. The widespread corruption within your country has paralyzed your economy and ruined what should have been paradise. Your countrymen need a good revolution and throw them all out and start over... Mexico is a step below most communist states in regards to doing business or general living conditions. Venezuala is a bad example of reform. Man has no incentive to excel in a socialist/communist state. Capitalism with company profit sharing and stock options gives employee motivation. The balance of a carrot and stick has to be used in all aspects of life. The only decent government is a Democratic Republic such as envisioned by Thomas Jefferson. Freedom, education, and justice are what make great countries, not goverments. I have seen communism and socialism first hand and it ruins all that it touches. The US is also in need of a peaceful throw them all out scenario before greed ruins us also. Good Luck!!!

[Indianer]

That really doesn't bother me. What does is how the news media or wire service refer to ILLEGAL immigrants as UNDOCUMENTED MIGRANTS :bash:


Lemme explain this.

Us Journalists (myself I am a journalism student) use our own dictionary, which has entries for most words. For example, most news services and my journalism college use the "AP Style."

Here's the entry for Illegal Immigrant:

"Used to describe those who have entered the country illegally, it is the preferred term, rather than illegal alien, or undocumented worker."


My copy of the AP stylebook is 2 years old, and it gets changed yearly - depending on how sensitive the word is. Yes, it's BS I know, but that's how we operate...trying to make things complete balanced (and individual words do make a difference unfortunately).

[Creeper]

This thread concerns lack of respect of the immigration laws of the United States and what the state Governor has done to protect its interests,laws and its people. I will not, nor shall or will anyone else, accept a sugar coated plea excuse for the right to break the laws of a neighboring country.What caused the economic failures is not my concern or very few others. Perhaps you should be pointing a finger or two at your politicans that goofed (that my friend - is putting it mildly) .
Lets review the statements:Mexico slams Georgia migrant law
The Mexican government has condemned a tough new immigration law passed in the US state of Georgia on Monday.
Presidential spokesman Ruben Aguilar said the legislation discriminated against Mexicans and that diplomats would monitor how it was applied.
The law, which will take effect next year, prevents illegal immigrants from receiving many social services.
It will also require police and employers to report undocumented workers to the Immigration Service.
WHAT right does Mexico have to 'condem' our laws - new or old? NONE. Is this the same government which has threw its citizens into poverty thru failing to properly manage? At this point how can the Mexican government afford to buy used military aircraft, supply its soliders with newly acquired weapons? The Interests Mexico should have is to feed its own people , not BT/WMD/Other terriorist affairs.
Additionally:"The referred legislation incurs discriminatory acts against the Mexican population and those of Mexican origin," Mr Aguilar said.
There is no talk of 'discrimination', an 'illegal or undocumented worker' has no right afforded to him/her. to declare 'descrimination' one must be a citizen of the US. The point of Mr.Aguilar is moot.
"It is our responsibility to ensure that our famous Georgia hospitality is not abused, that our taxpayers are not taken advantage of and that our citizens are protected," Mr Perdue.
This is a stance/position which every governor of the Union, lastly the Presindent of the US must portray.
["It is a punitive bill," said the president of the Georgia Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, Sara Gonzalez.
To Sara Gonalez: TOUGH. Get used to it. There will be many more just like it.

Perhaps insulting you even more will force you and others to correct the politicans who force your expats to illegally treaspass.
But then I am really a nice guy !

[Indianer]

While they are at it, can they strike back up the old Georgia flag with the stars and bars? It's just a flag afterall...

Screw Mexico...

just talked to them today about a journalism assignment, on their failed attempt to legalize narcotics in small; personel amounts.

[dangerdan]

I'm buying guns and ammo for the American Revolution part Deux p-)

[praetorian6]

Yes, it's BS I know, but that's how we operate...trying to make things complete balanced (and individual words do make a difference unfortunately).

What is the difference between this and spin? All that is resulting from the media doing this is putting a postitive spin on a bad situation. It's not helping the problem, it's making it worse by showing the ILLEGAL immigrants in a softer, more friendly light. It almost makes them sound like the victims. You're right, it is BS.

You're also right about the individual words making a difference. The media could do the country a service by using the ones that most accurately describe the facts.

[shocker1]

Us Journalists (myself I am a journalism student) use our own dictionary, which has entries for most words. For example, most news services and my journalism college use the "AP Style."


Now we are getting to the heart of the problem. I have been using Websters you should try it sometime.

[Creeper]

Lets put the media issues aside.

[Sancho Pancho]

When it comes to illegal immigrants, Mejico needs to practice what it preaches. Until then.....the Mexican government can chupa mi pinga!!

[tuercas]

When it comes to illegal immigrants, Mejico needs to practice what it preaches. Until then.....the Mexican government can chupa mi pinga!!
can you tell us what the Mexican government is preaching?

[Sancho Pancho]

can you tell us what the Mexican government is preaching?

....Mejico demands that we rectify the status all of its illegal immigrants, while they refuse to do the same to their illegal immegrants from the south. How's that for starters?

