View Full Version : (UK)Knife amnesties 'have no effect'
Geezah
12-07-2006, 01:19 PM
Knife amnesties have no real impact on reducing knife crime, according to a Metropolitan Police report.
An eight-week Met Police amnesty over the summer showed that, after a slight dip in knife-related crime, levels were back to normal within weeks, it said.
Pre-amnesty there were an average of 34.9 daily knife offences in London, dropping to 31 in the amnesty. Six weeks later, that figure was 34.2.
The report was obtained by the BBC under the Freedom of Information act.
More than 100,000 knives were handed into police forces in England, Scotland and Wales this summer during a five-week nationwide campaign and the amnesty was declared a success by ministers.
But an analysis of the concurrent but longer eight-week amnesty by the Metropolitan Police - between May and July - appears to question the effectiveness of the operation.
The report said "no changing trends" had been visible during the first five weeks of the operation from 15 May.
For the final three weeks of the operation and in the following weeks "a small downward trend appeared".
"In late August 2006 - six weeks after the operation ends - offence levels tend to return to pre-operation values", the report adds.
A spokesman for the Metropolitan Police said the force always recognised that a knife amnesty on its own was of limited effectiveness in tackling knife crime.
Amnesties needed to be used in conjunction with other initiatives, the spokesman added.
Link (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6216118.stm)
I've been saying it all along, these amnesties don't do diddly especially when the only people bringing knives in are old grannies.
Freedom06
12-07-2006, 01:28 PM
I remember some 'will someone please think of the children' hysterical women schmuckess suggesting after a recent stabbing they should ban the sale of kitchen knives here....
Nope. The kitchen utensil ban was called for by a group of "leading" NHS physicians and published in a formerly respectable medical journal.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4581871.stm
what's next, power tools?
Freedom06
12-07-2006, 01:58 PM
As much as I hate to agree with 'Mister Britanophobe' banning anything that could be used as weapon is ridiculous. There are already laws in place about carrying knives on the street.
As much as I hate to agree with 'Mister Britanophobe' banning anything that could be used as weapon is ridiculous. There are already laws in place about carrying knives on the street.
Hmm.. A Britton suggesting that enforcement of existing laws is preferable to punitive and draconian restrictions of civil liberties? Most unusual. Mayhaps the UK had no general prohibitions of gun and knife crime before the handgun ban and knife amnesty? Oh damn.. I guess it did. There goes that theory.
Back to your padded hamster ball.
Hydro
12-07-2006, 03:39 PM
The knife amnesty was always hilarious. How on earth was it supposed to be pulled off?
CPLHUNTER
12-07-2006, 03:42 PM
The UK laws on gun control & now knife control make me crack up...unbelievable
Createdeemcee
12-07-2006, 03:47 PM
Im glad you mooved here Geezah, I couldnt imagine you with out any ARM in your possession. Life for shooters must truely suck there. I guess the guy's in the armed forces there have fun while they can then when its over its over.
Freedom06
12-07-2006, 03:50 PM
Hmm.. A Britton suggesting that enforcement of existing laws is preferable to punitive and draconian restrictions of civil liberties? Most unusual. Mayhaps the UK had no general prohibitions of gun and knife crime before the handgun ban and knife amnesty? Oh damn.. I guess it did. There goes that theory.
Back to your padded hamster ball.
At the moment I prefer my padded cell, although that does look cool-New Zealand invention I believe..
Geezah
12-07-2006, 03:52 PM
^Oh, I was...........I had my trusty pointed stick on me at all times, I even applied and got my PSL.
Mr Gently Benevolent
12-09-2006, 09:02 AM
The UK laws on gun control & now knife control make me crack up...unbelievableSome states in the US have also implemented controls on certain knives.
Geezah
12-09-2006, 10:16 AM
Some states in the US have also implemented controls on certain knives.
