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Clearday-TRForce
12-07-2006, 06:15 AM
The Pope has wrapped up his trip to Turkey by saying Mass in a Catholic cathedral in Istanbul, and issuing a plea for freedom of religion in Turkey.

The four-day visit was seen as an attempt to repair the damage his comments on Islam in September caused across the Muslim world.

Many Turkish papers said he succeeded, with his moment of prayer in Istanbul's Blue Mosque hailed a "great gesture".

Was the Pope's visit a success? Has the visit helped to foster better relations between the Catholic Church and Muslim community? Do you live in Turkey? If so, how important was the visit?

BBC


Some answers;


1. The visit is positive it tells that broadminded religious leaders have got a role to play all over the world.
2. Communicative approach is the best way to understand the demand of communities worldwide, then to act accordingly to help them live in peace in a productive contributively way of living that results clean economics, industry relations based on fruitful behaviour. This is the crucial meaning of religions & its impact on human life.
3. It is this which makes life easier for the young generations cognitively avoid gloomy picture of events.

Abdulaziz Malik, Khartoum, Sudan



The Pope's trip was a major success. The world got a closeup of this gentle, kind and gracious man. However it never ceases to amaze me how much rubbish spews from the mainstream media. They enjoy so much to fan the flames of controversy and in particular the media driven "offense" the Pope was supposed to have made against Muslims.
The fact is that the entire Muslim world is an allay of the Pope since they, like him, stand firm against the brutal killing of unborn children through abortion and the nonsense of same *** marriage.Both religions have the same family values.

Joe Giardina, United States



This was an ideal example of how mis-information, mis-communications and mis-trusts are resolved. The Pope's visit was a significant and a very bold step in the right direction. The Pope knows that 'although his may be the true religion' others are but the 'creation of the same God'. The same goes for the Muslims. This however, was the best move the Pope could have made...I foresee a very good understanding between all the religions of the world...only if if we can have face to face dialogues rather than send press releases which can be mis-interpreted (unintionally or otherwise).

shariati, vancouver


"Stalin asked: How many divisions does the Pope have? Moral authority alone cannot overcome bitterly held views"

Well, Stalin was obviously wrong as a huge role of John Paul II in toppling communism in Eastern Europe, and eventually in USSR itself -
has amply demonstrated.

And that's why Stalin's successor, Yuri Aandropov ordered an assassination of JPII, asking Bulgarian Sigurnost to hire a Turk to throw investigators off the trail.

Mirek Kondracki


Let me get this straight. This is a man in a frock representing an organisation that only recently (historically) brutally enforced a program of executions against 'unbelievers', forcing people to adopt their structure in the name of a 'oracle'. And this man has visited a country in which 90 odd percent of the citizens are followers of a rival organization that actively suppresses women, with a just as inventive collection of methods of execution applied with the same enthusiasm on the orders of another collection of men in frocks.

Does this collective blind allegiance to questionably dressed, self appointed maniacs, and the brutal systems they administer, seem strange to anyone else?

Alex Stone, Studying in Moscow, Russia



After the Ottomans' collapse and the new Turkish Republic's foundation the Sultan could still carry the title of "halife" which means representative of Mohammed. But for the sake of a real secular country Turkish people gave the title up , though it brings an advantage upon controlling the other Muslim countries. For most of the Turks religion is an individual issue , it's a devotion between human and his god. So you don't need another human to contact with your god. We are not used to religious classes but we feel happy for our christian citizens. The problem is not the conflict between religions , but the people use religions. As Jesus said , if you look for me I am under a stone..

Funda TANJU, Istanbul-Turkey



Pope's successful visit is like a drop of reconcilliation in an ocean of clashing faiths and perceptions. The pope's negative comment on Islam he made before can never be forgotten, but at least he showed the willingness to try to understand Islam and being honest about his concerns. He wasn't patronizing but showed integrity. He needs to reach out & embrace people like John Paul II did because my friends still see Benedict XVI as still a bit rigid in his gestures. He needs to pray more oftenly to God & the Virgin Mary in his quest to rebuild moral esteem in The Church/Sanctuary after the scandals occured, before he can rebuild world peace with other faiths. He has some golden charm to use.

