Shariah Law :)

[Ayura]

http://downloads1.nadeemdownloads.com/ISLAMIC%20SERVER%2001/Hamza%20Yusuf%20-%20Shariah,%20the%20Sacred%20Law.mp3


Interesting lecture.



Any specific questions however, should be directed to a local Shiekh in your area. Don't worry, you'll be perfectly safe inside a Mosque. I assure you :P.


(P.S. This lecture won't make you an expert in Islamic Law. You'll have to endure 10-20 years of Islamic Schooling for that)

[LazyLob]

So what sheik should we go and see. The local Saudi funded one with a Wahhabi slant?



Saw the link and the name of your hero. To say he is pretentious would be an understatement “….for a Muslim…., it’s interesting in Islam the definition of extremism also includes lack of religion, so people that are not religious are seen as extremists in that they are not fulfilling a basic human function……”

Hmmmm…right on.

BTW why do you place laughing smilies all over your posts?

[Ayura]

So what sheik should we go and see. The local Saudi funded one with a Wahhabi slant?



Saw the link and the name of your hero. To say he is pretentious would be an understatement

Hmmmm…right on.

BTW why do you place laughing smilies all over your posts?


I have 2...

[Ayura]

“….for a Muslim…., it’s interesting in Islam the definition of extremism also includes lack of religion, so people that are not religious are seen as extremists in that they are not fulfilling a basic human function……”

Yes. People who do not engage in being nice to people, charity, forbidding evil in society etc is considered 'extremist'. If your not trying to stop a tyrant, your only helping it suceed.

[LazyLob]

That's why I asked. Yet I don't find sharia too smiley. What the hell has being nice got to do with religion?

[Ayura]

So what sheik should we go and see. The local Saudi funded one with a Wahhabi slant?


Usually, Saudi just funds the Mosques and that is it.

[Ayura]

That's why I asked. Yet I don't find sharia too smiley.


Fine - removed.

[ibstolidude]

Usually, Saudi just funds the Mosques and that is it.
by "Saudi" to whom or what do you refer? Are you stating the funding stops @ the mosque & is regardless of ideology?-2nd thought nevermind-removed.

[LazyLob]

Usually, Saudi just funds the Mosques and that is it.

“Usually”….and when its unusual what strings do the Saudis attach? Pray tell.

Going back to your hero. He says “lack of religion” and not “People who do not engage in being nice to people, charity, forbidding evil in society”. What happens if someone is nice, charitable and not evil yet is not taken in by the god thingy? Coz he’s quite clear about it.

Give it a spin.

[Daniel1115]

Also, people interested in doing a bit of research to gain some fundamental knowledge of jurisprudence (figh) can choose between the following schools (madhhabs):

Shafi'i - conservative.
Hanbali - very conservative.
Maliki - liberal.
Hanafi - very liberal.Most of the Muslims I know follow Hanafi principles.

[Ayura]

“Usually”….and when its unusual what strings do the Saudis attach? Pray tell.

Going back to your hero. He says “lack of religion” and not “People who do not engage in being nice to people, charity, forbidding evil in society”. What happens if someone is nice, charitable and not evil yet is not taken in by the god thingy? Coz he’s quite clear about it.

Give it a spin.


Well, I'm not Hamza Yusuf.

Try emailing the Zaytuna Instituite with your question. You'll get an answer soon enough.

[Firetxmi]

“Usually”….and when its unusual what strings do the Saudis attach? Pray tell.



Are all muslims bad?

Do you know a Muslim outside of the internet?

**These are honest questions I would like you to answer so I can better understand where you are coming from.**

[kinghk]

Don't worry, you'll be perfectly safe inside a Mosque. I assure you :P.



Police seize weapons in mosque raid (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/21/nmosq21.xml) :roll:

[Ayura]

Police seize weapons in mosque raid (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/21/nmosq21.xml) :roll:


That was the same Mosque under Abu Hamza right? Bears no surprise.

I guess we shouldn't step inside Churches, considering all the rape and things...

[block52]

That was the same Mosque under Abu Hamza right? Bears no surprise.

I guess we shouldn't step inside Churches, considering all the rape and things...


ok well I'll bite ayura.

rape? You wanna talk rape? Islam allows men to rape women captives in war.

Volume 7, Book 62, Number 137:
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:

We got female captives in the war booty and we used to do coitus interruptus with them. So we asked Allah's Apostle about it and he said, "Do you really do that?" repeating the question thrice, "There is no soul that is destined to exist but will come into existence, till the Day of Resurrection."


Anything else you want to discuss?

And last I checked rape is illegal in our western legal system. Muhammad your idol didn't have a problem with it as you can see in this very authentic hadith.

[LazyLob]

Are all muslims bad?

Do you know a Muslim outside of the internet?

