Tour in PLA Armour Division

[SS1983]

http://img471.imageshack.us/img471/1126/135161702006080411145047958100zg3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/710/135161702006080411145056641700rb8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/4106/135161702006080411145058661600pn6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/6210/135161702006080411145060754200rb6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/1168/135161702006080411145062761900yb9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/5636/135161702006080411145064891700yl5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Type-79MBT
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/4617/135161702006080411145066903400os9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/1598/135161702006080411145069545300jw2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/9085/135161702006080411145071510900ry8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/8798/135161702006080411145073551700ws9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Barrack
http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/1349/135161702006080411145075700400lp2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Reading room
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/451/135161702006080411145078493600yh5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Club?
http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/5508/135161702006080411145080835300cn1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/6610/135161702006080411145082789400he5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/9890/135161702006080411145084854700gp3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Army man!
http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/2988/135161702006080411145087568000yj3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/3668/135161702006080411145089761500pg2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Mess hall and Chinese food.

From:http://military.china.com/zh_cn/top01/11053250/20060804/13516170.html

All photos belong to 无名剑2

[zulu261]

Hahahaaha that food every day? never!

[khukuri]

Hahahaaha that food every day? never!

hahahaha, yeah right! Unless they were officers?!

[SS1983]

Hahahaaha that food every day? never!

Of course not,unless everyday is festa.

[SS1983]

hahahaha, yeah right! Unless they were officers?!

High rank officer can eat much more better I think,but in the barrack,they have meals together if I am not wrong.

You guys always focus on food made me disappoint.China is poor,but China can supply their good sons such as fresh vegetable,meat and fish every day.

[khukuri]

You guys always focus on food made me disappoint.China is poor,but China can supply their good sons such as fresh vegetable,meat and fish every day.

SS1983, not trying to flame, but have you ever made military service? Its not about rich or porr country...

[Heron]

first few pics are type-79 ?

[pave_hawk]

nice pics.
The food standard for an ordinary PLA Army solider is about RMB10/day. Navy and Air force are higher.

[Dilion]

I wonder if the PLA can be qualified as "military" per se. Afterall its allegiance is to the Communist Party, a para-terrorists organization no less.

[flanker7]

I wonder if the PLA can be qualified as "military" per se. Afterall its allegiance is to the Communist Party, a para-terrorists organization no less.

Please do not flame and do not troll

[Latin Jewish Soldier]

Nice pics.Are those 105mm's by the way? Food looks good!

[joedirt]

china is making progress a few years ago I bet it would be unheard to allow such pictures to be released

[pave_hawk]

I wonder if the PLA can be qualified as "military" per se. Afterall its allegiance is to the Communist Party, a para-terrorists organization no less.
oh, yes, you can also blame Mr. Bush and Blair for their meetings with the head of this terrorist organization.

[Hellfish]

Great ictures on the inner life of the PLA. Thanks very much - please post more if you have them!

[deadhorse]

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e178/fikays/formation.jpg

Always one in every formation!! rofl rofl rofl

[Dilion]

Please do not flame and do not troll

I believe I have raised a legitimate concern, don't u agree?

[Hellfish]

No, you didn't. You were purposely driving the topic into a flame war. Get the **** out of here.

[psychonana]

PLA is only looking good as always.

[Dilion]

No, you didn't. You were purposely driving the topic into a flame war. Get the **** out of here.if thats the case, no doubt u can easily refute my point in an instance.

if not, please retract your above remark, thank you.

[Hellfish]

I'll say it again - get the **** out of here. I don't have to refute **** to trolls.

[deadhorse]

I'll say it again - get the **** out of here. I don't have to refute **** to trolls.

Hey Hellfish....isn't it funny how the cherries around here wanna bow-up so fast??? lmao

[OldRecon]

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e178/fikays/formation.jpg

Always one in every formation!! rofl rofl rofl

Can't you read the request above dude? :fork:

Please do not flame and do not troll

Now please keep this thread civilised for once :roll:.

Nice and interesting pics btw. Fell free to post more of same.

[Hellfish]

Seriously. 1 - this isn't the political discussion thread. I'm not gonna debate the actions of the Chinese government here and 2 - the dude has an obvious agenda and no amount of debate is gonna work to change his mind, so why bother??

[deadhorse]

Can't you read the request above dude? :fork:


Now please keep this thread civilised for once :roll:.

Nice and interesting pics btw. Fell free to post more of same.