If you can read the King's language, try reading this very interesting article:

http://dfw.com/mld/laestrella/14372569.htm

[annihilation]

no need to drop the F bombs

dont get too upset about Vicente Fox being negative against moves by GA to address illegal imigration. the Mex gvt is going to do what any gvt anywhere would do ,protect its citizens no matter what with pr statements, specially with elections 2 months away. GA is going to do what they need to do and if they are going for the companies first that use fake ssn cards and such, they are actually doing it in a logical manner.

x2...................

[tuercas]

....Mejico demands that we rectify the status all of its illegal immigrants, while they refuse to do the same to their illegal immegrants from the south. How's that for starters?

http://dfw.com/mld/laestrella/14372569.htm
Mexico does allow illegal imigrants to rectify their status. Illegals are not deported rigth away and are afforded contact to their respective embassies and consulates . the ones that are deported are the ones who refuse to identify where they came from or have absolutely no form of identification, many illegals lie about where they came from so that they are only expelled to Guatemala and that way they can come back more easily. illegals that are arrested may be detained for months to give them the oportunity to legalize their status

If you can read the King's language, try reading this very interesting article:
I can read English well enough. So well in fact that i can educate you in the correct usage of the reference to the English language as the language of the British monarchs. When such a reference is made, it is customary to make reference to the current monarch, in this case the the reference should have been "If you can read the Queen's English"

[Sancho Pancho]

Mexico does allow illegal imigrants to rectify their status. Illegals are not deported rigth away and are afforded contact to their respective embassies and consulates . the ones that are deported are the ones who refuse to identify where they came from or have absolutely no form of identification, many illegals lie about where they came from so that they are only expelled to Guatemala and that way they can come back more easily. illegals that are arrested may be detained for months to give them the oportunity to legalize their status


I can read English well enough. So well in fact that i can educate you in the correct usage of the reference to the English language as the language of the British monarchs. When such a reference is made, it is customary to make reference to the current monarch, in this case the the reference should have been "If you can read the Queen's English"

Lighten up Francis. The article and your statement on giving the right to rectify immigration status clash. Take it up with the newspaper and its writer.

As for the referernce to British monarchs, when I posted the article and asked if you spoke the "King's language", it was referring to a King whose language is "Castellano". Currently there is no King in London, only a Queen. But there is a King living in Madrid.

p.s. Hommes lo dudo mucho que me puedas dar lecciones de gramatica en los dos idiomas que tu y yo hablamos.

[tuercas]

Lighten up Francis. The article and your statement on giving the right to rectify immigration status clash. Take it up with the newspaper and its writer.

too late to ask to take your comments ligthly when you post that my country's government can perform oral sex on you. I welcome debate and criticism but not ignorant remarks or name calling towards myself or my countrymen.

[JKD]

My ideas about legal and illegal immigration:

Build a wall. At least in the populated areas. If you're in Tijuana or Juarez looking up north to the border it should look like the fvcking Walls of Mordor or something.

Make sure each and every vehicle crossing into the US is searched. By a person, with dogs, and with sensors.

Ask the Border Patrol how much manpower they need and then give them more than that. Give 'em whatever equipment they need. UAVs, helicopters, sensors, whatever.

Make it a felony to hire an undocumented worker.

On a voluntary basis, use prisoners and maybe those sentenced to community service as cheap labor for the jobs that Illegals currently occupy.

Don't just bus Illegals a few miles right back across the border so they can just try again the same day. Put 'em on a Red Cross flight back to Mexico City.

Try and persuade American companies that are setting up factories in China and elsewhere around the world to build them in Mexico instead to create more jobs there.

Legal immigration is good. I am descended from legal immigrants. And the US just like most other developed nations has an aging population. We need to let people in to maintain a workforce in the decades ahead.

Increase the amount of people we'll let legally into the country.

Legal immigrants should be taught to speak and read English if they don't already know how and English should be one of the requirements for citizenship.

They should be given classes on American history and culture.

Help them find a places to live and jobs. Maybe even give them some starting out money if they need it.

They went through the process legally when so many others just break our laws and sneak across the border. I think that should be rewarded.

Just brainstorming. I don't know if any of these ideas are politically or financially realistic, or maybe if some of them are already in place. Just some thoughts.

[Sancho Pancho]

My ideas about legal and illegal immigration:

I've written to my complete congressional delegation asking that:

1. All remittences (the money that is sent back to the home country) be taxed at 30% and that such money be earmarked for Border Patrol needs.

2. All expenses of detention/deportation incurred by the US be refunded by the country of origin of the illegal alien. If they refuse, we can take attach their assets in the US and use them to offset our cost.

3. Create a certification program like the one for drugs. If a country fails to actively address the US demands for curtailment of illegal immigration, then all aid is cut off--excluding humanitarian aid.

4. Until US citizenship is obtained, no "advance parole" be granted to petitioners, REGARDLESS OF THE CAUSE. "Advance parole" is the permission a green card holder requires from ICE to be able to leave the US and travel overseas. That means no trips back home to visit grandma at her death bed.

5. Permanent Residency Status (green card) cannot be received ahead of legal petitioners. If, for example, a legal petitioner has to wait 10 years to obtain a green card to immigrate to the US, then the amnestied illegal has to wait in temporary status for 10 years before the green card is awarded.