**These are honest questions I would like you to answer so I can better understand where you are coming from.**

Are all Muslims bad?..... Why do you ask?. Just because I disagree with some Muslim "scholar's" sweeping, arrogant generalisation. I suppose you'd prefer we all just keep quiet and agree obediently with people making absurd statements about others? That is pretty spineless of you.

I am good friends with two Shia and several Sunni. My son has Muslim mates. Is that good enough for you? Mind you they're not very religious.

Now that we are opening our hearts to each other I am still waiting for you to answer my question on your sweeping generalisation about the crusades from sometime back. Or do you pick and choose?

Well, I'm not Hamza Yusuf.

Try emailing the Zaytuna Instituite with your question. You'll get an answer soon enough.

I'd probably get some religious double speak. But you're the one posting his videos and I would like the answer from you as he says that this point of view is common to all Muslims. Is this true? Am I not fulfilling a basic human function?

[annihilation]

Yes. People who do not engage in being nice to people, charity, forbidding evil in society etc is considered 'extremist'. If your not trying to stop a tyrant, your only helping it suceed.

Isn't half the middle east run by tyrants?

“….for a Muslim…., it’s interesting in Islam the definition of extremism also includes lack of religion, so people that are not religious are seen as extremists in that they are not fulfilling a basic human function……”
So how is lack of religion = to not being nice, charity and forbidding evil?

By the way I happily lack religion would that make me an extermist too?

[Ayura]

So how is lack of religion = to not being nice, charity and forbidding evil?


Because thats what Islam encompasses.

[annihilation]

Because thats what Islam encompasses.


You could fool me, i haven't been seeing much of that...

[Ayura]

You could fool me, i haven't been seeing much of that...


...Only if you watch CNN.

[LazyLob]

Because thats what Islam encompasses.

Only Islam?

[Ayura]

Only Islam?

Nope. Other religions do as well obviously.

[annihilation]

Nope. Other religions do as well obviously.


You could have fooled me on those too. lol

[Mailman]

I guess we shouldn't step inside Churches, considering all the rape and things...

I suspect thats probably a good thing for you mate...after all you would most likely end up bent over a pew getting it from behind! :D

Mailman

[LazyLob]

Nope. Other religions do as well obviously.

So what you are saying is that those who you consider are NOT religious are "extremsits" who "are not fulfilling basic human functions" and are not nice, cuddly etc etc..........................You're a bundle of laughs.....sounds..hmmm.... let me think.....extreme, blinkered?


Firextmi where are you ? I hope you're not doing one of your runners.

[VOD]

Yes. People who do not engage in being nice to people, charity, forbidding evil in society etc is considered 'extremist'. If your not trying to stop a tyrant, your only helping it suceed.

Right, because there are no tyrants in religions right?

If i stop being religious that does not mean i will not give charity, forbid evil, or being nice. :| I think its time you wave your self-righteous finger somewhere else.

[Firetxmi]

Firextmi where are you ? I hope you're not doing one of your runners.

No, no, Some just have a life other than forums and the internet...

As for my broad generalization of the Crusades, please refresh my memory.

[LazyLob]

No, no, Some just have a life other than forums and the internet...

As for my broad generalization of the Crusades, please refresh my memory.


Good answer. Not surprised though. Pot.

[Firetxmi]

Good answer. Not surprised though. Pot.

I don't remember what I said about the Crusades. What did I say in particular? Once I know more maybe then I can comment about it.

[LazyLob]

Use the search function and keep the reasoning on track.

[Firetxmi]

Use the search function and keep the reasoning on track.

Ok, I'll bite:

Please enlighten us about the crusades and those other "things" before and after. Dates included. Do you even know how these religions came about?

Edit. Its 21:32 here and I'm pissed as a fart. Probs off to bed soon.

Is this the question you want me to answer?

If so, I don't understand why you want me to explain history to you, I am not a History Professor, nor am I inclined to become one.

Be specific or go home.....

[LazyLob]

If so, I don't understand why you want me to explain history to you, I am not a History Professor, nor am I inclined to become one.

Well you seemed to want to sound like a prof.

Be specific or go home.....

Do I have to........? I want to stay here with you.


All I will say is Crusades, not to mention countless other things before and after...

I was waiting for your reply on this generalisation of yours within the context of those posts. I may not be as illuminated as you.


Edit:Actually I’ll oblige you, I’m buggering off. Just flew in back to the UK from an audit abroad and am knackered.

[Vorian]

ok well I'll bite ayura.

rape? You wanna talk rape? Islam allows men to rape women captives in war.

Volume 7, Book 62, Number 137:
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:

We got female captives in the war booty and we used to do coitus interruptus with them. So we asked Allah's Apostle about it and he said, "Do you really do that?" repeating the question thrice, "There is no soul that is destined to exist but will come into existence, till the Day of Resurrection."


Anything else you want to discuss?

And last I checked rape is illegal in our western legal system. Muhammad your idol didn't have a problem with it as you can see in this very authentic hadith.

