LATEST NEWS - Israel/Lebanon (Graphic Images)

[One]

IDF confirmed that 1 ship has be hit and several others are currently under attack.

Nasrallah told everyone on tv to watch the live broadcast and see the ship that was bombing beirut sink.

He also said the surprises will just begin and that israel brought the war on itself. He said that cities farther than haifa will be hit and that will include military bases also.

**** has really hit the fan.

[Kleistmaster]

yep going to use fajr 3 and 5.
what kind of weapons they could have used against boat?

[Dronetek]

Stop Making New Threads! Arghhhh

[Malchi]

Minor demage and the ship is still operating near
the coast.......

[frenchy]

Stop Making New Threads! Arghhhh

right, no need a new thread on each event.

[Snoshi]

Anyone got the footage?

[Lightweight 88]

Well the RM chinned an Argentine corvette back in '82 with a Charlie G.

Enough to make them think twice about coming too far inshore anyway, so I suppose an RPG is as likely as anything.

[Elemental666]

wow they got pretty far then the boats are not that close to the shore.hope the guys there are o.k....
But if it's the "Saar 5" i don't think RPG can do much damage.
If its the "Dabur" so yea it can go down.

[Mr. Nielsen]

IDF confirmed that 1 ship has be hit and several others are currently under attack.

Nasrallah told everyone on tv to watch the live broadcast and see the ship that was bombing beirut sink.

He also said the surprises will just begin and that israel brought the war on itself. He said that cities farther than haifa will be hit and that will include military bases also.

**** has really hit the fan.

Haaretz reported ship lightly damaged.

Apparently Lebanon don't have ordinary 155mm artillery and equipment for guiding artillery since I suppose Israeli ships wouldn't be sailing of shore within visible range as sitting ducks, if they had that.

[One]

The ship was hit with some sort of iranian made anti-ship missile it wasn't an rpg. The ships were about 5 miles away from the coast.

The IDF said the 1 ship was hit, tv stations were trying to film the action but it took place during nasrallah's speech. Eyewitnesses said they saw something blow up in the sea but thought it was just flares.

I recieved a PM saying that the ship will continue its mission and its not going back for repairs. We will find out later on I guess or when the sun comes up to see if the ship is still there.


*If other threads weren't turning into flame fests I would of posted it there.

Mods if you feel this thread is wasting space or bandwidth then please delete or merge.

[joshfox0]

The ship was hit with some sort of iranian made anti-ship missile it wasn't an rpg. The ships were about 5 miles away from the coast.

The IDF said the 1 ship was hit, tv stations were trying to film the action but it took place during nasrallah's speech. Eyewitnesses said they saw something blow up in the sea but thought it was just flares.

I recieved a PM saying that the ship will continue its mission and its not going back for repairs. We will find out later on I guess or when the sun comes up to see if the ship is still there.


*If other threads weren't turning into flame fests I would of posted it there.

Mods if you feel this thread is wasting space or bandwidth then please delete or merge.

interesting i would've thought it was just a couple of katyusha type rockets but proper anti ship missiles?! thats quite serious hardwear for them to keep in or near a large city. Seems pretty impossible that the Leabonese goverment wouldn't have known about anti ship missiles.

Also i'd like to back up the though that these new bits of news deserve new threads the old threads are so huge and flamey that i try to keep away from them now.

[Tamir]

afaik it was a medium caliber AA gun that fired at the ship.

[Kleistmaster]

afaik it was a medium caliber AA gun that fired at the ship.

more likely, definitely not an anti ship missile.

[One]

interesting i would've thought it was just a couple of katyusha type rockets but proper anti ship missiles?! thats quite serious hardwear for them to keep in or near a large city. Seems pretty impossible that the Leabonese goverment wouldn't have known about anti ship missiles.

Also i'd like to back up the though that these new bits of news deserve new threads the old threads are so huge and flamey that i try to keep away from them now.


I've been saying forever that the government knows about the weapons and the army helps bring them and transport them. There is a national agreement to supoprt the resistance. The main argument between lebanese politicians regarding hezbollah relies on who has the right to initiate the retaliation hezbollah or the government. Meaning should the government take the decision and tell hezbollah to strike, or should hezbollah strike as they deem necessary.

According to nasrallah he said unlike 1974, 1976, 1982, 1992, 1996, and the years till 2000 israel will not be able to have a stroll in the park they will have to face a new threat. The first new threat was the anti-ship missiles (or AA Guns?). They announced earlier that they will currently be using never before used Anti-Aircraft missiles. These could be some sort of iranian AA Missiles shoulder fired maybe?

If there is any iranian weapon expert please inform us.

[Snoshi]

afaik it was a medium caliber AA gun that fired at the ship.


How do you know?

[Tamir]

I have my sources p-)

[joshfox0]

I've been saying forever that the government knows about the weapons and the army helps bring them and transport them. There is a national agreement to supoprt the resistance. The main argument between lebanese politicians regarding hezbollah relies on who has the right to initiate the retaliation hezbollah or the government. Meaning should the government take the decision and tell hezbollah to strike, or should hezbollah strike as they deem necessary.

Thought as much myself. I think its been prooved though that hezbollah is a wild card and will not take direct orders from the goverment which is a shame seems as if they did they'd be alot more restrained. This dosn't however disconnect the goverment from them and the destruction of Lebonese infrastructure is pretty justifyed if the goverment knew about the weapons being bought in

[One]

I have my sources p-)


I will believe the IDF instead of your sources.

The Israel Defense Forces confirmed that a warship operating of the shore of Beirut was hit by rockets fired from land, but said the damage was not serious and there were no injuries.

Israeli source: http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3275792,00.html

[AFJROTC55]

if we're talkin AA, how close were these ships?. oh did someone say that they were corvettes or what?

1*

[One]

Thought as much myself. I think its been prooved though that hezbollah is a wild card and will not take direct orders from the goverment which is a shame seems as if they did they'd be alot more restrained. This dosn't however disconnect the goverment from them and the destruction of Lebonese infrastructure is pretty justifyed if the goverment knew about the weapons being bought in


The lebanese army is weak and doeesnt have the necessary experience, training and weapons. So the government allows hezbollah to get weapons in order to defend its borders. According the Lebanese Dialouge (that involved all political parties) there was talks about merging hezbollah with the army. Hence hezbollah becomes an integral part of the defensive strategy.

[One]

if we're talkin AA, how close were these ships?. oh did someone say that they were corvettes or what?

1*


Read my previous post. IDF confirmed it was a rockets fired from land. The ships were estimated at 5 miles away from the coast.

[Tamir]

I don't rely on news for this one, but time will tell.
I higly doubt they managed to fire an unguided rocket at ship several kilometers away.

[Asheren]

If they were 5 miles no AA could hit it. If my memory is correct top of the line AA guns have range around 3km with special ammo.

[tanks_alot]

The lebanese army is weak and doeesnt have the necessary experience, training and weapons. So the government allows hezbollah to get weapons in order to defend its borders. According the Lebanese Dialouge (that involved all political parties) there was talks about merging hezbollah with the army. Hence hezbollah becomes an integral part of the defensive strategy.

Ok.... hezbollah has around 4,000 men, the army has around 75,000 so i think the army could guard lebanon's border, plus if it wern't for hezbollah's actions there wouldn't be any need to guard aginst anyone right now.

if the IDF would decide to invade, hezbollah will do what it knowes best, hit and run tactics but it could by no means stand and hold it's ground aginst the IDF.

integrating hezbollah with the army is the worst possible move Lebanon could make as it will give Israel all of the excuses in the world to attack them as a whole.
not to mention that hezbollah is an pro Syria organization, which is aginst the intrests of the current goverment.

[Tamir]

If they were 5 miles no AA could hit it. If my memory is correct top of the line AA guns have range around 3km with special ammo. A 57mm gun can fire directly at targets 10-12 km away (with proper sighting).

[One]

Ok.... hezbollah has around 4,000 men, the army has around 75,000 so i think the army could guard lebanon's border, plus if it wern't for hezbollah's actions there wouldn't be any need to guard aginst anyone right now.

if the IDF would decide to invade, hezbollah will do what it knowes best, hit and run tactics but it could by no means stand and hold it's ground aginst the IDF.

integrating hezbollah with the army is the worst possible move Lebanon could make as it will give Israel all of the excuses in the world to attack them as a whole.
not to mention that hezbollah is an pro Syria organization, which is aginst the intrests of the current goverment.
ISRAELI SPECIAL FORCES (frogs) got compromised by the lebanese army and got engaged of the coast of sidon. They tried to do a water insertion (Shaytet 13?). Ansaria all over again...


There is news of 4 sailors missing according the IDF. Can anyone confirm?


tanks_alot according to Israel they estimate hezbollah to have 10,000+ members.

[Snoshi]

ISRAELI SPECIAL FORCES (frogs) got compromised by the lebanese army and got engaged of the coast of sidon. They tried to do a water insertion (Shaytet 13?). Ansaria all over again...


There is news of 4 sailors missing according the IDF. Can anyone confirm?


tanks_alot according to Israel they estimate hezbollah to have 10,000+ members.

Sources? I cant find anything.

[NimDod]

Sources? I cant find anything.

aljazeera tv.

nothing on Israeli sources so far.

[Snoshi]

An Israeli warship operating off the shore of Beirut sustained heavy damage after being hit by rockets fired by Hizbullah, the army says. (Hanan Greenberg

[tanks_alot]

ISRAELI SPECIAL FORCES (frogs) got compromised by the lebanese army and got engaged of the coast of sidon. They tried to do a water insertion (Shaytet 13?). Ansaria all over again...


There is news of 4 sailors missing according the IDF. Can anyone confirm?


tanks_alot according to Israel they estimate hezbollah to have 10,000+ members.