We've been down this road before and I think I supplied info to counter your claim, I even went so far as asking for information from the Met in reference to the knives you carry;)
kosse
12-09-2006, 10:25 AM
Why are they collecting tools from people?
daily666
12-09-2006, 10:32 AM
Well the baseball bat is considered a weapon in Poland, you can't buy it. Well since nobody plays it here the thing was quite a handy tool for the mafia and homegrown gangstaz.
kosse
12-09-2006, 10:36 AM
Well the baseball bat is considered a weapon in Poland, you can't buy it. Well since nobody plays it here the thing was quite a handy tool for the mafia and homegrown gangstaz.
roflrofl
Holy ****. It's like very hard to go to the woods, cut a tree and then make your own club. What else is banned in Poland? I hope EU doesn't try to start to force these stupid laws on it's member countries or I'm going to revolt.
Mr Gently Benevolent
12-09-2006, 10:42 AM
We've been down this road before and I think I supplied info to counter your claim, I even went so far as asking for information from the Met in reference to the knives you carry;)So far you have not supplied valid information on the control of certain blades in some US states. The fact reamins that postal outfitters will not supply some blades to persons residing in a number of states.
daily666
12-09-2006, 10:45 AM
roflrofl
Holy ****. It's like very hard to go to the woods, cut a tree and then make your own club. What else is banned in Poland? I hope EU doesn't try to start to force these stupid laws on it's member countries or I'm going to revolt.
It was implemented long before the we joined the EU. With the rule of Polish Supreme Court only original baseball bats are allowed to be carried for sports use. Well all the bats are considered "white weapon" but tha doesn't mean you will get jailed for owning one, however you can have some trouble if you own one but don't proove you really need it.
martinexsquaddie
12-09-2006, 11:17 AM
there was a campign to ban them in northan ireland one baseball team 1200 bats sold one year and favored weapon in punishment beatings not exactly rocket sicence what there being used for :(
kosse
12-09-2006, 11:23 AM
^ It really doesn't take a rocket scientist to make your own club. In that light these bans seem rather strange.
daily666
12-09-2006, 11:28 AM
^ It really doesn't take a rocket scientist to make your own club. In that light these bans seem rather strange.
But it's really rather rare to hear a crime commited with this sort of weapon. It was a huge mess in the 90s. Baseball bat was a standard issue of many car boots.
So far you have not supplied valid information on the control of certain blades in some US states. The fact reamins that postal outfitters will not supply some blades to persons residing in a number of states.
'Got to put this myth to rest.
Knife laws vary from state to state, and I don't purport to be an expert on all 50 states' laws. Connecticut, however, provides a good example of one of the more restrictive states.
C.G.S. Sec. 53-206 prohibits persons from carrying the following in public places: knives > 4.0", brass knuckles, spring loaded knives, telescoping batons, tazers, and a couple of other "dangerous weapons."
Exemptions are granted for outdoorsmen, security guards, reenactors, etc.
Most importantly, the prohibition does not apply within one's home or place of business, and does not restrict otherwise lawful defensive use of the weapons. This is nothing like the recent Australian ban of ceremonial swords.
So why is this statute justified? Persons with legitimate self-defense needs can simply acqure a handgun carry permit! Glock, or tazer? hmmm... The carrying of these items is only attractive to felons who can not legally carry or purchase handguns.
I suppose that the state could start issuing knife permits, but why?
exarmyguard
12-09-2006, 01:54 PM
There are some counties in the USA that mandate firearm ownership. The crime in those communities are very low. In Swizterland, firearm ownership is high and crime is low. It stinks how in England honest people can't have a gun and are presumed to be criminals. England blows! I would not want to be a "subject" of the crown.
http://www.youtube.com/v/zMVUKNkny3E
kamarian
12-09-2006, 06:01 PM
This is nothing like the recent Australian ban of ceremonial swords.
What ban? I live in australia and never heard of this.
Link please.
Geezah
12-09-2006, 06:10 PM
^They have banned pretty much anything dangerous in Victoria, I have a link at work.
Mr Gently Benevolent
12-09-2006, 06:35 PM
It stinks how in England honest people can't have a gun and are presumed to be criminals.Most people in England are criminals or would like to be a criminal it's a well known fact.
England blows! I would not want to be a "subject" of the crown.The mere fact that you seem to think that England is the UK tells me that your not the smartest and are something of a knob jockey.
Most people in England are criminals or would like to be a criminal it's a well known fact.
What's sad is that I can't tell whether or not you're trying to be sarcastic.
kamarian
12-09-2006, 08:16 PM
^They have banned pretty much anything dangerous in Victoria, I have a link at work.