Muhammad lived in the 7th century you idiot. Furthermore the Arabs were nomadic people with wild customs. Muhammad was an Arab, remember?
Besides, we Christians are not very innocent either. Let's see, Inquisition, Crusades(read about the massacre in Jerusalem), burning people at stake, etc. I could say that we are worst, at least Muslims are allowed to take lives by their religion, we are forbidden to kill but do so anyway. Even worst we have used the name of Christ to kill.

[Firetxmi]

Well you seemed to want to sound like a prof.



Do I have to........? I want to stay here with you.




I was waiting for your reply on this generalisation of yours within the context of those posts. I may not be as illuminated as you.


Edit:Actually I’ll oblige you, I’m buggering off. Just flew in back to the UK from an audit abroad and am knackered.

And I'll humor you.

I was relying to your comment of:
The problem is when you commit the crime because of your faith. Locus....cause and effect...etc..


My point was, Christians commited the acts of the Crusades in the name of their religion, at the expense of Muslims. Much like extremist Muslims wish to do with the west, and Christianity today.

[annihilation]

I could say that we are worst, at least Muslims are allowed to take lives by their religion, we are forbidden to kill but do so anyway. Even worst we have used the name of Christ to kill.

Christians are worse because they don't have the loophole in the clause as the muslims do? What happens if you get a decree from the pope that should be good enough....

We use the name of christ to kill, but they use the name of allah to kill. Whats the point?

[Erik2a4]

And I'll humor you.

I was relying to your comment of:


My point was, Christians commited the acts of the Crusades in the name of their religion, at the expense of Muslims. Much like extremist Muslims wish to do with the west, and Christianity today.

I don't believe that justifying islamic fundamentalist terrorism today by citing Christian (generally European) atrocities committed during the various Crusades makes sense.

Or should I still be upset with the Normans for 1066?

This discussion is silly, and reinforces my support of birth control and abortion.

[Firetxmi]

I don't believe that justifying islamic fundamentalist terrorism today by citing Christian (generally European) atrocities committed during the various Crusades makes sense.

Or should I still be upset with the Normans for 1066?

This discussion is silly, and reinforces my support of birth control and abortion.

I was not citing the Crusades as a justification in this forum. I was responding to a comment by Lazylob about another forum topic. Sorry for the confusion.

[Mailman]

My point was, Christians commited the acts of the Crusades in the name of their religion, at the expense of Muslims. Much like extremist Muslims wish to do with the west, and Christianity today.

You should actually read something about the Crusades because if you did you would realise that EVERYONE was fair game during the crusades...not just the muslims.

Mailman

[Firetxmi]

You should actually read something about the Crusades because if you did you would realise that EVERYONE was fair game during the crusades...not just the muslims.

Mailman

Well, yes. I was speaking specifically about 1 group in particular and not the Crusades as a whole. I understand that they were not the only ones targeted.

On that note,I am not discussing the Crusades any further in this thread, it is causing too much confusion and it is off topic- seeing as Lazylob is bringing in this debate from another thread. If anyone wishes to continue this conversation with me about my previous comment in another thread they can do it through PM.

[Ayura]

I could say that we are worst, at least Muslims are allowed to take lives by their religion, we are forbidden to kill but do so anyway. Even worst we have used the name of Christ to kill.

Erm - no we are not.


Do not take life which God has made sacred except in the course of Justice" (6:151), and "anyone who has killed a fellow human except in lieu of murder or mischief on earth, it would be as he slew the whole mankind" (5:32).


The Qu'ran makes a clear distinction between self-defense and killing.

[Ayura]

http://downloads1.nadeemdownloads.com/ISLAMIC%20SERVER%2001/hamza%20yusuf-zi--understanding%20jihad%20in%20Islam.mp3

[Firetxmi]

Erm - no we are not.




The Qu'ran makes a clear distinction between self-defense and killing.


:D
I love it when you have proof!

*I am not being sarcastic, it really makes me smile*

[Ayura]

ok well I'll bite ayura.

rape? You wanna talk rape? Islam allows men to rape women captives in war.

Volume 7, Book 62, Number 137:
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:

We got female captives in the war booty and we used to do coitus interruptus with them. So we asked Allah's Apostle about it and he said, "Do you really do that?" repeating the question thrice, "There is no soul that is destined to exist but will come into existence, till the Day of Resurrection."


Anything else you want to discuss?

And last I checked rape is illegal in our western legal system. Muhammad your idol didn't have a problem with it as you can see in this very authentic hadith.


First, it's nice to know that whilst you yourself lack Adab (manners), it is often people like you that demand Muslims to respect others. Remarkable eh?

Also, who gave you authority to dish out Hadith? People study for 15-30 years in the Shariah, and in the books of Hadith memorising a total 4000+ Hadith plus the wisdom and knowledge behind and Fiqh, etc etc and you just suddenly pull one off a website. Amazing. Could you tell me whether the hadith is Gharib, Aziz, Mashhur, Sahih or Hasan. Marfu'? Mawquf or Maqtu? Mu'allaq or Musal? Could you explain to me the grammatical structure in the Arabic also? Explain with Fiqh also.