So what the result?

--Lots of $$ for the Border Patrol paid by the illegals.
--Foreign nations pay our deportation costs
--Fear of God on nations that do not cooperate with our immigration requests
--10+ years as temporary, plus 6 years as a green card holder before you can apply for citizenship. Add 1 year waiting for the ok on the citizenship. That's close to 20 years from the day of amnesty petition is filed until that person can leave the US to go back to their country for a visit.

RESULT: Plenty of time for them to assimilate to our culture.

[tuercas]

My ideas about legal and illegal immigration....
i dont agree with the idea of walls and flying people to mexico city, it is too expensive and all it will do is simply delay somewhat the return of these people to the US. i agree with your idea of panalising those who hire illegals, its the only real solution.

i like your idea about trade with china, if the US would impose tariffs on china and protect its own industry we would benefit as well, we follow nafta to the letter and no imported goods come in from china UNLESS they come from the US. rigth now we are in bad shape because american companies are sending alot of cheap chinese products with whom Mexican products cannot compete.

the US needs a national ID program like the laser cards available in the border region that cannot be easily forged and citizenship and legal residency must be verified by all employers with the gvt instead of simply keeping SSN cards on file without verification. the requirement for learning english and american history is already in place and i agree with it as well, when in rome as the romans after all.

[annihilation]

I think the wall is a great and viable option. People talk about the cost but come on look at this government. All of a sudden they care where 6 billion dollars go when they dumped 300+ billion in Iraq? I don't think 6 billion will do that much to our overall debt.

[tuercas]

I think the wall is a great and viable option. People talk about the cost but come on look at this government. All of a sudden they care where 6 billion dollars go when they dumped 300+ billion in Iraq? I don't think 6 billion will do that much to our overall debt.
walls dont really work if someone makes the effor worthwhile to whoever wants to cross it . so they are not even worth the expense and effort. IF the US does not want a temporary worker program, sort of like the one with Canada, with Mexico, the US must eliminate the insentive to immigrate illegaly by penalising those who hire illegals so jobs wont be waiting for illegals anymore.

[Indianer]

I have an idea...

There is a company based in Phoenix that makes all the tasers the Police across the country use now.

They've been experimenting for several years with re-useable taser landmines.
How so you about a wall and a non-fatal,but immobilizing reinforcement of some taser landmines???

[annihilation]

walls dont really work if someone makes the effor worthwhile to whoever wants to cross it . so they are not even worth the expense and effort. IF the US does not want a temporary worker program, sort of like the one with Canada, with Mexico, the US must eliminate the insentive to immigrate illegaly by penalising those who hire illegals so jobs wont be waiting for illegals anymore.

I agree that they need to penalize those who hire illegal. I think its a combination of things needed for an effective immigration plan.

[Sancho Pancho]

walls dont really work if someone makes the effor worthwhile to whoever wants to cross it . so they are not even worth the expense and effort. IF the US does not want a temporary worker program, sort of like the one with Canada, with Mexico, the US must eliminate the insentive to immigrate illegaly by penalising those who hire illegals so jobs wont be waiting for illegals anymore.


I don't disagree with many of your points, but I think in the end we'll build the wall just the same. There are many groups with different ideas which will pressure the government to build large sections of wall. Whether it's to reassure the population that something is being done, or to create a feeling of security, a belief that it will deter many illegals, or maybe some people see it as just a way of giving the middle finger to Mexico.

Regardless of the different positions, large portions of wall are going to go up.

Plenty of space for murals.

[tuercas]

I agree that they need to penalize those who hire illegal. I think its a combination of things needed for an effective immigration plan.
if the aproach that is taken is just a wall, the US is seting up for failure on its illegal imigration policy.

I don't disagree with many of your points, but I think in the end we'll build the wall just the same. There are many groups with different ideas which will pressure the government to build large sections of wall. Whether it's to reassure the population that something is being done, or to create a feeling of security, a belief that it will deter many illegals, or maybe some people see it as just a way of giving the middle finger to Mexico.

Regardless of the different positions, large portions of wall are going to go up.

Plenty of space for murals.
far chanse such a wall will be used for murals. the wall, at least what is planed from eagle pass to brownsville sector will mostly be lines of electronic sensors. the river is enough of a barrier already and on the american side the bank is very steep. this is the section of the "wall" that will go up first. physical walls will only be set up where urban areas meet with the border like nogales and tijuana, there is a wall there already and it does not really help. good luck with that.

[annihilation]

if the aproach that is taken is just a wall, the US is seting up for failure on its illegal imigration policy.




Of course the wall alone wont help, but as part of an overall package it will. A wall from ocean to the other.

Personally until mexico cleans up their immigration policy they shouldn't be even voicing any concerns with the US. We should maybe offer anyone but mexico work visa papers if they wish to continue to complain and demand. Thats always an option.

[tuercas]

Of course the wall alone wont help, but as part of an overall package it will. A wall from ocean to the other.

Personally until mexico cleans up their immigration policy they shouldn't be even voicing any concerns with the US. We should maybe offer anyone but mexico work visa papers if they wish to continue to complain and demand. Thats always an option.