Gerardus Pedrico, Jakarta - Indonesia



As for the comment saying how successful the Pope's trip to Turkey since "...he displayed the core teaching of Christianity - Love your neighbor - which includes tolerating and respecting differences and seeking to understand others." -

Do you think Islam favours something else other than peace, respect and mutual understanding? How fair would it be to label all Muslims being "destroyers"? If those small group of extremist Islamists that act their sick actions under the name of Islam religion,this shouldn't be referred to all Muslims. We,as Turkish people,are also sick of them and sadly enough no teachings of any religion can help them.

Alev GUL


As an atheist, I would like to focus on one of motives of this trip beside the main one on the agenda that is Catholic-Orthodox relationships. It was a gesture to whole religious communities or national/regional identities, be it whatever, that the religious hatred or any identity shaped hatred or prejudices should leave its place to tolerance and understanding towards the other. Especially in our current era... Why we the people are so insistant to read this massage in a way to reproduce more hatred against particular religions and nations out of this massage. I think the massage should be read as it is... no need to be manupilative, no need to reproduce more hostility...

Isik Unan, Ankara-Turkey



pope instead of visting Turkey shud have visited bush and blair to teach them Bible. he shud teach these leaders that stealing others oil and natural resoucres and occupying others land,telling white lies and misleading people of their nation which are the causes of so many deaths and destruction worldwide is not sanctioned in Bible.so pope if he is serious abt world peace and interfaith dialogue is better advised to use his energy and resources to give correct teaching of Bible to bush/blair and neo-cons.

decent engineer, Delhi, India



I hope the Pope's gestures for dialoque does not translate into people's minds as welcoming Turkey in the EU as a full member.I hope people can realise that full membership means Turkey becoming the biggest country in the EU with toooo many MPS,meaning giving huge political and other power in EU's decisions and policies. Do we really want to surrender that much power to Turkey considering their 'norms' towards freedom of speech, women's rights, militaristic "pride" and lack of understandiing that a small country is considered as an equal as a huge one, in the EU..etc etc..? The Pope did not say that he wishes to see Turkey as a full member. Misinterpretated by Erdogan!

claudio, Italy



Stalin asked: How many divisions does the Pope have? Moral authority alone cannot overcome bitterly held views based on centuries of distrust. When Pope John visitd Greece he was attacked by fanatical Orthodox priests who saw his threading Greek soil as an abomination and insult to them. Attempts at reconciliation are just that attempts that engender their own misunderstandings necessitating more attempts with similar results. It's a useless cycle caused by the nature of all religions, unreasonble beliefs held blindly without question for centuries beyond their relevance. In that we are as wise as the Neandertals were or the ancient Egyptians in their day meaning we know nothing absolutely.

Yuri Olmchek, Chicago, Illinois



The Pope has made a mistake by praying in a mosque. To moderate Muslims the goodwill gesture was unnecessary but to the radicals it will be seen as a sign of weakness and proof that their view of religion is correct and Islam is destined to triumph over Christianity. His Holiness has only added fuel to the fire.

Scott W, Port Orchard, USA



Natalie's question: "I think it's now fair to say Christianity is violent. Isn't it?" is a valid one; indeed ALL religions, in their appeal to the young, gullible and generally less intelligent, are inherently divisive, seditious and encourage fervour. For us to have any hope mankind must evolve further, to the point where any and all ideas of an omnipotent being become as ridiculous as a flat earth.
Read, think and travel; but not in the wake of a silly man with no more wisdom than you or I and who, for no good reason, calls himself Pope; whatever that means.

Pige, Jersey, UK



Potentially this visit may be a good opportunity to curb tensions between so called "west" and "east". However, when biased "Western media" focuses on a bunch of lunatic Turkish enemylike protestors, and deliberatelly use this image in order to manipulate - this potentially promising event -into the direction of "look how intolerant the Turkish people are against Christianity" then the impact of this Pope visit might be slightly different. Nevertheless, I think it was a succes, and the bad intentions of the media cannot succeed in totally undermining it, although there are always a bunch of hate-loving ignorants who like to embrace this suspicious message of the media all too much.

Thomas, Dusseldorf



For man man reputed to be intelligent, The Pope's comments on Islam can only have been mischievous. A visit to a Muslim country and a few Mosques cannot and will not repair hundreds of years of distrust, heal the cultural rift nor build the bridges necessary for future peace. He has blotted his copy book right at the start and heightened tensions which are already killing scores of people daily. A Pope's role is to engender peace and understanding through faith, not state a political position which can destabilise nations and cultures and literally put them at each other's throats. I thought it was a woeful act and his visit to Istanbul is nothing more than a sop.

blogstar, Sydney Australia



It was a nice gesture from the Pope, but has it solved the problem that has been going on for the last couple thousands of years, no. This will not be a lasting effect. This is analogous when 9/11 happened, the city was united and nationalism was strong, but it didn't last long.