10,000 members or 10,000 combatants? hezbollah also has an political branch, either way it's still alot less than the army's 75,000 men.

anyway, i cant find anything about missing sailors, you got any links?

[NimDod]

An Israeli warship operating off the shore of Beirut sustained heavy damage after being hit by rockets fired by Hizbullah, the army says. (Hanan Greenberg

snoshi, could you please add a link to these updates? I checked 3 different news pages and all of them reported light damage and no casualties.

[Snoshi]

snoshi, could you please add a link to these updates? I checked 3 different news pages and all of them reported light damage and no casualties.

check Ynet

[Asheren]

A 57mm gun can fire directly at targets 10-12 km away (with proper sighting).

Heh frogot that somoene might stil use this stuff instead of AA missiles in that range.

[kosse]

BBC is saying that 4 soldiers are missing from the hit navy vessel.

[-=P=-]

Most likely well trained 122mm rocket operators are much more likely than any AshM's. Iran has a small AshM, but I doubt the Hizbollah got such/would use such advanced weapons.

[Tamir]

Just a general note - Ynet is crap, especially in English. Most reporters have no understanding of weapons or military affairs.
http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3275784,00.html
as you can see in the Hebrew version, that now claim they "don't know what weapon hit the ship".

Again I don't claim anything except what I heard from reliable sources and posted above, I could be wrong. However it's a lot harder to fire an unguided rocket at a moving ship than it is to use some kind of direct fire gun. And the chance of them firing an anti-ship missile is non-existent.

[Kvakva]

Just a general note - Ynet is crap, especially in English. Most reporters have no understanding of weapons or military affairs.
http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3275784,00.html
as you can see in the Hebrew version, that now claim they "don't know what weapon hit the ship".

Again I don't claim anything except what I heard from reliable sources and posted above, I could be wrong. However it's a lot harder to fire an unguided rocket at a moving ship than it is to use some kind of direct fire gun. And the chance of them firing an anti-ship missile is non-existent.

Heh everything that has a mg on it is a tank for reporters.
I'll wait for official version on what hit the ship.

[Tamir]

BBC is saying that 4 soldiers are missing from the hit navy vessel. they are quoting al-jazeera, and where did they get their information from? (not to say it's not likely, especially if the bridge was hit)

[tanks_alot]

An Israeli warship operating off the shore of Beirut sustained heavy damage after being hit by rockets fired by Hizbullah, the army says. (Hanan Greenberg

Apperantly ynet were talking about the ship that was hit earlier, it seems that it took heavier damage than first belived but still no report of casualties.

bunch of idiots.... i thought another ship was hit.....:roll:

[Snoshi]

they are quoting al-jazeera, and where did they get their information from? (not to say it's not likely, especially if the bridge was hit)


They also report that shayetet is fighting Lebaneese army on the beach

[joshfox0]

Heh everything that has a mg on it is a tank for reporters.
I'll wait for official version on what hit the ship.

god have i noticed that! only a few reportes actually know anything about the weaponary such as jeramy bowing. for instance the M109s israel use arn't even artillery they're tanks apparently as are the Zeldas and the regular tanks such as the markervas are apparently "heavy tanks" also annoys me when they say "missiles hit the runway" or "bombs hti the runway" what type of missile what type of bomb i want to know! **throws a big strop at the reporters**

[One]

10,000 members or 10,000 combatants? hezbollah also has an political branch, either way it's still alot less than the army's 75,000 men.

anyway, i cant find anything about missing sailors, you got any links?


The source for the SF ambush came from the lebanese army and it is being reported on all lebanese tv stations. Al-Arabiya tried to ask an IDF spokesperson and he did not wish to comment.

I head on al-jazeera that "the idf is looking for 4 sailors". Thats why I asked for confirmation. Usualy they talk with IDF officials but not for this.


Eyewitness accounts: 1 rocket was seen hit the ship. A second was fired also fired shortly afterwards. On camera they have some sort of emergency signal coming from the ship (light signals) and then shortly after the ship disappeared. So maybe they were able to move away from the danger zone.

Some stations are saying hezbollah taped the operation and are waiting to see the israeli reaction before making it public.

Keep posting news guys.

[saigonsmuggler]

Haaretz is reporting that a remote controlled plane laden with explosives hit that naval warship.

Serious damage.

[One]

Haaretz is reporting that a remote controlled plane laden with explosives hit that naval warship.

Serious damage.

hmmm

because eyewitnesses said they saw the "rocket" or now "plane" fly from a beirut suburb. So its very possible. Although I still believe its something iran developed. They want to test their equipment.

[tuercas]

Haaretz is reporting that a remote controlled plane laden with explosives hit that naval warship.

Serious damage.
x2
haaretz claims it was a remote controlled drone and it managed to damage the steering system
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=738611&contrassID=1&subContrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=0

[Greek soldier]

Wow... an improvised UCAV... like the IAI Harpy.

[-=P=-]

One of Irans drones is such an attack UAV but its payload is too low to sink such a ship.

[PILMAN]

What kind of ship was it that was damaged?

[nick_ua]

what kinda of damage are expecting from sh*t these guys have
paint damage, couple scrathces.
give me break

[joshfox0]

what kinda of damage are expecting from sh*t these guys have
paint damage, couple scrathces.
give me break

you obviosuly have no idea :|

[ed316]

what kinda of damage are expecting from sh*t these guys have
paint damage, couple scrathces.
give me break

If they have rockets that can hit Haifa then they probably have something that can do some damage to Isreali ships.

[NimDod]

What kind of ship was it that was damaged?

they say its a Saar5 corvette.
http://www.debka.co.il/photos/1726h.jpg

its not clear at the moment. Haaretz says it was hit by a UAV packed with explosives and other sites say it was two missile, and one of them hit the heli-deck and 4 crewmen are missing.

[alvarito]

Hi, i would like to ask you if the PHALANX should have worked here, or the BARAK ?????

[saigonsmuggler]

see this thread...

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=86098&page=4

[LordHalbert]

Interesting.

Not the first UAV attack like this - I believe the Nazi were the first. No actually the Nazi's had a guided glide bomb. My mistake.

Sort of a poor mans guided missile.

[One]

Israel is now reporting 4 sailors missing.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3275792,00.htmlT

[NimDod]

http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3275784,00.html
(Hebrew version only. Ynet english article doesnt have that video)

they said its a video of the hit, but I cant see a god damn thing. maybe someone who speaks arabic can translate?

[Klepto]

what kinda of damage are expecting from sh*t these guys have
paint damage, couple scrathces.
give me break


Shortly afterwards, crewmembers assessed the damage to the ship and discovered the hit was more severe than originally thought, and had caused damage to the ship’s internal operating systems. The security establishment was checking the possibility that the ship was hit by a drone loaded with explosives, or by rocket fire.


http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3275792,00.html

[Klepto]

http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3275784,00.html
(Hebrew version only. Ynet english article doesnt have that video)

they said its a video of the hit, but I cant see a god damn thing. maybe someone who speaks arabic can translate?

I think it either came in the other side, or too fast to see on tape.

[saigonsmuggler]

IDF now appears to be confirming that naval vessel was hit by drone.

[-=P=-]

Looked like a MANPAD.

[One]

http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3275784,00.html
(Hebrew version only. Ynet english article doesnt have that video)

they said its a video of the hit, but I cant see a god damn thing. maybe someone who speaks arabic can translate?


He is just saying that these are live images of the attack on the ships off the coast of beirut. He did not specify the type of attack.

Its Al-Manar the tv station for hezbollah. They had prior notice of the attack so their camera was waiting and ready.

We can wait a few hours or days and find out what they actually used. I'm pretty sure they would of taped the operation. They used to do it in the past why not now. And they had pictures of Raad-1 too.

Although eyewitnesses said it was 2 rockets. I dont know maybe it was that new iranian drone.

[akd]

I think it either came in the other side, or too fast to see on tape.

That looks like the cannon firing and was filmed from another Israeli ship. You can see the same ship at the same angle of view over the shoulder of the reporter. Maybe y'all are looking at a different video?

[SeanAshi]

Can we listen to Israel Army Radio on the net? If so then link?

[jeffe]

A CIWS shouldn't have had any problem with it. IF it was operational.

[One]

Can we listen to Israel Army Radio on the net? If so then link?

http://glz.msn.co.il/glz/default.htm

[SeanAshi]

http://glz.msn.co.il/glz/default.htm
Thank you One.

[nitrogen]

Cant we just merge all the threads of this conlict so that other news gets some spotlight...

Something like "Hezbollah-Israel conflict updates" thread

[Dalamara]

Cant we just merge all the threads of this conlict so that other news gets some spotlight...

Something like "Hezbollah-Israel conflict updates" thread

I'd rather not dig through a 80 page flame war and try to find the news in there...

[Canuck Farrier]

so what do you guys think possible ww3 in the middle east,Syria and Iran may get involved if they have enough balls and then things would really get messy.

[Aerosoul]

you're jumping way too far ahead.

[Nano]

WWIII I doubt it unless Syria and Iran want to loose ina conventional now or win one later. A war between Israel,Syria ,Iran etc will only happen after Iran gets its nukes not before or after unless Israel decides to not let them have nukes

[sp2c]

so what do you guys think possible ww3 in the middle east,Syria and Iran may get involved if they have enough balls and then things would really get messy.
didnt't some Iranian say that plans to destroy Israel were allready underway just a week ago?

that's one hell of a coincidence!!!!

but conventionally I'm pretty sure Syria will get involved at some point but not Iran they're in too much trouble atm as it is

[signatory]

ww3 in the middle east

Quoted for best comedic remark of the day.

[Darth Vidar]

This reminds me of the Egyptian Styx-missile attack on the IN destroyer "Eilat" October 20. 1967. The IN was taken by surprise back then too, they lost a ship and 49 sailors.