Dude, if you don't understand the point of my comment, maybe you should ASK first, instead of assuming. The arrow is merely pointing out, for those of us with experience would know, the fact that there is always some guy in formation that can not wear their uniform properly, slouches, or just generally looks like sh*t( and since you probably STILL won't understand, here it is SPELLED out for you - his hat is crooked and he is slouching). That is ALL. I bet you look pretty good with egg on your face.

and BTW, I DO appreciate this thread and the pics.

[Hellfish]

Dude, if you don't understand the point of my comment, maybe you should ASK first, instead of assuming. The arrow is merely pointing out, for those of us with experience would know, the fact that there is always some guy in formation that can not wear their uniform properly, slouches, or just generally looks like sh*t( and since you probably STILL won't understand, here it is SPELLED out for you - his hat is crooked and he is slouching). That is ALL. I bet you look pretty good with egg on your face.

and BTW, I DO appreciate this thread and the pics.

x2 - everyone who has ever served would know the truth behind these comments. Inevitably someone is always screwing off - intentionally or not - in formations. It is in no way a reflection on the PLA. Kudos for deadhorse pointing it out.

[pave_hawk]

Dude, if you don't understand the point of my comment, maybe you should ASK first, instead of assuming. The arrow is merely pointing out, for those of us with experience would know, the fact that there is always some guy in formation that can not wear their uniform properly, slouches, or just generally looks like sh*t( and since you probably STILL won't understand, here it is SPELLED out for you - his hat is crooked and he is slouching). That is ALL. I bet you look pretty good with egg on your face.

and BTW, I DO appreciate this thread and the pics.

Calm down dude. I do believe OldRecon misunderstood what you meant.
According to the remark (in Chinese) made by the orignal author of the pics, the hat of the soldier was slanting after a goose step march exercise. But he dare not to correct it without a command. So he looked very nervous.

[pave_hawk]

Nice pics.Are those 105mm's by the way? Food looks good!
Yes, and they are actually from Israel in late 1970s. :)

[Dilion]

I'll say it again - get the **** out of here. I don't have to refute **** to trolls.

sure u don't have to, but r u sure appearing unreasonable is sth u really want?

[Dilion]

oh, yes, you can also blame Mr. Bush and Blair for their meetings with the head of this terrorist organization.

200 yrs back, America and UK were at each other's throat, how things have changed over the course of time.

u follow?

[deadhorse]

Calm down dude. I do believe OldRecon misunderstood what you meant.
According to the remark (in Chinese) made by the orignal author of the pics, the hat of the soldier was slanting after a goose step march exercise. But he dare not to correct it without a command. So he looked very nervous.

I am calm. Maybe you haven't noticed, but there are a plenty of "misunderstandings" around here. I was making a "funny" for those of us who understand. I was just pointing out the obvious to this "individual" since he obviously had no idea what he was talking about, and instead chose to get mouthy first. Believe me; you will find it difficult to simply be polite with the mixed company around here.

[Lokos]

wonder if the PLA can be qualified as "military" per se. Afterall its allegiance is to the Communist Party, a para-terrorists organization no less.

What of the American military's allegiance to the government of the United States? Is it only the fact that it is ideologically Communist that makes an allegiance to the Chinese government a mark of 'para-terrorist organizational doctrine'? Do you also think, then, that the Soviet Army and the RKKA were also 'para-terrorist' organizations?

You ask for refutation. I ask you now to clarify your position, because as of right now, I am willing to put in the time and the effort to destroy any postulation you have to offer. And I will. Believe it.


PLA is only looking good as always.

You, sir, need to remove yourself from this thread, post haste.

Hellfish:

Thanks for trying to keep the trolls down, brother.

Lokos

[Flagg]

I wonder if the PLA can be qualified as "military" per se. Afterall its allegiance is to the Communist Party, a para-terrorists organization no less.

flame bait....you have been warned and have received an infraction.

[Flagg]

I like their squared away bedrolls...not too shabby!!!!

[somedude]

That's food for the regular GI Zhou? Amazing. Any pics of what the officers get to eat?

[S.H.P.D]

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e178/fikays/formation.jpg

Always one in every formation!! rofl rofl rofl


This soldier is just nervous!!!Because many visitors are in there.......so he can't adjust his cap.
This action tell us they have a good discipline.
It's very normal.

ok?!

[S.H.P.D]

That's food for the regular GI Zhou? Amazing. Any pics of what the officers get to eat?


