BDS Tactical Gear

[Mike762]

Anybody got any BDS Tactical gear? I was wondering what the quality was and if it's worth the money any info would be helpful thanks.

[Whisper_44]

BDS is good to go, quality gear made by quality people. I have 4 of the BDS Tactical Modular DA Pouches and they are a great peice of it. My only real complaint is those damn malice clips:-*$

BDS Tactical Modular DA Pouch (http://www.bdstacticalgear.com/pd_bds_tactical_modular_da.cfm)

[Mike762]

Thanks for the info whisper 44

[DTTO]

I would buy my stuff from John Willis instead... (Original SOE)
I won't spend a dime with BDS.

S.

[Mike762]

I would buy my stuff from John Willis instead... (Original SOE)
I won't spend a dime with BDS.

S.


why do you say that might i ask?

[DTTO]

SOE used to be owned by John Willis, He went away for a while, and his wife took things over. With some questionable quality gear being sent out, no where near old SOE standards. And later they changed the name to "BDS tactical".
John didn't see a dime as far as I know of any money made on the reputation he made with the company.

Now John is back and started up himself again, and is slowly growing again and I'd rather see my money go to someone who has made his own way and keeps trying to go forward despite setbacks and actually has love for the business and listens to the end-users than pay top dollar to someone who "stole" his designs, changed the name and is going from that.

That's just my opinion and my take on things, you want the full story, search some of the other boards or ask John Willis and decide for yourself where you want to spend your cash.

S.

[Mike762]

thanks DTTO i think i'll just find another company;-)

[Steel_Weasel]

SOE used to be owned by John Willis, He went away for a while, and his wife took things over.

Lets be honest. John went to prison. While he was behind bars his (ex) wife screwed him over and took the company from him, changing the name. When he got out he re-established his former business under the 'original' moniker.

On a somewhat related note I never seem to get a coherent answer as to why he went to prison, but rest assured he did something bad.

[James]

On a somewhat related note I never seem to get a coherent answer as to why he went to prison, but rest assured he did something bad.

This rings a bell. Maybe something about illegal firearms, but I'm not sure.

[DTTO]

I don't think it matters what he did.. The man did whatever time he was sentenced to do... And is now back doing his job.

James I'm pretty sure you are mistaken.

Anyway, John Willis as far as I have seen and heared from others makes the most bombproof gear out there.
You can't go wrong with his gear.

S.

[Catch22]

Having heard the SOE story before, and having some of their stuff (which I concur is rock solid, however conservative) I'd like to learn a bit more on why BDS is so bad then? I care little for someones private affairs, and I'd rather like to hear some more oppinions from actual BDS users, like Whisper44... So, anyone else?

[john willis]

Hi guys. John Willis here. I did a search for my name in google and this thread came up so I registered and thought I would say hello.

If there is any thing I can ever do for any of you please let me know. I can be contacted at: www.realsoegear.com (http://www.realsoegear.com)

Thank You
John Willis
John Willis Tcatical (the ORIGINAL Special Operations Equipment)
www.realsoegear.com (http://www.realsoegear.com)
jwillis10@san.rr.com

[Tactical Sense]

I sent 4000USD 7 months ago for an order and he did not send me anything yet and also he continue to lie about my order, ****ing person, to deserve to come back in jail..

Gaetano Garda
owner
Tactical Sense Italy

[dacanadianbomb]

Thats a pretty big accusation to throw around eh?
In some places thats got legal ramifications.

[One Shot Tactical Supply]

I'm sure he understands the legal issues surrounding it.

I've made similar posts about Bear Mountian Tomahawk that still owes me $1100 ( or five RR Ltd Edition hawks) from 2005.

The problem is you need legal representation in the State that the transaction happened to persue any legal action.

[Tactical Sense]

sorry to be rude but I want that people know my experience with him.

[dacanadianbomb]

Yeah but you are only stating that you sent him money and that he is a thief. I have no clue who you are, am I supposed to just take your word for it ?
You must recognize how stupid that would be?

How about you get more exact about what happened ?

btw. I am seeing more of the picture elsewhere.

[Tactical Sense]

I sent my money to him in November and after so many lies and bullsheet he told me that he could ship partially my order, so I said ok "maybe 7 months was not enough to prepare my items", and you know he was so in a harry to ship partially that after another 3 months I did not get my order, that's why I post to inform costumers about his way to work

[em_twofourzero]

I placed an order with BDS 25th June for a drop leg piece. They emailed me the next day to say they were out of stock and asking if I wanted to wait or cancel. Since I haven't been able to find a similar piece elsewhere, I decided to wait. Hopefully they aren't jerking me around here and I eventually get the damn thing.

http://www.rstacticalgear.com/prod_images_large/frontyLG1.jpghttp://www.rstacticalgear.com/prod_images_large/top1.jpg

[Tactical Sense]

BDS does not have anything with that, it is about John Willis and Original SOE gear, their products accordig to them are the best in the world, maybe that's why 9 months are not enough to receive an order concerning 5 or 7 vest and 20 poches..... off course it must be.

[One Shot Tactical Supply]

Tactical Assault Gear makes a drop leg shingle like that, we are out of stock though.

Or you can put a Shingle on a MOLLE panel. We have these in stock right now.

[NoDoze-29]

I've had experience with both of them. I don't know whether his wife "screwed him over" or not, my understanding was that he had done something substantially ****ed up to get on her bad side and that she reciprocated by taking over the company, then got Mike Bornfriend to take over running the company. That is all second and third hand, so who knows. In the end, I don't care what the guy did as long as the gear is good to go. Here's my issue--I've worn about everything there is out there. SOE (the original stuff), then BDS, some TAG stuff, some CSM stuff, etc. Haven't had any experience personally with MercWorx. The SOE stuff I bought when I was out there in '99 for SWAT school with LAPD was AWESOME. Everything I bought after that was equally well built. The problem was ALWAYS customer service. It took forever to get your gear once you ordered it, and that was with umpteen phone calls. I was a dealer for SOE for a while (admittedly small time) and while everyone I talked to loved the gear, they hated the customer service.