Samantha Souvatzis, Bronx, New York, USA



Difference between Religion and Spirituality. Religion is like high school. It has boundaries where you make mistakes and learn. Spirituality is like college where you apply what you learnt and make a better peaceful living without any boundaries. Figure out for yourself where you stand.

Anand, New York



"Bali bombings, Madrid bombings, Indionesia bombings, London bombings, murder of a dutch film maker, murder of a nun, the threat of violence to stop free speech in Denmark & Europe." Gareth Evans, UK

Well Gareth, give this a try...

World War I, World War II, Hitler/Nazis, Hiroshima/Nagasaki, Oklahoma Bombing, the KKK, Abortion Doctor Murders, Kosovo/Bosnia, the IRA bombings, Spanish ETA bombings, and of course - Iraq.

I think it's now fair to say Christianity is violent. Isn't it?

I hope the Pope's visit encourages some in the West to read a little more about a religion to which one quarter of the world's population adheres to.

Natalie Belle, Cairo, Egypt


NOTHING! Who really listens to this kind of non sense. IF you are a strong will/confident person in life you don't need a figure to tell you whats right and wrong. A confident person should have the ability to act in good manners and make good judgements in life. GOD IS LOVE GOD IS WAR, make no mistake! GOD divides people and instill hatred in people with diffrent views on life styles. Personally, I believe it's all about giving $$$$$$ to help them live a lavish life style behind the Vatican walls. If there is really GOD than the world would be ride of all the things happening now, rather than inflaming it! Live your life without restrictions, you make the decisions not GOD!

Roger T, Toronto



I take exception when you say Orthodox Christianity 'broke away from the Vatican'. If you would review Christian history you would see that all Christians were Orthodox, all bishops, including the Bishop of Rome(and he was called Pope even then) shared in power equally and the schism that occurred had one powerful see breaking ranks with the other four. Do you ever wonder why Roman Catholics seem to venerate saints that are, in relative terms, new? Because if they went back to there true roots it is there you would find Orthodoxy.

William, Lowellville, Ohio U.S.A.



I would like to first correct all reports indicating that the Pope said ANYTHING negative about any other religion. THE POPE WAS QUOTING SOMEONE ELSE. Many reports make it read as if the Pope in fact uttered these words as his opinion.
With that said, I believe the Pope's trip was successful because he demonstrated through actions how the three faiths who believe in GOD can coexist.
God Bless the people of all three faiths.

I. Tej, Chicago, IL



The Pope's visit to Turkey will certainly help to bridge the growing rift between Islam and the Western world. The scepticism and the disdain that were the receptors at his visit has largely subsided and this ought to be seen as a sign of a long process of the mendment of the relations that have been so severely didtorted between the two faiths.

Subhankar Mondal, Bangalore, India



It was appropriate that on St Andrews Day the pope joined Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I to mark the feast day of St. Andrew, who preached across Asia Minor and who, tradition says, ordained the first bishop of Constantinople, now Istanbul.
The symbolism of the ceremony was highly significant to Roman Catholics. Andrew was the brother of St. Peter, who was martyred in Rome and is considered the first pope.
We can hope that Scotland national saint can be a unifying force for good accross the churches

Edward, Hungerford



It says alot about the Turkish people that they can host a hostile Pope and treat him like royalty. I'm sure that if he visited anywhere else in the Islamic world he would not enjoy the hospitality

Olaf Kolzig, USA



Christianity and Islam have still so much to learn from each other, so any chance to bring them closer is most welcome.

homeralp, London



Pope has now arrived in Istanbul,so far the only impact has been to the TRAFFIC !,normally takes me 45 mins to get home,last night 3 hours !,i've seen & heard many commnents which seem to me to be coming from people who really dont understand the Turks at all, yes they have a minority group who hold protests etc which can portray the country at its worst, but most other countries also have such cases time to time, for those making comments regarding Turk's not accepting other religions let me tell you about a place here in Istanbul called Ortakoy, you can find a Church,Synagogue & Mosque within 100 yards of each other,everyone accepted & live happily in the area, Great City , Great People !

