M274 MULE: Any modern equivalent?

[Lt-Col A. Tack]

Just been reading a military vehicle magazine which showed a M274 Mule loaded with a recoilless rifle, and a question occurred:
Do we already have something similar in service?

Obviously not a tank or even an armored Humvee, but a kind of one-man gun carriage that is lighter, more "off-roadable" and more easily deployed via helicopters and fixed-wing aircraft.

There have been versions of the M274 with recoilless rifles.

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/9466/m247mule2qq1.jpg

Do we have any light (not medium) all-terrain vehicles capable of carrying weapons? I know of a few unmanned projects.


The M274 Mechanical Mule was developed to replace both the 1/4-ton and 3/4-ton 4 X 4 vehicles in infantry and airborne infantry battalions. It needed to weigh less than 750 pounds and carry a cross-country load of 1,000 pounds plus a driver. Link (http://www.transchool.eustis.army.mil/museum/MECHANICALMULE.htm)

I remember seeing during the early parts of the Afghanistan campaign, "individuals" (special forces of some variety) riding 4x4 ATVs.

Any thoughts?

[M_trace1187]

there was a pic on here some where of a recoiless mounted on the back of a polaris atv i could not find it though

[Belial]

Look into the french Fardier Lohr, pretty nifty air droppable little vehicle. It was quite versatile, used as ammo and personnal transport, could tow a 120mm mortar and a .50 or a Milan launcher could be mounted on it. It's being replaced by Auverland vehicles.
http://perso.orange.fr/big/lohr.htm


And there's also the german Kraka.


In the two wheeled category you also have the infamous french-built version of the vespa with a 75mm recoilless gun or 81mm mortar.

http://vintagescooters.free.fr/vespa/acma/v_acma150tap-56.htm
http://vintagescooters.free.fr/vespa/acma/v_acma150tap-59.htm
http://www.buema.ch/vespa/tapinternet.htm

[WarriorMonk]

FCS has a MULE Robot...

[Hollis]

They were also used in Viet-Nam......

[Lt-Col A. Tack]

Thanks for the post!


Look into the french Fardier Lohr, pretty nifty air droppable little vehicle. It was quite versatile, used as ammo and personnal transport, could tow a 120mm mortar and a .50 or a Milan launcher could be mounted on it. It's being replaced by Auverland vehicles.
http://perso.orange.fr/big/lohr.htm
Still in use?


And there's also the german Kraka.Hadn't heard of this before.
http://www.panzerbaer.de/helper/pix/bw_lkw_00-75t_gl_kraka-05269_017i.jpg
Looks very much like the Mule.



In the two wheeled category you also have the infamous french-built version of the vespa with a 75mm recoilless gun or 81mm mortar.

http://vintagescooters.free.fr/vespa/acma/v_acma150tap-56.htm
http://vintagescooters.free.fr/vespa/acma/v_acma150tap-59.htm
http://www.buema.ch/vespa/tapinternet.htm
New information for me; this was just for transporting the weapon, correct?

[Lt-Col A. Tack]

They were also used in Viet-Nam......Any reports on how useful or effective?

I know we also had something called the Ontos, but it was a tracked vehicle.

[Belial]

Thanks for the post!


Still in use?

Yes as far as I know either that or it's been phased out recently, but it's being replaced by Auverland A3's.
-edit-: found that it was phased out in 2005


New information for me; this was just for transporting the weapon, correct?
Somewhat yes, it couldn't be fired on the move, yet the vespa served as a support for the recoilless rifle.

[taiaha]

http://www.baesystemsomc.co.za/Portals/27/images/WASP-1.JPG
WASP

http://www.supacat.com/images/cats/Supacat-6-x-6-illustration.jpg
SUPACAT

[Crewdog]

I do beleive the Marines still use them in their mountain warfare school.

[Hollis]

Any reports on how useful or effective?

I know we also had something called the Ontos, but it was a tracked vehicle.


My avatar is a Ontos, one of my MOSs was 0353, Ontos.

I only saw them(mulls), I think they were good for hauling things in the base. Never really saw them used.

[baboon6]

http://www.lmt.co.za/product_gecko.htm

Gecko 8x8 RDLV (Rapid Deployment Logistics Vehicle) in service with South African paratroops and special forces.

[Katana-sr]

I know the U.S. looked at the Wiesel for robotics purposes, but I never heard of anything coming out of that project.

[Lt-Col A. Tack]

Thanks for all the excellent replies!