The mexican president will always make public statement and use alot of rhetoric but its just talk after all . any world leader would speak on behalf of his countrymen even if these country men are in the wrong side of any issue.

[fremen]

My ideas about legal and illegal immigration:
Build a wall. At least in the populated areas. If you're in Tijuana or Juarez looking up north to the border it should look like the fvcking Walls of Mordor or something.

Make sure each and every vehicle crossing into the US is searched. By a person, with dogs, and with sensors.

Make it a felony to hire an undocumented worker.


Some of you people are completely out of touch with reality, that or at least totally ignorant about the dinamics of the US-Mexico border. I'll tell you about my neck of the woods:
Regarding the "Walls of Mordor". The El Paso Times recently published the results of a poll it took among El Paso residents and it showed that two thirds of the population were against it. El Paso, TX. depends economically on Juárez, Chih. Juarenses that come over to shop constitute 25% to 30% of all sales in El Paso. Nothing would kill this better that to treat visitors from México in a draconian fashion, like as if they were all criminals. Last May 1, during the "Day without an Immigrants" demonstrations, Juarenses showed their support for their countrymen in the US by boycotting El Paso. The international bridges were empty on a day in which El Paso merchants expected to make big sales from Mexicans comming across (May 1 is "Labour Day" in México and most of them didn't work). As a result malls and stores in El Paso were nearly empty, and local businesses took a big hit. On the other side of the border, Mexican businesses increased their sales dramatically (35%). If you try to strangle international commerce, it's US businesses that suffer and Mexican businesses that gain. You'd be shooting yourselves in the foot. I don't think the local city government nor the chambers of commerce would sit quietly while you try to construct some sort of idiotic DMZ disconnecting them from the goose that lays the golden eggs.
Some of you also speak about México as if it were North Korea or Iran. An enemy nation that contributes nothing to the US economy. You forget that México is the US' third largest import partner (behind Canada and China), and the second largest export partner, only behind Canada (that's right, México buys more stuff from the US than China or any single European country!). Also, they supply the US with a s**tload of oil. (Source: The CIA World Factbook)
México is also the number one foreign nation where more US citizens choose to retire. Up to 1,000,000 by some estimates (there are no exact numbers because many are illegaly in México).
Someone also mentioned taxing remitances by Mexicans to their relatives by 30% (remitances go directly to families, not to the Mexican government). What makes you think that they would be so willing (and stupid) to hand over money to the US government if they don't even hand it over to their government. Besides, hypothetically, lets imagine that my brother in-law lives in AZ in a point far away from the border, makes a deposit in to my account (a perfectly legal and normal procedure), I then withdraw it, drive across into México (because I live on the border), walk into a bank and deposit the money into his mother's account. She, wherever she may live in México, goes to an ATM machine and withdraws the money. As simple as that, and you or no one else can touch that money. The Feds won't notice because we are talking about small ammounts, clearly under the radar. Tax that!
P.S. I can think of many other ways to send money that you wouldn't be able to touch.

[AOCBravo2004]

Some of you people are completely out of touch with reality, that or at least totally ignorant about the dinamics of the US-Mexico border. I'll tell you about my neck of the woods:
Regarding the "Walls of Mordor". The El Paso Times recently published the results of a poll it took among El Paso residents and it showed that two thirds of the population were against it. El Paso, TX. depends economically on Juárez, Chih. Juarenses that come over to shop constitute 25% to 30% of all sales in El Paso. Nothing would kill this better that to treat visitors from México in a draconian fashion, like as if they were all criminals.

Again, as said time and time again, and yet again and again and again, yet people still choose to ignore the difference between LEGALS and ILLEGALS!!! No one is trying to stop people who cross from Mexico to the US LEGALLY to do business!!! The only people that are being treated as criminals are those that cross the border illegally, thus breaking the law. Hmm law breakers, considered criminals??? What a concept!!!

[fremen]

Again, as said time and time again, and yet again and again and again, yet people still choose to ignore the difference between LEGALS and ILLEGALS!!! No one is trying to stop people who cross from Mexico to the US LEGALLY to do business!!! The only people that are being treated as criminals are those that cross the border illegally, thus breaking the law. Hmm law breakers, considered criminals??? What a concept!!!

You probably don't pay much attention to some of the posts on this site. There are retards here that refer to Mexicans IN México as illegals, as if they could be illegal while in their own country. The morons in the minuteman organization make a stink whenever they see the Mexican Army patrolling on the Mexican side of the border!!! How stupid can that be??? So, pay a little bit more attention to the Mexicophobes who dwell in this place and learn how many are incapable of making distinctions.

[I'mOnlyHalfPolish]

so if we penalize the co's that hire them...what happens to the 11 million (i believe +) illegals already here? will they take the streets in protest over co's not being able to hire illegals...? what would happen to mexico if a significant portion came back b/c of lack of work in US (including latin americans)? should we expect that they would "voluntarily" return to their countries of origin?

[AOCBravo2004]

The morons in the minuteman organization make a stink whenever they see the Mexican Army patrolling on the Mexican side of the border!!! How stupid can that be??? So, pay a little bit more attention to the Mexicophobes who dwell in this place and learn how many are incapable of making distinctions.