The IN`s most advanced warship, a Saar 5 with all its sensors, barak-missiles and phalanx mk.15 CIWS are being hit hard by a Hezbollah explosive packed drone.......


Info of Saar 5 can be found here:
http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/naval/saar5/Saar5.html


As a chief officer of a ship currently in the middle of the North Sea I`ll share my thoughts.

If the ship has been hit in the stern section, it might have caused damage to rudders or propulsion system.

The ship is devided into several watertight compartments, and it is designed to withstand a lot of beating.
The IN sailors should manage to get it safe back to Israel, if she still have enough power to run emergency bilge-pumps and fire-pumps. If she is still on fire without power to run the fire pumps, the situation could get out of control.


How many nautical miles are the distance from Beirut to Haifa? Anyone?

[Ayura]

Quoted for best comedic remark of the day.


Hilirious isn't. Quoted 2x for the best comedic remark of the month!!!

WW3 IN THE MIDDLE EAST


Haha. I'm dying of laughter over here.

[UZI4U]

Ship struck off Beirut shore; four crewmembers missing

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3275792,00.html

[UZI4U]

IDF confirms warship hit by explosive-laden UAV

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150885994586&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull (http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150885994586&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull)

[signatory]

^ That ship in the video is it not a Saar 4.5 rather than a Saar 5 ?

[One]

keep The ****ing Thread Flame Free We Are Using It For News Only.



its been very quite on the border nothing so far...

[Darth Vidar]

After reading several Israeli sites I think the vessel at the moment is being towed by another ship due to loss of steering.

What worries me is that the fire is reported as NOT having been put out several hours after the hit.

I think the helicopter/hangar is on fire. Should be a lot of helifuel there (and weapons maybe)?.....

Come on Israel Navy - save the ship!!!!!

[Darth Vidar]

According to http://www.haaretz.com/ IDF reports that hezbollah has tried to hit a second IN ship, but missed and hit an egyptian ship instead!

[One]

According to http://www.haaretz.com/ IDF reports that hezbollah has tried to hit a second IN ship, but missed and hit an egyptian ship instead!

the first wtf is what are egyptians doing in the area, and the second is why would israel allow them to be in the area?

[Darth Vidar]

the first wtf is what are egyptians doing in the area, and the second is why would israel allow them to be in the area?

Could well be a ship at anchor....

It could well have been there since before the blocade started a few days ago.

According to J-post the identity of the ship has not yet been 100% verified.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150886003205&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

[ArmedPacifist]

That doesn't make very much sense, why would the Israeli Navy allow an Egyptian ship to just sit there?

[signatory]

no one said it was a military ship.

[Darth Vidar]

A blocade of a harbour is as far as I know when you prevent ships from entering or leaving the area.

[signatory]

A blocade of a harbour is as far as I know when you prevent ships from entering or leaving the area.

which means there's going to be ships in dock waiting to leave, and outside of the blockade waiting to enter...

[Irish_Army01]

Think the UN has been too Quiet about all of this??

[kraf001]

which means there's going to be ships in dock waiting to leave, and outside of the blockade waiting to enter...
1) ok here is the thing so you have ships at dock which is understandable then you have Israeli navy far from the dock (at least not in the dock) how can a missile miss an Israeli ship and then do a round trip and come back to dock.. or am I completely off the mark with the way I am imagining the situation?

2) they say a drone hit the ship.. how did it got to the ship undetected and if it got to the ship undetected doesn't that kind of give credibility to Iranian claim over spying on American ships in Persian gulf undetected?

3) looking at the Iranian arsenal of ASM I can only think of couple of missiles that are small and non-sophisticated enough to be given away to Hezbollah and the damage done sounds about right... I just don't buy the drone full of explosive story!

[Ezekiel25:17]

Think the UN has been too Quiet about all of this??

Like that is something new.

[Irish_Army01]

Like that is something new.

If this escalates,and its looks like its gonna,I can see UN soldiers going back in there..

[Ezekiel25:17]

Doesn't matter who you send in. They will always fight.

[Irish_Army01]

Doesn't matter who you send in. They will always fight.

Yea I know that,BTDT..it might soften the blow for the normal Labanese People.Coz there the one's that are gonna suffer the most..And I'd go again in the morning.

[Ezekiel25:17]

Yea I know that,BTDT..it might soften the blow for the normal Labanese People.Coz there the one's that are gonna suffer the most..And I'd go again in the morning.

Yeah, I know how refugees feel. Was one myself. Civilians are the true victims in war.

[nick_ua]

Israel is now reporting 4 sailors missing.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7...75792,00.htmlT
I bet they been kidnaped by Hezbala
And they are sending them to Iran so Izrael can atacck Iran as well

[Nano]

I bet they been kidnaped by Hezbala
And they are sending them to Iran so Izrael can atacck Iran as well

Are you serious? It seems most likely they drowned or got killed in the attack.

[akd]

No, he's being an ass.

[Nano]

No, he's being an ass.

Yeah it seemed like a sarcastic statement, just wanted to verify how big an ass he was.

[JasonH]

Think the UN has been too Quiet about all of this??

Whats the un gonna do, wiggle their finger and say bad!

[Canuck Farrier]

Quoted for best comedic remark of the day.

"well they call me the joker"p-)

[akd]

Whats the un gonna do, wiggle their finger and say bad!

U.N.'s hands are tied when it comes to Israel. What exactly should the U.N. do?

[signatory]

The UN s.c knows Israel is right. They know about the illegal smuggling of arms to Hezbollah in recent months. They know about Hezbollah's terrorist actions. They have read the reports, and urged Lebanon time and time again to deal with it.

They are also aware of the self-defense article of the UN Charter.

[akd]

By The Associated Press Fri Jul 14, 6:34 PM ET


Hezbollah's remote-controlled attack on a warship Friday marked a first in the militant group's use of "air power" against its powerful enemy, the technologically advanced Israeli military.

http://us.bc.yahoo.com/b?P=2c7OfkSOwhUSCKvsQmWcPQT7R1Z400S4X2AAAHLc&T=1aloggbem%2fX%3d1152933728%2fE%3d84441876%2fR%3dnews%2fK%3d5%2fV%3d2.1%2fW%3d8%2fY%3dYAHOO%2fF%3d3524385436%2fH%3dY2FjaGVoaW50PSJuZXdzIiBjb250ZW50PSJtaWxpdGFyeTtJc3JhZWw7aXQ7V2FzaGluZ3RvbjtTZWN1cml0eTtJdDtob21lO3JlZnVybF9uZXdzX3lhaG9vX2NvbSIgcmVmdXJsPSJyZWZ1cmxfbmV3c195YWhvb19jb20iIHRvcGljcz0icmVm dXJsX25ld3NfeWFob29fY29tIg--%2fQ%3d-1%2fS%3d1%2fJ%3d62C28E44&U=139vk7srg%2fN%3dnRIsIUSOxJU-%2fC%3d388393.8887756.9671028.1442997%2fD%3dLREC%2fB%3d2923184The Lebanese militia had launched similar unmanned aerial vehicles, or drones, against Israel (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Israel) at least twice before, in November 2004 and April 2005, when they crossed over Israel's northern border on apparent reconnaissance flights, lasting just minutes before they returned to Lebanese territory.

On Friday, however, a Hezbollah drone loaded with explosives slammed into an Israeli navy vessel off Lebanon, causing severe damage and leaving it burning as it turned and cruised homeward, Israeli officials reported. The Arab television channel al-Jazeera said four sailors were missing after the attack.

After Hezbollah's first use of a drone in 2004, its leader, Sheik Hassan Nasrallah, warned that the pilotless aircraft were capable of carrying explosives and striking deep into Israel. On Friday, Nasrallah went on the air again, telling listeners the damaged ship could be seen off Beirut. "Look at it burning," he said.

Israel claimed in 2004 that the drone, dubbed by Hezbollah the "Mirsad 1," or "observation post" in Arabic, was Iranian-made. On Friday, however, Israeli officials suggested it had been developed by the Lebanese Shiite Muslim group, as Hezbollah itself has claimed in the past.
Defense analyst John Pike of the Washington-based firm Global Security doubted that claim.

"I think Hezbollah has people capable of rigging explosives to a drone, but I don't think they could develop a UAV on their own," he said. Global Security's website notes that a leading Arab newspaper, London-based Ash-Sharq Al-Awsat, once reported that Iran (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Iran) sold eight Mohajer-4 drones to Hezbollah.

Iran fields several types of UAVs, including one, called the Ababil, with a 9-foot-long body, capable of flying for 90 minutes, and able to carry a 90-pound payload. Nasrallah was quoted in 2004 as saying Hezbollah's drones could carry 40 kilograms — 90 pounds — of explosives.
The drone's TV camera makes it relatively easy to mount such an attack, Pike said.

"It's not bigtime rocket science to put explosives on the thing and then use the TV camera to home in on the ship," he said.


http://www.armscontrol.ru/UAV/pics/a21.jpg

Finally, one may conclude that, if the claim of Hezbollah leader is an exaggeration, it is not a big one, provided that this extremist group did obtain "Mheger 4" or "Ababil" type UAVs with technical specifications discussed above. Nevertheless, Sheik Hassan Nasrallah denies any possible connection with Iran and insists that Hezbollah develops unmanned vehicles on their own. Possibly, this statement reflects his intent not to expose Iran to an additional pressure from international community, even though Hezbollah drones are of Iran's origin indeed. However, the leader of extremists may well have told the truth. As a technical analysis shows (http://www.armscontrol.ru/UAV/report.htm), a small group of air model fans (or even a someone alone) can build a capable UAV. All necessary equipment and parts are available in the open market at affordable prices.

http://www.armscontrol.ru/UAV/mirsad1.htm

[saigonsmuggler]

to transmit TV signal back, the UAV prolly use some sort of high-frequency to carry broadband signal?