The Marine Corps Expeditionary Fire Support System (EFSS) vehicle, which I think is called the Growler (http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/issues/2005/Dec1/Ospreys_Cargo.htm), might work, but I think it's future is in doubt.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/He219/more/83ccd0f3.jpg


Small Wheels - Big Mission (http://www.special-operations-technology.com/article.cfm?DocID=162)

MP.net Link (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=66897&page=1)


Another candidate might be Desert Patrol Vehicle


Incorporates designs developed for the world's most grueling off-road competitions and proven in the crucible of combat. The LSV employs either an M2.50 caliber machine gun or a MK19 grenade launcher as the main armament, with 2 light machine guns, one each fore and aft. Powered by a high performance engine, its dash speed and superior off-road mobility are the principal factors in its lethality and survivability. Link (http://www.chenowth.com/DesertPatrolVehicle.php)
http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/3398/desertpatrolvehiclesh1.jpg

Many desirable attributes, but used only by SEALS, afaik.

With the advent of the Stryker Brigades, right now there seems to be a heavy emphasis on mobility. I didn't know if we already had something in our inventory (US) that could be made widely available to airborne units.

[Jeepix]

The canadian Army used the John Deer M-Gator 6X4 in Afghanistan.

[CSUCHICO]

The canadian Army used the John Deer M-Gator 6X4 in Afghanistan.

Ahhhh yes. The gator. A favorite of elite special forces and high school janitors world wide.

[Erik2a4]

The canadian Army used the John Deer M-Gator 6X4 in Afghanistan.

As has the US Army since 2001.

Ranger Regiment also used the Dune Buggies as the RSOV. They have been replaced by Strikers.

[baboon6]

As has the US Army since 2001.

Ranger Regiment also used the Dune Buggies as the RSOV. They have been replaced by Strikers.

I thought they had Land Rovers

[Sabre]

Supacats were used in the UK by airmobile forces. I think they adpoted a new version and then scrapped them entirely due to safety issues. One too many paras getting squished when they flipped I think...:|

Supacat 'A' in Kosovo 1999:

http://www.defenceimagedatabase.mod.uk/FotoWeb/FWbin/preview.dll/45108580.jpg?D=A3108B28C8B3B032194131CE08F670ECE6B1838E4B40E5E614A0B3395072B1683679B0B233B26840E83D0D8C18ACC907A150640268C2BC2B6BA0BE589409A282C22978D0A09FD8DBDCCC4E96E67C07CB94EBFF676A2E1BCD719F9A47B8A87FE19174F2E435DB95BEAA5F8960ED64D1217F850DB1B9EE274CC80881044128B4B061C1406C501636C6D2C4C47A35BC3 225238BD4D19DBC7E8CCA6AC9A2F7FF4D8DDC61467153A8C63FF79A93F2093FC0A2D14027873D40F064

http://www.defenceimagedatabase.mod.uk/FotoWeb/FWbin/preview.dll/45108428.jpg?D=A3108B28C8B3B032194131CE08F670ECE6B1838E4B40E5E614A0B3395072B1683679B0B233B26840E83D0D8C18ACC907A150640268C2BC2B6BA0BE589409A282C22978D0A09FD8DB20E2CAFA7475928694EBFF676A2E1BCD719F9A47B8A87FE19174F2E435DB95BEAA5F8960ED64D1217F850DB1B9EE274CC80881044128B4B061C1406C501636C67F5C29F8B5E70 A8A973CE05003B0FD74CA6AC9A2F7FF4D8DDC61467153A8C63FF79A93F2093FC0A2D14027873D40F064

http://www.bellum.nu/armoury/SMKIII6x6CAT-UK.jpg

Supacat with roll cage in use with the RHF (as was) back in 2001. Also used here is a quad bike. The pic was taken on a mountain warfare ex near Dundonnell.

http://www.defenceimagedatabase.mod.uk/FotoWeb/FWbin/preview.dll/45111242.jpg?D=A3108B28C8B3B032194131CE08F670ECE6B1838E4B40E5E614A0B3395072B1683679B0B233B26840E83D0D8C18ACC907A150640268C2BC2B6BA0BE589409A282C22978D0A09FD8DBA1D30716338E951594EBFF676A2E1BCD719F9A47B8A87FE19174F2E435DB95BEAA5F8960ED64D1217F850DB1B9EE274CC80881044128B4B0FC858CE3982A84435F6F9CBE67489 CB2465AF584E512FFE4CA6AC9A2F7FF4D8DDC61467153A8C63FF79A93F2093FC0A2D14027873D40F064

I'm sure there's a good pic out there of MILAN mounted on a supacat, just can't find it.

