DPM kit

[Royal]

When wearing S95 DPM (trousers and shirt)...
do you tuck in the shirt or leave it out like on American BDU's?

It depends.

In camp tucked in. Out depends on personal preference and/or how much of a **** the CSM is.

Secondly, do British troops wear (or are they authorised to wear) green-canvas jungles with S95 kit? Or do they only use them with tropical DPM?

There were still some old ones issued in the early SFOR days in Bosnia (just after CS95 came in). The black Altamas have long since replaced them. Nowadays there are plenty of other hot weather boots on issue/available. Trops are rarely, if ever, issued anymore - even in Sierra Leone, Belize, Brunei. The black Altamas are still issued for proper jungle, rather than just hot weather.

Lastly, if you're in the cold and decide to don a wooly or Norgie, do you wear it over your T-shirt by itself with the field jacket or over your DPM shirt under the field jacket?

If you're cold, you do what you like in the field.

You'll rarely see a wooly pully worn in the field outside 3 Commando Brigade - and then it'll be some crusty old WOII/Major. For some bizzare reason the army considers the norgie as underwear and I have had to conduct attitude readjustments on several SNCOs who told young marines to put on manky field jackets (to cover their underwear) in the galley. Norgies are worn on their own under a smock or sometimes under a DPM shirt.

[Britboy]

+1 on the 'norgy under shirt'

The best way for cold weather layers I find is 't shirt, norgy, softy, jacket, goretex'

But since you only get one jacket it might be soaked or somesuch, but you do carry a spare shirt in your bergen, although its meant for warmer climates ideally, you can go 't shirt, norgy, shirt, softy, goretex' and it works.

Hasn't got as many pockets as the jacket and its either 'softy AND goretex' or neither, since you cant get softy under your shirt and can't really get away with wearing softy as a top layer on its own; but the shirt idea does work and is better than freezing with a soaked through jacket or whatever.

[Vince S]

+1 on the 'norgy under shirt'

The best way for cold weather layers I find is 't shirt, norgy, softy, jacket, goretex'

.

That's a whole lot of layer, but then again I never went into the arctic

[Britboy]

I haven't been to the arctic either, but I have been pretty damned cold just in the UK at times! Army training areas seem to have their own peculiar microclimates of cold and wet - particularly Sennybridge, Leek, Sennybridge, Sennybridge, and Sennybridge.

Depends on what you're doing too. You wouldn't wear all that stuff if you were marching off looking for a scrap, but if you were static in bad weather at night for hours, why not throw it on? Any fool can get hypothermia...

[Vince S]

I haven't been to the arctic either, but I have been pretty damned cold just in the UK at times! Army training areas seem to have their own peculiar microclimates of cold and wet - particularly Sennybridge, Leek, Sennybridge, Sennybridge, and Sennybridge.

Depends on what you're doing too. You wouldn't wear all that stuff if you were marching off looking for a scrap, but if you were static in bad weather at night for hours, why not throw it on? Any fool can get hypothermia...

Granted that having never been in the army I've never had to wear soaking wet clothes for extended periods.

Though I,ve been through mad cold winter, hurray for Canada

[Sabre]

Quick set of questions:

When wearing S95 DPM (trousers and shirt)...
do you tuck in the shirt or leave it out like on American BDU's?

Supposedly, the shirt (actually a lightweight jacket according to the label) was intended to be worn out, but most RSMs at the time probably blew a collective gasket at the idea of an untucked shirt and it was decided to be worn tucked in, which does look smarter around barracks.

In the field I don't take 95 shirts out. They don't keep you warm, they don't keep you dry and they don't hold much kit. If anything I wear an old jungle shirt rather than a wicking base layer and then my smock.

Secondly, do British troops wear (or are they authorised to wear) green-canvas jungles with S95 kit? Or do they only use them with tropical DPM?

As Royal has said, the new black altamas replaced the OG jungle boots a while ago. I've not seen anyone with the older type. I had a pair but they're absolutely f***ed now!