Nah, didn't think so.

Anyways, read this;

Response:


Before i start with my response to sham shamoun’s comments i first want to tell the reader that only non-muslim prisoners of war could become slaves in islam (therefore slavery was doomed to disappear with the expansion of Islam). It’s important to know that slaves in islam had the same right to respect and good treatment like any other human being.,I shall show and proof the reader that the raping of female slaves is forbidden in islam, rather islam gave men the permission to have sexual intercourse with their slave-girl and this did certainly not mean that muslim men could rape their female slaves (female prisoners of war ) , since Allah swt and the prophet (saw) command muslim men to treat their slave girls well and with respect and dignity. The next quotations from the authentic hadith proof that the raping of female slaves is forbidden in islam:


Related by Al-Daraqutni, Ibn Majah and Ahmad:


“The Prophet said, “There shall be no infliction of harm on oneself or others".


‘Others’ includes all people, so also slavegirls ! Raping a slavegirl is clearly doing her harm (emotional and physical) which would be a big sin for a muslim to commit and violation of the above hadith. Moreover the prophet (peace be upon him) commanded muslims to treat their slaves well and with respect, which clearly proofs that rape of female slaves is forbidden in islam. The prophet (peace be upon him) said:




* Your servants and your slaves are your brothers. Anyone who has slaves should give them from what he eats and wears. He should not charge them with work beyond their capabilities. If you must set them to hard work, in any case I advise you to help them.

Source: Bukhari, Iman, 22; Adab, 44; Muslim, Iman, 38–40; Abu Dawud, Adab, 124



* Ali reported that the last words of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, were: "The prayer! The prayer! Fear Allah concerning your slaves ! "

Source: Al-Adab al-Mufrad Al-Bukhari , Nr. 158.



· Jabir ibn 'Abdullah said, "The Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, advised that slaves should be well-treated. He said, 'Feed them from what you eat and clothe them from what you wear. Do not punish what Allah has created.' "

Source: Al-Adab al-Mufrad Al-Bukhari , Nr. 188.



· Sallam ibn 'Amr reported from one of the Companions of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said, "Your slaves are your brothers, so treat him well. Ask for their help in what is too much for you and help them in what is too much for them."

Source: Al-Adab al-Mufrad Al-Bukhari , Nr. 190.



· Abu Hurayra reported that the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said, "The slave has his food and clothing. Do not burden a slave with work which he is incapable of doing."

Source: Al-Adab al-Mufrad Al-Bukhari , Nr. 192.





* Not one of you should [ when introducing someone ] say ‘This is my slave’ , ‘This is my concubine’. He should call them ‘my daughter’ or ‘my son’ or ‘my brother’.

Source: Ibn Hanbal, Musnad, 2 ,4





For this reason ‘Umar and his servant took it in turns to ride on the camel from Madina to Jerusalem on their journey to take control of Masjid al-Aqsa. While he was the head of the state, ‘Uthman had his servant pull his own ears in front of the people since he had pulled his. Abu Dharr, applying the hadith literally, made his servant wear one half of his suit while he himself wore the other half. From these instances, it was being demonstrated to succeeding generations of Muslims, and a pattern of conduct established, that a slave is fully a human being, not different from other people in his need for respect and dignity and justice.

"The masters were obliged not to put slaves under hardship; slaves were not to be tortured, abused or treated unjustly. They could marry among “themselves with their master's permission - or with free men or women ! They could appear as witnesses and participate with free men in all “affairs. Many of them were appointed as governors, commanders of army and administrators. In the eyes of Islam, a pious slave has precedence over “an impious free man." Source: Al-Tabataba'i, Tafsir ( vol.16, pp. 338-358 )

The Prophet, upon him peace, had stipulated in his "last pilgrimage" speech:



* "And your slaves ! see that you feed them such food as you eat yourselves and dress them what you yourself wear. And if they commit a “mistake which you are not inclined to forgive then sell them, for they are the servants of Allah and are not to be tormented! "

Source: Ibn Sa'd, op. cit., vol. II:1, p. 133


And again in another hadith the prophet (saw) makes clear that rape of female slaves is forbidden, The prophet (peace be upon him) said:



* “Whoever causes harm to others subjects himself to harm caused by God.”

Source: Related by Ibn Majah and Abu Dawood on the authority of Abu Sirmah.





* “You must refrain from dealing wickedly with others, for that would count as a benefaction you do to yourself”.

Source: Related by Al-Bukhari and Muslim on the authority of Abu Tharr.