Jackie Nixon, Istanbul / Turkey

exarmyguard
12-07-2006, 07:10 AM
Ignorant muslims (the minority) are searching for anything to complain about regarding christianity. The pope, this pope, did enough as far as diplomacy is concerned. Now I think we should concentrate on these Imam's and Ayatollah's who call for the death and destruction of the west on a DAILY basis. THe hypocrisy and BS in dealing with Muslims is so thick, you could drive an Abrams on top of it and not sink.

Clearday-TRForce
12-07-2006, 07:19 AM
and what about Pope opinion about Turkey? The Pope says Turkey should be part of the European Union. Is he right? what is your opinion?

The Pope approved that Turkey be part of the European Union when in delicate position, both politically and diplomatically.

Turkey, by way of its membership in NATO, recent emigration patterns to EU states as well as high volumes of trade, investment and tourism with the EU, is already an integral part of the European Union. From an economic standpoint, Turkey's ascension into the EU would be a simple recognition of existing conditions.From a social standpoint however, the inevitable initial difficulties not withstanding, Turkey's admission to the EU would send a strong signal that Europe is not an exclusively Christian club, that Islam is not fundamentally incompatible with liberal democracy and that there are values around which humans of all walks can coalesce.




The United States should encourage its European allies to embrace Turkey and accelerate its acceptance into the European Union in order to undercut Iran's spreading influence in the Middle East and help counter the rising tide of Islamist extremism. Apart from brokering a breakthrough in peace talks between Israel and the Palestinians and Israel and Syria, there may arguably now be mo more effective available means of promoting democracy and progress in the Muslim world--and defusing the threat of a clash of civilizations--than supporting Turkey's quest for EU membership.

Turkey is a truly unique and important country. A secular democracy with a dynamic, growing economy, Turkey is part of Europe and identifies with Europe while also looking east for trade and other opportunities. The country is overwhelmingly Muslim and is actually led by a moderately Islamist government; yet, it is also a Westernizing NATO member with significant ties to the US and Israel.

Rejecting or indefinitely delaying Turkey's application for EU membership--over the Cyprus issue and other disputes--would send the wrong signal at the worst possible time, reinforcing the radical Islamist view that the EU is a hopelessly Christian club and that the West will never fully accept a Muslim nation into its midst.

I have great faith in Turkey: even if its EU membership drive is derailed, it will not turn against the West. For one thing, the Turkish military, which sees itself as the guardian of the secular state, will not allow Turkey to become another Iran. More important, the extremist element in Turkey is a contained minority with limited support.

It's Europe that concerns me. The continent that has been so outspoken in its criticism of the US for its misguided attempt to import democracy into Iraq has so far shown itself to be basically devoid of statesmanship and vision in its approach to Turkey.

Jonathan Braun, New York, USA, The Badner Group, Managing Partner, http://www.badnergroup.com

:)

regards,
CDTRF

roland
12-07-2006, 08:33 AM
Yes: Turkey showed great tolerance despite the current difficult political situation with Europe.

Lazy Lob
12-07-2006, 08:46 AM
and what about Pope opinion about Turkey? The Pope says Turkey should be part of the European Union. Is he right? what is your opinion?

No, Turkey should not form part of the EU. Joining would be an awful mistake for both sides, far worse than the lack of planning for post-invasion Iraq.

AROUETLJ
12-07-2006, 09:34 AM
He's starting to wobble. Probably folliwing the advice of the previous Pope's posse.

Vandervahn
12-07-2006, 11:02 AM
and what about Pope opinion about Turkey? The Pope says Turkey should be part of the European Union. Is he right? what is your opinion? ....

Personally, I object Turkeys ascension to the EU for two very simple reasons:

1. Under NO circumstances am I willing to support a turkish EU membership in the foreseeable future... because I think that sharing a common border to the Middle East would be the greatest security risk for Europe since Leonid Brezhnev.

2. I donīt consider Turky to be a European nation, given its pure geographical position. If we did that, we could also allow Morocco to join (they applied in 1987) - THAT would at least have some comedic value.

Furthermore, with all the historical parallels and common heritage, I do not think that Turkish-muslim culture and values are all too well compatible to the westernized EU culture. I donīt see this as an intrinsic deficiency of Turkey, but I think that makes "us" incompatible.

ren0312
12-07-2006, 11:24 AM
Personally, I object Turkeys ascension to the EU for two very simple reasons:

1. Under NO circumstances am I willing to support a turkish EU membership in the foreseeable future... because I think that sharing a common border to the Middle East would be the greatest security risk for Europe since Leonid Brezhnev.