The last straw came from me in 2001. I ordered around a thousand dollars worth of stuff for my personal use and it kept not coming, and not coming. Finally I was told, "You will have it by August, for sure." That would have been a little over four months into it. Then 9/11 hit, I was activated and given a deployment date to the desert. I was told, "No worries, we'll get it to you before you go." I went without my gear. While I was deployed my wife called them to get it, so she could get it to me. She was told, "No worries, we'll send it to him directly through his APO." That was in October. It never came.

I returned home from my first deployment the second week of March 2002. The third week of March 2002 we served a high risk warrant on a homicide suspect wanted on suspicion of a contract killing. That's how I remember that my SOE gear finally showed up the last week of March. I didn't have it for the entire deployment, then a really kick-ass warrant that had me out in the field doing surveillance for three days.

So, later, when I set up my own on-line store, I went to BDS Tactical. Initially they were really great. The gear I got was good, customer service was decent, etc. That only lasted a few months, however, and shortly thereafter customer service went completely to ****. Right now as I write this I have been trying for THREE WEEKS to get an e-mail or a call back on two separate orders that should have arrived weeks and weeks ago. I can't even get a call-back or an e-mail to check their status. As for quality, what I've had personally was good to go. I don't think it was as good as my old SOE, but it's okay. That's only what I've had my hands on, though, I can't vouch for the rest it.

So here's my quandary...I'd like to have some gear in my on-line store. Not because I give much of a **** about making a lot of money, but because the money we do make goes into teaching troops and cops or to developing instructors for the same purpose. We don't take any money for our instruction, the whole thing is on a volunteer basis...the store supports us, at least partially. I have been trying to decide if I wanted to go back to Original SOE and carry his gear again. I'm sure it's very, very good gear...BUT...how can I find out whether or not customer service is any good?

As for BDS, the stuff I've ordered has been satisfactory, but given what I've heard from customers that came to me after going direct with them, and damned sure what I've personally experienced with them, you better have plenty of time to wait on your order because it's pretty much a roll of the dice whether you get it on time or months later.

The only ones I can say for sure that have shipped anything I ordered quickly and without any problem have been MercWorx and CSM, but the volume I've ordered from them makes me leery to make that a blanket statement. I just honestly can't comment about their timeliness without doing additional business.

Sorry to post such a novel, but that's my experience. BDS takes FOREVER to give you your stuff, if ever (I've refunded money to a couple of people that just never did receive their gear, even after it supposedly shipped). I can't tell you what John is like now because I haven't dealt with him lately. I've heard from two people that timeliness was still an issue, but take that with a grain of salt as that's second hand.

I hope that helps.

Edit: I misspoke. I've had some Tactical Tailor accessories (not the vests or rigs) and they were very rugged. The TAG stuff I've had was built okay (haven't really done anything terribly challenging to the TAG pouches, admittedly) but the loop system they use to fix to your belt or wherever sucks, so I've replaced most of it already. For instance, a pistol mag pouch will come up with the magazine unless you do something to augment their loop fixture system. Sorry for the edit.

[Crewdog]

Dude, I feel for you on this.... but you dug a year old thread out of the grave for it?

[NoDoze-29]

Just started researching the Original SOE gear to see how customer service was developing. Year old or not, maybe somebody gets helped or has some info that will help me, eh?

[Crewdog]

Point taken. I have heard mixed review on the CS as well. I tend to get things from store fronts here in Washington. Very rarly do I order from online retailers unless I can get a stock status ahead of time simply to avoid issues like this.


BTW, got a link to your site?

[James]

Dude, I feel for you on this.... but you dug a year old thread out of the grave for it?

I thought his post was pretty informative. As an aside, I've been very happy with Tactical Tailor for a while, as well as the BattleLab stuff from Diamondback.

[Crewdog]

TT is one of the stores I hit up when I am in the south sound. Them and Quantico Arms.

[NoDoze-29]

I didn't want to put my site up because I didn't want it to look like I was trying to generate business as some sort of ulterior motive. Since you ask, however, it's www.goingloud.com (http://www.goingloud.com). We do our instruction through www.centuriontraininggroup.org (http://www.centuriontraininggroup.org) (we're a non-profit affiliate of TTOS, if you follow tracking stuff). Right now BDS is on there, but that's only because my web gal is on vacation. As soon as she gets back we're going to stop carrying it. We can make some money with it, but I'm tired of telling people I don't know when or if they're going to get their gear.

Edit: I may place a small order of stuff I can keep in stock, and retail that, but overall I'm gonna stop. The only reason we got into the store business was so we could teach more classes, and it's turned into a huge pain in the ass. I think if we can just make enough to teach 3 or 4 schools a year I'll be happy. If we have to work with 2nd hand power point projectors and beat-up gear, then it'll be worth just to avoid having to deal with the sales problems.

[Jippo]

The TAG stuff I've had was built okay (haven't really done anything terribly challenging to the TAG pouches, admittedly) but the loop system they use to fix to your belt or wherever sucks, so I've replaced most of it already. For instance, a pistol mag pouch will come up with the magazine unless you do something to augment their loop fixture system. Sorry for the edit.

Are you talking about the molle or the duty line?

I'm asking cause I think the best part of TAG is the molle attaching system without any buttons, clips etc. I haven't had problems with it.