How stupid can that be??? Probably as stuipd if not less stupid then the protestors who fail/ignore or are too stupid/ignorant to distinguish between legal and illegal immigration when it comes to proposed legislation. Hell the Mexican Government makes a big stink of the Minuteman Organization for patrolling on the American side of the border. We can go like this all day. So I'll say this, let's agree to disagree. Though I think we could both agree that American companies should be punished severly for breaking the law.

Immigration is a wonderful thing, if done legally like my parents did, from Mexico.

I don't pay too much attention to some posts, especially the 3-4 word ones.

[JKD]

Some of you people are completely out of touch with reality, that or at least totally ignorant about the dinamics of the US-Mexico border. I'll tell you about my neck of the woods:
Regarding the "Walls of Mordor". The El Paso Times recently published the results of a poll it took among El Paso residents and it showed that two thirds of the population were against it. El Paso, TX. depends economically on Juárez, Chih. Juarenses that come over to shop constitute 25% to 30% of all sales in El Paso. Nothing would kill this better that to treat visitors from México in a draconian fashion, like as if they were all criminals. Last May 1, during the "Day without an Immigrants" demonstrations, Juarenses showed their support for their countrymen in the US by boycotting El Paso. The international bridges were empty on a day in which El Paso merchants expected to make big sales from Mexicans comming across (May 1 is "Labour Day" in México and most of them didn't work). As a result malls and stores in El Paso were nearly empty, and local businesses took a big hit. On the other side of the border, Mexican businesses increased their sales dramatically (35%). If you try to strangle international commerce, it's US businesses that suffer and Mexican businesses that gain. You'd be shooting yourselves in the foot. I don't think the local city government nor the chambers of commerce would sit quietly while you try to construct some sort of idiotic DMZ disconnecting them from the goose that lays the golden eggs.
Some of you also speak about México as if it were North Korea or Iran. An enemy nation that contributes nothing to the US economy. You forget that México is the US' third largest import partner (behind Canada and China), and the second largest export partner, only behind Canada (that's right, México buys more stuff from the US than China or any single European country!). Also, they supply the US with a s**tload of oil. (Source: The CIA World Factbook)

I've crossed the bridge from El Paso into Juarez and back again many many times(granted, never sober on the retun trip. "Drink and drown"). A wall of mordor, which was mostly a joke, wouldn't be neccesary there as the Rio Grande forms a pretty good barrier. You'd need a wall, something somebody couldn't easily climb or dig under, further down about where that shanty town on the west end of J-town starts and the river cuts north, and run for another ten miles or so.

If there were enough BP officers on hand, if we gave them enough manpower, searching vehicles wouldn't take long at all. I fail to see how scanning a car to see if there's any people hiding inside, drugs, or anything else illegal(saw it on National Geographic. Somehow they scan through with light I guess) having a dog walk around sniffing for the same, and having a person have a look-see to see if he notices anything out of the ordinary are "draconian". A nation has the right to secure it's borders. If there are enough personnel on hand it wouldn't take very long. I, as a caucasian US citizen, have gone through check points on I10 East, I10 West, on 72 between Alamogordo and Las Cruces, and 54 from El Paso to Alamogordo, where I have to assure the BP agent that yes everyone in the vehicle is a US citizen, have him look in and around the vehicle to see if there's probable cause for a detailed search, ask where I'm coming from and going, etc. And y'know what? I don't f*cking complain about that. As a law abiding citizen I'm glad they're there doing what they're doing.

But if El Paso wants to be on the Mexico side of any fences or Border Patrol patrolling, okay then. Place is a sh!thole anyway.

I don't see why you quoted the part about making employing illegals, not legal, immigrants a felony. Yes those folks who encourage people to in some cases risk their lives to come here to get taken advantage of by working **** jobs for **** pay are truly saints aren't they?

You forgot to quote the part where I said we should try and increase the amount of jobs available for Mexicans in Mexico. You forgot to quote where I said legal immigration is good and we should increase the amount of people who can do just that and assist them in their new life here in the states.

No one idea I posted would work alone by itself without others. There's no magic bullet to stop illegal immigration.


México is also the number one foreign nation where more US citizens choose to retire. Up to 1,000,000 by some estimates (there are no exact numbers because many are illegaly in México).
If they're there illegally the Mexican government should kick them out.

[fremen]

Again, as said time and time again, and yet again and again and again, yet people still choose to ignore the difference between LEGALS and ILLEGALS!!! No one is trying to stop people who cross from Mexico to the US LEGALLY to do business!!! The only people that are being treated as criminals are those that cross the border illegally, thus breaking the law. Hmm law breakers, considered criminals??? What a concept!!!