Maybe IDF Navy should jam those frequency bands.

[Nano]

to transmit TV signal back, the UAV prolly use some sort of high-frequency to carry broadband signal?

Maybe IDF Navy should jam those frequency bands.
They could have done that if they had intel of the frequencies being used and that is assuming that they detected the drone in time to just jam frequencies.otherwise just jamming will affect their own communications in other area of operations.

[sferrin]

The thing I'd like to know is how does a ship armed with Phalanx AND Barak and in a WAR ZONE manage to get hit with what is starting to sound like a glorified R/C kludge?

[Corvus]

http://network.news.com.au/image/0,10114,5187239,00.jpg
Strike ... a Hezbollah rocket lights up the Beirut sky as it streaks towards an Israeli warship moored off the coast of Lebanon / Reuters

So it wasn't an explosives laden UAV? Any comments?

[sferrin]

http://network.news.com.au/image/0,10114,5187239,00.jpg


So it wasn't an explosives laden UAV? Any comments?

If that's an unguided rocket it didn't hit what it was aimed at. Either Reuters doesn't know what they're looking at (THAT'S never happened) or maybe it is a boosting UAV or missile.

[signatory]

The thing I'd like to know is how does a ship armed with Phalanx AND Barak and in a WAR ZONE manage to get hit with what is starting to sound like a glorified R/C kludge?

since they have not released info on the exact ship one can only speculate but someone said it was at least with a heli pad so no aft gun system in place.

And the forward phalanx has limited range and coverage. On top of that the sensors of the ship do not cover 360 degrees, this depends on class model tho. The air search radar for the Barak system is not 360 either, it's looking side-ways (180 degrees). Depending on the weather situation (I've noticed rough seas in video clips) the ship might have been flaunting its weak side to the enemy. i.e aft/rear mid section.

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/876/saar52b32f8766gi8.jpg

on this version: No aft gun, and of course no way the forward phalanx can do anything.

It's pretty weird tho...not like the Navy wouldn't know of these 'holes'

[Nano]

If that's an unguided rocket it didn't hit what it was aimed at. Either Reuters doesn't know what they're looking at (THAT'S never happened) or maybe it is a boosting UAV or missile.

It most likely is a missile of some sort perhaps with some kind of quidance system would make sense as to how the Israeli ship was hit successfully.

[Nano]

since they have not released info on the exact ship one can only speculate but someone said it was at least with a heli pad so no aft gun system in place.

And the forward phalanx has limited range and coverage. On top of that the sensors of the ship do not cover 360 degrees, this depends on class model tho. The air search radar for the Barak system is not 360 either, it's looking side-ways (180 degrees). Depending on the weather situation (I've noticed rough seas in video clips) the ship might have been flaunting its weak side to the enemy. i.e aft/rear mid section.

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/876/saar52b32f8766gi8.jpg

on this version: No aft gun, and of course no way the forward phalanx can do anything.

It's pretty weird tho...not like the Navy wouldn't know of these 'holes'

Maybe they underestimated their enemy and let their guard down.

[moneyCrew]

i do think the drone is developed by hezbollah themselves.....you know why...i have a colleague of mine who studies engineering developes UAV for his final test project.....the thing is the military is very interested in his crude and simple design because he uses a lot of off the shelf commercial stuff.....c'mon if he studies engineering for 4 years only without any military background.... why can't those hizzass do it also.....

[Snoshi]

Right now IDF says it was a missile

[Clearday-TRForce]

Hezbollah drone batters Israeli warship

BEIRUT, Lebanon - Hezbollah rammed an Israeli warship with an unmanned aircraft rigged with explosives Friday, setting it ablaze after Israeli warplanes smashed Lebanon's links to the world one by one and destroyed the headquarters of the Islamic guerrilla group's leader.

The attack on the warship off Beirut's Mediterranean coast was the most dramatic incident on a violent day in the conflict that erupted suddenly Wednesday and appeared to be careening out of control despite pleas from world leaders for restraint on both sides.

Israel again bombarded Lebanon's airport and main roads in the most intensive offensive against the country in 24 years. For the first time it struck the crowded Shiite neighborhood of south Beirut around Hezbollah's headquarters, toppling overpasses and sheering facades off apartment buildings. Concrete from balconies smashed into parked cars, and car alarms set off by the blasts blared for hours.

The toll in three days of clashes rose to 73 killed in Lebanon and at least 12 Israelis, as international alarm grew over the fighting and oil prices rose to above $78 a barrel. The U.N. Security Council held an emergency session on the violence, and Lebanon accused Israel of launching "a widespread barbaric aggression."

In addition to the fighting in Lebanon, Israel pressed ahead with its offensive in the Gaza Strip against Hamas, striking the Palestinian economy ministry offices early Saturday.

The ramming of the Israeli warship indicated Hezbollah has added a new weapon to the arsenal of rockets and mortars it has used against Israel. The Israeli army said the ship suffered severe damage and was on fire hours later as it headed home. There were no details on the ship's crew, though Al-Jazeera TV said the Israeli military was searching for four missing sailors.

"You wanted an open war and we are ready for an open war," Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah said in a taped statement. He vowed to strike even deeper into Israel with rockets.

Despite fears the assault could bring down the Western-backed, anti-Syrian government of Lebanon, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert vowed the campaign would continue until Hezbollah guerrillas, who are backed by Syria and Iran, lose their near-control of southern Lebanon bordering Israel.

Olmert agreed in a phone call with U.N. chief Kofi Annan to allow U.N. mediation for a cease-fire — but only if the terms include the disarming of Hezbollah and the return of two Israeli soldiers whose capture by the Muslim guerrillas Wednesday triggered the fighting.

Hezbollah rained dozens of rockets on towns in northern Israel. One rocket hit a home in Meron, killing a woman and her grandson. Some 220,000 people in northern towns hunkered down in bomb shelters.

Nasrallah was not hurt after the Israeli missiles demolished his headquarters among two buildings in Beirut's southern neighborhoods, the militant group said. Three people died in the airstrikes.

The attack on the warship was apparently timed to coincide with Nasrallah's message on the militant group's television station. "The surprises that I have promised you will start now. Now in the middle of the sea, facing Beirut, the Israeli warship ... look at it burning," Nasrallah boasted.

Israeli military officials said the drone apparently was developed by Hezbollah. The Lebanese guerrilla group has managed to fly unmanned spy drones over northern Israel at least twice in recent years.

"If they kill us all, we will still not give them back the prisoners," said one resident, Nasser Ali Nasser, as palls of smoke rose from fuel depots hit farther south. "We have nothing left to lose except our dignity. We sacrifice ourselves for Sheik Nasrallah," he said.

President Bush, who has backed Israel's right to defend itself, spoke by phone with Lebanese Prime Minister Fuad Saniora from a G-8 summit in Russia and "reiterated his position" that the Israeli attacks should limit any impact on civilians, White House spokesman Tony Snow said.

But the promise fell short of the Lebanese leader's request for pressure for a cease-fire.

Israel's campaign appeared to have a two-pronged goal. One was to batter Hezbollah and end its near control of the south on Israel's borders.

"We know it's going to be a long and continuous campaign and operation, but it's very clear. We need to put Hezbollah out of business," Brig. Gen. Ido Nehushtan told The Associated Press.

Israel's army chief, Lt. Gen. Dan Halutz, said Hezbollah has rockets that can reach as far as 43.5 miles or more, which would bring more Israeli cities, such as Hadera, within range.

The other goal was to seal off Lebanon by repeatedly striking its airport and main roads — including the coastal highway from north to south and the Beirut-Damascus highway, Lebanon's main land link to the outside world. At the same time, Israel was gradually escalating the damage to the country's infrastructure, painstakingly rebuilt since the civil war ended in 1990.

Israel holds Lebanon responsible for the capture of its two soldiers in a surprise Hezbollah raid; the Lebanese government insists it had nothing to do with the attack. However, Israel wants it to rein in the guerrillas, a move Lebanon has long resisted.

The level of damage inflicted by Israel appeared finely calibrated. For example, a missile punched a hole in a major suspension bridge on the Beirut-Damascus road but did not destroy it, unlike less expensive bridges on the road that were brought down. An Israeli strike hit fuel depots at one of Beirut's two power stations — sending massive fireballs and smoke into the sky — but avoided the station itself.

Throughout the morning, Israeli fighter-bombers pounded runways at Beirut's airport for a second day, apparently trying to ensure its closure after the Lebanese national carrier, Middle East Airlines, managed to evacuate its last five planes to Jordan. One bomb hit close to the terminal building.

Civilian casualties were mounting faster than during Israel's last major offensive in Lebanon, in 1996, an assault also sparked by Hezbollah attacks. In that campaign, 165 people were killed over 17 days, including 100 in the shelling of a U.N. base.

"We are on the right and we shall avenge every attack we endure," said Fadi Haidar, an American-Lebanese who swept up the shattered glass outside his store in south Beirut. "I have huge debts and now my store is damaged. ... But as time goes by, they will all realize that Sayyed Nasrallah is right and is working in the interest of Muslims."

There was some resentment that Hezbollah had dragged the Lebanese into another bloody fight with Israel. "As long as Hezbollah has its weapons and acts according to its leader's whims, there is pretext for Israel to keep on destroying Lebanon," said Ibrahim al-Hajj, a Christian shop owner in the southern village of Qleia.

[PeterG]

OOps. Already posted ( Now they say it was a missile )

[kraf001]

OOps. Already posted ( Now they say it was a missile )
can you post a link? thanks.