Oh, where is GI Zhou?

[somedude]

Oh, where is GI Zhou?

I meant it as a parody of GI Joe, aka the regular enlisted guy.

But seriously, any pics of the officers' mess?

[Mike762]

What's with the guys on the left shirts they are not tucked in?

[deadhorse]

This soldier is just nervous!!!Because many visitors are in there.......so he can't adjust his cap.
This action tell us they have a good discipline.
It's very normal.

Don't flame and troll,please.

WTF is wrong with the people around here?! How is what I said a "flame" or a "troll"???? For the last time, and you non-English as a first language folks take heed : it was a f*cking JOKE. That's it! And it wasn't even a joke at the expense of the PLA!!! I am sick and tired of trying to be polite or having to explain things in plain ENGLISH over and over. If anyone chooses to assume in reality what they can only interpret without completely understanding what is said in PLAIN English, can just kiss my f*cking ass.

[pave_hawk]

That's food for the regular GI Zhou? Amazing. Any pics of what the officers get to eat?

According to the original author, these photos were taken when some guests were visiting the unit. So I don't think the food is regualr, it is more likely for a party.

For officers, they don't always meal with soldiers. It is very flexible for them. Some can eat with soldiers, some have their own kitchens, and some even go home for lunch or go to restaurants. But whatever they eat, they have to pay for it if they are not in action.

[pave_hawk]

I like their squared away bedrolls...not too shabby!!!!

Unfortunately, squared bedrolls have been removed from PLA's dorctrines.:)

[Heron]

WTF is wrong with the people around here?! How is what I said a "flame" or a "troll"???? For the last time, and you non-English as a first language folks take heed : it was a f*cking JOKE. That's it! And it wasn't even a joke at the expense of the PLA!!! I am sick and tired of trying to be polite or having to explain things in plain ENGLISH over and over. If anyone chooses to assume in reality what they can only interpret without completely understanding what is said in PLAIN English, can just kiss my f*cking ass.

chill,bro
chill

he's not refer to you,mate
he's talking with that "PLA=terroist" guy

let's juat enjoy pics here:hug:

[deadhorse]

chill,bro
chill

he's not refer to you,mate
he's talking with that "PLA=terroist" guy

let's juat enjoy pics here:hug:


Well who knows who's referring to what around here! Although I think he was referring to me.....but yeah, you're right, I am chill now - had a couple of beers...individuals just need to understand what they are reading before they open their pie-holes, is all. Cheers!

[goat89]

Nice pics and nice food LOL!

[baifrank]

1.the cannon on the type 79 MBT,is L7 105mm, CHINA bought it from ISRAEL at 1970's.
2.the food is so rich because of soliers will dine with the visitor and officer together.
usually ,soliers have the rice,noodle, but little bread. egg,vegetable,pig,chicken,fish, but little seefood or beef.
soybean milk but little creamery

[Ordie]

What's with the guys on the left shirts they are not tucked in?


Judging from his shoulder boards, he looks like an officer. The uniform is similar to the Soviet/Russian summer uniforms. IMHO it looks kina dorky, but it's the norm over there, and functional in the humid Chinese summer.

[Ordie]

1.the cannon on the type 79 MBT,is L7 105mm, CHINA bought it from ISRAEL at 1970's.
2.the food is so rich because of soliers will dine with the visitor and officer together.
usually ,soliers have the rice,noodle, but little bread. egg,vegetable,pig,chicken,fish, but little seefood or beef.
soybean milk but little creamery

I would assume the food depends on the local conditions. For example Northern Chinese (Beijing, Shangdong) tend to eat more wheat products such as noodles or dumplings than rice and vice versa for the Southern Chinese (Guanzhou, Fujian).

Beef is not very common since a cow is considered a working animal. It would be the same as eating a horse in western societies. Until recently, dairy products were not the norm for the Chinese diet.

A common breakfast dish I had in China was "Jook" or "Xi-fan". It was plain rice porrage with toppings of your choice such as tofu, dried pork sung, peanuts, or pickeled vegetables. It gave me instant engery. I'm willing to bet the PLA provides the same food for breakfast.

[mikcem]

Very Nice Pics and thnx for sharing them

[PatricVadec]

Impressive pics,post it more please!

[S.H.P.D]

I meant it as a parody of GI Joe, aka the regular enlisted guy.

But seriously, any pics of the officers' mess?