Yes, I think that you and I will just have to agree to disagree, but let me throw one interesting concept your way before I go to bed tonight. Did you know that I am a criminal, that is a criminal under your perspective. Let me tell you why. The other day I was driving on that interstate that passes by your city, I-10, on the very crowded part in between Tucson and Phoenix. I must confess that I broke the law, because I was doing 80 mph when the speed limit was 75 mph. Under your vision of the law, since I broke the law (which I have done several times when driving on interstate highways, and which half the drivers on them also do), I am a criminal and should be treated as such. So shoot me.
Entering the country illegaly to look for work is against the law, I understand that, but there is a difference between that and being a criminal. A criminal is someone that makes a living out of breaking the law, someone that is habitual, like a smuggler, a thief or burglar, a murderer, a credit card scam artist, a drug dealer, a world leader responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of people, etc. But to call someone a criminal because the only thing that they want is to find work to feed their kids, that is just plain being a dick. Especially, when those "criminals" help to make the food that you eat cheaper, the house that you bought more affordable, help to keep many businesses afloat and make them more competitive, take care of your kids and elderly, clean your house, etc, etc.
Yes, "carnal", you and I will just have to disagree.

[AOCBravo2004]

Yes, I think that you and I will just have to agree to disagree, but let me throw one interesting concept your way before I go to bed tonight. Did you know that I am a criminal, that is a criminal under your perspective. Let me tell you why. The other day I was driving on that interstate that passes by your city, I-10, on the very crowded part in between Tucson and Phoenix. I must confess that I broke the law, because I was doing 80 mph when the speed limit was 75 mph. Under your vision of the law, since I broke the law (which I have done several times when driving on interstate highways, and which half the drivers on them also do), I am a criminal and should be treated as such. So shoot me.
Entering the country illegaly to look for work is against the law, I understand that, but there is a difference between that and being a criminal. A criminal is someone that makes a living out of breaking the law, someone that is habitual, like a smuggler, a thief or burglar, a murderer, a credit card scam artist, a drug dealer, a world leader responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of people, etc. But to call someone a criminal because the only thing that they want is to find work to feed their kids, that is just plain being a dick. Especially, when those "criminals" help to make the food that you eat cheaper, the house that you bought more affordable, help to keep many businesses afloat and make them more competitive, take care of your kids and elderly, clean your house, etc, etc.
Yes, "carnal", you and I will just have to disagree.

Actually I'm 99.9% sure that your speedometer is wrong, typically all speedometer's are off by several MPH. Mine is off by about 5MPH, I've tested this using GPS. I'm also sure that you are aware of the difference between MOVING VIOLATIONS and CRIMINAL OFFENSES, now if you were doing 86+ then you would be on the criminal side of the law. Now, if you were pulled over for going 5mph over the speed limit you would only get a citation, it is not a misdemeanor offense, which currently crossing the border illegally is. Someone that is making a living out of breaking the law? Well, if you want to get into semantics, then every day an illegal is in the United States illegally is another day of breaking the law.

[fremen]

I've crossed the bridge from El Paso into Juarez and back again many many times(granted, never sober on the retun trip. "Drink and drown"). A wall of mordor, which was mostly a joke, wouldn't be neccesary there as the Rio Grande forms a pretty good barrier. You'd need a wall, something somebody couldn't easily climb or dig under, further down about where that shanty town on the west end of J-town starts and the river cuts north, and run for another ten miles or so.

If there were enough BP officers on hand, if we gave them enough manpower, searching vehicles wouldn't take long at all. I fail to see how scanning a car to see if there's any people hiding inside, drugs, or anything else illegal(saw it on National Geographic. Somehow they scan through with light I guess) having a dog walk around sniffing for the same, and having a person have a look-see to see if he notices anything out of the ordinary are "draconian". A nation has the right to secure it's borders. If there are enough personnel on hand it wouldn't take very long. I, as a caucasian US citizen, have gone through check points on I10 East, I10 West, on 72 between Alamogordo and Las Cruces, and 54 from El Paso to Alamogordo, where I have to assure the BP agent that yes everyone in the vehicle is a US citizen, have him look in and around the vehicle to see if there's probable cause for a detailed search, ask where I'm coming from and going, etc. And y'know what? I don't f*cking complain about that. As a law abiding citizen I'm glad they're there doing what they're doing.

But if El Paso wants to be on the Mexico side of any fences or Border Patrol patrolling, okay then. Place is a sh!thole anyway.

I don't see why you quoted the part about making employing illegals, not legal, immigrants a felony. Yes those folks who encourage people to in some cases risk their lives to come here to get taken advantage of by working **** jobs for **** pay are truly saints aren't they?

You forgot to quote the part where I said we should try and increase the amount of jobs available for Mexicans in Mexico. You forgot to quote where I said legal immigration is good and we should increase the amount of people who can do just that and assist them in their new life here in the states.

No one idea I posted would work alone by itself without others. There's no magic bullet to stop illegal immigration.



If they're there illegally the Mexican government should kick them out.

