PDA

View Full Version : Most Germans Dissatisfied with Their Democracy, Survey Shows



Macs.
11-03-2006, 01:10 PM
Most Germans Dissatisfied with Their Democracy, Survey Shows

Despite an economy which is finally coming out of the doldrums, over half of all Germans are dissatisfied with the country's democracy, a new survey shows.

The news on the economic front in Germany could hardly be better: unemployment below 10 percent for the first time in four years, unexpected tax revenue surpluses to be spent, and an economy growing faster than expected. You might expect the Germans to be content with their lot.


But, while Germans might be looking forward to the prospect of a bit more money in their pocket, they are less than thrilled about how the country is being run. According to a new survey, a majority of Germans say they are dissatisfied with the way democracy functions in Germany -- a surprising result for a country which is one of the pillars of the European Union and is widely regarded as a model of democracy and civil society.

In a survey released on Thursday evening by the German public television station ARD, 51 percent of the 1,500 people surveyed answered negatively to the question, "Are you satisfied with how democracy functions in Germany?" It's the lowest result since the station began asking the question in 1997.

As recently as September 2005, 60 percent said they were satisfied with democracy in Germany. Now, it's only 49 percent -- a drop of 11 percentage points.

Similarly, the number of Germans who say that the situation in the country is "unjust" continues to rise. Only 27 percent regard the current situation in Germany as "just", with 66 percent disagreeing. It is a significant change since May, when only 57 percent felt the situation was "unjust".
The results confirm findings released by the University of Leipzig this summer. A study there found that only 27 percent of eastern Germans were satisfied with how democracy functions in Germany. In western Germany, every second person surveyed answered in the affirmative. Trust in political parties in the country is at a new low, the Leipzig psychologist Elmar Brähler commented at the time.

ARD's new survey also puts Germany well below the European average when it comes to satisfaction with democracy. An EU poll this spring found that, on average, 56 percent of Europeans were happy with their system of governance. Denmark led the pack with 93 percent while Croatia and Bulgaria tied for last place with a mere 22 percent each. Most countries with above average levels of satisfaction were in Western Europe, while the populations of formerly communist Eastern European countries tended to have below average levels of satisfaction -- suggesting that they are not as grateful for having traded totalitarianism for democracy as might have been expected.

The erosion of faith in democracy is nothing new, however. Oscar Gabriel, a professor at the University of Stuttgart, has observed the process for the last decade and a half. He has found that there has been a tendency for residents of the former East Germany to lose faith in democracy since the fall of the Wall. In the West, faith in democracy has climbed slightly during the same period, however.


The high levels of German dissatisfaction with the functioning of the country's democracy could well be due to the current political atmosphere in Germany. One year after welcoming Angela Merkel and her grand coalition -- the pairing of the Social Democrats with the conservatives -- to power, Germans are increasingly dissatisfied with the government's work. Only 27 percent think the current government is doing better than ex-chancellor Gerhard Schröder's government. And with the grand coalition looking increasingly unwieldy, it may be some time before Germans cheer up again.


http://www.spiegel.de/international/0,1518,446365,00.html

ed316
11-03-2006, 01:27 PM
I bet the "half" were from E.Germany.

Count Lippe
11-03-2006, 01:36 PM
Not really, everyone is just dissatisfied by the red/black coalition's performance. Most think they aren't any better than what we had with Schröder. And that's why we think our democracy suck, because we don't have any real diversion in our political system. Apart from the obvious nazis and old commies...:roll:

M4ko
11-03-2006, 02:33 PM
I bet the "half" were from E.Germany.

and what would the point be? -socialists hate freedom?

ed316
11-03-2006, 02:36 PM
Joke and I didn't know E.Germay had democratic election before unifying with W.Germany.:roll:

Did I say hate freedom? They are unhappy with democracy.

M4ko
11-03-2006, 02:46 PM
Joke and I didn't know E.Germay had democratic election before unifying with W.Germany.:roll:

Did I say hate freedom? They are unhappy with democracy.

yea i was going to say democracy instead of freedom, but definition of democracy is too vague now, but what US, ussualy associates with democracy is freedom. so i gave an American expression of democracy/.

Weasel
11-03-2006, 02:48 PM
Demoracy strong!

We have the choice between pest and cholera.

Fade
11-03-2006, 03:32 PM
Demoracy strong!

We have the choice between pest and cholera.

You know, sounds about the same over here....devil you know and the devil you fear (which turns out to be worse than the devil you know)

theholeinthedonut
11-03-2006, 03:58 PM
Demoracy strong!

We have the choice between pest and cholera.

Now, there aren't many of my neighbors to the east that scare me as much as you do, my dear oppossum!

Weasel
11-03-2006, 04:32 PM
Now, there aren't many of my neighbors to the east that scare me as much as you do, my dear oppossum!

Why, my dear nothing/holeinthedonut?

Mastermind
11-03-2006, 05:12 PM
Hell...I'm unhappy with democracy! And I'm a hard core American!...probably soon to be a soft shelled Mex-erican!

apm
11-03-2006, 05:41 PM
again the intention of journalists. i am really surprised that the article tells the truth, namely that germans are dissatisfied with their democracy and not with democracy in general like nearly all groups of german media report - just to heat the fires "uuh brown parties made a plus in an election"-like.

maybe some points get better at the moment but generally it´s the same stuff wich makes everyday life hard to handle- social problems, immigration and integration problems and a hell of bureaucracy.