Let me know. I've started collecting odd bits and pieces and would like to know whats going on.
Geezah
12-09-2006, 10:44 PM
Let me know. I've started collecting odd bits and pieces and would like to know whats going on.
It's been in place for a few years now, I'll see if I can find the link.
Let me know. I've started collecting odd bits and pieces and would like to know whats going on.
Also replica handguns. Kids toys, effectively. Welcome to the nanny State. :-(
Geezah
12-09-2006, 10:57 PM
It also covers MA weapons like tonfa, chuks, bo staffs, a whole bunch of things, it names every single one off. I posted here before but can't find the thread:(
kamarian
12-09-2006, 11:20 PM
thats ok. I know a lot of martial arts stuff is illegal, and so is replica weapons. but that why i'm going to get a collectors licence one day, so i dont really have to worry about that sort of crap.
Geezah
12-09-2006, 11:28 PM
^I'm having a hard time searching for the law on Google, I'll dig it up Monday at work.
thats ok. I know a lot of martial arts stuff is illegal, and so is replica weapons. but that why i'm going to get a collectors licence one day, so i dont really have to worry about that sort of crap.
???
Better apply tomorrow! Leave it too long and the effect of import bans and illegalisation will mean you will have jack all to collect.
kamarian
12-10-2006, 02:40 AM
nah, there's always ways of collecting stuff. even if it's illegal.
Geezah
12-11-2006, 11:03 AM
Ok ,I found what I was looking for. It isn't the one I thought I had saved to my favorites but this one works.
List of Prohibited Weapons
The following are prohibited weapons in Victoria:
Sword - a thrusting, striking or cutting weapon with a long blade with one or two edges, a hilt or handle
Crossbow - a bow fixed transversely on a stock grooved to direct a dart, bolt or arrow
More specifically a:
pistol crossbow, an easily concealed crossbow that you can raise and fire with one hand
general category crossbow (anything other than a pistol crossbow).
Flick knife - a knife designed or adapted to hide the blade inside the handle, which either opens by gravity, centrifugal force or by pressure applied to a button, spring or device in or attached to the handle of the knife
Dagger - a sharp and pointed stabbing instrument (other than an oyster knife) that can be easily concealed, either with a:
flat blade with cutting edges (serrated or not) along the length of each side
needle-like blade, which has a cross section that is elliptical or has 3 or more sides (does not include weapons such as swords or bayonets)
Knuckle knife - an open or exposed blade attached to a handle designed or adapted to be held between the knuckles (including the device commonly known as the 'Urban Pal Knife')
Anything designed to conceal a sword or blade
These include:
a belt, or something similar, designed or adapted to hide or disguise a knife, dagger or similar object (for example, something known as the 'Bowen Knife Belt')
a 'swordstick', which could be a cane, stick or something similar designed or adapted conceal the blade of a sword until it is withdrawn from the cane, stick or other object
a riding crop designed or adapted to conceal a blade or spike until it is withdrawn from the crop.