Lastly, if you're in the cold and decide to don a wooly or Norgie, do you wear it over your T-shirt by itself with the field jacket or over your DPM shirt under the field jacket?

Thanks in advance to anyone who can offer any help.

The S95 layering system was designed so that all elements could be worn together. I think the order was:

Tshirt (or cold weather top), norgie, dpm shirt, fleece, field jacket, goretex.

This is, of course, utter BS. The T shirt and norgie are cotton, which is the last thing you want next to your skin in the cold and wet. Personally I think norgies are dangerous to issue to recruits as warm kit for that reason.

I wear my own kit generally. If it's warmish, then jungle top and smock for tabbing and a swedish issue ullefrote wool cardigan when I stop at night. If it's colder, then I might chuck in a softie type jacket for the night and wear the ullefrote when static in the day. If it's mega baltic, then I wear my wool baselayer, but only when tabbing as it's too expensive to wear during LFTT!

Apart from all that, kevlar is a very good insulative material, along with a full bergan!

[MaverickCowboy]

@ Sabre

those Warrior Assault Systems pouches seem good?
can ya drop me a link? -are they Temp DPM?

[Sabre]

Warrior Assault Systems do pouches in OG, Tan and Multicam. I have a few pouches (ammo, smoke, grenade, zip utility) and a low profile rig. The quality is ok, comparable to blackhawk, but with some additional features. Personally I'm going to get shot of the rig as I use a blackhawk chest rig, but the pouches seem sound. I've not used them yet myself but most of the lads seem to think they're ok.

Link: http://www.uktactical.com/index.html

Not ordered anything from them, but seems to have a good rep. May have a delay in delivery though.

If you want DPM MOLLE pouches, I'd try pointman. They're selling seconds (wonky stitching, apparently) on ebay.co.uk for half price. Look reasonable, but I've never tried them.

[Red_Fern]

I've finally gotten around to taking pictures of my Trop pants to see if anyone can point me in the right direction towards getting a shirt that matches. These are the older-issue (I think) pants with the straight pocket closure edges as opposed to the ones with the triangular pocket closures. They also have the small puke-green buttons as opposed to the larger, dark green buttons.

Here they are:


Full shot of the pants.



Close-up of the leg and rear pocket. I modified the buttons by just touching over them with a black sharpie (the buttons were very shiny, I did it to cut down glare.)


Close up of the pattern. Pay special attention to the waistband...I need a shirt with this type material and with the yellow-green buttons.

I noticed that it almost resembles US-issue heavyweight twill type pattern...if that's of any help to anyone.

If anyone has a shirt like this or knows where to get one, please reply. Thanks.

[wotsnext]

These are "temperate" (cold weather) pants by the look of them, not s95 .....No longer issued, they must be quite old.

[Red_Fern]

They're trops. The tag says:

Trousers, Combat
(Tropical)

And they're of the heavier-weight fabric

[Britboy]

Yep, they look like trops to me.
I've a trop shirt, but its worn and bright luminous colours almost. Its not tea bag, its older than that. Still in decent nick actually, bought it when I was a mere air cadet

I will have to go find that in the attic, or track down a replacement. It has crazy colourings though, like lime green almost. What were they thinking?

[Britboy]

Someone mentioned Temperates (1990 or 1994?), they are not that old, I was on a course in 2003 and some of the blokes there had just been issued temperates.

I think that they got CS95 like everyone does, but they said they got temperates due to their role as mountain troops. Temperates being thicker and a bit warmer than the ripstop jackets and lightweight trousers, I guess. I didn't know we really had a mountain unit apart from RMs (which we were nothing to do with), but they were Scottish TA Infantry so I guessed they must have spent a lot of time in the hills in any case...

Or maybe they had a storeman who discovered them in a disused corner somewhere, or they had popped down the surplus shop!

Regards
BB

[Red_Fern]

So do you know where I could find a shirt that's equally "worn" as mine?

[Giv'ati]

Look for a Pattern 68 tropical shirt, the pants look like the pattern 68 ones. the buttons were the same models from the old battledress, same as the ones used in the WW2.