[Javehn]

One of the 4 missing soldiers found dead inside the ship (collapsed compartment) .
I bellieve other three in the same condition :| . RIP

[Snoshi]

One of the 4 missing soldiers found dead inside the ship (collapsed compartment) .
I bellieve other three in the same condition :| . RIP


RIP :( .....

[kraf001]

One of the 4 missing soldiers found dead inside the ship (collapsed compartment) .
I bellieve other three in the same condition :| . RIP
report says 2 found

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150886004498&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

RIP..

[Kleistmaster]

seems israel has few intel about hezbollah capabilities, more surprises may come soon.

[Greek soldier]

Greek Ministry of Foreign Affairs: There are about 2,500 Greeks in Lebanon.

Allready an Olympic Airlines plane flew to Damascus to take 90 persons of Greek and other European origin. In case of emergency, they will send another plane.

Larnaka airport (Cyprus) is very busy at this time.

[BassHanter]

Death to Hizbolla death to nassralla :-*$ :-*$ :-*$

[Bert]

i do think the drone is developed by hezbollah themselves.....you know why...i have a colleague of mine who studies engineering developes UAV for his final test project.....the thing is the military is very interested in his crude and simple design because he uses a lot of off the shelf commercial stuff.....c'mon if he studies engineering for 4 years only without any military background.... why can't those hizzass do it also.....
They probably could, but Israelis shot down an Hezbollah UAV before and it looked quite Iranian to them.. So they've probably bought them.

[UZI4U]

It was an Iranian C-802 missile.

[-=P=-]

A C.802 would have sunk a ship of this size, it could be a so called Kowsar which is something like a mini C.802.

A C.802 is too large for the Hizbollah.

[UZI4U]

A C.802 would have sunk a ship of this size.


Apparently not...

[Kleistmaster]

"A C.802 would have sunk a ship of this size"

X2

[Snoshi]

"A C.802 would have sunk a ship of this size"

X2


Aparrantly it dint

[Smok]

Polish media say that ship was badly damaged and is towing to Israel. They also say that ship is still burning. Is it true?

[-=P=-]

It most likely was no C.802, a Kowsar is the same as the C.802 but only half as big and with a 4-5 times less range.

The reports say that the ship was hit at its back and such a large AshM like the C.802 would most likely have very bad effects on a ship of the Saar-5 size.

Thats why I believe that it was a Kowsar and not a C.802 Harpoon size, 120km range AshM.

The ship would have to be very happy to survive a backshot with a C.802.

[UZI4U]

Polish media say that ship was badly damaged and is towing to Israel. They also say that ship is still burning. Is it true?

No, in fact it's sailing on it's own.

[UZI4U]

Either way... Nasrllah promised some "surprises".

[Kleistmaster]

kowsar missile

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/11_8501150475_L600.jpg

[kraf001]

A C.802 would have sunk a ship of this size, it could be a so called Kowsar which is something like a mini C.802.

A C.802 is too large for the Hizbollah.
Kowsar is similar (but not the same) to C 701 R. and although I still think Iran won't give any of its new toys to Hezbollah! but the fact that it hit the ship undetected makes me wonder if it indeed was the new Kowsar..

[UZI4U]

Kowsar is similar (but not the same) to C 701 R. and although I still think Iran won't give any of its new toys to Hezbollah! but the fact that it hit the ship undetected makes me wonder if it indeed was the new Kowsar..

If so, it seems Iran is really set on turning Lebanon into a testing ground for its weapons.

[-=P=-]

@kraf001

The Kowsar is not exactly new nor termed as one of Irans advanced weapons which are not to be given to others. Just like the Misagh series its possible that a Hizbollah unit was equipped with them.

[NimDod]

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3275923,00.html
A senior IDF officer said the ship was struck by an Iranian-made C802 missile, but he refused to say whether or not Iranian activists were behind the launching itself.

The army said two C802 missiles were fired at the vessel; the first missed the ship and struck an Egyptian boat some 60 kilometers (37 miles) off the Lebanon coast.

The stern of the ship was hit shortly after 8:30 p.m. Friday night and a conflagration ignited on the helicopter landing pad. The hit also damaged the ship’s internal operating systems.

all news sites say the missile that hit the ship was "Iranian made".
personally, I find it hard to belive that a corvette could survive such a large missle. must have been something smaller.

[kraf001]

well in any case claiming that a C802 did little damage like that is a bit strange... what is up with IDF anyways first claim it was a drone now say it was a C802... somebody is lying and lying with reason!

[UZI4U]

well in any case claiming that a C802 did little damage like that is a bit strange... what is up with IDF anyways first claim it was a drone now say it was a C802... somebody is lying and lying with reason!

Fog of war anyone?

[Snoshi]

The disaster that overtook one of the Israeli Navy’s state of the art warships, Ahi-Hanit, was thoroughly planned in advance by an enemy which managed to take Israel’s military commanders by surprise. It has shocked Israel’s military to a degree comparable to the profound effect on US forces of al Qaeda’s 2000 attack on the USS Cole in Aden.

The Saar-5 class corvette, with a crew of 61 seamen and a 10-man helicopter crew, was hit Friday, July 17 at 20:15 hours, while shelling Beirut international airport. Four crewmen were reported missing. One was found dead Saturday aboard the crippled ship. Three are still sought by rescue teams.

DEBKAfile’s military sources reveal that the warship was struck from Beirut by an Iran-made C-802 shore-to-sea missile of the Silkworm family. Weighing 715 kilos, with a range of 120km, the missile is armed with a strong anti-jamming capability, which lends it a 98% success rate in escaping interception.

The Israeli ship is armed with an advanced Barak anti-missile system, which may have missed the incoming missile. Israeli military planners must now look at the vulnerability of the navy following the appearance of the first Iranian C-802 missiles

The Israeli chief of staff, Lt.Gen. Dan Halutz, started his news conference Friday night just 15 minutes earlier at 20:00. The campaign was then 60 hours old from the moment Hizballah raiders captured two Israel soldiers in an ambush inside Israel. He was poised, assured and clear, until a reporter asked if the military goals of the Lebanese offensive matched the objectives set out in government decisions. His answer was: “Don’t start looking for cracks.”

But Hizballah found the cracks 15 minutes later. Its secretary general Hassan Nasrallah put in a telephone appearance on Al Manar TV straight after General Halutz to inform his listeners across the Middle East that one of Israel’s warships was ablaze at that very moment. He said the ship had been crippled while it was bombing Beirut and was sinking. Hizballah, he added, had prepared a number of surprises for Israel and its armed forces Despite several Israeli air raids, the station is still broadcasting.

In Israel, the Hizballah chief’s words were taken at first as an implausible threat for the future – until the order of events began to unfold.

DEBKAfile’s military sources reveal:

Shortly before 20:00 hours Friday, Hizballah launched a pair of land-to-sea C-802 missiles against the Israeli ship from the coast of Beirut. The trajectory of the first was adjusted to a landing amidships from above. It missed and exploded in the water. The second was rigged to skim the water like a cruise missile. It achieved a direct hit of the Ahi Hanit’s helicopter deck, starting a fire. The ship began to sink, as Nasrallah said, and would have been lost were it not for the speed and bravery of crewmen who jumped into the flames and doused them before the ship exploded and sank.

It is not known whether the men dead and missing paid with their lives for saving the ship.

This was the second time in 48 hours that the Israeli high command was taken by unawares.

July 12, the day that Hizballah kidnapped two Israeli soldiers, was also the deadline for Iran to deliver its answer to the six-power package of incentives for giving up its nuclear enrichment program. Tehran let the day go by without an answer. Someone should have kept an eye on Iran’s Lebanese surrogate and made the connection with a fresh virulent threat against Israel from Iran’s president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. However, the high alert declared earlier this month for Israeli units on the Lebanese border was not restored.

The Hizballah guerrillas took advantage of this lack of vigilance to infiltrate Israel near Zarit, penetrate to a distance of 200 meters, fire RPGs and roadside bombs at two Israeli Hammer jeeps on patrol, and make off with Ehud Goldwasser and Eldad Regev. Eight Israeli soldiers lost their lives as a result of this attack.

The IDF ground pursuit for the two men was cut short when an Israeli tank was blown up by a massive 300-kilo bomb in south Lebanon, killing the four-man crew and a fifth soldier who tried to rescue his comrades.

The attack on the Ahi-Hanit was the third surprise.

When General Halutz was asked if Israel does not fear Syrian and Iranian intervention in the hostilities, he replied firmly in the negative. But Iran has been involved from the very first moment.

This localized perception of the Just Reward campaign in Lebanon is hampering its effectiveness. The war embarked on Wednesday night, July 12, is no local conflict. It is therefore not enough to limit the operation to a duel with Nasrallah, when his strings are pulled by Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and Ahmadinejad from Tehran and the Syrian president Bashar Assad, who opened up Damascus military airport for the delivery of Iranian missiles to his militia.

Saturday morning, Hizballah TV broadcast a videotape showed a blurred object looking like a small unmanned aircraft purportedly packed with explosives exploding in the water. This was an attempt to muddy the trail leading to Tehran and present the fatal attack as an extraordinary feat of arms by Hizballah. It was also another move in and intense psychological war to undermine Israeli morale. The inference they are trying to get across is that if the Shiite terrorists have a weapon that can hit a moving target at sea, the will not find it hard to reach any part of Israel including Tel Aviv.

Debka.com

[NimDod]

Debka.com

Snoshi, come on... dont waste our time quoting Debka file "reports".

[Snoshi]

Snoshi, come on... dont waste our time quoting Debka file "reports".


I know, but still :)

[Luno]

It most likely was no C.802, a Kowsar is the same as the C.802 but only half as big and with a 4-5 times less range.

The reports say that the ship was hit at its back and such a large AshM like the C.802 would most likely have very bad effects on a ship of the Saar-5 size.