Too bad that the only reason that you cross the border is to get drunk. It might surprise you to know, but Ciudad Juárez has a lot of history. Being founded in the mid-seventeenth century makes it older than most of the United States. The place was considered an "Eden" by most travelers that passed by including the famous Alenxander von Humboldt. It produced wines that were considered quite good. It was the objective of many battles during the time of the Mexican Revolution, including the decisive one of the first stage in May 1911. The site of the first use of airplanes in war also.
There are plenty of very good restaurants in Juárez, much better than in El Paso or many other US cities where all that you see are the same restaurants over and over again. Too bad that you only go there to get drunk, that means that you will never get to see some of the very interesting cultural events, museums (the Juárez History Museum blows away anything in El Paso), film festivals, sporting events, theater, etc.
In regards to your "ideas" for the international bridges, I have news for you, the BP doesn't staff them, it is staffed by Customs and Immigration, and everything you said that should be done, is already being done. The only problem that I see is that they do it with rudeness and arrogance. Waits of two hours in the heat are not uncommon, as are stupid questions when you finally reach the inspectors (like my favorite: "What was the purpose of your visit to México?", as if I were going to tell them if I had done something illegal). I find going to Juárez to shop, have some good food and drink (in moderation), getting my hair cut, shoes shinned, visiting a dentist, and all that one can do on the other side, very, very refreshing. The only thing that s*cks is the unpleasant experience on the way back. Some US inspectors can be real a-holes, regardless of whether you are law abiding or not. I would bet my left nut that they don't treat Canadians that way.
Now, about "we" trying to increase the number of jobs available in México, my question is who do you think you are? México is a sovereign nation and the US doesn't have a free hand there. Just like you demmand respect for US sovereignty, Mexicans have a right to make their own decisions, they aren't children and México is not the US' backyard or apendage.
Your point about El Paso being a ****hole and about it being on the Mexican side of the wall is just plain dumb. El Paso is a part of the US, and El Pasoans are US citizens and have a right to their opinion, even if they rankle your feathers. I think that being on the border makes it a great place to live, and if you don't like it, all the better.

[JKD]

Too bad that the only reason that you cross the border is to get drunk.Haven't been there since I was my late teens/very early twenties. Good times.

It might surprise you to know, but Ciudad Juárez has a lot of history. That wouldn't surprise me at all. All places have a history.

Too bad that you only go there to get drunk, That's what college age kids went there for and I'm assuming still do.

that means that you will never get to see some of the very interesting cultural events, museums (the Juárez History Museum blows away anything in El Paso), film festivals, sporting events, theater, etc.
If I'm ever there again I'll look into that.
In regards to your "ideas" for the international bridges, I have news for you, the BP doesn't staff them, it is staffed by Customs and Immigration, and everything you said that should be done, is already being done. The only problem that I see is that they do it with rudeness and arrogance. Waits of two hours in the heat are not uncommon, as are stupid questions when you finally reach the inspectors (like my favorite: "What was the purpose of your visit to México?", as if I were going to tell them if I had done something illegal). I find going to Juárez to shop, have some good food and drink (in moderation), getting my hair cut, shoes shinned, visiting a dentist, and all that one can do on the other side, very, very refreshing. The only thing that s*cks is the unpleasant experience on the way back. Some US inspectors can be real a-holes, regardless of whether you are law abiding or not. I would bet my left nut that they don't treat Canadians that way.
I'd bet my left nut fewer laws are broken along the US/Canada border.

Now, about "we" trying to increase the number of jobs available in México, my question is who do you think you are?
I am someone who sees a country to my south that has a huge unemployment, underemployment, and coruption problem. And it's citizens are fleeing in droves, illegally to my country looking for work in what would be low paying jobs even for a US citizen(though a job someone would certainly be happy to have but the employer can pay an illegal even less) and making even less than that. I take it you are happy with that situation? You seem to be, if my suggesting that we a wealthier nation that would be in a situation to help create more jobs there so fewer of them would need to come to the US looking for work is some how insulting. Yes who do I think I am? Suggesting that Mexico obviously needs more jobs and that maybe we(America) could help out with that. I should be absolutely ashamed of myself.

I guess more jobs in Mexico would be a terrible thing.

México is a sovereign nation and the US doesn't have a free hand there. Just like you demmand respect for US sovereignty, Mexicans have a right to make their own decisions, they aren't children and México is not the US' backyard or apendage.
So now threatening the sovereignty of Mexico by thinking US companies should open factories in Mexico instead of China. Yeesh. You keep going on and on about these poor people who are just crossing the border illegally to look for work, well, what if there was work for them in their own damn country? How could that possibly be a bad thing? How in the hell is that insulting?

If a US company went to the Mexican government and said "hey we would like to build a factory in your country. It will employ a thousand full time employees" do you honestly think they would say no?

I guess the US should get offended everytime Toyota opens up a new plant in the US. "Those damn Japanese! Opening a factory and creating jobs here! Who do they think we are? Children?!"

Maybe you should be less concerned with how Americans feel about people who come into this country in violation of our laws and more concerned with the conditions in their home country that cause them to flee it in the first place.

Your point about El Paso being a ****hole and about it being on the Mexican side of the wall is just plain dumb. El Paso is a part of the US, and El Pasoans are US citizens and have a right to their opinion, even if they rankle your feathers. I think that being on the border makes it a great place to live, and if you don't like it, all the better.
I never said they didn't have a right to their opinion. I however am also entitled to mine. And if their opinion is that they don't want more border enforcement in the El Paso area, fine, I don't see why we couldn't oblige that. We could just secure the border around the city or county limits. Let them have all the illegal aliens they want.