These food on the pics are eaten by soldiers and officers(The soldier have same food level with the officer in China army.) when some important festivals are coming or some VIPs are coming.
In normal life, their food level are also very good,but the level is lower than that level on pics.

[S.H.P.D]

WTF is wrong with the people around here?! How is what I said a "flame" or a "troll"???? For the last time, and you non-English as a first language folks take heed : it was a f*cking JOKE. That's it! And it wasn't even a joke at the expense of the PLA!!! I am sick and tired of trying to be polite or having to explain things in plain ENGLISH over and over. If anyone chooses to assume in reality what they can only interpret without completely understanding what is said in PLAIN English, can just kiss my f*cking ass.


Hey,this word isn't aimed at you. Chilldown........

[SS1983]

Look like I made a good thread.I feel good.haha

[SS1983]

SS1983, not trying to flame, but have you ever made military service? Its not about rich or porr country...

I was misunderstanding you,Sorry.

[Lt.Havoc]

Nice pics, very intresting. Yup the Tanks are older Type 79, but most of them where upgraded. BTW: will the Type 79 be replaced by the newer Type 96? The even better Type 98 is only for the Elite Tank Dvisions as far as I know.

As for the food: well, I think that the standart food for the PLA Soldiers int better or worser then in any other army, at least in the Mess Hall. From the look of it, The PLA is als professional as any other army in the wrold. I mean, they are transforming a Mass army away from the "People War" to the "War under high-tech conditons" and thats a big task in an army that numbers over 1,6 million soldiers, even if they reduced the numbers greatly (in 1996 the army numberd 2,2 million people).

Well, anyway, great pics, would love to see more like that.

[stupkin]

For officers, they don't always meal with soldiers. It is very flexible for them. Some can eat with soldiers, some have their own kitchens, and some even go home for lunch or go to restaurants.

Did I got it the right way?
Do the officers, during training periods (in barraks for instance), have their meals together with the soldiers or do they eat at some kind of officers mess?
If there is some VIP visit then they all eat toghether, right. It's not like the VIP is going with the officer to the officers mess and the soldiers have to eat in their place. This one I got.
You mentioned about "having their own kitchen". So, they install kinchens in the officers accomodations or how is this to be understood?

I'm just askin 'cause I thought the PLA was a "old fashioned" (don't take it the wrong way, pls) army where they divided between soldier, NCO and officer (like the french do, if I'm not mistaken)

[Luno]

Great pictures SS1983 the food looks great :hug:

And I have a question :) the red ribbon around the cap does that mean something? Also what does the chine’s letter on that badge say?


http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/8798/135161702006080411145073551700ws9.jpg

[Cpl Ho]

Also what does the chine’s letter on that badge say?


It says 8-1, or 1st August, the date of the founding of PLA... red ribbon for Army Officers...

[pave_hawk]

Did I got it the right way?
Do the officers, during training periods (in barraks for instance), have their meals together with the soldiers or do they eat at some kind of officers mess?
If there is some VIP visit then they all eat toghether, right. It's not like the VIP is going with the officer to the officers mess and the soldiers have to eat in their place. This one I got.
You mentioned about "having their own kitchen". So, they install kinchens in the officers accomodations or how is this to be understood?

As I said, officers have the right to choose. Most of units have officer mess today. It is depend on their own will to select where to eat. No matter which one they go, they have to pay. So if they have meals with soldiers, they pay the soldier daily level (soldiers need not to pay).

In case of VIP visit, it depends on what kinda of visit it is. Not all VIPs dine with soldiers.

sorry, the "kitchen" here means "mess".


I'm just askin 'cause I thought the PLA was a "old fashioned" (don't take it the wrong way, pls) army where they divided between soldier, NCO and officer (like the french do, if I'm not mistaken)
The "old fashion" of PLA was just opposite the way you think. Traditionally, officers and soldiers were very equal in PLA. Before 1970, they treated each other as "class brothers", and most of officers are promoted from soldiers. After 1980s, as the army becomes more and more professional and modernlized, and as the communistic ideology fades, soldiers and officers are more and more divided. Most of officers are now graduated from military colleges and have no service records before they enter these colleges.

[Lt.Havoc]

Seems they are going in the direction the Soviet Army of the 60s-80s, where Soldiers and NCOs where devided from the Officers and many Officers came from the Academies and Schools and all that. This let to a big tension between the Soldiers and thier Officers and many Officers where kinda "Removed" position wise. I hope the PLA knows what they are doing, then it could lead to moral problems as well as a idelogical problem. Of course, Officers have the right for better food and all, but if you devied them from the men he will lead into battle, the "connection" will get lost and the soldiers wont be effective at all.