[Durandal]

I've driven and worked on a Mule before. Neat little vehicles and perfect for the role they played.

Gas engine and you have them in 2 wheel or 4 wheel steer. Simple to control and simple to rebuild.

I've got some pictures of the one we used a lot some of the times we camped at Knob Creek...my friend's father owned a pair and sold them for a whopping 7500 USD for the pair...a steal at that price.

[Lt-Col A. Tack]

FLYER Defense ITV

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/7070/flyeritvtk8.jpg

Specifications
GENERAL
Seating 1 to 6 seats
Manufacturing California, USA
Drivetrain layout Rear engine, full time 4x4

POWERTRAIN
Engine type Turbocharged intercooled diesel
Horsepower 115
Torque, lb-ft 197
Transmission type 3 Speed, power shift
Final drive 6.8 : 1
Final drive ratio - first gear 18.4 : 1
Differential Limited slip - rear

DIMENSIONS
Wheelbase, in. 112
Length, in. 179 / 207 with winch
Body Width, in. 62
Height, in. 72.5 (63 with rollbars folded)
Base curb weight, lb. 3,200
Payload, lb. 3,000
Ground clearance, in. 14 - 18
Approach angle 70 degrees / 48 degrees with winch
Departure angle 45 degrees
Fuel capacity, gal. 38 (optional 70 gal.)

CHASSIS
Type Tubular space frame
Suspension f/r 4-wheel independent suspension
Steering type Power assisted
Turning radius, ft 21.5
Brakes, f/r 4-wheel disc
Tire size 36 x 9 x R16 with bead lock

ELECTRICAL
Battery Qty 2 - 62 Amp/hr each (4 batteries optional)
Alternator 24V, 100 amp (200 amp optional)
Standards met MIL-STD 1275A, MIL-STD 461C

PERFORMANCE
Top speed, mph 65
Cruising range, mi. 450 (1,000 with optional 70 gal. fuel tank)
Maximum grade, % 60
Dynamic side slope, % 40
Fording, in. 60 with kit / 30 (no prep.)
Winch 9,000 lb. Hydraulic

http://www.marvineng.com/flyer/specifications.htm

Capabilities
Weapons Integration
Primary Weapon
.50 cal, MK-19, MILAN or TOW
Secondary Weapon
7.62 or 5.56

Excellent transportability
V-22 (1 internal & 2 external)
CH-53E (2 internal & 3 external)
CH-47D (2 internal & 3 external)
UH-60A (1 external)
CH-46E (1 internal or external)
KC-130 (6 stacked internal)
Stack 2 in a 20' ISO container for sea or land transport
Air deliverable

Tactical benefits
Flexibility in mission reconfiguration
Variants: Utility, C2 and Ambulance
High payload to weight ratio (>1:1)
High mobility / agility / stability
Fording

http://www.marvineng.com/flyer/capabilities.htm

Flyer Defense ITV-1 all terrain vehicle has been deployed with the US Special Forces and the Singapore Army. The vehicle which is currently under production in Singapore, (known there as LCV) is designed to provide high tactical mobility for light forces. The ITV-1 weighs only 1,700 kg and can carry up to two tons of loads, (including five to seven fully equipped troops and over one ton of extra load, which can also comprise of a protection suite).

The vehicle offers excellent mobility and high flexibility in modeling, to suite customer requirements. The lightweight platform can be lifted internally in a C-130 or V-22 or sling loaded under a heavy lift helicopter. Two ITVs can be stacked together in an airlift, a load configuration which can be utilized for rapid deployment of Special Forces. The company is currently developing a similar vehicle for the Marine Corps Internally Loaded Vehicle program. The Flyer ITV may also be configured with add-on armor and still be internally transported in the new Special Operations aircraft, the V-22 Osprey.

In May 2006 Ceradyne and Flyer Defense announced the cooperation and teaming for the development of an armored cab for the ITV made of FlexKit ceramic armor system. Ceradyne is displaying the kit at the Special Operations Command Exhibition next month in Tampa, Florida.

http://www.defense-update.com/products/i/itv-1.htm




US Army Ranger Special Operations Vehicle (RSOV)

http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/5213/rsovpv4.jpg

The Ranger Special Operations Vehicle is a Land Rover design that was introduced after the Gulf War. Produced by Land Rover's SVO (Special Vehicle Operations), the RSOV was designed as a rapid defensive fighting platform.