Thats why I believe that it was a Kowsar and not a C.802 Harpoon size, 120km range AshM.

The ship would have to be very happy to survive a backshot with a C.802.

it can still be an C.802 but the missile did hit the stern of the ship and she is still sailing on its own back to Israel then I doubt that the missile did explode on impact.. a 165 kg HE Warhead would seriously damage the stern of that ship

This is what an antiship missile with a 200kg Warhead does to a destroyer then guess what a 165 kg HE Warhead would do to a Corvette
http://img428.imageshack.us/img428/5999/rbs155en.jpg

[Kleistmaster]

it can still be an C.802 but the missile did hit the stern of the ship and she is still sailing on its own back to Israel then I doubt that the missile did explode on impact.. a 165 kg HE Warhead would seriously damage the stern of that ship

This is what an antiship missile with a 200kg Warhead does to a destroyer then guess what a 165 kg HE Warhead would do to a Corvette
http://img428.imageshack.us/img428/5999/rbs155en.jpg

towed to israel...

[Tamir]

Snoshi, come on... dont waste our time quoting Debka file "reports".
I have to say debka has been more accurate with this then actual IDF spokesman briefings.

[Snoshi]

A senior IDF intelligence official says that Iran has approximately 100 soldiers in Lebanon and that they helped Hizbullah hit an Israel Navy ship with an anti-ship missile.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150886005663&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

[Luno]

towed to israel...

Oki I see there where one post here that did say that she where sailing back to Israel with out any help.

[UZI4U]

towed to israel...

It sailed on its own back to port.

[daily666]

The saar 5 has a Barak SAM system and a Mk-15 Phalanx. And so many people here on MP.net were 100% sure the AAW coverage of US warships would easily cope with missile attacks of small Iranian vessels in the Gulf. The Israeli crew must have been completely unaware of the situation and (propably) the Israeli intelligence didn't know about Hisballah having any kind of SSMs. One more thing , if it was a C.802 the ship would have sunk for sure, no question. The missile has a 165kg warhead and the range of about 80nm, I'm not fully sure but I don't think it would activate on such a short distnance.

[Darth Vidar]

If there are C.802 anti-ship missiles in Lebanon with a 120 km range, then the Israeli navy base in Haifa is within range.

Everytime a navy ship leave or approach the harbour of Haifa the Hezbollah only need a call from a friendly israeli-arab with a binocular and a cell-phone to be able to fire a missile towards the general area.
If they are lucky the seeker in the missiles nose pick up a target and go after it.

The balance of power in the region is changing from day to day now. The Israeli navy will have to make major changes to its routines while operating in Lebanese waters.

[-=P=-]

Yes the Hizbollah obviously don’t have C.802's and to transport it at least something in the size of a truck is needed.

A Kowsar in its transport container on the other hand could be put on a van and thus very hard to spot, the van only needs a personal computer to give the input of where the target is at the moment and how fast it moves in which direction and the rest will be done by the missile and its small radar.


PS: DEBKA isn’t a very useful source; the C.802 for example is certainly not of the "Silkworm" family...

[Mr. Nielsen]

This is what an antiship missile with a 200kg Warhead does to a destroyer then guess what a 165 kg HE Warhead would do to a Corvette
http://img428.imageshack.us/img428/5999/rbs155en.jpg
Are you sure it's a missile strike and not a torpedo?

[Tamir]

Yes the Hizbollah obviously don’t have C.802's and to transport it at least something in the size of a truck is needed.

A Kowsar in its transport container on the other hand could be put on a van and thus very hard to spot, the van only needs a personal computer to give the input of where the target is at the moment and how fast it moves in which direction and the rest will be done by the missile and its small radar.


PS: DEBKA isn’t a very useful source; the C.802 for example is certainly not of the "Silkworm" family...
Is there an online page with details on the kowsar? or an Iranian brochoure like they make for most weapons?

[daily666]

Here's some information on it

http://www.afpc.org/mdbr/mdbr146.shtml

http://www.iranian.ws/cgi-bin/iran_news/exec/view.cgi/2/3124

I can't find any pics of it.

[kraf001]

Is there an online page with details on the kowsar? or an Iranian brochoure like they make for most weapons?

well the closest thing to Kowsar is the Chinese C-701:

TYPE - ANTI-SHIP AND LAND ATTACK
MAKER - China Hai-Ying Electro-Mechanical Technology Academy (CHETA) - CASIC 3rd Academy
WARHEAD - 64 LB. (29 KG) time-delayed semi-armour-piercing high-explosive
RANGE - 12 MILES
WING SPAN - 23 INCHES
LENGTH - 8.125 FEET
WEIGHT - 220 POUNDS
ENGINE - SOLID PROPELLENT BOOSTER AND SUSTAINER
GUIDANCE - I/R TV SEEKER OR ACTIVE MILIMETER WAVE RADAR HOMING SEA SKIMMER
TERMINAL GUIDANCE USING HIGH RES. RADAR IMAGING
SPEED - MACH .8 AT SEA LEVEL

[Tamir]

Here's some information on it

http://www.afpc.org/mdbr/mdbr146.shtml

http://www.iranian.ws/cgi-bin/iran_news/exec/view.cgi/2/3124

I can't find any pics of it. I already found that using google, looking for some better details & statistics.
Thanks.

[Luno]

Are you sure it's a missile strike and not a torpedo?

I am 110% sure that it is a anti-ship missiles and not a torpedo.
The anti-ship missiles is a Bofors RBS 15 and the photo is from a movie. You can see the missile just before hitting the ship in the movie

[kraf001]

I can't find any pics of it.
http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/7_8501150475_L600.jpg

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/8_8501150475_L600.jpg

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/9_8501150475_L600.jpg

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/11_8501150475_L600.jpg
http://www.mehrnews.com/mehr_media/image/2006/04/187078_orig.jpg
http://www.mehrnews.com/mehr_media/image/2006/04/187083_orig.jpg

[daily666]

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/7_8501150475_L600.jpg

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/8_8501150475_L600.jpg

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/9_8501150475_L600.jpg

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8501/ImageReports/8501150475/11_8501150475_L600.jpg
http://www.mehrnews.com/mehr_media/image/2006/04/187078_orig.jpg
http://www.mehrnews.com/mehr_media/image/2006/04/187083_orig.jpg


I knew you're gonna help, thanks a lot.

[Mr. Nielsen]

I am 110% sure that it is a anti-ship missiles and not a torpedo.
The anti-ship missiles is a Bofors RBS 15 and the photo is from a movie. You can see the missile just before hitting the ship in the movie
OK.

Impressive effect.

[B25Hmitchell]

AP reports it was indeed a missile, launched by Iranian military personnel from Lebanon. C802 built by China and bought by Iran.

[Luno]

I am not an expert on anti-ship missiles but when I look at the first picture of it get confused because I did believe that an anti ship missiles flies about 2-4 meter above the water to avoid the radar .
But on this picture it looks like it is flying 50-150m above the ground and still climbing :|
http://network.news.com.au/image/0,10114,5187239,00.jpg

[Darth Vidar]

If it turns out that Iranians fired the anti-ship missiles, Israel should strike back by sinking an iranian warship with a torpedo from one of its Dolphin-subs operating near Iranian waters.

An eye for an eye......

[PeterG]

Incidentally, i believe an israeli warship ( The destroyer 'Eilat' ) was the first warship to be sunk by a ship-to-ship missile, a russian made 'silkworm', in the 60s.

This whole affair, from the ambush/abduction of the troops, the huge IED that blew up the tank, a guided missile at the israeli corvette, seems like the biggest israeli intelligence screwup since the yom kippur...Hope there are no more nasty surprises.

And again, i am actually beginning to believe in earnest that Ahmadinejad is a complete lunatic - in the clinical sense, that primarily wants nuclear weapons to strike at Israel - not threaten, but actually strike.

[Darth Vidar]

Incidentally, i believe an israeli warship ( The destroyer 'Eilat' ) was the first warship to be sunk by a ship-to-ship missile, a russian made 'silkworm', in the 60s.
.

You are right. The "Eilat" was attacked oct 20. 1967 by Egyptian FAC`s firing 4 "Styx" anti ship missiles. I think one or two struck. The Eilat sank, 49 sailors died.

[Lanton]

I am not an expert on anti-ship missiles but when I look at the first picture of it get confused because I did believe that an anti ship missiles flies about 2-4 meter above the water to avoid the radar .
But on this picture it looks like it is flying 50-150m above the ground and still climbing :|
http://network.news.com.au/image/0,10114,5187239,00.jpg
It looks to me like that missile was launched from a built-up area - which explains why you'd want it to quickly gain altitude from the point of launch, clear the surrounding buildings and then have it descend to hit the target.

[NimDod]

You are right. The "Eilat" was attacked oct 20. 1967 by Egyptian FAC`s firing 4 "Styx" anti ship missiles. I think one or two struck. The Eilat sank, 49 sailors died.

4 missiles. the first two blow up comunication systems and the engine, the third one blow up the ship's ammo, and the 4th missle was the one that killed most of the sailors who abandoned the ship and were in the water.
47 were killed, 91 wonded.

http://www.inseilat.com/images/pics/pic12.jpg

[Flavius22]

IDF : Missile that hit ship was Iranian
Ynet ^

Posted on 07/15/2006 4:48:46 AM PDT by maquiladora

A senior IDF officer said the ship was struck by an Iranian-made C802 missile, but he refused to say whether or not Iranian activists were behind the launching itself.

The army said two C802 missiles were fired at the vessel; the first missed the ship and struck an Egyptian boat some 60 kilometers (37 miles) off the Lebanon coast.

The stern of the ship was hit shortly after 8:30 p.m. Friday night and a conflagration ignited on the helicopter landing pad. The hit also damaged the ship’s internal operating systems.

