Assault rifles

[Tony Williams]

I've updated the article on the history of assault rifle ammo on my website, both to add some more historical information and to bring it up to date with the latest developments. It's HERE (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/Assault.htm)

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)

[vajt]

Good stuff Tony!

-----JT-----

[Hydro]

Seconded, excellent stuff Tony, something for the techie nuts like myself to have a look at.


Just a quick question - what the hell weapon was the 5.56mm Folded round to be fired from?

[Masai]

Very interesting site, excellent work

[Little J]

As alway Tony, a very good read...




Would still like to see someone bring back the British experimental 6.25 from the 60's. That round had great potenital, reaseach on it being stopped because the NATO tests didnt allow rounds bigger than 5.56...

[Demigod-17]

i liked the ".256 british a wasted oppertunity" article too (: nice

[Demigod-17]

As alway Tony, a very good read...




Would still like to see someone bring back the British experimental 6.25 from the 60's. That round had great potenital, reaseach on it being stopped because the NATO tests didnt allow rounds bigger than 5.56...

that was 6.25 x 43 IIRC would make a nice cartridge.

[oldsoak]

- nah, the EM2 7mm round - good all rounder that we never adopted...:-(

[Hispeed1]

Interesting website and article. Thanks for sharing.

[_Kommando]

What would the M14 be if you don't consider it an assault rifle?

[Octavian]

What would the M14 be if you don't consider it an assault rifle?

Battle rifle. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_rifle)

[_Kommando]

Battle rifle. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_rifle)

Ok thanks for clearing that up.

[souljahP]

nice stuff :hug:

[Hollis]

There is a History to the name assault rifle. The N. Germans had a rifle they called assualt rifle, but that is not why. In the States.. the anti-gun people invented the name and discription to create a "vision of nasty" to help push various Assault rifle bans.

About any military style rifle (current usage) fit the discription. It did not stop production or sales, just limited features, Magazine size, Bayonet lug, collapsible stock ... Look at pre and post ban versions.

But over time Industry and gun users started using the name too.. for "black rifles".

[Tony Williams]

As I understand it, the anti-gun people call them assault WEAPONS (along with anything else they don't like). The term assault RIFLE is an older and specifically military one.

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)

[Hollis]

As I understand it, the anti-gun people call them assault WEAPONS (along with anything else they don't like). The term assault RIFLE is an older and specifically military one.

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)


That sounds better, anything to conjure up the black art of assaulting people. I don't think the term was really used much in the military, except for that one N. German rifle.

[Tony Williams]

That sounds better, anything to conjure up the black art of assaulting people. I don't think the term was really used much in the military, except for that one N. German rifle.
Well, there have been a few military rifles with the equivalent of "assault rifle" in their designations. The Swiss and the Austrians still use Stg. or Stgw. (for Sturmgewehr, just like the Germans) and I understand that the Finnish RK designation (Ryannakkokivaari mali) also means "assault rifle". That's all the ones I know, though.

Ironically, the archetypal assault rifle, the Kalashnikov, isn't officially called that by the Russians. The term was simply adopted from the German original as a shorthand way of describing selective-fire military rifles designed around an intermediate cartridge.

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)

[Jabroni]

Came across dis.
http://img313.imageshack.us/img313/6137/sa80tf1.jpg

Is there any Assault Rifles still being called an STG?

There was the STG 44 Then the STG 58 which was used for the Austrian FAL and the STGW 57 Rifle used in Switzerland.

[Green Leader]

And of course the Stgw 90/Sturmgewehr 90 (the SIG SG 550, SG means also Sturmgewehr) and the Stgw 04 (probably the SIG SG 552 LB). And last but not least the official designation of the Steyr AUG in the austrian army is STG 77.

[Jippo]

and I understand that the Finnish RK designation (Ryannakkokivaari mali) also means "assault rifle".

That would be correct.


-jippo

[Vandervahn]

Germany itself also calls its weapon "Sturmgewehr G36".

Its simple, basically there is quite a long history of weapons whose designation has been more or less directly taken over from other languages... and usually the language that pioneered said type of weapon. The "Howitzer" for example dates back to a 15th century Czech-german expression; "(Hand) Grenade" comes from the french and/or italian word for a fruit, and there are numerous more examples where weaponry is named after one specific source in a variety of languages.

Thats not to say that there are not any "domestic" expressions for said weapon concepts. It is just that oftentimes the "internationally accepted" designtion becomes dominant, espeially in our times of short communication ways.

The "Sturmgewehr" expression in particular certainly had the benefit of being a.) the one type of weapon certainly most bolt-action-rifle-equipped soldier longed for, and b.) that it had the right amount of menacing connotation.

[Little J]

Came across dis.
http://img313.imageshack.us/img313/6137/sa80tf1.jpg

And I thought my attempts at photoshopping was S*** p-)

[Tony Williams]

Came across dis.
http://img313.imageshack.us/img313/6137/sa80tf1.jpg

That looks like the L22A1, the shorty carbine version of the SA80, only the barrel is slightly different in your pic, and a fraction shorter. HK made about 1,500 of them for the British Army as a "tanker" PDW. I fired one a couple of months ago - it's neat, and the forward handgrip works very well, but the SUSAT on that gun is silly; it should have a unit-magnification red dot type.

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)

[Vandervahn]

That looks like the L22A1, the shorty carbine version of the SA80, ... HK made about 1,500 of them for the British Army as a "tanker" PDW.

In this configuration? Maybe you didnt´realize the weapon in the picture has no bullpup layout anymore?

[Tony Williams]

In this configuration? Maybe you didnt´realize the weapon in the picture has no bullpup layout anymore?

Aaaargh - I KNEW I was getting senile! Talk about missing the obvious...

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)

[REMOV]

I've updated the article on the history of assault rifle ammo on my website, both to add some more historical information and to bring it up to date with the latest developments. It's HERE (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/Assault.htm)I've found one mistake

http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/EM1LMG.jpg
AFAIK this is not "EM1 LMG" this is 7,92 mm Roman Korsak battle rifle, let's say British answer to the German 7,92 mm FG.42 battle rifle.

http://www.militech.sownet.pl/bullpup/_Korsak(600)R.jpg
http://www.militech.sownet.pl/bullpup/_Korsak(600)L.jpg

There is also a typing error in the caption: "sectioned 7.62x51 M189 Duplex (which actually saw service)." - the proper name of this round is M198

[Tony Williams]

Thanks for that, I'll make the changes.

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)