Butterfly knife - a knife with a two-piece handle that folds together to cover both edges of the blade (serrated or not)
Double-end knife - a knife that looks like two overlapping curved blades joined together to form an ellipse shape
Knife with a concealed blade - a knife whose blade is concealed by a plastic, wooden or metal sheath that retracts and expose the blade (for example, a 'Black Eagle Knife')
Push knife - a weapon with a single-edged or multi-edged blade or spike that has a handle fitted allowing the blade to be controlled and supported by the palm of the hand so stabbing blows or slashes can be inflicted by a punching or pushing action
Trench knife - a single-edged or multi-edged blade or spike fitted with a handle made of any hard substance that can be placed over the user's knuckles to protect their knuckles, and to increase the effect of a punch or blow (or anything adapted for such use)
Throwing blade - any knife or axe designed or modified to be thrown
Ballistic knife - designed or adapted to fire or discharge a knife, dagger or similar instrument by mechanical, percussive or explosive means
Non-metal or ceramic knife - any knife, blade or spike that has no metallic component (excludes plastic cutlery)
Blow gun - a blow pipe or anything else designed to propel an arrow, dart or similar projectile using air expelled from someone's mouth
Dart - something designed to be projected from a blow-gun or similar device
Hunting sling or slingshot - any sling or slingshot that is used with an arm brace that fits or rests someone's forearm to support the wrist from the tension of the elastic material throwing the projectile (for example, 'Saunders Falcon Hunting Sling')
Catapult, shanghai or hunting sling - (without a sling) that is manufactured or intended to be commercially distributed
Dart projector - that is manufactured or intended to be commercially distributed
Slingshot - that is manufactured or intended for commercial distribution
Capsicum spray - or anything designed or adapted to discharge oleoresin capsicum spray
Noxious gas or and other types of emitting agents - anything designed to emit or discharge an offensive, noxious or irritant liquid, powder, gas or chemical that may disable or harm another person
Electric current device - anything designed to incapacitate or injure
Acoustic anti-personnel device - anything designed to cause permanent or temporary incapacity or disability, or that would physically disorientate a person
Shark dart - anything designed to expel any gas or other substance capable of causing bodily harm on, or after contact, with a person
Extendable baton - a baton that extends by gravity, centrifugal force, or any pressure button or handle on the baton
Knuckle-duster - something that is worn across a knuckle or knuckles, finger, fingers or thumb so as to:
increase the force or impact of a blow when striking another person with that hand, finger, fingers or thumb
protect the knuckle or knuckles from injury when striking another person with that hand, finger, fingers or thumb.
Weighted glove - a glove that is used as a weapon (including a fingerless glove) with weighted material sown into it to increase the effect of a blow
Studded glove - a glove that is used as a weapon (including a fingerless glove) with any number of raised studs or spikes made of a hard substance and positioned over the back of the glove to increase the effect of a blow
Mace - a club or staff fitted with a flanged or spiked head that is capable of causing injury (excluding a ceremonial mace, which is solely used as symbol of authority on ceremonial occasions)
Flail - a staff or handle with a freely-swinging striking part that is armed with spikes or studded with any protruding matter
Whip with metal lashes
'Cat o'nine tails' with knotted lashes
Strong laser pointer - any hand-held laser pointer that can emit a laser beam with an accessible emission limit of greater than 1mW
Baton-chucks or bo-chucks - any baton or stick that can be unscrewed or broken into two or more parts joined by chain, rope or cord
Scythe or sickle type objects - anything resembling a scythe or sickle that has a fixed or folding blade, which includes objects with or without a chain attached (for example, a 'Karma')
Kasari-fundo, Kusari-fundo and Manrikigusari - anything where two wooden or metal batons, sticks or rods are joined together by a chain, rope or a cord
Kubotan, and similar objects - any stick or rod (of any material) designed as a weapon to be applied to the pressure points of the human body
Ninja climbing claws, ninja hand claws and ninja foot claws - anything that is attached to hands or feet with claws on it
Nunchaku - two sticks, rods or batons joined by a cord, rope or chain
Sai or Jitte - any short, tapered, metal rod, dull at the point, with flared metal ****gs guarding the handle
Suan Ywe Gou - anything with curved blade pointed at both ends and a handle attached to the middle
Shoge, ninja Kyokeysu-shoge or Kyotetsu-shoge - any object that includes a blade (or blades) with cord, rope or chain attached so the blade can be thrown and retrieved
Throwing star - a sharpened star-shaped article designed for throwing (for example 'Surikan', 'Suriken' or 'Shaken'), including where the star is attached to a belt
Chinese whip - a handle and an edged blade, joined by chain or a combination of chain and metal pieces or steel rods, designed to be used as a whip
Butterfly Sword
Tonfa
Visit the Victoria Police website for more information on prohibited weapons including photographs and licensing requirements.
Link (http://www.justice.vic.gov.au/wps/wcm/connect/DOJ+Internet/Home/Community+Safety/Weapons/JUSTICE+-+List+of+Prohibited+Weapons)
The only thing missing on that list was my farts. What a nanny state. Mind you the poms on this board would feel at home...eh Kev?
Geezah
12-11-2006, 11:40 AM
The only thing missing on that list was my farts. What a nanny state. Mind you the poms on this board would feel at home...eh Kev?
I was surprised when I read it the first time how specific they were regarding MA weapons.
How many crimes have been commited by someone with Bat Jam Do(Butterfly Swords)?
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