‘Others’ includes all people, so also slavegirls ! Raping a slavegirl is clearly doing her harm (emotional and physical) which would be a big sin for a muslim to commit and violation of the above hadith. Allah swt also commands in the Qur’an muslims to treat their slaves (female slaves) kindly:

"Serve God, and join not any partners with Him ; and do good to parents, kinsfolk, orphans, those in need, neighbours who are near, neighbours “who are strangers, the Companion by your side, the way-farer (ye meet), And what your right hands possess : for God loveth not the arrogant, the “vainglorious" Surah An Nisa, verse 36

The phrase "What your right hands possess" refers to one’s slaves (male and female). Allah swt ordains the kind treatment of slaves in the same verse where He commands man to worship Him and to treat his parents, relations and neighbours generously, and this signifies the importance of this ruling.

For more proof read:: http://www.answering-christianity.com/right_hand_possession.htm





-Status of Slave Women in Islam


When Islam was reveled to Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him), slavery was a worldwide common social phenomenon; it was much older than Islam. Slavery was deeply rooted in every society to the extent that it was impossible to imagine a civilized society without slaves.


In spite of this social fact, Islam was the first religion to recognize slavery as a social illness that needed to be addressed. Since slavery was deeply rooted in the society, Islam did not abolish it at once. Rather, Islam treated slavery in the same manner it treated other social illnesses. Islam followed the same methodology of gradual elimination in dealing with this social disease as it did with other social illnesses, for example: the prohibition of alcohol in three steps.


Concerning having slave women, we would like to let you know that it happens to be a practice necessitated by the condition in which early Muslims found themselves vis-a-vis non-Muslims, as both parties engaged in wars. Slave women or milk al-yameen are referred to in the Qur'an as “Those whom your right hand possess” or “ma malakat aymanukum”; they are those taken as captives during conquests and subsequently became slaves, or those who were descendants of slaves.


Thus, it was a war custom in the past to take men and women as captives and then turn them into slaves. Islam did not initiate it, rather, it was something in practice long ago before the advent of Islam. And when Islam came, it tried to eradicate this practice, bit by bit. So it first restricted it to the reciprocal practice of war, in the sense that Muslims took war captives just as the enemies did with Muslims.


But as it aimed at putting an end to such issue, Islam laid down rules which would eventually lead to eradicating the practice. So it allowed Muslims to have intercourse with slave women taken as captives of just and legitimate wars. In so doing, the woman would automatically become free if she got pregnant. What's more, her child would also become free.


Not only that, Islam also ordered a Muslim to treat the slave woman in every respect as if she were his wife. She should be well fed, clothed and given due protection. In the family environment, she had the opportunity to learn about Islam and was free to accept it or reject it. She also had the opportunity to earn her freedom for she could be ransomed.

In the light of the above-mentioned facts, and the nature of the question posed by people, it's clear that some people misunderstand the wisdom behind the permissibility of having female slaves and think that it is meant to unleash men’s desires and give them more enjoyment. Never ! That is not the point ! It is, rather, means of freeing slaves; and this is clarified above in the fact that if a master got a female slave pregnant, then he could neither sell her nor give her away as a present. And if he died, she would not be considered part of his property. She'd receive her freedom and her baby would also be free.

But, we have to stress that this case should not be confused with that of female servants or maids, for they are free and not slaves. Therefore, it is forbidden to engage in sexual relations with them except through an Islamic marriage.

Slavery has been abolished by international conventions, and goes in line with aims and objectives of Islam, as it has called for centuries ago. As for marrying slaves, it is something permissible under two conditions: first, if one is unable to pay the dowry of a free woman. Second, if there is fear of committing adultery if one doesn’t get married. This is clarified by the following verse:

“And whose is not able to afford to marry free, believing women, let them marry from the believing maids whom your right hands possess. This is “for him among you who feareth to commit sin. But to have patience would be better for you.” (An-Nisaa’: 25)

This verse shows that Muslim men should abstain from illicit relations and seek enjoyment through marriage to free women or through their female slaves. In conclusion, Allah has forbidden certain types of behavior and permitted other kinds of behavior as a safeguard to the individual and to the society. Allah has forbidden fornication and adultery. However, in the case of captives whom your right hands posses, it's something necessitated by the special circumstances which were created when the Muslims were at war.”

Source: Status of Slave Women in Islam




-What about the female slaves who were married ?


Mufti Ebrahim Desai in his fatwa comments:

After their return to Islamic territory. Each soldier was then entitled to have relations only with the slave girl over which he was given the right of ownership and not with those slave girls that were not in his possession. This right of ownership was given to him by the “Ameerul-Mu'mineen” (Head of the Islamic state.) Due to this right of ownership, It became lawful for the owner of a slave girl to have intercourse with her ( which doesn’t mean that he can rape her, since doing harm to female slaves and rape in general is strict forbidden in islam, see the hadith quoted in my previous sections in this article as proof ).

