Anyone has more info on the "new" M249 Stock?

[Merit]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/dailypix/militarypix/fresh/PC8S7614_CHOI_LOW2.jpg
Quote:
Lance Cpl. Chuc Choi, 21, became an American citizen during a citizenship ceremony Aug. 29, 2006, at Balad Air Force Base in Iraq. Choi, a food service specialist assigned to the Hawaii-based Headquarters and Service Company, 3rd Battalion, 3rd Marine Regiment, left Taegu, Korea, and came to the United States with his parents when he was only two-years-old. For Choi and his parents, America was a “place of opportunity where everybody has equal rights regardless of their race.” A year after he graduated from A.C. Paris High School in 2002, Choi decided he wanted to do something challenging with his life and did not want to end up like a lot of his peers who were using drugs and involved with criminal street gangs. Choi started to research the branches of the military and initially planned to join the Army. Choi quickly changed his mind when he met a Marine Corps recruiter and learned that the Marine Corps was the “most disciplined and well trained branch of the American Armed Forces.”

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/dailypix/militarypix/fresh/more/CSA-2006-10-09-100657.jpg
Quote:
Soldiers from Company B, 2nd Battalion, 6th Infantry Regiment, 1st Armored Division, raid a house in Ramadi, Iraq.

Anyone has more info on the new M249 stock?

[KillerBD]

It looks just like an M-4 plastic polymer stock, fitted for an M249.

[Argyll]

Yeah nothing special, it's not new, we had some on our team with the same stocks

[Merit]

Then any close up pick of yours is much appreciated.

[lt tahoe]

Ugh, why? The M249's stock folds down to nothing, and works fine when extended. This new fascination with putting the M4 stock on _everything_ drives me crazy.

[SMGLee]

I see your point, but with the M249, the Para has little support and it is not easy to deploy. the use of M4 stock is actually an upgrade.

[Gryphon81]

the canadian c9a2 has a m4 type stock among several other changes

[Catch22]

US version looks sturdier, with that raised cheek rest and buttplate.

here.
www.peosoldier.army.mil/portfolio/sw/csw/M249_SAW%20Collapsible%20Buttstock.pdf

[Ratamacue]

I see your point, but with the M249, the Para has little support and it is not easy to deploy. the use of M4 stock is actually an upgrade.Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I would also imagine that the para stock can't be deployed at intermediate lengths, and even if it can, not with the buttstock in the vertical position.

[SMGLee]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I would also imagine that the para stock can't be deployed at intermediate lengths, and even if it can, not with the buttstock in the vertical position.

Yes.. It is either open or closed, no middle ground.

[HoboWithAK]

Ugh, why? The M249's stock folds down to nothing, and works fine when extended. This new fascination with putting the M4 stock on _everything_ drives me crazy.

And you know this from all the first hand trigger time you have with both systems, right? :roll:

[Merit]

Thanks everyone, especially Catch22, that's what I'm looking for!

[Anthony91]

I wonder if my cousin has this on his SAW. Looks pretty cool.

[KillerBD]

I like the old school m249 over the new para version, it has a longer barrel and better butt-stock in my opinion.

[freedomofold]

I like the old school m249 over the new para version, it has a longer barrel and better butt-stock in my opinion.


You found this out when clearing rooms in a war zone right? Or are you basing this on your wanting to bone that set up more then your dog? (you know you like the peanut butterp-) )

[lt tahoe]

And you know this from all the first hand trigger time you have with both systems, right? :roll:

I don't know, 9 years in uniform I might have seen one up close once or twice...

[KillerBD]

You found this out when clearing rooms in a war zone right? Or are you basing this on your wanting to bone that set up more then your dog? (you know you like the peanut butterp-) )

Room clearing with an m249 isn't the best gun to use, but what I was getting at is the sorter barrel isn't as good in my opinion. The longer standard one is more accurate and deadlier. Oh and for the record the best GPMG is the M60E4, U.S. Ordnace did a great job making that thing better than previous models.