(Excerpt) Read more at ynetnews.com ...

silkworm

[PeterG]

IDF : Missile that hit ship was Iranian
Ynet ^

Posted on 07/15/2006 4:48:46 AM PDT by maquiladora

A senior IDF officer said the ship was struck by an Iranian-made C802 missile, but he refused to say whether or not Iranian activists were behind the launching itself.

'Iranian activists'..Very well equipped 'activists' i must say...It must have been a challenge getting anti-ship missiles through customs.

[-=P=-]

The attack was at 2015 hours, it couldn't have been so dark as in this supposed picture.

[epc]

'Iranian activists'..Very well equipped 'activists' i must say...It must have been a challenge getting anti-ship missiles through customs.

Maybe they meant to say "Iranian operators?"

[Kaplanr]

'Iranian activists'..Very well equipped 'activists' i must say...It must have been a challenge getting anti-ship missiles through customs.

You're behind the times. Haven't you seen Beirut International's Arrivals Hall?

Red Line if you have something to declare
Blue Line if you don't
Green Line if you're a Revolutinary Guard or Hizb. :)

[Kaplanr]

This from (www.fas.org):
The Ying-Ji-802 land attack and anti-ship cruise missile [Western designation SACCADE], is an improved version of the C-801 which employs a small turbojet engine in place of the original solid rocket engine. The weight of the subsonic (0.9 Mach) Yingji-802 is reduced from 815 kilograms to 715 kilograms, but its range is increased from 42 kilometers to 120 kilometers. The 165 kg. (363 lb.) warhead is just as powerful as the earlier version. Since the missile has a small radar reflectivity and is only about five to seven meters above the sea surface when it attacks the target, and since its guidance equipment has strong anti-jamming capability, target ships have a very low success rate in intercepting the missile. The hit probability of the Yingji-802 is estimated to be as high as 98 percent. The Yingji-802 can be launched from airplanes, ships, submarines and land-based vehicles, and is considered along with the US "Harpoon" as among the best anti-ship missiles of the present-day world.

So it raises the question of if the IDF was running radar and countermeasures or they assumed that the Lebanese and Hizb. didn't have the capabilities to launch a "real" anti-ship missile.

[Pille1234]

I am 110% sure that it is a anti-ship missiles and not a torpedo.
The anti-ship missiles is a Bofors RBS 15 and the photo is from a movie. You can see the missile just before hitting the ship in the movie

Sorry Luno, you have been fooled by RBS propaganda as I was at first.

The picture acutally shows the sinking of the USS Mullinix in 1992. IIRC it was hit by several Fuel-Aerosol-Bombs and it was the uncontrolled fire that finally destroyed the ship.

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/936/123bl4.jpg
http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/2310/124og3.jpg
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/2662/sinkexfireball2navybi8.jpg

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8000/125mz5.jpg

[daily666]

4 missiles. the first two blow up comunication systems and the engine, the third one blow up the ship's ammo, and the 4th missle was the one that killed most of the sailors who abandoned the ship and were in the water.
47 were killed, 91 wonded.

http://www.inseilat.com/images/pics/pic12.jpg


It was an intelligence disaster, The Osa I PTM capabilites was virtually unknown to the west at that time.

This from (www.fas.org):


So it raises the question of if the IDF was running radar and countermeasures or they assumed that the Lebanese and Hizb. didn't have the capabilities to launch a "real" anti-ship missile.


Yes it's very possible that the Israeli Navy ship commander was cought with his pants down, maybe no AA or surface radar on, only navigation. However we still have no clue what kind of missile struck the ship. It's hard to believe it was the C.802, first of all the ship would have sunk, however it's possible they were lucky and none of the vital parts were hit. Also it's impossible it was shelling the Beirut airport as Saar-5 doesn't have a gun for doing so.

[Luno]

Pille1234
Ohh I damn didn’t know that I where 100 % sure that the ship on the picture where from a old Swedish destroyer. :oops:
but thank you for clearing that up :)

[daily666]

This is what a 100kg AGM-84C Harpoon warhead did to an old destroyer. And it was an old-school of shipbuilding, with haredened steel not stealthy alloy stuff they use nowdays.

http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/9259/harpoon20damageue7.jpg

[alvarito]

Hi

I Wanted To Ask, Why Israel Doesnt Have Destroyers, And Only Has Corvettes???

[Bert]

Hi

I Wanted To Ask, Why Israel Doesnt Have Destroyers, And Only Has Corvettes???
Well.. A destroyer would block the Israeli coast tip-to-tip when moored. p-)

It's a small country, they don't need a large navy to protect their coast. The air force can reach out so fast because the country is so small.

I'm sure Israeli members have more useful input..

[daily666]

I think this is a good resource.

http://www.israeli-weapons.com/israeli_weapons_naval.html

[Kaplanr]

. . .
The picture acutally shows the sinking of the USS Mullinix in 1992. IIRC it was hit by several Fuel-Aerosol-Bombs and it was the uncontrolled fire that finally destroyed the ship.


Certainly looks like her back was broken, doomed regardless of fires, no?

Hi
I Wanted To Ask, Why Israel Doesnt Have Destroyers, And Only Has Corvettes???

The previously mentioned sinking of the INS Eilat changed Israeli naval doctrine. From independence until then, Israel relied on coastal defence craft, some submarines and 3-4 mostly ex RN destroyers for heavier coastal defense, shore bombardment and if needed force projection, though that was really wishful thinking. The Eilat sinking made everyone realize that WWII era ships required too many crew for a weapon of limited tactical ability. If the Komar class boats could engage the "traditional" naval forces with 1/4 of the crew or less, and more lethal weapons, then the doctrine needed to be changed.

The direct result was the contract for the Saar class missile boats (derivatives of the German Jaguar class) with the boatyards in Cherbourg. Fast, offensively armed and requiring smaller crews, they were relatively state of the art ships in 1969. Their worth was proven (after being embargoed and "stolen back" by the Israelis - worth a Speilberg movie too) in the Battle of Latakia during the Yom Kippur War.

A classic destroyer is designed for escort duties (either convoy or battle group) and sub hunting. Israel doesn't have any battle groups and the threat to maritime lines of communications isn't considered high vis-a-vis enemy naval forces. The danger lies in blockade - Gibralter, Suez, and Bab El Mandeb at the horn of Africa.

In a partial example of fighting the last war or something, The Saars aren't rally designed for the role they're currently in as far as bombardment goes, though the blockade is effective.

[Kaplanr]

The saar 5 has a Barak SAM system and a Mk-15 Phalanx. And so many people here on MP.net were 100% sure the AAW coverage of US warships would easily cope with missile attacks of small Iranian vessels in the Gulf. The Israeli crew must have been completely unaware of the situation and (propably) the Israeli intelligence didn't know about Hisballah having any kind of SSMs. One more thing , if it was a C.802 the ship would have sunk for sure, no question. The missile has a 165kg warhead and the range of about 80nm, I'm not fully sure but I don't think it would activate on such a short distnance.

Personally, and I'm sure to get zapped by my brethern for this, I think we've seen some pretty poor examples in the last two weeks of IDF readiness and training shortcomings. WHat happened at Kerem Shalom shouldn't have happened, the attack on the border shouldn't have happened - especially after the Gilad Shalit kidnapping, and now the ship being hit. Maybe I'm being harsh, but I know that even extreme precautions and alertness becaome routine when it's a daily practice.

[One]

So I was right when I said it was an Iranian anti-ship missile.


Updates

Beirut, Jounieh, Tripoli ports attacked by apache helicopters

[Pille1234]

Certainly looks like her back was broken, doomed regardless of fires, no?

Not neccessarily. The pictures my give a wrong impression, the ship was afloat and on fire for quite some time. The back was not broken by impact but subsequently by the huge fire weakening the structure and the uncontrolled flood increasing the pressure on the hull.
Pure speculation of course, but a damage and fire control team may have been able to save the ship.

[Snoshi]

Personally, and I'm sure to get zapped by my brethern for this, I think we've seen some pretty poor examples in the last two weeks of IDF readiness and training shortcomings. WHat happened at Kerem Shalom shouldn't have happened, the attack on the border shouldn't have happened - especially after the Gilad Shalit kidnapping, and now the ship being hit. Maybe I'm being harsh, but I know that even extreme precautions and alertness becaome routine when it's a daily practice.


I partly agree. Kerem Shalom attacked could have been prevented because there were warning about the attack.

Hezbollah attack was a tactical failure.. after the last Hezbollah attack IDF destroyed many out posts close to Israeli border.. but after the incident they returned.

And there was probably intelligence warning that Hezbollah will try to kidnap soldier.. But i dont think it could have been prevented.. you cant stop Jeeps from patrolling.

[alvarito]

i want to ask what is the difference between the artillery israel is using to shell hezbollah positions
http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/vehicles/self_propelled_artillery/m109/Doher.html

and this type of artillery


http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/missile_systems/artillery/lar/LAR.html

http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/missile_systems/artillery/gradlar/GRADLAR.html



of course, wanted to apologise for my ignorance.

[Tamir]

Personally, and I'm sure to get zapped by my brethern for this, I think we've seen some pretty poor examples in the last two weeks of IDF readiness and training shortcomings. WHat happened at Kerem Shalom shouldn't have happened, the attack on the border shouldn't have happened - especially after the Gilad Shalit kidnapping, and now the ship being hit. Maybe I'm being harsh, but I know that even extreme precautions and alertness becaome routine when it's a daily practice. Zapped? I completely agree. Complacency and arrogance, gets us every time.