If a slave woman was married previously in enemy territory to a non-Muslim, and is then captured alone, i.e. without her husband, it is not permissible for any Muslim to have relations with her until her previous marriage is nullified, and that is done by bringing her to an Islamic country and making her the legal possession of a Muslim. Bringing her into Islamic territory necessitates the rendering of her previous marriage as null and void by Islamic law because with her husband in enemy territory and she in Islamic territory, it becomes virtually impossible for them to meet and live as man and wife. That is why it is not permissible to have intercourse with a woman whose husband is also taken into captivity and put into slavery with her. Another resemblance between the two is that, just as a divorcee has to spend a period called "Iddat" before another man is allowed to marry her, similarly, a slave woman has to spend a period called "Istibraa" before her owner can have coition with her.

Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) enjoined his followers to treat the slaves kindly, gently, and, above all, to regard them as members of the family. In this way, they were made to feel wanted; which was far better than treating them as outcasts and leaving them to wander the streets of a strange society in a peniless, destitute condition. Such treatment would have ultimately forced them to take up evil occupations such as prostitution in the case of slave woman in order to fill their hungry stomachs. The First World War in 1914 was a clear reflection of the evils involved in setting captive women free to roars about in a strange society with strange surroundings. During that war, German and English women prisoners on either side were set free to roam the streets with no-one to feed them. The result was obvious that they resorted to other unrefined and uncivilised methods of income on the streets. Thus, it is evident that the Islamic treatment of women prisoners of war was conducive towards better social relations and led to the refinement of their overall social lives.

Over and above all this, History will show that Islam did not encourage slavery but rather encouraged moves towards the extirpation of slavery. Rasulullah Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam has said something to this effect in a Hadith, that: "Whosoever freed a Muslim slave, the Lord would redeem all his limbs - in compensation for each limb of the slave, so much so that the private parts for the private parts - from the Fire of Hell. If a slave woman becomes pregnant from her owner, and delivers his child, she automatically gets her freedom after the death of her master whose child she gave birth to.

Moreover, there are many wrongs and sins for which the liberation of a slave serves as a compensation and atonement. This was a further incentive for the extirpation of slavery. Rasulullah Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam also taught that whosoever teaches good manners to his slave girl, adorns her with politeness and good education, then frees her and gets married to her, for him there is double recompense and reward. These encouraging teachings served as incentives towards the emancipation of slaves and slaves were liberated by the thousands.


* Rasulullah Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam himself freed 63 slaves,
* Hazrat Abu Bakr Radhiallahu Anhu freed 63,
* Hazrat Abdur-Rahman bin Auf Radhiallahu Anhu 30,000;
* Hazrat Hakim bin Huzam Radhiallahu Anhu 100;
* Hazrat Abbas Radhiallahu Anhu 70;
k
* Hazrat Ayesha Radhiallahu Anha 69;
* Hazrat Abdullah bin Umar Radhiallahu Anhu 100;
* Hazrat Uthman Radhiallahu Anhu used to free one slave every Friday and he would say that he would free any slave who performed his prayers-with humility.
k
* Hazrat Zul-Kilah Radhiallahu Anhu freed 8,000 slaves in a single day.
* Hazrat Umar Radhiallahu Anhu passed certain laws during his Khilafat which led to the emancipation of thousands of slaves, and to the prevention of certain specific forms of slavery. Some of the edicts that he issued:




1. All the apostate tribes that were enslaved during the Khilaafat of Hazrat Abu Bakr Radhiallahu Anhu were to be freed.


2. A Zimmi (protected non-Muslim subject of an Islamic state) should not be enslaved.


3. Arabs will not be enslaved.


4. Those who had been enslaved during the days of ignorance (prior to the advent of Islam) and had lived to witness the Islamic era, should redeem themselves from slavery by paying their costs (their value) to their owners whether they were willing or not.


As a result of all these laws, there came a time when slavery was totally extirpated. But of course, this extirpation came about after a gradual process because that was the only safe and expedient way of tackling the problem.



Islam restored dignity to slaves and enhanced their social status



Guardianship: A father or grandfather had absolute authority over his offspring. He could sell or gift him or her away; could lend him or her to someone else, or exchange him or her with another's son or daughter.

When Islam came on the scene, it nullified and negated the last two factors completely. No ruler or progenitor was allowed to treat his subjects or offspring as his slaves. Every individual was bestowed with well-defined rights; the ruler and the ruled, the progenitor and the offspring had to live within the limits prescribed by religion; no one could transgress those limits.

And it drastically restricted the first cause, i.e., war, by allowing enslavement only in a war fought against unbelieving enemy. In no other way could anyone be enslaved. At the same time, Islam raised the status of slavery to that of a free man; and opened many ways for their emancipation

Source: al-Tabataba'i, Sayyid Muhammad Husayn, al-Mizan fi Tafsir'l Qur'an, vol.16, 2nd ed. (Beirut, 1390/1971), pp. 338-358.