[Catch22]

Room clearing with an m249 isn't the best gun to use, but what I was getting at is the sorter barrel isn't as good in my opinion. The longer standard one is more accurate and deadlier. Oh and for the record the best GPMG is the M60E4, U.S. Ordnace did a great job making that thing better than previous models.

And you base that statement on? Vast personal experience with MG3/MAG/PK and others? "The best" statements aren't going to win you much credibility...

[HoboWithAK]

I don't know, 9 years in uniform I might have seen one up close once or twice...

Your opinion varies greately from what i've heard others say about the application. Nobody has said it was not advantage over the old para stock.

[TacoDelRio]

Room clearing with an m249 isn't the best gun to use, but what I was getting at is the sorter barrel isn't as good in my opinion. The longer standard one is more accurate and deadlier. Oh and for the record the best GPMG is the M60E4, U.S. Ordnace did a great job making that thing better than previous models.

Not trying to jump on a bandwagon, but regardless of whether it's the best, the soldier carrying one has no choice. If he has to clear a room, then he hasta'.

I think it's a good idea. There are a bazillion and one aftermarket M4 stock out there, so it'll just keep getting "better".

[ABNINF]

Room clearing with an m249 isn't the best gun to use, but what I was getting at is the sorter barrel isn't as good in my opinion. The longer standard one is more accurate and deadlier. Oh and for the record the best GPMG is the M60E4, U.S. Ordnace did a great job making that thing better than previous models.

Here's the thing. The M249 is the SQUAD Automatic Weapon. It's not meant to be able to produce a good quality "beaten zone" at 800m, that's what the M240 is for. The sole purpose of the SAW is to provide high volume, supressive fire capabilites to the fireteam, this includes MOUT, your standard entry team is, gee shock surprise, a squad fire team, meaning there will be a SAW in the room. I don't know of any squads that execute 4 and 500m bounds by themselves, without the rest of the platoon to support them. Now, looking at that, the short barrel, collapsible stock configuration is a great compromise for MOUT and still works well in the conventional role. Having done MOUT with a full length SAW, it's not as manueverable as the shorter barrel/stock combo. We're doing a good job of tailoring the weapon to the mission these days we need to keep at it.

[echohund]

dont know about this new version ........BUT I HATED!! the old m249...........JAM MASTER!!! JAM MASTER!!!

[TacoDelRio]

dont know about this new version ........BUT I HATED!! the old m249...........JAM MASTER!!! JAM MASTER!!!

How old were your old M249's? Some have been in constant service since they were introduced, in 1993 or something.

[Koskela]

I was serving in Kosovo in summer of 2000 with the Swedish batallion as a M249 Para gunner. I really liked the machinegun, we joked about as a assault rifle on steriods...

Anyway, I´d like also to see some close up pics on the M4 stock. It looks nice. One thing that I´m unsure about, how much shorter will the M4 stock be when you fold it in, compared to when it is extended?

[SMGLee]

we joked about as a assault rifle on steriods...

Anyway, I´d like also to see some close up pics on the M4 stock. It looks nice. One thing that I´m unsure about, how much shorter will the M4 stock be when you fold it in, compared to when it is extended?

that is funny. take a good look at the Mk46Mod1... that is really making your statement true.

[Hydro]

Room clearing with an m249 isn't the best gun to use, but what I was getting at is the sorter barrel isn't as good in my opinion. The longer standard one is more accurate and deadlier. Oh and for the record the best GPMG is the M60E4, U.S. Ordnace did a great job making that thing better than previous models.


The M60E4's barrel is shorter than any of its contemporaries, I'm sure that affects it's long range performance. It looks great for a 7.62 weapon at section/squad level, but I can't see it being as good as say the MAG at SF engagement out to to 1800m.

[lt tahoe]

Your opinion varies greately from what i've heard others say about the application. Nobody has said it was not advantage over the old para stock.

Hobo, after looking at it more carefully it looks like it's only similar to the M4 stock, not the same stock. I retract my judgement. I've just never cared for the standard 4-position stock, and these days there are kits to put it on shotguns, AK's and everything else, so I thought this was the same thing.