Thats just my view, if I´m wrong then please tell me what I didnt get right.

[Ordie]

Seems they are going in the direction the Soviet Army of the 60s-80s, where Soldiers and NCOs where devided from the Officers and many Officers came from the Academies and Schools and all that. This let to a big tension between the Soldiers and thier Officers and many Officers where kinda "Removed" position wise. I hope the PLA knows what they are doing, then it could lead to moral problems as well as a idelogical problem. Of course, Officers have the right for better food and all, but if you devied them from the men he will lead into battle, the "connection" will get lost and the soldiers wont be effective at all.

Thats just my view, if I´m wrong then please tell me what I didnt get right.

The PLA is going through a transitional phase. They paid close attention to both Gulf Wars and are taking baby steps towards reforming its organizational structure. Part of this effort is to contribute towards UN Peacekeeping missions worldwide. This allows for exposure to other militaries in organizational structure, communications, and operations. There is no doubt that many of these UN Veterans will have much to contribute to the overall modernization process.

The Soviet organizational structure in which the military is subordinate to the Party is no different than the KMT political organizational structure preceeding the CCP. Sun Yat Sen was an admierer of the Bolsheviks organizational structure. Chiang Kai Shek was the KMT's man in Moscow.

Like modern militaries worldwide, the PLA is struggling to attract highly qualified individuals. The PLA is competiting against the private sector with high paying jobs and a chance to make it big. Another factor is the one child policy. Many families do not relish the idea of thier only born offspring into harms way, specifically if he/she are supposed to take care of thier elderly parents. Finally, traditional Chinese society had always "looked down" on the military as a career. Until recently, scholars, and beureaucrats have been the top of the world.

[pave_hawk]

Seems they are going in the direction the Soviet Army of the 60s-80s, where Soldiers and NCOs where devided from the Officers and many Officers came from the Academies and Schools and all that. This let to a big tension between the Soldiers and thier Officers and many Officers where kinda "Removed" position wise. I hope the PLA knows what they are doing, then it could lead to moral problems as well as a idelogical problem. Of course, Officers have the right for better food and all, but if you devied them from the men he will lead into battle, the "connection" will get lost and the soldiers wont be effective at all.

Thats just my view, if I´m wrong then please tell me what I didnt get right.

This is a very good question. I think PLA's strategy against this problem is two-fold. First, They keep the position of political officers which are responsible for the interior unification and loyalty. Second, they are trying to establish a professional NCO system similar with that in western armed forces to form the backbone of the army. NCOs have long service periods as officers, but are more tightely coupled with soldiers, and are responsible for routine administration of their units. Now there are six levels of NCO in PLA. By contrast, there was only 1 level in 1988 when PLA reestablished its ranking system.

[Polyshot]

1.the cannon on the type 79 MBT,is L7 105mm, CHINA bought it from ISRAEL at 1970's.


But Sind Defence said that it was from Austrian??




The Type 88 is a hybrid of the Chinese tank design with heavy Soviet influenced and Western technologies. The tank hull is based on the Type 79 MBT developed from the Type 59 (Chinese copy of the Soviet T-54). The original five large road wheels were replaced by an arrangement of six smaller road wheels with three track rollers. The tank retained the Soviet-style half-egg-shape cast turret design, but was fitted with a German-designed 730hp diesel engine, a British-designed dual-axis stabilised fire-control with laser rangefinder, and a NATO-standard 105mm rifled gun based on the Austrian technology.

[pave_hawk]

But Sind Defence said that it was from Austrian??

This should be a mistake. What China got from Austrian is the G5 Howitzer technology. Its fruits in China now are PLZ 45 and PLL01.
http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/row/plz45-155sp-suppling.jpg http://www.sinodefence.com/army/artillery/pll01towed_155mm1lg.jpg

[baifrank]

This should be a mistake. What China got from Austrian is the G5 Howitzer technology. Its fruits in China now are PLZ 45 and PLL01.
http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/row/plz45-155sp-suppling.jpg http://www.sinodefence.com/army/artillery/pll01towed_155mm1lg.jpg


it was from Austria GHN -45 ,not South-Africa G5

[pave_hawk]

it was from Austria GHN -45 ,not South-Africa G5
well, at least they are siblings,haha....