2. I donīt consider Turky to be a European nation, given its pure geographical position. If we did that, we could also allow Morocco to join (they applied in 1987) - THAT would at least have some comedic value.

Furthermore, with all the historical parallels and common heritage, I do not think that Turkish-muslim culture and values are all too well compatible to the westernized EU culture. I donīt see this as an intrinsic deficiency of Turkey, but I think that makes "us" incompatible.

If you allow Turkey and Morocco to join, then allow the Philippines to join to, since it is a former colony of Spain, yummmmmmmmmmmm, all those fat EU subsidies.rofl :hug: p-)

Vandervahn
12-07-2006, 11:33 AM
If you allow Turkey and Morocco to join, then allow the Philippines to join to, since it is a former colony of Spain, yummmmmmmmmmmm, all those fat EU subsidies.rofl :hug: p-)


http://www.carsten-hoefer.de/Grafik/Sketchshow_Tuersteher.jpg

Sorry, Clubīs full!

Loki77
12-07-2006, 11:39 AM
If you allow Turkey and Morocco to join, then allow the Philippines to join to, since it is a former colony of Spain, yummmmmmmmmmmm, all those fat EU subsidies.rofl :hug: p-)

I'm big supporter of the entrance of the Phillipines in the EU...It will be a bridge between Europe and Asia..

Ergnkon
12-07-2006, 02:10 PM
No, Turkey should not form part of the EU. Joining would be an awful mistake for both sides, far worse than the lack of planning for post-invasion Iraq.


On the thread subject, Yes I think the Pope's visit to Turkey was success at least for the Turks, I think millions think positively about him prior to his visit.

But, I'm with LazyLob's comments regarding Turkey's EU membership. It's a dangerous idea for both sides, esp. for Turkey. Hopefully it'll all be over pretty soon :)


If you allow Turkey and Morocco to join, then allow the Philippines to join to, since it is a former colony of Spain, yummmmmmmmmmmm, all those fat EU subsidies.

LOL! really LOL! I think they're encouraged by the Cyprus's membership despite its location. LOL!!!

Altough I'm against Turkey membership, I could not resist such an ignorant comment.


because I think that sharing a common border to the Middle East would be the greatest security risk for Europe since Leonid Brezhnev.

If you think you're bordering ME now with the secular Turkey to your eastern borders, wait till when/if the Islamists take over that country, thanks to EU's help.

Lazy Lob
12-07-2006, 02:55 PM
. It's a dangerous idea for both sides, esp. for Turkey. Hopefully it'll all be over pretty soon :)

x 2 mate.

Today old Erdogan purchased some life insurance policy by giving some concessions on the Cyprus front. He knows what’s coming and wants the EU to sustain him. I hope he fails. I cannot understand how we’re so blinkered in Europe.

PS I sincerely hope there are plenty more who think like you in Turkey.

Ergnkon
12-07-2006, 03:09 PM
x 2 mate.

Today old Erdogan purchased some life insurance policy by giving some concessions on the Cyprus front. He knows what’s coming and wants the EU to sustain him. I hope he fails.

Well, he has elections ahead and he cannot give into EU demands now, so needs to by some time. Unfortunatelly they help him out with that :(



I cannot understand how we’re so blinkered in Europe.

Actually, you have absolutelly nothing to worry about. All that "pro Turkey" movements are false. EU will NEVER give membership to Turkey. They're just trying keep Turkey in course so they can get some of the things that couldn't if Turkey was not in this phase. Erdogan knows this too but he has other goals. He'll just keep on playing until it gets too dangerous for him.

So don't worry mate, it's a dead end. :)


PS I sincerely hope there are plenty more who think like you in Turkey.

Millions man. To be exact, the support for the EU went down to 25% from 75% in the last year or so and it's going steady down. Remember, Erdogan had only 34% support from the public when he came to power, now even that is going down.

exarmyguard
12-07-2006, 07:08 PM
As the name indicates, European Union, countries that encompass Europe should be apart of it. Turkey is not In Europe and should not be in the Union.

exarmyguard
12-07-2006, 07:25 PM
and what about Pope opinion about Turkey? The Pope says Turkey should be part of the European Union. Is he right? what is your opinion?

The Pope approved that Turkey be part of the European Union when in delicate position, both politically and diplomatically.