The RSOV is used not as an assault vehicle, but as a method for rapidly applying forces to key locations in the battlefield. Impressed with its capabilities, the US Rangers bought 60 vehicles and dubbed them the Ranger Special Operations Vehicle.

Designed with a crew of three in mind, the RSOV carries a driver, gunner, and Leader/gunner.

It has a top mount that can be used to mount one of five different weapons (M-60, M240, M2 .50 cal heavy machine gun, Mk19 grenade launcher).

There is also a mount for a machine gun in the passengers side seat and capabilities to carry AT-4 or RAAWS (Ranger Anti-Armor Weapon System), which is the 84mm Carl Gustav recoilless Rifle.

The Rangers have three main types of RSOV, the weapons carrier, Medical vehicle, or Communications vehicle.

As a weapons carrier it can carry up to 8,000 lbs and six fully armed Rangers.

Based on the 110 Land Rover Chassis, the RSOV is powered by a four cylinder turbocharged engine with plenty of power and torque for hauling loads around the battlefield.

It is compact enough to fit inside a CH-47 Chinook (as well as European EH-101 helicopter) and C-130 Hercules cargo plane and can be sling-loaded underneath Chinooks or Blackhawks.

http://www.lr-mad.co.uk/conversions.html

[baboon6]

Supacats were used in the UK by airmobile forces. I think they adpoted a new version and then scrapped them entirely due to safety issues. One too many paras getting squished when they flipped I think...:|

Supacat 'A' in Kosovo 1999:

http://www.defenceimagedatabase.mod.uk/FotoWeb/FWbin/preview.dll/45108580.jpg?D=A3108B28C8B3B032194131CE08F670ECE6B1838E4B40E5E614A0B3395072B1683679B0B233B26840E83D0D8C18ACC907A150640268C2BC2B6BA0BE589409A282C22978D0A09FD8DBDCCC4E96E67C07CB94EBFF676A2E1BCD719F9A47B8A87FE19174F2E435DB95BEAA5F8960ED64D1217F850DB1B9EE274CC80881044128B4B061C1406C501636C6D2C4C47A35BC3 225238BD4D19DBC7E8CCA6AC9A2F7FF4D8DDC61467153A8C63FF79A93F2093FC0A2D14027873D40F064

http://www.defenceimagedatabase.mod.uk/FotoWeb/FWbin/preview.dll/45108428.jpg?D=A3108B28C8B3B032194131CE08F670ECE6B1838E4B40E5E614A0B3395072B1683679B0B233B26840E83D0D8C18ACC907A150640268C2BC2B6BA0BE589409A282C22978D0A09FD8DB20E2CAFA7475928694EBFF676A2E1BCD719F9A47B8A87FE19174F2E435DB95BEAA5F8960ED64D1217F850DB1B9EE274CC80881044128B4B061C1406C501636C67F5C29F8B5E70 A8A973CE05003B0FD74CA6AC9A2F7FF4D8DDC61467153A8C63FF79A93F2093FC0A2D14027873D40F064

http://www.bellum.nu/armoury/SMKIII6x6CAT-UK.jpg

Supacat with roll cage in use with the RHF (as was) back in 2001. Also used here is a quad bike. The pic was taken on a mountain warfare ex near Dundonnell.

http://www.defenceimagedatabase.mod.uk/FotoWeb/FWbin/preview.dll/45111242.jpg?D=A3108B28C8B3B032194131CE08F670ECE6B1838E4B40E5E614A0B3395072B1683679B0B233B26840E83D0D8C18ACC907A150640268C2BC2B6BA0BE589409A282C22978D0A09FD8DBA1D30716338E951594EBFF676A2E1BCD719F9A47B8A87FE19174F2E435DB95BEAA5F8960ED64D1217F850DB1B9EE274CC80881044128B4B0FC858CE3982A84435F6F9CBE67489 CB2465AF584E512FFE4CA6AC9A2F7FF4D8DDC61467153A8C63FF79A93F2093FC0A2D14027873D40F064

I'm sure there's a good pic out there of MILAN mounted on a supacat, just can't find it.

There's a Supacat A visible in some of the combat footage of 3 Para in AFG, at one of the camps. So it would appear it's still in service.