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Thread: A good but lengthy article on the decaying Russian fleet

  1. #16
    Senior Member nagant_m44's Avatar
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    most of the "new" stuff being built today are projects started years ago that they are just finishing.

  2. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andarius-Militarius View Post
    I just don't understand why my country can't replace its current stock of old warships. Russian shipyards are actually making alot fo new ships, but most them are for foreign orders mainly to India and China. As for missile submarines, well lets just say, most have been under construction for eternity (construction of the first Borei began in 1998 and it was launched in 2008) and the Bulava missiles are not even completely tested.
    We not talking about LEGO here and you have to consider all the destabilizing factors, especially in the 90th.

  3. #18

    Default On the Kuzetsov's umbilical cord

    Project 11435 aircraft carrier “Orel”


    Displacement 55,000 metric tons. Overall length 304 meters, beam 72 meters, draft 10 meters. Full speed 29 knots, cruising range 8,000 miles. Capacity of steam turbine engines - 200,000 horse-powers. Armament: aircraft group (up to 52 Su-33, Su-25 jets, and helicopters), 12 launchers for P-700 anti-ship missiles “Granit” (range 550 kilometers), air defense and anti-submarine systems. Crew of 1960 people (including 518 officers).
    It just hit me that relative to a Nuclear powered carrier, a steam engine powered carrier seems utterly limiting. Did Soviet/Russian designers ever considered putting a nuclear powered engine in the Kuznetsov?

  4. #19
    Member Migman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by delio View Post
    It just hit me that relative to a Nuclear powered carrier, a steam engine powered carrier seems utterly limiting. Did Soviet/Russian designers ever considered putting a nuclear powered engine in the Kuznetsov?
    Not on the Kuz, on the Ulyanovsk towards the end of the Cold War.

    http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...sia/1143_7.htm

  5. #20
    Senior Member NicNZ's Avatar
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    Throughout the article, the author seems particularly critical of the Russian administration for not maintaining the size of the fleet(s) from Soviet times. I think most people would agree that, following the collapse of the USSR, a massive reduction in the size and scope of the navy was justified. Similarly, it is not neccessary for Russia to maintain or develop some of the systems and complexes that were required during the Cold War.

    Despite the above, however, it seems clear that there are many parts of the navy that are suffering as a result of insufficient funding.

  6. #21
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    Fleet is in a much better state that it was 10 years ago. No article can change that fact. I for one am not crying over the decrease of the fleet in size. Frankly Russia does not need to maintain the fleet it used to, and the money is certainly better used somewhere else.

  7. #22

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    Much like Saddam's mighty on paper air force, I don't think the issue is size but all around utter lack of operational readiness, manifested in both the crew and equipment. The Kuznetsov has been a good example of that.

    That's an indication of lack of all around leadership, perhaps more so than it is an indication of lack of money.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by delio View Post
    Much like Saddam's mighty on paper air force, I don't think the issue is size but all around utter lack of operational readiness, manifested in both the crew and equipment. The Kuznetsov has been a good example of that.
    Saddams air force was hardly mighty on paper. After the Iran war, they were significantly down on operational aircraft. The pilots on the other hand had decent operational experience.

    Of course compared to the overwhelming power of the coalition forces, it didn help.

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    Edit: double post

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRussian1 View Post
    Fleet is in a much better state that it was 10 years ago. No article can change that fact. I for one am not crying over the decrease of the fleet in size. Frankly Russia does not need to maintain the fleet it used to, and the money is certainly better used somewhere else.

    This article was written last year.What has changed since then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Afro-European View Post
    This article was written last year.What has changed since then?
    Wasn't the Marshal Ustinov modified too to carry the Vulkan instead of the older SS-N-12 Bazalt?

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRussian1 View Post
    Fleet is in a much better state that it was 10 years ago. No article can change that fact. I for one am not crying over the decrease of the fleet in size. Frankly Russia does not need to maintain the fleet it used to, and the money is certainly better used somewhere else.
    Well some single ships are in better state (Kuznetzov for example wasn't even able to steam under own power during the late 90s).
    However to get money for funding those repairs many other, still usable ships, were decomissioned and many valuable ships were just left rotting at all. (SSV-33, once a worldwide unique vessel, is now a plundered and rotten hulk).
    the main problem of russian navy is not even lacking funding but wasting it. While posessing the Sineva, world's most efficient SLBM, they spend milliards on far inferior Bulawa which don't even fly yet and construct a 24000 ton submarine which will be able to carry only 12 of them (20 years older Ohio-class subs carry 24 larger and better missiles @18000t)

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    Quote Originally Posted by 103 View Post
    Wasn't the Marshal Ustinov modified too to carry the Vulkan instead of the older SS-N-12 Bazalt?
    Yes. Ustinov got it recently and Varyag was commisioned with them. Moskva is also upgraded. No Bazalts in russian service left.

  14. #29
    Senior Member TheArmenian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Switek View Post
    Kommersant is not an opposition newspaper. It represents Russian point of view to foreigners.

    I'm really surprised that they wrote sad truth about conditions of the fleet. By parallel it's easy to make an opinion about RF air force and ground forces.
    Opposition or not...Kommersant is one of the most negative papers I have come accross. They sometimes present positive news negatively.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheArmenian View Post
    Opposition or not...Kommersant is one of the most negative papers I have come accross. They sometimes present positive news negatively.
    Nah i don't think so.It generally gives broad,independant opinions with actual facts.Maybe this article rubbed some people the wrong way coz it showcases the weakness of the Russian navy.

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