Turkey, by way of its membership in NATO, recent emigration patterns to EU states as well as high volumes of trade, investment and tourism with the EU, is already an integral part of the European Union. From an economic standpoint, Turkey's ascension into the EU would be a simple recognition of existing conditions.From a social standpoint however, the inevitable initial difficulties not withstanding, Turkey's admission to the EU would send a strong signal that Europe is not an exclusively Christian club, that Islam is not fundamentally incompatible with liberal democracy and that there are values around which humans of all walks can coalesce.





:)

regards,
CDTRF

I kindly disagree with the points in your statement. Islam, as it is practiced in many parts of the world, is not compatible with democracy. This is blatantly stated by Islamic religious leaders who continue to wish death to western nations. Islam is the complete opposite of democracy. Islam does not encourage free expression of thoughts and ideas. For example, a muslim is forbidden to change faiths and the penalty is death. In the Taliban controlled Afganistan, justice was dispensed by an executioner for comparitively trival crimes. In Europe and the US, there are laws that protect human rights. Peoples are free to practice their faiths without fear. Christians in Muslim countries are ostracized, maimed and killed. That is a sad fact. The fact that a Danish cartoon about Islam provokes people to burn embassies, burn epogies of western leaders, burn flags, and to kill is frightening to reasonable people, yet is acceptable and promoted in the Islamic faith. No, I do not think Turkey should be accepted in the EU. The lack of tolerance inherent in the Islamic faith is not compatible with the individual freedoms inherent in European society.

The idea of Europe being "christian" is a dated idea. Europe is a liberal and humanist society. Human rights and socialist values that ensure the secular nation functions to serve peoples needs. Religion is passe. If the pope were to tell catholics to rise up and invade a Middle East country, few would pay attention. Yet if an Ayatollah said for the masses to kill Americans, that may be taken alot more seriously.

We all wish for peace, but peace only comes when there is tolerance. I hate to say it, but Islam lacks in this consideration.

Respectfully yours.

IraGlacialis
12-07-2006, 09:35 PM
As the name indicates, European Union, countries that encompass Europe should be apart of it. Turkey is not In Europe and should not be in the Union.
Well... Turkey technically in Europe (if only by a small protion) due to the fact that a portion of Thrace is part of it.
I think the visit had thawed the thoughts of some moderate muslims that had reservations about him because of the comments. Nothing will change the thoughts of the extremists.

exarmyguard
12-07-2006, 09:56 PM
Well... Turkey technically in Europe (if only by a small protion) due to the fact that a portion of Thrace is part of it.
I think the visit had thawed the thoughts of some moderate muslims that had reservations about him because of the comments. Nothing will change the thoughts of the extremists.

Then have Thrace come on board. The rest can scr#w.

Clearday-TRForce
12-08-2006, 06:19 AM
Turkish surprise move confuses EU diplomacy
07.12.2006 - 17:37 CET | By Mark Beunderman
EUOBSERVER / BRUSSELS - Turkey's last-ditch offer to open one port and one airport to Cypriot traffic appears only to have complicated EU efforts to find a common stance on the fate of Ankara's membership talks.

EU member states' representations in Brussels signalled confusion on Thursday (7 December) over a morning proposal from Ankara to start allowing trade from EU member state Cyprus, in a bid to avert a partial freeze of its EU membership negotiations.

The "unclear" language of the Turkish proposal prompted the Finnish EU presidency to shift a meeting of member states' EU ambassadors on the issue to Friday, with the specifics of the plan still unclear on late Thursday afternoon.

"This can either be the golden goal or a trick cigar," one EU diplomat stated.

Finnish foreign minister Erkki Tuomioja in a statement confirmed that Ankara intends to "provisionally open a major sea port to Cypriot vessels," partially fulfilling a key obligation under the so-called Ankara protocol which prohibits blocking trade from EU member states.

"Turkey's initiative is a positive step towards full implementation of the Ankara protocol, but still needs clarification," Mr Tuomioja said referring to a second part of the plan in which Ankara also signalled it would open an airport to Cypriot commercial flights.

Some diplomats said that Ankara apparently made the opening of one airport conditional on a parallel move by Cyprus to allow the opening of one airport in Turkish-controlled Northern Cyprus which is under an international trade embargo.

While Finnish presidency sources said they were still seeking clarification from the Turks, both the presidency and the European Commission reacted cautiously but positively to Ankara's willingness to open at least one port without conditions.