[Mastermind]

Georgia makes me proud! Now, if only my Federal Gvt would grow some spheres.

[Supe]

No good coming out of this??? HELLO!!! The less the state has to pay in benefits to illegals, the more money the state will have!!!

She's an opportunist that could care less about the citizens of Georgia, just her 'base'. The issue is not complicated at all. People are illegally entering the U.S. Automatically this puts them in the law breaker bracket. They've abrogated any rights they had to gain citizenship. Those folks going through the legal process to become U.S citizens must be incredulous at the current state of affairs.

Since becoming Mexico's president in 2000, Vicente Fox has been pressing for reforms that would allow more Mexicans to work legally in the US.

Instead of working to create jobs for Mexicans in U.S, he should be applying the same energy to creating jobs domestically. There is tremendous economic potential in Mexico. I cannot see why Mexico can't become an emerging economic power to rival emerging economies of China and India.

Unfortunately, it appears that a parasitical culture exists within the political elite of Mexico. Evidently they expect U.S to shoulder the burden of carrying the bloated tick that is Mexico. It's time to dump that load. Close those borders and enforce American territorial sovereignty.

[Mastermind]

The issue is that a vast underground employment system is exploiting 12 million people. We, as a government, have no idea who these people are, what their status is or what taxes they are not paying. We pay for their medical and the education of their children and the care of them when they get old. They live in a gray zone of hidden existance. They are exploited by their compatriots, the American employers and the American government.

With a registered guest worker program, they could be much better protected from unscrupulous employers, taxed, insured and sent back to their native country with hefty retirement plans. Some could prove their law abiding status and eventually become new American citizens...LEGALLY! But, this sytem we have now is just crap for them and for the United States.

[annihilation]

Some of you people are completely out of touch with reality, that or at least totally ignorant about the dinamics of the US-Mexico border. I'll tell you about my neck of the woods:
Regarding the "Walls of Mordor". The El Paso Times recently published the results of a poll it took among El Paso residents and it showed that two thirds of the population were against it. El Paso, TX. depends economically on Juárez, Chih. Juarenses that come over to shop constitute 25% to 30% of all sales in El Paso. Nothing would kill this better that to treat visitors from México in a draconian fashion, like as if they were all criminals. Last May 1, during the "Day without an Immigrants" demonstrations, Juarenses showed their support for their countrymen in the US by boycotting El Paso. The international bridges were empty on a day in which El Paso merchants expected to make big sales from Mexicans comming across (May 1 is "Labour Day" in México and most of them didn't work). As a result malls and stores in El Paso were nearly empty, and local businesses took a big hit. On the other side of the border, Mexican businesses increased their sales dramatically (35%). If you try to strangle international commerce, it's US businesses that suffer and Mexican businesses that gain. You'd be shooting yourselves in the foot. I don't think the local city government nor the chambers of commerce would sit quietly while you try to construct some sort of idiotic DMZ disconnecting them from the goose that lays the golden eggs.
Some of you also speak about México as if it were North Korea or Iran. An enemy nation that contributes nothing to the US economy. You forget that México is the US' third largest import partner (behind Canada and China), and the second largest export partner, only behind Canada (that's right, México buys more stuff from the US than China or any single European country!). Also, they supply the US with a s**tload of oil. (Source: The CIA World Factbook)
México is also the number one foreign nation where more US citizens choose to retire. Up to 1,000,000 by some estimates (there are no exact numbers because many are illegaly in México).
Someone also mentioned taxing remitances by Mexicans to their relatives by 30% (remitances go directly to families, not to the Mexican government). What makes you think that they would be so willing (and stupid) to hand over money to the US government if they don't even hand it over to their government. Besides, hypothetically, lets imagine that my brother in-law lives in AZ in a point far away from the border, makes a deposit in to my account (a perfectly legal and normal procedure), I then withdraw it, drive across into México (because I live on the border), walk into a bank and deposit the money into his mother's account. She, wherever she may live in México, goes to an ATM machine and withdraws the money. As simple as that, and you or no one else can touch that money. The Feds won't notice because we are talking about small ammounts, clearly under the radar. Tax that!
P.S. I can think of many other ways to send money that you wouldn't be able to touch.

Taxing money going to mexico I think is a bad idea. That money is mostly going to help people.

About the wall and how it would El Paso, Tx and other boarder towns. Well true they might suffer economic hardships but its not like its the first time that the government imposed economic hardship to an industry or a region when it signed treaties with other nations (NAFTA, china, etc). That is sadly a by product, one that we have taken before and survived and one we can take again if need be. So a small region of boarder town might be effected but I don't think that will be a big enough reason to stop building a wall.

Also the wall is useless with out enforcement of our own laws and penalize those who individuals who would hire illegals in america.

[haze99]

The USA has been in a ethical and morale decline for 40+ years. With that stated, American business's are wrong for hiring NON-Citizens in the first place. Then our State/Fed govt is wrong for not rounding up NON-Citizens and shipping them back to their true home country. And fining the US business that hired the Non-Citizens! Anything less than these actions is foolishness!
If we want to continue to be a 1st world nation we need to fix this today. If not, we will be a 3rd world nation in the next 20 years!