Islam restored dignity to slaves and enhanced their social status. It made no distinction between a slave or a free man, and all were treated with equality. It was this fact that always attracted slaves to Islam. It is painful to see that those who never cease to be vociferous in their unjust criticism of Islam should take no notice of this principle of equality, when even in this enlightened age there are countries where laws are made discriminating against the vast majority of population, to keep them in practical servitude.

Islam recognises no distinction of race or colour, black or white, citizens or soldiers, rulers or subjects; they are perfectly equal, not in theory only, but in practice. The first mu'azzin (herald of the prayer call) of Islam, a devoted adherent of the Prophet and an esteemed disciple, was a Negro slave. The Qur'an lays down the measure of superiority in verse thirteen of chapter forty-nine. It is addressed to mankind, the whole human race, and preaches the natural brotherhood of man without distinction of tribe, clan, gender, race or colour. It says:

“O you men! We have created you of a male and a female, and then We made you (into different) races and tribes so that you may know (and “recognise) each other. Surely the most honourable of you with Allah is the one who is most pious among you; surely Allah is All-Knowing and “Aware.” The Qur'an 49:13

This verse makes clear the view point of Islam as regards human life on earth. It lays down only one criterion of superiority or honour and that is piety, which means complete obedience to the will of God. It annihilates all man-made and artificial distinctions of race, gender and colour which we find all over the world even now (this verse proofs my case even more: ‘ that it is strict forbidden in islam to rape female slaves’ , since rape is clearly forbidden in islam, since slaves in islam have the same position and status to allah as other human beings, it is clear that therefor rape of female slaves is strict forbidden, since rape of a free women is also strict forbidden, this verse proofs that a slave woman and a free woman have the same postion to allah swt and status as human beings in islam, therefor the raping of female slaves is strict forbidden in islam just as it is strict forbidden in islam to rape a free woman ). To explain the qualities of piety, let us note what Allah says:

“It is not righteousness that you turn your faces towards the East and the West, righteousness is this that one should believe in Allah, the Last Day, “the angels, the Book and the Prophets, and give away wealth out of love for Him to the near of kin, the orphans, the needy, the wayfarer, the “beggars and to those in bondage and keep up prayers, pay the poor-rate; and those who fulfil their promise and the patient ones in distress and “affliction and in the time of war - these are they who are the truthful and these are they who are pious.” The Qur'an 2:177

This verse clearly shows that by itself there is no specific virtue in turning towards any particular direction for prayer. (The unity of the Qiblah indicates the unity of faith which leads to spiritual unity and culminates in physical harmony.) The belief and practice enjoined in the verse are the real virtues, and apart from being ordered by God, they appeal to human reasoning. Please mark that "to give away wealth out of love for God to...those in bondage" is one of them.




The Non-Muslim Perspective:



On the attitude of Muslim master with his slaves, Will Durant says,

"...he handled them with a genial humanity that made their lot no worse - perhaps better, as more secure - than that of a factory worker in nineteenth-century Europe."

Source: Hurgronje C., Mohammedanism, (N.Y., 1916), p. 128 as quoted by W. Durant, The Story of Civilization, vol. IV (N.Y., 1950), p. 209.



At the end of the 18th century, Mouradgea d'Ohsson (a main source of information for the Western writers on the Ottoman empire) declared:

"There is perhaps no nation where the captives, the slaves, the very toilers in the galleys are better provided for or treated with more kindness than among the Muhammedans."

Source: As quoted in The Encyclopaedia of Islam, vol.I, p. 35.



P. L Riviere writes:

"A master was enjoined to make his slave share the bounties he received from God. It must be recognised that, in this respect, the Islamic teaching acknowledged such a respect for human personality and showed a sense of equality which is searched for in vain in ancient civilization"

Source: Riviere P.L., Revue Bleaue (June 1939).




And not only in ancient civilisations; even in the modern Christian civilisation the ingrained belief of racial supremacy is still manifesting itself every day. A. J. Toynbee says in Civilization on Trial:

"The extinction of race consciousness as between Muslims is one of the outstanding achievements of Islam, and in the contemporary world there is, as it happens, a crying need for the propagation of this Islamic virtue..." Then he comments that "in this perilous matter of race feeling it can hardly be denied that (the triumph of English-speaking peoples) has been a misfortune."

Source: Toynbee, A.J., Civilization on Trial (New York, 1948), p. 205.





Napoleon Bonaparte is recorded as saying about the condition of slaves in Muslim countries:

"The slave inherits his master's property and marries his daughter. The majority of the Pashas had been slaves. Many of the grand viziers, all the Mamelukes, Ali Ben Mourad Beg, had been slaves. They began their lives by performing the most menial services in the houses of their masters and were subsequently raised in status for their merit or by favour. In the West, on the contrary, the slave has always been below the position of the domestic servants; he occupies the lowest rug. The Romans emancipated their slaves, but the emancipated were never considered as equal to the free-born. The ideas of the East and West are so different that it took a long time to make the Egyptians understand that all the army was not composed of slaves belonging to the Sultan al-Kabir."