I'mOnlyHalfPolish
11-03-2006, 09:07 PM
do i smell a third world war...perhaps a 4th reich in the midst..........

just kidding not surprised with the high taxes and unemployment even at 10% thats pretty bad

johanness
11-03-2006, 09:27 PM
third world war? sure not

most german people don't like their democracy 'cause you give your vote
evry 4 years and in the time between they never ask you again,they
just do as they like.
in other european countries there are national referendums about important
decissions ,in germany not.
so you just sit back,watch their broken promesis, feel angry and can do
nothing.
and many people think,there are no plebiscits,'cause most people are against
many ideas of the EU.

ElHombre
11-03-2006, 10:39 PM
Sounds like a better title would have been 'Most Germans Dissatisfied with Their Government'.

In which case, join the rest of us.;-)

Thor
11-04-2006, 12:00 AM
Hard facts in that poll, Germany is still the most undemocratic country in Europe.

There are of course other rising "stars" but none have reached Germany's level quite yet. Countries like Belarus and Russia are not included in this ranking.

apm
11-04-2006, 03:57 AM
@thor

source for this statement? germany might be less democratic than the very open netherlands or denmark but the most undemocratic? i dont think so. if you refer to that survey last week which had shown us that german medias havent got the same freedom of media like in other countries you should analyze the past months. the value of this survey was incredible pushed up because the secret service spyed on some journalists who wanted to publish books about them. unfortunately media are very free here and can write whatever they want...


third world war? sure not

most german people don't like their democracy 'cause you give your vote
evry 4 years and in the time between they never ask you again,they
just do as they like.
in other european countries there are national referendums about important
decissions ,in germany not.
so you just sit back,watch their broken promesis, feel angry and can do
nothing.
and many people think,there are no plebiscits,'cause most people are against
many ideas of the EU.

exactly. the only time politicians here work is before an election. otherwise they waste their time with unneccessary stuff and talkings or do only some reforms wich could be effective in 2020 -maybe if at all however, before this time comes, those reforms are set down again by the successor again wich makes it own reform bunch which also will never become effective and so on...great coalition was a big mistake. they have 69 or so percent in the parliament and could do what they want but they waste their time with debates and arguments because none of the both ruling parties wants to be less important than the other. really sad.

Weasel
11-04-2006, 04:26 AM
@thor

source for this statement?

He has written this a multiple times. It´s his standard text. ;)

Weasel
11-04-2006, 04:43 AM
Sounds like a better title would have been 'Most Germans Dissatisfied with Their Government'.

In which case, join the rest of us.;-)

One big familiy all around the world.

It´s time for new revolutions. p-)

Thor
11-04-2006, 05:38 AM
source for this statement? germany might be less democratic than the very open netherlands or denmark but the most undemocratic? i dont think so.
I think we have been through this discussion before on this forum. Most nations in Europe are questionable when it comes to civil liberties.

Britain is a dark horse that might challenge Germany in this less noble field in a few decades, but right now I can't think of any nation in Europe that is worse than Germany. Can you?

apm
11-04-2006, 11:01 AM
I think we have been through this discussion before on this forum. Most nations in Europe are questionable when it comes to civil liberties.

Britain is a dark horse that might challenge Germany in this less noble field in a few decades, but right now I can't think of any nation in Europe that is worse than Germany. Can you?

The best opening for a debate: don´t name your sources. by the way: bureaucracy is not equal to democracy, it seems that you mixed that up. of course one can get a bad impression of his states constitution because bureaucracy, but that has nothing to do with democracy. germany´s political "landscape" allows nearly every political opinion, even the craziest ones. the media is allowed to report what they want, and in general everyone can do what comes into his mind. and if i tomorrow say a part of my guaranteed right of free development of personality is for my opinion that i am allowed to move without graduation and education into the deepest franconian forests and to work as a potter and make fertility symbols, then i am allowed to do this. germany is probably the most democratic land in europe because everytime when somewhere the democracy is cut just a bit, a federation or a lobby comes and cries.

Vandervahn
11-04-2006, 11:51 AM
Don´t expect to get a comprehensive explanation of the valued member Thor as to where his view of German democracy originates from. In the one year I have been a member here, he never once gave one solid reason for this statement... other than that he dislikes commies, and considers Germany a socialist state... not the very best prerequisites for a well-balanced opinion.

His usual mantra is however irrelevant to this thread, because the important reasons why "democracy" has so low approval ratings is because people are unhappy with the current state of Germany and perceived or real failures of its government - it is not a distinct criticism of the german democratic system per se. Historically, Germans have both trusted more on, but also called for more responsibility of the government than other peoples (BTW, one of the reasons why Germany is so over-regulated and bureaucratic... I´d like to see the public outcry would the TÜV be abandoned and the first insecure cars roam the streets for example).

You can expect such polls to be directly related to the economic situation (in a broader sense) of Germany. When people are afraid of the future, they blame the government for not doing what is good for them - which leads to them saying they are not sufficiently democratically represented.

The article states it well:

The erosion of faith in democracy is nothing new, however. Oscar Gabriel, a professor at the University of Stuttgart, has observed the process for the last decade and a half.
Germany has been in a more or less steady economic stagnation since the reunification, spawning social security and economic reforms. With Germans as a people that place extremely high value on their financial and future security that has a very bad effect on public approval, of course.


He has found that there has been a tendency for residents of the former East Germany to lose faith in democracy since the fall of the Wall. In the West, faith in democracy has climbed slightly during the same period, however.
There you have the basic reason: West Germany never was the paradise some thought it to be in the GDR. And nowadays its quite the easy way out to speak favourably of the low unemployment and more equal income in the GDR while ignoring that that exactly was what drove this state into ruins. Many east Germans compare the current Germany to an idolized version of their former country.

I´d recommend a STASI-style "interview" to get all these idiots back to their senses.