[Elemental666]

Agreed...i was shocked when heard about the kidnapping of the soldiers in the Lebanese border.and what suprised me the most is not the kidnap itself,but the fact that they actually got away and not got spotted by I.D.F....i reallllly hope they learned their lessons and this kinda of things wont happen again.i understand that soldiers are not machines and no mather how well they are trained still things like that can happen,but we got to change some things,first,in a case of kidnap I.D.F should respond FAST.that can be done by constant communication between the patrolling units and their base,say like every 10 minutes.and of course better countermeasures at the border,cameras on every inch of the border,no "dead zonez" as they are called.

[signatory]

i want to ask what is the difference between the artillery israel is using to shell hezbollah positions
http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/vehicles/self_propelled_artillery/m109/Doher.html

and this type of artillery


http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/missile_systems/artillery/lar/LAR.html

http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/missile_systems/artillery/gradlar/GRADLAR.html



of course, wanted to apologise for my ignorance.


First is artillery.. it has shorter range, but greater accuracy and the shells cost much much less. The other two is rocket based systems with better range and can deliver more firepower over a larger area in shorter time than the artillery system.

They complement eachother...

[saigonsmuggler]

It sailed on its own back to port.
can you post link? Every report I read said that it was TOWED back to port.

[UZI4U]

can you post link? Every report I read said that it was TOWED back to port.

That's what was reported on one of Israel's main channels (channel 10).

But I stand corrected, the ship had problems sailing on its own

[alvarito]

thanks man, for your response.

how do you aim artilley like doher? katyushas fall in the second type of artillery, like the gradlar?? why does israel doesnt have cheap rockets as katyushas?

[UZI4U]

It seems the Saar 5's missile defenses were not operational and unmanned at the time of the attack.

[daily666]

It seems the Saar 5's missile defenses were not operational and unmanned at the time of the attack.


I knew it! Caught with pants down. Propably the Israelis had no idea Hizballah has any SSMs, or the intel fellas forgot to share that info with the navy guys.

[Pille1234]

It seems the Saar 5's missile defenses were not operational and unmanned at the time of the attack.
That is very hard to believe.

Btw I wonder if the boat was equipped with a 76mm gun or Phalanx. If shelling Libanon was the task as could be seen in one of the ynet videos (I know it was a different vessel) than I'd go with the OTO.

[Elemental666]

That is very hard to believe.

Well if they didn't expect it so sadly it is totally posible.and we paid for it.hope they are more carefull this time.did the launch crew of the missile was atacked by I.A.F or they got away?

[PeterG]

That is very hard to believe.

Actually, it is totally unbelievable..This while directly engaged in combat, just off the coast of the enemy, shelling them? Someone won't make admiral....

[Big Lebowski]

Well if they didn't expect it so sadly it is totally posible.and we paid for it.hope they are more carefull this time.did the launch crew of the missile was atacked by I.A.F or they got away?
they probely got away course they fired the missiles from an urban area

[He219]

I posted some pix yesterday ...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30700184.jpg
Israeli Navy ship Tarshish fires a 76mm artillery round towards the area of the southern Lebanon town of Necore as it patrols off the southern Lebanese coast, in Lebanese territorial waters, Friday, July 14, 2006. Israel tightened its seal on Lebanon, blasting its air and road links to the outside world and bringing its offensive to the capital for the first time Friday in order to punish Hezbollah, and with it, the country, for the capture of two Israeli soldiers. In the background the Lebanese town of Sidon.(AP Photo/Baz Ratner)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30700072.jpg

Israeli soldiers stand on the bridge of the Israeli Navy ship Keshet as it patrols off the southern Lebanese coast next to the Lebanese town of Necore, in Lebanese territorial waters, Friday, July 14, 2006. Israel tightened its seal on Lebanon, blasting its air and road links to the outside world and bringing its offensive to the capital for the first time Friday in order to punish Hezbollah, and with it, the country, for the capture of two Israeli soldiers.(AP Photo/Baz Ratner)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30699937.jpg
Israeli soldiers stand on the bridge of the Israeli Navy ship Keshet as it patrols off the southern Lebanese coast next to the Lebanese town of Necore, in Lebanese territorial waters, Friday, July 14, 2006. Israel tightened its seal on Lebanon, blasting its air and road links to the outside world and bringing its offensive to the capital for the first time Friday in order to punish Hezbollah, and with it, the country, for the capture of two Israeli soldiers.(AP Photo/Baz Ratner)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30700262.jpg
Israeli Navy Ship Tarshish patrols off the southern Lebanese coast next to the Lebanese town of Necore, in Lebanese territorial waters, Friday, July 14, 2006. Israel tightened its seal on Lebanon, blasting its air and road links to the outside world and bringing its offensive to the capital for the first time Friday in order to punish Hezbollah, and with it, the country, for the capture of two Israeli soldiers. (AP Photo/Baz Ratner)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30699993.jpg
Israeli soldiers stand on the bridge of the Israeli Navy ship Keshet as it patrols off the southern Lebanese coast next to the Lebanese town of Necore, in Lebanese territorial waters, Friday, July 14, 2006. Israel tightened its seal on Lebanon, blasting its air and road links to the outside world and bringing its offensive to the capital for the first time Friday in order to punish Hezbollah, and with it, the country, for the capture of two Israeli soldiers.(AP Photo/Baz Ratner)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30700040.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30700316.jpg
In Israeli soldier is sprayed by a wave as he stands next to a machine gun on board the Israeli Navy Ship Keshet as it patrols off the southern Lebanese coast next to the Lebanese town of Necore, in Lebanese territorial waters, Friday, July 14, 2006. Israel tightened its seal on Lebanon, blasting its air and road links to the outside world and bringing its offensive to the capital for the first time Friday in order to punish Hezbollah, and with it, the country, for the capture of two Israeli soldiers.(AP Photo/Baz Ratner)

[UZI4U]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30700262.jpg



That's a Saar Saar 4.5.

[daily666]

That's a Saar Saar 4.5.


Thats Saar 4. IIRC The 4.5 doesn't have a 76mm at the back.

[tanks_alot]

Actually, it is totally unbelievable..This while directly engaged in combat, just off the coast of the enemy, shelling them? Someone won't make admiral....

Well in the news here it was told they turned the defences of because of the IAF opearting in the area..... thats a serious fuk up.....

also they just showed the ship sailing on it's on.

[UZI4U]

Thats Saar 4. IIRC The 4.5 doesn't have a 76mm at the back.

Yes it does...

http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/naval/saar45/Saar45.html

[UZI4U]

BTW, Israel's channel 2 news just showed the damaged INS Hanit sailing on its own...

[daily666]

Yes it does...

http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/naval/saar45/Saar45.html


Ok, you're right, I was fooled by that 76mm at the back but it seems there are Saar 4.5 which lack the 76mm but has a helicopter deck in this place.

[sferrin]

This is what a 100kg AGM-84C Harpoon warhead did to an old destroyer. And it was an old-school of shipbuilding, with haredened steel not stealthy alloy stuff they use nowdays.

http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/9259/harpoon20damageue7.jpg

A Harpoon warhead is more like 227kg.

[Pille1234]

Well in the news here it was told they turned the defences of because of the IAF opearting in the area..... thats a serious fuk up.....

also they just showed the ship sailing on it's on.

There is a difference between autonomous engagement and 'switching off' air defences.

Any pic or link to a video showing the ship?

[Giann53]

Which ship was hit was it the Sa'aar 5 I believe?

[UZI4U]

but it seems there are Saar 4.5 which lack the 76mm but has a helicopter deck in this place.

That's only the Saar 5 that has a landing deck...

[AOCBravo2004]

BTW, Israel's channel 2 news just showed the damaged INS Hanit sailing on its own...

Any picture of this? Any other word on the still missing 3 sailors???

No offense, but Lebanon and the UN brought this problem upon themselves for allowing Hezbollah to carry on.

[UZI4U]

Any picture of this? Any other word on the still missing 3 sailors???


The three other sailors are still MIA...

As for the ship...



http://uploaded.fresh.co.il/2006/07/15/89059583.jpg

[LazerLordz]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/notgonnadothismuchlonger/more/more/more/30700262.jpg

Resembles the RSN's Seawolf class Missile Gunboats. Armed with Gabriel and Harpoons, with a OTO Melara 76mm in the front and a Bofors 30mm out back.

[alexz]

Apperntly Israel just destroyed all the Lebanese army costal radars.
hezzbullah used them to hit the ship.
Why wasn't that done before or how they miss the missile lunch straight from
the Beirut cost should cost some hias job!

[alexz]

Resembles the RSN's Seawolf class Missile Gunboats. Armed with Gabriel and Harpoons, with a OTO Melara 76mm in the front and a Bofors 30mm out back.

Not at all. Saar 5 is much more modern and advanced.

[UZI4U]

Apperntly Israel just destroyed all the Lebanese army costal radars.
hezzbullah used them to hit the ship.
Why wasn't that done before or how they miss the missile lunch straight from
the Beirut cost should cost some hias job!

I guess some people in govenment thought the Lebanese military and Hizballah were two separate entities...

[UZI4U]

Resembles the RSN's Seawolf class Missile Gunboats. Armed with Gabriel and Harpoons, with a OTO Melara 76mm in the front and a Bofors 30mm out back.

That's a Saar 4.5.

This is a Saar 5...

http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/naval/saar5/saar5_1b.jpg

[perdurabo]

Polish media are bunch of fouls, in one they said that israeli ship was hit by unmaned aircraft loaded with explosives and in other they said that Israeli cruisier was hit by rocket....

[Bert]

I guess some people in govenment thought the Lebanese military and Hizballah were two separate entities...
Perhaps they didn't except Iran to be daring enough to give them reverse-engineered Chinese missiles..

[daily666]

Polish media are bunch of fouls, in one they said that israeli ship was hit by unmaned aircraft loaded with explosives and in other they said that Israeli cruisier was hit by rocket....


Heavens, where the hell they said that crap? I was watching TVN24 and they said only about a missile