Looking again it looks interesting; still has the same butt plate as the SAW stock.

[22.5degrees]

lt tahoe,
I don't know what you smoke, but that stock is identicle to the standard 6 position M4 carbine stock. The tube normally associated with the 6 pos. may not be used but the buttstock is indeed an M4 6 position stock.

Hydro,

I see your point, however I don't think the M60E4 was designed for SF support. Besides the hills of A-stan where and when have we been involved in a serious engagement beyond 500 metres? Most fighting is now urban.

22.5

[Hydro]

Hydro,

I see your point, however I don't think the M60E4 was designed for SF support. Besides the hills of A-stan where and when have we been involved in a serious engagement beyond 500 metres? Most fighting is now urban.

22.5


True enough, it's good for what it was designed for I'm sure, but I don't think that totally qualifies it as the best GPMG around, as KillerBD was saying. It is supposed to be a General Purpose weapon after all ;)

SF still has a role, there's got to be some reason the UK, Canadian, Australian, NZ armies keep it up (maybe it's a Commonwealth thing? :))

[Catch22]

lt tahoe,
I don't know what you smoke, but that stock is identicle to the standard 6 position M4 carbine stock. The tube normally associated with the 6 pos. may not be used but the buttstock is indeed an M4 6 position stock.

Hydro,

I see your point, however I don't think the M60E4 was designed for SF support. Besides the hills of A-stan where and when have we been involved in a serious engagement beyond 500 metres? Most fighting is now urban.

22.5

22.5, I beg to differ. the new US SAW stock is a bit diffrent form the usual standard 6 position one used on M16/M4. Look up to the .pdf I posted, lt tahoe is quite right actually. On the other hand Canadian C9A1 stock is more or less unmodified telescope 4 position one with additional rubber buttplate.
http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=23074.0;attach=1141;image

I fully agree on your comment on M60E4, but that just adds up to undermine that somewhat bold statement of it being the "best" GPMG. It may be a decent specialist weapon but surely not as universal in the roles of SF fire, vehicle mounted weapon etc. It's not just the Commonwealth thing Hydro.

[22.5degrees]

I stand corrected. The genereal shape is the same but it is not a straight across mounted 6 pos. The Canadian C9 is definitely a standard stock. I think it looks better than the other one. Then again, its not about looks.


On a side note, for best GPMG I'd give it a toss up for the MG34/MG3? and the FN MAG58.

22.5

[Catch22]

So on a sidenote from me: PK/PKM with some modifications (soft box, forward grip, telescope stock, some rails) when using 25rnd belt sections (no dragging belt to step on), I'm still not sure about our UKM 2000 dependablity (its a PKM with reversed feed, using NATO 7,62X51 and disintegrating ammo belt) if it's comparable to normal PK my vote goes to it (with all the bells&whistles applied).

[dobrodan]

So on a sidenote from me: PK/PKM with some modifications (soft box, forward grip, telescope stock, some rails) when using 25rnd belt sections (no dragging belt to step on), I'm still not sure about our UKM 2000 dependablity (its a PKM with reversed feed, using NATO 7,62X51 and disintegrating ammo belt) if it's comparable to normal PK my vote goes to it (with all the bells&whistles applied).

Why "reversed feed"? I would prefer the ammo to be fed from the right side, because the co-gunner would have more space to work, and would to a much lesser degree interfere with the gunners field of observation.

The practical reason may of course be that the links don´t work correctly when fed from the right side, because they are intended for a M240 or M60... Or it may be that the gun is intended to be operated by only one man, and therefore is preferrable that most operations should be easily performed with the left arm...

Still, it is a 7.62 MG, and I would not enjoy having to carry all the ammunition and operate it on my own...

[Catch22]

Ah, sorry for the screw-up, just checked and I got it mixed with wz.2003 which feeds from the left, ukm 2000 has standard PK right side feed, just with NATO M13 disintegrating belt. My bad.