Source: Cherfils, Bonaparte et l'Islam (Paris, 1914)



Annemarie Schimmel writes:

"The entire history of Islam proves that slaves could occupy any office, and many former military slaves, usually recruited from among the Central Asian Turks, became military leaders and often even rulers as in eastern Iran, India (the Slave Dynasty of Delhi), and medieval Egypt (the Mamluks). “

Source: "Islam: An Introduction", p. 67



Islam totally objects and fights all forms of slavery. The focus of Islam in all its teachings and rites was to eradicate this prevailing practice. Now, slavery has been abolished by international conventions, and this goes in line with aims and objectives of Islam.

-Dr. Taha Jaber Al-`Alwani, President of the Graduate School of Islamic and Social Sciences and President of the Fiqh Council, states the following:

When Allah created human beings, He created them to be free and to be vicegerents on the earth. Slavery is something that came from people who couldn’t understand the position of the human being and it was made, in the past, as a global phenomenon.

When Islam came, it tried to bring change to get the human being back to being free, as Allah has created us, by certain procedures. Those procedures of Islam went through without interference from the other nations or states who are non-Muslim states or nations. Maybe within the third century of Hijrah or the migration of the Prophet to Madinah, this phenomenon would have been over and disappeared. But as I mentioned, because it was a global phenomenon, that procedure which was established by Islam couldn’t go through and finish with this very bad phenomenon.

Now, al-hamdulillah all people have agreed to stop this phenomenon and stand up against it. With this, there is no way to go back to adopt this phenomenon again in any way, especially for Muslims, since they must protect the freedom of others and always be with their rights to be free servants of Allah only. We should remember when the Caliph `Umar Ibn Al-Khattab (may Allah be pleased with him) said in a famous khutbah (Speech or sermon) of his,

“ When did you make the people as slaves or servants of you while Allah, the Almighty, created them free”

This means that the Muslims from the very beginning advocated the freedom of all human beings and were against the oppression of free people by tyrants and dictator leaders.

Having clarified the above, we would like to states that it was a war custom in the past to take men and women as captives and then turn them into slaves. Islam did not initiate it, rather, it was something in practice long ago before the advent of Islam. And when Islam came, it tried to eradicate this practice, bit by bit. So it first restricted it to the reciprocal practice of war, in the sense that Muslims took war captives just as the enemies did with them.

Source: Islam and Slavery

[ibstolidude]

Anyways, read this
While I tend to avoid such debates, and do not argue along side those who contend Islam is an inherently flawed, violent, evil religion - that website is a farce.

Explaining the Koran by using context and the subsequent interpretations, while comparing it to a direct translation of the bible is plain ignorant - regardless of ones opinion, and should someone have done the opposite (which is equally as ignorant) you too would have called it ignorant. Especially so in this case given that the author uses a book of the Pentateuch (5 books of the old testiment also found in the Torah), Deuteronomy no less. A book that is predominently nothing more than discourses of Moses. Amazing that a non-muslim cannot interpret the Koran, but a Muslim seems to fully grasp all of Christianity and Judiasm?

Likewise when the author writes, "I openly challenge any Jew or Christian to produce ONE, JUST ONE Noble Verse from the Muslims' Noble Quran that condones killing of innocent children, women or even hostile enemy men who drop their weapons before Muslims (surrender). " That is a matter of context, for any religious book, and the interpretation of "innocent." Just as men fighting under the banner of Christianity have ignored or hand-picked a supporting doctrine, men under the Muslim banner have found scholars able to do the same. One could point out verses (as the author did in the Bible) or even Islamic scholastic interpretations, but they would only be discounted by the author's interpretation the author has chosen to accept.

[Apathy]

http://downloads1.nadeemdownloads.com/ISLAMIC%20SERVER%2001/Hamza%20Yusuf%20-%20Shariah,%20the%20Sacred%20Law.mp3


Interesting lecture.



Any specific questions however, should be directed to a local Shiekh in your area. Don't worry, you'll be perfectly safe inside a Mosque. I assure you :P.


(P.S. This lecture won't make you an expert in Islamic Law. You'll have to endure 10-20 years of Islamic Schooling for that)

Hey it's that dude who fought against the Soviets! Good man.

[Erik2a4]

I love islam; your religon sucks...blah, blah, blah

Shariah law sounds about as fun as having herpes.

What's the point of this argument, by the way? Proving that one religon is better than another? Or arguing that Shariah law is a viable alternative to law based upon secular values?

[Abolith]

well I guess once we die we'll see who was right and who was wrong..

[Vorian]

Erm - no we are not.




The Qu'ran makes a clear distinction between self-defense and killing.

Yes but what about holy wars-jihads? The Christians can not wage holy wars, (the Crusades were more political than religious campaign) but Muslims can.