"If Turkey is ready for such an unconditional move, this positive step will influence the Council's [member states'] discussions on the continuation of Turkey's EU accession process," said Mr Tuomioja with the commission calling it an "important step" if confirmed.

A diplomat from a large western member state suggested the European Commission should look at Ankara's proposal as early as Thursday night before member states' ambassadors meet again on Friday.

He added that Brussels might need to "reconsider" its recommendation made last week to partially freeze Turkey's membership talks.

The commission is recommending the suspension of the opening of eight chapters of Turkey's 35-strong EU negotiations book while talks on the remaining chapters could continue - as a sanction for Turkey's refusal to implement the Ankara protocol before the end of the year.

Continuing rift
The commission proposal forms the basis for discussions by EU foreign ministers at a key meeting next Monday, which are expected to reveal deep divisions between those member states taking a soft line on Turkey and those wanting to push a harder line.

Turkey's latest move seems to have done little to bridge these divides, with diplomats saying that Cyprus suspects Turkey of wanting to derail Monday's EU foreign ministers meeting with an eleventh-hour partial concession.

According to DPA press agency, a Cypriot spokesman said Nicosia would in any case not allow the opening of any airport in the North of the island, while a Greek foreign ministry spokesman said the opening of just one port is not enough.

German foreign minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier on the other hand said Turkey appeared to be showing a "cautious readiness to make concessions."

In a strong positive reaction, a British official told ******* "We have been pressing the Turkish government to implement its obligations. A unilateral move would be courageous and positive. It is essential that the EU responds."


http://euobserver.com/9/23059/?rk=1



p-) ...Ankara,nice shot.

Clearday-TRForce
12-08-2006, 06:31 AM
I kindly disagree with the points in your statement. Islam, as it is practiced in many parts of the world, is not compatible with democracy. This is blatantly stated by Islamic religious leaders who continue to wish death to western nations. Islam is the complete opposite of democracy. Islam does not encourage free expression of thoughts and ideas. For example, a muslim is forbidden to change faiths and the penalty is death. In the Taliban controlled Afganistan, justice was dispensed by an executioner for comparitively trival crimes. In Europe and the US, there are laws that protect human rights. Peoples are free to practice their faiths without fear. Christians in Muslim countries are ostracized, maimed and killed. That is a sad fact. The fact that a Danish cartoon about Islam provokes people to burn embassies, burn epogies of western leaders, burn flags, and to kill is frightening to reasonable people, yet is acceptable and promoted in the Islamic faith. No, I do not think Turkey should be accepted in the EU. The lack of tolerance inherent in the Islamic faith is not compatible with the individual freedoms inherent in European society.

The idea of Europe being "christian" is a dated idea. Europe is a liberal and humanist society. Human rights and socialist values that ensure the secular nation functions to serve peoples needs. Religion is passe. If the pope were to tell catholics to rise up and invade a Middle East country, few would pay attention. Yet if an Ayatollah said for the masses to kill Americans, that may be taken alot more seriously.

We all wish for peace, but peace only comes when there is tolerance. I hate to say it, but Islam lacks in this consideration.

Respectfully yours.



Your Islam explanation needs reading practice and learning process. Coz you have minimal information what Islam is or not. Your opinion consists of more violence and aggresive and untolerated than Islam here. Ayatollah or soem so-called religion leaders can not talk instead of Islam. This is your explanation not us.

Schizo
12-08-2006, 06:49 AM
I'm not a EU citizen, and I'm not in favor of Turkey in EU (it's up to you to decide whether you want to screw yourself even more), but the whole "Turkey isn't geographiclly European" argument is shyte! Turkey is more geographically European than Cyprus(which is a member of EU).

Bandeirante
12-08-2006, 08:35 AM
The Pope visit was a success !

Politics is not always a geographical or cultural fact. Canary Islands is considered a part of Europe. So Morocco wanted the Peijil Islands/Leila Islet to set a foot in Europe !
If Anatolia were a Christian Land it would be considered part of the Classical European World, like Greece and the old Roman Empire. Scandinavia or Poland are new Europeans because they were not in the Classical Mediterranean-European world. If Sicily were a Muslim Land it wouldn't be classified as Europe too.
And we the old "European Colonials" that broke political ties with Europe in our processes of independence are not part of the European Club because our forefathers didn't want. But an English descendant in the United States, a Portuguese descendant in Brazil and a Spaniard descendant in Mexico or Argentina is not an European but we have more things in common with the old metropolis than any country in Europe have in common to others EU members...